Thread title says it all: Has The Lord of the Rings ever influenced your musical choices or preferences?
Quote from: LKB on August 13, 2022, 06:31:13 PM
Thread title says it all: Has The Lord of the Rings ever influenced your musical choices or preferences?
I don't believe so.
Thanks, Karl.
Some explanation may be warranted... during my first year in college l was fortunate enough to be introduced to both symphonic Bruckner and Tolkien, and in close proximity. As a result l invariably experience the Bruckner symphonies as a sort of imaginary soundtrack for Tolkien's work, and l was just wondering if there might be others who might have enjoyed the same happy accident.
Now you're being more clear. I was exploring Mahler's Symphony No. 2 during the time oh, so many years ago when I was reading The Two Towers. The Scherzo has been my imaginary soundtrack for Fangorn Forest ever since.
I don't think so. I read LotR for the first time at 20 years old (I had read the Hobbit in translation years earlier, maybe with 14 or so, not as a young child, the books were known in 1980s Germany but not as well known as later, fantasy overall more niche, I read far more crime mystery and (realist) adventure as a teenager) and I was already listening to classical music for years then and I don't remember any association with romantic or heroic or "landscape" music. I re-read the book several times although I am not one to read it every year or two and the last time could be many years ago and I don't remember any strong musical associations later on either.
Quote from: Jo498 on August 13, 2022, 11:27:11 PM
I don't think so. I read LotR for the first time at 20 years old (I had read the Hobbit in translation years earlier, maybe with 14 or so, not as a young child, the books were known in 1980s Germany but not as well known as later, fantasy overall more niche, I read far more crime mystery and (realist) adventure as a teenager) and I was already listening to classical music for years then and I don't remember any association with romantic or heroic or "landscape" music. I re-read the book several times although I am not one to read it every year or two and the last time could be many years ago and I don't remember any strong musical associations later on either.
I think in my case proximity was the most important factor. Bruckner and Tolkien entered my experience at very nearly the same time, and l think the somewhat archaic aspects of the Bruckner symphonies resonated very well with Tolkien's mythology.
Sibelius's 4 Legends for Orchestra comes to mind, although I discovered Sibelius before Tolkein.
Interesting, gents.
Quote from: vandermolen on August 14, 2022, 12:36:15 AM
Sibelius's 4 Legends for Orchestra comes to mind, although I discovered Sibelius before Tolkein.
I need to hear the Sibelius anyway, and you've now supplied extra motivation. 8)
Does Tolkien discuss music in the books or is it just the general atmosphere of them that has parallels to music?
Quote from: hvbias on August 14, 2022, 06:45:05 AM
Does Tolkien discuss music in the books or is it just the general atmosphere of them that has parallels to music?
I recall at least a couple of musical episodes in
The Fellowship of the Ring, with the Hobbits singing in Tom Bombadil's house and some of the Elves in Rivendell playing instruments. There may well be more which escape me.
Quote from: LKB on August 13, 2022, 06:31:13 PM
Thread title says it all: Has The Lord of the Rings ever influenced your musical choices or preferences?
Yes. When I was a teenager I read quite a bit of Lord of the Rings in a tent in the wilderness in the High Peak in Derbyshire, with my mates Martin Weinberg, Paul Clark and Nick Smith. Where are you now guys? We listened to lots of Pink Floyd - Dark Side of the Moon and Wish You Were Here.
Quote from: hvbias on August 14, 2022, 06:45:05 AM
Does Tolkien discuss music in the books or is it just the general atmosphere of them that has parallels to music?
Not in LOTR but in Silmarillion the world (the same world as in LOTR) is created through Music of The Ainur.
Quote from: LKB on August 14, 2022, 07:13:33 AM
I recall at least a couple of musical episodes in The Fellowship of the Ring, with the Hobbits singing in Tom Bombadil's house and some of the Elves in Rivendell playing instruments. There may well be more which escape me.
There are songs strewn throughout
The Hobbit &
LotR, sometimes with a brief description of the music's character or emotional effect. Not really anything for a composer to run with.
Quote from: Ganondorf on August 14, 2022, 07:45:20 AM
Not in LOTR but in Silmarillion the world (the same world as in LOTR) is created through Music of The Ainur.
Aye, a beautiful passage, indeed.
It certainly has; reading The Lord of the Rings made me fond of Norse mythology and Middle Ages legends, so when I started listening to classical music and, after some time, I discovered there were operas based on Norse myths (Wagner's Ring), I was irresistibly curious to explore them; good thing, because it made me discover and fall in love with Wagner, that is now my favourite composer.
I was worried this thread was asking if Howard Shores soundtracks shaped your idea of what is Classical. Glad it's not.
I haven't read Tolkien, but can't think of any work of literature where I've associated it with a work of music, or vice versa.
I know my first serious experience of Proust and the Beethoven piano sonatas happened at exactly the same time, but even then I don't associate one with the other now.
Quote from: SimonNZ on August 14, 2022, 05:14:08 PM
I was worried this thread was asking if Howard Shores soundtracks shaped your idea of what is Classical. Glad it's not.
I've never read the books, only seen the movies so my answer was going to be Howard Shore! Joke is no good now, you beat me to it.
Yes. I only like music by orcs.
Who's Howard Shore?
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on August 15, 2022, 07:25:15 AM
Who's Howard Shore?
The composer of the soundtracks of the Trilogy movies.
Quote from: Lisztianwagner on August 15, 2022, 07:27:43 AM
The composer of the soundtracks of the Trilogy movies.
Thank you.
Quote from: LKB on August 14, 2022, 06:28:43 AM
I need to hear the Sibelius anyway, and you've now supplied extra motivation. 8)
Excellent! It's very Tolkeinesque ;D
(//)
Tangentially ... I think I remember reading a remark that Tolkien modeled his High Elven language, Quenya on Finnish. Separately, the mischief-maker in me wants to prounce Quenya, "Kenya."
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on August 15, 2022, 07:47:00 AM
Tangentially ... I think I remember reading a remark that Tolkien modeled his High Elven language, Quenya on Finnish. Separately, the mischief-maker in me wants to prounce Quenya, "Kenya."
You're correct regarding Quenya. And l think Renee Fleming's brief contributions to
Return of the King are sung in it, but I'm not positive...
No
Nope.
LKB did you used to sing the songs to yourself?
Quote from: DavidW on August 17, 2022, 03:59:22 PM
Nope.
LKB did you used to sing the songs to yourself?
I like that question, though it wasn't directed at me. Some of the songs I hummed a bit, but never to an extent that might reach to a setting at all ....
Quote from: DavidW on August 17, 2022, 03:59:22 PM
Nope.
LKB did you used to sing the songs to yourself?
No, but l whistle and hum them from time to time. I probably should try singing those in Quenya, l used to be fairly comfortable with Finnish, years ago.
Quote from: Lisztianwagner on August 14, 2022, 09:13:48 AM
It certainly has; reading The Lord of the Rings made me fond of Norse mythology and Middle Ages legends, so when I started listening to classical music and, after some time, I discovered there were operas based on Norse myths (Wagner's Ring), I was irresistibly curious to explore them; good thing, because it made me discover and fall in love with Wagner, that is now my favourite composer.
Cause and effect from Tolkien to Wagner... as one of my TV role models used to say, " Fascinating. "
Just an ancillary comment...
I do think Howard Shore's work in the films is extremely impressive. Most film composers don't wear the three hats of composing, orchestrating and conducting in the studio. John Williams, for instance, historically composed and conducted, but left the orchestration for others.
In the orchestral soundtrack for the LotR trilogy, Shore does it all. The only instances where others make creative musical contributions are when Pippen sings at Denethor's command ( Billy Boyd both composed and performed quite effectively ), and when Aragorn sings the Lay of Luthien in the first film, and at his coronation in the last film. ( Viggo Mortensen is in fact a fairly accomplished musician.)
Note that I'm not counting the end credits, where some terrific contributions occurred: Annie Lennox in RotK and Emilíana Torrini in TTT. Gollum's Song, in particular, always makes me sorry for the little bastard.
Intéressant.
A thought that just crossed my mind: much to the dismay of diehard Wagnerites and "classical music" snobs, The Lord of the Rings might be the closest contemporary approximation to Gesamtkunstwerk yet. The only historical precedents were Meyerbeer and his lavishly produced grand-operas in Paris, preceding Wagner's own efforts by years, if not decades.
No, really, we today can't even begin to imagine, let alone feel, the impact the very first night of Robert le Diable in 1831 had on the audience. It was most probably the 19th century equivalent of the Lord of the Rings --- and thus we're coming full circle. :D
Feel free to disagree and/or lambast me. ;)
Somewhat off-topic, but if any of my fellow Tolkienists haven't seen this, it is most assuredly worth a watch:
https://youtu.be/LWxnHuVEwUg
Quote from: LKB on August 26, 2022, 09:37:38 PM
Somewhat off-topic, but if any of my fellow Tolkienists haven't seen this, it is most assuredly worth a watch:
https://youtu.be/LWxnHuVEwUg
That was very cool. Made it feel like history.
Quote from: LKB on August 26, 2022, 09:37:38 PM
Somewhat off-topic, but if any of my fellow Tolkienists haven't seen this, it is most assuredly worth a watch:
https://youtu.be/LWxnHuVEwUg
Delightful!
Quote from: Ganondorf on August 14, 2022, 07:45:20 AM
Not in LOTR but in Silmarillion the world (the same world as in LOTR) is created through Music of The Ainur.
Not only is the creation myth a musical one, but chaos and strife emerge in the world when a rebellious being (Melkor?) introduces new harmonies and melodies discordant with the divine music and his followers take them up.
Quote from: BasilValentine on August 28, 2022, 04:14:04 AM
Not only is the creation myth a musical one, but chaos and strife emerge in the world when a rebellious being (Melkor?) introduces new harmonies and melodies discordant with the divine music and his followers take them up.
We musical modernists don't like to read too much into that, but at a guess, our revered Don did not care much for
Schoenberg ....