If ever there was a piece of music which to me always sounded as though it needed a really imaginative and inspired performance, then it's Sibelius 6. Whenever I've heard it, to me it feels better music than it actually sounds. The most interesting that I've found is the Vanska above.
Listening this morning to Rosbaud's Cologne recording I had exactly that sentiment of frustration again unfortunately. Hence this thread.
Akeo Watanabe is always to be considered:
Sir Colin Davis was also an expert on
Sibelius:
Then we have the ubiquitous
Neeme Jarvi from 1983 on BIS:
Eugene Ormandy with
The Philadelphia Orchestra was a great promoter of
Sibelius, visiting him in his later years on a quest for the
Eighth Symphony.
His performance is still available via Amazon, but not on YouTube!
Most recordings of the 6th focus on the delicate, chamber-like nature of the music. The prime example is the Karajan DG performance, which I think captures this aspect of the music very well, unfortunately I find the recording itself just bloodless and lacking in any bass warmth at all. His later version for EMI (Warner) is better recorded but the music does not sound quite so refined.
(https://d1iiivw74516uk.cloudfront.net/eyJidWNrZXQiOiJwcmVzdG8tY292ZXItaW1hZ2VzIiwia2V5IjoiODkzNTY0Ny4xLmpwZyIsImVkaXRzIjp7InJlc2l6ZSI6eyJ3aWR0aCI6OTAwfSwid2VicCI6eyJxdWFsaXR5Ijo2NX0sInRvRm9ybWF0Ijoid2VicCJ9LCJ0aW1lc3RhbXAiOjE3MTQxNzgwNDZ9)
As a contrast and foil to Karajan, I rather like the young Saraste who delivers a full-blooded account putting the Symphony much more in line with the 5th and 7th.
(https://d1iiivw74516uk.cloudfront.net/eyJidWNrZXQiOiJwcmVzdG8tY292ZXItaW1hZ2VzIiwia2V5IjoiODAyOTUxNS4xLmpwZyIsImVkaXRzIjp7InJlc2l6ZSI6eyJ3aWR0aCI6OTAwfSwid2VicCI6eyJxdWFsaXR5Ijo2NX0sInRvRm9ybWF0Ijoid2VicCJ9LCJ0aW1lc3RhbXAiOjE0MzU3NjEyNzZ9)
Sibelius 5 & 6, Saraste
There's also a Karajan Philharmonia -- I used to have it on CD I think.
I always loved Ashkenazy's Sibelius, in great sound. Herbert Blomstedt, also on Decca is another favorite.
(https://e.snmc.io/i/fullres/s/08dd4009ac2263af898836124fa92aa6/3092837)
(https://i.discogs.com/wDpWTtbNSjQnko5fiGCqPZfyPEPTC3McOt0mZUCM9lQ/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:600/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWRhdGFiYXNlLWlt/YWdlcy9SLTE2NjA0/NjkxLTE2Mjk0MTEy/NDktOTYyNC5qcGVn.jpeg)
Well I think I've found an outstanding 6 - Järvi on BIS. Sparkling, exciting and intense - nothing pastoral here - you'd be forgiven for thinking this is Sibelius's greatest work. In fact I've heard it before, about 20 years ago in someone's car, a music journalist who was sent it for review by BBC Music Magazine. I was impressed. I suddenly remembered the journey, not least because I was amused at the idea of his writing the review on the basis of one listen in a car - he said he knew the music and they were only paying him £50 so it's all good. It was one of the things which made me lose all confidence in journalists.
(https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/51IriWTmOcL._AC_.jpg)
Love the health warning on the cover. Does the back page say "do not listen if you have a dodgy ticker"?
Quote from: Mandryka on January 01, 2025, 08:45:14 AMWell I think I've found an outstanding 6 - Järvi on BIS. Sparkling, exciting and intense - nothing pastoral here - you'd be forgiven for thinking this is Sibelius' greatest work....
(https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/51IriWTmOcL._AC_.jpg)
Yes, as mentioned above, it is a great performance!
I checked again for
Eugene Ormandy: weirdly, instead of what I found earlier, Amazon says it has no recording of a
Sixth Symphony, and Google now has a claim that
Ormandy never recorded it...
because he said that he did not understand it!All right then!
Let me know if you listen to the
Colin Davis and
Akeo Watanabe performances!
Quote from: Mandryka on January 01, 2025, 08:45:14 AM- he said he knew the music and they were only paying him £50 so it's all good. It was one of the things which made me lose all confidence in journalists.
Well, they certainly don't offer such generous pay anymore! :'(
I always thought that this was probably the symphony that fit the characterization that Sibelius was like cold spring water best, so there seemed nothing wrong with more distant, austere interpretations.
But I am not a Sibelian at all, although I probably have heard at least a handful of recordings I don't have strong opinions on any.
Quote from: Cato on January 01, 2025, 09:34:03 AMLet me know if you listen to the Colin Davis and Akeo Watanabe performances!
The Davis is very beautiful, translucent orchestral sounds. At times he made me think of La Mer. I like the bracing tempi, the rhythm like little wavelets. Did you choose that one because you think it's more interesting than his (three?) commercial recordings?
Always with Davis, the feeling of total engagement with the music. I heard him a lot when he was at Covent Garden, and often in London concerts too - never disappointing. Recently I've been impressed by his Missa Solemnis and Gran Partita, and now this.
Watenabe tomorrow hopefully.
Quote from: Mandryka on January 01, 2025, 01:17:36 PMThe Davis is very beautiful, translucent orchestral sounds. At times he made me think of La Mer. I like the bracing tempi, the rhythm like little wavelets. Did you choose that one because you think it's more interesting than his (three?) commercial recordings?
Always with Davis, the feeling of total engagement with the music. I heard him a lot when he was at Covent Garden, and often in London concerts too - never disappointing. Recently I've been impressed by his Missa Solemnis and Gran Partita, and now this.
Watenabe tomorrow hopefully.
In fact, I thought the YouTube was from one of the recordings: your other point is why I always liked
Sir Colin Davis.
Shamefully, the 1960's complete symphonies of
Sibelius with
Watanabe and the
Japan Philharmonic are not available on CD's at regular prices: used copies of the vinyl go for c. $100.00 +.
CD's of the DENON 1980's performances can be found here and there: some critics preferred the 1960's performances.
Quote from: Mandryka on January 01, 2025, 05:00:52 AMThere's also a Karajan Philharmonia -- I used to have it on CD I think.
Mono, but still lovely sounding.
Richard Kaplan of Fanfare gave the 1967 Karajan as his desert island choice of the 6th in his "Sibeliusaurus" discography of the symphonies.
Quote from: Mandryka on January 01, 2025, 01:17:36 PMThe Davis is very beautiful, translucent orchestral sounds. At times he made me think of La Mer. I like the bracing tempi, the rhythm like little wavelets. Did you choose that one because you think it's more interesting than his (three?) commercial recordings?
Always with Davis, the feeling of total engagement with the music. I heard him a lot when he was at Covent Garden, and often in London concerts too - never disappointing. Recently I've been impressed by his Missa Solemnis and Gran Partita, and now this.
Watenabe tomorrow hopefully.
An appreciation for Berglund's recordings, particularly the middle and late cycle, is growing within me.
Quote from: Cato on January 01, 2025, 02:46:18 PMCD's of the DENON 1980's performances can be found here and there: some critics preferred the 1960's performances.
Well having now heard both I think I'm one of those who prefers the earlier performance. Both are very fluid, and natural, one feels in the presence of someone who's at home with the music, in his element. For some reason the earlier one produced more frissons, it's just more urgent, intense - maybe it's a sense of someone who's just discovered the music and wants to share it.
Thanks for all your guidance with this,
@Cato - much appreciated.
By the way, I just found this, I'm not sure what it is yet
https://open.spotify.com/album/2XbSFpRj8b85aIxkbSTIdP
I've enjoyed the Colin Davis LSO Hybrid-SACD that I have [One of the first ones that I purchased of it]. Have you listened to that one?
Quote from: Brian on January 01, 2025, 10:54:27 AMWell, they certainly don't offer such generous pay anymore! :'(
Ouch! :(
K
Quote from: Mandryka on January 01, 2025, 01:59:15 AMIf ever there was a piece of music which to me always sounded as though it needed a really imaginative and inspired performance, then it's Sibelius 6. Whenever I've heard it, to me it feels better music than it actually sounds. The most interesting that I've found is the Vanska above.
A trivial point, but personally I find it easy to hear it as a transitional work, both in position and character - 5 being a revelation after the darkness of 4, 6 a transition and 7 the destination. But I like its inconclusive feel and can't say I've ever struggled with a performance of it.
Quote from: Iota on January 03, 2025, 11:54:10 AM5 being a revelation after the darkness of 4, 6 a transition and 7 the destination.
You'd be in a spot of bother with that idea if he had finished 8! The fact that he started it suggests to me that he didn't himself see 7 as the end of the journey.
He seems to have been developing a new style - you hear it in the cinq esquisses, op 114.
Quote from: Mandryka on January 03, 2025, 12:51:25 PMYou'd be in a spot of bother with that idea if he had finished 8! The fact that he started it suggests to me that he didn't himself see 7 as the end of the journey.
He seems to have been developing a new style - you hear it in the cinq esquisses, op 114.
I hadn't meant for a moment to suggest Sibelius thought that. As I said, it was a trivial point, just one possible way of hearing things that for me seems to fit.
Quote from: Mandryka on January 01, 2025, 08:45:14 AMyou'd be forgiven for thinking this is Sibelius's greatest work.
I'm in much need of forgiveness, 'cos it absolutely is ;D. And I know there's not always much enthusiasm for Rattle on the forum, but his CBSO recording is my particular favourite.
Quote from: DaveF on January 04, 2025, 01:30:00 PMI'm in much need of forgiveness, 'cos it absolutely is ;D. And I know there's not always much enthusiasm for Rattle on the forum, but his CBSO recording is my particular favourite.
The early recordings with the Birmingham orchestra can be very good - there's a Mahler 10 which is superb. Will listen to the Sibelius soon.
Quote from: Mandryka on January 05, 2025, 07:40:26 AMThe early recordings with the Birmingham orchestra can be very good - there's a Mahler 10 which is superb. Will listen to the Sibelius soon.
I don't know any other recording (Sibelius 6) that injects so much sheer joy into the first movement climax - clarinets and harp bubbling and gurgling together like a crowd of happy babies in a bath.
Quote from: DaveF on January 05, 2025, 07:49:14 AMI don't know any other recording (Sibelius 6) that injects so much sheer joy into the first movement climax - clarinets and harp bubbling and gurgling together like a crowd of happy babies in a bath.
love that description!
PS: what is the collective noun for a crowd of happy babies in a bath.......... a "gurgle" perhaps.......
Quote from: Roasted Swan on January 05, 2025, 09:48:51 AMlove that description!
PS: what is the collective noun for a crowd of happy babies in a bath.......... a "gurgle" perhaps.......
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