Here, I offer myself up to you. This is my sorry tale of why you don't know me as a Famous Dead Musician.
I have always been extremely Creative. When I was in the 12y.o. grade, I was writing spicy Bond-like stories with members of the class in embarrassing situations, and reading them to class (also this is when the lesbian vampire thing was happening!). I was writing fairly reasonable screenplays. Paint and draw and blah blah blah. Super Creative in a family of couldn't-care-less,... looking back, it seems inevitable that I was doomed to failure, or, so it would seem.
Two things happened on my 14th birthday, one of which was getting an electric guitar. I went to Film School (oy veeey!!eyeroll). I ended up in the middle of the boho scene, and, ultimately, succumbed to life-as-we-know-it.
I'm the most Creative person I know, and, trust me, I say that not for myself. Surely most all people I know know me as a Failed Mad Genius to what ever greater or lesser extent. I certainly should have been poised in the '90s boho-mania to make a play, but, between my own slackness and what ever other external forces there were, nothing.
The 'fantasy' of the American Dream, yes, I somehow believed I would 'make it',... but, to cut to the chase, this last decade saw me go from a potential career in Faux Finishing/Distressing (lots of fun... fumes... hell on hands) to jobs in grocery stores. I've now hit 4.5 years without a Full Time job.
So, this whole time, I still 'play' music,... whatever instrument, the point is, I use my hands. So, I'm at a point in my life where I have to ask myself,- Do I get any old job/career choice regardless, or do I look for something that will preserve my hands?
I know there's plenty of people on here who MAKE MONEY MAKING MUSIC. When people ask me, I love saying I'm a 'Musician', but, I most certainly feel like a chump saying it because I know what a Professional Musician is. I'm not really that. But, no one I know can deny that I'm some kind of Creating Machine. I don't want to die of a heart attack working the produce aisle of your local grocery.
Look, I'm the guy who realizes that 'Tequila', 'Andy Griffith', and 'I Dream of Jeannie' are the same song, and then play them simultaneously. In a movie scene with Lesbian Vampires. Hmm, maybe I DO belong in retail, aye aye aye! :P
Waaah! I'm a whiny spoiled brat. Without the Trust Fund.
I know one guy who plays a 12string guitar and sings, probably nightly. He plays a 12STRING NIGHTLY!!! For decades. Not that I ever wanted to play Bob Seger for my entire life, but, I'm just sayin'.
Anyhow, I guess I was just looking for someone to tell me to shut up. Shut up snyprrr.
OK, do I reeeally want to Post this? If you're reading this, then you're probably as confused as I am, haha!! Ah, looks like he's going for the Post...
What are you saying, you're actually "Weird Al" Yankovic? and you're out of work because it the current crop of pop stars are so out there they are beyond parody?
Will work for arugula.
Quote from: Parsifal on May 15, 2013, 06:33:27 PM
What are you saying, you're actually "Weird Al" Yankovic? and you're out of work because it the current crop of pop stars are so out there they are beyond parody?
Wow! Give this guy a banana!! You're good
Quote from: karlhenning on May 15, 2013, 06:51:20 PM
Will work for arugula.
Tell me the 'Sell Out' Button is for you, Karl. To my eyes, you seem like someone doing what they WANT,... you're true to yourself,... so, have you ever had the 'Crossroads Choice'?,... what would you be doing if you had sold out? As an 'Artist' you must surely have seen the low road that that Artistic Choice could have taken you (I personally think I would have ended up like Kurt Cobain had I actually become successful, so, I thank God I'm a loser?).
I'm just looking at you (and some others here) as people who have 'Made It', so to speak (why you, Karl, don't have someone setting up Chamber Recitals for Recording is beyond me. Surely it's not that hard to get a disc on Amazon or Ebay?). Surely, it takes a certain amount of SOMETHING, some discipline from youth (I was left to my own devices, hence, I seem to have a total lack of personal daily discipline)??,...
I remember when I was about 18, and the folks were gone, and we had band practice in the basement for a party, and I distinctly remember choosing the tequila bottle over the second set of practice songs.
And here's an even better one. I had joined my hometown hero's band, and we were set to play The Big Gig. I was tuning to a electronic tuner in the dark. We went on. Bass and drums began. I went for my Big Opening, and... I had been tuning to a CHROMATIC TUNER, and was PERFECTLY out of tune. Promptly fired.
I spent 3 years and $8000 producing an album of Psalms in Original King James English (maybe I'll try and make it available to you?), that began with me sober and ended in abject relapse (coked out vocals on a Bible cd??????haha(now)).
Lately, I worked hard on that Classical Guitar piece, which abruptly ended Jan. 1 as I joined a new project which may have some commercial viability (... ya really make me wanna Shout!, kick my...).
Really, the one area in which God seems to bless me endlessly is in the Scriabinesque, esoteric 'aha!' moments that many here seem to crave. I seem to have sacrificed my life to live in The Now Moment (for which, apparently, there is now future bank account?). Sure, I feel enriched, but I am hungry (stay hungry?). I no longer yearn to be 'Rich & Famous', but I still seem to have an Ultimate Need for Expression (snyprrr is my nephew) that seems elusive?
You'll be sure to let me know what I just wrote, won't you dear! ;) ??? :laugh: :-* 8) $:) $:) ;D :D ;)
But Karl has a day job, and so did Charles Ives, Albert Einstein...
Quote from: Parsifal on May 16, 2013, 08:14:43 AM
But Karl has a day job, and so did Charles Ives, Albert Einstein...
That appears to be the key to doing entirely what one pleases, musically.
Quote from: Parsifal on May 16, 2013, 08:14:43 AM
But Karl has a day job, and so did Charles Ives, Albert Einstein...
He WAS the first one I admired like that.
I thought Karl's day job was being a music teacher?
'Trade', 'Vocation',... there are so many words,... Paul was a tent maker!
I was not brought up with this nugget, the two-in-one deal. What are some
Famous Composer Day Jobs? Or, were they ALL Composers? I mean, I know they were music teachers, conductors,...
Ugh, I'm feeling constipated again! :-[ :( :-[
Quote from: snyprrr on May 16, 2013, 03:55:09 PM
Ugh, I'm feeling constipated again! :-[ :( :-[
Well, you're usually good at getting it
all out.
If you have a living situation that permits sleeping during the day/evening, and if your body can tolerate overnights, I wonder if that could be a way to maximize your time. I have loved that kind of schedule before, as long my home life is suited to it. If the job is right, that is: if it's low-stress, you might even be able to get all your reading, fiddling-around, learning, internettery out of the way while you're being underpaid for it. Maybe even some lo-fi music listening. I imagine this is something you have tried, though....
I think of Wallace Stevens as a guy who did some good work when he had the time (a busy guy in Ordinary Citizen mode). Lots of poets before MFA programs started absorbing them Human Centipede style. Didn't Webern have to work as a copyist drudge in dire circumstances, while producing most of his body of work? I seem to remember stories about him actually writing a tiny amount each day, on average, sometimes just a few notes or so, though that probably had to do with methods. I like the idea of someone just doggedly chipping away at the mountain of possible material, with the form in view, constant or fleetingly, at all times. A bit romantic, yeah, but I like it.
Einstein worked full time as a pharmacist while he produced the material for his first Nobel Price, as well as doeing the basic footwork on the material for his second one. So if you only put a little effort into it, it is possible. :P
Quote from: The new erato on May 17, 2013, 01:05:35 AM
Einstein worked full time as a pharmacist while he produced the material for his first Nobel Price, as well as doeing the basic footwork on the material for his second one. So if you only put a little effort into it, it is possible. :P
Was he related to the Einstein who won the Nobel price once after working as a patent clerk? ???
Quote from: Parsifal on May 17, 2013, 06:07:54 AM
Was he related to the Einstein who won the Nobel price once after working as a patent clerk? ???
Yes, two dayjobs makes it even more impresskve!
Did either of them win the Nobel prize?
Looks like I may have to start a thread about my auto-correct grumbles. ::)
Surely, you do not refuse to garden? Is it not the mind one should worry about? - that it not be stultified by drudgery.
Quote from: Parsifal on May 16, 2013, 08:14:43 AM
But Karl has a day job, and so did Charles Ives, Albert Einstein...
Funny how Ives is always the only one mentioned that had a non-musical job. And then there's Kyle Gann, who mentioned that he couldn't possibly be happy having a non-musical, 40 hour a week job.
Quote from: Ten thumbs on May 18, 2013, 02:37:32 AM
Is it not the mind one should worry about? - that it not be stultified by drudgery.
Ha, what a distant dream...
Quote from: Ten thumbs on May 18, 2013, 02:37:32 AM
Is it not the mind one should worry about? - that it not be stultified by drudgery.
Quote from: Greg on May 18, 2013, 04:52:04 AMHa, what a distant dream...
Before there was civilization the life of a human desperate struggle to survive one more day. To obtain the benefits of civilization (beyond lolling around the your parents' basement playing video games) you need to engage in civilization.
Quote from: Ten thumbs on May 18, 2013, 02:37:32 AM
Surely, you do not refuse to garden? Is it not the mind one should worry about? - that it not be stultified by drudgery.
Actually a very pertinent point. We inherited some wind driven shit-grass from the neighbor (the kind of grass that's pointy, not fescu), and I went a-pullin', but, yaiy yaiy yaiy that's wasting my grip muscles horrendously.
The time I spend as an artisan,... endless sanding, and gripping, and other non-friendly hand activities,... really took my hands to a place I really didn't want to go. Now I can't really pull those stubborn weeds (grass?,... really??). YES, I AM starting to feel like a wussy,... but, I just CAN'T do these hand things... my hand don't WANT TO. It's like they're saying, "Fuck you, do you want us to play music for you, or do you want us to seize up?"
The Bible says that "(so-and-sos) hands REFUSE to work." It's the HANDS that are literally refusing to work for me. When, at the height of my artisan pain, I could not barely hold a pencil or brush in my hand, it was so pissed at me.
Working in the dairy section and lifting all those 8 lb. milk jugs (that bend you fingers because of the handle),... that was no hand-fun either.
Haha, as I'm looking at the Thread Title,... I don't say 'These Hands' because the are Sacred Art Producers, I say it because 'These Hands' flippin' hurt!!!! Aye!!
Anyhow, as of yesterday, WE HAVE OUR FIRST GIG!!!!!!!!!! SO, YAY!!!
Quote from: Greg on May 18, 2013, 04:52:04 AM
Funny how Ives is always the only one mentioned that had a non-musical job. And then there's Kyle Gann, who mentioned that he couldn't possibly be happy having a non-musical, 40 hour a week job.
Ha, what a distant dream...
btw Greg, thanks for asking about 'Tekh'. I haven't looked at it since Jan. 1. I figured the first part was pretty well down, and I just knew I didn't have the juice to start of the Part2, so, I just have to shelve it until some time might arise. I've been working with the band since January, and we just got a first potential gig, which makes me want to go out and look for more. 'Tekh' wasn't going to allow me to play with anyone, and I NEEDED a band situation desperately. We just had our first practice-recording-cd, and, all flubbing aside, it definitely shows our potential. I will certainly endeavor to Post some samples when I'm satisfied (probably a few more recordings down the pike). I am SOOOO going to sneak some Avant-Modern-Classical bits into this band, haha,... Stockhausen-meets-Surf!!!!!!!!
Quote from: Parsifal on May 18, 2013, 07:59:00 AM
Before there was civilization the life of a human desperate struggle to survive one more day. To obtain the benefits of civilization (beyond lolling around the your parents' basement playing video games) you need to engage in civilization.
But lolling around your parents'
basement house
(basements don't exist down here, so they are a foreign concept to me :P ) playing video games is one of the benefits of civilization. I couldn't imagine how awesome it would be to be able to play Final Fantasy 11 all day and not have to go to work and/or school
every day. :o
Quote from: snyprrr on May 18, 2013, 08:30:27 AM
btw Greg, thanks for asking about 'Tekh'. I haven't looked at it since Jan. 1. I figured the first part was pretty well down, and I just knew I didn't have the juice to start of the Part2, so, I just have to shelve it until some time might arise. I've been working with the band since January, and we just got a first potential gig, which makes me want to go out and look for more. 'Tekh' wasn't going to allow me to play with anyone, and I NEEDED a band situation desperately. We just had our first practice-recording-cd, and, all flubbing aside, it definitely shows our potential. I will certainly endeavor to Post some samples when I'm satisfied (probably a few more recordings down the pike). I am SOOOO going to sneak some Avant-Modern-Classical bits into this band, haha,... Stockhausen-meets-Surf!!!!!!!!
Good to hear! I will be looking forward to hearing stuff when you're ready.
Quote from: snyprrr on May 18, 2013, 08:22:56 AM
Actually a very pertinent point. We inherited some wind driven shit-grass from the neighbor (the kind of grass that's pointy, not fescu), and I went a-pullin', but, yaiy yaiy yaiy that's wasting my grip muscles horrendously.
The time I spend as an artisan,... endless sanding, and gripping, and other non-friendly hand activities,... really took my hands to a place I really didn't want to go. Now I can't really pull those stubborn weeds (grass?,... really??). YES, I AM starting to feel like a wussy,... but, I just CAN'T do these hand things... my hand don't WANT TO. It's like they're saying, "Fuck you, do you want us to play music for you, or do you want us to seize up?"
The Bible says that "(so-and-sos) hands REFUSE to work." It's the HANDS that are literally refusing to work for me. When, at the height of my artisan pain, I could not barely hold a pencil or brush in my hand, it was so pissed at me.
Working in the dairy section and lifting all those 8 lb. milk jugs (that bend you fingers because of the handle),... that was no hand-fun either.
Haha, as I'm looking at the Thread Title,... I don't say 'These Hands' because the are Sacred Art Producers, I say it because 'These Hands' flippin' hurt!!!! Aye!!
Anyhow, as of yesterday, WE HAVE OUR FIRST GIG!!!!!!!!!! SO, YAY!!!
What about working at Starbucks? Would that little handle they pull to make the steam come out be traumatic for your hands? :)
Quote from: Greg on May 18, 2013, 08:38:10 AM
But lolling around your parents' basement house (basements don't exist down here, so they are a foreign concept to me :P ) playing video games is one of the benefits of civilization. I couldn't imagine how awesome it would be to be able to play Final Fantasy 11 all day and not have to go to work and/or school every day. :o
You're aware that someone had to make Final Fantasy (whatever that is).
Quote from: Parsifal on May 18, 2013, 08:57:15 AM
What about working at Starbucks? Would that little handle they pull to make the steam come out be traumatic for your hands? :)
I'll go ask Fairy Princess now, haha!!
Don't you have to be gay+married to work there?
"little handle"????? have you SEEN :o :o :o that thing?!?! No wonder you have to be gay+married!!!!!!aye carumba!!!
Quote from: Parsifal on May 18, 2013, 08:58:57 AM
You're aware that someone had to make Final Fantasy (whatever that is).
umm... where are you going with this? You were talking about accessing the benefits of civilization, and the people who make the games are part of civilization and playing them is accessing the benefits... am I missing something here? ???
Unrelated note: I used to want to be one of the people making games, but they tend to live at their work (and I have many more interests than just games). Business computer programming is a better choice...
Quote from: snyprrr on May 18, 2013, 08:22:56 AM
... Anyhow, as of yesterday, WE HAVE OUR FIRST GIG!!!!!!!!!! SO, YAY!!!
I'm sure I'm not the lone soul who wants to know more.
Quote from: karlhenning on May 18, 2013, 07:44:47 PM
I'm sure I'm not the lone soul who wants to know more.
Clearly it means Obama's economic policies are bearing fruit. Probably a theme song for a company making solar panels or electric cars...
Hi. I'm a bit like you, except that my ego mostly died about ten years ago. When I was in school, all I wanted to do was draw, concentrate on things that interested me, and ignore my general education. When my parents asked me what my goals and future plans were, I would grumble something about being an artist. After graduating High School, I got a full time grocery store job working Produce (not heart attack inducing; it's best job in a grocery store by far.) I may have not been making great money, but, basically, I learned to be a Real Man and earn my keep in the world without outside help from others. Lately, wanting to concentrate on something I love, like the American Craft Beer movement, I have been doing a lot of studying of brewing and beer history and in a short while I hope to land a job in that industry doing something I love. As far as being a musician or artist, most are a dime a dozen, and even the really great ones probably need a day job as well.
Quote from: LVB_opus.125 on May 22, 2013, 05:55:31 AM
Hi. I'm a bit like you, except that my ego mostly died about ten years ago. When I was in school, all I wanted to do was draw, concentrate on things that interested me, and ignore my general education. When my parents asked me what my goals and future plans were, I would grumble something about being an artist. After graduating High School, I got a full time grocery store job working Produce (not heart attack inducing; it's best job in a grocery store by far.) I may have not been making great money, but, basically, I learned to be a Real Man and earn my keep in the world without outside help from others. Lately, wanting to concentrate on something I love, like the American Craft Beer movement, I have been doing a lot of studying of brewing and beer history and in a short while I hope to land a job in that industry doing something I love. As far as being a musician or artist, most are a dime a dozen, and even the really great ones probably need a day job as well.
1) Mine died too, it's just that I'm an idea machine, I can't stop,... haha, but, 'ideas' seem to be limited in terms of daily common sense, haha!
2) You're right, produce IS the way to go, but now, all Full Time positions (except for manager) have been pretty well eliminated. Yea, still, the produce guys were crusty,... hoooo but not like the angry meatcutters, haha! I worked in frozen,... which will mess with your good nature (the cold that is). And milk jugs are murder on the stuff between your fingers.
3) Yea, 'musician' is not what you want to be. That's like a union job. No, you haaave to be the sole super genius who comes up with something and sells it. I'm considering finding out where I can sell my Pop Songs. I know they're hits.
FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU.....
The nail file just dropped on the floor, in front of me, and it has flippin vanished!!!!! aaaaarrrrggghhhh
>:D >:D >:D >:D >:D >:D >:D >:D >:D
ok, cocktails before lunch, arrrgghh
Quote from: LVB_opus.125 on May 22, 2013, 05:55:31 AM
Lately, wanting to concentrate on something I love, like the American Craft Beer movement, I have been doing a lot of studying of brewing and beer history and in a short while I hope to land a job in that industry doing something I love. As far as being a musician or artist, most are a dime a dozen, and even the really great ones probably need a day job as well.
Good for you, man. Our local brewpub has a couple of artistic types working at it (one musician, one writer). They seem to enjoy what they're doing.
Quote from: Velimir on May 22, 2013, 07:41:59 AM
Good for you, man. Our local brewpub has a couple of artistic types working at it (one musician, one writer). They seem to enjoy what they're doing.
ok, so now that alcoholism has crept into the Thread Topic,... I'm glad I'm not drinking right now in my life, because, I have been drinking at other points in my life when I was in similar straits, and, of course, it it just adds another factor into the mix for me. However, liquor stores seem to be hiring, and being around it doesn't bother me in the slightest.
The dental cleaning lady says she needs a light at the end of her teeth-scraper. In my mind I have invented a durable fiber-optic scraper instead of metal. Anyone want to buy my multi-million dollar idea?
Quote from: snyprrr on May 22, 2013, 09:39:55 AM
However, liquor stores seem to be hiring, and being around it doesn't bother me in the slightest.
If liquor stores and dollar stores are hiring more than ever, what does that say...? :-X
Quote from: Greg on May 22, 2013, 10:39:55 AM
If liquor stores and dollar stores are hiring more than ever, what does that say...? :-X
Weez B wasted bro!! IF WE CAN TRADE JUUUUST A LITTLE MORE FREEDOM FOR SECURITY, I'M SURE WE'L;L all be ok.
btw- the pet sitting lady called me back. However, I started thinking about the gas consumption. It's like being a school bus driver with your own car. >:(
How bout that hilarious beheading in London? Have you seen the video? Sorry, it doesn't look that real. Did you see passersby just walking by as if nothing is happening? aaanyhooo...
I saw through the local club's flyer that old musicians seem to work till they drop. Spyro Gyra, etc.,... EVERYONE STILL PLAYS, all the old bands,... there's no retirement plan in music, is there?, haha!!
Well, just the little banter on this Thread has snapped me back to reality. Music is NOT accounting, haha!!!
There's the Asian story about the boy who gets to choose between a sword and a basll. If he picks the ball, he GETS the sword!! :o :o :o I feel like I picked the ball... big time, hah!
Quote from: snyprrr on May 23, 2013, 05:49:45 AM
How bout that hilarious beheading in London? Have you seen the video? Sorry, it doesn't look that real. Did you see passersby just walking by as if nothing is happening? aaanyhooo...
You're a funny guy....hilarious, even.