GMG Classical Music Forum

Referring to post-1945 western classical music up to the present day.

Interesting thread, James. There's so many possibilities and my list is nowhere near definitive. I'll be mostly picking pieces composed between 1945 to 1970 (with the exception of the Aho work), because I have a lesser tendency to enjoy music written after 1970 than music written before it. In no particular order with one piece per composer:

Shostakovich: Symphony no. 10 (1953)
Prokofiev: Symphony no. 6 (1947)
VW: Symphony no. 8 (1953-55)
Arnold: Symphony no. 5 (1961)
Holmboe: Four Symphonic Metamorphoses (1956-71)
Braga Santos: Symphony no. 4 (1950)
Rubbra: Symphony no. 7 (1957)
Aho: Symphonic Dances (2001)
Hartmann: Symphony no. 6 (1951-53)
Kabelac: Passacaglia The Mystery of Time (1957)

Morton Feldman - Coptic Light (1985)
Unlike the "typical", "quiet", "sparse" Feldman that I cherish as well, this work is tense and trance inducing. Not for the lighthearted.

Georg Friedrich Haas - in vain (2000)
Kind of a spectralist best of. And I do enjoy spectralists a lot.

Miloslav Kabeláč - Mystery of Time (1957)
I've gushed over this work of wonder before and I will again, as I feel it is indeed one of the greatest pieces of music out there. And by "out" I mean "still criminally unknown".

Petr Eben - Labyrinth of the World and the Paradise of the Heart (2003)
A stunning organ work based on a 17th century allegorical epic by a renowned Czech educator. Think Messiaen doing Dante's Inferno, sped up.

Olivier Messiaen - The Turangalîla-Symphonie (1949)
Speak of the devil.. I'd include this behemoth even on the basis of its first movement alone. The embodiment of tour de force.

Arvo Pärt - Tabula Rasa (1977)
The embodiment of tour de where are we really? God? Are you still there? Anybody? Oh, it's so nice in here. Let's just close our eyes and wait..

Thomas Adès - The Tempest (2004)
I'm hesitant to include Adès but I think I should be honest about my enjoyment of his celebrated opera, even though it's more of a catalogue of 20th century classical music. But I do really enjoy it and the libretto is a brilliant take on a well-beaten horse.

Steve Reich - Music for 18 musicians (1976)
Tough choice. I adore Different Trains but then again, I adore M18 even more.

Philip Glass - Satyagraha / Akhnaten (1979 / 1983)
A little bit of cheating, I know, but hey, look at those guys in the "3 x 3 x 3 favourite composers" thread! And I truly can't decide. These operas contain both moments of earth-shaking power and humanity-transcending beauty.

Alan Hovhaness - Symphony no.2 'Mysterious Mountain' (1955)
Had to sneak in the Tallis Fantasia in here somehow!

Quote from: Rinaldo on September 28, 2013, 02:37:24 PM
Miloslav Kabeláč - Mystery of Time (1957)
I've gushed over this work of wonder before and I will again, as I feel it is indeed one of the greatest pieces of music out there. And by "out" I mean "still criminally unknown".

I think I'll replace the Rautavaara with the Kabelac. Kudos for mentioning it, Rinaldo!

I'm probably forgetting a dozen must-haves (Martinu, Villa-Lobos, RVW), but this will have to do until I do a proper one..
Clarinet Concerto (Aho)
Faust Cantata (Schnittke)
Ainsi la nuit... (Dutilleux)
Tabula Rasa (Pärt)
Symphony No. 14 (Shostakovich)
Clarinet Sonata (Poulenc)
Nocturne (Britten)
Cello Sonata (Poulenc)
Violin Sonata No. 1 (Prokofiev)
Piano Concerto No. 3 (Bartók)

Such a difficult task, but here goes nothing:

Shostakovich: Violin Concerto No. 1 (1947-48)
Hartmann: Symphony No. 6 (1951-1953)
Schnittke: Viola Concerto (1985)
Vaughan Williams: Symphony No. 8 (1953-1955)
W. Schuman: Symphony No. 10 'American Muse' (1975)
Milhaud: Symphony No. 6 (1955)
Villa-Lobos: Gênesis (1954)
Copland: Clarinet Concerto (1948)
Martinu: Oboe Concerto (1955)
Chavez: Sinfonía romántica (1953)

Again, a list like this could never be all-inclusive, but I gave it a shot anyway. :)

Only two come immediately to mind (plus I'd have to check some dates on others). But two I am sure of:
Karel Husa: Music for Prague 1968
Johan de Meij: Symphony No. 1 (maybe this is temporary, but I have been quite taken with it)

Quote from: kyjo on September 28, 2013, 01:43:59 PM
Interesting thread, James. There's so many possibilities and my list is nowhere near definitive. I'll be mostly picking pieces composed between 1945 to 1970 (with the exception of the Aho work), because I have a lesser tendency to enjoy music written after 1970 than music written before it. In no particular order with one piece per composer:

Shostakovich: Symphony no. 10 (1953)
Prokofiev: Symphony no. 6 (1947)
VW: Symphony no. 8 (1953-55)
Arnold: Symphony no. 5 (1961)
Holmboe: Four Symphonic Metamorphoses (1956-71)
Braga Santos: Symphony no. 4 (1950)
Rubbra: Symphony no. 7 (1957)
Aho: Symphonic Dances (2001)
Hartmann: Symphony no. 6 (1951-53)
Kabelac: Passacaglia The Mystery of Time (1957)

I largely agree with this list!

Kabelac Mystery of Time
Kalabis Sinfonia Pacis
Vasks Symphony 2
Vaughan Williams Symphony 9 (or 6)
Braga Santos Symphony 4 (or 3)
Shostakovich Symphony 10
Prokofiev Symphony 6
Freitas Branco Symphony 4
Rubbra Symphony 5 (or 7)
Arnold Symphony 5

Hon mention Honegger Symphony 3

Ten's impossible--not that twelve's any more possible ;)

So, to attempt the impossible, one work per composer, and only large orchestral or orchestral/vocal works. I may submit a chamber list later.


Havergal Brian Symphony #8 B minor (1948)
Fartein Valen Symphony #4 (1947-49)
Vaughan Williams Symphony #8 D minor (1953-55)
Shostakovich Symphony #15 A major (1971)
Prokofiev Symphony #7 C sharp minor (1951-52)
Rautavaara Symphony #3 (1961)
Stravinsky Agon (1957)
Britten War Requiem (1961)
Korngold Symphony in F Sharp major (1947-52)
Pettersson Symphony #6 (1963-66)
Lloyd Symphony #4 (1946)
Strauss Vier letzte Lieder (1948)


Sarge

Pettersson Violin Concerto #2
Pettersson Symphony #7
Britten War Requiem
Brian Symphony #10
Simpson Haydn Variations Quartet
Schnittke Peer Gynt
Feldman for Piano and String Quartet
Feldman Rothko Chapel
Andriessen De Staat
Stockhausen Stimmung

Quote from: springrite on September 29, 2013, 04:28:40 AM
Pettersson Violin Concerto #2
Pettersson Symphony #7

Those would be high on my list as well!

10 favorite chamber works since WWII

Henning Viola Sonata (2012)
Shostakovich String Quartet #3 F major (1946)
Shostakovich String Quartet #7 F sharp minor (1960)
Boulez Le marteau sans maître for alto and six instruments (1953–55; revised 1957)
Feldman Crippled Symmetry for flute, percussion and piano/celeste (1983)
Prokofiev Violin Sonata #1 F minor (1946)
Britten String Quartet #3 (1975)
Poulenc Sonata for Clarinet and Piano (1962)
Wuorinen String Quartet #2 (1979)
Sallinen String Quartet #3 (1969)


Sarge

Shostakovich Symphony No.10
Hartmann Symphony No.2
Holmboe Symphony No.8
Rautavaara Symphony No.7
Messiaen Turangalîla-Symphonie
Honegger Symphony No.3
Korngold Violin Concerto
Adams Harmonielehre
Stockhausen Klavierstück X
Schnittke Viola Concerto

chronological, 1945-1975 (other selections in other thread)
Lloyd: Symphony #5 (1947)
Strauss: Vier letzte Lieder (1948)
Lutoslawski: Concerto for Orchestra (1950-54)
Prokofiev: Symphony #7 C sharp minor (1951-52)
Shostakovich: Symphony no. 10 (1953)
Martinu: Oboe Concerto (1955)
Holmboe: Four Symphonic Metamorphoses (1956-71)
Bernstein: West Side Story (1957)
Poulenc: Flute Sonata (1957) (also orchestration by Lennox Berkeley, 1973)
Shostakovich: String Quartet #8 (1960)

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on September 29, 2013, 07:12:10 AM
Shostakovich Symphony No.10
Hartmann Symphony No.2
Holmboe Symphony No.8
Rautavaara Symphony No.7
Messiaen Turangalîla-Symphonie
Honegger Symphony No.3
Korngold Violin Concerto
Adams Harmonielehre
Stockhausen Klavierstück X
Schnittke Viola Concerto

You like Stockhausen, Ilaria?! ??? Don't worry, we can still be friends! :D Very nice list BTW. I'm going to include the Rautavaara and Adams works in my list for the post-1975 thread. :)

Quote from: Brian on September 29, 2013, 07:26:49 AM
chronological, 1945-1975 (other selections in other thread)
Lloyd: Symphony #5 (1947)
Strauss: Vier letzte Lieder (1948)
Lutoslawski: Concerto for Orchestra (1950-54)
Prokofiev: Symphony #7 C sharp minor (1951-52)
Shostakovich: Symphony no. 10 (1953)
Martinu: Oboe Concerto (1955)
Holmboe: Four Symphonic Metamorphoses (1956-71)
Bernstein: West Side Story (1957)
Poulenc: Flute Sonata (1957) (also orchestration by Lennox Berkeley, 1973)
Shostakovich: String Quartet #8 (1960)

Nice list! I especially love your inclusion of the Holmboe, needless to say! :D You're the second member to list a Lloyd symphony-that's great to see!

Quote from: kyjo on September 29, 2013, 08:19:32 AM
Nice list! I especially love your inclusion of the Holmboe, needles to say! :D You're the second member to list a Lloyd symphony-that's great to see!

Interestingly Vagn Holmboe is the only composer on my 1945-1975 AND 1975-2013 lists!

Quote from: kyjo on September 29, 2013, 08:16:20 AM
You like Stockhausen, Ilaria?! ??? Don't worry, we can still be friends! :D Very nice list BTW. I'm going to include the Rautavaara and Adams works in my list for the post-1975 thread. :)

No, I'm not a great fan of Stockhausen, most of his music (especially the electronic one) still sounds rather strange to me; but he composed very interesting works like the Klavierstück X, Zyklus and Kontakte.

On second thoughts, I could replace the Stockhausen with Martinu's Piano Concerto No.4, I had incredibly forgotten it before....

Quote from: James on September 29, 2013, 09:17:27 AM
Heaven forbid anyone liking something that actually breaks the mold and is different.

I was only joking, James. :)

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on September 29, 2013, 09:04:06 AM
On second thoughts, I could replace the Stockhausen with Martinu's Piano Concerto No.4, I had incredibly forgotton it before....

Ah yes, Martinu's PC 4. A great work. Such imaginative atmospheres and textures are incorporated into this work.

Quote from: Sergeant Rock on September 29, 2013, 04:09:16 AM
Ten's impossible--not that twelve's any more possible ;)

So, to attempt the impossible, one work per composer, and only large orchestral or orchestral/vocal works. I may submit a chamber list later.


Havergal Brian Symphony #8 B minor (1948)
Fartein Valen Symphony #4 (1947-49)
Vaughan Williams Symphony #8 D minor (1953-55)
Shostakovich Symphony #15 A major (1971)
Prokofiev Symphony #7 C sharp minor (1951-52)
Rautavaara Symphony #3 (1961)
Stravinsky Agon (1957)
Britten War Requiem (1961)
Korngold Symphony in F Sharp major (1947-52)
Pettersson Symphony #6 (1963-66)
Lloyd Symphony #4 (1946)
Strauss Vier letzte Lieder (1948)


Sarge

Great list.

Quote from: James on September 29, 2013, 09:45:46 AM
Martinu is no replacement for such a one-of-kind master like Stockhausen

To degrade Martinu as to anything less than a 'one of a kind master' pretty much sums up how you feel about composers who aren't Stockhausen. You continuously tell us all, who don't like Stockhausen, to 'open up our ears' but with this kind of comment I quoted from you, it is you who actually are in dire need of opening your ears.

Quote from: James on September 29, 2013, 09:17:27 AM
Heaven forbid anyone liking something that actually breaks the mold and is different.

Why do I think YOU are crying out: I need some love! You don't need to hide behind Stockhausen, and we (well, most of us) do love (well, mostly tolerate) you!

Another attempt here, some favourite pieces in chronological order (not exactly the kind of music James is thinking about, perhaps, but then, Contemporary music is so much more than just the narrow path of strict Modernism):

Havergal Brian, Symphony No. 8 (1949)
Vagn Holmboe, Sinfonia Boreale [No. 8] (1952)
Alberto Ginastera, Variaciones concertantes (1953)
Ralph Vaughan Williams, Symphony No. 9 (1957)
Dmitri Shostakovich, Symphony No. 15 (1971)
Einar Englund, Symphony No. 4 'Nostalgic' (1976)
Malcolm Arnold, Symphony No. 9 (1986)
Robert Simpson, Symphony No. 9 (1987)
Veljo Tormis, Unustatud rahvad (Forgotten Peoples) (1970-1989)
Peteris Vasks, Symphony No. 2 (1999)

Quote from: James on September 29, 2013, 12:38:53 PM
Calm down. I like plenty of composers .. and each one is irreplaceable/indispensable & unique. As it should be.

I'm quite calm, I was just merely telling you how you were wrong, which you still are about Martinu.

Quote from: Mirror Image on September 29, 2013, 02:12:58 PM
I'm quite calm, I was just merely telling you how you were wrong, which you still are about Martinu.

I wouldn't say he is wrong. Nobody is really wrong here. It is more of a social etiquette thing.

Wait! How the hell did I get to 4000 posts? I am supposed to be working all the time! Well, I know it is a modest number compared to the Johns (and soon, Kyjo) of this world, but still!

I'm most amazed by the prejudice toward symphonies and large orchestral works. For some reason, many of my favorite works from the last 60 years are chamber music. It's more true post-1975 for me (almost half that list is chamber music), but in the 1945-1975 and 1975-2013 lists combined, I have a total of only 4 symphonies. So it's surprising to me that Sarge, Jeffrey, Kyle, etc. can have lists of top 10 works where 7-9 of them are symphonies.

Quote from: Brian on October 01, 2013, 07:00:20 AM
I'm most amazed by the prejudice toward symphonies and large orchestral works. For some reason, many of my favorite works from the last 60 years are chamber music. It's more true post-1975 for me (almost half that list is chamber music), but in the 1945-1975 and 1975-2013 lists combined, I have a total of only 4 symphonies. So it's surprising to me that Sarge, Jeffrey, Kyle, etc. can have lists of top 10 works where 7-9 of them are symphonies.

It would be easy (seriously) to make a Top 50 Symphonies covering the time period. Despite the Stockhausens and Boulezs, the tradition continued, and the music is marvelous...well, a few of us think so anyway  8)

Sarge

Quote from: Brian on October 01, 2013, 07:00:20 AM
I'm most amazed by the prejudice toward symphonies and large orchestral works. For some reason, many of my favorite works from the last 60 years are chamber music. It's more true post-1975 for me (almost half that list is chamber music), but in the 1945-1975 and 1975-2013 lists combined, I have a total of only 4 symphonies. So it's surprising to me that Sarge, Jeffrey, Kyle, etc. can have lists of top 10 works where 7-9 of them are symphonies.

The form of the symphony is the one I am most attracted to. As much as I like concertos, ballets, choral/orchestral works, and some chamber music, the vast majority of my favorites in any category will always be symphonies.

Quote from: kyjo on September 29, 2013, 09:39:08 AM
I was only joking, James. :)

James had a humorectomy early on . . . .

Quote from: kyjo on October 01, 2013, 10:55:44 AM
The form of the symphony is the one I am most attracted to. As much as I like concertos, ballets, choral/orchestral works, and some chamber music, the vast majority of my favorites in any category will always be symphonies.

One could easily compose such a list purely of unaccompanied choral works, BTW.

Quote from: karlhenning on October 01, 2013, 10:59:02 AM
One could easily compose such a list purely of unaccompanied choral works, BTW.

Oh goodness, yes! Lauridsen, Tormis, Rautavaara, Glass... almost a golden age for unaccompanied choir. Silver age or something.

Quote from: James on October 01, 2013, 12:21:06 PM
So your orientation is more traditional / conservative.

Yes, compared to yours, at least. :)

Actually I like lists, although I'm aware how questionable they are. But 10 are definately too little.

Boulez - Pli Selon Pli
Elliott Carter - Double Concerto for Harpsichord & Piano with Two Chamber Orchestras
Feldman - Rothko Chapel
Ferneyhough - 3rd string quartet
Lachenmann - El Grido
Ligeti - Atmospheres
Lutoslawski - 3rd Symphony
Messiaen - Des canyons aux étoiles...
Nancarrow - Studies for Player Piano
Nono - Prometeo
Penderecki - Threnodi
Schnittke - Viola Concerto
Shostakovich - 10th Symphony
Stockhausen - Hymnen
Stravinsky - Agon
Xenakis - Metastasis
B.A. Zimmermann - Die Soldaten

I'm a sucker for huge orchestrations, but there are two string quartets too

Quote from: Sergeant Rock on October 01, 2013, 07:06:12 AM
It would be easy (seriously) to make a Top 50 Symphonies covering the time period. Despite the Stockhausens and Boulezs, the tradition continued, and the music is marvelous...well, a few of us think so anyway  8)
Sarge

My words.  ;)

Quote from: Brian on September 29, 2013, 07:26:49 AM
chronological, 1945-1975 (other selections in other thread)
Lloyd: Symphony #5 (1947)
Strauss: Vier letzte Lieder (1948)
Lutoslawski: Concerto for Orchestra (1950-54)
Prokofiev: Symphony #7 C sharp minor (1951-52)
Shostakovich: Symphony no. 10 (1953)
Martinu: Oboe Concerto (1955)
Holmboe: Four Symphonic Metamorphoses (1956-71)
Bernstein: West Side Story (1957)
Poulenc: Flute Sonata (1957) (also orchestration by Lennox Berkeley, 1973)
Shostakovich: String Quartet #8 (1960)

This is the most congenial list I have seen posted here.

Four Last Songs probably tops my list. Other must haves:
Simpson 9
Nyman Facing Goya
Thomson The Feast Of Love
Shostakovich 49-72 (puzzle for Nate)
Sondheim Sweeney Todd

Quote from: James on September 29, 2013, 09:17:27 AM
Heaven forbid anyone liking something that actually breaks the mold and is different.

Nice to hear such a ringing endorsement of minimalism, and indeed the entire rejection of serialist dogma we have seen in the past few decades.

UPDATED by merging my previous posts in both this thread and the living composers thread.

TOP TEN
Lloyd: Symphony #5 (1947)
Strauss: Vier letzte Lieder (1948)
Lutoslawski: Concerto for Orchestra (1950-54)
Prokofiev: Symphony #7 in C sharp minor (1951-52)
Kernis: String Quartet No. 1, "musica celestis" (1990)
Rouse: Flute Concerto (1993)
Glass: Symphony No. 3 (1995)
Czarnecki: String Quartet No. 2, "Spis" (1997)
Penderecki: String Quintet (after Quartet No. 3; 2008)
Penderecki: Horn Concerto, "Winterreise" (2008-09)

ARGH WHY COULDN'T IT BE TOP TWENTY-FIVE
Shostakovich: Symphony no. 10 (1953)
Martinu: Oboe Concerto (1955)
Holmboe: Four Symphonic Metamorphoses (1956-71)
Bernstein: West Side Story (1957)
Poulenc: Flute Sonata (1957) (also orchestration by Lennox Berkeley, 1973)
Shostakovich: String Quartet #8 (1960)
Glass: String Quartet No. 4, "Buczak" (1989)
Holmboe: Viola Concerto (1992)
Rautavaara: Canto IV, for string orchestra (1992)
Lauridsen: O magnum mysterium (1994)
Frank: Danza de los Saqsampillos (2000; arr. for two marimbas 2006)
Dorman: Piccolo Concerto (2001)
Frank: Leyendas, for string quartet (2001)
Aho: Symphonic Dances (2001)
Kats-Chernin: Ornamental Air, for basset clarinet and orchestra (2007)
Malecki: The Dream of Frédéric, for string quartet (2010)


It's interesting to me that even expanded to 26, I couldn't think of anything between 1960 and 1989, but plenty before and after.

I'll keep it post-1970 to make it more interesting:

In approximate order:
Ligeti Clocks and Clouds
Ligeti Piano Concerto
Messiaen Des Canyons aux Etoiles
Ligeti San Francisco Polyphony
Ades Asyla
Feldman Piano and String Quartet
Feldman Rothko Chapel
Feldman Coptic Light
Boulez Notations for Orchestra (orchestrated version is post-1970)
Reich Music for 18 Musicians

Quote from: EigenUser on January 27, 2015, 12:11:03 AM
I'll keep it post-1970 to make it more interesting:

Nice list, Nate - although a bit narrow with just six composers.
BTW, where is that Ligeti quotation in your signature from? I presume he meant 'medal' and not 'metal'.  8)

Quote from: North Star on January 27, 2015, 12:15:56 AM
Nice list, Nate - although a bit narrow with just six composers.
BTW, where is that Ligeti quotation in your signature from? I presume he meant 'medal' and not 'metal'.  8)

Yes, I know it's narrow. ::) But it is what I love.

Thanks for pointing out that error in my signature BTW. I can't believe I've had that for over half of a year!

From this interview (in part 2, start around 7:20 in the video)
https://www.youtube.com/v/aNFq6HIlMEc
https://www.youtube.com/v/DEuUM6hAcDY

Quote from: EigenUser on January 27, 2015, 12:23:02 AM
Yes, I know it's narrow. ::) But it is what I love.

Nice interview, I think I must have asked about this before (and hence seen the video before, too)
Of course, and a list of ten is going to be narrow in any case. I'd rather just copy my list from the 1950-2000 thread.

Quote from: North Star on January 15, 2014, 09:11:08 AM
Boulez: Le marteau sans maître (1953-7)
Tippett: Fantasia Concertante on a Theme of Corelli (1953)
Finzi: Cello Concerto (1955)
Stravinsky: Agon (1954–57)
Britten: Nocturne, Op. 60 (1958)

Martinů: Nonet (1959)
Villa-Lobos: Floresta do Amazonas (1959)
Ligeti: Atmosphères (1961)
Stevenson: Passacaglia on DSCH (1960-1962)
Hartmann: Symphony no. 8 (1962)

Messiaen: Et exspecto resurrectionem mortuorum (1964)
Scelsi: Uaxuctum (1966)
Shostakovich: Symphony No. 14 (1969) 
Holmboe: Chamber Symphony No. 3, op. 103a "Frise" (1969-70)
Dutilleux: Ainsi la nuit (1976)
Xenakis: Dikhthas (for vln & pno) (1979)

Lutosławski: Symphony No. 3 (1981–83)
Schnittke: Concerto for Mixed Chorus (1984–85)
Pärt: Stabat Mater (1985)
Carter: String Quartet No. 4 (1986)
Tavener: The Protecting Veil (1988)

Finnissy: Gershwin Arrangements (1975–88)
Takemitsu: A String around Autumn (1989)
Bryars: After the Requiem (1990)
Kurtág: ΣΤΗΛΗ (Stele) (1994)
Romitelli: Professor Bad Trip: Lesson I (1998)

And add to that:
Aho: Clarinet Concerto (2005)
Ligeti: Piano Etudes

Quote from: Brian on January 26, 2015, 05:10:25 PM

It's interesting to me that even expanded to 26, I couldn't think of anything between 1960 and 1989, but plenty before and after.

Suggestions  ;)

Shostakovich
Op. 113: Symphony No. 13 in B-flat minor Babi-Yar (1962)
Op. 135: Symphony No. 14 (1969)
Op. 141: Symphony No. 15 in A major (1971)
Op. 126: Cello Concerto No. 2 in G major (1966)
Op. 129: Violin Concerto No. 2 in C-sharp minor (1967)
Op. 117: String Quartet No. 9 in E-flat major (1964)
Op. 118: String Quartet No. 10 in A-flat major (1964)
Op. 122: String Quartet No. 11 in F minor (1966)
Op. 133: String Quartet No. 12 in D-flat major (1968)
Op. 138: String Quartet No. 13 in B-flat minor (1970)
Op. 142: String Quartet No. 14 in F-sharp major (1972–1973)
Op. 144: String Quartet No. 15 in E-flat minor (1974)
Op. 134: Sonata for violin and piano (1968)
Op. 147: Sonata for viola and piano (1975)

Havergal Brian Symphonies 15-32

Well, okay, if anyone is interested: I will do this with the caveat that minutes later, the list would be different, because I am just following my turbulent stream of consciousness, full of rapids, rocks, and waterfalls:

(And therefore not in any particular order   ;)   )

Hartmann: Symphonies VI-VIII
Carrillo: Mass for Pope John XXIII (a capella in a quarter-tone system)
Wuorinen: Grand Bamboula for Orchestra
Karl Henning: Nuhro, Annabel Lee, and Out in the Sun
Luke Ottevanger Piano Sonatas
Herrmann: Psycho
Penderecki: Threnody
Poulenc: Dialogues of the Carmelites
Vyacheslav Ovchinnikov: Symphony #1 and War and Peace film score
Glass: The Illusionist film score

Quote from: Ken B on January 26, 2015, 04:45:46 PM
Nice to hear such a ringing endorsement of minimalism, and indeed the entire rejection of serialist dogma we have seen in the past few decades.

I see you've met "If I like it, it breaks the mold!" James.

Quote from: Cato on January 27, 2015, 04:58:56 AM
Well, okay, if anyone is interested: I will do this with the caveat that minutes later, the list would be different, because I am just following my turbulent stream of consciousness, full of rapids, rocks, and waterfalls:

(And therefore not in any particular order   ;)   )

Hartmann: Symphonies VI-VIII
Carrillo: Mass for Pope John XXIII (a capella in a quarter-tone system)
Wuorinen: Grand Bamboula for Orchestra
Karl Henning: Nuhro, Annabel Lee, and Out in the Sun
Luke Ottevanger Piano Sonatas
Herrmann: Psycho
Penderecki: Threnody
Poulenc: Dialogues of the Carmelites
Vyacheslav Ovchinnikov: Symphony #1 and War and Peace film score
Glass: The Illusionist film score

Thanks, and I am going to show Nuhro to this as-yet-unnamed Boston collective . . . .

Quote from: North Star on January 27, 2015, 01:36:29 AM
Nice interview, I think I must have asked about this before (and hence seen the video before, too)
Of course, and a list of ten is going to be narrow in any case. I'd rather just copy my list from the 1950-2000 thread.

Actually, let's remove Rothko Chapel (not that I don't love it, but just to make room -- plus it gets enough love already) and put in Takemitsu's Dream/Window. Seeing Takemitsu on your list reminded me.

In approximate order:
Ligeti Clocks and Clouds
Ligeti Piano Concerto
Messiaen Des Canyons aux Etoiles
Ligeti San Francisco Polyphony
Ades Asyla
Feldman Piano and String Quartet
Takemitsu Dream/Window
Feldman Coptic Light
Boulez Notations for Orchestra (orchestrated version is post-1970)
Reich Music for 18 Musicians

If I were to add yet another I would say to remove Ligeti's San Francisco Polyphony and add Steven Mackey's Ars Moriendi to the bottom of the list, but I'm not so sure about that. I rarely listen to it (a very sad piece). So, never mind.

While narrow as far as composers go (three Ligeti and two Feldman), I think it is pretty diverse in terms of what the music sounds like and actual style. It encompasses (here we go!) post-serialism (Boulez), post-impressionism (Takemitsu), proto-minimalism (Feldman), mock-minimalism (Ligeti C&C), hardcore-minimalism (Reich), post-minimalism-fusion (Ades), birdsongism (Messiaen), and whatever-the-hell-I-want-to-do-ism (Ligeti PC).

Quote from: EigenUser on January 27, 2015, 07:26:26 AMActually, let's remove Rothko Chapel (not that I don't love it, but just to make room -- plus it gets enough love already) and put in Takemitsu's Dream/Window. Seeing Takemitsu on your list reminded me.

If I were to add yet another I would say to remove Ligeti's San Francisco Polyphony and add Steven Mackey's Ars Moriendi to the bottom of the list, but I'm not so sure about that. I rarely listen to it (a very sad piece). So, never mind.

While narrow as far as composers go (three Ligeti and two Feldman), I think it is pretty diverse in terms of what the music sounds like and actual style. It encompasses (here we go!) post-serialism (Boulez), post-impressionism (Takemitsu), proto-minimalism (Feldman), mock-minimalism (Ligeti C&C), hardcore-minimalism (Reich), post-minimalism-fusion (Ades), birdsongism (Messiaen), and whatever-the-hell-I-want-to-do-ism (Ligeti PC).

Very nice list, and I agree that there is more to variety than just lots of different composers, and the Ligeti selections certainly aren't homogeneous. And Canyons is much more than just birdsongism.  8)

Time to revise my list (in no particular order):

1. Vaughan Williams: Symphony No. 8 (1953-55)
2. Ligeti: Melodien (1971)
3. Kurtág: Stele (1994)
4. Lutoslawski: Chantefleurs et Chantefables (1989-90)
5. Scelsi: Uaxuctum (1966)
6. Schnittke: Symphony No. 8 (1994)
7. Adams: Harmonielehre (1985)
8. Pärt: Tabula Rasa (1977)
9. Britten: Phaedra (1975)
10. Sculthorpe: Kakadu (1988)

Messiaen: Turangalîla-Symphonie (1946-8)
Varèse: Déserts (1950-4)
Boulez: Le marteau sans maître (1955)
Finzi: Cello Concerto in A minor (1955)
Martinů: Oboe Concerto (1955)
Stravinsky: Requiem Canticles (1966)
Lucier: I Am Sitting in a Room (1969)
Shostakovich: String Quartet No. 13 in B-flat minor (1969-70)
Feldman: Rothko Chapel (1971)
Reich: Music for 18 Musicians (1974-6)
Crumb: Apparition (1979)
Grisey: Les Espaces Acoustiques (1974-80)
Schnittke: String Quartet No. 2 (1981)
Glass: Koyaanisqatsi (1982)
Xenakis: Keqrops (1986)
Welmers: Minimal Music for Organ (1989)
Takemitsu: From Me Flows What You Call Time (1990)
Pelēcis: Nevertheless (1993)
Lauridsen: O Magnum Mysterium (1994)
Ligeti: Études pour piano (1985-2001)
J.C. Adams: The Dharma at Big Sur (2003)
Furrer: Piano Concerto (2007)
Dusapin: Seven Solos for Orchestra (1994-2008)
Chin: Cello Concerto (2009)
Haas: limited approximations (2010)
J.L. Adams: Become Ocean (2013)



(oops)

Ok, time to present a second list too, with a few fresh 'discoveries' added. Again, in chronological order:

Herman D. Koppel, Symphony No. 3 (1945)
Eduard Tubin, Symphony No. 6 (1954)
Camargo Guarnieri, Chôro para violoncelo e orquestra (1961)
Henri Dutilleux, Timbres, Espace, Mouvement (1978)
Sulkhan Nassidze, Concerto for Violin, Cello and Chamber Orchestra (1982)
Vagn Holmboe, Symphony No. 13 (1994)
Richard Einhorn, Voices of Light (1994)
John Kinsella, Symphony No. 7 (1997)
Arvo Pärt, Kanon Pokajanen (1997)
Ēriks Ešenvalds, Passion and Resurrection (2005)

Quote from: James on January 27, 2015, 02:30:56 PM
These terms/boxes are meaningless to me.

Alexia, the next plague.

Galina Ustvolskaya ~ Grand Duet ~ simplicity without cliché, ecstasy without sensuality
Igor Stravinsky ~ Requiem Canticles ~ the perfection of serialism Cornelius Cardew ~ The Great Learning ~ a musical mass movement
Karlheinz Stockhausen ~ Mikrophonie I ~ the invention of the sounding icon
György Kurtág ~ Messages of the late Miss R. S. Troussova ~ the postwar Dichterliebe
Heinz Holliger ~ String Quartet No. 1 ~ companion to Op. 131
Luc Ferrari ~ Presque rien ~ the composer as storyteller
Morton Feldman ~ Neither ~ a modern opera (var. 1)
Robert Ashley ~ Perfect Lives ~ a modern opera (var. 2)
La Monte Young ~ The Well-Tuned Piano ~ beyond the twelve tones
Salvatore Sciarrino ~ Quaderno di strada ~ the return of melody
Alvin Curran ~ Inner Cities ~ the piano, like the world, contains everything

Quote from: amw on January 27, 2015, 05:04:05 PM
Galina Ustvolskaya ~ Grand Duet ~ simplicity without cliché, ecstasy without sensuality
Igor Stravinsky ~ Requiem Canticles ~ the perfection of serialism
Karlheinz Stockhausen ~ Mikrophonie I ~ the invention of the sounding icon
György Kurtág ~ Messages of the late Miss R. S. Troussova ~ the postwar Dichterliebe
Heinz Holliger ~ String Quartet No. 1 ~ companion to Op. 131
Luc Ferrari ~ Presque rien ~ the composer as storyteller
Morton Feldman ~ Neither ~ a modern opera (var. 1)
Robert Ashley ~ Perfect Lives ~ a modern opera (var. 2)
La Monte Young ~ The Well-Tuned Piano ~ beyond the twelve tones
Salvatore Sciarrino ~ Quaderno di strada ~ the return of melody
Alvin Curran ~ Inner Cities ~ the piano, like the world, contains everything

I haven't heard Feldman's Neither, yet (at least, I don't think I have). I've only heard the Ustvolskaya a few times, but I was very much impressed by it. Indeed, "simplicity without cliche". Well said.

No Messiaen or Ligeti? (It's okay, those guys get enough love as it is... good for you for choosing some slightly less-known stuff!)

Quote from: amw on January 27, 2015, 05:04:05 PM
Galina Ustvolskaya ~ Grand Duet ~ simplicity without cliché, ecstasy without sensuality
Igor Stravinsky ~ Requiem Canticles ~ the perfection of serialism
Karlheinz Stockhausen ~ Mikrophonie I ~ the invention of the sounding icon
György Kurtág ~ Messages of the late Miss R. S. Troussova ~ the postwar Dichterliebe
Heinz Holliger ~ String Quartet No. 1 ~ companion to Op. 131
Luc Ferrari ~ Presque rien ~ the composer as storyteller
Morton Feldman ~ Neither ~ a modern opera (var. 1)
Robert Ashley ~ Perfect Lives ~ a modern opera (var. 2)
La Monte Young ~ The Well-Tuned Piano ~ beyond the twelve tones
Salvatore Sciarrino ~ Quaderno di strada ~ the return of melody
Alvin Curran ~ Inner Cities ~ the piano, like the world, contains everything

I know a few these pieces, Strav, Stock, Young. Some intriguing comments (but of course melody never left, though some tried to banish it). I have heard a few things by Ferrari and quite liked a couple. Curran is a new name to me, as is Ashley. I will hunt a few of these on Spotify. Not the operas though!

Hmmm. I find these lists surprising. Perhaps I shouldn't.

Cornelius Cardew - The Great Learning
John White - Piano sonata no. 90
Lou Harrison - Double concerto for violin, cello + gamelan
Jean Barraqué - Concerto for clarinet, vibraphone etc
Aarre Merikanto - Genesis
Tom Dissevelt - Fantasy in Orbit
John Cage - Sonatas + Interludes
Harry Partch - Castor and Pollux
Terry Riley - Poppy Nogood and the Phantom Band
Bernd Alois Zimmermann - Les Soupirs du Roi Ubu

I was tempted to include the Medtner piano quintet (1903-49), but that's stretching things a bit.

Quote from: amw on January 27, 2015, 05:04:05 PM
Galina Ustvolskaya ~ Grand Duet ~ simplicity without cliché, ecstasy without sensuality
Igor Stravinsky ~ Requiem Canticles ~ the perfection of serialism
Karlheinz Stockhausen ~ Mikrophonie I ~ the invention of the sounding icon
György Kurtág ~ Messages of the late Miss R. S. Troussova ~ the postwar Dichterliebe
Heinz Holliger ~ String Quartet No. 1 ~ companion to Op. 131
Luc Ferrari ~ Presque rien ~ the composer as storyteller
Morton Feldman ~ Neither ~ a modern opera (var. 1)
Robert Ashley ~ Perfect Lives ~ a modern opera (var. 2)
La Monte Young ~ The Well-Tuned Piano ~ beyond the twelve tones
Salvatore Sciarrino ~ Quaderno di strada ~ the return of melody
Alvin Curran ~ Inner Cities ~ the piano, like the world, contains everything

What's the op 131/Holliger connection about? Feldman denied that Neither was an opera, was it staged? Interesting choice from Kurtag rather than Kafka Fragments (post war Winterreise.) I too like the Ustvolskaya duet and the Ferrari. Some of the music I've never heard but I'll try to hear it (Curran, Ashley)

Quote from: Dax on January 28, 2015, 09:12:31 AM
Cornelius Cardew - The Great Learning

Excellent choice. I might displace Stravinsky for this one, actually (serialism itself being a prewar development).

Quote from: Ken B on January 28, 2015, 05:55:08 AM(but of course melody never left, though some tried to banish it).

Sciarrino brings melody—and a sense of line—and a minimalist concentration on process and gradual transformation—to a postwar aesthetic of alienation and loss. He's not afraid of ugliness, nor of repeating ideas and beautiful colours and textures. It's music that requires relativism and pluralism, post-structuralism, to exist. (The String Quartet No. 8 & the 12 Madrigali are more accessible starting points perhaps.)

Quote from: Mandryka on January 28, 2015, 09:35:57 AM
What's the op 131/Holliger connection about?

Holliger's 1st quartet seems to me to interact with its tradition in a critical and radical way, rather than in a reactionary or escapist or wilfully bizarre way. Within the string quartet literature, Op. 131 is the only other work so extreme for its time. Also important as a long work that plays continuously with no movement breaks—possibly the earliest such work in the quartet repertoire—and sharing its rhetorical force.

Quote
Feldman denied that Neither was an opera, was it staged?

That denial of course makes up part of its status as a 'modern opera': it can't be a 'normal' opera like the old-fashioned ones, not without self-awareness, without a meta-narrative of some kind. (And yes it's been staged, though not with Feldman's approval I don't think.)

Let' see, let' see... Sooo tough to choose only 10, but I'll give it a try (alphabetical by composer):

Luciano Berio: Sinfonía
Pierre Boulez; La Marteau sans maître
Pierre Boulez: Pli selon pli
Pierre Boulez: Répons
Elliott Carter: A Symphony of three orchestras
George Enescu: Symphonie de chambre op. 33
Cristóbal Halffter: Versus
Bruno Maderna: Vioiln Concerto
Karlheinz Stockhausen: Michaels Reise um die Erde
Igor Stravinsky: Agon

EDIT: Looking at my list, I realize it's very biased towards one composer, as well as to orchestral (or ensemble) muisc in general...but what the heck, these are the pieces that (if I have to reduce the number of works to only 10) first come to mind

Quote from: amw on January 28, 2015, 01:04:00 PM
Excellent choice. I might displace Stravinsky for this one, actually (serialism itself being a prewar development).
Sciarrino brings melody—and a sense of line—and a minimalist concentration on process and gradual transformation—to a postwar aesthetic of alienation and loss. He's not afraid of ugliness, nor of repeating ideas and beautiful colours and textures. It's music that requires relativism and pluralism, post-structuralism, to exist. (The String Quartet No. 8 & the 12 Madrigali are more accessible starting points perhaps.)
Holliger's 1st quartet seems to me to interact with its tradition in a critical and radical way, rather than in a reactionary or escapist or wilfully bizarre way. Within the string quartet literature, Op. 131 is the only other work so extreme for its time. Also important as a long work that plays continuously with no movement breaks—possibly the earliest such work in the quartet repertoire—and sharing its rhetorical force.
That denial of course makes up part of its status as a 'modern opera': it can't be a 'normal' opera like the old-fashioned ones, not without self-awareness, without a meta-narrative of some kind. (And yes it's been staged, though not with Feldman's approval I don't think.)

It was Ferneyhough 6 which made me think of op 131 most.

Favorite 10?  Can't limit it that much.  But perhaps my favorite form developed in the 20th century is the "concerto for orchestra."  Of course the most famous one is by Bela Bartok, but there are also concertos for orchestra by Kodaly, Hovhaness, Lutoslawski and Elliott Carter.  All are among my favorites.  (Actually, come to think of it, Hovhaness wrote several Concertos for Orchestra but I'm only familiar with one of them, No. 6.)

Quote from: jochanaan on January 29, 2015, 07:21:24 AM
Favorite 10?  Can't limit it that much.

+ 1

Quote from: jochanaan on January 29, 2015, 07:21:24 AM
Favorite 10?  Can't limit it that much.  But perhaps my favorite form developed in the 20th century is the "concerto for orchestra."  Of course the most famous one is by Bela Bartok, but there are also concertos for orchestra by Kodaly, Hovhaness, Lutoslawski and Elliott Carter.  All are among my favorites.  (Actually, come to think of it, Hovhaness wrote several Concertos for Orchestra but I'm only familiar with one of them, No. 6.)

In this case one has to mention the set of CfO by Petrassi!!!

Quote from: springrite on January 29, 2015, 07:26:58 AM
In this case one has to mention the set of CfO by Petrassi!!!

Ooooh, I'm not familiar with those! :)

Quote from: jochanaan on January 29, 2015, 07:56:03 AM
Ooooh, I'm not familiar with those! :)

Did anyone else compose these many and, in fact, an intended set?

http://www.amazon.com/Petrassi-Concerti-per-orchestra-Integrale/dp/B00DN47BVG/ref=sr_1_3?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1422550808&sr=1-3&keywords=petrassi+concerto+for+orchestra

Quote from: springrite on January 29, 2015, 08:02:01 AM
Did anyone else compose these many and, in fact, an intended set?

http://www.amazon.com/Petrassi-Concerti-per-orchestra-Integrale/dp/B00DN47BVG/ref=sr_1_3?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1422550808&sr=1-3&keywords=petrassi+concerto+for+orchestra

Hovhaness composed at least eight, but I doubt he intended them to be an actual set.

Quote from: jochanaan on January 29, 2015, 08:30:30 AM
Hovhaness composed at least eight, but I doubt he intended them to be an actual set.

Indeed, but Petrassi's is like the Art of the Fugue of CfO!

Quote from: springrite on January 29, 2015, 07:26:58 AM
In this case one has to mention the set of CfO by Petrassi!!!

And the one by Hindemith!

Quote from: Dax on January 29, 2015, 11:20:58 AM
And the one by Hindemith!

+1 Very cool work, too!

Quote from: EigenUser on January 27, 2015, 07:26:26 AM
Actually, let's remove Rothko Chapel (not that I don't love it, but just to make room -- plus it gets enough love already) and put in Takemitsu's Dream/Window. Seeing Takemitsu on your list reminded me.

In approximate order:
Ligeti Clocks and Clouds
Ligeti Piano Concerto
Messiaen Des Canyons aux Etoiles
Ligeti San Francisco Polyphony
Ades Asyla
Feldman Piano and String Quartet
Takemitsu Dream/Window
Feldman Coptic Light
Boulez Notations for Orchestra (orchestrated version is post-1970)
Reich Music for 18 Musicians

If I were to add yet another I would say to remove Ligeti's San Francisco Polyphony and add Steven Mackey's Ars Moriendi to the bottom of the list, but I'm not so sure about that. I rarely listen to it (a very sad piece). So, never mind.

While narrow as far as composers go (three Ligeti and two Feldman), I think it is pretty diverse in terms of what the music sounds like and actual style. It encompasses (here we go!) post-serialism (Boulez), post-impressionism (Takemitsu), proto-minimalism (Feldman), mock-minimalism (Ligeti C&C), hardcore-minimalism (Reich), post-minimalism-fusion (Ades), birdsongism (Messiaen), and whatever-the-hell-I-want-to-do-ism (Ligeti PC).

I realized that this list is a disaster. I forgot to include Ohana's In Dark and Blue (a 1990-ish cello concerto). ???

Remove Ligeti SF Polyphony (ugh, I do love that piece!).

In approximate order (updated -- Takemitsu's Dream/Window has been an (unhealthy?) obsession this past week):
Ligeti Clocks and Clouds
Ligeti Piano Concerto
Takemitsu Dream/Window
Messiaen Des Canyons aux Etoiles
Feldman Coptic Light
Ades Asyla
Ohana Cello Concerto 'In Dark and Blue'
Feldman Piano and String Quartet
Boulez Notations for Orchestra (orchestrated version is post-1970)
Reich Music for 18 Musicians

Ligeti and Feldman appear twice. Makes sense since they are both in my top ten favorite composers of all-time.