Hi everybody! Male, 39, coming from a lately much maligned but culturally very rich country. I consider any day spent without listening to music a wasted day! Favourite composers? Too many! Where to start? Let'me sum up mentioning Bach, Beeth, Mahler, Verdi and Wagner. Tried to learn play the piano but frustratingly a cat would have been more talented than me... Avid collector though as I am (just under 10000 cds) I believe more in the live experience of music, the miracle just being happening in front of your very eyes and ears. Therefore eagerly awaiting the concert of Philharmonia Orchestra under Lorin Maazel next Saturday 15 in Athens, I'd like to glean some opinions about the prominent maestro before expressing my own! Thanks beforehand for your attention and welcome (Forgive my use of english as I have only set foot on english soil for just 2 hours at Dover, England)
Hello Obradovic, welcome to GMG (and your English is fine). I agree with you about experiencing music live (when possible), and heard Maazel many times when he was here in New York with the Philharmonic. My experiences with him have been mostly positive. He's a great technician, and can make a group really sound magnificent; when he's not-so-good he tends to micro-manage every phrase. For me, his takes on Ravel's La valse and Rapsodie espagnole were frustrating (though well-played). But I heard all of his recent Mahler cycle live and liked pretty much all of the symphonies. He also did a terrific Ravel L'enfant et les sortilèges (one of his specialties) and a great concert version of Richard Strauss's Elektra.
What is he doing on the 15th?
--Bruce
hi! i'm gald you're here :)
Hi Bruce, sorry, I forgot to mention the program: Tchaikovsky's Pathétique and Brahms' 2nd. It will be my second live contact with maestro Maazel, the first was back in 1993 conducting here in Athens the Bavarian RSO in Tchaikovsky's Romeo and Juliet and Dvořak's New World which I remember as rather exciting. Interesting that you also liked his Mahler. Did he again, in New York, run the 3rd for 110 minutes?? In his Vienna PO recording in Sony, lauded elsewhere, he stretched the first movement to 38 minutes. It'was mercilessly dragged to its limits, disfigured. He applied rather broad tempos in the other movements too and the whole work sounded endless. Even the late Bernstein, in his DG NYPO 3rd, not a speed-seller himself was more volatile! Not that tempo itself is the determining factor but at this instance... it was! Imagine Celibidache what would have made of this symphony... You're very lucky living in the Big Apple. Every April I visit the Carnegie Hall site to preview the coming season's program, just to...salivate! Greetings!
He also did a terrific Ravel L'enfant et les sortilèges (one of his specialties) and a great concert version of Richard Strauss's Elektra.
Hi there Obradovic. Greetings from Beethoven's Vienna. Welcome to the forum. I'm sure you will enjoy it here. (http://www.smileygarden.de/smilie/Schilder/00000732.gif)
Welcome, Obradovic!
Welcome to the forum and have a nice time here. :)
So glad to see Wagner, Beethoven and Mahler in your list, they're among my favourite composers too! Hope you like Liszt as well.
Ilaria
Quote from: flyffdzd on December 09, 2012, 04:50:30 PM
He also did a terrific Ravel L'enfant et les sortilèges (one of his specialties) and a great concert version of Richard Strauss's Elektra.
[/quote/]
Yes, you mean the DG recording coupled with L'heure espagnole which is fine too. Thanks for posting
Quote from: Hollywood on December 09, 2012, 10:44:12 PM
Hi there Obradovic. Greetings from Beethoven's Vienna. Welcome to the forum. I'm sure you will enjoy it here. (http://www.smileygarden.de/smilie/Schilder/00000732.gif)
Thanks for your welcome! And if you could find me New Year Concert ticket...you could win my girlfriend! (not that I would gladly give her up to you but she would want to marry you!!)
Welcome, Obradovic!
Daniel has been busy lately (as if I haven't been), so I'll just say this for him: I'm glad you like Mahler!
Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 10, 2012, 04:06:05 AM
Welcome to the forum and have a nice time here. :)
So glad to see Wagner, Beethoven and Mahler in your list, they're among my favourite composers too! Hope you like Liszt as well.
Ilaria
Hi Ilaria, thanks for your welcome. Yes, I like Liszt, only 5-6 volumes (some transcriptions) of the complete Hyperion edition aren't on my shelves! One of the best live concerts I have attended in my life was ca.15 years ago in Athens with the Budapest Festival Orchestra under Ivan Fischer in an all-Liszt mouthwatering program: Tasso, lamento e trionfo, 3 Episodes from Lenau's Faust and A Faust Symphony! Yes, 2+ hours with the finest Liszt and Lisztian interpreters. I wish you were there...
Quote from: Obradovic on December 10, 2012, 08:51:26 AM
Hi Ilaria, thanks for your welcome. Yes, I like Liszt, only 5-6 volumes (some transcriptions) of the complete Hyperion edition aren't on my shelves! One of the best live concerts I have attended in my life was ca.15 years ago in Athens with the Budapest Festival Orchestra under Ivan Fischer in an all-Liszt mouthwatering program: Tasso, lamento e trionfo, 3 Episodes from Lenau's Faust and A Faust Symphony! Yes, 2+ hours with the finest Liszt and Lisztian interpreters. I wish you were there...
Glad to know it. :) Really, Fischer and the Budapest Festival Orchestra?? Ah, you were so lucky, it must have been wonderful; what a great programme they played!! ;D
Quote from: North Star on December 10, 2012, 08:48:59 AM
Welcome, Obradovic!
Daniel has been busy lately (as if I haven't been), so I'll just say this for him: I'm glad you like Mahler!
Hi Daniel, thanks for you welcome! As for Mahler let me give you some numbers: I have 9 Firsts, 9 Seconds, 10 Thirds, 8 Fourths, 16 Fifths, 17 Sixths, 8 Sevents, 7 Eighths, 19 Ninths and 5 Tenths (including the completions). Yes, I know, aren't too many but I'm still only 39 years old... Now an apology: I forgot to mention Sibelius as one of my favourites. BIS has made me very happy the last 2 decades... you know what I mean...
Quote from: Obradovic on December 09, 2012, 12:33:27 AM
Hi Bruce, sorry, I forgot to mention the program: Tchaikovsky's Pathétique and Brahms' 2nd. It will be my second live contact with maestro Maazel, the first was back in 1993 conducting here in Athens the Bavarian RSO in Tchaikovsky's Romeo and Juliet and Dvořak's New World which I remember as rather exciting. Interesting that you also liked his Mahler. Did he again, in New York, run the 3rd for 110 minutes?? In his Vienna PO recording in Sony, lauded elsewhere, he stretched the first movement to 38 minutes. It'was mercilessly dragged to its limits, disfigured. He applied rather broad tempos in the other movements too and the whole work sounded endless. Even the late Bernstein, in his DG NYPO 3rd, not a speed-seller himself was more volatile! Not that tempo itself is the determining factor but at this instance... it was! Imagine Celibidache what would have made of this symphony... You're very lucky living in the Big Apple. Every April I visit the Carnegie Hall site to preview the coming season's program, just to...salivate! Greetings!
Thanks for all of this, and I'm not surprised about the Vienna Mahler 3 recording "mercilessly dragged to its limits." (I've only heard one or two in that series, but not the Third.) I do recall some of his recent NYPO Mahler performances being a bit long, but I suspect the main reason I (mostly) liked them is that the orchestra itself just
sounded so good, and I confess to being seduced (sometimes) by an orchestra's sheer technical prowess.
Anyway, that program should be very interesting and please post something on how it goes.
--Bruce
Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 10, 2012, 08:58:48 AM
Glad to know it. :) Really, Fischer and the Budapest Festival Orchestra?? Ah, you were so lucky, it must have been wonderful; what a great programme they played!! ;D
Yes, superlative playing and a luxury to have Hans-Peter Blochwitz as the tenor soloist. Despite the long duration of the whole concert the final ovation was overwhelming! Deservedly so!
Quote from: Brewski on December 10, 2012, 09:02:42 AM
Anyway, that program should be very interesting and please post something on how it goes.
--Bruce
Of course! Greetings!
Quote from: Obradovic on December 10, 2012, 09:06:42 AM
Yes, superlative playing and a luxury to have Hans-Peter Blochwitz as the tenor soloist. Despite the long duration of the whole concert the final ovation was overwhelming! Deservedly so!
Yeah, it's not hard to imagine it! :)
Quote from: Obradovic on December 10, 2012, 09:01:08 AM
Hi Daniel, thanks for you welcome! As for Mahler let me give you some numbers: I have 9 Firsts, 9 Seconds, 10 Thirds, 8 Fourths, 16 Fifths, 17 Sixths, 8 Sevents, 7 Eighths, 19 Ninths and 5 Tenths (including the completions). Yes, I know, aren't too many but I'm still only 39 years old... Now an apology: I forgot to mention Sibelius as one of my favourites. BIS has made me very happy the last 2 decades... you know what I mean...
No, I'm not Daniel - member
madaboutmahler is whom I was refering to. Although I do like Mahler, too.
You're probably not going to win contests here with those numbers, but that doesn't mean they aren't crazy ;D
I'm only 21, so haven't yet bought multiple sets of pretty much anything (except Sibelius's symphonies, of course.
Yes, although I don't think I have much beyond the Vänskä & Lahti in the 4th and together with Kavakos in the violin concerto (including the early version). I should get their tone poem box, though.
Quote from: North Star on December 10, 2012, 09:28:21 AM
No, I'm not Daniel - member madaboutmahler is who I was refering to. Although I do like Mahler, too.
You're probably not going to win contests here with those numbers, but that doesn't mean they aren't crazy ;D
I'm only 21, so haven't yet bought multiple sets of pretty much anything (except Sibelius's symphonies, of course.
Yes, although I don't think I have much beyond the Vänskä & Lahti in the 4th and together with Kavakos in the violin concerto (including the early version). I should get their tone poem box, though.
Ooops! apologies for the confusion-and you have a very nice nickname! My favourite tone poems are Pohjola's Daughter and Tapiola. Give a chance to The Wood Nymph! The poem of V. Rydberg that has inspired it is extraordinary too. And multiple numbers are for collectors, not so for listeners! And I mean to listen to all my discs again and again having in mind that I'm human and not a turtle or a crow... I heard Kavakos play Sibelius Concerto live here a couple of years ago with the London SO and V. Gergiev. It is HIS concerto but the last years he tries to keep a distance from it in order to try other demanding stuff as well. A new Decca Beethoven violin sonatas cycle arrives early in 2013. But that is an other story
Welcome and enjoy yourself. I got the Essential Sibelius, which means your Sibelius and my Sibelius are essentially the same! :)
Quote from: Obradovic on December 10, 2012, 09:57:18 AM
Ooops! apologies for the confusion-and you have a very nice nickname! My favourite tone poems are Pohjola's Daughter and Tapiola. Give a chance to The Wood Nymph! The poem of V. Rydberg that has inspired it is extraordinary too. And multiple numbers are for collectors, not so for listeners! And I mean to listen to all my discs again and again having in mind that I'm human and not a turtle or a crow... I heard Kavakos play Sibelius Concerto live here a couple of years ago with the London SO and V. Gergiev. It is HIS concerto but the last years he tries to keep a distance from it in order to try other demanding stuff as well. A new Decca Beethoven violin sonatas cycle arrives early in 2013. But that is an other story
The underlined part I don't quite understand.
Pohjola's Daughter and Tapiola are both fantastic pieces, and The Wood Nymph, too.
Kavakos is excellent in the concerto, but I don't know whether he owns the piece - e.g. Mullova, Tetzlaff, and Zehetmair aren't exactly bad, either (keeping the discussion to active players)
Quote from: North Star on December 10, 2012, 12:27:04 PM
The underlined part I don't quite understand.
I mean I'll probably not live as long as a turtle or a crow: 200 years... Of course, I'll do my best but... Our time is limited and there is so much good music to enjoy and explore (among other things of course). For example talking about Finnish I prefer to buy a new Klami (by the way, the Helsinki PO/J. Storgaards CD in Ondine with Northern Lights and Kalevala Suite is thrilling, don't miss it)/Madetoja/Melartin cd than buying again and again the same staples of the repertoire. I hope I'm clear now! For Kavakos I'm partial (you can say positively prejudiced) because for years before my acquaintance with his interpretation of the Concerto which it eventually didn't disappoint me, he was hailed internationaly as the best performer receiving rave reviews everywhere. He made his name playing it around the world and that BIS chose him to play the world premiere of the original version is self-explanatory. When my father visited Helsinki in mid 90s the travel guide congratulated him for being Kavakos' compatriot! But always the determining factor is personal gusto. And your opinion has great value, Finnish as you are!
Quote from: Obradovic on December 10, 2012, 01:08:40 PM
I mean I'll probably not live as long as a turtle or a crow: 200 years... Of course, I'll do my best but... Our time is limited and there is so much good music to enjoy and explore (among other things of course). For example talking about Finnish I prefer to buy a new Klami (by the way, the Helsinki PO/J. Storgaards CD in Ondine with Northern Lights and Kalevala Suite is thrilling, don't miss it)/Madetoja/Melartin cd than buying again and again the same staples of the repertoire. I hope I'm clear now! For Kavakos I'm partial (you can say positively prejudiced) because for years before my acquaintance with his interpretation of the Concerto which it eventually didn't disappoint me, he was hailed internationaly as the best performer receiving rave reviews everywhere. He made his name playing it around the world and that BIS chose him to play the world premiere of the original version is self-explanatory. When my father visited Helsinki in mid 90s the travel guide congratulated him for being Kavakos' compatriot! But always the determining factor is personal gusto. And your opinion has great value, Finnish as you are!
Yes (although I don't think crows live that old - more like 5-30 years), and I certainly agree that I'd rather explore new repertoire than buy dozens of recordings of the same pieces. I know some Klami (Kalevala Suite, Pyörteitä - an unfinished ballet, Kalevi Aho has made a completion and the ballet was received it's world premiere here in Oulu last season, was absolutely splendid), and have a disc of Madetoja (Volmer & Oulu Symphony Orchestra :) )
Speaking of the less famous Finnish composers - do you know Väinö (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yiDT2jQLsIY) Raitio (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gLwqMcIrk6U)? There aren't many recordings of his music available, but much can be found from Youtube or Spotify. Unlike other Finns around that time, there's a lot of French influence on the music.
I understand your fanaticism :) , but I was just saying that it's not like no-one else should play the work while Kavakos is alive.
I do agree that Sibelius's music has a lot to do with the nature and the Finnish people, but I wouldn't say that a Finn automatically has a better understanding of his music. The fact that Finns hear, and seek to hear because of nationalist reasons, more of it, on the other hand, more probably does have an effect.
Quote from: Obradovic on December 10, 2012, 08:41:29 AM
Thanks for your welcome! And if you could find me New Year Concert ticket...you could win my girlfriend! (not that I would gladly give her up to you but she would want to marry you!!)
I would think that ticket to the New Year's Day concert here are easy enough to get, if you can afford it. The prices range from €350 to €4,000. Who would pay €350 for a Standing Room Only ticket when this concert is live on TV here to watch in the comfort of one's own home? That said, you won't have to loose your girlfriend in the process of getting a ticket. FYI, I am female, in case my username isn't that gender friendly. (http://www.smileygarden.de/smilie/Schleifchen-Girls/smilie_girl_207.gif)
Quote from: North Star on December 10, 2012, 01:39:38 PM
Speaking of the less famous Finnish composers - do you know Väinö (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yiDT2jQLsIY) Raitio (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gLwqMcIrk6U)? There aren't many recordings of his music available, but much can be found from Youtube or Spotify. Unlike other Finns around that time, there's a lot of French influence on the music.
Unfortunately I know him only by name. And you're right, Klami's last unfinished ballet Whirls completed by Aho is very colourful and exciting. The french influence along with that of Scriabin's I think is prominent in Ernest Pingoud's music too. A rather tough nut to crack despite his tonal language. If I speak wrong throw me a snowball!! (I'm sure you have a lot of this stuff up there in Oulu)
Quote from: mc ukrneal on December 10, 2012, 10:09:04 AM
Welcome and enjoy yourself. I got the Essential Sibelius, which means your Sibelius and my Sibelius are essentially the same! :)
Thanks for your welcome! I'm afraid the rest of your message isn't very flattering to the old Finn and may I guess that you prefer the last period of Sibelius life, the silence of Järvenpää, as the most rewarding one!!
Quote from: Hollywood on December 10, 2012, 11:26:39 PM
I would think that ticket to the New Year's Day concert here are easy enough to get, if you can afford it. The prices range from €350 to €4,000. Who would pay €350 for a Standing Room Only ticket when this concert is live on TV here to watch in the comfort of one's own home? That said, you won't have to loose your girlfriend in the process of getting a ticket. FYI, I am female, in case my username isn't that gender friendly. (http://www.smileygarden.de/smilie/Schleifchen-Girls/smilie_girl_207.gif)
Forgive me about the gender confusion but I couldn't guess! Are you sure the prices are so high? Because she tried her lot last January, applied through the VPO website and we saw that prices ranged from 90-900 EUR (roughly), unless you imply black market inquiry! Of course she wasn't drawn and I'm sure coming January we'll repeat the same story with probably the same results... But her try last January was her first ever, so she must not complain! I'm watching it in the TV the last 30 years and I don't complain too!
Quote from: Obradovic on December 11, 2012, 02:14:16 AM
Unfortunately I know him only by name. And you're right, Klami's last unfinished ballet Whirls completed by Aho is very colourful and exciting. The french influence along with that of Scriabin's I think is prominent in Ernest Pingoud's music too. A rather tough nut to crack despite his tonal language. If I speak wrong throw me a snowball!! (I'm sure you have a lot of this stuff up there in Oulu)
There isn't that much snow yet, but I can't say that I'm well acquainted with Pingoud (although it seems you're right about him)- so I won't be needing it :D
I tried to find some Pingoud on Amazon, but there's just one album, and that's OOP. Plenty of biochemistry books, though.
Just don't mess with me in March - plenty of snow by then ;D
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-1TIhayg-FUk/TuYhFN8GBuI/AAAAAAAAAF8/XswSSGRVg0g/s1600/calvin+snowball-thumb.gif)
Quote from: North Star on December 11, 2012, 02:51:46 AM
I tried to find some Pingoud on Amazon, but there's just one album, and that's OOP. Plenty of biochemistry books, though.
Just don't mess with me in March - plenty of snow by then ;D
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-1TIhayg-FUk/TuYhFN8GBuI/AAAAAAAAAF8/XswSSGRVg0g/s1600/calvin+snowball-thumb.gif)
I would gladly hand you over my Pingoud cd (that one with the tone poems in Ondine) but in exchange you should arrange me a date with Kiira Korpi! Think of it, it's a real bargain! By the way I have Madetoja's Okon Fuko with the Oulu SO/Arvo Volmer on my shelves but I haven't heard it yet. This Christmas I'll do it for you! Finally, speaking about snow, in my hometown in Western Peloponese (60km from Ancient Olympia) I have had enjoyed snowfall only three times during my lifetime: 1978, 1987 and 2001!
Quote from: Obradovic on December 11, 2012, 03:27:54 AM
I would gladly hand you over my Pingoud cd (that one with the tone poems in Ondine) but in exchange you should arrange me a date with Kiira Korpi! Think of it, it's a real bargain! By the way I have Madetoja's Okon Fuko with the Oulu SO/Arvo Volmer on my shelves but I haven't heard it yet. This Christmas I'll do it for you! Finally, speaking about snow, in my hometown in Western Peloponese (60km from Ancient Olympia) I have had enjoyed snowfall only three times during my lifetime: 1978, 1987 and 2001!
Yeah, I'm a Finn so I must know Kiira Korpi...
(actually, she's in the same class (uni) as my schoolmate :-X :P)
Must be nice to cycle there - no ice, no snow, no slush, or any combinations of those :)
I must confess that I only have one disc from Volmer & Oulu SO's Madetoja series, though - with Symphony no. 1 & others.
Quote from: Obradovic on December 11, 2012, 02:18:29 AM
Thanks for your welcome! I'm afraid the rest of your message isn't very flattering to the old Finn and may I guess that you prefer the last period of Sibelius life, the silence of Järvenpää, as the most rewarding one!!
Ha! I was just trying to be funny. Big fail I guess! :)
Quote from: North Star on December 11, 2012, 03:36:22 AM
Yeah, I'm a Finn so I must know Kiira Korpi...
(actually, she's in the same class (uni) as my schoolmate :-X :P)
Must be nice to cycle there - no ice, no snow, no slush, or any combinations of those :)
I must confess that I only have one disc from Volmer & Oulu SO's Madetoja series, though - with Symphony no. 1 & others.
Really, do you have access to Kiira? Splendid! Take your chances and the Pingoud cd is coming! And you're welcome down here, anytime you'd wish with your company (and Kiira of course!)
Quote from: mc ukrneal on December 11, 2012, 04:08:08 AM
Ha! I was just trying to be funny. Big fail I guess! :)
Not at all! I highly appreciate good humour-much as I love Wagner I find Rossini's quips on it delightful ('Wagner is a composer who has beautiful minutes but awful quarter hours'). Cheers!
Quote from: Obradovic on December 11, 2012, 02:28:23 AM
Forgive me about the gender confusion but I couldn't guess! Are you sure the prices are so high? Because she tried her lot last January, applied through the VPO website and we saw that prices ranged from 90-900 EUR (roughly), unless you imply black market inquiry! Of course she wasn't drawn and I'm sure coming January we'll repeat the same story with probably the same results... But her try last January was her first ever, so she must not complain! I'm watching it in the TV the last 30 years and I don't complain too!
These prices are listed on the Vienna Concert online ordering site. They are cheaper if you buy them direct from the Vienna Philharmonic but you pretty much need to get them almost one year in advance. This concert is so popular the tickets go on sale at the beginning of January for the following year's concert. They are sold out before you know it. I still wouldn't pay over $100 for a ticket to this concert when I can watch it free live on Austrian TV sitting comfortably on my sofa.
Quote from: Obradovic on December 11, 2012, 08:06:14 AM
Really, do you have access to Kiira? Splendid! Take your chances and the Pingoud cd is coming! And you're welcome down here, anytime you'd wish with your company (and Kiira of course!)
No 'access', so you can hold on to that Pingoud.
Quote from: Hollywood on December 12, 2012, 12:16:15 AM
I still wouldn't pay over $100 for a ticket to this concert when I can watch it free live on Austrian TV sitting comfortably on my sofa.
Agree! Last April I savoured the Vienna PO twice here in Athens playing Haydn, Brahms and Schumann, courtesy of Pappano and Thielemann paying only 19,00 EUR per concert! 19,00 not 190,00!! Of course I had to wake up 05.30 in the morning to get the tickets but... never mind, it was worth the case!