As requested...
Congrats. to the Arse (7 nil!) and the Mancs last night.
My boys (Liverpool) are playing tonight and in much need of a win in Turkey after an (ahem) indifferent start to the Champions League, then Arsenal Sunday. Gonna' be a tough week...
Arse fan here, hehe! ;D Oh jolly, I did not watch the CL match but wished I had. Good luck against the turks, and hopefully you manager won't go thinkering around further!
Quote from: MISHUGINA on October 24, 2007, 04:56:37 AM
Arse fan here, hehe!
People will get the wrong(or right!) idea with that kind of talk 'round here...
:P
Quote from: MISHUGINA on October 24, 2007, 04:56:37 AM
Good luck against the turks, and hopefully you manager won't go thinkering around further!
I'm banning the use of tinker, tinkering and tinkerman from this thread. It's a myth, propogated by the media. Rafa tinkers no more than the next manager... ;) Ferguson, statistically, made more changes than Rafa last season, so there! :P
Well done yesterday, but we'll stuff you at the weekend, at least 1-0 ;D
Fabregas goal last night was an absolute peach....poor Slavia Prague
And big well done to Rangers!
FC Internazionale for me, thanks.
(http://www.aboutmilan.com/sobre-milan/milan-imagines/sports/FC_Inter.png)
(http://www.brondbytifo.dk/fusion_images/photoalbum/udland/inter-12.jpg)
(http://www.milanonerazzurra.it/Sito_foto03-04/inter-reggina_0304a.jpg)
:D
nothing impressive there. Best fans are Fenerbahce. Just look at this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LBBPoyXEOhM
oooh, Arsenal beat slavia prague 7:0, i guess this is their year.
I used to support Lille, but they betrayed their fans and traded all of their star players... Now I am rooting for Shakhtar Donetsk.
Quote from: sidoze on October 24, 2007, 07:23:59 AM
nothing impressive there. Best fans are Fenerbahce. Just look at this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LBBPoyXEOhM
The Turks can certainly crank it up when they want! I'm sure we'll get a 'traditional' welcome this evening. ;)
FC Porto Fan here! 8)
Quaresma ftw!
If I was to support any team, it would be the one directly in the town in which I am living, rather than the nearest city.
This means that I would be rooting for Yeovil Town F.C. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yeovil_Town_F.C.), who appear to have done very well in climbing three leagues in as many years.
Quote from: The Emperor on October 24, 2007, 08:04:07 AM
FC Porto Fan here! 8)
Quaresma ftw!
He absolutely roasted us a few weeks ago, fantastic player, better then Ronaldo I think when he's 'on'. There were mutterings that we were gonna' buy him in the summer, but don't think he's a Rafa player. Does he track back? ;D
It's nice to know that GMG supports the Arsenal.
It's been far too long since the Gunners picked up silverware. Now it's time. Cesc is the best in the world. And what about Hleb? :o
Theo is showing sparks of his future greatness. RVP is injured (may he have a fast recovery), but Adebayor looks lethal in front of goal. Flamini is a workhorse. Diaby is a smooth sailor (who is Vieira?): fantastic skills with the ball. Rosicky has yet to shine. Gilberto and Jens are disgruntled. Clichy and Sagna: it's a beautiful thing watching them. Gallas is back. Toure is a king.
We have Liverpool, then United. We'll be tested (I predict 4 points, but hope for 6). Some people seem to think that when it gets cold, things will change. Some think that if Arsenal are still on top of the table come January, they will be champions. I see nothing stopping the Gunners from firing. Let it be done.
Quote from: sidoze on October 24, 2007, 07:23:59 AM
nothing impressive there. Best fans are Fenerbahce. Just look at this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LBBPoyXEOhM
I wasn't suggesting that our fans are the best - they're rather cold instead, and pretentious. Just picked up some photos of the Curva Nord. I'm not an "Ultras" admirer to be honest.
By the way, here's a clip from one the most intense "derby" we got recently. Of course we won.
http://www.youtube.com/watch/v/7s9Srs-ia-M
Yes, Arsenal are looking quite impressive in both the CL and EPL at the moment but you have to look at who they've actually played so far and then reserve judgement. While they are a very attractive team to watch they are also very young and it will be interesting to see what happens when they come up against the likes of Chelsea, Man U and Liverpool.
I tell ya, Benitez has looked rather clueless strategically since his assistant took off. Could it be another case of Rijkaard without Ten Cate (except without the implication that they play attractive football -- tee-hee ;D )?
Quote from: Scriptavolant on October 24, 2007, 08:46:09 AM
By the way, here's a clip from one the most intense "derby" we got recently. Of course we won.
high scoring game. Nice to see Dida let in so many goals. Did you see him flop at Celtic a couple of weeks ago?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZviLX37sMY
Quote from: Holden on October 24, 2007, 12:27:34 PM
and it will be interesting to see what happens when they come up against the likes of Chelsea, Man U and Liverpool.
Liverpool this Sunday, the Mancs next weekend I think.
Quote from: sidoze on October 24, 2007, 01:33:59 PM
I tell ya, Benitez has looked rather clueless strategically since his assistant took off. Could it be another case of Rijkaard without Ten Cate (except without the implication that they play attractive football -- tee-hee ;D )?
My heads in my hands this evening, it's all going tits up! Dunno' whether Pako Ayestran leaving has had an effect, but something ain't right at present...
:(
Any Difference?
Honestly, I don't know whats funnier ;D
let's not forget which team has the best fans in the world ;D
(http://cache.gettyimages.com/xc/74250577.jpg?v=1&c=NewsMaker&k=2&d=17A4AD9FDB9CF1935A6DEC864C2BC5D91AA9185BB534C5DF)
(http://cache.gettyimages.com/xc/74250573.jpg?v=1&c=NewsMaker&k=2&d=17A4AD9FDB9CF1935A6DEC864C2BC5D95C5BAB7A55E722F5)
(http://cache.gettyimages.com/xc/74397988.jpg?v=1&c=NewsMaker&k=2&d=17A4AD9FDB9CF193FDE3AF4FFC4B70CF7362AC97481C2EBDA55A1E4F32AD3138)
No "love lost" for Liverpool either here, but that's the bitter Bordeaux supporter in me talking >:D ;D
otherwise, i am a french tractor boy ... go figure 8)
Quote from: Peregrine on October 24, 2007, 08:12:00 AM
He absolutely roasted us a few weeks ago, fantastic player, better then Ronaldo I think when he's 'on'. There were mutterings that we were gonna' buy him in the summer, but don't think he's a Rafa player. Does he track back? ;D
He does track back when he feels like it lol, he is a fantastic player when he's on like you said, but when he is not, he can be quite irritating, because he is a bit selfish playing, sometimes it's too much when he tries to drible like 3 or 4 players and starts with the circus and ballet stuff, it's fun but come on just past the ball!!
I wouldn't say he is better than Ronaldo even when he is on, cuz when Ronaldo is on, he is unstopable hhehe
Anyway next season i'm sure he will be gone to a top team, 30million € at least for the transfer, and i'm being generous eheh that was pepe and anderson, Quaresma has to be more, much more!
Anyway we draw at marseille and did a good match, could have won if we had scored in the first half, couple of good chances plus 2 shots hit the post, the second half was not as good and we could have actually lost it, thank god for that penalty eheh
We have 5 points, and if we win at home against marseille, 1st place!!!
The funny thing is the favorites, Liverpool only has 1 point and in 4th ;D
I used to be a major fan of Real Madrid when they had the 7As...now almost all of them left (except for Raul of course) so I don't like them as much. They used to be an all-star team really...
Quote from: AnthonyAthletic on October 24, 2007, 02:19:51 PM
Any Difference?
Honestly, I don't know whats funnier ;D
Quote from: sidoze on October 24, 2007, 02:47:10 PM
let's not forget which team has the best fans in the world ;D
Tossers...
:P ;D
Quote from: sidoze on October 24, 2007, 02:47:10 PM
let's not forget which team has the best fans in the world ;D
(http://cache.gettyimages.com/xc/74250577.jpg?v=1&c=NewsMaker&k=2&d=17A4AD9FDB9CF1935A6DEC864C2BC5D91AA9185BB534C5DF)
(http://cache.gettyimages.com/xc/74250573.jpg?v=1&c=NewsMaker&k=2&d=17A4AD9FDB9CF1935A6DEC864C2BC5D95C5BAB7A55E722F5)
(http://cache.gettyimages.com/xc/74397988.jpg?v=1&c=NewsMaker&k=2&d=17A4AD9FDB9CF193FDE3AF4FFC4B70CF7362AC97481C2EBDA55A1E4F32AD3138)
I believe Galatasaray deserve a shot at this prize...
Quote from: sidoze on October 24, 2007, 01:54:09 PM
high scoring game. Nice to see Dida let in so many goals. Did you see him flop at Celtic a couple of weeks ago?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZviLX37sMY
Yeah I saw that. He had great responsibility on the last Celtic goal too. Dida is infact in deep crisis and AC Milan is planning to replace him.
Cska's goalkeeper is another genius ;D
http://youtube.com/watch/v/HfaoncOikOc
Quote from: sidoze on October 24, 2007, 01:33:59 PM
I tell ya, Benitez has looked rather clueless strategically since his assistant took off. Could it be another case of Rijkaard without Ten Cate (except without the implication that they play attractive football -- tee-hee ;D )?
He has never struck me as a great tactician.
Only he knows what he is playing at this season.
At this rate they could end up being the only team in the top half of the table being beaten by Wigan ;D
However, Chelsky aside, it looks as if the Champions League will be won by an English team. Sorry Scotland :(
Nice to see so many Gooners around here at GMG!
It's official! Martin Jol's sacked.
The statement coming from the club is pretty blunt. Instead of parting with "mutual understanding", he's asked to "stand down with immediete effect." :P
Quote from: MISHUGINA on October 26, 2007, 03:53:02 AM
It's official! Martin Jol's sacked.
The statement coming from the club is pretty blunt. Instead of parting with "mutual understanding", he's asked to "stand down with immediete effect." :P
Too bad they can't sack some of their players.
Poor Hyypiä, two own goals in a row... :o :-[
Quote from: MISHUGINA on October 26, 2007, 03:53:02 AM
It's official! Martin Jol's sacked.
The statement coming from the club is pretty blunt. Instead of parting with "mutual understanding", he's asked to "stand down with immediete effect." :P
It seems Jol found out about this at full time. But radio, press and fans knew at half time.... ::)
Quote from: lukeottevanger on October 26, 2007, 05:51:55 AM
It seems Jol found out about this at full time. But radio, press and fans knew at half time.... ::)
I don't think so. Before the match started.
He's been a 'Dead Man Walking' since, at least, game 4. Although I think his number was up when he blew a 3 goal lead against Chelsky at Stamfordski Bridge in last years Cup.
Shame Botlon didn't hang on a bit longer before they appointed Gary-Mr. 15per cent-Megson. Mind you, Leicester are looking for a manager who can last more than 10 weeks! ;D
It's amazing how some quite poor and unsuccessful managers seem to get another job - is this football's version of recycling? Megson would certailnly fit into that mold! You've got to give Spurs some credit for acting now instead of waiting until Xmas when it's far too late.
Quote from: Hector on October 26, 2007, 06:08:43 AM
Although I think his number was up when he blew a 3 goal lead against Chelsky at Stamfordski Bridge in last years Cup.
And that was really his own fault. I remember watching his substitutions and thinking he's doing himself in. And he did indeed. The Fulham come back earlier this season hurt too.
The board behaved disgracefully and I feel genuinely sorry for the guy. He did what he could--barring that joke of a £16m Bent transfer, though apparently it might not have been all his doing--and he had a lot of injuries to deal with last season. Main problem was that over the summer the team didn't really address their midfield and defensive worries (which are huge). Instead they did exactly the sort of thing all of us would do as testosterone-fuelled teenagers -- go for the (questionable) firepower ::)
Quote
Shame Botlon didn't hang on a bit longer before they appointed Gary-Mr. 15per cent-Megson.
'You'll never play here again!' ;D
Quote from: springrite on October 26, 2007, 05:36:53 AM
Too bad they can't sack some of their players.
Technically, they could, but an early termination of the contract will mean a lot of buyout money.
'God' comes home this evening...
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=IM4LaXPYu3A
And just for the bitter blues!
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=czc5vKu5wqg
Quote from: sidoze on October 26, 2007, 09:04:04 AM
And that was really his own fault. I remember watching his substitutions and thinking he's doing himself in. And he did indeed. The Fulham come back earlier this season hurt too.
The board behaved disgracefully and I feel genuinely sorry for the guy. He did what he could--barring that joke of a £16m Bent transfer, though apparently it might not have been all his doing--and he had a lot of injuries to deal with last season. Main problem was that over the summer the team didn't really address their midfield and defensive worries (which are huge). Instead they did exactly the sort of thing all of us would do as testosterone-fuelled teenagers -- go for the (questionable) firepower ::)
'You'll never play here again!' ;D
But he was completely undermined by the 'Director of Football,' Comolli.
He wanted a centre-half to replace the long-term injured Ledley King and got Bale. He did not want Bent who, he thought, wasn't good enough(correct) and he wanted Petrov because he thought, rightly, he could combine with his friend Berbatov and Petrov was desperate to get into the Premiere. He wanted a holding midfielder and got Boeteng who, he thinks, is not up to the Premiership.
Having said all that, it is Bale who has proved to be the best buy!
Ramos will have his work cut out fending off the 'internal politics.'
Quote from: Hector on October 31, 2007, 07:08:40 AM
Ramos will have his work cut out fending off the 'internal politics.'
Probably well prepared, coming from Spanish football... ;)
Good luck to him!
can't wait for the Arsenal-ManU game later today at 12.45. Hope it's a classic. Should wake up just in time for it ;D
ah, the days of fans on the pitch ;D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hrOyedpeZnk
Calzaghe/Kessler fight is an absolute pleasure to watch ;D Thank god for Sopcast
Well after our Record-breaking result mid-week, I'm hoping for 10-0 today at least!
8)
Wasn't aware that there was a thread where I could point out that my hometown team Rosenborg now has beat Valencia home and away in the CL. ;D
Quote from: erato on November 10, 2007, 02:37:25 AM
Wasn't aware that there was a thread where I could point out that my hometown team Rosenborg now has beat Valencia home and away in the CL. ;D
Yes! very good result(s), well done!
Israel will be without Benayoun. Not that I ever esteem players from Scouseland, but still :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(
Quote from: sidoze on November 11, 2007, 10:16:25 AM
Israel will be without Benayoun. Not that I ever esteem players from Scouseland, but still :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(
Being completely un-patriotic when it comes to the national footie team, I'm over the moon :D
And with the international break, gives him time to recover and get revved up for the important stuff - the welfare of LFC. He's starting to get into some form for us, good acquisition from Mr Benitez.
Quote from: Peregrine on November 11, 2007, 10:20:19 AM
He's starting to get into some form for us, good acquisition from Mr Benitez.
well if you blindly throw 100 darts at the board, one of them is bound to stick in ::) ;D :P :-*
Quote from: sidoze on November 12, 2007, 01:07:45 AM
well if you blindly throw 100 darts at the board, one of them is bound to stick in ::) ;D :P :-*
Ouch...
Djemba-Djemba, Veron, Kleberson, Howard, Forlan, some dodgy Italian keeper who's name escapes me Taibi? Tablesi?.....The list is endless...
:-*
Quote from: Peregrine on November 12, 2007, 02:39:39 AM
Djemba-Djemba, Veron, Kleberson, Howard, Forlan, some dodgy Italian keeper who's name escapes me Taibi? Tablesi?.....The list is endless...
jeez what a lot of crap. glad that's long gone! LOL!
Quote from: sidoze on November 12, 2007, 04:06:44 AM
jeez what a lot of crap. glad that's long gone! LOL!
Most annoyingly we (almost) had deals in place to sign both Ronaldo and Vidic, to be trumped at the last moment by your bunch. Scout you own players!
Quote from: erato on November 10, 2007, 02:37:25 AM
Wasn't aware that there was a thread where I could point out that my hometown team Rosenborg now has beat Valencia home and away in the CL. ;D
Easy.
More importantly, you held Chelski at home! ;)
Going back to Liverpool, which, I know we were not, if they are to get anywhere this season they have to beat, not Wigan anymore - they're finished, but Birmingham!
Quote from: Hector on November 12, 2007, 05:41:54 AM
Easy.
More importantly, you held Chelski at home! ;)
Going back to Liverpool, which, I know we were not, if they are to get anywhere this season they have to beat, not Wigan anymore - they're finished, but Birmingham!
I honestly think this is our season (although have said that for I don't know how many years... :-\). We're in the best position in the league at this stage of the season, than we have been for many a year. We've played shite football (largely due to the fact that our mentronome - Alonso, has been out for ages, the difference with him in the side is vast), but the spine of the team is returning from injury and our approach play will now improve.
Torres is back from injury and looking absolute class. I think we'll steadily cruise up the table now and be there or there abouts come May. You are more than welcome to qoute this post if I'm hideously wrong... ;D
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/bn/thumb/c/c9/FC_Bayern_Munich_Logo.svg/600px-FC_Bayern_Munich_Logo.svg.png)
It must really be something to watch a game at the Allianz arena, whether in the league or against a top European side like, er, Bolton. teehee ;D
Isn't Bayern technically under-achieving? all that money spent, and only1 point ahead of Bremen and Hamburg,
Scotland 1 v Italy 2
O Flower of Scotland,
When will we see
Your like again,
That fought and died for,
Your wee bit Hill and Glen,
And stood against him,
Proud Edward's Army,
And sent him homeward,
Tae think again.
Support Scotland....Not on Your Life!!
Israel 2 v Russia 1
Don't know the Israeli for "Thanks for Kicking Ass tonight....You may have just saved Steve McClaren's job" ;D
Something to look forward to, come Wednesday!!
Ok, once more for Scotland....
O Flower of Scotland,
When will we see
Your like again,
That fought and died for,
Your wee bit Hill and Glen,
And stood against him,
Proud Edward's Army,
And sent him homeward,
Tae think again.
;D
Quote from: AnthonyAthletic on November 17, 2007, 11:59:51 AM
Scotland 1 v Italy 2
how unfortunate ;D
... We don't play, and we qualify along with Italy... c'est magnifique !! >:D
Quote from: AnthonyAthletic on November 17, 2007, 11:59:51 AM
Don't know the Israeli for "Thanks for Kicking Ass tonight....You may have just saved Steve McClaren's job" ;D
it's a very hard choice really. Hope England fluff it so we get to see the back of McClaren, or hope England win or draw in spite of the clown and we get to enjoy ourselves (for at least a week anyway) during Euro 08. Hmm. Call me unpatriotic but I'm really 50/50 on it ::) Happy to see Russia lose though. Hiddink was too confident, serves him right.
Quote from: sidoze on November 17, 2007, 04:32:51 PM
it's a very hard choice really. Hope England fluff it so we get to see the back of McClaren.
Win, lose or draw, England should get rid of McClaren. If he was to be fired had the Russians won, he should be fired after the Russians lost. Half the population of England have a better clue on managing England than this clown. I would happily nominate Sidoze, AnthonyAtheletic or Luke for the job!
Quote from: springrite on November 18, 2007, 07:43:20 AM
Win, lose or draw, England should get rid of McClaren. If he was to be fired had the Russians won, he should be fired after the Russians lost. Half the population of England have a better clue on managing England than this clown. I would happily nominate Sidoze, AnthonyAtheletic or Luke for the job!
I personally think it all went downhill after Venables left.... :-\
that win over Holland at Euro '96, best I've ever seen England play...
Quote from: springrite on November 18, 2007, 07:43:20 AM
I would happily nominate Sidoze, AnthonyAtheletic or Luke for the job!
I nominate myself as new England coach, if only so I, like McClaren, can prance around all the stadia in the country and watch the games for free ;D
Quote from: sidoze on November 18, 2007, 07:52:57 AM
I nominate myself as new England coach, if only so I, like McClaren, can prance around all the stadia in the country and watch the games for free ;D
I nominated you with that in mind my friend, and I ask only for a couple of Arbiter CDs in return for the favor!
Mclaren was always just the safe option. In my view...we should never have gotten rid of Sven
Nice to see a football thread. I favour Rosenborg from my home town Trondheim. This year they have done really well in CL - last time beating Valencia 2-0 at Mestalla, easily! And they got 1-1 against Chelsea at Stamford Bridge, but that was more of a lucky result that lead to Mourinhos fall (which I really think will harm Chelsea...). Still Rosenborg has some players I used to play against myself when I was 9-19 years old.
In Norway many people follow English team closely and often have a favourite team. For club football I favour Spanish football which I think is more nice to watch. But the EC and especially the WC are the events I really follow. I loved Brazil in 1982 and 1986 + generally teams who play attacking football.
big game tonight. our home team against the footballing country I always supported after us ::) not sure how to call the game. could go either way, especially with a crap 4-5-1 formation.
I got the World Cup winner right and predicted Italy would beat the Scots.
So, how about 3-0 to England and everybody wondering why there was ever anything to worry about?
Admit it, even some of the petriotic England supporters subconciously want to see a train wreck if just for the entertainment value.
Quote from: springrite on November 21, 2007, 06:57:36 AM
Admit it, even some of the petriotic England supporters subconciously want to see a train wreck if just for the entertainment value.
oh no doubt, and I'm definitely one. I know we don't deserve it, and I think the manager is a muppet, all of which makes me think we should sink tonight. But...............a summer without England in Europe? It would be sad :'(
petriotic :)
I want England to lose for that reason. Also, I don't want our collection of imports tired to start the next season with your English core rested and fresh!
useless. overpaid and underskilled. you could see it coming even when they levelled at 2 all. Spot on Hector, just wrong team with the 3.
For non-England fans, this game was comically entertaining. A train wreck it is.
Quote from: springrite on November 21, 2007, 01:12:42 PM
For non-England fans
not to worry mate, we're all with you now! LOL!
Portugal did it so i'm happy.
And seeing England lose at wembley when they only needed a draw was kinda of....funny :P
Quote from: sidoze on November 21, 2007, 01:04:09 PM
useless. overpaid and underskilled. you could see it coming even when they levelled at 2 all. Spot on Hector, just wrong team with the 3.
Wishful thinking on my part.
Could they have been any worse? That first goal...not even Robinson could make a gaffe worse than that!
Ah, well, from the ashes of defeat we will rise again, etc, etc...
Next prediction: a British club will win the Champions League ::)
*yawn* so who's the next England coach?
Quote from: MISHUGINA on November 22, 2007, 08:39:54 AM
*yawn* so who's the next England coach?
If Martin Jol is English he'd be perfect for the job. No club typifies tactic blunders and underachieving like the Spurs (and England).
I bet my arse they would bypass the usual aces (eg: Mourinho, Capello, Klinsmann) for another mediocre Englishman....maybe Steve Copell, Stuart Pierce or even Sam Allerdyce.
Scolari?
My money has gone to those nice people at William Hill.
Question in the qualities today is "Who do we support this Summer, if anybody?"
Suggestions range from nobody, go and watch the cricket, to Croatia, of course, they've got a bloody good team.
Poland? Lot of Poles in England, very nice people, hard-working, don't rip you off, undemanding, etc, etc...
Italy? World Champions, so what, beat the Scots? ;D
Austria? Underdogs and, being English, we always support the underdog(yes, but they are...Austrian!).
France? I know, but, they are nearby and most of their best players play in the EPL - and the best of them play for...Arsenal!
Netherlands? See above!
Me, I'm a Francophile but those Russians play well under Guus Hiddink...hmm, difficult.
Man Utd fans at least will be supporting us, Portugal!! :D because of Ronaldo ...eheh
Quote from: Hector on November 23, 2007, 06:04:14 AM
Question in the qualities today is "Who do we support this Summer, if anybody?"
like I said before, I support Croatia in spite of all :) *runs*
I am sorry that England was defeated.
They would not win the EC but they could provide good games. Croatia is a very modest team and I don't like the way they play.
Without England, we will have four good teams, Germany, Czech Republic, Portugal and Spain, but not strong enough to defeat Italy or France.
Italy will probably win. But their game is so boring !!
Quote from: val on November 24, 2007, 04:18:27 AM
I am sorry that England was defeated.
They would not win the EC but they could provide good games. Croatia is a very modest team and I don't like the way they play.
Without England, we will have four good teams, Germany, Czech Republic, Portugal and Spain, but not strong enough to defeat Italy or France.
Italy will probably win. But their game is so boring !!
Yeah, England can definately participate in some of the classic games when they are in the EC/WC, but they often lose them. And then they often play bad against the weaker teams. I think England (more than other countries) clearly plays at their best at Wembley. Probably they will need to have the EC/WC at home if should have a chance to win it all. They were close in '96.
Italy's game can be boring, and I was SO disappointed when France lost the finale in the WC. Sometimes they play OK in some matches, but when they're getting closer to the finale they always choose the safe and boring defensive/counter-attacking game. I will be a little surprised if they win next summer. Usually it's very difficult to win both the EC/WC in a row. And their team is not so excellent.
I say never under-estimate the Germans. They're almost at home in Austria/Switzerland, so my guess is that they will grab the title next summer.
Czech Republic's golden generation is sadly over (when Nedved said goodbye). They were the moral winners of last EC. I loved their beautiful attacking football. Sadly they were stopped by Nedveds injury, and the super-defensive Greek team.
Portugal will not be the same after Figo quitted, and Spain...They have very good players but talk about a team with such LACK of success in championships.
Euro 2008 tables have been drawn :
Group A
1-Switzerland
2-Czech Republic
3-Portugal
4-Turkey
Group B
1-Austria
2-Croatia
3-Germany
4-Poland
Group C
1-Netherlands
2-Italy
3-Romania
4-France
Group D
1-Greece
2-Sweden
3-Spain
4-Russia
Will surely be interesting from the French perspective :-\ :-\ :-\
Good group for Portugal, it shouldn't be too hard if we play at our level 8)
Holland, France and Italy in the same group, sweet, one will go sooner!!
Quote from: papy on December 02, 2007, 02:58:30 AM
Group C
1-Netherlands
2-Italy
3-Romania
4-France
you can almost bet your house that someone from this, ***The Group of Death****, will win Euro '08. Often it's a team that has it rough from the start that'll make it through.
Greece last time didn't have a hard time, they beat us in the group, and then beat us in the final.
Did i mention i hate them? lolz
Quote from: The Emperor on December 02, 2007, 03:30:13 AM
Greece last time didn't have a hard time, they beat us in the group, and then beat us in the final.
Did i mention i hate them? lolz
You and me both.
Boring one nil wins.
However, the 'Group of Death' will be so exhausting for the teams that none that get through will, eventually, reach the final.
Good time to put some money on Croatia. Teams that beat England tend to do well ;D
First knockout round draw for Champions League.
Schalke - Porto
Roma - Real Madrid
Olympiacos - Chelsea
Liverpool - Internazionale
Celtic - Barcelona
Lyon - Man. United
Fenerbahçe - Sevilla
Arsenal - Milan
We got Liverpool >:D
AS Roma is doomed.
Quote from: Scriptavolant on December 21, 2007, 11:34:54 AM
First knockout round draw for Champions League.
Schalke - Porto
Roma - Real Madrid
Olympiacos - Chelsea
Liverpool - Internazionale
Celtic - Barcelona
Lyon - Man. United
Fenerbahçe - Sevilla
Arsenal - Milan
We got Liverpool >:D
AS Roma is doomed.
It's going to be the following in the next round: Schalke, Chelski, Looserpool, Barca, Man Utd, Sevilla, Arse :)
Are we going to see Chelsea finally make it through to the Final as they have the second leg at home? If they score tonight then they have every chance of making it. Can't bet against the scousers at home though - 2-1, with Carragher being suspended for the second leg.
Quote from: ezodisy on April 22, 2008, 09:59:29 AM
Are we going to see Chelsea finally make it through to the Final as they have the second leg at home? If they score tonight then they have every chance of making it. Can't bet against the scousers at home though - 2-1, with Carragher being suspended for the second leg.
No ;D This time though, the Scousers don't have the "BIG ANFIELD SECOND LEG" to look forward to.
Chelsea 1 v Wigan Athletic 1 (hahahaha) "Blew the league there BIG TIME" :D
then again;
Liverpool 1 v Wigan Athletic 1 (hahahaha)
I have an infalible system as to who will be Champions of Europe based on how they did against Wigan LOL
Manchester United 4 v Wigan Athletic 0 There's your next European Champions!!
* Disclaimer, As Barcelona haven't played Wigan this season, nor the next or ever (come to think of it), then my judgment is based on a substantial "What If" ;D
wow what an amazing close to the transfer window. Where the hell did Man City come from? Robinho for 32.5m confirmed on Sky?
Quote from: ezodisy on September 01, 2008, 01:07:26 PMWhere the hell did Man City come from?
A rhetorical question, I suppose - they came from Dubai, in a manner of speaking. That surprise takeover is the really shocking story of the day, I think. 'We have deep pockets. Very deep pockets....' they say! Move over Chelsea....
Quote from: lukeottevanger on September 01, 2008, 01:16:28 PM
A rhetorical question, I suppose - they came from Dubai, in a manner of speaking. That surprise takeover is the really shocking story of the day, I think. 'We have deep pockets. Very deep pockets....' they say! Move over Chelsea....
Yeah and you know what I like most about this? The scousers are probably looking on in complete jealousy as they're owned by a couple of American twits instead of that Dubai group which tried to buy them out. Suckers. LOL. Man City are sending out a message (as you said from Dubai) that they are going to have some real muscle in January and next summer. Thing is, they need some imagination if they're not going to just copy Chelsea's tactic of picking off others' targets (like Berbatov, Robinho, Villa). A symptom of being nouveau riche, no doubt.
I am still trying to come to terms with John Terry's penalty miss in the Champion's League final. If only :'(
Quote from: ezodisy on September 01, 2008, 01:22:05 PM
Yeah and you know what I like most about this? The scousers are probably looking on in complete jealousy as they're owned by a couple of American twits instead of that Dubai group which tried to buy them out. Suckers. LOL. Man City are sending out a message (as you said from Dubai) that they are going to have some real muscle in January and next summer. Thing is, they need some imagination if they're not going to just copy Chelsea's tactic of picking off others' targets (like Berbatov, Robinho, Villa). A symptom of being nouveau riche, no doubt.
What I found funny is that (apparently), in a photo shoot to celebrate their acquisition of Man City, the buyers held up a City shirt with Dubai Utd written on it. :o :o :o :o They have so much to learn!
Not to worry, money fixes everything, and everyone forgives money. Robinho has agreed to join Man City. What a tosser. Even Calderon stated that it cannot be for footballing reasons. Crying for weeks, calling press conferences to announce his wish to join the chavs, and what happens? ha ha ha ha ha
The Bulgarian gypsy moves north. I always knew that that red colour wouldn't suit him. All the same the league's most creative striker (by a country mile) will now unleash the power of the white Pele, Wayne Rooney. All we need is to get Berbatov an Englsh passport and we'll mop the international floor.
(http://www.manutdpics.com/image/Dimitar-Berbatov-signs-for-Manchester-United_1217067.jpg?mediatype=2&mediaid=1217067&fitfill=fit&pvw=694)
FCB
You see, this is the difference between educated football managers and directors, and those who are on a nouveau riche high. Managers like Ferguson and Benitez have scouted (more or less) and acquired top dollar strikers who are reaching or in their prime, exceptional talents who are sure to fit into their teams (if not played out of position...). On the other side of things you have the trigger-happy folk at Chelsea and now Man City who will chase others' interests and more or less disregard an overall scheme of how the player will fit in, if even taking into account any potential or compatability he might have in the exceptionally fast and aggressive PL. God knows that 32.5m for a 1-goal-in-4-games striker, who looks almost certain to dislike the pace and weather here, is almost bound to be a doomed purchase. I'd be very surprised if this works out. A good opinion here I think: http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/timvickery/2008/09/the_big_question_left_by.html
Apparently the new City owners plan to buy Ronaldo in January, for £120m, followed next summer by Eto'o, Berbatov, Ronaldinho, Fabregas, Torres, Buffon, and probably a few other "names" I've forgotten. Is this guy fucking serious? lol
the world's only source for PL football news: http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/article1641272.ece
Federer through to the US Open final. He played too well, I thought Djokovic was in with a chance but sometimes the guy veers too close to self-destruction for his own good. In the other semi-final Murray is very close to getting through, up two sets to love, play starting again at 9pm tonight London time.
Hyypia shocked at Reds omission from UCL squad (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/l/liverpool/7605682.stm)
"This is yet another appalling decision by Rafa. I've followed the Reds passionately for 35 years and am frankly disgusted with the way the club is being run. Benitez has completely lost the plot in his transfer dealings and team selections and as a result we have regressed rapidly compared to last season. Finnan, along with Carra, has been our best defender for the last 4 seasons. He is everything you could ask for in a right back so Rafa sells him and brings in a dodgy Spanish B int'l, Arbeloa, who is a complete liability, as his replacement. Riise was solid on the left, in defence and midfield, popping up with important goals in the UCL. He is sold. We now essentially have a crop of dodgy full backs and no decent midfield width. He sells Crouch who generally performed well, scored goals and linked well with Torres. He plays Kuyt and Babel continually out of position in wide areas. We look completely one-dimensional as a side and totally lacking creativity. Hyppia played well every time he was given a chance last season and he is now binned from the squad. He gets rid of Paco, an excellent right hand man and we now have Pelegrino and Sammy Lee - a man who wasn't fit to wear the Reds shirt let alone help coaching them.
The American ownership, as I feared, has been a complete shambolic disaster. The biggest sadness is, all the squad needed were a couple of tiny tweaks after last season. We have an excellent spine and what the side has been crying out for, as it has done for the last 18 years, basically since Beardsley left, is a world class playmaker. We should have snapped up Pablo Aimar. Instead we buy yet more middle-of-the-road, overseas players who you instinctively know will fail. We will win nothing this season, Gerrard will be on his bike at the end of the year and we'll end up in an even more dire position." - johnnyrant [not much of a rant there I would say]
Quote from: ezodisy on September 09, 2008, 01:42:50 AM
Hyypia shocked at Reds omission from UCL squad (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/l/liverpool/7605682.stm)
"This is yet another appalling decision by Rafa. I've followed the Reds passionately for 35 years and am frankly disgusted with the way the club is being run. Benitez has completely lost the plot in his transfer dealings and team selections and as a result we have regressed rapidly compared to last season. Finnan, along with Carra, has been our best defender for the last 4 seasons. He is everything you could ask for in a right back so Rafa sells him and brings in a dodgy Spanish B int'l, Arbeloa, who is a complete liability, as his replacement. Riise was solid on the left, in defence and midfield, popping up with important goals in the UCL. He is sold. We now essentially have a crop of dodgy full backs and no decent midfield width. He sells Crouch who generally performed well, scored goals and linked well with Torres. He plays Kuyt and Babel continually out of position in wide areas. We look completely one-dimensional as a side and totally lacking creativity. Hyppia played well every time he was given a chance last season and he is now binned from the squad. He gets rid of Paco, an excellent right hand man and we now have Pelegrino and Sammy Lee - a man who wasn't fit to wear the Reds shirt let alone help coaching them.
The American ownership, as I feared, has been a complete shambolic disaster. The biggest sadness is, all the squad needed were a couple of tiny tweaks after last season. We have an excellent spine and what the side has been crying out for, as it has done for the last 18 years, basically since Beardsley left, is a world class playmaker. We should have snapped up Pablo Aimar. Instead we buy yet more middle-of-the-road, overseas players who you instinctively know will fail. We will win nothing this season, Gerrard will be on his bike at the end of the year and we'll end up in an even more dire position." - johnnyrant [not much of a rant there I would say]
I feel sorry for your loss ;D
Quote from: ezodisy on September 09, 2008, 01:42:50 AM
Hyypia shocked at Reds omission from UCL squad (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/l/liverpool/7605682.stm)
"This is yet another appalling decision by Rafa. I've followed the Reds passionately for 35 years and am frankly disgusted with the way the club is being run. Benitez has completely lost the plot in his transfer dealings and team selections and as a result we have regressed rapidly compared to last season. Finnan, along with Carra, has been our best defender for the last 4 seasons. He is everything you could ask for in a right back so Rafa sells him and brings in a dodgy Spanish B int'l, Arbeloa, who is a complete liability, as his replacement. Riise was solid on the left, in defence and midfield, popping up with important goals in the UCL. He is sold. We now essentially have a crop of dodgy full backs and no decent midfield width. He sells Crouch who generally performed well, scored goals and linked well with Torres. He plays Kuyt and Babel continually out of position in wide areas. We look completely one-dimensional as a side and totally lacking creativity. Hyppia played well every time he was given a chance last season and he is now binned from the squad. He gets rid of Paco, an excellent right hand man and we now have Pelegrino and Sammy Lee - a man who wasn't fit to wear the Reds shirt let alone help coaching them.
The American ownership, as I feared, has been a complete shambolic disaster. The biggest sadness is, all the squad needed were a couple of tiny tweaks after last season. We have an excellent spine and what the side has been crying out for, as it has done for the last 18 years, basically since Beardsley left, is a world class playmaker. We should have snapped up Pablo Aimar. Instead we buy yet more middle-of-the-road, overseas players who you instinctively know will fail. We will win nothing this season, Gerrard will be on his bike at the end of the year and we'll end up in an even more dire position." - johnnyrant [not much of a rant there I would say]
Dunno' where you got that from, but most of it is absolute bollocks... ::)
Quote from: ezodisy on September 01, 2008, 01:22:05 PM
Yeah and you know what I like most about this? The scousers are probably looking on in complete jealousy as they're owned by a couple of American twits instead of that Dubai group which tried to buy them out. Suckers. LOL.
Well, sorry to piss on your bonfire, but those in the know think a DIC or more likely, Dubai Holdings take over is still very much on the cards. Dialogue between the Americans and DIC is still very much continuing and the Sheikh himself is now said to be personally involved:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammed_bin_Rashid_Al_Maktoum#Liverpool_F.C._takeover_bid
The Sheikh is quite prepared to wait for them to be down on their knees (financially speaking) and looks like they are doing a fine job...
;)
Quote from: Peregrine on September 09, 2008, 01:21:59 PM
Dunno' where you got that from, but most of it is absolute bollocks... ::)
606 on BBC, it seemed accurate to me. Actually I also think Liverpool will be takenover by them too. The thing is, are Liverpool really having a hard time with the Americans? Since the takeover they've bought two £20m players (more or less a few £m) and a whole host of other players. Maybe they're sitting on a mountain of loans and debts, I don't know, but I would guess that the problem is being exaggerated by supporters who seem to be fooled or at least led on somewhat by media and by Benitez when the manager instead is the one who's causing the problems, IMHHHHHO :)
Quote from: ezodisy on September 09, 2008, 11:44:50 PM
606 on BBC, it seemed accurate to me. Actually I also think Liverpool will be takenover by them too. The thing is, are Liverpool really having a hard time with the Americans? Since the takeover they've bought two £20m players (more or less a few £m) and a whole host of other players. Maybe they're sitting on a mountain of loans and debts, I don't know, but I would guess that the problem is being exaggerated by supporters who seem to be fooled or at least led on somewhat by media and by Benitez when the manager instead is the one who's causing the problems, IMHHHHHO :)
Hmmmm ::) I think we'll have to agree to disagree
Quote from: Peregrine on September 10, 2008, 07:21:52 AM
Hmmmm ::) I think we'll have to agree to disagree
Nonsense we'll do nothing of the sort ;D
We can perhaps reach a truce after Saturday's game, once the foregone conclusion has occured ;D
Quote from: ezodisy on September 10, 2008, 08:10:25 AM
Nonsense we'll do nothing of the sort ;D
We can perhaps reach a truce after Saturday's game, once the foregone conclusion has occured ;D
Oh, don't be a wimp! I know you are not a Milwall man, but hey!
Quote from: springrite on September 10, 2008, 08:13:04 AM
Oh, don't be a wimp! I know you are not a Milwall man, but hey!
hey don't underestimate me, I'll support them if they're winning! lol
Not this weekend, I hope - they're playing my lot of losers. Yes indeed, Leicester seem to have found their level this season, shall we say, riding high as they are....in League One, which is the lowest division they've ever graced. ::) And only ten years back we had O'Neill and we had trophies.... :( :( Doesn't do to think about it too much....
(http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/liverpoolecho/sep2008/7/6/6560B54A-CBEB-9D13-99E459163828047F.jpg)
Top of the league? You're having a........no, wait........nevermind.......a laugh :P
"DIC is not involved in any negotiations to buy Liverpool and is not planning a fresh bid for LFC or any other club."
Quote from: ezodisy on September 10, 2008, 08:34:39 AM
I'll support them if they're winning!
Now where is the fun in that?
Quote from: Drasko on September 15, 2008, 11:21:50 AM
Now where is the fun in that?
Well surely there isn't any at all (aside from the party factor, mind). To show that I am not such an opportunistic mercenary, I will gladly support FK Rad as they attempt to climb the table from 11th (out of 12) to 1st. One point from the first 4 games, already trailing Partizan by 8 yet the latter has only played 3 games. After all with a name like RAD how could one not be happy supporting them?
Quote from: ezodisy on September 15, 2008, 11:18:08 AM
"DIC is not involved in any negotiations to buy Liverpool and is not planning a fresh bid for LFC or any other club."
As has been known for some time. DIC as the investment arm of Dubai, no longer see the acquisition as an investment, but as I stated above this looks like being the likely outcome:
"Dubai ruler Sheikh Mohammed could yet fund a takeover of the Reds, however.
The BBC understands Sheikh Mohammed is still keen on a takeover of the Merseyside club, although he would not utilise DIC in any negotiations."
Quote from: ezodisy on September 15, 2008, 01:22:28 PM
After all with a name like RAD how could one not be happy supporting them?
You sure know how to pick 'em. Their supporters are small but viscious bunch, possibly the meanest around. Here is their web page, I think everything is in Serbian but picture gallery will suffice (Следећа means Next (page)).
http://www.united-force.org/index.php?page=galerija&sezona=1987-2008&clanak=ne
Quote from: Drasko on September 15, 2008, 01:49:58 PM
You sure know how to pick 'em. Their supporters are small but viscious bunch, possibly the meanest around. Here is their web page, I think everything is in Serbian but picture gallery will suffice (Следећа means Next (page)).
http://www.united-force.org/index.php?page=galerija&sezona=1987-2008&clanak=ne
Well the first thing I would say about this is that they need to hire someone who can establish some order -- I don't mean among the fans but the online pictures which seem to be spread randomly so shots from a single incident can be split across a dozen pages. Not helpful. Needless to say that I don't like that sort of violence at all. I do rather like the sort which has a comic side to it though, like in this picture:
(http://www.united-force.org/galerija/203487-08%20(145).jpg)
which reminds me of the picture I use for my desktop:
(http://cache3.asset-cache.net/xc/74250573.jpg?v=1&c=NewsMaker&k=2&d=17A4AD9FDB9CF1935A6DEC864C2BC5D95C5BAB7A55E722F5)
though this one's pretty good too:
(http://cache2.asset-cache.net/xc/74397988.jpg?v=1&c=NewsMaker&k=2&d=17A4AD9FDB9CF193FDE3AF4FFC4B70CF7362AC97481C2EBDA55A1E4F32AD3138)
Note that the fans of Rad are smart enough to fight the cops, whereas the scousers are fighting each other ;D
Quote from: ezodisy on September 15, 2008, 02:17:08 PM
I do rather like the sort which has a comic side to it though, like in this picture:
(http://www.united-force.org/galerija/203487-08%20(145).jpg)
I don't get it. What's so funy about that?
Quote from: M forever on September 15, 2008, 04:17:58 PM
I don't get it. What's so funy about that?
Well you know what senses of humour are like.......Nothing terribly funny about it, I just rather like the age on the left (Where's Waldo?), the, um, element of surprise coming in, and the fact that someone caught it moment on camera, which seems to happen with everything these days. Not sure what happened to the Getty images I posted, they don't seem to be showing. Anyway, c'est la vie.
(http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:Xbu7HoAdKodNPM:http://www1.dortmund.de/upload/binarydata_do4ud4cms/87/57/16/00/00/00/165787/bvb.50x50.jpg)
A good weekend this weekend: Borussia Dortmund (BVB) against FC Schalke 04. THE Ruhrgebiets-Derby.
After 0:3, Dortmund achieved a 3:3 in the 89th minute with friendly help of the referee. This is great, because it's even more painful for the FC Gelsenkirchen folks.
The 3:3 on the objective ;) BVB net radio. Norbert Dickel is the speaker, he's an ex Dortmund player and now radio man and stadium announcer at the same time.
[mp3=200,20,0,left]http://www.fileden.com/files/2007/9/21/1446950/1495888freitorall.mp3[/mp3]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5jL5nADDaY
Last night's Champions League has been such an incredible goal fest! 6:3? 5:2? What a night to watch the glorious game! The "low scoring" games (3:0 ManU vs Celtics, etc.) are incredible games as well. I will have trouble finding enough time to watch all the replays today!
Quote from: springrite on October 21, 2008, 08:33:06 PM
Last night's Champions League has been such an incredible goal fest! 6:3? 5:2? What a night to watch the glorious game! The "low scoring" games (3:0 ManU vs Celtics, etc.) are incredible games as well. I will have trouble finding enough time to watch all the replays today!
Walcott, there is only one Theo Walcott (continually repeat refrain)!
After his spectacular goal the whole stadium went silent, accept for the murmurrings of the few Arsenal supporters.
Aragones...retire! ;D
someone made this song in tribute of Totenham Hotspurs (sung to the tune of American Pie)
A long, long time ago,
I can still remember,
How the Carling Cup win made them smile,
And they knew this could be their chance,
To finally make that big advance,
And maybe, break the top 4 for a while.
But transfer windows made them shiver,
As Robbie Keane went off to Liver.....
Pool, and Berbs to Man U,
You can't believe it can you?
Tears of laughter we all cried,
As on Bent they have to rely,
And Frasier Campbell really tried,
The Day That Tottenham Died !
So my my kiss UEFA goodbye,
When Comoli sold the Goalie,
Well it made Levy Cry,
When you play for Spurs you kiss Capello goodbye,
Soon your gonna be a Magpie,
I bet you wish you were a Magpie.
Did your players eat the poisoned food,
To let Arsenal in and Spoil your mood,
If the fansite tells you so,
Do you believe in Chas n Dave,
Can their music save you from an early grave,
And can Dawson teach me how to run real slow,
Well, I knew you were set for a let down,
When the Spaniard signed the Blackburn clown,
You sacked poor Martin Jol,
And now everyone just laughs out loud,
I have long been laughing at your lack of luck,
Your delusion means I couldn't give a .....,
That to the table bottom you are stuck,
The day the Tottenham died,
I started singing........
So my my kiss UEFA goodbye,
When Comoli sold the goalie,
Well it made Levy cry,
When you play for Spurs you kiss Capello goodbye,
Soon your gonna be a Magpie,
I bet you wish you were a Magpie
Poor old Totteringham.
They do not deserve such ignominy. :-[
Quote from: Hector on October 24, 2008, 05:50:29 AM
Poor old Totteringham.
They do not deserve such ignominy. :-[
Well, it sure is the most entertaining show of the EPL this season!
St. Totteringham Day comes early this season for sure!
fight night!!!!!
Roy Jones Jr v Joe Calzaghe: Madison Square Garden, New York
Date: Saturday 8 November (0415 GMT Sunday)
Very very difficult one to call (might as well pump the fight up a little) but only a fool would bet against the dragon. Just hoping Jones doesn't suddenly shed 10 years for 1 night ::)
;D
excellent fight, Joe cut him open badly in the 7th or 8th and it was all downhill for Jones from that point. 118-109, remains undefeated.
Quote from: vandermolen on November 08, 2008, 03:22:38 PM
;D
Very good.
Now that I have been persuaded into acquiring a satellite dish I have watched some of the greatest of games.
The revival of Totteringham back into Spurs under Harry-I-don't-know-how-he-does-it-but-they-should-bottle-it-Redknap at the Arse and, again, the recent magnificent win over Man. U by the Gunners. ;D ;D ;D
Quote from: Hector on November 11, 2008, 05:24:02 AM
the recent magnificent win over Man. U by the Gunners. ;D ;D ;D
that was a great game of football, end-to-end and full flight. It's funny that that sort of high octane footballl tends to be produced only from either very bad sides or very very good sides. The space in the middle of the park at times was outrageous.
Quote from: ezodisy on November 11, 2008, 11:35:16 PM
that was a great game of football, end-to-end and full flight. It's funny that that sort of high octane footballl tends to be produced only from either very bad sides or very very good sides. The space in the middle of the park at times was outrageous.
Good observation. In most sports, the best games are usually the ones where the two sides are of comparable quality. For me, some of the best games every season are the end of season relegation battles.
What's the deal with Dirk Kuyt this year? He's playing like a dream-team player. Surely this sort of luck cannot continue through to May.
Lucky I only sat through the second half of the Liverpool/Fulham game. That was absolute rubbish. Villa/ManU was a good intense scoreless game, the Chavs shouldn't have dropped 2 points, and Arsenal are now out of the top 4. That is your football round-up. Tonight is fight night!!!!!! Hatton in 4, that nouveau riche ponce has no chance against him.
Quote from: ezodisy on November 22, 2008, 11:29:44 AM
Lucky I only sat through the second half of the Liverpool/Fulham game. That was absolute rubbish. Villa/ManU was a good intense scoreless game, the Chavs shouldn't have dropped 2 points, and Arsenal are now out of the top 4. That is your football round-up. Tonight is fight night!!!!!! Hatton in 4, that nouveau riche ponce has no chance against him.
Arsenal was awful. Liverpool was rubbish. ManU was OK and Chelsea did not score either. None of the so-called "Big Four" scored this weekend. Villa looked good. This season is turning into the most "interesting" season in the EPL in ages. No clear indications on either end of the table as December approaches. Vanessa is losing patience with Arsenal. But I find this season to be more interesting to follow in terms of the overall scheme of things.
Yeah I agree. Chelsea have been chugging along quietly but steadily, I could see them winning the title this year. Second half of the season will be thrilling at both ends of the table.
Hatton won, fight stopped in round 11.
man this looks good. Arsenal against Barcelona might have been preferable, but ya don't complain when you've got near perfection.
Champions League holders Man Utd will play Inter Milan in the last 16, while Liverpool face Real Madrid, Chelsea play Juventus and Arsenal take on Roma.
Gerrard charged in assault probe (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/merseyside/7804056.stm)
HA HA HA HA HA!
Quote from: ezodisy on December 29, 2008, 11:41:23 PM
Gerrard charged in assault probe (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/merseyside/7804056.stm)
HA HA HA HA HA!
Would have been funnier if it were C. Ronaldo. But still...
nah you can't beat the timing of this, just hours after he was talking up his title chances and how it's the best team he's played in. For someone who so desperately wants to win the league, and has a great chance this year, the timing could hardly be worse (or better for some).
Quote from: ezodisy on December 29, 2008, 11:51:27 PM
nah you can't beat the timing of this, just hours after he was talking up his title chances and how it's the best team he's played in. For someone who so desperately wants to win the league, and has a great chance this year, the timing could hardly be worse (or better for some).
What is it about Liverpool? Remember the "let's give Michael a chance to win some trophy" sentiment and his subsequent transfer to Real (with the blessing of most of the Scousers). Then Liverpool won the CL without him. Michael got buried on the bench at Real, got the desperation transfer to Newcastle and went downhill from there.
Oh the curse of being the #1 guy at Liverpool FC.
well if you spend 24 hours inside like he did then they probably have something on you (CCTV and/or witnesses). I don't know what he's doing hanging around there anyway when he could be using his ridiculous and as ever with English footballers wholly undeserved riches to go pick up beautiful foreign leggy catwalk mistresses. I was down in Belgravia this morning for a rather tense agm and on the way back up Sloane Street caught sight of the hottest pair of legs I've seen in ages in these tight dark stripey black/green leggings with the perfect crossover walk which looked totally unaffected. Instead of hanging around with a bunch of deadbeats Gerrard should be trying to win the cup and picking up mistresses like that one who obviously was only interested in shopping and (spending) money but that can be forgiven. At least now we know what'll be pointed to as the turning point if Liverpool concede top spot.
(http://www.kickette.com/images/uploads/gerrardbottom.jpg)
the boy wears a thoooooooooooong
*clap* *clap* *clap*
On his knees in
prison all night long
The Clash - Rock the Casbah
;D
I think this will get an airing today -
(To the tune of Robin Hood)
Steven Gerrard is our captain
Steven Gerrard is a red
Steven Gerrard plays for Liverpool
A Scouser born and bred...
the guy who got battered was probably asking for it by doing something stupid to provoke him, and I doubt Gerrard did much if anything anyway. Don't think it'll affect his season either. I'm really looking forward to thos champs league games next month
Enjoying the beating The Richest Club on the Planet is receiving AT HOME from Forest!
well you know all teams have players which even their own fans think are rubbish or near to it. It's just a wonder why that particular one (Lucas) gets played again and again because he doesn't score, doesn't create all that much, doesn't even bust a gut like Kuyt, just tends to give the ball away a whole lot. It's not quite the same team without Alonso is it?
Quote from: ezodisy on January 10, 2009, 10:27:27 AM
well you know all teams have players which even their own fans think are rubbish or near to it. It's just a wonder why that particular one (Lucas) gets played again and again because he doesn't score, doesn't create all that much, doesn't even bust a gut like Kuyt, just tends to give the ball away a whole lot. It's not quite the same team without Alonso is it?
Lucas is a young lad and making a name for himself in a foreign country. He has had his fair share of dodgy games, but after a MoM against Newcastle (arguably shared with Gerrard) he's been on a bit of a roll, today's game excepted. He's come very highly rated from Brazil and if given the chance will become a top midfielder, but modern day Sky orientated fans strive for immediacy in everything and if they don't get what they want, react accordingly.
However, Alonso is a fantastic player and having a great season, but injured. I still think I'ld have played Lucas ahead of him in this game because Alonso is an artist and probably would have struggled against a physical side like Stoke. Whilst Lucas doesn't have the passing range of Alonso (who does?), he's decent, and along with the Masch' can put himself about a bit.
Hindsight as ever is a wonderful thing and a draw today is disappointing, but I'm just really chuffed at our position in the league and let's just see how it all pans out at the end eh?
Quote from: Peregrine on January 10, 2009, 10:46:34 AM
Lucas is a young lad and making a name for himself in a foreign country.
Yeah dude so's my bricklaying friend from Poland. lol No doubt he's got talent to play at any PL club. Just saying that I don't see his merit in a starting roll, and even less in an off-the-bench change-the-game sort of roll. Carling Cup/FA/home to West Brom type of player maybe, second string, build up his game, earn a spot in the first team. Then again, it does beg the question of whether there's anyone better on the bench to replace him right now?
Alonso is quality and I think he's a tough player too, I've seen him fly into tackles many times and am pretty certain he would have done fine against Stoke.
Quote
Hindsight as ever is a wonderful thing and a draw today is disappointing, but I'm just really chuffed at our position in the league and let's just see how it all pans out at the end eh?
yeah that's all that matters. I said at the start of the season that I don't really see ManU taking it and so far they haven't really clicked. Should be an interesting run in, but I'm particularly looking forward to the CL games next month
Quote from: ezodisy on January 10, 2009, 10:57:36 AM
Yeah dude so's my bricklaying friend from Poland. lol
Are you mocking me? ;D
Quote from: ezodisy on January 10, 2009, 10:57:36 AM
Then again, it does beg the question of whether there's anyone better on the bench to replace him right now?
I think a midfield pool of Gerrard, Alonso, Masch and Lucas is more than sufficient...and IMO is the best in the league, but maybe I'm biased...
Quote from: ezodisy on January 10, 2009, 10:57:36 AM
Alonso is quality and I think he's a tough player too, I've seen him fly into tackles many times and am pretty certain he would have done fine against Stoke.
He is tough and maybe I've done him a disservice, but I'm with Rafa on this and still think Lucas is good enough to fill his boots, albeit a different type of player.
Quote from: ezodisy on January 10, 2009, 10:57:36 AM
yeah that's all that matters. I said at the start of the season that I don't really see ManU taking it and so far they haven't really clicked. Should be an interesting run in, but I'm particularly looking forward to the CL games next month
I am just really excited that we are in the mix at this stage of the season. I know you like to knock Liverpool, but I can only see it as a positive that we are competing and in turn making the Premier League more competitive. Oh how I yearn for days of yonder when we were winning the league regularly but had umpteen teams chasing us for the title at the beginning of a season. We now just look at the top four amd guess who's gonna' take it and even then, it's only really been yourselves and Chelsea over the past few years! God forbid it ends up like Scotland with two teams contesting top honours year in, year out.
Quote from: Peregrine on January 10, 2009, 11:14:53 AM
I know you like to knock Liverpool
Well for me it's not so much the team as the manager. Honestly I would knock any team with Benitez, because I just don't like overly defensive types (which I think he is) and I especially don't like chaps who appear too petty to appreciate their talented rivals (Ferguson, Mourinho, Wenger, for all their venom you know there's an appreciation of each other deep down, whereas Benitez appears to despise them all, particularly F and M). If he wants to win the league he's going to have to gamble a bit more. Ferguson might be a cantankerous wino but one thing I like about him is that he's willing to gamble with fortune. After the Japanese trip a few weeks back, being held by Stoke away, he threw on his last striker and went for it and it paid off with a typical last minute Tevez goal. Keane might not be doing so well without a creative strike partner to feed off (Berbatov) but why leave him on the bench again? He's a scorer and Benitez needs to win these games, because 1 point against the other big 3 might be okay but against a team lower down it can only stand as a missed chance. I'm still surprised that decisions like that keep the fan base loyal to him, because to me they just don't make sense, if anything are just self-destructive. As a fan of an opposing team, however, I am not going to complain too loudly >:D
Quote from: Peregrine on January 10, 2009, 11:14:53 AM
God forbid it ends up like Scotland with two teams contesting top honours year in, year out.
yeah that would be nonsense. Competition is everything and I hope it continues
problem with going on the attack too early is that on the counter you can be made to look like a dumbass. Luckily for Benitez the season still has a long way to run.
Next 5 pool league fixtures:
Liverpool v Everton
Wigan v Liverpool
Liverpool v Chelsea
Portsmouth v Liverpool
Liverpool v Man City
then off to Real Madrid. Not easy games at all, I think 9 or 10 points from that lot would be very good indeed.
Jose's last episode of I'm on Setanta Sports. What a shame, that was a bloody marvelous show
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/article2126618.ece
Quote from: ezodisy on November 23, 2008, 01:00:51 AM
Yeah I agree. Chelsea have been chugging along quietly but steadily, I could see them winning the title this year.
I doubt it and I speak as a long-suffering Chelsea supporter (ie from the early 1960s)
long-suffering? You've been suffering what, for 2 seasons? ;) Chelsea should win something agains oon. Seems the boss is getting a bit bored of the club though
I am surprised that Chelsea's lack of results with the pay-and-dominate plan hasn't discouraged other foolish rich people from buying up English clubs. They've done well but are very far from dominating their rivals despite all that cash influx.
Atm the positions of Man City owned by a seriously rich guy, and Man United owned by a guy in debt show quite well that existing talent is equally important to near-infinite supplies of money. Arsenal also seem to be doing fine near the top (if not challenging) despite being financial welterweights in comparison.
But whatever, as long as they're wasting their money in England rather than abroad, that is OK with me :P
Benitez 'rejects' new deal offer (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/l/liverpool/7827052.stm)
I recall reading somewhere that Benitez in part ended falling out with his old club/chairman/owners over trying to take too much control. That may just be malicious drivel, but it would fit the part of someone who seems overly organised, i.e. a control freak. History repeating? He'll probably sign at some point though, but it's all a little silly
Quote from: ezodisy on January 16, 2009, 03:16:44 AM
Benitez 'rejects' new deal offer (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/l/liverpool/7827052.stm)
I recall reading somewhere that Benitez in part ended falling out with his old club/chairman/owners over trying to take too much control. That may just be malicious drivel, but it would fit the part of someone who seems overly organised, i.e. a control freak. History repeating? He'll probably sign at some point though, but it's all a little silly
Oh bollocks, it's all going to end in tears...fuck it, got a court rpeort to do...
Quote from: Peregrine on January 16, 2009, 03:21:22 AM
Oh bollocks, it's all going to end in tears...fuck it, got a court rpeort to do...
lol! good luck with the report. Does anyone even like Parry? I thought he was viewed as someone who gets in the way?
Meanwhile, Tottenham is spending big again. Buying back Defoe at more than double the price one year after selling him. buying Palacio for 14mil one year after Wigan bought him for 1mil. The soap opera at WHL never ceases to amaze. ;)
Quote from: ezodisy on January 16, 2009, 03:34:20 AM
Does anyone even like Parry? I thought he was viewed as someone who gets in the way?
No, the common consensus is that he is a complete tool and Gilletes lapdog. Rafa hates him.
"First reports of the "£100m" bid appeared on a website owned by Berlusconi."
That just about says it all ::)
Liverpool: Reina, Carragher, Hyypia, Skrtel, Aurelio, Kuyt, Gerrard, Alonso, Riera, Keane, Torres.
Liverpool's best line-up? I'd say so. They should win tonight.
"[Keane] is expensive and high profile, yes. But Manchester United have bought plenty of players who cost £20m or more every single year. Sometimes more than one player. But nothing is said about them being left out," added Benitez.
lol! Again?
He'd win this:
(http://www.nicholsoncartoons.com.au/cartoons/new/2005-11-24%20Vanstone%20Beazley%20foot%20in%20mouth%20media%20450.jpg)
great Australian Open final, can't believe Nadal could play like that after the 5 set semi final on Friday, bloody well deserved. Not a comfortable sight to see Federer break down in tears at the speech though.
An American by birth, I will be celebrating our national religious holiday today in the company of friends, most of whom are far more faithful worshippers than I, though they tolerate my apostasy. We will intoxicate ourselves with the holy sacraments of chips and beer, writhe and shout feverishly when the spirit moves us (Are you blind, ref? No way that was interference!), forgive our misguided brethern who root for the other side, and gaze raptly upon the 30-second messages of salvation.
A week from now most of us won't remember the score or even who played. I don't even know who's in it this year, but I think I heard that Pittsbug is the AFC representative.
Get in!!!
(http://www.redimps.co.uk/javaImages/c4/63/0,,10440~3302340,00.jpg)
(http://image.guardian.co.uk/sys-images/Football/Pix/gallery/2004/09/01/lampardandrewsilcox-toe.jpg)
and whilst we're on the subject of fat blokes:
(http://www.thisisnot1966.com/images/fat-rooney.jpg)
;D
lol! nice pics.
but lucky lucky lucky with that red. That has got to be one of the worst decisions this season. Great result for Liverpool though.
One thing I will say is that if Keane gets shipped out during this window then it would be without doubt the worst case of man-management I've seen or heard of with a player. It is just absolutely ridiculous what's gone on with him.
Quote from: DavidRoss on February 01, 2009, 05:32:53 AM
A week from now most of us won't remember the score or even who played. I don't even know who's in it this year, but I think I heard that Pittsbug is the AFC representative.
lol! Sounds about right!
Quote from: ezodisy on February 01, 2009, 09:04:06 AM
One thing I will say is that if Keane gets shipped out during this window then it would be without doubt the worst case of man-management I've seen or heard of with a player. It is just absolutely ridiculous what's gone on with him.
Well, dunno' about the worst, I'm sure there's far worse that's occurred, but Rafa is being incredibly obstinate over this and highlighting the fact that he never wanted to pay the money for Keane in the first place - he wanted Barry.
Do have to feel sorry for Keane in the middle of all this though....
well I know he wanted Barry but I can't imagine he wouldn't have wanted Keane. He's hardly evne tried to accommodate the player. Okay maybe there are incidents of poor man-management equal to this, but I think this one will live long in the memory if Keane gets shipped out. Every manager has dud buys--some more than others *ahem*--but it's usual for the manager to at least try to shuffle the pack and get the guy into the team in a proper position. Rafa hasn't really done that. For Keane it would be best for his career to get the hell out
It seems Keane has understood that it just won't work out, which is a real shame because it was his childhood dream, the guy must feel real down about it. Not his fault obviously. Arsenal seem to have nailed down that smug little Russian c*nt.
lol!
Liverpool: Reina, Carragher, Skrtel, Agger, Dossena, Arbeloa, Mascherano, Aurelio, Babel, Ngog, Benayoun. Subs: Cavalieri, Hyypia, Torres, Riera, Alonso, Kuyt, El Zhar.
Quote from: ezodisy on February 07, 2009, 08:12:36 AM
lol!
Liverpool: Reina, Carragher, Skrtel, Agger, Dossena, Arbeloa, Mascherano, Aurelio, Babel, Ngog, Benayoun. Subs: Cavalieri, Hyypia, Torres, Riera, Alonso, Kuyt, El Zhar.
Over the past 6 weeks or more, Rafa has made Pool into his one man farcical comedy.
May it continue.
PS: He should have started El Zhar and Cavalieri Rusticana.
lucky lucky lucky.
I've been watching this and frankly you could sense that last goal was coming. Pompey look rubbish right now
We're still in it....
I love this man:
(http://www.epltalk.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/fernando-torres.jpg)
8)
Tony, someone posted this on TLW the other day. Fucking cracks me up, like one of those dodgy ads you used to see at the cinema when you were about ten:
http://www.youtube.com/v/y60RGIvgh2s
Quote from: Peregrine on February 07, 2009, 10:39:57 AM
Tony, someone posted this on TLW the other day. Fucking cracks me up, like one of those dodgy ads you used to see at the cinema when you were about ten:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_kj0STSZFl0
hahaha what a wink! I think it's really cool he agreed to do that, it's like a high school project (or worse) without any affectation. Nice one.*
* (no wonder he's the only scouser everyone likes) lol!
derby day, man I love derby days. The game they played earlier this season was sensational, hope this one is as good (with a lot of blood & guts & stuff)
This could have gone on humerous youtube video thread but thought it might be appreciated here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x7vRWOZpkdE
Norway just beat Germany!
Quote from: erato on February 11, 2009, 12:33:02 PM
Norway just beat Germany!
A pity that 'the Voice of Norway' is no longer alive to celebrate this great achievement:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PqZTP8-8wIs&feature=related
"We're quite far behind them now and we needed to win the game, but you never know," said Beckham.
"This league is strange, you can win one week and lose the next, so there's a chance, but it's a slim chance.
(http://weblogs.newsday.com/sports/watchdog/blog/twilight-zone.jpg)
fuck off Mourinho!!!!!
CL is back :) :) :) :)
Quote from: ezodisy on February 23, 2009, 11:43:08 PM
fuck off Mourinho!!!!!
CL is back :) :) :) :)
That CL you're raving about. Is that abbreviated CELTIC? Yes, Glasgow Celtic are indeed a finer team than any he has managed so far.
But wait, why tell Mourinho to 'fuck off'. Is there no better way you would like to see him go from the World of Soccer entertainment?
Mourinho is one of the finest if not THE finest soccer manager in the World, driven by tactics of the heart and not the head. Any attempt by him to 'fuck off' will be met with extreme hostility.
I'm glad he moved on from Chelsea, he was too good for such a rolling rambuckle pile of players such as Chelsea. Now I can watch them lose matches again.
no I meant (The) Champion's League, this is always my favourite part of the footballing calendar.
Mourinho I hope will soon receive his foot squarely into his mouth. He is smart, charismatic and handsome, but to see him humiliated on the pitch would be an absolute pleasure. You make it sound as if I want to see him dead ::)
I guess you're joking about the 'tactics of the heart and not the head' part, because he sets his teams up like machines, like battering rams, and not as creative sides which get the emotions boiling (heart).
We agree about Chelsea :)
football!
Looking forward to Liverpool v R Madrid.
I am not a fan of Real Madrid. Hope Liverpool win. But...if it was Liverpool v Everton, I'd have to go Everton every time. My two favourite clubs (in England) are Everton and Newcastle. I used to support Scarborough, but they no longer exist. :'(
Favourite Scottish team is Milngavie Wanderers. ???
Favourite German team is Weder Bremen. ;D
Favourite Dutch team is Ajax. ;D
Favourite Italian side is Bari. :o
Favourite club manager is Arsen Wenger. :)
Favourite contemporary composer is Rautavaara... :-\
Well, that was fun, wasn't it?
Yeah, both games pretty much over by the half. Bayern must be happy
4-0 Liverpool v Real Madrid. Didn't expect that.
2-2 Juventus v Chelsea. Kind of expected that.
7-1 Bayern v Sporting. WTF? :o
Next, Man United...
I hope all the English teams make it through (okay only 2 to go). Looking ahead to an all-English semi-final, that would really make Platini and Blatter happy. lol!
Manure just got owned 4-1 at Prawn Trafford. The empty seats by 90th minute is freaking priceless. ;D
The last time Benitez opened his mouth and tried mind games against the master, Pool nosedived. You'd think he'd learn. But NO.
I am laughing at him now and the following comment from ESPN is apt:
"Liverpool meanwhile, were almost entirely nullified. It's no secret that if Gerrard and Torres are kept quiet, they have very little goalthreat from elsewhere, and tonight, for the most part, they were as quiet as a mute mouse sucking on an everlasting gobstopper in a monastery."
Well chaps, Man Utd gave a fine display against the Arse-nil ;D yesterday mixing brawn with flair and booking their rightful place in Rome. I bet a repeat of last year's final against the Chavs
----------------
Now playing: Bruckner, Anton - III: Scherzo (Con Moto-Moderato) & Trio (http://www.foxytunes.com/artist/bruckner%2c+anton/track/iii%3a+scherzo+(con+moto-moderato)+%26+trio)
via FoxyTunes (http://www.foxytunes.com/signatunes/)
Have just returned from the pub where I watched Chelsea v Barcelona as I don't have Sky Sports at home. As a (very) long term Chelsea supporter this was a predictably disastrous evening. Mobile phone contact with my daughter, watching the match in Leiden, made it more bearable. Certainly it was not as bad as John Terry's penalty miss in the Champions League final last year. Hohum ::)
Haha, more pretend death threats from Chelsea fans. Given how easy people are to locate when they post these online, it's a shame that they never seem to be prosecuted. Idle threats, certainly, but they deserve their day being ruined yet further for being so immature :P
As a totally unbiased Man Utd supporter >:D I'm glad we get to play against the Barca with 3 of the their 4 defenders out of the final, but.... Chelsea, I feel your pain :'(
----------------
Now playing: Brahms, Johannes - 1. Un Poco Sostenuto - Allegro (http://www.foxytunes.com/artist/brahms%2c+johannes/track/1.+un+poco+sostenuto+-+allegro)
via FoxyTunes (http://www.foxytunes.com/signatunes/)
The thing to watch today is the relegation battles!
I am hoping for Middlesborough to win and both Newcastle and Hull to lose. It would be nice to see a team thinking it is too good to go down (Magpie was never too good this year at any point) to get relegated. (I was hoping that would be Tottenham at the beginning of the year!)
Good to see "Massive Club" Newcastle go down.
Nice to see 2 of the promoted side stay up.
Quote from: springrite on May 24, 2009, 09:50:43 AM
Good to see "Massive Club" Newcastle go down.
Nice to see 2 of the promoted side stay up.
Yes I agree. And I know that you'll all be supporting my team Chelsea in the FA Cup Final ;D
I would start a Cricket thread....but no one would join in :( :(
Quote from: Dundonnell on May 26, 2009, 03:54:17 PM
I would start a Cricket thread....but no one would join in :( :(
Some will IF it is about the insect. In fact, I will offer receipes. ;D
Quote from: springrite on May 26, 2009, 07:56:17 PM
Some will IF it is about the insect. In fact, I will offer receipes. ;D
hehe ;D
The final day of the EPL has to be the most inconsequential in recent memory as ALL teams with something to play for lost.
Now, to the Champions League Final.
What about rugby?
Quote from: Mn Dave on May 27, 2009, 11:09:37 AM
What about rugby?
If we are going that route, gotta go with Aussie Rules!
(BTW, Vanessa is a huge All Black supporter, having lived in New Zealand and watched many of their matches, usually standing in a small stool made by the man of the house in her host family to compensate for her lack of height.)
Quote from: springrite on May 27, 2009, 11:12:35 AM
If we are going that route, gotta go with Aussie Rules!
(http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/8600/lens27272721234898364au.jpg)
Is it just me, or did this thread just get slightly gayer? :P $:)
AC/DC for attitude adjustment, Lethe.
You people have no taste ;D
What could go better with classical music than the stately pace of a game of cricket with all its measured complexities :)
Quote from: Dundonnell on May 27, 2009, 04:55:17 PM
What could go better with classical music than the stately pace of a game of cricket with all its measured complexities :)
(http://www.independent.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00152/sumo-getty_152562t.jpg)
:) :) :)
Quote from: vandermolen on May 30, 2009, 12:03:30 PM
:) :) :)
Got a little scare fairly early, didn't you? ;D
Congrats!
Quote from: springrite on May 30, 2009, 04:40:02 PM
Got a little scare fairly early, didn't you? ;D
Congrats!
Yes it did! I missed the Everton goal as I was just making myself a cup of tea before settling down to watch the match on TV.
Thank you :)
Anyone into gaelic football?
First day of the EPL, last year's best teams behind the Top Four were the most awful. Everton got creamed by the Gunners and Villa was inept against Latics -- both at home. Chelsea got lucky, but you get lucky more often when you are good, which Drogba surely is.
Nice to have football back. Kimi seems to like it.
Wow, uh, not much discussion happening over here, huh? :-X
Quote from: Elnimio on January 10, 2011, 09:14:23 AM
Wow, uh, not much discussion happening over here, huh? :-X
I assume that all the talk in Atlanta is about the Falcons.
I couldn't care less about american football, but thanks for assuming!
but yeah, that's what everyone's talking about :D
Quote from: Elnimio on January 10, 2011, 09:35:46 AM
I couldn't care less about american football, but thanks for assuming!
but yeah, that's what everyone's talking about :D
Living in Atlanta, you must feel a little left out. For better or worse, soccer in the U.S. is an after-thought.
The beginning of yet another great escape by Wigan? Now above the relegation zone by goal differences and only a point behind the two teams above but with one less game played. Anthony must be happy!
Very happy tonight Paul!
QPR & Reading look doomed. We play QPR next Sunday live on TV in a real crunch game. Win that and it's Steve McQueen on a bike time.
Our win today drew Sunderland into the mire, and I will be praying the Liverpool "Red Sox" beat Aston Villa and keep them under us.
The escape is on again.....playing some good football, albeit we pinched the win today from a Norwich side who set up shop for a draw.
Just looking at Wigan's run-in - 3 wins from those last 8 matches, do we think? (Plus the small distraction of an FA Cup final appearance.) That should do the job. And if they could survive by beating the Villans and send them down on the last day, supporters of all other Midlands clubs would be dancing with delight as well!
DF
I'm sure you're all celebrating (with me) Chelsea's FA Cup victory over Manchester United today. 8)
I'm still celebrating Finland's tie with Spain ;D
Quote from: vandermolen on April 01, 2013, 12:20:26 PM
I'm sure you're all celebrating (with me) Chelsea's FA Cup victory over Manchester United today. 8)
Perhaps not quite celebrating, but it's always good to see Moan Utd getting beaten, nevertheless. Well done Chelsea. Also making me laugh a lot over the past couple of days has been learning of Neil Warnock's nickname - Colin - and more important its derivation - "Neil Warnock" is an anagram of "Colin W*****".
DF
Quote from: North Star on April 01, 2013, 12:21:24 PM
I'm still celebrating Finland's tie with Spain ;D
I am still hoping that one day Scotland will win a game of football.
My team is Inverness Caledonian Thistle. In England, I like both Leeds and Everton. In Germany, Schalke. In Italy, Roma. In Finland,
Mixu Paatelainen and Finland in general, beause Paatelainen did a fantastic job both playing and managing in Scottish football in the not too distant past. There's not a Scot who would have a bad word against him. ;D
EDIT: We love Mixu Paatelainen here, but I bet his controversial predecessor in the Finland Managers job, Stuart Baxter, a Scot, is not quite held in the same regard over there!
Quote from: AnthonyAthletic on March 30, 2013, 10:20:13 AM
Very happy tonight Paul!
QPR & Reading look doomed. We play QPR next Sunday live on TV in a real crunch game. Win that and it's Steve McQueen on a bike time.
Our win today drew Sunderland into the mire, and I will be praying the Liverpool "Red Sox" beat Aston Villa and keep them under us.
The escape is on again.....playing some good football, albeit we pinched the win today from a Norwich side who set up shop for a draw.
Wigan will not go down, and as you saw, my Reds beat a game Villa to ease your passage...Now it would be nice if we could actually defend against the odd goal here and there. Ah, well...
I do think QPR, Villa and Norwich will take the parachute, though... ;D
It would have been criminal to lose to QPR when you are one man up for an hour. But at the death, what a free kick by the little guy! But it wouldn't have been had Taarabt not turn and duck!
The problem with QPR is that they hired so many hired guns at lofty salaries, all of whom have it in their contract an escape clause had the team gone down or a clause to have the same EPL salary if they go down. They have no incentive to really fight to keep the team up. They did play hard today, but it is really only a hand full of games that they did.
What is the point of being a member of that wall if you are going to get out of the way of the ball???
Mortified. :-[ >:( ???
How do Liverpool play/pass that badly and still entertain any hope of Europe next year? Beats me...
The Hammers' Collins had Suarez in his pocket all afternoon, and might well be worth buying to replace Skyrtel or Agger, come to think of it. 0:)
Liverpool are like the Pakistan cricket team (who I also support). You never know which team will turn up on the day. Sure, we were a far more talented side yesterday, but why can't we then just drill inferior teams and move up the league? We seem to only play to our best capabilities against teams that are genuinely skillful, which is ridiculous.
Woe.
BVB Netradio comment at 3:2 last minute goal of Champions League match BVB - Malaga CF
This is why we love soccer.
http://www.youtube.com/v/LJSEJE_yzoA
In the 90s, I experienced something similar, BVB vs. Nuremberg, long time it was 1:3, people already went home. 2:3 shortly before the end, 3:3 and 4:3 in the extra time.
Loves BVB. When they are in form and hussling, they look like a swarm of angry bees!
I still remember Rosicky in the BVB uniform！
Yes, that era also Jan Koller played here, we loved him.
I love Dortmund!
Only other fanclub in the world to sing 'You'll Never Walk Alone' ...weird, I know! ;D
Quote from: huntsman on April 10, 2013, 12:06:14 PM
I love Dortmund!
Only other fanclub in the world to sing 'You'll Never Walk Alone' ...weird, I know! ;D
Nah. You will hear them in Scotland, too. Was it Celtics? I forgot. There's another club in England as well, but in the lower divisions. I do remember both set of fans protesting the claim that it is Liverpool's song, or that it started in Liverpool. (Fact: They were both using the song ahead of Liverpool). But who cares? God Save the Queen is also the National Anthem of Luximburg. But so what. This world belongs to the big boys. Just ask Uncle Sam.
Dang - I had no idea!
Well, supporting Scottish football is best left to the Scots, so I'll stick to:
Barca
Dortmund
AC Milan
and of course my beloved - yet fairly insipid - Liverpool. 0:)
Millwall 0 Wigan Athletic 2
Wigan into the FA Cup Final for the first time! Well done to them also for beating the most horrible team in Britain (unless you know different...). Wonder if Tony was there.
DF
Quote from: MISHUGINA on October 24, 2007, 04:56:37 AM
Arse fan here, hehe! ;D
I'm a great fan of Arsenal, it's my favourite football team along with Inter and Bayern Munich; I'm very glad it won 3-1 against Norwich this afternoon. ;D
Arsenal fan here as well!
Also very happy for Wigan!
Liverpool picked up another point yesterday against a one-man side of Reading.
At least it seemed that way as the goalie pulled off every save in the book (including two that were only pencilled in!) to deny the Reds an emphatic victory.
Instead we were emphatically frustrated...
Quote from: huntsman on April 14, 2013, 03:06:59 AM
Liverpool picked up another point yesterday against a one-man side of Reading.
At least it seemed that way as the goalie pulled off every save in the book (including two that were only pencilled in!) to deny the Reds an emphatic victory.
Instead we were emphatically frustrated...
I remember when we (Arsenal) used to get it all the time from the lower tier teams when a backup keeper would suddenly become the greatest keeper in the world for 90+ minutes (and often never heard from again). Seems it's your turn now. Pool has really been playing well lately but the results are simply not there.
It hurts, man... :(
Anyhow, congrats to the Gunners and a relieved Arsene, eh? :)
Is Wigan really going to accomplish another great escape? What a great game. Imagine if they had won the last one which they almost did?
Well, when Arsenal plays Wigan, it is quite possible that Premiership safety for Wigan and UCL football (4th place) are both on the line! I certainly do not look forward to that, and I don't want Arsenal to accomplish Champions League status by dropping Wigan! Let's get that done before that!
Told you weeks ago that Wigan would not go down. Still holds true...We need Wigan in the Premier Div!
Big game at Anfield at lunchtime today!Even if we beat the Toffies, however, we will still trail them by 2 points and that's a little hard to chew. Suarez needs a kick up the %^#$ though - thanks to him chewing on a defender he won't get his teeth into Everton, which makes our task damned difficult!
That said, we did manage to put 6 past Newcastle without the little beaver's help...
Quote from: huntsman on May 04, 2013, 09:47:18 PM
That said, we did manage to put 6 past Newcastle without the little beaver's help...
Your avatar is very Beaverliciously Suarez...y.
When I was in the US I watched EPL football with a couple of friends -- one an Arsenal supporter like myself, and the other is a Liverpool man. But the last two times I went to the US, poor liverpool guy, Lawrence, no longer watches with us as he is suffering from altheimers. His daughter was the first to suspect something was wrong with dad and took him for a check. The problem she noticed then, ten years ago, was that dad no longer hates Everton.
(http://imageshack.us/a/img515/3923/lmaonw0.gif)
Quote from: springrite on May 05, 2013, 09:51:30 AM
When I was in the US I watched EPL football with a couple of friends -- one an Arsenal supporter like myself, and the other is a Liverpool man. But the last two times I went to the US, poor liverpool guy, Lawrence, no longer watches with us as he is suffering from altheimers. His daughter was the first to suspect something was wrong with dad and took him for a check. The problem she noticed then, ten years ago, was that dad no longer hates Everton.
A box of paracetamol is waiting at reception for a Mr A. Athletic....
Please pick up Sunday morning first thing... :laugh:
Yes, well done, Wigan. I was sure it would go the way of the form book, as FA Cup Finals nearly always do. Earlier rounds always produce their crop of upsets, finals almost never. Even Wimbledon v Liverpool in 1988 and Coventry v Tottenham the year before (supreme moment of my football supporting life, incidentally) don't come close, as both Wimbledon and Cov were comfortably upper mid-table at the time. Last upset in the final of similar magnitude, anyone?
DF
Sunderland v Leeds in '73?
Sunderland were in the second Div and were the first team from the lower divisions to win the cup in 40 years...
Well done Wigan, and congrats to Everton's new manager...(?)
I am so happy for Wigan!
BUT
I need my Gunners to win tonight though!
Even with relegation, winning the FA Cup more than made for it, I'd think!
Wigan need the win more than you do, mate - ;)
I'll be shouting for the Latics tonight and then again as they send Villa into the NPower Championships on the weekend...
Quote from: huntsman on May 11, 2013, 10:40:50 PM
Sunderland v Leeds in '73?
Sunderland were in the second Div and were the first team from the lower divisions to win the cup in 40 years...
Well done Wigan, and congrats to Everton's new manager...(?)
As a Leeds supporter I was gutted!
Quote from: huntsman on May 14, 2013, 01:40:30 AM
Wigan need the win more than you do, mate - ;)
That is true. I would love to see Villa go down instead of Wigan. But as much as I love Wigan, finished above Spurs and in UCL place is of far greater importance to me.
Poldoski just scored as I type! One Nil to the Arsenal!
Crying shame, but then no shame really...
Wigan were punching well above their weight for three seasons at least and can be damn proud of themselves.
Congrats to the Gunners, who were ably led by the enigma that is Arsene Wenger for yet another European place. Well done!
For the, well, like every year since 1995, Spurs failed in catching Arsenal. Not as painful as the toilet bowl game, nor as bad as last year when even falling behind Arsenal, they should have had the UCL spot except for the unlikely event of Chelsea under a caretaker actually won the darn thing.
Another year, another celebration at the expense of the pethetic spuds! Yes!
Borussia Dortmund desevers to be applauded for the pluck and the great playing expressed in the final match (as well as in the whole competition), but I'm really happy Bayern Munich has won the Champions League; what a wonderful result!
Quote from: Lisztianwagner on May 25, 2013, 12:53:02 PM
Borussia Dortmund desevers to be applauded for the pluck and the great playing expressed in the final match (as well as in thw hole competition), but I'm really happy Bayern Munich has won the Champions League; what a wonderful result!
Yes, a deserved win for Bayern München, considering the entire competition and their 2nd half tonight. I'm happy for Arjen Robben, who was born 10 kilometers from here, that he finally made his GFG (
Golden Finale Goal), after his misses in 2010 (Word Championship) and 2012 (Champion's League).
Bayern were the better team on the night and deserving winners.
Dortmund can be very proud of their entire campaign, particularly since they were considered rank outsiders from the beginning and touted to depart in the group stage.
Now if we can hold onto Lewandowski for next season, we build again.
The Girondins de Bordeaux, the club I have supported since I was a kid, has won the French FA Cup tonight (our first FA cup since 1987, our first trophy since our league title in 2009. A nice recovery from 4 years of frustrations and some poor management since that title, and a relegation position a year and a half ago when the new coach took over at the Mercato. He did a good recovery job on the "tight" budget we had with some good young'uns.
(http://medias.lequipe.fr/img-photo-jpg/bordeaux-a-remport-a-quatri-coupe-de-france-aux-d-ns-d-evian-tg/1500000000280775/211:158,1918:1018-665-0-70/c15b4.jpg)
7th in the league, Last 16 in Europa League (only losing 1-0/2-3 to Benfica who went on to the final), an FA cup win for an other European spot next season...
...and to top it all, the Under 19 also won their FA Cup-equivalent "Gambardella" earlier today in the opening event. We're only the 3rd team do the double in the French football history.... It was a good night. :laugh:
(http://medias.lequipe.fr/img-photo-jpg/bordeaux-a-remport-a-deuxi-coupe-gambardella-apr-celle-de-1976/1500000000280645/23:73,1688:912-665-0-70/f4f31.jpg)
Meanwhile, as battles rage in the Independent Scotland thread, :blank: the USA are in Scotland tonight in a soccer friendly. It's part of the USA's warmup for the World Cup Finals next year, and Scotland not having qualified for that event, are using it as part of their warmup for the 2016 Euro Championships.
It is halftime. The score is 0-0. Both sides seem to be well matched. The US have the German ace Klinsman as their Manager these days, and Scotland have pint sized but brilliant ex-Scotland player Gordon Strachan as their Manager. Both these guys last met playing football together in 1995 when Klinsman played for Tottenham in the English Premiership and Strachan played for Coventry in the same league. Coventry won 3-1 that day.
Not the most exciting match in the World, it is a friendly after all, but there's nothing between the two sides. Scotland may have had a wee bit more possession in the first half...
Quote from: Scots John on November 15, 2013, 12:04:39 PM
Meanwhile, as battles rage in the Independent Scotland thread, :blank: the USA are in Scotland tonight in a soccer friendly.
My nephew made the trip from Ohio to Scotland, just to see this match. Well, he is also enjoying the local brew 8)
Sarge
Quote from: Sergeant Rock on November 15, 2013, 12:07:02 PM
My nephew made the trip from Ohio to Scotland, just to see this match. Well, he is also enjoying the local brew 8)
Sarge
Great Sarge. I
sincerely hope he enjoys his visit.
Quote from: Scots John on November 15, 2013, 12:09:36 PM
Great Sarge. I sincerely hope he enjoys his visit.
He's enjoying it so far. He was in the Highlands yesterday, and posting great pics of the trip on Facebook. Just hope he doesn't run into hooligans ;)
Sarge
Ukraine 2 - France 0 in the 1st leg of the world cup play-offs...
maybe not a bad thing if we miss a world cup actually...that would teach them a lesson, to this arrogant lot... :blank: *sigh*
Quote from: Sergeant Rock on November 15, 2013, 12:17:06 PM
Just hope he doesn't run into hooligans ;)
Sarge
What a disappointing remark. >:(
The score ended 0-0, which was a fair result given the balance of play.
Quote from: Sergeant Rock on November 15, 2013, 12:17:06 PM
Just hope he doesn't run into hooligans ;)
Or become one. I hear recruitment season is in full swing.
Quote from: springrite on November 15, 2013, 02:33:01 PM
Or become one. I hear recruitment season is in full swing.
>:(
This is Scotland. It was a
friendly match in a family stadium.
Such remarks as this and Sarges remark are unacceptable. While other European countries and Easter European countries and Russia and some South American countries like football violence...
we in Scotland got our act together a
very long time ago with that sort of thing.
>:(
I wish we'd won now. :(
Quote from: Scots John on November 15, 2013, 02:42:10 PM
>:(
This is Scotland. It was a friendly match in a family stadium.
Such remarks as this and Sarges remark are unacceptable. While other European countries and Easter European countries and Russia and some South American countries like football violence...we in Scotland got our act together a very long time ago with that sort of thing.
>:(
I wish we'd won now. :(
You are absolutely right. In fact, I am amazed at how well that is done in England and Scotland (Milwall aside) , considering how things were, while the problem is getting worse in other parts of the world where it was not that bad years ago. It goes to show how admitting the problem and facing up to it is step one. Now we get the "no, we do not have a problem" attitude from some of the Eastern European countries. Look for problems over there to get worse before it gets better.
BTW, talk about civil, I am an Arsenal supporter and we play in a library.
Quote from: Scots John on November 15, 2013, 02:42:10 PM
>:(
This is Scotland. It was a friendly match in a family stadium.
Such remarks as this and Sarges remark are unacceptable. While other European countries and Easter European countries and Russia and some South American countries like football violence...we in Scotland got our act together a very long time ago with that sort of thing.
>:(
I wish we'd won now. :(
I was always under the impression that hooliganism was an English thing, never really flourishing in Scotland.
A couple of months ago, when Chelsea was playing Madrid Real (I think) here in Miami, I got two baseball style caps (I suppose one can't actually call them baseball caps if they are associated with soccer), one for Chelsea FC and one for Manchester United. I therefore qualify as a fan of those teams, although at the moment I couldn't tell you how they're doing....
It is a shame that Iceland did not make it for the first time in its history. I was looking forward to LEIFS at full blast instead of looking at all the checkered flags and shirts that makes me dizzy.
Quote from: Jeffrey Smith on November 15, 2013, 05:39:20 PM
I was always under the impression that hooliganism was an English thing, never really flourishing in Scotland.
A couple of months ago, when Chelsea was playing Madrid Real (I think) here in Miami, I got two baseball style caps (I suppose one can't actually call them baseball caps if they are associated with soccer), one for Chelsea FC and one for Manchester United. I therefore qualify as a fan of those teams, although at the moment I couldn't tell you how they're doing....
I remember back in the 70s and 80s that hooliganism was pretty much an equal opportunity evil in Britain. Scenes of Scottish fans demolishing the Wembley goal posts after the pitch invasion in the 70s spring to mind (that may have been just exuberance though!). A quick scan of youtube would suggest there's probably not much difference. Alcohol and football crowds were never a good combination, and throw in a handful of right wing or sectarian idiots and you had the proverbial powder keg.
I was too young to experience the worst - by the time I regularly attended matches in Manchester in the early 80s the clean-up was well underway, though I remember it was a painful exercise to meet up with a friend after a United vs Chelsea game as the away supporters were herded to and from the trains by dozens of police, and breaking ranks could get you in a lot of trouble.
Although I'm sure that a lot of football clubs and police spent a lot of time and effort on anti-hooligan measures, it has been argued that the demise of hooliganism had a lot to do with economics as it became more and more expensive, and more difficult, to get a ticket for a game. Whereas I used to turn up for a game at Old Traffic (or Maine Road) on a whim and queue to get in, I would have no chance of that today. And although I could afford to go to a game every week as a student back then, I don't suppose that is even remotely possible financially today.
No Wigan Athletic fans on this forum, are there? :) (Or "Wigan Town", as Alan Shearer referred to them on Match of the Day last night.)
Anthony Athletic is from that neck of the woods and might have something to report... And recover from.... 😁😁
Quote from: Papy Oli on February 20, 2018, 03:35:45 AM
Anthony Athletic is from that neck of the woods and might have something to report... And recover from.... 😁😁
Yes, I was hoping to inspire a contribution from him - perhaps a link to a YouTube video of himself singing the Will Grigg song...
Do you appreciate beach soccer?
https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/58705912
Sheriff Tiraspol produced one of the great Champions League shocks as the competition's least experienced club upstaged 13-time European champions Real Madrid at the Bernabeu.
Sebastien Thill snatched victory for the debutants with a stunning final-minute strike, sparking scenes of wild celebration from the Moldovan champions.
https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/59696612 (with video)
Frank Mill must feel like Marty McFly, the main character from Back to the Future. Regardless of what he's up to, he is continuously being dragged back to the mid-1980s. To one day in particular: 9 August 1986.
It was Mill's first game for Borussia Dortmund. Just before half-time, he was played clean through. One pass split the Bayern Munich defence and, after dribbling past the keeper, he found himself in front of an empty goal. What happened next is often described in Germany as the 'miss of the century'.
Mill waited too long. With an open net in front of him, he took an extra touch to steady himself, slightly to the side of the six-yard box, delaying what seemed like the inevitable. As the keeper came rushing back, sliding in to make a hopeless attempt to block, Mill suddenly ran out of rhythm and the ball held up in his feet. When he finally did shoot, he hit the post. The ball bounced back to a waiting Bayern defender.
Even 35 years on, whenever anybody in German football misses a good chance, it doesn't take long for commentators to bring this story up. Reporters will call him asking for an opinion. The very act of failing to score from an open goal is known as 'a Mill'.
Ah, but this miss is even worse (warning - very loud pounding music on soundtrack):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSY8hbmsNFM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSY8hbmsNFM)
Tomasson was practically on the goal-line, yet still managed to put the ball over the bar.
Quote from: DaveF on December 29, 2021, 09:16:54 AM
Ah, but this miss is even worse (warning - very loud pounding music on soundtrack):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSY8hbmsNFM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSY8hbmsNFM)
Tomasson was practically on the goal-line, yet still managed to put the ball over the bar.
This is a case where it is much harder (in fact, almost impossible) to miss than to score.
On the other hand, someone who probably wishes he could have missed is Lee Dixon:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpSo1aciPqU (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpSo1aciPqU)
I'm right in remembering that you're a Gooner, am I not, Springrite? I was at that match - lifelong Coventry fan - probably the only time we ever won at Highbury (a few months earlier, on the last day of the season, you'd thrashed us 6-1 and lifted the league title). Coincidentally, it was a match against Arsenal that first turned me into a Sky Blues fan - 1970, aged 10, at Highfield Road. Highfield Road, Highbury - 2 famous old grounds, now both housing developments :(
Quote from: DaveF on December 31, 2021, 08:58:01 AM
On the other hand, someone who probably wishes he could have missed is Lee Dixon:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpSo1aciPqU (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpSo1aciPqU)
I'm right in remembering that you're a Gooner, am I not, Springrite? I was at that match - lifelong Coventry fan - probably the only time we ever won at Highbury (a few months earlier, on the last day of the season, you'd thrashed us 6-1 and lifted the league title). Coincidentally, it was a match against Arsenal that first turned me into a Sky Blues fan - 1970, aged 10, at Highfield Road. Highfield Road, Highbury - 2 famous old grounds, now both housing developments :(
Yes, your memory is correct. I am a gooner. I do miss Coventry in the premiership! Wasn't Gordon Strahan at Coventry when I watched? Yes, I think so. What an honest hard-nosed old-school player he was!
From the Belgian championship about ten years ago ;D
Goal-bound effort stopped... by mud!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bqj0xO8Sk9s
https://www.youtube.com/v/Bqj0xO8Sk9s
Not a dry eye in the house! Top scorer for Ukraine the enigmatic Andriy Yarmolenko although a hero in his own country has not worked out for West Ham. Important game yesterday against Aston Villa, closely matched first half and then into the second period the football Gods took control! Our striker Antonio went down injured and on came Yarmolenko from the bench. The whole 60,000 crowd rose, including Villa fans applauded, not for the player but for his country. With the score still even a split second of sublime skill and Yarmolenko scored! A surreal moment with tens of thousands of lumps in throats and for poor old Andriy, it was too much.
Quote from: Irons on March 14, 2022, 02:04:55 AM
Not a dry eye in the house! Top scorer for Ukraine the enigmatic Andriy Yarmolenko although a hero in his own country has not worked out for West Ham. Important game yesterday against Aston Villa, closely matched first half and then into the second period the football Gods took control! Our striker Antonio went down injured and on came Yarmolenko from the bench. The whole 60,000 crowd rose, including Villa fans applauded, not for the player but for his country. With the score still even a split second of sublime skill and Yarmolenko scored! A surreal moment with tens of thousands of lumps in throats and for poor old Andriy, it was too much.
I saw that on the news this morning (CNN)---great story! Loved to hear about the support for him and his country. I also read that he had just come back from "compassionate leave" too. He apparently still has family in Ukraine. Must be unbelievably stressful for him.
PD
p.s. I immediately thought of you when I was watching the news. :)
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 14, 2022, 06:12:37 AM
I saw that on the news this morning (CNN)---great story! Loved to hear about the support for him and his country. I also read that he had just come back from "compassionate leave" too. He apparently still has family in Ukraine. Must be unbelievably stressful for him.
PD
p.s. I immediately thought of you when I was watching the news. :)
The Premier League is watched worldwide as you prove, PD. Every story like this helps the cause, hopefully. The West Ham goalkeeper Lukasz Fabianski is Polish and reportedly involved in facilitating some of Yarmolenko's family to leave Ukraine into Poland.
The Chelsea/Abromovich connection is sending unprecedented shock waves through English football.
Quote from: Irons on March 14, 2022, 02:04:55 AM
Not a dry eye in the house! Top scorer for Ukraine the enigmatic Andriy Yarmolenko although a hero in his own country has not worked out for West Ham. Important game yesterday against Aston Villa, closely matched first half and then into the second period the football Gods took control! Our striker Antonio went down injured and on came Yarmolenko from the bench. The whole 60,000 crowd rose, including Villa fans applauded, not for the player but for his country. With the score still even a split second of sublime skill and Yarmolenko scored! A surreal moment with tens of thousands of lumps in throats and for poor old Andriy, it was too much.
Yes, this was very moving.
Quote from: Irons on March 14, 2022, 02:04:55 AM
Not a dry eye in the house! Top scorer for Ukraine the enigmatic Andriy Yarmolenko although a hero in his own country has not worked out for West Ham. Important game yesterday against Aston Villa, closely matched first half and then into the second period the football Gods took control! Our striker Antonio went down injured and on came Yarmolenko from the bench. The whole 60,000 crowd rose, including Villa fans applauded, not for the player but for his country. With the score still even a split second of sublime skill and Yarmolenko scored! A surreal moment with tens of thousands of lumps in throats and for poor old Andriy, it was too much.
A touching story, thanks for sharing! :)
Quote from: vandermolen on March 14, 2022, 12:11:26 PM
Yes, this was very moving.
What is your view of the situation at Chelsea, Jeffrey?
Quote from: Irons on March 15, 2022, 12:32:29 AM
What is your view of the situation at Chelsea, Jeffrey?
It's a shambles Lol. Did you see the Panorama about Abramovich and corruption? I didn't but intend to do so on catch-up. As a Chelsea supporter it's all very dispiriting, but good for Tuchel for maintaining his integrity and holding the team together. It was shameful for a section of the Chelsea fans to chant Abramovich's name at a recent match.
Quote from: Irons on March 14, 2022, 09:12:03 AM
The Premier League is watched worldwide as you prove, PD. Every story like this helps the cause, hopefully. The West Ham goalkeeper Lukasz Fabianski is Polish and reportedly involved in facilitating some of Yarmolenko's family to leave Ukraine into Poland.
The Chelsea/Abromovich connection is sending unprecedented shock waves through English football.
Wonderful to hear about the help from the goalkeeper!
And, yes, I've read a bit about Abromovich wanting to sell the team and that he said that he would donate the proceeds to aid--less his net costs (which folks have been wondering what that all includes).
Quote from: vandermolen on March 15, 2022, 01:33:28 AM
It's a shambles Lol. Did you see the Panorama about Abramovich and corruption? I didn't but intend to do so on catch-up. As a Chelsea supporter it's all very dispiriting, but good for Tuchel for maintaining his integrity and holding the team together. It was shameful for a section of the Chelsea fans to chant Abramovich's name at a recent match.
They were chanting his name?! :(
PD
Quote from: vandermolen on March 15, 2022, 01:33:28 AM
It's a shambles Lol. Did you see the Panorama about Abramovich and corruption? I didn't but intend to do so on catch-up. As a Chelsea supporter it's all very dispiriting, but good for Tuchel for maintaining his integrity and holding the team together. It was shameful for a section of the Chelsea fans to chant Abramovich's name at a recent match.
I did watch the Panorama programme, Jeffrey. The corruption in Russia is off the scale and Abramovich was and is a main beneficiary. I had not realised he was the first foreign owner of an English football club. My view of him is conflicted because in all honesty I know if an owner of my club - the joint owners of West Ham built their fortune from the pornography industry so cannot claim the moral high ground - invested in my club anything approaching what Abramovich did in Chelsea I would be delighted and take little interest the source. Dirty money built something good and special. The Chelsea training ground at Cobham is ten minutes from where I live and it is beautifully equipped and landscaped. Abramovich built something that will serve the club for generations. The chanting thing although crass I sort of understand. A well known saying amongst football supporters " He may be a ---- hole but he is our ---- hole" but the enormity of the situation in Ukraine stifles the chants and I don't think they will persist. I agree with you concerning Tuchel, a likable chap, humble and charismatic. Chelsea need to hold on to him.
There was an argument raised by some Chelsea fans in the last few days that "if Abramovich has always been so bad news and dodgy, how in hell did the authorities/FA allow him to buy a Premier League club in the first place"? Which is a fair query to some extent, similar to how did we allow Russian oligarchs to have such power over London/UK government over the last few years.
Very nice story about Yarmolenko. The only Ukrainian currently playing in the French league (Danylo Ignatenko) signed for my club (Bordeaux) right at the end of the January window, with his family initially remaining in Ukraine. After the war kicked off, there were reports that our chairman (who salvaged the club from liquidation last summer) was pushing his contacts in Eastern Europe to bring the family back to Bordeaux asap. He managed to bring them to France during last week, just a couple of days before the player's birthday.
Quote from: Irons on March 15, 2022, 10:10:01 AM
I did watch the Panorama programme, Jeffrey. The corruption in Russia is off the scale and Abramovich was and is a main beneficiary. I had not realised he was the first foreign owner of an English football club. My view of him is conflicted because in all honesty I know if an owner of my club - the joint owners of West Ham built their fortune from the pornography industry so cannot claim the moral high ground - invested in my club anything approaching what Abramovich did in Chelsea I would be delighted and take little interest the source. Dirty money built something good and special. The Chelsea training ground at Cobham is ten minutes from where I live and it is beautifully equipped and landscaped. Abramovich built something that will serve the club for generations. The chanting thing although crass I sort of understand. A well known saying amongst football supporters " He may be a ---- hole but he is our ---- hole" but the enormity of the situation in Ukraine stifles the chants and I don't think they will persist. I agree with you concerning Tuchel, a likable chap, humble and charismatic. Chelsea need to hold on to him.
Oh yes, there's no doubt that without Abramovich the club would not have been nearly as successful as it has been in recent years.
Quote from: Papy Oli on March 15, 2022, 12:58:23 PM
There was an argument raised by some Chelsea fans in the last few days that "if Abramovich has always been so bad news and dodgy, how in hell did the authorities/FA allow him to buy a Premier League club in the first place"? Which is a fair query to some extent, similar to how did we allow Russian oligarchs to have such power over London/UK government over the last few years.
Very nice story about Yarmolenko. The only Ukrainian currently playing in the French league (Danylo Ignatenko) signed for my club (Bordeaux) right at the end of the January window, with his family initially remaining in Ukraine. After the war kicked off, there were reports that our chairman (who salvaged the club from liquidation last summer) was pushing his contacts in Eastern Europe to bring the family back to Bordeaux asap. He managed to bring them to France during last week, just a couple of days before the player's birthday.
At least there was not a precedent, Olivier. The same could not be said of the Saudis who mass executed 81 poor souls on Saturday and are the new owners of Newcastle United.
Leaving aside issues of fit and proper owners how can it be right on competition terms that a state owns a Premier League club. As the co-owner of West Ham, David Gold once said "I own 140 sex shops (Ann Summers), Sheikh Mansour (owner of Manchester City) owns 140 oil wells."
114 minutes on the clock.
I assume Irons/Lol is in the West Ham crowd right now going berserk, shirtless, after Yarmolenko's goal.
Give us a wave, Irons !! :laugh:
Forever blowiiiiing buuuubbles... :laugh:
*steady on, Lol !!*
Quote from: Papy Oli on March 17, 2022, 02:36:13 PM
Forever blowiiiiing buuuubbles... :laugh:
*steady on, Lol !!*
What a night! The tension and atmosphere could be cut with a knife. Arrived home 12.45 am exhausted, didn't sleep really and then watched a recording of the whole game, after which viewed the quarter/semi final draw live. Well Olivier, the next step on the cockney boys European tour is from your home country, Olmpique Lyonnais. I have my ticket already, home not away sadly. If by some freak of nature we get past Lyon, who is waiting in the wings?
Barcelona! Little old West Ham walking out at the Nou Camp. 8)
Quote from: Irons on March 20, 2022, 07:00:22 AM
What a night! The tension and atmosphere could be cut with a knife. Arrived home 12.45 am exhausted, didn't sleep really and then watched a recording of the whole game, after which viewed the quarter/semi final draw live. Well Olivier, the next step on the cockney boys European tour is from your home country, Olmpique Lyonnais. I have my ticket already, home not away sadly. If by some freak of nature we get past Lyon, who is waiting in the wings? Barcelona! Little old West Ham walking out at the Nou Camp. 8)
Sounds like you had quite the night Irons! ;D
PD
Quote from: Irons on March 20, 2022, 07:00:22 AM
What a night! The tension and atmosphere could be cut with a knife. Arrived home 12.45 am exhausted, didn't sleep really and then watched a recording of the whole game, after which viewed the quarter/semi final draw live. Well Olivier, the next step on the cockney boys European tour is from your home country, Olmpique Lyonnais. I have my ticket already, home not away sadly. If by some freak of nature we get past Lyon, who is waiting in the wings? Barcelona! Little old West Ham walking out at the Nou Camp. 8)
What a great draw for you guys. Please walk freely over Lyon, I won't mind, they are not in a great phase in the league at the moment. :laugh:
Quote from: Papy Oli on March 20, 2022, 11:23:25 AM
What a great draw for you guys. Please walk freely over Lyon, I won't mind, they are not in a great phase in the league at the moment. :laugh:
If it wasn't for a Frenchman we would be quite possibly out of the competition and not playing Lyon. With the score at 0 0 El Nasri, the Saville striker hit a shot from point blank range. How Areola saved it is beyond belief. A turning point deflating Saville and inspiring us. It has to be said, Alphonse Areola is one cool guy.
We watched the "Arsene Wenger - Invincible" documentary last night on AMZ prime (also available on DVD).
(https://www.arsenewengerfilm.com/resources/images/social-share.png)
Had high expectations of this one as a generally Arsenal supporting household, this turned out somewhat disappointing overall actually.
Stylishly done but too much of the documentary was spent on the already re-hashed "Invincibles" 2004 season while really brushing over too briefly on some lesser known parts of his life which would have been of greater interest: His formative years in Alsace, his spell in Monaco, his spell in Japan, how he revolutionised the approach to football, etc.
The players intervening were OK (Henry, Wrighty, Bergkamp, Dixon, Keown, Pires, Petit, etc..).
The major positive aspect for us was the valuable input they got from Alex Ferguson, making it very clear that beyond the rivalries and the tabloid headlines, there was (or at least is now) a massive respect between both those "dinosaurs of the games" as he calls it. His perspective was worthy of its time.
Wenger's own view on the latter "difficult" years was a good insight but it could also have been expanded on.
Sadly, it didn't make up for the eventual lingering feeling of seeing a 90-min motivational speech on the after-dinner speaking circuit...
Amazing fact with two weeks to go before the transfer window closes more spent in the Premier League then La Liga, Bundesliga and Serie A combined!
Club by club's spend -
Chelsea £175.89m
Spurs £126m
Arsenal £115.7m
West Ham £115.1m
Nottingham Forest £111m
Man City £107m
Liverpool £99.2m
Leeds £89.9m
Man Utd £69.6m
Wolves £69.5m
Newcastle £62m
Southampton £60m
Fulham £56.4m
Aston Villa £46m
Brentford £45.8m
Crystal Palace £32.8m
Brighton £32.1m
Everton £34m
Bournemouth £23.3m
Leicester No spend
Historically there is plenty of dealing in the last hours before the transfer window closes. I expect the above figures to rise appreciably.
FTR I'm not related to City #9. Haaland/Håland is a very common farm name in that area of Norway.
Steven Gerrard sacked, Lampard could be next. An odd truism that great players make poor managers and average at best players make outstanding managers, Mourinho and Wenger for example.
Quote from: Irons on October 22, 2022, 12:27:21 AM
Steven Gerrard sacked, Lampard could be next. An odd truism that great players make poor managers and average at best players make outstanding managers, Mourinho and Wenger for example.
I largely agree with this. I think that it can, in general terms, be applied to artists and composers in that the greatest ones are invariably not the greatest teachers, as they can suffocate the originality of their pupils. One of the greatest sculptors, the Romanian Brancusi, for example, refused to study under Rodin stating that 'acorns don't thrive under great oak trees.'
Arteta is doing just fine and long may it continue... :P >:D
Quote from: vandermolen on October 22, 2022, 01:06:16 AM
I largely agree with this. I think that it can, in general terms, be applied to artists and composers in that the greatest ones are invariably not the greatest teachers, as they can suffocate the originality of their pupils. One of the greatest sculptors, the Romanian Brancusi, for example, refused to study under Rodin stating that 'acorns don't thrive under great oak trees.'
Good point. In fact there is an example of that I posted today on the vinyl thread. I hope I'm not doing a disservice to Jiri Hlinka when I say he is not of the highest echelon of pianists but I believe his pupil Leif Ove Andes is.
Quote from: Papy Oli on October 22, 2022, 01:10:28 AM
Arteta is doing just fine and long may it continue... :P >:D
Fine cultured player but not I think in the Garrard/Lampard class.
Quote from: Irons on October 22, 2022, 02:58:41 AM
Fine cultured player but not I think in the Garrard/Lampard class.
Fair comment of course, but in the presence of a West Ham fan and a Chelsea fan, it was difficult not to be facetious ;)
Simeone maybe is one that has had a successful transition ? To what extent did
Zidane make it as well, I don't know, he would need to be seen again with a "lesser" team to judge (a bit like
Pep).
Laurent Blanc was successful for a short 5-6 years (Titles with Bordeaux then PSG) but it was well known and documented all the work was actually his assistant's (who, case in point helped Bordeaux and other clubs since on his own in some lean years - Blanc then disappeared for ten years or so until last month with joining Lyon).
Would
Deschamps count as a national manager ?
We'd have to ask Jeffrey about
Gullit, Vialli, etc...
It is indeed more often disappointment than not in most cases.
Quote from: Papy Oli on October 22, 2022, 03:25:06 AM
Fair comment of course, but in the presence of a West Ham fan and a Chelsea fan, it was difficult not to be facetious ;)
Simeone maybe is one that has had a successful transition ? To what extent did Zidane make it as well, I don't know, he would need to be seen again with a "lesser" team to judge (a bit like Pep). Laurent Blanc was successful for a short 5-6 years (Titles with Bordeaux then PSG) but it was well known and documented all the work was actually his assistant's (who, case in point helped Bordeaux and other clubs since on his own in some lean years - Blanc then disappeared for ten years or so until last month with joining Lyon).
Would Deschamps count as a national manager ?
We'd have to ask Jeffrey about Gullit, Vialli, etc...
It is indeed more often disappointment than not in most cases.
I don't know of Simeone's playing career but would love him at my club. The rest you mention, no thanks.
The one manager that is impressing me at the present time is Michael Beale. QPR top of the Championship! Impressive.
Quote from: Papy Oli on October 22, 2022, 03:25:06 AM
Fair comment of course, but in the presence of a West Ham fan and a Chelsea fan, it was difficult not to be facetious ;)
Simeone maybe is one that has had a successful transition ? To what extent did Zidane make it as well, I don't know, he would need to be seen again with a "lesser" team to judge (a bit like Pep). Laurent Blanc was successful for a short 5-6 years (Titles with Bordeaux then PSG) but it was well known and documented all the work was actually his assistant's (who, case in point helped Bordeaux and other clubs since on his own in some lean years - Blanc then disappeared for ten years or so until last month with joining Lyon).
Would Deschamps count as a national manager ?
We'd have to ask Jeffrey about Gullit, Vialli, etc...
It is indeed more often disappointment than not in most cases.
I think that Ruud Gullit is an exception (sort-of) to my rule as he was a successful player and manager. Nobody lasts long at Chelsea as they always get sacked. I think that it was a big mistake to get rid of Thomas Tuchel (Di Matteo is another example).
Quote from: Papy Oli on October 22, 2022, 01:10:28 AM
Arteta is doing just fine and long may it continue... :P >:D
Yeah!
Quote from: vandermolen on October 22, 2022, 03:02:49 PM
I think that Ruud Gullit is an exception (sort-of) to my rule as he was a successful player and manager. Nobody lasts long at Chelsea as they always get sacked. I think that it was a big mistake to get rid of Thomas Tuchel (Di Matteo is another example).
Gullit also got the tin-tac at Newcastle.
Quote from: Irons on October 23, 2022, 02:00:23 AM
Gullit also got the tin-tac at Newcastle.
Good point.
Going back to my artists/composers point, if you look at the great Impressionist painters, Monet, Renoir etc, none of their teachers (Gleyre etc) are now highly regarded artists although they were able to liberate their students' talents. I'd argue the same for Stanford and Vaughan Williams or Steinberg (whose music I do rate highly) and Shostakovich.
I realise that we are not supposed to discuss music here but that is not really the point of my argument about great teachers not necessarily being great artists and great artists not necessarily being great teachers (Jacques Louis David's only really successful pupil was Ingres who had a strong enough talent and personality to avoid being suffocated by J L David's suffocating presence).
So, how did Celeste's song "Stop the Flame" get used by FIFA? I fell in love with it a few years ago after reading and listening to a BBC article about musicians that you need to listen to and are on the rise.
PD
I think I'm correct thinking Florestan resides in Rumania. The mighty Hammers played there last night but more importantly it seems a very nice place to live. At no time our fans threatened, unlike Germany, and they had a great time. A grey dull East European country Rumania plainly is not.
https://youtu.be/WGaEXqWnlVI
Quote from: Irons on November 04, 2022, 07:20:55 AM
I think I'm correct thinking Florestan resides in Rumania. The mighty Hammers played there last night but more importantly it seems a very nice place to live. At no time our fans threatened, unlike Germany, and they had a great time. A grey dull East European country Rumania plainly is not.
https://youtu.be/WGaEXqWnlVI
I
thought that I had seen you there in the crowd, Lol! :)
And, yes, from what I watched of the video, looks like a lovely place to visit/live. And from what I saw of the hotel lobby, 45 quid gets you a very nice place to stay!
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 04, 2022, 09:29:15 AM
I thought that I had seen you there in the crowd, Lol! :)
And, yes, from what I watched of the video, looks like a lovely place to visit/live. And from what I saw of the hotel lobby, 45 quid gets you a very nice place to stay!
PD
Love to go on a claret and blue European tour, PD. The farthest I have got is Manchester and Blackburn unfortunately.
That hotel is amazing.
Quote from: Irons on November 05, 2022, 01:47:04 AM
Love to go on a claret and blue European tour, PD. The farthest I have got is Manchester and Blackburn unfortunately.
That hotel is amazing.
Hello,
I suspect that all of the world (minus me) are watching the World Cup? Looks like there were serious problems yesterday(?) with the ticketing app not working properly? Any idea how many people were shut out?
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 21, 2022, 07:44:15 AM
Hello,
I suspect that all of the world (minus me) are watching the World Cup? Looks like there were serious problems yesterday(?) with the ticketing app not working properly? Any idea how many people were shut out?
PD
Like a lot of Brits trying my best to ignore the World Cup due to the politics of FIFA/Qatar. Watched the England game though and I guess will watch a lot of other games through clenched teeth. Politics again, but this time for the good. The Iran team refused to sing their country's national anthem as a protest against Iran's rulers.
Quote from: Irons on November 21, 2022, 08:51:48 AM
Like a lot of Brits trying my best to ignore the World Cup due to the politics of FIFA/Qatar. Watched the England game though and I guess will watch a lot of other games through clenched teeth. Politics again, but this time for the good. The Iran team refused to sing their country's national anthem as a protest against Iran's rulers.
I enjoyed USA v Wales today. The Welsh team looked finished at half-time, but they made a great fight back in the second half and deserved their 1 - 1 draw. It was extraordinary and brave to see the Iranian team maintain a stony silence during the playing of their national anthem with the Iranian supporters jeering it, I've never seen anything like it before.
Quote from: vandermolen on November 21, 2022, 12:26:41 PM
I enjoyed USA v Wales today. The Welsh team looked finished at half-time, but they made a great fight back in the second half and deserved their 1 - 1 draw. It was extraordinary and brave to see the Iranian team maintain a stony silence during the playing of their national anthem with the Iranian supporters jeering it, I've never seen anything like it before.
Very brave of the Iran team to make that protest. It is reported there will be consequences when they get back home.
Oh my Lord! Minnows Saudi Arabia beat the favourites for the World Cup, Argentina! Betting has no interest for me but.... Listening to the game on "Talk Sport" while gardening, with Argentina 1-0 up at halftime they had a sponsor on from Betfair who was discussing odds such as how many goals would Messi score. As a throwaway line he mentioned for Saudi to actually win the game after being 1 down at HT Betfair were offering 80 to 1! This is for an outcome that only can go one of three ways!
Quote from: Irons on November 22, 2022, 07:19:30 AMOh my Lord! Minnows Saudi Arabia beat the favourites for the World Cup, Argentina! Betting has no interest for me but.... Listening to the game on "Talk Sport" while gardening, with Argentina 1-0 up at halftime they had a sponsor on from Betfair who was discussing odds such as how many goals would Messi score. As a throwaway line he mentioned for Saudi to actually win the game after being 1 down at HT Betfair were offering 80 to 1! This is for an outcome that only can go one of three ways!
That was a turn up for the books wasn't it...and we already have the goal of the tournament with their second goal too!!
France got a bit of a scare against the Aussies last night but eventually got going. Sadly, we have another defender added to our already long injury list (ACL). Difficult to know how we'll actually fare against stronger teams.
Australia were depressing, even when in front. A distinct lack of ambition.
Quote from: Irons on November 04, 2022, 07:20:55 AMI think I'm correct thinking Florestan resides in Rumania. The mighty Hammers played there last night but more importantly it seems a very nice place to live. At no time our fans threatened, unlike Germany, and they had a great time. A grey dull East European country Rumania plainly is not.
https://youtu.be/WGaEXqWnlVI
You should come visit us some day. And when you do that, let me know.
Romania is a beautiful country. Bucharest is - cfr. Budapest, or even Berlin, pockmarked by wars, fraud and deceit....During summer, the old city center (what is left of it...) changes at night into a frightening, loud, hellish disco, alas.
But I met Andréi (bonjour, cher Andreï), visited the (let's say "charmingly") delapidated villa of Enescu, listened to Enescu's massive 3rd symphony - live. I saw the Danube and pelicans, the Black sea ...and the crumbling remains of Constanta's superb Art Nouveau casino....
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constan%C8%9Ba_Casino
There, I dreamed of a better world near Ovid's statue, in front of the National History and Archaeology Museum ....
Quote from: pjme on November 23, 2022, 02:20:21 AMRomania is a beautiful country. Bucharest is - cfr. Budapest, or even Berlin, pockmarked by wars, fraud and deceit....During summer, the old city center (what is left of it...) changes at night into a frightening, loud, hellish disco, alas.
But I met Andréi (bonjour, cher Andreï), visited the (let's say "charmingly") delapidated villa of Enescu, listened to Enescu's massive 3rd symphony - live. I saw the Danube and pelicans, the Black sea ...and the crumbling remains of Constanta's superb Art Nouveau casino....
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constan%C8%9Ba_Casino
There, I dreamed of a better world near Ovid's statue, in front of the National History and Archaeology Museum ....
Bon jour, cher Pierre!Re: Enescu's villa in Bucharest, that was actually inherited by his aristocratic wife Maruca Cantacuzino. He didn't like it too much and actually lived in an annex building behind it. His real villa, built on his own design, is located in Sinaia, in the Carpathian Mountains. It's there where he spent a lot of time and composed a lot of his music.
(http://ziardebusteni.ro/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/vila-luminis.jpg)
One thing that I was curious about was wondering how many of the Saudi Arabia's team are actually from Saudi Arabia? From what I understand, good football players are often courted by other teams to come and play for them. I believe that they can be "traded" during a certain window of time (like Dec/Jan)? How all does this work?
In any event, good on them for winning!
PD
Another surprise: Japan beats Germany 2-1 (0-1 half time).
Quote from: Florestan on November 23, 2022, 06:14:57 AMAnother surprise: Japan beats Germany 2-1 (0-1 half time).
I caught the highlights of that this morning. Impressive job by Japan!
PD
Quote from: Florestan on November 23, 2022, 06:14:57 AMAnother surprise: Japan beats Germany 2-1 (0-1 half time).
Incredible, how disappointing! I support Germany in this World Cup, I hope this was just a false step....
Quote from: Florestan on November 23, 2022, 01:54:16 AMYou should come visit us some day. And when you do that, let me know.
Love to.
Quote from: Florestan on November 23, 2022, 06:14:57 AMAnother surprise: Japan beats Germany 2-1 (0-1 half time).
Blimey! Did not see that coming. Watched the first half with Germany leading. Such a boring game I gave up on it. What a mistake!
Quote from: Irons on November 23, 2022, 07:48:19 AMBlimey! Did not see that coming. Watched the first half with Germany leading. Such a boring game I gave up on it. What a mistake!
The second half was much more animated. It's not very often one sees Neuer in the opposing team's goalkeeper square trying to hit the ball with his head. :)
Quote from: Irons on November 22, 2022, 07:19:30 AMVery brave of the Iran team to make that protest. It is reported there will be consequences when they get back home.
Oh my Lord! Minnows Saudi Arabia beat the favourites for the World Cup, Argentina! Betting has no interest for me but.... Listening to the game on "Talk Sport" while gardening, with Argentina 1-0 up at halftime they had a sponsor on from Betfair who was discussing odds such as how many goals would Messi score. As a throwaway line he mentioned for Saudi to actually win the game after being 1 down at HT Betfair were offering 80 to 1! This is for an outcome that only can go one of three ways!
I am worried about the Iranian players too. Iranian people are nice, intelligent people with high moral imprisoned in the vicious system.
Quote from: Lisztianwagner on November 23, 2022, 07:18:28 AMIncredible, how disappointing! I support Germany in this World Cup, I hope this was just a false step....
My sympathies to you LW. Sadly, one team has to lose (or tie? I don't know exactly how this works in terms of proceeding/winning--I hate to say :-[ ). I
do know that Germany has an excellent reputation in terms of football and *Fifa Cup wins though....*four times I believe?
Best,
PD
Before play, I thought that Group F (Belgium, Canada, Morocco and Croatia) was going to be the toughest of the groups. I've seen nothing to alter that opinion.
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 23, 2022, 04:12:04 AMOne thing that I was curious about was wondering how many of the Saudi Arabia's team are actually from Saudi Arabia? From what I understand, good football players are often courted by other teams to come and play for them. I believe that they can be "traded" during a certain window of time (like Dec/Jan)? How all does this work?
In any event, good on them for winning!
PD
You're confusing club trading with shifting countries. One occurs at certain times of year. The other is a question of naturalising and obtaining citizenship.
While some countries have recruited players born elsewhere, I'm not aware of Saudi Arabia taking that route.
Quote from: Madiel on November 23, 2022, 07:32:24 PMBefore play, I thought that Group F (Belgium, Canada, Morocco and Croatia) was going to be the toughest of the groups. I've seen nothing to alter that opinion.
Canada let Belgium get away with one there. I'm supporting Morocco because Nayef Aguerd plays for them.
Germany have their work cut out after the shock of losing to Japan, up next Spain!
Talking of Japan, their supporters cleared up discarded rubbish in the stadium when the game ended.
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 23, 2022, 02:12:49 PMMy sympathies to you LW. Sadly, one team has to lose (or tie? I don't know exactly how this works in terms of proceeding/winning--I hate to say :-[ ). I do know that Germany has an excellent reputation in terms of football and *Fifa Cup wins though....*four times I believe?
Best,
PD
Thank you, PD, it's ok anyway.:) Results like that at least make football unpredictable and full of surprise, so worth watching!
Yes, Germany has won four World Cups.
Quote from: Irons on November 24, 2022, 12:01:36 AMCanada let Belgium get away with one there. I'm supporting Morocco because Nayef Aguerd plays for them.
Germany have their work cut out after the shock of losing to Japan, up next Spain!
Talking of Japan, their supporters cleared up discarded rubbish in the stadium when the game ended.
Yeah, Japanese fans did that last World Cup. Welcome to World cultural differences.
I'm rooting for Spain or England. Gods of football, no more Germany or Brazil, please! ;D
Quote from: Florestan on November 24, 2022, 01:19:43 AMI'm rooting for Spain or England. Gods of football, no more Germany or Brazil, please! ;D
No way,
Deutschland über alles! ;D But as a matter of fact, it wouldn't be bad if Spain or England won, Spain has an amazing playing and it would be time for England to win something with the national team.
Quote from: Lisztianwagner on November 24, 2022, 01:29:20 AMNo way, Deutschland über alles! ;D
Obviously not
über Japan... ;D
If Spain beats them --- which in all probability they will --- Deutschland is in big trouble.
Quote from: Madiel on November 23, 2022, 07:33:48 PMYou're confusing club trading with shifting countries. One occurs at certain times of year. The other is a question of naturalising and obtaining citizenship.
While some countries have recruited players born elsewhere, I'm not aware of Saudi Arabia taking that route.
Thanks!
Quote from: Madiel on November 24, 2022, 01:04:23 AMYeah, Japanese fans did that last World Cup. Welcome to World cultural differences.
Wow! Way to go Japanese fans! ❤️
PD
I think the German team that destroyed Brazil and won the WC 8 years ago was already a bit past their best (they had been a bit unlucky in 2010, but played in some ways better in that tournament than in 2014).
Then they failed to replace the coach (or what the Brits call "manager" I think) in time for getting properly reorganized and even after the disaster 2018 (failed the group phase, something that had never happened before, and it was a weaker group than now) they stuck with Löw. I fear the current one (Flick) is also mediocre but they didn't play that bad. They were complacent after the goal, missed lots of good chances and Japan bounced back. (FWIW both japanese scorers and several more of their team play in the Bundesliga ;D)
After watching 0-0 draw between Uruguay and South Korea, which I enjoyed, an interesting statistic emerged. In the whole of the previous World Cup only one 0-0 draw in the whole competition. So far and we have only just started, there has been four! I think that tells us although Brazil may be the fly in the ointment as they haven't played yet, all nations have evened out and anyone can win it.
That Uruguay-South Korea game was very entertaining indeed, Lol.
As for the Korean striker that missed that sitter in front of the goal (Hwang Ui-Jo), he used to play for Bordeaux and that brought me flashbacks :laugh: He either scored worldies for us or missed sitters... That said, he was always running all over the pitch and giving 200% at every game. We could have done with another 10 of him in the team on that basis alone in the last two years.
Portugal beats Ghana 3-2, best match so far. Ghana could have made it to a draw in the very last minute of extra time. I would have loved it.
Ghana's opportunity at the very end was so surprising! Almost stole the ball from the keeper. If he hadn't fallen down...
Quote from: Brian on November 24, 2022, 09:08:54 AMGhana's opportunity at the very end was so surprising! Almost stole the ball from the keeper. If he hadn't fallen down...
Why almost? He did steal it alright. ;)
Quote from: Irons on November 24, 2022, 07:32:42 AMAfter watching 0-0 draw between Uruguay and South Korea, which I enjoyed, an interesting statistic emerged. In the whole of the previous World Cup only one 0-0 draw in the whole competition. So far and we have only just started, there has been four! I think that tells us although Brazil may be the fly in the ointment as they haven't played yet, all nations have evened out and anyone can win it.
Several of the 0-0 draws have been highly entertaining. Defence has been on top, but not for want of trying.
There have really only been a few teams that were disappointing and uncompetitive in the first matches. Unfortunately, Australia was one of them. Too passive. The same for Qatar and Iran. Costa Rica was just overrun.
Pretty much everyone else made a decent fist of it. As well as the upsets, there were several draws where a more fancied team was held, and several more where the favourite was seriously pushed.
Only another 48 matches to go...
A jaw-dropping second goal by Richarlison but although Serbia were good I wasn't blown away by Brazil.
That 6'8" Serbian goalkeeper! I would not like to be the one who knocks his beer over in a bar. :o
Quote from: Madiel on November 24, 2022, 08:06:21 PMOnly another 48 matches to go...
I missed only the matches on Sunday and Monday (wasn't aware the WC had started already). Their timing is very convenient for me, Romanian time 12:00, 15:00, 18:00 and 21:00. I guess in Australia it's not that convenient.
Iran beats Wales 2-0, a deserved victory albeit in the very last two extra minutes.
The Welsh goalkeeper should have seen the red card directly, his action (although justified by the imminent danger) was reckless and could have resulted in very serious injuries both to the Iranian player and to himself. Hat tip to the VAR referees for making the principal rectify his error (yellow card only).
Quote from: Florestan on November 25, 2022, 02:21:10 AMI missed only the matches on Sunday and Monday (wasn't aware the WC had started already). Their timing is very convenient for me, Romanian time 12:00, 15:00, 18:00 and 21:00. I guess in Australia it's not that convenient.
9pm, midnight, 3am and 6am.
I'm used to it... and take time off work when there's 4 matches a day. ;D
Quote from: Florestan on November 25, 2022, 03:07:42 AMIran beats Wales 2-0, a deserved victory albeit in the very last two extra minutes.
The Welsh goalkeeper should have seen the red card directly, his action (although justified by the imminent danger) was reckless and could have resulted in very serious injuries both to the Iranian player and to himself. Hat tip to the VAR referees for making the principal rectify his error (yellow card only).
Iran utterly redeemed themselves after playing pretty poorly for much of their first match.
I have to admit I didn't initially see the red card, because in terms of denying a goal it was only a yellow (because there was a covering defender). But yes, the KIND of contact he made was dangerous and worthy of red.
But I have to wonder what Hennessy was thinking, given that there was a covering defender it wasn't necessary to come out like that. A moment of irrational panic.
Iran was arguably on top anyway. The bit where they hit both posts in about 10 seconds was pretty amazing.
Quote from: Irons on November 24, 2022, 11:43:25 PMA jaw-dropping second goal by Richarlison but although Serbia were good I wasn't blown away by Brazil.
That 6'8" Serbian goalkeeper! I would not like to be the one who knocks his beer over in a bar. :o
:laugh:
No footie for me lately; yard work calls! ::)
At least it's not terribly cold outside...actually colder
inside.Enjoy!
PD
Senegal-Qatar 2-1, not a bad match. As a general rule so far, second halves are more interesting than first ones.
I just found out that England is playing the USA today. :) Hope that I can catch a little bit of it. Heard the announcer say that apparently America has a really young team?
PD
Yet another surprise, The Netherlands-Ecuador 1-1. The Dutch should actually be happy with this draw, the match could have ended disastruously for them.
Decidedly, this WC is full of surprises --- and all the better for it. 8)
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 25, 2022, 09:12:15 AMI just found out that England is playing the USA today. :) Hope that I can catch a little bit of it. Heard the announcer say that apparently America has a really young team?
PD
The youngest in the tournament, I think, or maybe tied with another country. The Americans are young and promising but there is some question as to whether the coaching is getting them mature enough to win. We'll see - so far the game has been fun!
Ecuador looked really good. Enjoyed watching them and hope the striker is able to return from that injury.
England-USA 0-0. It gets beter and better by the match. 8)
I am well aware that one of the big names will win this WC, but it's good and refreshing to see outsiders doing their best in opposing them --- and succeeding. I am particularly fond of Iran's victory today --- that unfortunate nation deserves better than being enslaved by the fanatically criminal and criminally fanatic regime of the Ayatollahs, and it really made my day seeing Iranian players and supporters alike showing their contempt for, and protest against, their leaders. I say, forget Iran, make Persia great again!
Quote from: Brian on November 25, 2022, 10:29:11 AMI just found out that England is playing the USA today. :) Hope that I can catch a little bit of it. Heard the announcer say that apparently America has a really young team?
The live banner at the
WaPo says it was a draw, which sounds like success for the US team
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on November 25, 2022, 12:07:47 PMThe live banner at the WaPo says it was a draw, which sounds like success for the US team
Yep. See my post above.
Well, I managed to catch some of the first half and then had to go back to other business. Alas, I checked back later and was just in time to seeing the men shaking the other team's hands. :( So it goes! At least I was able to catch the post-game commentary and the highlights. Died when I saw the bounce off of the crossbar.
One last chance to advance on Tuesday. Come on guys, you can do it! :)
And well done to England to be at the top of Group B!
PD
Of all my favorites, only Spain lived up to expectations.
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on November 25, 2022, 12:07:47 PMThe live banner at the WaPo says it was a draw, which sounds like success for the US team
I don't know about that, if anything they could have won and might be a bit disappointed that they didn't. They really put England under a lot of pressure for periods of the match.
USA v Iran could be an absolute doozie.
Quote from: Florestan on November 25, 2022, 09:55:01 AMYet another surprise, The Netherlands-Ecuador 1-1. The Dutch should actually be happy with this draw, the match could have ended disastruously for them.
I definitely felt that Ecuador were on top, they were most impressive.
Netherlands aren't going to have any trouble making the next round against Qatar. But Ecuador v Senegal... all sorts of variables there. If Ecuador's captain is injured that will be a big blow to them.
I like the logos of Wales, England, Tunisia and Morocco!
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/d/dc/Wales_national_football_team_logo.svg/350px-Wales_national_football_team_logo.svg.png)
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/8/8b/England_national_football_team_crest.svg/340px-England_national_football_team_crest.svg.png)
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/5/5d/Logo_federation_tunisienne_de_football-copy.svg/360px-Logo_federation_tunisienne_de_football-copy.svg.png)
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/2a/FRFM.svg/500px-FRFM.svg.png)
There are entire websites devoted to rating the team jerseys (which regularly change in their details, pretty much every year, as a way of making money).
Quote from: Dry Brett Kavanaugh on November 25, 2022, 07:15:19 PMI like the logos of Wales, England, Tunisia and Morocco!
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/d/dc/Wales_national_football_team_logo.svg/350px-Wales_national_football_team_logo.svg.png)
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/8/8b/England_national_football_team_crest.svg/340px-England_national_football_team_crest.svg.png)
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/5/5d/Logo_federation_tunisienne_de_football-copy.svg/360px-Logo_federation_tunisienne_de_football-copy.svg.png)
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/2a/FRFM.svg/500px-FRFM.svg.png)
I agree Manabu (I like the Welsh Red Dragon especially).
England were very disappointing in the match against the USA, who were the better team. We are following the usual pattern here of huge unrealistic expectations followed by massive let-down.
England lost 0-0.
USA were fitter, more committed and tactically aware. They lack a cutting edge, a striker, as only scoring a single goal in two games proves, but impressive just the same. The USA v Iran game has become highly significant.
Australia won a rather dull match.
Quote from: Florestan on November 26, 2022, 03:00:03 AMAustralia won a rather dull match.
Well...
It wasn't the greatest match, and you can tell which Australian commentators can't resist going overboard.
But we did play pretty well in the first half with a lot of good midfield control. Things got a bit scrappy later, but Tunisia never really made much of their chances. They kept shooting straight at our goalkeeper.
I also have a much greater appreciation of our defender Harry Souttar. He's nearly 2 metres tall, and it turns out those super long legs are INCREDIBLY useful when it comes to a scrambling block.
Quote from: Madiel on November 26, 2022, 03:28:17 AMwe did play pretty well in the first half with a lot of good midfield control.
I missed the first half. Imo the second one was not as interesting as other second halves so far.
The Saudis did not played badly (they had more shots on goal than the Poles) but missing a penalty and a colossal gaffe did them in.
And Lewandowski is Lewandowski.
France-Denmark 2-0, one of the best matches so far.
And Mbappe is Mbappe.
It took me longer than usual today to get through all the games and be safe looking at this thread.
I think Poland can count themselves pretty fortunate. Somehow they're on top of their group. Against that... Argentina will be determined. Which also gives Mexico a chance.
Quote from: Florestan on November 26, 2022, 08:59:47 AMFrance-Denmark 2-0, one of the best matches so far.
And Mbappe is Mbappe.
Currently best player in the world. I think it most unfair* for France to win two World Cups in a row but beginning to think they will.
*We are still rattling on about 1966!
Quote from: Irons on November 27, 2022, 01:50:00 AMCurrently best player in the world. I think it most unfair* for France to win two World Cups in a row but beginning to think they will.
*We are still rattling on about 1966!
Not in a row, though: the current WC holder is Argentina. ;)
Quote from: Madiel on November 26, 2022, 10:54:50 PMArgentina will be determined. Which also gives Mexico a chance.
It was a good match. And Messi is Messi. :)
Quote from: Florestan on November 27, 2022, 01:55:29 AMIt was a good match. And Messi is Messi. :)
And raspberries are raspberries. And chairs are chairs. And dachshunds are dachshunds. And Courtois is Courtois. And...
Gin is how I'm going to get through at least part of Japan v Costa Rica. And my bed is my bed, and I need it.
Quote from: Madiel on November 27, 2022, 02:02:01 AMAnd raspberries are raspberries. And chairs are chairs. And dachshunds are dachshunds. And Courtois is Courtois. And...
Gin is how I'm going to get through at least part of Japan v Costa Rica. And my bed is my bed, and I need it.
:)
Quote from: Florestan on November 26, 2022, 08:59:47 AMFrance-Denmark 2-0, one of the best matches so far.
And Mbappe is Mbappe.
Missed France yesterday, Christmas shopping got in the way! 0:)
I'll have to watch it on catch up.
Going along nicely though, in Deschamps we trust 8)
Just so you're aware, Australia is only my 2nd or 3rd team. I'm a Belgium supporter.
For Australia-Denmark I will be uncertain who I want to win. Australia-Belgium has thankfully never come up.
Quote from: Madiel on November 27, 2022, 02:40:00 AMJust so you're aware, Australia is only my 2nd or 3rd team. I'm a Belgium supporter.
For Australia-Denmark I will be uncertain who I want to win. Australia-Belgium has thankfully never come up.
Now, where is that dislike button again... :P
Quote from: Florestan on November 26, 2022, 08:59:47 AMFrance-Denmark 2-0, one of the best matches so far.
And Mbappe is Mbappe.
No, 2 - 1.
Quote from: Papy Oli on November 27, 2022, 02:43:16 AMNow, where is that dislike button again... :P
You have a Geelong premiership, what more do you want?
Quote from: Madiel on November 27, 2022, 03:03:17 AMYou have a Geelong premiership, what more do you want?
- A third star on the shirt in 3 weeks time
- A sore losing Courtois in the news saying they should have won
- A "Geelong Premiers 2022" Banner at the top of the GMG homepage,
Geelong Magic Geelong... It depends which team
@Dungeon Master barracks for, I guess :laugh:
- Tom Hawkins lifting the premiers Trophy again in September next year
- Antoine Dupont lifting the RWC next year (I'd take that one alone over all four to be honest...the absence of a French RWC win does hurt the most).
Quote from: Papy Oli on November 27, 2022, 03:16:12 AM- A third star on the shirt in 3 weeks time
- A sore losing Courtois in the news saying they should have won
- A "Geelong Premiers 2022" Banner at the top of the GMG homepage, Geelong Magic Geelong... It depends which team @Dungeon Master barracks for, I guess :laugh:
- Tom Hawkins lifting the premiers Trophy again in September next year
- Antoine Dupont lifting the RWC next year (I'd take that one alone over all four to be honest...the absence of a French RWC win does hurt the most).
I can't process all this. I have to process Japan v Costa Rica first.
As an aside, does anyone here (In the US) know who is currently showing the Cup live? I was initially watching it on Fox, but then it seems that they aren't showing it live now. Or perhaps reruns later in the day?
It looks like there's a Spanish channel showing it live, but as I don't speak Spanish, it would be nice to be able to watch it with English-speaking commentators. Note: it seems that I can watch it "On Demand", but I'd rather catch the games live.
PD
Quote from: Madiel on November 27, 2022, 03:36:19 AMI can't process all this. I have to process Japan v Costa Rica first.
Surprising, isn't it, that we have come to regard Costa Rica beating Japan as a surprise. :)
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 27, 2022, 03:45:45 AMAs an aside, does anyone here (In the US) know who is currently showing the Cup live? I was initially watching it on Fox, but then it seems that they aren't showing it live now. Or perhaps reruns later in the day?
It looks like there's a Spanish channel showing it live, but as I don't speak Spanish, it would be nice to be able to watch it with English-speaking commentators. Note: it seems that I can watch it "On Demand", but I'd rather catch the games live.
PD
This is the official page for showing where matches are broadcast. https://www.fifa.com/fifaplus/en/tournaments/mens/worldcup/qatar2022/scores-fixtures?country=US&wtw-filter=ALL
Quote from: Florestan on November 27, 2022, 01:54:03 AMNot in a row, though: the current WC holder is Argentina. ;)
Russia 2018 was the last one wasn't it? France 4 Croatia 2.
Quote from: Madiel on November 27, 2022, 04:32:28 AMThis is the official page for showing where matches are broadcast. https://www.fifa.com/fifaplus/en/tournaments/mens/worldcup/qatar2022/scores-fixtures?country=US&wtw-filter=ALL
Thanks, I'll explore it more later. :)
PD
Quote from: Irons on November 27, 2022, 05:24:16 AMRussia 2018 was the last one wasn't it? France 4 Croatia 2.
You're right, I had a memory lapse.
Morrocco-Belgium 2-0, the world has really gone upside down. :)
I didn't quite understand the VAR decision this time. The Morroccan player was indeed in offside but he didn't play the ball. ???
A short trip for Morocco supporters and didn't they do well. They inspired their team to a famous victory, I for one jumped out of my chair at the second goal. One thing that worries me is OTT celebrations at the end. A more experienced manager would reign that in - a battle won, not the war.
Wow, Croatia is giving Canada a thumping! Now 4-1
PD
I don't know if it's because of messianism or lack of education, but the USA team keeps doing weird, and non-soccer related, things against Iran. It just looks bizarre and creepy.
Quote from: Florestan on November 27, 2022, 07:51:40 AMI didn't quite understand the VAR decision this time. The Morroccan player was indeed in offside but he didn't play the ball. ???
The rule is whether you are affecting play. Standing almost directly in the goalkeeper's line of sight is a definite Yes.
Quote from: Dry Brett Kavanaugh on November 27, 2022, 12:17:29 PMI don't know if it's because of messianism or lack of education, but the USA team keeps doing weird, and non-soccer related, things against Iran. It just looks bizarre and creepy.
What did they do?
Quote from: Madiel on November 27, 2022, 06:08:46 PMThe rule is whether you are affecting play. Standing almost directly in the goalkeeper's line of sight is a definite Yes.
Makes sense. I hadn't thought about that.
Germany deserved their equaliser against Spain.
Quote from: Irons on November 27, 2022, 11:15:40 PMGermany deserved their equaliser against Spain.
Yes and they will qualify for the eighth-finals --- unless Costa Rica and Japan offer the biggest surprise in the history of WC and send both Germany and Spain home, that is. ;D
I think if Japan and Germany win Spain could still advance because of more goals. But Japan needs to try to win because if Spain-Japan tie Germany will probably advance before Japan as they hopefully will have more goals scored against Costa Rica. And IIRC goal difference are the first tie-breaker, than direct confrontation (which would be Japan > Germany).
Yes in any kinds of points tie, Spain's great goal difference and Costa Rica's terrible goal difference will have an impact.
I think Germany are in a fairly good position, but no guarantees.
Does anyone else get into the design of the stadiums?
They're not all totally distinctive this time, but there are some different looks and each one has its own logo design for the image in the centre of the field pre-match (when they have the fireworks).
The shipping container and the Bedouin tent that are the ones are immediately recognisable this time.
Cameroun-Serbia 3-3. Imho best match so far and the result totally fair. I supported Serbia but Cameroun did not deserve to lose so I am happy with the result.
Quote from: Madiel on November 28, 2022, 01:40:41 AMDoes anyone else get into the design of the stadiums?
They're not all totally distinctive this time, but there are some different looks and each one has its own logo design for the image in the centre of the field pre-match (when they have the fireworks).
The shipping container and the Bedouin tent that are the ones are immediately recognisable this time.
Ah, I found the list of the stadiums and if you click on them, you can see images of the exteriors. https://footballtripper.com/world-cup/qatar-2022-stadiums/
With the exception of the shipping containers one, I think that (at least looking at them from the outside), that they are all gorgeous and unique. Very clever architects. The containers one is certainly unique, but I'm not keen on it myself.
PD
Ghana - South Korea 3-2, another good match. I felt sorry for the Koreans, they fought hard and would have deserved a draw,.
Quote from: Florestan on November 28, 2022, 06:15:18 AMGhana - South Korea 3-2, another good match. I felt sorry for the Koreans, they fought hard and would have deserved a draw.
I watched that game (though it was hard to follow the commentary as I was only able to find it in Spanish--at least without paying for yet another service). Yes, I enjoyed it too and was impressed with the comeback by South Korea. They managed to level it and then Ghana came back with yet another goal. :)
PD
p.s. By the way, what was that mask that the Korean goalie was wearing about? Was it designed to help protect his face in some way or ?
Well, I found out the answer to my question here: https://www.goal.com/en/news/why-south-koreas-heung-min-son-wearing-mask-world-cup/blt06977fc1d7dda1ec
PD
I think Group H is my favourite (Ghana, South Korea, Portugal, Uruguay). All 4 teams play well and it's a shame that 2 will be eliminated soon...
I think Ghana v South Korea might have been the best match so far. And I believe today was the most goals to date (14).
The excitement begins!
Must admit, looking at the "Permutations explained" on FIFA's website is enough to make my head spin! And I thought that watching the men's end of year tennis finals (and the women's) with its round robin format was [initially] confusing enough with all of its different scenarios and ways of figuring out who was going through. ;D
PD
Well, PD, I hope you're still excited.
Quote from: Madiel on November 29, 2022, 07:11:36 PMWell, PD, I hope you're still excited.
Yep! ;D
Though seeing Pulisic on the ground and then hobbling around for a while after scoring was really hard to watch. :(
Alas, I couldn't watch any of the England vs. Wales map, but I'm happy for my English friends here.
PD
So, Papi, are you watching France play now?
And, Madiel, are you watching *Australia?
Here, watching a bit of the France/Tunisia match whilst trying to get some things done.
Was excited to see France score a goal earlier then letdown when it was decided that one of the players was offsides....so it goes!
*Which reminds me, haven't seen MusicTurner posting for a while? :(
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 30, 2022, 06:20:26 AMSo, Papi, are you watching France play now?
And, Madiel, are you watching *Australia?
Here, watching a bit of the France/Tunisia match whilst trying to get some things done.
Was excited to see France score a goal earlier then letdown when it was decided that one of the players was offsides....so it goes!
*Which reminds me, haven't seen MusicTurner posting for a while? :(
PD
Oh yes I am - even if it's very much a French B-team for now.
The offside goal was for Tunisia, not us, so I am very grateful for the offside ;D
Quote from: Papy Oli on November 30, 2022, 06:27:20 AMOh yes I am - even if it's very much a French B-team for now.
The offside goal was for Tunisia, not us, so I am very grateful for the offside ;D
Oh! Time for new glasses for me! :-[ lol That, and paying closer attention!
Storm headed this way, so am trying to get some things done before it gets nasty.
PD
Sadly for you Papy, but Tunisia did score this time. It looked to my very inexpert eyes that Khazi did a nice job maneuvering around other players and also avoid the goalie?
Heard that Australia is up 1-0.
PD
Well that was dire, unsurprisingly with 9 changes initially. Still, job done anyway, top of the group.
Well done Australia too!
Argentina, Poland or Saudi Arabia in the next round for either of us,
@Madiel ...
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 30, 2022, 06:20:26 AM*Which reminds me, haven't seen MusicTurner posting for a while? :(
He hasn't posted during the last two months. But he was active a week ago without posting.
It can hardly surprise anyone that I am very disappointed with the "efforts" of my countrymen to day.
Quote from: (: premont :) on November 30, 2022, 08:24:54 AMHe hasn't posted during the last two months. But he was active a week ago without posting.
I thought as much (re posting), but glad that he's been checking in. I hope that all is well with him.
Quote from: (: premont :) on November 30, 2022, 08:26:39 AMIt can hardly surprise anyone that I am very disappointed with the "efforts" of my countrymen to day.
Sorry to hear that premont. I believe that you're Danish?
PD
Well, now that it's completely safe to read the thread...
What a day. Honestly, I wasn't actually going for Australia for about 30 minutes. For various reasons I know the Danish team better, and they were doing all the attacking. But couldn't put it together.
Edit: Which really surprised me given how good Denmark has been the last 18 months or so.
And then by the second half I remembered where I live. Leckie's goal was superb.
France B was pretty terrible. I doubt Deschamps is happy with his team, and France had better hope there are no more injuries to star players.
Watching Argentina was impressive. Watching Mexico push for the big win they needed was thrilling. I switched between my recordings of the 2 matches, and there were SO many close calls that could have changed the outcome.
Edit: Commentators have pointed out that the Polish goalkeeper has saved penalties in 2 matches, and this in itself is enough to make the difference in their group.
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on November 30, 2022, 06:20:26 AMSo, Papi, are you watching France play now?
And, Madiel, are you watching *Australia?
Here, watching a bit of the France/Tunisia match whilst trying to get some things done.
Was excited to see France score a goal earlier then letdown when it was decided that one of the players was offsides....so it goes!
*Which reminds me, haven't seen MusicTurner posting for a while? :(
PD
Actually watching at 2am is beyond me. Which is why I take leave from work to start at a more sensible time.
Quote from: Madiel on November 30, 2022, 07:07:14 PMFrance B was pretty terrible. I doubt Deschamps is happy with his team, and France had better hope there are no more injuries to star players.
That was dire but the 9 changes were necessary sadly. The number and calibre of the absentees through injury did show last night. There's really not much beyond the main 11. We were left with too many unexperienced players.
Did you see that France lodged an appeal to FIFA to have their late equaliser reinstated ?! Even though the Griezmann offside was correct, the VAR Call was made after the final whistle and that is not allowed. Maybe there will be a little bit of karma thrown back at Tunisia after all for their supporters booing the French anthem last night >:D
Quote from: Papy Oli on December 01, 2022, 01:55:54 AMDid you see that France lodged an appeal to FIFA to have their late equaliser reinstated ?! Even though the Griezmann offside was correct, the VAR Call was made after the final whistle and that is not allowed.
No, I didn't see that, I thought that the whistle had not actually been blown (the clock reaching the allotted time is not what ends the match). I don't have the recording any more to go check (though I could go stream the replay).
Who the hell cares, anyway? You won the group.
EDIT: I also find it very hard to believe that the referee actually would have blown the final whistle as well as having a VAR check. Those two actions seem fundamentally incompatible.
Quote from: Madiel on December 01, 2022, 02:07:48 AMNo, I didn't see that, I thought that the whistle had not actually been blown (the clock reaching the allotted time is not what ends the match). I don't have the recording any more to go check (though I could go stream the replay).
Who the hell cares, anyway? You won the group.
EDIT: I also find it very hard to believe that the referee actually would have blown the final whistle as well as having a VAR check. Those two actions seem fundamentally incompatible.
Not sure what there is to gain either for the French FA on this (other than some points for the FIFA ranking maybe, but that seems petty.. or the idea to be undefeated throughout the tournament in the unlikely event we go all the way ? Now, that would be peak French arrogance :P ).
This was definitely after the final whistle because I read the main French TV channel broadcasting the game last night went straight to an ad break upon that whistle, with a score draw... and came back to live TV from the stadium... with a 1-0 loss... they took some flack for that untimely interruption ;D
Well no, that doesn't mean the referee had actually blown the FINAL whistle. That just means someone at a TV station believed it.
There are a whole lot of different whistle blows involved. I forget which match it was that an offside was right near the halfway line and people wrongly believed the referee was pointing to the kickoff spot. Maybe Ecuador v Senegal?
So even knowing that the referee blew his whistle is no kind of proof that he was intending to signal the end of the match.
Quote from: Madiel on December 01, 2022, 02:44:41 AMWell no, that doesn't mean the referee had actually blown the FINAL whistle. That just means someone at a TV station believed it.
There are a whole lot of different whistle blows involved. I forget which match it was that an offside was right near the halfway line and people wrongly believed the referee was pointing to the kickoff spot. Maybe Ecuador v Senegal?
So even knowing that the referee blew his whistle is no kind of proof that he was intending to signal the end of the match.
I have checked the end of the game stream on the BBC and you can hear the triple whistle for the end of the game, the English commentator saying full time as well...then about 15-20 seconds later, there's a shot of the referee then listening to his ear piece for the VAR call out.
Checking on l'Equipe article, the French channel launched the ad break just as the referee was shown listening to his earpiece, but after the end of the game...with their subsequent grovelling apologies ;D
Still according to l'Equipe, the VAR rules states that the VAR can't be referred to if the game has resumed already unless it is relating to a player identity issue or a sending off issue. In this case, we do not see the game resuming at all on the BBC broadcast. You can just hear the final whistle while they are broadcasting replays of the goal. Not sure if there was actually a kick off after the goal (L'Equipe, however, mentions there was a Tunisian kick off again then the final whistle).
Still, ultimately, a petty appeal if anything.
Well hang on, having VAR after a kick-off? That makes no sense either.
Edit: this page is helpful. https://www.espn.com/soccer/fifa-world-cup/story/4820758/why-var-disallowed-griezmanns-goal-for-france-for-offside?platform=amp
Anyway... I need some sleep before finding out in the morning whether Belgium survived.
Quote from: Madiel on November 30, 2022, 07:07:14 PMEdit: Commentators have pointed out that the Polish goalkeeper has saved penalties in 2 matches, and this in itself is enough to make the difference in their group.
Interesting!
Quote from: Madiel on November 30, 2022, 07:08:32 PMActually watching at 2am is beyond me. Which is why I take leave from work to start at a more sensible time.
You
really are a football fan! ;D
Quote from: Papy Oli on December 01, 2022, 01:55:54 AMThat was dire but the 9 changes were necessary sadly. The number and calibre of the absentees through injury did show last night. There's really not much beyond the main 11. We were left with too many unexperienced players.
Did you see that France lodged an appeal to FIFA to have their late equaliser reinstated ?! Even though the Griezmann offside was correct, the VAR Call was made after the final whistle and that is not allowed. Maybe there will be a little bit of karma thrown back at Tunisia after all for their supporters booing the French anthem last night >:D
:o Oh, my!
Quote from: (: premont :) on November 30, 2022, 08:31:01 PMThat's right.
My sympathies to you re the results. :(
PD
Quote from: Madiel on December 01, 2022, 03:29:35 AMWell hang on, having VAR after a kick-off? That makes no sense either.
Edit: this page is helpful. https://www.espn.com/soccer/fifa-world-cup/story/4820758/why-var-disallowed-griezmanns-goal-for-france-for-offside?platform=amp
Anyway... I need some sleep before finding out in the morning whether Belgium survived.
great article, thank you...and what a mess.. imagine if all this had hampered one of the two teams actually progressing on or in the final 16 onwards...
Damn you, insomnia.
Might as well start watching... 🇧🇪
Quote from: Madiel on December 01, 2022, 06:10:14 AMDamn you, insomnia.
Might as well start watching... 🇧🇪
Oh, no! Well, I was hoping that Belgium would manage to score a goal. Great defending by Croatia though.
PD
I watched one half of Belgium-Croatia before being tired enough for bed.
It took me a while to get back to it all today. The Group F matches (including the above) were a bit dispiriting. Belgium just couldn't do it. Out of the teams I support, who would have guessed Australia was the one that would get out of the groups? Not me.
But the Group E matches were astounding in the second half! I'm glad I did the thing of switching between games. By my estimate, the qualifying teams changed 5 times, including one glorious minute where Costa Rica was winning. In the end they didn't, but Japan held on well. Two sudden knockout punches against two European powers, and they win the group! Just amazing.
If you looked at the groups and the rankings before the tournament, Morocco and Japan shouldn't have made it out of the groups and they each won them.
Unlike last time when they totally screwed up I have sympathy for the German team. It was pretty clear before they would not be able to score 8 goals but nobody expected Spain to lose (as they couldn't risk Costa Rica winning)
It's now the worst spell ever for a German national team. They had never before 2018 (in tournaments with group phase) failed to advance and now they failed twice in a row. It's a bit of bad luck because I think the team in the late 1990s and 2002 was actually worse (maybe not always but frequently) and nevertheless got pretty far in these world cups.
I think Spain was actually okay with coming second and playing against Morocco instead of Croatia. It was obvious to me that they did not force a draw.
Btw, what do you guys think? Ball out or not at Japan's second goal? I confess that both I and my wife saw it out in its entirety on several replays but on the other hand it's hard to believe that the VAR could have much such a blunder.
But Spain would have been out if Costa Rica had one and they had the lead, although only for a a short time! Except for the last 10 min or so when Germany led again it was very risky to count on Costa Rica not winning.
Quote from: Jo498 on December 02, 2022, 01:12:29 AMBut Spain would have been out if Costa Rica had one and they had the lead, although only for a a short time! Except for the last 10 min or so when Germany led again it was very risky to count on Costa Rica not winning.
Precisely. It's in the last 10 minutes or so (including additional time) that the Spaniards left me with the distinct impresssion they were actually content with the result. They knew Costa Rica could not win anymore and did not force the draw, thus avoiding playing against Croatia which is a much tougher nut to crack than Morocco, at least in theory.
Quote from: Florestan on December 02, 2022, 12:56:54 AMI think Spain was actually okay with coming second and playing against Morocco instead of Croatia. It was obvious to me that they did not force a draw.
Btw, what do you guys think? Ball out or not at Japan's second goal? I confess that both I and my wife saw it out in its entirety on several replays but on the other hand it's hard to believe that the VAR could have much such a blunder.
I think the ball was in. Seeing grass at ground level is meaningless because the whole of the ball has to be over the line. If it was a cube/box, you could judge it at the ground. But it's a ball. The edge of the ball hovering over the line is enough to be in.
Quote from: Madiel on December 02, 2022, 02:07:08 AMthe whole of the ball has to be over the line
Yes, I knew that. I found this very helpful article with excellent pictures. The first one, right under the title, it's the one that made us believe the ball was out. The second one, posted by one Chris Williams on Twitter, clearly shows it was in, albeit by the smallest of margins.
https://www.goal.com/en/news/explained-why-japan-second-goal-spain-controversially-allowed-var/blt78d3cdd7144ece65 (https://www.goal.com/en/news/explained-why-japan-second-goal-spain-controversially-allowed-var/blt78d3cdd7144ece65)
Quote from: Florestan on December 02, 2022, 03:22:16 AMYes, I knew that. I found this very helpful article with excellent pictures. The first one, right under the title, it's the one that made us believe the ball was out. The second one, posted by one Chris Williams on Twitter, clearly shows it was in, albeit by the smallest of margins.
https://www.goal.com/en/news/explained-why-japan-second-goal-spain-controversially-allowed-var/blt78d3cdd7144ece65 (https://www.goal.com/en/news/explained-why-japan-second-goal-spain-controversially-allowed-var/blt78d3cdd7144ece65)
The Chris Williams tweet is excellent. Thanks.
I feel sorry for Uruguay. They'd have deserved to qualify, no less than Ghana would have deserved a draw. Anyway, this is probably the most surprising WC ever.
Japan's new flag.
(https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/onesport/cps/976/cpsprodpb/05A6/production/_127864410_whatsubject.jpg)
Quote from: Dry Brett Kavanaugh on December 02, 2022, 09:19:04 AMJapan's new flag.
(https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/onesport/cps/976/cpsprodpb/05A6/production/_127864410_whatsubject.jpg)
Hilarious! :)
Serbia-Switzerland 2-2 half time. This will certainly be the most heated and dramatic match so far.
Go, Serbia!
Quote from: Florestan on December 02, 2022, 10:59:31 AMSerbia-Switzerland 2-2 half time. This will certainly be the most heated and dramatic match so far.
Go, Serbia!
The Swiss were much better in the second half and deserved their qualifying. Bravi!
Also, bravi Cameroun! They didn't qualify but joined the very select club of teams that beated Brazil at WC.
A special hat tip to Rigobert Song who is a true gentleman --- he always takes off his cap before shaking hands with / embracing the opposing team's coach.
I still root for Spain, England or Portugal.
Quote from: Florestan on December 02, 2022, 08:12:11 AMI feel sorry for Uruguay. They'd have deserved to qualify, no less than Ghana would have deserved a draw. Anyway, this is probably the most surprising WC ever.
Yes, as I said before, that was probably my favourite group.
But Korea's winning goal was magnificent!
In general it's fantastic to see the surprises. Two African teams and three Asian teams into the knockout rounds. The world game is getting more global and is all the better for it.
The utter joy of the South Korean team and supporters was something to behold. Nearly brought a tear to my eye!
Quote from: Dry Brett Kavanaugh on December 02, 2022, 09:19:04 AMJapan's new flag.
(https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/onesport/cps/976/cpsprodpb/05A6/production/_127864410_whatsubject.jpg)
Very funny! ;D
Quote from: Irons on December 02, 2022, 11:51:40 PMThe utter joy of the South Korean team and supporters was something to behold. Nearly brought a tear to my eye!
Me too!
Quote from: Madiel on December 02, 2022, 08:56:02 PMIn general it's fantastic to see the surprises. Two African teams and three Asian teams into the knockout rounds. The world game is getting more global and is all the better for it.
Fully agreed.
Netherlands - USA
Argentina - Australia
Japan - Croatia
Brazil - South Korea
England - Senegal
France - Poland
Morocco - Spain
Portugal - Switzerland
Place your bets ;D ;D
Quote from: Papy Oli on December 03, 2022, 01:23:02 AMPlace your bets ;D ;D
No betting, but I did draw Brazil in the office sweepstakes...
I really don't know. Of all those matches, Australia's task looks like one of the hardest, but a heck of a lot of strange things have happened in this tournament already.
Matches I'm most looking forward to are England-Senegal and Morocco-Spain.
Quote from: Papy Oli on December 03, 2022, 01:23:02 AMNetherlands - USA
Argentina - Australia
Japan - Croatia
Brazil - South Korea
England - Senegal
France - Poland
Morocco - Spain
Portugal - Switzerland
Place your bets ;D ;D
I'm saying my prayers (and leaving offerings to whichever gods/deities will accept them) for the US today...particularly as from what I understand the Dutch have a very good team. How do you think the Argentina/Australia match will go?
PD
Quote from: Madiel on December 03, 2022, 01:43:32 AMI really don't know. Of all those matches, Australia's task looks like one of the hardest, but a heck of a lot of strange things have happened in this tournament already.
Matches I'm most looking forward to are England-Senegal and Morocco-Spain.
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 03, 2022, 02:09:35 AMI'm saying my prayers (and leaving offerings to whichever gods/deities will accept them) for the US today...particularly as from what I understand the Dutch have a very good team. How do you think the Argentina/Australia match will go?
PD
Hi both,
Tough ones to call, all of them.
This household kind of looks forward to an England-France obviously so we don't want any Senegalese or Lewandowski upsets, thank you...
As for ARG-AUS, Messi could bottle it under his country's pressure, you never know... ;)
Quote from: Papy Oli on December 03, 2022, 01:23:02 AMNetherlands - USA
Argentina - Australia
Japan - Croatia
Brazil - South Korea
England - Senegal
France - Poland
Morocco - Spain
Portugal - Switzerland
Place your bets ;D ;D
A very interesting round of 16; thinking about what happened in the groups, it seems there can be no totally predictable matches. Germany didn't pass, so provably I'll support Spain or England.
Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 03, 2022, 02:52:53 AMA very interesting round of 16; thinking about what happened in the groups, it seems there can be no totally predictable matches. Germany didn't pass, so provably I'll support Spain or England.
@Lisztianwagner Must admit, I was quite surprised to see both Spain and Germany lose their matches. I guess that the way the official figuring is done, is that despite losing to Japan, Spain is still alive and kicking (no pun intended).
PD
USA looking unable to beat the Dutch defense. They'll need the energy of someone like Gio Reyna to score anything in the second half but the American coach makes conservative, defense-minded substitutions. Real test of whether both team and coach can change tactics to unlock an unfamiliar defensive strategy.
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 03, 2022, 03:52:33 AM@Lisztianwagner Must admit, I was quite surprised to see both Spain and Germany lose their matches. I guess that the way the official figuring is done, is that despite losing to Japan, Spain is still alive and kicking (no pun intended).
PD
Yes, Germany won against Costa Rica, but it wasn't enough to qualify, because although both got 4 points, Spain had a better goal difference; I'm sorry Germany didn't pass, but at least this unpredictability of results is what makes football such a wonderful sport to watch.
Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 03, 2022, 08:11:34 AMthis unpredictability of results is what makes football such a wonderful sport to watch.
Precisely. I confess, though, that I have never been a football Germanophile and always supported whichever team they played against. >:D I was mad with joy when, many moons ago, Romania beat Germany 5-0, albeit in a non-official match.
Quote from: Florestan on December 03, 2022, 08:25:48 AMPrecisely. I confess, though, that I have never been a football Germanophile and always supported whichever team they played against. >:D I was mad with joy when, many moons ago, Romania beat Germany 5-0, albeit in a non-official match.
You have to admit the 7-1 game was magnificent!
Quote from: Brian on December 03, 2022, 08:39:53 AMYou have to admit the 7-1 game was magnificent!
Why, of course, when Germany is in top form they play superbly. It's just that of all great teams they have always been my least favorite. I can't explain why, that's just how it is. :)
@Florestan Well, you have the right to root against. ;)
I agree Germany can play superbly (yes, 7-1 against Brazil docet), but unfortunately they have been in poor form since the previous World Cup: they didn't pass groups in 2018, they played a decent and nothing more European championship, and now they are out of the World Cup again.
Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 03, 2022, 08:11:34 AMYes, Germany won against Costa Rica, but it wasn't enough to qualify, because although both got 4 points, Spain had a better goal difference; I'm sorry Germany didn't pass, but at least this unpredictability of results is what makes football such a wonderful sport to watch.
Ah, yes, that makes sense now.
*Bummed about the US being out, but the Dutch did play very well; they kept blocking the middle "lane" of the field and it seemed that the Americans didn't want to go down the outsides. And were excellent at individually targeting and sticking next to our players. At least some of their players too are really tall/big! A 6'8" goalkeeper?! :o In any event, our young team will learn and grow from this experience I trust. :)
I had hope when we scored our first and only goal that we could at least tie things before time ran out (think that it's then penalty kicks after that? Or is there another 30 minutes added on first? I forget how it works). There was something like 10-15 minutes left on the clock; however, when the Nederlands scored their third goal, that little bird called Hope flew away from me. :(
Back from some quick errands to catch Australia vs. Argentina.
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 03, 2022, 09:57:04 AMBummed about the US being out, but the Dutch did play very well; they kept blocking the middle "lane" of the field and it seemed that the Americans didn't want to go down the outsides. And were excellent at individually targeting and sticking next to our players.
The Dutch team didn't sound too happy with their work yet, they need to get better, was the general tone, after the match.
@Pohjolas Daughter 45+45 min (with break of 15) regular time, if a tie after this, 15+15 min extension. If still or again tied, penalties, first 5 each team (alternating), then directly alternating penalties so any one miss vs. score will decide.
Quote from: Jo498 on December 03, 2022, 10:31:11 AM@Pohjolas Daughter
45+45 min (with break of 15) regular time, if a tie after this, 15+15 min extension. If still or again tied, penalties, first 5 each team (alternating), then directly alternating penalties so any one miss vs. score will decide.
Hi, thanks for the info. As I was typing it, I was thinking "...there's something about 15 minutes"
What do you mean about "with break of 15" though Is that half-time? I do remember seeing penalty kicks where, if I'm recalling correctly, that they went between one team and the other and weighing up who missed penalty kicks vs. the other team. So, if I'm understanding correctly, that it goes down to one team's penalty shot vs. the other teams....one shot at a time if things are still undecided?
I forget the term now, but from what I understand, there is also time added on (after the 90 minutes) for stoppage time?
And, wow, Argentina is on through!
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 03, 2022, 11:58:18 AMHi, thanks for the info. As I was typing it, I was thinking "...there's something about 15 minutes"
What do you mean about "with break of 15" though Is that half-time? I do remember seeing penalty kicks where, if I'm recalling correctly, that they went between one team and the other and weighing up who missed penalty kicks vs. the other team. So, if I'm understanding correctly, that it goes down to one team's penalty shot vs. the other teams....one shot at a time if things are still undecided?
I forget the term now, but from what I understand, there is also time added on (after the 90 minutes) for stoppage time?
PD
Indeed, as
@Jo498 said, there's an interval of 15 minutes between the first and the second half time, a football match doesn't take 90 min in a row; if the teams are still tidying after the regular time and the minutes of stoppage time, an extra time begins (two half times of 15 min); if there's a tie at the end of that, then penalty kicks. :)
USA played pretty well, but Netherlands had worked out the right tactics against them - the Americans don't particularly like having control of the ball so much. And Netherlands were ruthlessly efficient with chances.
EDIT: USA in 4 years time at home could be pretty good, given how young the majority of the team are.
Australia played pretty well, but Messi happened and breached what had until then been a very good defence. And Matty Ryan... sigh. This is not the first time our goalkeeper has done something dreadful. He's a very, very good goalkeeper but also things like that happen exactly when you don't want them to.
The "overtime" after each half is really something not quite consistent. Unlike in basketball time is not stopped for the little breaks in game. In former times, the referee usually let only around 2 min. overtime play and one never knew how long! This was a bit annoying, so they improved it towards having announced after 45 min how many minutes longer (it's still not exact, the referee's whistle decides, not the clock).
And I think they also now have a policy to make up for a bit more, there was 10 min. overtime in one match recently and I had rarely seen this before, only if there were obvious long breaks with a severe injury oe uncommonly many in-game penalties or something like that. Usually, it was accepted as part of the game that playing time can be a bit different and only unusual or longer delays should be partially made up by the overtime. (And they introduced more delay by the video check of some situations!) I doubt we want to do this but stopping the clock like in other sports would make this a different game. And so (to a lesser extent) would frequent 55-60 min halfs.
The policy has explicitly changed for this tournament, yes. So that all of the time taken for substitutions, for example, is included.
As it should be. Teams that are leading should not be able to do something like a substitution in order to wind down the lock.
The fact that the spectators don't see the clock stopping and starting doesn't bother me in the slightest, as this is how Australian Rules has always worked if you're at the game. On television, they show you the clock stopping and starting, but not at the ground.
Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 03, 2022, 04:27:29 PMIndeed, as @Jo498 said, there's an interval of 15 minutes between the first and the second half time, a football match doesn't take 90 min in a row; if the teams are still tidying after the regular time and the minutes of stoppage time, an extra time begins (two half times of 15 min); if there's a tie at the end of that, then penalty kicks. :)
Thank you all for the clarifications!
By the way, who all is playing today?
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 04, 2022, 02:07:45 AMBy the way, who all is playing today?
France v Poland
England v Senegal
Thanks. I'll look up the times (after coffee has kicked in a bit more).
Actually, speaking of caffeine, how are you keeping up with watching so much football? Naps? Auto-pilot? ;)
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 04, 2022, 02:54:31 AMActually, speaking of caffeine, how are you keeping up with watching so much football? Naps? Auto-pilot? ;)
Well, as discussed... not working. So I could watch matches during the day off recordings.
But also a fair amount of auto-pilot. 4 matches a day took a large part of the day. Avoiding news, and particularly this thread, until I was done. How long after the last match varied hugely. Sometimes I was only about 7 hours behind real time at the end, sometimes more like 10 hours behind. But basically not having anything else to do gave me the flexibility.
It was the insomnia over several nights that made it really difficult, though. That was probably due to the weather changing here. I'm not used to summer in this house yet, I need to figure it out! Not super hot yet, but it's enough to mean it's not so cool at night.
But it's going to be far easier now, with only 2 matches a day. I'll even be back at work from tomorrow (your time). Getting up at 5am to watch the matches beforehand... They're actually on at 2am and 6am, but again, recordings, watching on delay.
I should be in bed by now, but I have an opera to finish...
Quote from: Madiel on December 04, 2022, 03:10:18 AMWell, as discussed... not working. So I could watch matches during the day off recordings.
But also a fair amount of auto-pilot. 4 matches a day took a large part of the day. Avoiding news, and particularly this thread, until I was done. How long after the last match varied hugely. Sometimes I was only about 7 hours behind real time at the end, sometimes more like 10 hours behind. But basically not having anything else to do gave me the flexibility.
It was the insomnia over several nights that made it really difficult, though. That was probably due to the weather changing here. I'm not used to summer in this house yet, I need to figure it out! Not super hot yet, but it's enough to mean it's not so cool at night.
But it's going to be far easier now, with only 2 matches a day. I'll even be back at work from tomorrow (your time). Getting up at 5am to watch the matches beforehand... They're actually on at 2am and 6am, but again, recordings, watching on delay.
I should be in bed by now, but I have an opera to finish...
Ouch, the time difference is even more than I had thought! Get some rest. And perhaps time to get your air conditioner running?
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 04, 2022, 03:17:33 AMAnd perhaps time to get your air conditioner running?
It hasn't been hot enough to need the aircon during the day. Well, today was borderline (EDIT: the maximum in your language was 83) and tomorrow will be the same. But again, not really hot. But for sleeping you need a little cooler. What I need is probably some window opening, is all. Even during the day. But which window(s)...
Part of my issue is I'm excessively sensitive to sound and I'm still not used to sleeping at the front of the house. Even in a quiet neighbourhood. My old house was laid out differently.
Quote from: Madiel on December 04, 2022, 03:26:20 AMIt hasn't been hot enough to need the aircon during the day. Well, today was borderline (EDIT: the maximum in your language was 83) and tomorrow will be the same. But again, not really hot. But for sleeping you need a little cooler. What I need is probably some window opening, is all. Even during the day. But which window(s)...
Part of my issue is I'm excessively sensitive to sound and I'm still not used to sleeping at the front of the house. Even in a quiet neighbourhood. My old house was laid out differently.
What about using a fan? I have one which I like a lot. It's by a company named Rowenta and is a floor standing one. Helpful when it's not super hot and is also very quiet (a friend of mine also noticed that). It has 3 speeds and also a kind of a surge function for each of the speeds. You can also either fix it so that it's in one position or let it do a slow sweep from side to side. Or a window fan might work for you. Let the outside air in but I suspect that it would also help to drown out outside noise. Or a window a/c that has both a fan and a cooling options?
PD
An interesting aside, for me anyway. Listening to a a podcast with an interview with Anton Ferdinand (brother of Rio) who as an ex-player knows the ropes. He made the point that England have an advantage at this World Cup purely down to timing of the competition. Premier League football is unique in that the busiest congestion of games falls over Christmas. The Bundesliga for example is suspended. Players in the Premier League build up to maximum fitness for this period. After a long season the usual time frame for a WC they are knackered.
Quote from: Irons on December 04, 2022, 05:52:05 AMAn interesting aside, for me anyway. Listening to a a podcast with an interview with Anton Ferdinand (brother of Rio) who as an ex-player knows the ropes. He made the point that England have an advantage at this World Cup purely down to timing of the competition. Premier League football is unique in that the busiest congestion of games falls over Christmas. The Bundesliga for example is suspended. Players in the Premier League build up to maximum fitness for this period. After a long season the usual time frame for a WC they are knackered.
Interesting! By comparison, I've watched/followed a fair bit of tennis and most of the players are pretty tired by the end of the year--the exceptions being ones who are elite enough that they can opt out of certain events and those who have been injured and are now able to play again. The hard part with that though is fitness and particularly match play. It's very different practicing with partners on ones team or with other players and playing an actual match.
Pleased to see England score. I'm just back from doing some errands and am catching the match on t.v. It's now currently about 43 minutes into the game. Can't understand the commentators alas as it's in Spanish. Glad that I can watch it though. :) And another goal by England!
Would be interested in commentary from those who know the sport better than myself and can also listen to the commentary as to how you think Senegal is playing and various strategies between the two teams.
PD
Job done & Job done today.
Bring on England ;D ;D
Senegal played very well for about 35 minutes and had some good chances but after that England dominated the match. France (the World Champions) will be a rather different proposition.
All of the round of 16 matches have been following a similar pattern so far, with the lower-ranked team doing some good things for a while and then it breaks down.
Still, there's another 4 matches to go...
There have been surprise advances of less highly rated teams in the past but I think they are remembered partly because they are comparably rare. It's usually when a higher rated team is performing poorly but still makes it into the k.o. stage.
Still, at least one underdog will have to advance to the quarter finals from Japan vs. Croatia. Of the other 3 matches, I'd probably least surprised by the Swiss beating Portugal. This would be the biggest success for Switzerland since 1954 (although then it really was a different world with 16 teams only.
Quote from: Papy Oli on December 04, 2022, 12:11:41 PMJob done & Job done today.
Bring on England ;D ;D
What worries me Olivier is that England have some world class players and France have the best player in the world. Only Kyle Walker has the pace to live with Mbappé and he didn't look fit to me last night.
Quote from: Jo498 on December 04, 2022, 11:36:52 PMat least one underdog will have to might advance to the quarter finals from Japan vs. Croatia.
Fixed. Croatia is the current vice-world-champion, so hardly an underdog. ;)
It's just more evidence how far an underdog can occasionally go... Not quite as outrageous as Greece winning European CS. But you are right that they might be favored in that particular match, although Japan has won against Germany and Spain, so I would not bet on it.
The explanation is probably just that there are relatively few goals/points but soccer seems clearly the one of the international ball games where most surprises occur. (It's usually evened out in leagues with dozens of matches)
Quote from: Jo498 on December 05, 2022, 01:38:46 AMIt's just more evidence how far an underdog can occasionally go... Not quite as outrageous as Greece winning European CS. But you are right that they might be favored in that particular match, although Japan has won against Germany and Spain, so I would not bet on it.
Greece winning the European Championship was crazy but I supported them all along.
Japan-Croatia is unpredictable. I expect a terrific match.
Quote from: Florestan on December 05, 2022, 01:43:46 AMGreece winning the European Championship was crazy but I supported them all along.
Japan-Croatia is unpredictable. I expect a terrific match.
When are Japan and Croatia playing?
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 05, 2022, 01:48:56 AMWhen are Japan and Croatia playing?
PD
17:00 Romanian time which is 10:00 in Washington, DC. Hope that helps.
Quote from: Florestan on December 05, 2022, 01:53:47 AM17:00 Romanian time which is 10:00 in Washington, DC. Hope that helps.
Yep! Thank you. :)
PD
Japan were utterly brilliant in the first half and I'm very disappointed they only had one goal to show for it.
There was reportedly a second match. You wouldn't know...
^ Nice game, good players and nice referee. The better team won.
Great job by Morocco today...particularly by Bono! Feel for the Spanish team, but that's how it goes somedays.
PD
Greatest surprise. So far.
what a crazy game...
Quote from: Papy Oli on December 06, 2022, 08:56:33 AMwhat a crazy game...
The Spaniards did not lose at penalty kicks. They lost during regular time.
That was utterly tedious at times.
I haven't watched the second match, but know the result. I'll watch it later. The goals will make up for the first match.
Quote from: Madiel on December 06, 2022, 12:37:52 PMThat was utterly tedious at times.
I haven't watched the second match, but know the result. I'll watch it later. The goals will make up for the first match.
I thoroughly enjoyed the game. A master class in defending by Morocco.
Morocco were not the problem.
Netherlands - Argentina
Croatia - Brazil
England - France
Morocco - Portugal
Place your bets, ladies and gents 8)
Quote from: Papy Oli on December 07, 2022, 01:05:07 AMNetherlands - Argentina
Croatia - Brazil
England - France
Morocco - Portugal
Place your bets, ladies and gents 8)
1-X-2 for all of them. ;D
Quote from: Jo498 on December 04, 2022, 11:36:52 PMat least one underdog will have to advance to the quarter finals from Japan vs. Croatia. Of the other 3 matches, I'd probably least surprised by the Swiss beating Portugal.
In retrospect this is quite funny. An underdog it was, only not from that match. And poor Switzerland, they stood no chance whatsoever.
Quote from: Florestan on December 07, 2022, 01:09:08 AM1-X-2 for all of them. ;D
smarty pants >:D
I'll have a go:
Netherlands
Brazil
France
Portugal
Quote from: Papy Oli on December 07, 2022, 01:12:53 AMsmarty pants >:D
I'll have a go:
Netherlands
Brazil
France
Portugal
Theoretically speaking, you are correct. We shall see.
Quote from: Florestan on December 07, 2022, 01:12:01 AMIn retrospect this is quite funny. An underdog it was, only not from that match. And poor Switzerland, they stood no chance whatsoever.
Admittedly, I had not seen any of their matches this time, the hunch was more based on general lack of reliability in case of Portugal and the comparable success of the Swiss of the last few tournaments.
Quote from: Jo498 on December 07, 2022, 01:29:24 AMAdmittedly, I had not seen any of their matches this time, the hunch was more based on general lack of reliability in case of Portugal and the comparable success of the Swiss of the last few tournaments.
I think Portugal played better without Ronaldo. ;D
Quote from: Florestan on December 07, 2022, 01:31:53 AMI think Portugal played better without Ronaldo. ;D
Oh, they were better without him by a mile! In Ronaldo's absence everyone seems to feel free, instead of being constantly stuck in the "let's look for Ronaldo" mode or risk the stare, the head shake or the rolling of the eyes from The Big Ego. Nothing better than his replacement, in his first ever start for the National Team, scoring a hat trick!
Quote from: springrite on December 07, 2022, 06:21:28 AMOh, they were better without him by a mile! In Ronaldo's absence everyone seems to feel free, instead of being constantly stuck in the "let's look for Ronaldo" mode or risk the stare, the head shake or the rolling of the eyes from The Big Ego. Nothing better than his replacement, in his first ever start for the National Team, scoring a hat trick!
Yep, that's precisely what I meant but was too lazy to write in full. Plus Pepe, 3 years older than Ronaldo, making a great match and scoring is yet another blow in Ronaldo's face.
Quote from: Papy Oli on December 07, 2022, 01:12:53 AMsmarty pants >:D
I'll have a go:
Netherlands
Brazil
France
Portugal
It's not coming home then, Olivier. :(
Quote from: Irons on December 07, 2022, 06:55:26 AMIt's not coming home then, Olivier. :(
It might do, Lol, it might do... I am just not particularly keen on the idea of us losing to England on Saturday ;)
By all means, you can continue your much deserved team progression...just at another time against somebody else :D ;D
Quote from: Papy Oli on December 07, 2022, 07:23:33 AMIt might do, Lol, it might do... I am just not particularly keen on the idea of us losing to England on Saturday ;)
By all means, you can continue your much deserved team progression...just at another time against somebody else :D ;D
We get all exited but always ends in tears. So yes, France on Saturday.
Some fans abroad find "Football's Coming Home" annoying. They don't get the irony of the song that England never wins anything.
https://youtu.be/RJqimlFcJsM
Must admit that I was quite impressed by the way that the Portuguese players played--particularly some amazing jumping and scoring going on; rather a "Take-no-prisoners/No-messing-around" kind of attitude.
Heard that Ronaldo will reportedly be getting $200,000,000 US dollars per season for playing for the Saudis. :o
PD
Quote from: Irons on December 07, 2022, 08:19:52 AMWe get all exited but always ends in tears. So yes, France on Saturday.
Some fans abroad find "Football's Coming Home" annoying. They don't get the irony of the song that England never wins anything.
https://youtu.be/RJqimlFcJsM
That irony did got tiresome at times though, and I have only been on this side for nearly 25 years... ;D
Credit where it's due, Southgate is at least managing to move gradually away from the traumas that the English supporters have wallowed in over the last decade or three or five...(whilst he himself epitomised one of those traumatic times but he has learnt from it in the best way and is passing it on to his players). The way he has reshaped the English team, away from the club cliques within, being given time to develop players is bearing its fruits in the last 2-3 years. There is definitely a noticeable shift there.
To be honest, I am quite worried by Foden, Bellingham and Saka at least. They will create havoc in our makeshift defence (Kounde had a severe wobble for us). On the flip side, I am not too worried by Stones or Maguire (Walker is a much harder proposition).
The over-focus on Mbappé might actually serve us and allow Griezman, Giroud and Dembele more liberty in the game. Mbappé was quite well controlled in the first 20-30 minutes against Poland then he eventually found a way. He is a gem of a player but the over-reliance on him or towards him could be our downfall too.
Quote from: Irons on December 07, 2022, 08:19:52 AMWe get all exited but always ends in tears. So yes, France on Saturday.
Some fans abroad find "Football's Coming Home" annoying. They don't get the irony of the song that England never wins anything.
https://youtu.be/RJqimlFcJsM
I hadn't heard that song/seen that video before. When was that recorded?
PD
Quote from: Papy Oli on December 07, 2022, 08:42:56 AMThat irony did got tiresome at times though, and I have only been on this side for nearly 25 years... ;D
Credit where it's due, Southgate is at least managing to move gradually away from the traumas that the English supporters have wallowed in over the last decade or three or five...(whilst he himself epitomised one of those traumatic times but he has learnt from it in the best way and is passing it on to his players). The way he has reshaped the English team, away from the club cliques within, being given time to develop players is bearing its fruits in the last 2-3 years. There is definitely a noticeable shift there.
To be honest, I am quite worried by Foden, Bellingham and Saka at least. They will create havoc in our makeshift defence (Kounde had a severe wobble for us). On the flip side, I am not too worried by Stones or Maguire (Walker is a much harder proposition).
The over-focus on Mbappé might actually serve us and allow Griezman, Giroud and Dembele more liberty in the game. Mbappé was quite well controlled in the first 20-30 minutes against Poland then he eventually found a way. He is a gem of a player but the over-reliance on him or towards him could be our downfall too.
Someone made a valid point that Southgate wins games he is expected to, but has never won a game when England are not favourites to do so. I am looking forward to Saturday though as I think it could be a cracking game.
Hopefully England will not give Mbappé the space afforded to him by Poland.
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 07, 2022, 09:29:57 AMI hadn't heard that song/seen that video before. When was that recorded?
PD
Ages ago. David Baddiel and Frank Skinner are old men now. ;)
A lady choir sing a reserved rendition of "Football's Coming Home" https://youtu.be/80USjBrDX4U
Quote from: Irons on December 08, 2022, 01:32:28 AMAges ago. David Baddiel and Frank Skinner are old men now. ;)
A lady choir sing a reserved rendition of "Football's Coming Home" https://youtu.be/80USjBrDX4U
I saw that lady choir video shortly after their live performance. :D And well done to them!
Speaking of female football teams, I'm very proud of these women: Winning both on the pitch and off (like as in fighting for equal pay for female soccer players--see lawsuit against the US Soccer Federation) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_women's_national_soccer_team
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 08, 2022, 01:52:37 AMI saw that lady choir video shortly after their live performance. :D And well done to them!
Speaking of female football teams, I'm very proud of these women: Winning both on the pitch and off (like as in fighting for equal pay for female soccer players--see lawsuit against the US Soccer Federation) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_women's_national_soccer_team
PD
You are right to be proud of them, PD. USA led the way in ladies football with European teams only just catching up. The American captain, with the coloured hair her name escapes me, is a great ambassador for the sport and speaks much sense. As for equal pay, gender should not come into it if female football fills stadiums and television companies pay for it then of course they must be paid to reflect that.
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 07, 2022, 08:30:10 AMMust admit that I was quite impressed by the way that the Portuguese players played--particularly some amazing jumping and scoring going on; rather a "Take-no-prisoners/No-messing-around" kind of attitude.
Heard that Ronaldo will reportedly be getting $200,000,000 US dollars per season for playing for the Saudis. :o
PD
Agreed, the Portuguese national team has many technical players who can create a fine, brilliant playing, very enjoyable to watch.
That would be a very rich offer, but if Ronaldo accepted, he would be cut out from the first-rate football; I think he is too egocentric to do that. Not that now there are many teams wanting to offer him a contract anyway....
Quote from: Irons on December 08, 2022, 08:10:04 AMYou are right to be proud of them, PD. USA led the way in ladies football with European teams only just catching up. The American captain, with the coloured hair her name escapes me, is a great ambassador for the sport and speaks much sense. As for equal pay, *gender should not come into it if female football fills stadiums and television companies pay for it then of course they must be paid to reflect that.
I almost typed "Rapina?"...glad that I double-checked. I suspect that you were referring to Megan Rapinoe?
Speaking of women's sports, did you see how packed Serena Williams' final matches were? :D
Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 08, 2022, 08:37:44 AMAgreed, the Portuguese national team has many technical players who can create a fine, brilliant playing, very enjoyable to watch.
That would be a very rich offer, but if Ronaldo accepted, he would be cut out from the first-rate football; I think he is too egocentric to do that. Not that now there are many teams wanting to offer him a contract anyway....
I found this recent article: https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/fifa-world-cup/world-will-take-note-saudi-fans-on-ronaldo-link-to-local-club/ar-AA152PqM
How much longer do you think that he could last in terms of still being able to play well and for the top teams? I believe that he's 37 now? I did notice, however, that one of the older players...I want to say his name was Pedro?? Well, after him scoring a goal, the commentators made note of that and his age (39). And any idea of what was his then current contract like?
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 08, 2022, 08:44:56 AMSpeaking of women's sports, did you see how packed Serena Williams' final matches were? :D
I found this recent article: https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/fifa-world-cup/world-will-take-note-saudi-fans-on-ronaldo-link-to-local-club/ar-AA152PqM
How much longer do you think that he could last in terms of still being able to play well and for the top teams? I believe that he's 37 now? I did notice, however, that one of the older players...I want to say his name was Pedro?? Well, after him scoring a goal, the commentators made note of that and his age (39). And any idea of what was his then current contract like?
PD
Well, I think it's not very easy to say, because Ronaldo always trains a lot and takes care of his body maniacally, but certainly not many, age is starting to weigh for him too: he doesn't move on the field as he did before, he misses goals and doesn't serve final passages to his teammates, and moreover, he has poor teamworking and often conplains if he doesn't win; last summer his agent tried to find him another team, he asked everywhere, but it seemed none was interested.
Yes, Pepe scored, he currently plays for F.C. Porto.
I strongly support Argentina against The Netherlands. In all other matches I have no preference.
Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 08, 2022, 09:20:57 AMWell, I think it's not very easy to say, because Ronaldo always trains a lot and takes care of his body maniacally, but certainly not many, age is starting to weigh for him too: he doesn't move on the field as he did before, he misses goals and doesn't serve final passages to his teammates, and moreover, he has poor teamworking and often conplains if he doesn't win; last summer his agent tried to find him another team, he asked everywhere, but it seemed none was interested.
Yes, Pepe scored, he currently plays for F.C. Porto.
Yes, age catches up with us all eventually. Sorry to hear that he's not a team player, etc. I haven't followed his career (other than knowing his name and that he had a lot of fans and was very talented). At least according to that article, it sounds like he's going to go for that deal (Who knows though what the actual numbers are?). We'll find out eventually.
PD
The Croatians were fantastic and absolutely deserved their qualification.
Go, Argentina!
Quote from: Florestan on December 09, 2022, 09:52:50 AMGo, Argentina!
Yessss!!!! Take that, The Netherlands!!! Take that!!!
Both of the results arguably went the way I would like (although I had Brazil in the office sweep)... but gosh it was tight.
Croatia's ability to cope with being behind, across 2 World Cups, is really quite remarkable. Whoever their psychologist is should be sought after worldwide.
This World Cup keeps giving and giving. As a scribe once said "You couldn't make it up".
The second Netherlands goal was an act of pure genius.
Quote from: Irons on December 10, 2022, 12:47:37 AMThe second Netherlands goal was an act of pure genius.
Indeed. Our commentator was waxing lyrical about having basically never seen that tactic before. Which is exactly why it worked. The Argentines hadn't seen it either!
Quote from: Madiel on December 10, 2022, 01:21:05 AMIndeed. Our commentator was waxing lyrical about having basically never seen that tactic before. Which is exactly why it worked. The Argentines hadn't seen it either!
It was very clever!
Apart from a few moments I thought Argentine - Netherlands was a plug ugly game, a yellow card festival.
The Dutch played nothing until their first goal, after which they played very well. Overall, though, Argentina played better and deserved to go further. My anti-Netherlands stance has a reason which has got nothing to do with the team itself; I even felt a little sorry for them, because they really tried hard.
Quote from: Herman on December 10, 2022, 02:23:39 AMApart from a few moments I thought Argentine - Netherlands was a plug ugly game, a yellow card festival.
Well, that was the worst refereeing performance I have seen in a long long time. He totally lost control of the game. Messi got kicked and knocked down so many times with no cards for the offending players, yet Argentinian players received cards for complaining about the fouls. As it turned out, many of Argentinian yellow cards were for cussing at the referee. They were essentially penalized for speaking Spanish (the ref is from Spain) and not Dutch. The Dutch players had the advantage of cussing in a language the ref did not understand.
You know the referee did a bad job when BOTH sides were angry and upset.
Quote from: springrite on December 10, 2022, 06:23:25 AMWell, that was the worst refereeing performance I have seen in a long long time. He totally lost control of the game. Messi got kicked and knocked down so many times with no cards for the offending players, yet Argentinian players received cards for complaining about the fouls. As it turned out, many of Argentinian yellow cards were for cussing at the referee. They were essentially penalized for speaking Spanish (the ref is from Spain) and not Dutch. The Dutch players had the advantage of cussing in a language the ref did not understand.
Haha, love it. I have heard many people say just the opposite, and especially that Messi could do anything, just because he was Famous Messi. In general I thought the referee was an interesting example of the lesson 'the more you punish, the more people will transgress.'
Anyone for a final Croatia - Morocco? ;D
No, such a final would be 0:0 after extension, I fear. While it was not undeserved, Morocco was very lucky to keep their advantage. Portugal has again turned out to be an uneven and unlucky team. Their only lucky win was the Euro final vs. France (but I am not sure that this balanced out their debacles vs. Greece earlier).
Quote from: Florestan on December 10, 2022, 08:00:18 AMAnyone for a final Croatia - Morocco? ;D
I would love a Croatia - Morocco final and an Argentina - France third place match. The only problem with that final is that I wouldn't know who to cheer for. (Perhaps Croatia since they lost so nobly last time.)
Anyway: three cheers for Morocco!!
I took such schadenfreude from the sight of Cristiano Ronaldo abandoning all his teammates and sulking off the field alone while everyone else consoled each other.
Quote from: Jo498 on December 10, 2022, 08:13:23 AMNo, such a final would be 0:0 after extension, I fear.
This is quite possible, both are elite defensive teams that counterattack only when given opportunity, and they might well combine to make for some uneventful play.
Quote from: Jo498 on December 10, 2022, 08:13:23 AMsuch a final would be 0:0 after extension,
Which, of course, could happen in
any final. ;)
To be fair to Morocco, they have scored decisive wins against Portugal and Belgium, and only went to shootout against Spain, while Croatia has gone to two penalty shootouts this tournament (after doing the same last time).
But Croatia and Morocco have already played each other to 0-0 in the group stage...
Quote from: Brian on December 10, 2022, 08:14:16 AMI would love a Croatia - Morocco final and an Argentina - France third place match. The only problem with that final is that I wouldn't know who to cheer for. (Perhaps Croatia since they lost so nobly last time.)
Anyway: three cheers for Morocco!!
I took such schadenfreude from the sight of Cristiano Ronaldo abandoning all his teammates and sulking off the field alone while everyone else consoled each other.
I was very impressed the other day when I saw Luka Modric consoling a young Brazilian player...spending a while holding him and talking to him. Great sportsmanship and compassion.
Didn't see Ronaldo walking off...wow! Really was that bad, Brian?
Enjoyed a piece on Harry Kane a few minutes ago (leading up to the current match).
And looking forward to watching Mbappe play!
PD
Quote from: Brian on December 10, 2022, 08:14:16 AMI took such schadenfreude from the sight of Cristiano Ronaldo abandoning all his teammates and sulking off the field alone while everyone else consoled each other.
His egotism is indeed something else. Still, his frustration is fully understandable: this is the last WC for him.
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 10, 2022, 09:03:38 AMDidn't see Ronaldo walking off
He was crying like a baby, consoled by each and every person crossing his way.
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 10, 2022, 09:03:38 AMLuka Modric
He's exactly the same age as Ronaldo, 37 --- but his physical condition and psychological stamina are greater than Ronaldo's and he's much more a team player.
I will support
Croatia for the title, not least because they are a fellow Eastern European, former Communist country --- I am sick and tired of Western European arrogance and smugness. And I will have my fingers crossed for a Croatia - Morocco final.
Morocco were excellent.
France can count themselves bloody lucky. Commentators here agreed that their first goal was preceded by a foul. England were all over them for much of the match.
Quote from: Florestan on December 10, 2022, 10:55:34 AMHe was crying like a baby, consoled by each and every person crossing his way.
Not quite true, did you see he shoved one person out of the way?
Random thought: a Croatia-Morocco final would make Belgium's failure look a hell of a lot better.
I always said it was the toughest group...
Quote from: Florestan on December 10, 2022, 11:03:45 AMHe's exactly the same age as Ronaldo, 37 --- but his physical condition and psychological stamina are greater than Ronaldo's and he's much more a team player.
I will support Croatia for the title, not least because they are a fellow Eastern European, former Communist country --- I am sick and tired of Western European arrogance and smugness. And I will have my fingers crossed for a Croatia - Morocco final.
Not much smugness here as England invariably lose at this stage, as happened last night.
Must admit like my fellow compatriots feeling gutted. Not for the first time a good show but not quite good enough. We did a job on Mbappé, but as Olivier sagely predicted France had another ace up their sleeve named Griezmann who I thought MOTM. I have no love for our local rivals Spurs, but do not blame Kane at all for penalty miss. Any other keeper he would have scored, but Kane although already putting one past Lloris was spooked and overthinking it by facing a keeper taking pens training at club level. I thought the referee gave a shocking performance - how on earth did he need VAR to instruct him to award the second pen? Giroud is a gentleman and Mbappé isn't.
Quote from: Irons on December 11, 2022, 01:17:23 AMMust admit like my fellow compatriots feeling gutted. Not for the first time a good show but not quite good enough. We did a job on Mbappé, but as Olivier sagely predicted France had another ace up their sleeve named Griezmann who I thought MOTM. I have no love for our local rivals Spurs, but do not blame Kane at all for penalty miss. Any other keeper he would have scored, but Kane although already putting one past Lloris was spooked and overthinking it by facing a keeper taking pens training at club level. I thought the referee gave a shocking performance - how on earth did he need VAR to instruct him to award the second pen? Giroud is a gentleman and Mbappé isn't.
My brother was so convinced, after all the hype, that England would lose that he didn't watch the match and went to a local performance of Handel's 'Messiah' instead. I don't blame Kane either - easy to be wise after the event but maybe someone else should have taken the second penalty (maybe Mount who was fouled).
Quote from: vandermolen on December 11, 2022, 01:30:21 AMMy brother was so convinced, after all the hype, that England would lose that he didn't watch the match and went to a local performance of Handel's 'Messiah' instead. I don't blame Kane either - easy to be wise after the event but maybe someone else should have taken the second penalty (maybe Mount who was fouled).
In a way a blessing for me Jeffrey as I will miss the final whoever playing. It is easy, as you say, to be wise after the event but isn't it Southgate's job to give serious thought to such possible outcomes. He is paid enough.
Quote from: Brian on December 10, 2022, 05:32:33 PMdid you see he shoved one person out of the way
I missed that. I only saw two or three people patting him on the back.
Quote from: vandermolen on December 11, 2022, 01:30:21 AMmaybe someone else should have taken the second penalty
Precisely. The coach should not have allowed Kane to take it.
I felt for Kane after missing his penalty kick; he must have been gutted. And my sympathies to those who were rooting for England.
Well, looking forward to watching Croatia play Argentina.
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 11, 2022, 04:45:52 AMI felt for Kane after missing his penalty kick; he must have been gutted. And my sympathies to those who were rooting for England.
Well, looking forward to watching Croatia play Argentina.
PD
Thank you PD :)
Bonjour,
Job done.
Job done.
One job left.
;D 8)
This is hopefully going to be a pretty good final. Morocco seemed stronger than Croatia (the latter were a bit down because of the early penalty, I think) so it's hard to pick a favorite.
However spurious, stats are against the defending champion; this worked only once in the postwar era (Brazil 1958 + 62, and before Italy 1934 + 38). Often defending champions do poorly the next time, again only Brazil managed to reach the final as defending champion, AFAIS: 1994 + 98.
In the long run the favorites dominate these tournaments. There are only two teams who won only once (England 1966, Spain 2010) but 3 with four or more, and there will be again a 3 star team after the final.
My general feeling last night was the utter disbelief and appreciation that France has now reached the WC final 4 times in the last 7 WC. Definitely counting our blessings, It more than makes up for the "failings" of the Platini generation and then the ghostly early 90's.
It'll be much tougher against the Argentinians with our makeshift back four being the concern. Messi might just bottle it on the day ;D
The Platini generation had bad luck in the WC as the Germans both times played their best match of the tournament against them. (And there was also one action by the German keeper during that legendary match 1982 that would have meant a red card later on but back then, some rough action was accepted.) At least they won Euros in 1984.
Quote from: Jo498 on December 15, 2022, 03:26:37 AMthere was also one action by the German keeper during that legendary match 1982 that would have meant a red card later on
That savage attack of Schumacher against Battiston (which resulted in the latter's losing a few teeths) should have been punished not only by a red card but by a temporary suspension from all official competitions as well. And his remark to the effect of "I have enough money to replace all the Frenchman's teeth" only showed what an utterly despicable personality Schumacher had.
I noticed that there will be a match to determine third place on Saturday. A couple of questions about this: do many people normally attend this match? And also, does the winner of this round and the finalist on Sunday receive any sort of awards and/or prize money?
As an aside, I was surprised to read about the mess up between Morocco and Qatar regarding extra flights and apparently also conflicting news sources re free tickets. A lot of upset and disappointed fans. :(
PD
Quote from: Florestan on December 15, 2022, 03:38:22 AMThat savage attack of Schumacher against Battiston (which resulted in the latter's losing a few teeths) should have been punished not only by a red card but by a temporary suspension from all official competitions as well. And his remark to the effect of "I have enough money to replace all the Frenchman's teeth" only showed what an utterly despicable personality Schumacher had.
:o
1982 was my "first" WC and I cried a fair bit after that semi-final in Sevilla, just like the wee kids they've shown in the Qatar stadiums this week.
Any mentions of Schumacher, Stielike or Hrubesch still brings a shiver :P
You need those traumatic sport memories though, to really enjoy the later happier times.
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 15, 2022, 03:46:14 AMI noticed that there will be a match to determine third place on Saturday. A couple of questions about this: do many people normally attend this match? And also, does the winner of this round and the finalist on Sunday receive any sort of awards and/or prize money?
As an aside, I was surprised to read about the mess up between Morocco and Qatar regarding extra flights and apparently also conflicting news sources re free tickets. A lot of upset and disappointed fans. :(
PD
The third place match has largely lost its meaning. It used to be that the top 3 teams automatically qualified for the next tournament, so there was a good incentive to finish 3rd rather than 4th. But now it's a bit redundant.
Mind you, the pressure being off can mean some good football.
Yes there is prize money. But 3rd versus 4th doesn't make much difference in the scheme of things.https://sports.yahoo.com/world-cup-prize-money-table-165437791.html
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 15, 2022, 03:46:14 AMI noticed that there will be a match to determine third place on Saturday. A couple of questions about this: do many people normally attend this match? And also, does the winner of this round and the finalist on Sunday receive any sort of awards and/or prize money?
As an aside, I was surprised to read about the mess up between Morocco and Qatar regarding extra flights and apparently also conflicting news sources re free tickets. A lot of upset and disappointed fans. :(
PD
As Madiel says PD, it's a bit of a non-event but I think that the 3rd place team receive a medal.
Quote from: Madiel on December 16, 2022, 02:25:08 AMThe third place match has largely lost its meaning. It used to be that the top 3 teams automatically qualified for the next tournament, so there was a good incentive to finish 3rd rather than 4th. But now it's a bit redundant.
Mind you, the pressure being off can mean some good football.
Yes there is prize money. But 3rd versus 4th doesn't make much difference in the scheme of things.https://sports.yahoo.com/world-cup-prize-money-table-165437791.html
Quote from: vandermolen on December 16, 2022, 02:41:55 AMAs Madiel says PD, it's a bit of a non-event but I think that the 3rd place team receive a medal.
Wow, that's a lot of moolah involved! :o I suspect that the coaches and trainers, etc., also get some sort of bonus/cut out of it?
And how has things changed with regard to the third place and qualifying (Madiel said tournment. By that do you mean next world cup or another event before then?).
PD
There is a pre-tournament qualifying round for everyone. Even the defending champion has to qualify now, the only auto-qualified team is the host nation. Surprises in qualifying are rare but do happen, e.g. Italy missed this time and it also had happened to the Netherlands for the 2002 event (which spawned abundant Schadenfreude in German boulevard press, TV etc. "Ohne Holland fahrn wir zur WM").
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_FIFA_World_Cup_qualification
Quote from: Jo498 on December 16, 2022, 04:34:16 AMThere is a pre-tournament qualifying round for everyone. Even the defending champion has to qualify now, the only auto-qualified team is the host nation. Surprises in qualifying are rare but do happen, e.g. Italy missed this time and it also had happened to the Netherlands for the 2002 event (which spawned abundant Schadenfreude in German boulevard press, TV etc. "Ohne Holland fahrn wir zur WM").
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_FIFA_World_Cup_qualification
Thanks for the info and link Jo! :)
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 15, 2022, 03:46:14 AMI noticed that there will be a match to determine third place on Saturday. A couple of questions about this: do many people normally attend this match? And also, does the winner of this round and the finalist on Sunday receive any sort of awards and/or prize money?
As an aside, I was surprised to read about the mess up between Morocco and Qatar regarding extra flights and apparently also conflicting news sources re free tickets. A lot of upset and disappointed fans. :(
PD
Well, the only World Cup match I ever watched was the (meaningless) third place match in 1994 between Sweden and Bulgaria in the Rose Bowl. The tickets were only $10 and I bought 12 tickets to treat many friends.
We were in the front row, between the corner flag and the goal. We'd have the perfect view for attacking plays and goals at this end.
In the first half, Sweden scored 4 goals, at THE OTHER END. Bulgaria hardly ventured into our end. The Swedish keeper was so bored, he talked to us and even did handstands to amuse the audience and himself. In short, WE SAW NO FOOTBALL.
We hoped that we'd see more action in the second half after the two teams switched ends. However, since Sweden was already 4 goals up, THEY STOPPED ATTACKING! Again, WE SAW NO FOOTBALL!
Anyway, to summarize my World Cup experience: I saw NOTHING.
Well, nothing except the handstands by the Swedish Keeper.
Well for a match that supposedly doesn't mean much, the Moroccans got rather worked up in the second half.
Don't know what happened to France but they are a pale shadow of their former self. Not that I mind it, Messi really deserves to win his last WC match and his last WC. Go, Argentina!
France has tied, 2-2, incredible!
Yes, unbelievable. Two goals in two minutes after they had been playing nothing for 80 minutes. That's the beauty of this game.
Penalty kicks! What a crazy match to end a crazy WC! I love it.
Yes, spectacular!! Let's follow the penalty kicks now....
Argentina have won. 8)
Bravo, Argentina! Bravo, France! A fantastic match, one of the best finals I've ever watched (I watch the WC since 1982). All things considered, Argentina deserves it, Messi deserves it. Congratulations!
And thus ends WC '23, a spectacular one.
Quote from: Florestan on December 18, 2022, 09:02:03 AMBravo, Argentina! Bravo, France! A fantastic match, one of the best finals I've ever watched (I watch the WC since 1982). All things considered, Argentina deserves it, Messi deserves it. Congratulations!
And thus ends WC '23, a spectacular one.
Truly spectacular, one of the best matches I've ever seen. A real emotional ride, so many great moments for individual players, changes of momentum. Thrilling!
Good game, good game...probably fair overall :P
It's been a little bit stressful, not gonna lie ;D ;D
Merci les Bleus.
Good night 8)
Yes, it was deserved. I would have become mad if France had won in the penalties because Argentina was superior during the main match. The three in-game penalties were all for rather soft offenses, especially the "elbow-ball" of the last one.*
Sure, it was great how France got back into the game but they were mostly very disappointing in the first hour.
*This is almost impossible to solve. Penalties should be very rare because there are so few goals in soccer and half of the goals in a match resulting from penalties should almost never occur. On the other hand, if one lets players off with too much, it will be advantage for the more brutal or ruthless team.
It was an incredible rollercoaster.
I was rooting for the French... :-\
Well that was epic.
All the penalties were legitimate I think (certainly our local commentators thought so). The comeback was astonishing, even given how many times this tournament Argentina had lost its grip on a game. And then they recovered. And then France equalised AGAIN.
Certainly the kind of match you want in a final. But in the end, the fairytale came true. Messi's trophy cabinet is completed.
It's interesting (to me) how this World Cup story has been told, and how totally different the story is from what it used to be in the past.
It was all about Messi.
The WC trophy was on Messi's bucket list (a concept that didn't really exist, say, twenty years ago), he had a right to the trophy.
If by some stroke of bad luck he had not won, I don't know what would have happened.
There has been some pretty bad losership and even bad winnership at these games (the stuff at the end of Argentine - Netherlands).
The whole concept of humility in winning is a thing of the past, or so it seems.
Quote from: Herman on December 18, 2022, 11:19:05 PMIt's interesting (to me) how this World Cup story has been told, and how totally different the story is from what it used to be in the past.
It was all about Messi.
The WC trophy was on Messi's bucket list (a concept that didn't really exist, say, twenty years ago), he had a right to the trophy.
If by some stroke of bad luck he had not won, I don't know what would have happened.
There has been some pretty bad losership and even bad winnership at these games (the stuff at the end of Argentine - Netherlands).
The whole concept of humility in winning is a thing of the past, or so it seems.
This is so far from a description of Messi's actual personality that I can only assume you don't actually watch football and are putting your 2 cents in as a casual observer.
There was undoubtedly hype around the man. But you seem to assume that the hype was his own idea.
I doubt anyone (at least not outside Argentina) thought Messi had a "right" to the cup. They weren't even betting favorites, even before the final, France had a (slight, I think) advantage.
As for the penalties within the match, I don't think any of them was clearly wrong but I doubt that any would have been given 20 years ago, almost certainly not all three of them (and I used to find accidental handball penalties rather unfair even then when they were given).
It's very hard to solve; if fewer penalties are given, it could be become more unfair, but half of the goals from penalties should remain a rare ocassion, and I fear that penalties might become far more frequent with the video assistant, and this would change the game clearly for the worse, IMO.
That was not an accidental handball. That was "I am throwing my body in the way quite deliberately and there's a decent chance that my arm is what will be hit".
Quote from: springrite on December 17, 2022, 09:42:40 AMWell, the only World Cup match I ever watched was the (meaningless) third place match in 1994 between Sweden and Bulgaria in the Rose Bowl. The tickets were only $10 and I bought 12 tickets to treat many friends.
We were in the front row, between the corner flag and the goal. We'd have the perfect view for attacking plays and goals at this end.
In the first half, Sweden scored 4 goals, at THE OTHER END. Bulgaria hardly ventured into our end. The Swedish keeper was so bored, he talked to us and even did handstands to amuse the audience and himself. In short, WE SAW NO FOOTBALL.
We hoped that we'd see more action in the second half after the two teams switched ends. However, since Sweden was already 4 goals up, THEY STOPPED ATTACKING! Again, WE SAW NO FOOTBALL!
Anyway, to summarize my World Cup experience: I saw NOTHING.
Well, nothing except the handstands by the Swedish Keeper.
Hope that the handstands were exceptional then! ;)
Did you watch this year's WC...at least the final?
Really enjoyed the final. It was so good that it managed to convince a friend of mine to watch the second half with me; we were going to do some errands and he's extremely time conscience (so to speak). :)
PD
R.I.P. Pelé (Edson Arantes do Nascimento) 1940 - 2022
(https://media-cldnry.s-nbcnews.com/image/upload/t_social_share_1024x768_scale,f_auto,q_auto:best/rockcms/2022-12/221222-pele-brazil-1970-mb-1321-c9ac6b.jpg)
The greatest footballer of all times. May God rest him in peace.
"He was the most complete player: two good feet. Magic in the air. Quick. Powerful. Could beat people with skill, could outrun people. Only 5ft 8in, yet he seemed a giant. Perfect balance and impossible vision".
Bobby Moore, England's 1966 World Cup-winning captain.
Quote from: Irons on December 30, 2022, 06:37:23 AM"He was the most complete player: two good feet. Magic in the air. Quick. Powerful. Could beat people with skill, could outrun people. Only 5ft 8in, yet he seemed a giant. Perfect balance and impossible vision".
Bobby Moore, England's 1966 World Cup-winning captain.
Superb post and picture,
Irons, thanks a lot!
Courtesy of our dear
Karl Henning, take a a look at this:
Quote from: k a rl h e nn i ng on December 29, 2022, 12:53:33 PM
I say, claim and maintain that imnsho the inventivity, playfulness and sheer joy
Pelé displayed in all that he did are on a par with
Haydn's*. They were both geniuses born of humble stock who raised to well-deserved worldwide fame due to their talent, hard work and cheerful, optimistic, childlike nature and faith. I'm sure that right now, up there in Heaven, they are having a good time.
*
John Keats' dictum that "
Haydn is like a child: you never know what he'll do next" applies to
Pelé as well.
I ran across this story (and short video) and thought that you die-hard footie fans might appreciate it. :)
https://www.cnn.com/2023/05/15/football/santiago-ramirez-goal-morelia-celaya-spt-intl/index.html
PD
Semi-final of Champions League, Inter vs Milan.....I'm strung tight as a violin! :-\
Quote from: Lisztianwagner on May 16, 2023, 11:13:56 AMSemi-final of Champions League, Inter vs Milan.....I'm strung tight as a violin! :-\
Who are (or were) you rooting for?
PD
Quote from: Lisztianwagner on May 16, 2023, 12:33:51 PMInter! ;D
Looks like we'll have an Inter - Manchester final.
Quote from: Florestan on May 16, 2023, 12:39:20 PMLooks like we'll have an Inter - Manchester final.
Are Real Madrid and Man City playing too?
Quote from: Lisztianwagner on May 16, 2023, 12:42:45 PMAre Real Madrid and Man City playing too?
Tomorrow în Manchester. First match în Madrid resulted in 1-1. Man has the better chance.
Quote from: Florestan on May 16, 2023, 01:07:46 PMTomorrow în Manchester. First match în Madrid resulted in 1-1. Man has the better chance.
Yes, that's true, but Real Madrid is used to this kind of crucial matches; it's going to be a thrilling final anyway.
Quote from: Lisztianwagner on May 16, 2023, 01:14:33 PMYes, that's true, but Real Madrid is used to this kind of crucial matches; it's going to be a thrilling final anyway.
Agreed. I'm rooting for Man City, though.
Quote from: Lisztianwagner on May 16, 2023, 12:33:51 PMInter! ;D
I'll look to see if I can find the final on t.v. Do you happen to know when it is schedule for?
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on May 16, 2023, 01:26:13 PMI'll look to see if I can find the final on t.v. Do you happen to know when it is schedule for?
PD
June 10, în Istanbul.
Quote from: Florestan on May 16, 2023, 01:29:40 PMJune 10, în Istanbul.
Oh, it's quite a ways away then! In any event, thanks!
PD
Don't bother with all that Champions League stuff! A much more important game this week. My club West Ham, who have not won a trophy since 1980, take a slender one goal advantage to the Netherlands on Thursday for the semi-final Europa Conference second leg against AZ Alkmaar.
COYI
Quote from: Irons on May 17, 2023, 07:17:17 AMDon't bother with all that Champions League stuff! A much more important game this week. My club West Ham, who have not won a trophy since 1980, take a slender one goal advantage to the Netherlands on Thursday for the semi-final Europa Conference second leg against AZ Alkmaar.
COYI
We need you to do well, Lol. Your victory again tomorrow will keep Netherlands away from France in the FIFA points ranking and allows France to keep their three Champions League spots...for now ;D
Quote from: Irons on May 17, 2023, 07:17:17 AMA much more important game this week. My club West Ham, who have not won a trophy since 1980...
Although coming second in the "Gerrard Final" in 2006, probably the greatest FA Cup Final I've ever seen, is worth a lot (or perhaps you don't want to be reminded about surrendering that 2-goal lead).
But, oh dear, that's even longer since a trophy than my team, Coventry City, who last won a "real" cup in '87 (and who are also involved in a game of some significance - tonight). (Not sure about these play-offs, despite our having benefitted from them before - as far as I can see, Luton finished 3rd, so should go up - and probably will.)
Anyway, good luck on Thursday - I used to go to the Orient a lot when I lived in East London, and we liked West Ham, our big brothers down the road.
Quote from: Papy Oli on May 17, 2023, 07:22:25 AMWe need you to do well, Lol. Your victory again tomorrow will keep Netherlands away from France in the FIFA points ranking and allows France to keep their three Champions League spots...for now ;D
Happy to oblige, Olivier.
Quote from: DaveF on May 17, 2023, 08:46:55 AMAlthough coming second in the "Gerrard Final" in 2006, probably the greatest FA Cup Final I've ever seen, is worth a lot (or perhaps you don't want to be reminded about surrendering that 2-goal lead).
But, oh dear, that's even longer since a trophy than my team, Coventry City, who last won a "real" cup in '87 (and who are also involved in a game of some significance - tonight). (Not sure about these play-offs, despite our having benefitted from them before - as far as I can see, Luton finished 3rd, so should go up - and probably will.)
Anyway, good luck on Thursday - I used to go to the Orient a lot when I lived in East London, and we liked West Ham, our big brothers down the road.
That either Coventry or Luton Town will be in the Premier League next season after what both clubs have been through in the last twenty years is mind-blowing. Good luck to them after dispatching much bigger clubs as Sunderland and Middlesbrough.
Quote from: Irons on May 18, 2023, 07:53:29 AMGood luck to them after dispatching much bigger clubs as Sunderland and Middlesbrough.
Thanks - so that's two happy supporters tonight! (And now I appreciate your user-name - not to be confused with "The Iron", otherwise the hapless Scunthorpe United, a club that a good friend of mine spends a lot of his time and money following on their reckless dive into oblivion.)
Quote from: Irons on May 17, 2023, 07:17:17 AMDon't bother with all that Champions League stuff! A much more important game this week. My club West Ham, who have not won a trophy since 1980, take a slender one goal advantage to the Netherlands on Thursday for the semi-final Europa Conference second leg against AZ Alkmaar.
COYI
Your team sure left it very late last night, Irons. Enjoy the final! ;D
Moyes deserves something going his way, on top of already keeping West Ham up. The way he was treated at Man U was despicable, when he turned out to be the pick of all their successive useless coaches. Just for not being as "fashionable" as some of them.
Quote from: Papy Oli on May 19, 2023, 02:43:36 AMYour team sure left it very late last night, Irons. Enjoy the final! ;D
Moyes deserves something going his way, on top of already keeping West Ham up. The way he was treated at Man U was despicable, when he turned out to be the pick of all their successive useless coaches. Just for not being as "fashionable" as some of them.
My joy was somewhat tempered Olivier by the disgraceful scenes at the end of the match when the AZ Ultras attacked the West Ham family and friends section. It took the bravery of a 58 year old man recovering from hip replacement who stood at the top of the stairwell and used his fists to stop the thugs entering a section including David Moyes 87 year old father. If they had got in I dread to think of the outcome.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/22409485/west-ham-fan-az-alkmaar-hooligans-fight/
Quote from: Irons on May 20, 2023, 01:17:42 AMMy joy was somewhat tempered Olivier by the disgraceful scenes at the end of the match when the AZ Ultras attacked the West Ham family and friends section. It took the bravery of a 58 year old man recovering from hip replacement who stood at the top of the stairwell and used his fists to stop the thugs entering a section including David Moyes 87 year old father. If they had got in I dread to think of the outcome.
A cometh the cometh the man moment.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/22409485/west-ham-fan-az-alkmaar-hooligans-fight/
I can imagine. That was just disgraceful. Here's hoping for strong sanctions against those AZ "supporters".
in happier notes, for this household, Ipswich is finally back in the Championship and Bordeaux has got its destiny in its hands with 3 games for promotion back to Ligue 1 as well but it gets edgier and edgier. Arsenal gave us too many hopes in the last few months and they dropped too many points and it is as good as over. The silver lining is that they are back in Champions League and their young team was the only one this season to be on par with Man city. Maybe City will have some points deductions for those 115 financial fair-play breaches at some point >:D
And what about that Sheffield Wed - POSH play off second leg!!! 4-0, 1-5, Sheffield on penalties... Jesus!!!
So, Champions League final: Man City vs. Inter Milano. Whom do you root for? My 10yo son is a big fan of MC so he has high hopes. :D
Quote from: Irons on May 18, 2023, 07:53:29 AMHappy to oblige, Olivier.
That either Coventry or Luton Town will be in the Premier League next season after what both clubs have been through in the last twenty years is mind-blowing. Good luck to them after dispatching much bigger clubs as Sunderland and Middlesbrough.
I hadn't kept up with this. Sunderland and Middlesbrough BOTH lost? Wow!
EDIT: Actually looking back at the table/season you'd have to think Luton was the favourite to get through. Difficult to beat.
Quote from: Florestan on May 20, 2023, 06:45:56 AMSo, Champions League final: Man City vs. Inter Milano. Whom do you root for? My 10yo son is a big fan of MC so he has high hopes. :D
100%
Inter, my favourite football team; we won't start with the favors of the prediction, but football is a wonderful sport because it can be unpredictable.
Just settling down to the Championship Play-Off final (on Sky, not at Wembley, sadly) - Coventry v Luton - beers lined up, lucky T-shirt from the 1987 FA Cup Final on - what could possibly go wrong?
Quote from: DaveF on May 27, 2023, 07:31:24 AMJust settling down to the Championship Play-Off final (on Sky, not at Wembley, sadly) - Coventry v Luton - beers lined up, lucky T-shirt from the 1987 FA Cup Final on - what could possibly go wrong?
It did and I feel your pain. I feel so sorry for your man who skied his penalty. £150 million up the swanee in an instant. Attempting to console him I would say it is often the case the team that fail one year are successful the following season.
Quote from: Irons on May 28, 2023, 06:14:49 AMIt did and I feel your pain. I feel so sorry for your man who skied his penalty. £150 million up the swanee in an instant. Attempting to console him I would say it is often the case the team that fail one year are successful the following season.
Thank you - typical Sky Blues' performance in many ways - seemed not to have got out of bed in the first half, followed by a lot of frantic semi-skilled effort in the second. I'm not a great fan of the playoffs, in fact - Luton finished 10 points ahead of us, so deserved to go up. But it does the heart good to see us half-filling Wembley, which we even managed 5 years ago for the League 2 final (I was there that time). No idea what will happen next season - Gyökeres will certainly leave, perhaps Hamer, so a busy summer ahead for Mr Robins. Looking forward already...
The interesting thing for Luton is the funds available to them? Kennilworth Rd does not meet EPL guidelines for a stadium so they'll have to spend money there as well as trying to buy the players they need to stay up.
I was in Much Wenlock, a village in the Midlands, the day Aston Villa did the same as Luton in 2019. Thanks to a VPN and my Fox Sports connection (they've since closed that loophole) I got to watch it on my iPad live in The Gaskell Arms. I had quite a few people peering over my shoulder and they were happy to buy me a beer or two for letting them watch it as the pub didn't subscribe BT Sport. Thanks also to Apple's personal hotspot.
Quote from: Holden on May 29, 2023, 12:42:30 AMThe interesting thing for Luton is the funds available to them? Kennilworth Rd does not meet EPL guidelines for a stadium so they'll have to spend money there as well as trying to buy the players they need to stay up.
I was in Much Wenlock, a village in the Midlands, the day Aston Villa did the same as Luton in 2019. Thanks to a VPN and my Fox Sports connection (they've since closed that loophole) I got to watch it on my iPad live in The Gaskell Arms. I had quite a few people peering over my shoulder and they were happy to buy me a beer or two for letting them watch it as the pub didn't subscribe BT Sport. Thanks also to Apple's personal hotspot.
That is what makes the Premier League what it is and why the fans said no thank you very much to a European Super League. The thought of the Sky elite six - seven now Newcastle United are owned by an Arab state - turning up at Kenilworth Road and their reaction does raise a smile.
None of the promoted clubs last season were relegated this, so Luton have a fighting chance.
Quote from: Irons on May 28, 2023, 06:14:49 AMIt did and I feel your pain. I feel so sorry for your man who skied his penalty. £150 million up the swanee in an instant. Attempting to console him I would say it is often the case the team that fail one year are successful the following season.
I'm trying to interpret your comments...ah! Think that I figured it out (at least partially)...so someone missed their penalty kick? And I suspect that the winning team earns a lot of money (but 150 million pounds?!)?
Two cents if you can guess what I've been watching lately! When they actually show it on either t.v. or online (Oh, brother!).
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on May 29, 2023, 09:56:29 AMI'm trying to interpret your comments...ah! Think that I figured it out (at least partially)...so someone missed their penalty kick? And I suspect that the winning team earns a lot of money (but 150 million pounds?!)?
Two cents if you can guess what I've been watching lately! When they actually show it on either t.v. or online (Oh, brother!).
PD
I will try to be brief, PD. Two teams are automatically promoted to the promised land (EPL) and after a play-off process two teams, this year Luton and Coventry who both incidentally have both teetered on the brink of extinction not so long ago, contest the final promotion place playing each other at Wembley. A fixture I enjoy very much is described as the richest game in world football. The winner is promoted to the EPL and the riches that brings and the loser get's nothing. A close game between Luton and Coventry finished I-1 after extra time so the only way to come up with a winner was penalties (watch here https://youtu.be/xQK1oNoadgA ).
Quote from: Irons on May 30, 2023, 07:01:19 AMso the only way to come up with a winner was penalties (watch here https://youtu.be/xQK1oNoadgA ).
I can never bring myself to watch penalty shoot-outs past the first or second penalty, even ones I have nothing invested in. They just seem too cruel.
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on May 29, 2023, 09:56:29 AM...so someone missed their penalty kick?
He did, and apparently came in for a lot of (racist) abuse online. The club (Coventry City) naturally condemned the abuse, offered him (Fankaty Dabo) their full support - then a couple of days later terminated his contract. OK, he's had a fair bit of time out injured, but has been one of our most reliable players, at both right- and left-back. So a bit hard to understand at the moment.
Quote from: Irons on May 30, 2023, 07:01:19 AMI will try to be brief, PD. Two teams are automatically promoted to the promised land (EPL) and after a play-off process two teams, this year Luton and Coventry who both incidentally have both teetered on the brink of extinction not so long ago, contest the final promotion place playing each other at Wembley. A fixture I enjoy very much is described as the richest game in world football. The winner is promoted to the EPL and the riches that brings and the loser get's nothing. A close game between Luton and Coventry finished I-1 after extra time so the only way to come up with a winner was penalties (watch here https://youtu.be/xQK1oNoadgA ).
Thanks. So is this an annual event? And how many teams vie for entering the EPL?
PD
Waits patiently for someone to explain the whole concept of promotion and regulation to an American... ;D
I don't know how many tiers of football clubs there are in the English system. At least 5 or 6 professional tiers? Then several more below that.
The American model of franchises, that might be bought and sold across cities but are fundamentally secure in their league, is completely alien to how football/soccer works in Europe. There are thousands of clubs dreaming of their ability to rise up the ranks.
I'll do that.
There are four professional and at least four semi professional leagues in the UK and they operate in a tier system. The Premier league is the highest and the lowest professional league is called League Two.
Let's look at Luton Town who have just been promoted to the Premier League. A few years ago they were in the National League (top semi pro league) and won promotion to League Two by coming either first or second in the NL. Over the last few years they have been promoted through League One, The Championship (where they were this year) and next Year will be in the EPL for the first time. This is the most lucrative league because of TV broadcast rights.
Luton weren't automatically promoted. The first two teams in the Championship (Burnley and Sheffield United) won automatic promotion and the next four teams had a knock out play off series to fill the third EPL promotion spot. Luton, who finished third beat the sixth place team over a two leg semi final play off and then beat Coventry, the other semi final winner, in a sudden death one off final at Wembley.
All the leagues have this system. The bottom three EPL teams (Leeds, Leicester and Southampton) drop down to the Championship.
I understand what I've written and I'm hoping you do too.
Quote from: Holden on May 30, 2023, 07:22:56 PMI'll do that.
There are four professional and at least four semi professional leagues in the UK and they operate in a tier system. The Premier league is the highest and the lowest professional league is called League Two.
Let's look at Luton Town who have just been promoted to the Premier League. A few years ago they were in the National League (top semi pro league) and won promotion to League Two by coming either first or second in the NL. Over the last few years they have been promoted through League One, The Championship (where they were this year) and next Year will be in the EPL for the first time. This is the most lucrative league because of TV broadcast rights.
Luton weren't automatically promoted. The first two teams in the Championship (Burnley and Sheffield United) won automatic promotion and the next four teams had a knock out play off series to fill the third EPL promotion spot. Luton, who finished third beat the sixth place team over a two leg semi final play off and then beat Coventry, the other semi final winner, in a sudden death one off final at Wembley.
All the leagues have this system. The bottom three EPL teams (Leeds, Leicester and Southampton) drop down to the Championship.
I understand what I've written and I'm hoping you do too.
Thank you! That was extremely helpful! :)
PD
How is that for a peculiar football evening:
Last night was the last game of the season in the French Ligue 2 (second division). For full fairness and equality between the clubs, the last 2-3 games are always played at the same time on the same day.
3 clubs are fighting for the top 2 promotion spots to Ligue 1:
Le Havre 72 pts
Metz 69 pts
and my club Bordeaux 69 pts (Goal difference of -3 compared to Metz)
Le Havre was up to 10 pts clear a few weeks ago and kept dropping points
Bordeaux was up to 9 points clear in second and kept dropping points
It all came down to last night's game.
For a bit of context, Bordeaux has been in steady sporting decline in the last decade when some dodgy American investors bought the club circa 2019. Last season, Bordeaux got relegated to Ligue 2 on the pitch but the mismanagement of the club and other internal tension and scandals took it to the brink of bankruptcy last July, with a looming liquidation and relegation to 5th tier football i.e the top tier of amateur football.
A buyer came through (a controversial one at that because he has bought other clubs on the brink before with some dodgy dealings, hence not a favourable reputation in the Ligue anyway) and bought the club last August. With only 2 days before the start of this season did he get the final confirmation from the league and financial authorities that we could play and play in Ligue 2 (and not further down). That meant selling our "best" (non-performing evidently) players and building the new team on mostly academy youngsters, a couple of seasoned players from Ligue 2 and a couple of key players that decided to stay at the club regardless to fight back, after accepting a 50% pay cut to help the club's finances (another 19 year old promising youngster reluctantly accepted to be sold to Southampton for 11 million euros, knowing that amount would definitely save his formative club).
The season felt like a miracle to us all if only for existing and it was a clean slate with the supporters now fully backing the mostly inexperienced team. it obviously took some time to gel and with lots of ups and downs, we eventually settled in the top three. Last bit of context, all season, for cost management reasons, the stadium capacity was kept at half, to 22K, still making it one of the biggest ligue 2 attendances.
To last night.
Knowing how important that last home game was, the stadium was sold to full attendance. 42,000 supporters filled the stadium with an atmosphere frankly not seen since we played PSG or Marseille in our better years. Some supporters even travelled from the USA, Canada or Asia to be at the game and supporting the team whatever happens, still clinging to hopes of promotion.
7.45pm kick off.
Le Havre plays at home against Dijon who fights to stay in ligue 2.
Metz at home plays against Bastia, currently 5th with nothing to play for.
Bordeaux plays in a sold out stadium against Rodez, who are also fighting to stay in Ligue 2.
Bordeaux has 5 or 6 clear chances in the first 15 minutes. still 0-0.
8.02 pm.
Rodez scores on a counter attack. 0-1. Sh!t happens, that's ok, long time to go. Cue Rodez players bundling up and celebrating in front of the Bordeaux Kop. One Bordeaux "supporter" (from the kop association Admin team, at the time sorting a banner) somehow goes on the pitch and pushes the Rodez goal scorer to the ground. The player stays on the ground, even it looks inconspicuous. Game is stopped. The player lies down for several minutes and both teams are sent to the dressing rooms. As per the rules, If the game is stopped for more than 45 minutes it is definitely aborted and it is down to the Ligue authorities to decide the outcome or replay of the game or resuming from where it stopped at another date.
20.50
The game is definitely aborted. the Rodez player is off to hospital for concussion assessment. 42K supporters in disbelief in the stadium. The Ligue communicates that they will take a decision/sanctions on... Monday. Our chairman makes a press conference explaining they will sue that Kop individual and also make any appeal to the Ligue on Monday.
Just around 9.45pm.
Le Havre is leading. they will be Champions. Dijon is going down.
Metz is leading too, they will finish second as it stands and go up too.
As for Bordeaux-Rodez, god knows. Because it is the last game of the season, it would seem unlikely to be replayed and is likely to be given as a default 3-0 win to Rodez. However (beside Bordeaux), one other club (Annecy) who is fighting to stay in Ligue 2 against Rodez wants our game to be resumed/replayed too because that default Rodez win would keep Rodez (and not them) up. Quite a mess.
What that "supporter" did is unforgivable and unjustifiable. He should be banned from the stadium for life. Based on precedents, Bordeaux will probably get some point deductions for the start of next season, most likely a handful of home games behind closed doors too.
if the game is to be resumed/replayed in a few days after all, it is likely that Bordeaux will also get a 1 or 2 pts penalty for this season, so that even if we beat Rodez in that final game, we could not go up at all...while maintaining some sporting fairness for Rodez and Annecy.
For some perspective, if Bordeaux had gone up last night, they would have been breaking even financially for the start of the next season. Staying in Ligue 2, means starting the next season with a 15 million euros debt, meaning more jobs losses in the admin staff and selling some of our better players and re-weaken our team again.
You can imagine how distraught we felt last night and today. Having a club still, was a miracle for us. Fighting for promotion to the last day was a bonus. We would have accepted, albeit with the expected disappointment, to remain in Ligue 2 on the pitch...but not in last night's manner. It is heart-breaking, for the silly action of one individual, wrecking the party atmosphere and the excitement of long-suffering parents and children at the stadium.
Now for the other oddity of the night.
As I said earlier, Le Havre was beating Dijon in the dying minutes, walking towards the Ligue 2 title.
With 30 seconds to go in injury time, due to a misunderstanding the Le Havre supporters invaded the pitch thinking they had won the game. Both teams had to go back to their dressing rooms. The game is stopped for around 20 minutes while the Havre captain and coach try to convince their supporters to go back into the terraces (note: The club had actually warned their supporters all week that any pitch invasion, even for the title, would mean lifetime bans for the individuals but also sanctions for the club!!)
Anyway, the supporters are back in their terraces eventually.
The game resumes.
There's 30 seconds left to play.
The referee whistle the official end of the game after 5 seconds.
Guess what... That's not the odd bit.
it's that bit: Only the Le Havre players ever came back on the pitch. The Dijon players did stay in their dressing room. And yet, the game resumed for 5 seconds.
Le Havre won 3-2. Cue another pitch invasion and actual title ceremony and celebrations.
not making sense to you ? Nope, nor me....
The Ligue has quite a cluster-fudge to sort out on Monday.
As a Bordeaux supporter, I am numb.
Sorry for that long post, it might be cathartic...
or not.
8)
Quote from: Papy Oli on June 03, 2023, 03:16:11 AMHow is that for a peculiar football evening:
Last night was the last game of the season in the French Ligue 2 (second division). For full fairness and equality between the clubs, the last 2-3 games are always played at the same time on the same day.
3 clubs are fighting for the top 2 promotion spots to Ligue 1:
Le Havre 72 pts
Metz 69 pts
and my club Bordeaux 69 pts (Goal difference of -3 compared to Metz)
Le Havre was up to 10 pts clear a few weeks ago and kept dropping points
Bordeaux was up to 9 points clear in second and kept dropping points
It all came down to last night's game.
For a bit of context, Bordeaux has been in steady sporting decline in the last decade when some dodgy American investors bought the club circa 2019. Last season, Bordeaux got relegated to Ligue 2 on the pitch but the mismanagement of the club and other internal tension and scandals took it to the brink of bankruptcy last July, with a looming liquidation and relegation to 5th tier football i.e the top tier of amateur football.
A buyer came through (a controversial one at that because he has bought other clubs on the brink before with some dodgy dealings, hence not a favourable reputation in the Ligue anyway) and bought the club last August. With only 2 days before the start of this season did he get the final confirmation from the league and financial authorities that we could play and play in Ligue 2 (and not further down). That meant selling our "best" (non-performing evidently) players and building the new team on mostly academy youngsters, a couple of seasoned players from Ligue 2 and a couple of key players that decided to stay at the club regardless to fight back, after accepting a 50% pay cut to help the club's finances (another 19 year old promising youngster reluctantly accepted to be sold to Southampton for 11 million euros, knowing that amount would definitely save his formative club).
The season felt like a miracle to us all if only for existing and it was a clean slate with the supporters now fully backing the mostly inexperienced team. it obviously took some time to gel and with lots of ups and downs, we eventually settled in the top three. Last bit of context, all season, for cost management reasons, the stadium capacity was kept at half, to 22K, still making it one of the biggest ligue 2 attendances.
To last night.
Knowing how important that last home game was, the stadium was sold to full attendance. 42,000 supporters filled the stadium with an atmosphere frankly not seen since we played PSG or Marseille in our better years. Some supporters even travelled from the USA, Canada or Asia to be at the game and supporting the team whatever happens, still clinging to hopes of promotion.
7.45pm kick off.
Le Havre plays at home against Dijon who fights to stay in ligue 2.
Metz at home plays against Bastia, currently 5th with nothing to play for.
Bordeaux plays in a sold out stadium against Rodez, who are also fighting to stay in Ligue 2.
Bordeaux has 5 or 6 clear chances in the first 15 minutes. still 0-0.
8.02 pm.
Rodez scores on a counter attack. 0-1. Sh!t happens, that's ok, long time to go. Cue Rodez players bundling up and celebrating in front of the Bordeaux Kop. One Bordeaux "supporter" (from the kop association Admin team, at the time sorting a banner) somehow goes on the pitch and pushes the Rodez goal scorer to the ground. The player stays on the ground, even it looks inconspicuous. Game is stopped. The player lies down for several minutes and both teams are sent to the dressing rooms. As per the rules, If the game is stopped for more than 45 minutes it is definitely aborted and it is down to the Ligue authorities to decide the outcome or replay of the game or resuming from where it stopped at another date.
20.50
The game is definitely aborted. the Rodez player is off to hospital for concussion assessment. 42K supporters in disbelief in the stadium. The Ligue communicates that they will take a decision/sanctions on... Monday. Our chairman makes a press conference explaining they will sue that Kop individual and also make any appeal to the Ligue on Monday.
Just around 9.45pm.
Le Havre is leading. they will be Champions. Dijon is going down.
Metz is leading too, they will finish second as it stands and go up too.
As for Bordeaux-Rodez, god knows. Because it is the last game of the season, it would seem unlikely to be replayed and is likely to be given as a default 3-0 win to Rodez. However (beside Bordeaux), one other club (Annecy) who is fighting to stay in Ligue 2 against Rodez wants our game to be resumed/replayed too because that default Rodez win would keep Rodez (and not them) up. Quite a mess.
What that "supporter" did is unforgivable and unjustifiable. He should be banned from the stadium for life. Based on precedents, Bordeaux will probably get some point deductions for the start of next season, most likely a handful of home games behind closed doors too.
if the game is to be resumed/replayed in a few days after all, it is likely that Bordeaux will also get a 1 or 2 pts penalty for this season, so that even if we beat Rodez in that final game, we could not go up at all...while maintaining some sporting fairness for Rodez and Annecy.
For some perspective, if Bordeaux had gone up last night, they would have been breaking even financially for the start of the next season. Staying in Ligue 2, means starting the next season with a 15 million euros debt, meaning more jobs losses in the admin staff and selling some of our better players and re-weaken our team again.
You can imagine how distraught we felt last night and today. Having a club still, was a miracle for us. Fighting for promotion to the last day was a bonus. We would have accepted, albeit with the expected disappointment, to remain in Ligue 2 on the pitch...but not in last night's manner. It is heart-breaking, for the silly action of one individual, wrecking the party atmosphere and the excitement of long-suffering parents and children at the stadium.
Now for the other oddity of the night.
As I said earlier, Le Havre was beating Dijon in the dying minutes, walking towards the Ligue 2 title.
With 30 seconds to go in injury time, due to a misunderstanding the Le Havre supporters invaded the pitch thinking they had won the game. Both teams had to go back to their dressing rooms. The game is stopped for around 20 minutes while the Havre captain and coach try to convince their supporters to go back into the terraces (note: The club had actually warned their supporters all week that any pitch invasion, even for the title, would mean lifetime bans for the individuals but also sanctions for the club!!)
Anyway, the supporters are back in their terraces eventually.
The game resumes.
There's 30 seconds left to play.
The referee whistle the official end of the game after 5 seconds.
Guess what... That's not the odd bit.
it's that bit: Only the Le Havre players ever came back on the pitch. The Dijon players did stay in their dressing room. And yet, the game resumed for 5 seconds.
Le Havre won 3-2. Cue another pitch invasion and actual title ceremony and celebrations.
not making sense to you ? Nope, nor me....
The Ligue has quite a cluster-fudge to sort out on Monday.
As a Bordeaux supporter, I am numb.
Sorry for that long post, it might be cathartic...
or not.
8)
Wow! :o And so sorry about your team--what a nightmare! And bizarre for all of the teams involved!
By the way, the one thing that I wasn't able to follow: what is the kop association admin team? Is that some sort of head of your team's fan club?
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 03, 2023, 04:51:14 AMBy the way, the one thing that I wasn't able to follow: what is the kop association admin team? Is that some sort of head of your team's fan club?
PD
Yes, the perpetrator that entered the pitch yesterday is one of the key members managing the supporters' club in that particular south terrace. We're talking about somebody in his late 30's/early 40's, not an 18 year old who lost the plot.
Sadly, this is not the first time some of their members have been problematic, the actual head of that group clashed with some of our own players (!!) on the pitch during a game last season when we were relegated (racist allegations against within the team, found unfounded in court last week). Even more sadly, these supporters have actually behaved really well all season, singing non-stop home and away behind the team.
It is such a waste...
Goodness me, what an epic. That's crazy.
I can't personally understand the mindset of someone who decides to get involved in any way, rather than just spectate. As it is, some of the behaviour of supporters in the stands - certain chants, booing, a ridiculously one-sided view of every referee call - is something that I am against. Actually going onto the pitch is a whole other level. A life ban is absolutely appropriate for the man who pushed a player.
Quote from: Madiel on June 03, 2023, 06:17:45 AMI can't personally understand the mindset of someone who decides to get involved in any way, rather than just spectate. As it is, some of the behaviour of supporters in the stands - certain chants, booing, a ridiculously one-sided view of every referee call - is something that I am against.
Remember than in the Eastern Roman Empire (wrongly called the Byzantine Empire) factions at the hippodrome could make or change an Emperor... ;D
Quote from: Papy Oli on June 03, 2023, 03:16:11 AMHow is that for a peculiar football evening:
That's quite a story - although I see Metz won 3-2, which would have meant Bordeaux had to score 5 to gain promotion (it could have happened, I'm sure). A lot of us "of a certain age" still think of Bordeaux as a top club (I was just reminding myself of former players - Tigana, Zidane, Dugarry, Lizarazu - wow!).
A lot of your story (apart from the pitch invasion) sounds horribly familiar to supporters of my club, Coventry City (subject of some discussion earlier in the thread). Relegation from the Premiership 22 years ago, move to a brand-new stadium which was then sold to pay debts, several seasons sharing stadiums with clubs up to 30 miles away, bankruptcy, purchase by venture capital company 2 hours before liquidation, relegation to the 4th tier... but then just missing out on promotion back to the Premiership by one penalty kick. So let's make a date for the Champions League Final in 10 years time -
Les Girondins v Coventry City ;D
I martyred myself today by agreeing to go to a GARDEN CENTRE ( :o :o >:D ) with my wife instead of watching the Cup Final (it would have been different if Chelsea had been playing). Anyway, I got home in time to watch the second half and felt that Man City deserved their victory.
Quote from: vandermolen on June 03, 2023, 09:39:43 AMa GARDEN CENTRE
What is a garden center, Jeffrey? ???
Quote from: Florestan on June 03, 2023, 09:53:31 AMWhat is a garden center, Jeffrey? ???
Somewhere where you can buy plants, compost, gravel for pathways, gardening tools, etcetc
I spend most of my life in such places Andrei ::)
Quote from: vandermolen on June 03, 2023, 11:12:47 AMSomewhere where you can buy plants, compost, gravel for pathways, gardening tools, etcetc
Worth a visit every 10 years or so. ;D
QuoteI spend most of my life in such places Andrei ::)
Oh, dear! OH, DEAR! Now I truly do understand why you like doom-and-gloom, defiant and valedictory music, Jeffrey. ;D
Quote from: Florestan on June 03, 2023, 11:17:49 AMWorth a visit every 10 years or so. ;D
Oh, dear! OH, DEAR! Now I truly do understand why you like doom-and-gloom, defiant and valedictory music, Jeffrey. ;D
Why do you think I have been listening to so much Allan Pettersson recently Andrei? ;D
Quote from: vandermolen on June 03, 2023, 11:25:35 AMWhy do you think I have been listening to so much Allan Pettersson recently Andrei? ;D
I do pity you,
Jeffrey, I really do... ;D :P >:D
I don't know whether there is any
Petterssonia plant, but I do know there is a
Fuchsia, so I heartily recommend you
Robert Fuchs' serenades --- for once just let go all thoughts of wife and garden centers and just wallow in the nonchalant, devil-may-care, happy-go-lucky soundworld of
Alt Wien. Then tomorrow you can go, with renewed forces, into full
Pettersson mode --- if it suits you anymore, that is. ;)
Quote from: Madiel on June 03, 2023, 06:17:45 AMGoodness me, what an epic. That's crazy.
I can't personally understand the mindset of someone who decides to get involved in any way, rather than just spectate. As it is, some of the behaviour of supporters in the stands - certain chants, booing, a ridiculously one-sided view of every referee call - is something that I am against. Actually going onto the pitch is a whole other level. A life ban is absolutely appropriate for the man who pushed a player.
The head of the kop released a statement, apologising to the teams, staffs, spectators.. and taking full responsibility for their member's action, but somehow explaining this by the fact the kop was full nearly 2 hours before the game and red hot with anticipation and hopes. "Their emerit historical member" acted against nature but as a result of this context. And then went on blaming the referee for stopping the game for something much less worse than past interrupted games.
Guess they didn't read the room, or stadium rather...
Beggars belief really. >:(
Quote from: DaveF on June 03, 2023, 09:39:06 AMThat's quite a story - although I see Metz won 3-2, which would have meant Bordeaux had to score 5 to gain promotion (it could have happened, I'm sure). A lot of us "of a certain age" still think of Bordeaux as a top club (I was just reminding myself of former players - Tigana, Zidane, Dugarry, Lizarazu - wow!).
A lot of your story (apart from the pitch invasion) sounds horribly familiar to supporters of my club, Coventry City (subject of some discussion earlier in the thread). Relegation from the Premiership 22 years ago, move to a brand-new stadium which was then sold to pay debts, several seasons sharing stadiums with clubs up to 30 miles away, bankruptcy, purchase by venture capital company 2 hours before liquidation, relegation to the 4th tier... but then just missing out on promotion back to the Premiership by one penalty kick. So let's make a date for the Champions League Final in 10 years time - Les Girondins v Coventry City ;D
I'd settle for that with you ;D
Your club's story is a tough ride too, blimey!!
Quote from: vandermolen on June 03, 2023, 09:39:43 AMI martyred myself today by agreeing to go to a GARDEN CENTRE ( :o :o >:D ) with my wife instead of watching the Cup Final (it would have been different if Chelsea had been playing). Anyway, I got home in time to watch the second half and felt that Man City deserved their victory.
Well done Jeffrey! And you must have been thinking about the old adage "Happy Wife, happy life" [though probably whilst checking your cell phone for score updates...]? ;D ;)
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 03, 2023, 01:31:34 PMWell done Jeffrey! And you must have been thinking about the old adage "Happy Wife, happy life" [though probably whilst checking your cell phone for score updates...]? ;D ;)
PD
Actually they had the TV on at the garden centre and some of the staff were watching the match.
Quote from: vandermolen on June 03, 2023, 09:39:43 AMI martyred myself today by agreeing to go to a GARDEN CENTRE ( :o :o >:D ) with my wife instead of watching the Cup Final (it would have been different if Chelsea had been playing). Anyway, I got home in time to watch the second half and felt that Man City deserved their victory.
Your story reminds me an episode of
The Simpsons, where Marge makes Homer have a tour at an apple cider factory, while he would have preferred to stay at home and watch the baseball World Series.
Quote from: Lisztianwagner on June 03, 2023, 02:10:56 PMYour story reminds me an episode of The Simpsons, where Marge makes Homer have a tour at an apple cider factory, while he would have preferred to stay at home and watch the baseball World Series.
That sounds about right. ::)
Quote from: vandermolen on June 03, 2023, 01:55:32 PMActually they had the TV on at the garden centre and some of the staff were watching the match.
They had a tv at a garden center?! Never seen that one before! :o
PD
Quote from: Lisztianwagner on June 03, 2023, 02:10:56 PMYour story reminds me an episode of The Simpsons, where Marge makes Homer have a tour at an apple cider factory, while he would have preferred to stay at home and watch the baseball World Series.
OT
Actually I was late for work once and my wife made me stay behind for a demonstration of 'how to plump up the cushions'. ::)
Quote from: vandermolen on June 05, 2023, 01:08:04 AMOT
Actually I was late for work once and my wife made me stay behind for a demonstration of 'how to plump up the cushions'. ::)
lol
The only "tv" that I've ever seen at a garden center before was for this (or one like it):
Note: I haven't purchased one myself, so don't know how well it works. The first time that I saw one of their ads, it cracked me up! ;D
PD
Quote from: Papy Oli on June 03, 2023, 04:59:47 AMYes, the perpetrator that entered the pitch yesterday is one of the key members managing the supporters' club in that particular south terrace. We're talking about somebody in his late 30's/early 40's, not an 18 year old who lost the plot.
Sadly, this is not the first time some of their members have been problematic, the actual head of that group clashed with some of our own players (!!) on the pitch during a game last season when we were relegated (racist allegations against within the team, found unfounded in court last week). Even more sadly, these supporters have actually behaved really well all season, singing non-stop home and away behind the team.
It is such a waste...
Pitch invasion is raising it's ugly head in English football too. I hate the thought of caging the fans in but without fanfare Wembley Stadium have installed a metal installation surrounding the pitch similar to a cattle grid.
Quote from: Irons on June 05, 2023, 07:16:55 AMPitch invasion is raising it's ugly head in English football too. I hate the thought of caging the fans in but without fanfare Wembley Stadium have installed a metal installation surrounding the pitch similar to a cattle grid.
When I went to try and see what it looked like (couldn't find), I found out two things. Firstly, I believe that they are going to install some kind of fencing outside of the stadium (to prevent ticketless holders from illegally entering W.) and secondly, that they are apparently doing a lot of work inside of the stadium (besides the fencing by the pitch). Sadly, two of the workers were injured when some scaffolding suddenly fell on them--one of the guys was actually killed. :(
PD
Tonight's the night! The first European Final since 1965 when the great Bobby lifted the trophy.
(https://i.imgur.com/nYeRJRg.jpg)
Fiorentina will be difficult opponents who are slight favourites. We have two Czech lads in our team which will be an advantage in Prague. If it goes to penalties don't think I would survive that!
COYI
Quote from: Irons on June 07, 2023, 07:49:34 AMTonight's the night! The first European Final since 1965 when the great Bobby lifted the trophy.
(https://i.imgur.com/nYeRJRg.jpg)
Fiorentina will be difficult opponents who are slight favourites. We have two Czech lads in our team which will be an advantage in Prague. If it goes to penalties don't think I would survive that!
COYI
What time does the game start? I'm trying a (short) free trial of Fubo and there's some football on there. Ah, I just looked...looks like 2:30 p.m. and I'm guessing that that is EST time. Will check it out.
PD
Quote from: Irons on June 07, 2023, 07:49:34 AMTonight's the night! The first European Final since 1965 when the great Bobby lifted the trophy.
(https://i.imgur.com/nYeRJRg.jpg)
Fiorentina will be difficult opponents who are slight favourites. We have two Czech lads in our team which will be an advantage in Prague. If it goes to penalties don't think I would survive that!
COYI
All the best for the...
@Irons 8)
Quote from: Irons on June 07, 2023, 07:49:34 AMTonight's the night! The first European Final since 1965 when the great Bobby lifted the trophy.
(https://i.imgur.com/nYeRJRg.jpg)
Now that's a nostalgic photo for those of us who were around in the '60s! I can recognise Alan Sealey, Martin Peters (looking remarkably like George Harrison), Brian Dear... Can't decide whether Sir Geoff is immediately on Bobby Moore's left, or the one in front looking backwards. Anyway, best of luck for tonight - try to avoid penalties!
Congratulations to West Ham on winning the Conference League, well done! Fiorentina played well, but it wasn't enough to get the cup.
Congratulations to West Ham!
I'm old enough to remember the 1964 Cup Final, featuring two very young players I think (of the top of my head, Sissons of West Ham and Kendall of Preston NE).
One for Lol /
@Irons :
David Moyes, West Ham's coach, celebrating last night's trophy (his first as a coach apparently) with his 87-yo dad:
https://twitter.com/HLTCO/status/1666713736755793921 (https://twitter.com/HLTCO/status/1666713736755793921)
:) :)
Quote from: DaveF on June 07, 2023, 09:23:36 AMNow that's a nostalgic photo for those of us who were around in the '60s! I can recognise Alan Sealey, Martin Peters (looking remarkably like George Harrison), Brian Dear... Can't decide whether Sir Geoff is immediately on Bobby Moore's left, or the one in front looking backwards. Anyway, best of luck for tonight - try to avoid penalties!
Hurst is on Bobby Moore's left.
Quote from: Papy Oli on June 03, 2023, 03:16:11 AMHow is that for a peculiar football evening:
Last night was the last game of the season in the French Ligue 2 (second division). For full fairness and equality between the clubs, the last 2-3 games are always played at the same time on the same day.
3 clubs are fighting for the top 2 promotion spots to Ligue 1:
Le Havre 72 pts
Metz 69 pts
and my club Bordeaux 69 pts (Goal difference of -3 compared to Metz)
Le Havre was up to 10 pts clear a few weeks ago and kept dropping points
Bordeaux was up to 9 points clear in second and kept dropping points
It all came down to last night's game.
For a bit of context, Bordeaux has been in steady sporting decline in the last decade when some dodgy American investors bought the club circa 2019. Last season, Bordeaux got relegated to Ligue 2 on the pitch but the mismanagement of the club and other internal tension and scandals took it to the brink of bankruptcy last July, with a looming liquidation and relegation to 5th tier football i.e the top tier of amateur football.
A buyer came through (a controversial one at that because he has bought other clubs on the brink before with some dodgy dealings, hence not a favourable reputation in the Ligue anyway) and bought the club last August. With only 2 days before the start of this season did he get the final confirmation from the league and financial authorities that we could play and play in Ligue 2 (and not further down). That meant selling our "best" (non-performing evidently) players and building the new team on mostly academy youngsters, a couple of seasoned players from Ligue 2 and a couple of key players that decided to stay at the club regardless to fight back, after accepting a 50% pay cut to help the club's finances (another 19 year old promising youngster reluctantly accepted to be sold to Southampton for 11 million euros, knowing that amount would definitely save his formative club).
The season felt like a miracle to us all if only for existing and it was a clean slate with the supporters now fully backing the mostly inexperienced team. it obviously took some time to gel and with lots of ups and downs, we eventually settled in the top three. Last bit of context, all season, for cost management reasons, the stadium capacity was kept at half, to 22K, still making it one of the biggest ligue 2 attendances.
To last night.
Knowing how important that last home game was, the stadium was sold to full attendance. 42,000 supporters filled the stadium with an atmosphere frankly not seen since we played PSG or Marseille in our better years. Some supporters even travelled from the USA, Canada or Asia to be at the game and supporting the team whatever happens, still clinging to hopes of promotion.
7.45pm kick off.
Le Havre plays at home against Dijon who fights to stay in ligue 2.
Metz at home plays against Bastia, currently 5th with nothing to play for.
Bordeaux plays in a sold out stadium against Rodez, who are also fighting to stay in Ligue 2.
Bordeaux has 5 or 6 clear chances in the first 15 minutes. still 0-0.
8.02 pm.
Rodez scores on a counter attack. 0-1. Sh!t happens, that's ok, long time to go. Cue Rodez players bundling up and celebrating in front of the Bordeaux Kop. One Bordeaux "supporter" (from the kop association Admin team, at the time sorting a banner) somehow goes on the pitch and pushes the Rodez goal scorer to the ground. The player stays on the ground, even it looks inconspicuous. Game is stopped. The player lies down for several minutes and both teams are sent to the dressing rooms. As per the rules, If the game is stopped for more than 45 minutes it is definitely aborted and it is down to the Ligue authorities to decide the outcome or replay of the game or resuming from where it stopped at another date.
20.50
The game is definitely aborted. the Rodez player is off to hospital for concussion assessment. 42K supporters in disbelief in the stadium. The Ligue communicates that they will take a decision/sanctions on... Monday. Our chairman makes a press conference explaining they will sue that Kop individual and also make any appeal to the Ligue on Monday.
Just around 9.45pm.
Le Havre is leading. they will be Champions. Dijon is going down.
Metz is leading too, they will finish second as it stands and go up too.
As for Bordeaux-Rodez, god knows. Because it is the last game of the season, it would seem unlikely to be replayed and is likely to be given as a default 3-0 win to Rodez. However (beside Bordeaux), one other club (Annecy) who is fighting to stay in Ligue 2 against Rodez wants our game to be resumed/replayed too because that default Rodez win would keep Rodez (and not them) up. Quite a mess.
What that "supporter" did is unforgivable and unjustifiable. He should be banned from the stadium for life. Based on precedents, Bordeaux will probably get some point deductions for the start of next season, most likely a handful of home games behind closed doors too.
if the game is to be resumed/replayed in a few days after all, it is likely that Bordeaux will also get a 1 or 2 pts penalty for this season, so that even if we beat Rodez in that final game, we could not go up at all...while maintaining some sporting fairness for Rodez and Annecy.
For some perspective, if Bordeaux had gone up last night, they would have been breaking even financially for the start of the next season. Staying in Ligue 2, means starting the next season with a 15 million euros debt, meaning more jobs losses in the admin staff and selling some of our better players and re-weaken our team again.
You can imagine how distraught we felt last night and today. Having a club still, was a miracle for us. Fighting for promotion to the last day was a bonus. We would have accepted, albeit with the expected disappointment, to remain in Ligue 2 on the pitch...but not in last night's manner. It is heart-breaking, for the silly action of one individual, wrecking the party atmosphere and the excitement of long-suffering parents and children at the stadium.
Now for the other oddity of the night.
As I said earlier, Le Havre was beating Dijon in the dying minutes, walking towards the Ligue 2 title.
With 30 seconds to go in injury time, due to a misunderstanding the Le Havre supporters invaded the pitch thinking they had won the game. Both teams had to go back to their dressing rooms. The game is stopped for around 20 minutes while the Havre captain and coach try to convince their supporters to go back into the terraces (note: The club had actually warned their supporters all week that any pitch invasion, even for the title, would mean lifetime bans for the individuals but also sanctions for the club!!)
Anyway, the supporters are back in their terraces eventually.
The game resumes.
There's 30 seconds left to play.
The referee whistle the official end of the game after 5 seconds.
Guess what... That's not the odd bit.
it's that bit: Only the Le Havre players ever came back on the pitch. The Dijon players did stay in their dressing room. And yet, the game resumed for 5 seconds.
Le Havre won 3-2. Cue another pitch invasion and actual title ceremony and celebrations.
not making sense to you ? Nope, nor me....
The Ligue has quite a cluster-fudge to sort out on Monday.
As a Bordeaux supporter, I am numb.
Sorry for that long post, it might be cathartic...
or not.
8)
Anyone fancy a follow-up ? ;D
- The Ligue authorities met last monday around 2 pm. the Bordeaux chairman turned up with his lawyers. Rodez didn't.
- After 20 minutes, meeting is off. The Ligue releases a statement saying that they have to proceed with further investigations. Next meeting is now due this coming Monday 12th May. Meanwhile, the game's score (0-1 to Rodez after 23 minutes) is temporary on hold for the Ligue table.
- Not waiting for the Ligue 1st meeting, Rodez has already sent their (non-internationals) players on holiday last Sunday.
Now for the juicy bits:
- If the Ligue ever decides to have the game replayed, it can not be replayed between the 12th and 20th May...because this period is legally needed by FIFA for some International games. It could only be replayed from the 20th May onwards. Bordeaux have sent their (non-international) players on holiday for now. They are due to reconvene for training on Friday 16th in hope the hope the game will be replayed the following week. fun fact: If the game is to be replayed, as per the Ligue rules, it would have to be restarted from scratch (at 0-0) and not from the 24th minute at 0-1. Fun fact 2: This would all happen potentially within 7-10 days of the official start of the 2023-2024 pre-season for all clubs.
- On the evening of the stopped game:
* the Rodez Chairman stated in a press conference that his shoved player had been hospitalised and concussed. he possibly went to hospital for checks but didn't stay there. it's been found out he travelled back with his team-mates on the team bus an hour and a half after the game. He wasn't concussed. if he had been, he would have been given 8-days sick leave as per the Ligue's current head-injury protocols. Turns out he was handed one day sick-leave.
* the Rodez coach stated in an interview that that same player was injured at the neck. He wasn't.
* The referee took the decision on the night to stop the game based on the alleged severity of the injury and disruption, as per the (neutral) ER doctor's report at the stadium. That report only called for an assessment of the player and not confirming he was concussed. Furthermore, that specific document is apparently not legally binding either.
- Remember Annecy who will be relegated if Rodez do keep the win? Well, The Annecy chairman has accused Rodez of seizing the incident as an opportunity to save their bacon, without having to play the full game. Called their players and chairman outright cheats and will take all legal routes to sue Rodez and the Ligue for loss of incomes and compensation if the 0-1 score is upheld (game not replayed) and Annecy gets relegated.
Fun times.
8)
Quote from: Papy Oli on June 08, 2023, 04:45:22 AMFun times.
What a mess! And all that because of one single idiot. ;D
Quote from: Papy Oli on June 08, 2023, 04:45:22 AMAnyone fancy a follow-up ? ;D
- The Ligue authorities met last monday around 2 pm. the Bordeaux chairman turned up with his lawyers. Rodez didn't.
- After 20 minutes, meeting is off. The Ligue releases a statement saying that they have to proceed with further investigations. Next meeting is now due this coming Monday 12th May. Meanwhile, the game's score (0-1 to Rodez after 23 minutes) is temporary on hold for the Ligue table.
- Not waiting for the Ligue 1st meeting, Rodez has already sent their (non-internationals) players on holiday last Sunday.
Now for the juicy bits:
- If the Ligue ever decides to have the game replayed, it can not be replayed between the 12th and 20th May...because this period is legally needed by FIFA for some International games. It could only be replayed from the 20th May onwards. Bordeaux have sent their (non-international) players on holiday for now. They are due to reconvene for training on Friday 16th in hope the hope the game will be replayed the following week. fun fact: If the game is to be replayed, as per the Ligue rules, it would have to be restarted from scratch (at 0-0) and not from the 24th minute at 0-1. Fun fact 2: This would all happen potentially within 7-10 days of the official start of the 2023-2024 pre-season for all clubs.
- On the evening of the stopped game:
* the Rodez Chairman stated in a press conference that his shoved player had been hospitalised and concussed. he possibly went to hospital for checks but didn't stay there. it's been found out he travelled back with his team-mates on the team bus an hour and a half after the game. He wasn't concussed. if he had been, he would have been given 8-days sick leave as per the Ligue's current head-injury protocols. Turns out he was handed one day sick-leave.
* the Rodez coach stated in an interview that that same player was injured at the neck. He wasn't.
* The referee took the decision on the night to stop the game based on the alleged severity of the injury and disruption, as per the (neutral) ER doctor's report at the stadium. That report only called for an assessment of the player and not confirming he was concussed. Furthermore, that specific document is apparently not legally binding either.
- Remember Annecy who will be relegated if Rodez do keep the win? Well, The Annecy chairman has accused Rodez of seizing the incident as an opportunity to save their bacon, without having to play the full game. Called their players and chairman outright cheats and will take all legal routes to sue Rodez and the Ligue for loss of incomes and compensation if the 0-1 score is upheld (game not replayed) and Annecy gets relegated.
Fun times.
8)
Oh, brother! :(
And
@Irons, congrats! :) Trust that you weren't up too too late celebrating? ;)
PD
Quote from: DaveF on June 07, 2023, 09:23:36 AMNow that's a nostalgic photo for those of us who were around in the '60s! I can recognise Alan Sealey, Martin Peters (looking remarkably like George Harrison), Brian Dear... Can't decide whether Sir Geoff is immediately on Bobby Moore's left, or the one in front looking backwards. Anyway, best of luck for tonight - try to avoid penalties!
Yes, Jeffrey is correct re Sir Geoff. BT Sport intervened Brian Dear at last night's game and he looked chipper. Ken Brown is far right in photo and Johnny Sissons is between him and Sir Geoff. The fella at the front is Ronnie Boyce.
Quote from: Irons on June 08, 2023, 06:49:25 AMYes, Jeffrey is correct re Sir Geoff. BT Sport intervened Brian Dear at last night's game and he looked chipper. Ken Brown is far right in photo and Johnny Sissons is between him and Sir Geoff. The fella at the front is Ronnie Boyce.
Didn't Boyce score the winning goal in the 1964 Cup Final (Hammers 3 Preston NE 2)?
Quote from: Lisztianwagner on June 07, 2023, 01:04:09 PMCongratulations to West Ham on winning the Conference League, well done! Fiorentina played well, but it wasn't enough to get the cup.
Fiorentina were the better team. Tactics played a huge part in at times a disjointed game and Fiorentina came out on top. What turned form on its head was a 50 million player, Lucas Paqueta, who I feel did not have a particularly good game, with a sublime pass to Jarrod Bowen in the 90th minute which won us the game. EPL clubs will often have the edge thanks to Sky as they can afford to sign players like Paqueta.
Quote from: vandermolen on June 08, 2023, 06:53:31 AMDidn't Boyce score the winning goal in the 1964 Cup Final (Hammers 3 Preston NE 2)?
Correct. Howard Kendall, who was later to play and manage Everton, was at that time at PNE was the youngest player to play in a Cup Final.
Quote from: Irons on June 08, 2023, 07:15:56 AMCorrect. Howard Kendall, who was later to play and manage Everton, was at that time at PNE was the youngest player to play in a Cup Final.
For some reason that is the earliest Cup Final that I have the clearest memory of. I think that I kept a scrapbook in which I glued relevant newspaper articles and pictures about it. I was 8 at the time. I remember supporting PNE (sorry!) as they were the underdogs. One of West Ham's goals was a bit flukey as it hit the crossbar, the post and then trickled over the line having hit the back of the goal-keeper (Kelly).
Quote from: Papy Oli on June 03, 2023, 03:16:11 AMHow is that for a peculiar football evening:
Last night was the last game of the season in the French Ligue 2 (second division). For full fairness and equality between the clubs, the last 2-3 games are always played at the same time on the same day.
3 clubs are fighting for the top 2 promotion spots to Ligue 1:
Le Havre 72 pts
Metz 69 pts
and my club Bordeaux 69 pts (Goal difference of -3 compared to Metz)
Le Havre was up to 10 pts clear a few weeks ago and kept dropping points
Bordeaux was up to 9 points clear in second and kept dropping points
It all came down to last night's game.
For a bit of context, Bordeaux has been in steady sporting decline in the last decade when some dodgy American investors bought the club circa 2019. Last season, Bordeaux got relegated to Ligue 2 on the pitch but the mismanagement of the club and other internal tension and scandals took it to the brink of bankruptcy last July, with a looming liquidation and relegation to 5th tier football i.e the top tier of amateur football.
A buyer came through (a controversial one at that because he has bought other clubs on the brink before with some dodgy dealings, hence not a favourable reputation in the Ligue anyway) and bought the club last August. With only 2 days before the start of this season did he get the final confirmation from the league and financial authorities that we could play and play in Ligue 2 (and not further down). That meant selling our "best" (non-performing evidently) players and building the new team on mostly academy youngsters, a couple of seasoned players from Ligue 2 and a couple of key players that decided to stay at the club regardless to fight back, after accepting a 50% pay cut to help the club's finances (another 19 year old promising youngster reluctantly accepted to be sold to Southampton for 11 million euros, knowing that amount would definitely save his formative club).
The season felt like a miracle to us all if only for existing and it was a clean slate with the supporters now fully backing the mostly inexperienced team. it obviously took some time to gel and with lots of ups and downs, we eventually settled in the top three. Last bit of context, all season, for cost management reasons, the stadium capacity was kept at half, to 22K, still making it one of the biggest ligue 2 attendances.
To last night.
Knowing how important that last home game was, the stadium was sold to full attendance. 42,000 supporters filled the stadium with an atmosphere frankly not seen since we played PSG or Marseille in our better years. Some supporters even travelled from the USA, Canada or Asia to be at the game and supporting the team whatever happens, still clinging to hopes of promotion.
7.45pm kick off.
Le Havre plays at home against Dijon who fights to stay in ligue 2.
Metz at home plays against Bastia, currently 5th with nothing to play for.
Bordeaux plays in a sold out stadium against Rodez, who are also fighting to stay in Ligue 2.
Bordeaux has 5 or 6 clear chances in the first 15 minutes. still 0-0.
8.02 pm.
Rodez scores on a counter attack. 0-1. Sh!t happens, that's ok, long time to go. Cue Rodez players bundling up and celebrating in front of the Bordeaux Kop. One Bordeaux "supporter" (from the kop association Admin team, at the time sorting a banner) somehow goes on the pitch and pushes the Rodez goal scorer to the ground. The player stays on the ground, even it looks inconspicuous. Game is stopped. The player lies down for several minutes and both teams are sent to the dressing rooms. As per the rules, If the game is stopped for more than 45 minutes it is definitely aborted and it is down to the Ligue authorities to decide the outcome or replay of the game or resuming from where it stopped at another date.
20.50
The game is definitely aborted. the Rodez player is off to hospital for concussion assessment. 42K supporters in disbelief in the stadium. The Ligue communicates that they will take a decision/sanctions on... Monday. Our chairman makes a press conference explaining they will sue that Kop individual and also make any appeal to the Ligue on Monday.
Just around 9.45pm.
Le Havre is leading. they will be Champions. Dijon is going down.
Metz is leading too, they will finish second as it stands and go up too.
As for Bordeaux-Rodez, god knows. Because it is the last game of the season, it would seem unlikely to be replayed and is likely to be given as a default 3-0 win to Rodez. However (beside Bordeaux), one other club (Annecy) who is fighting to stay in Ligue 2 against Rodez wants our game to be resumed/replayed too because that default Rodez win would keep Rodez (and not them) up. Quite a mess.
What that "supporter" did is unforgivable and unjustifiable. He should be banned from the stadium for life. Based on precedents, Bordeaux will probably get some point deductions for the start of next season, most likely a handful of home games behind closed doors too.
if the game is to be resumed/replayed in a few days after all, it is likely that Bordeaux will also get a 1 or 2 pts penalty for this season, so that even if we beat Rodez in that final game, we could not go up at all...while maintaining some sporting fairness for Rodez and Annecy.
For some perspective, if Bordeaux had gone up last night, they would have been breaking even financially for the start of the next season. Staying in Ligue 2, means starting the next season with a 15 million euros debt, meaning more jobs losses in the admin staff and selling some of our better players and re-weaken our team again.
You can imagine how distraught we felt last night and today. Having a club still, was a miracle for us. Fighting for promotion to the last day was a bonus. We would have accepted, albeit with the expected disappointment, to remain in Ligue 2 on the pitch...but not in last night's manner. It is heart-breaking, for the silly action of one individual, wrecking the party atmosphere and the excitement of long-suffering parents and children at the stadium.
Now for the other oddity of the night.
As I said earlier, Le Havre was beating Dijon in the dying minutes, walking towards the Ligue 2 title.
With 30 seconds to go in injury time, due to a misunderstanding the Le Havre supporters invaded the pitch thinking they had won the game. Both teams had to go back to their dressing rooms. The game is stopped for around 20 minutes while the Havre captain and coach try to convince their supporters to go back into the terraces (note: The club had actually warned their supporters all week that any pitch invasion, even for the title, would mean lifetime bans for the individuals but also sanctions for the club!!)
Anyway, the supporters are back in their terraces eventually.
The game resumes.
There's 30 seconds left to play.
The referee whistle the official end of the game after 5 seconds.
Guess what... That's not the odd bit.
it's that bit: Only the Le Havre players ever came back on the pitch. The Dijon players did stay in their dressing room. And yet, the game resumed for 5 seconds.
Le Havre won 3-2. Cue another pitch invasion and actual title ceremony and celebrations.
not making sense to you ? Nope, nor me....
The Ligue has quite a cluster-fudge to sort out on Monday.
As a Bordeaux supporter, I am numb.
Sorry for that long post, it might be cathartic...
or not.
8)
It only takes one idiot! More then one last night throwing plastic cups at a Fiorentina player when he took a corner. There is always one and last night he threw a vape which hit the Fiorentina player on the back of the head. When I saw the blood I froze fearing the game to be called off. Fair play to the guy as unlike your Rodex player he didn't make a meal of it and actually defused a potentially serious situation.
Quote from: vandermolen on June 08, 2023, 07:27:34 AMFor some reason that is the earliest Cup Final that I have the clearest memory of. I think that I kept a scrapbook in which I glued relevant newspaper articles and pictures about it. I was 8 at the time. I remember supporting PNE (sorry!) as they were the underdogs. One of West Ham's goals was a bit flukey as it hit the crossbar, the post and then trickled over the line having hit the back of the goal-keeper (Kelly).
Think I am a little bit older then you, Jeffrey. My earliest Cup memory is 1956 when a German goalkeeper Bert Troutman carried on playing for Man City with a broken neck! I thought the opponents were Newcastle United but on checking it was Birmingham City. Was a long time ago. ;D
Quote from: Irons on June 08, 2023, 07:38:08 AMIt only takes one idiot! More then one last night throwing plastic cups at a Fiorentina player when he took a corner. There is always one and last night he threw a vape which hit the Fiorentina player on the back of the head. When I saw the blood I froze fearing the game to be called off. Fair play to the guy as unlike your Rodex player he didn't make a meal of it and actually defused a potentially serious situation.
Indeed, kudos to him! But all such idiots should be promptly identified and banned for life, under penalty of a large fine, from attending any live sports event, not just football. There is no other way.
Quote from: Irons on June 08, 2023, 07:38:08 AMIt only takes one idiot! More then one last night throwing plastic cups at a Fiorentina player when he took a corner. There is always one and last night he threw a vape which hit the Fiorentina player on the back of the head. When I saw the blood I froze fearing the game to be called off. Fair play to the guy as unlike your Rodex player he didn't make a meal of it and actually defused a potentially serious situation.
Very sad all this... Don't know what to say anymore.
One Bordeaux player has actually posted pictures about this Fiorentina incident this morning and asked why your game did continue and not ours.
Using such a "whataboutism" doesn't actually sit right with me in itself (when one of "ours" is definitely at fault anyway) but the inconsistency can still be puzzling.
Quote from: Florestan on June 08, 2023, 07:46:56 AMIndeed, kudos to him! But all such idiots should be promptly identified and banned for life, under penalty of a large fine, from attending any live sports event, not just football. There is no other way.
They will get him and he will never set foot in a West Ham game again. Of course the club can expect sanctions from UEFA.
Quote from: vandermolen on June 07, 2023, 02:35:15 PMCongratulations to West Ham!
I'm old enough to remember the 1964 Cup Final, featuring two very young players I think (of the top of my head, Sissons of West Ham and Kendall of Preston NE).
Oh dear, I feel scarcely out of nappies in such company - first one I remember is Man City - Leicester in 1969 (Bell, Lee, Summerbee, Tony Book - they would run rings round Gündogan, Haaland, Grealish & Co. any day). Anyway, congratulations to the 'Appy 'Ammers - one can forgive the enthusiasm of the fan down the Commercial Road interviewed by the BBC - "We're champions of Europe!"
Quote from: Irons on June 08, 2023, 08:09:28 AMThey will get him and he will never set foot in a West Ham game again. Of course the club can expect sanctions from UEFA.
I caught bits and pieces of the game. I do remember thinking "Why is this player's upper face/head being wrapped in medical wrap?" I didn't catch the incident but had noticed rubbish on the pitch. Later on, I saw photos of the blood on him and was shocked and horrified.
On a side note, I've heard about tennis players receiving horrible comments on places like Twitter. They're trying to use AI to filter things but as one young, talented and grand-slam winner (Sloane Stephens) has said (due to her own experience with social media), in so many words "they use asterisks to get through".
It's horrible. It's abuse. And it shouldn't be allowed. How to stop it?
PD
Quote from: Irons on June 08, 2023, 07:46:49 AMThink I am a little bit older then you, Jeffrey. My earliest Cup memory is 1956 when a German goalkeeper Bert Troutman carried on playing for Man City with a broken neck! I thought the opponents were Newcastle United but on checking it was Birmingham City. Was a long time ago. ;D
That's a very famous story. I think that Trautmann may have been a POW in Britain. I was only 1 at the time.
I should perhaps mention that I did attend the 1966 World Cup Final ;D :o :)
Quote from: vandermolen on June 08, 2023, 12:16:47 PMI should perhaps mention that I did attend the 1966 World Cup Final ;D :o :)
Outstanding, young man! :D
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 08, 2023, 12:10:01 PMI caught bits and pieces of the game. I do remember thinking "Why is this player's upper face/head being wrapped in medical wrap?" I didn't catch the incident but had noticed rubbish on the pitch. Later on, I saw photos of the blood on him and was shocked and horrified.
On a side note, I've heard about tennis players receiving horrible comments on places like Twitter. They're trying to use AI to filter things but as one young, talented and grand-slam winner (Sloane Stephens) has said (due to her own experience with social media), in so many words "they use asterisks to get through".
It's horrible. It's abuse. And it shouldn't be allowed. How to stop it?
PD
The day is not long in coming when a football team march off field of play during a game due to one of their players receiving racist abuse from opposing fans.
Quote from: vandermolen on June 08, 2023, 12:16:47 PMThat's a very famous story. I think that Trautmann may have been a POW in Britain. I was only 1 at the time.
Even I've heard of Bert Trautmann! There was slightly sentimental but very engaging biopic about him a while ago, called 'The Keeper'. An extraordinary life story, which would have broken many I think. I came away from the film with a great respect for him.
Quote from: vandermolen on June 08, 2023, 12:16:47 PMI should perhaps mention that I did attend the 1966 World Cup Final ;D :o :)
Amazing that you were there! The closest I got was attempting to collect the Esso coins issued at the time. ::)
Quote from: Iota on June 10, 2023, 03:51:22 AMEven I've heard of Bert Trautmann! There was slightly sentimental but very engaging biopic about him a while ago, called 'The Keeper'. An extraordinary life story, which would have broken many I think. I came away from the film with a great respect for him.
Amazing that you were there! The closest I got was attempting to collect the Esso coins issued at the time. ::)
I think that Esso coins may have been for the 1970 World Cup. I remember that they launched them before the squad was announced and so that they featured some players who were not selected!
Quote from: vandermolen on June 10, 2023, 04:21:38 AMI think that Esso coins may have been for the 1970 World Cup. I remember that they launched them before the squad was announced and so that they featured some players who were not selected!
Oh right, well that reveals the subterranean levels of my football knowledge pretty accurately. ::)
Nonetheless I remember that board so well (and with some nostalgia), thanks for putting it up. I never could seem to complete the collection no matter how many different petrol stations we visited, a sizeable frustration for me at the time.
Quote from: Iota on June 10, 2023, 04:54:14 AMOh right, well that reveals the subterranean levels of my football knowledge pretty accurately. ::)
Nonetheless I remember that board so well (and with some nostalgia), thanks for putting it up. I never could seem to complete the collection no matter how many different petrol stations we visited, a sizeable frustration for me at the time.
I remember that as well. I ended up with multiple coins of the same player (usually not one of my favourites, like Colin Bell). However at the end you could send off for the ones that you were missing and they would send them to you. I was 15 at the time so a bit more savvy than I was in 1966. Somewhere in our attic, I suspect, is the completed set probably worth a billion pounds 8)
Damn, what a pity!! :'( Man City won the Champions League and deserved to win, but Inter had chances to score and wasted them. Haaland was greatly stopped. We played at the best of our possibilities and we have nothing to regret......
Quote from: vandermolen on June 10, 2023, 05:14:55 AMI remember that as well. I ended up with multiple coins of the same player (usually not one of my favourites, like Colin Bell). However at the end you could send off for the ones that you were missing and they would send them to you. I was 15 at the time so a bit more savvy than I was in 1966. Somewhere in our attic, I suspect, is the completed set probably worth a billion pounds 8)
I was a bit younger than you and had no idea the complete collection was made available at the end! That's one serious dopamine opportunity I'm never getting back! My board got chucked out in one of my mother's house moves, which is perhaps why I got such a little surge of happiness seeing the image above.
Quote from: Iota on June 11, 2023, 12:20:37 AMI was a bit younger than you and had no idea the complete collection was made available at the end! That's one serious dopamine opportunity I'm never getting back! My board got chucked out in one of my mother's house moves, which is perhaps why I got such a little surge of happiness seeing the image above.
I think that I must have written to Esso or phoned them. I just remember that there was a way of asking them to send any missing players. Maybe there was something about it on the back of the board.
My mother threw my entire collection of Tintin books (hardback) out whilst I was at university - never forgave her >:( . I had to buy them all again as an adult. ::)
Quote from: Lisztianwagner on June 10, 2023, 01:02:27 PMDamn, what a pity!! :'( Man City won the Champions League and deserved to win, but Inter had chances to score and wasted them. Haaland was greatly stopped. We played at the best of our possibilities and we have nothing to regret......
I must admit I thought Man City would walk it as they do with practically every club in EPL. How wrong I was. Tactically a master class from Inter with a high press that snuffed out City's creativity. Inter were unlucky not to score in the closing minutes.
An Italian team in all three European Finals and each lost.
Forgive me for posting but no one has a party like the East End https://youtu.be/IikNdoCkLZU
Quote from: vandermolen on June 11, 2023, 01:18:21 AMI think that I must have written to Esso or phoned them. I just remember that there was a way of asking them to send any missing players. Maybe there was something about it on the back of the board.
My mother threw my entire collection of Tintin books (hardback) out whilst I was at university - never forgave her >:( . I had to buy them all again as an adult. ::)
Oh dear, that's far more traumatic than my loss was, I was merely a bit miffed/sad. I stopped following football about age 11/12, though still take a gander at World Cups and Euros, and keep an occasional eye on Man U as a nod to my boyhood self. But yes, families can very trying sometimes. ::)
Quote from: Iota on June 11, 2023, 05:59:24 AMOh dear, that's far more traumatic than my loss was, I was merely a bit miffed/sad. I stopped following football about age 11/12, though still take a gander at World Cups and Euros, and keep an occasional eye on Man U as a nod to my boyhood self. But yes, families can very trying sometimes. ::)
There's only one survivor of my original Tintin collection - a rather battered copy of 'The Red Sea Sharks' :-\
Quote from: vandermolen on June 10, 2023, 05:14:55 AMI remember that as well. I ended up with multiple coins of the same player (usually not one of my favourites, like Colin Bell). However at the end you could send off for the ones that you were missing and they would send them to you. I was 15 at the time so a bit more savvy than I was in 1966. Somewhere in our attic, I suspect, is the completed set probably worth a billion pounds 8)
Sadly not - I've got the complete set too, and got very excited when it turned up during my house move a few years ago. They go for about £10 on eBay.
Quote from: DaveF on June 11, 2023, 08:02:01 AMSadly not - I've got the complete set too, and got very excited when it turned up during my house move a few years ago. They go for about £10 on eBay.
Very disappointing! So much for my villa in the South of France ;D
Quote from: vandermolen on June 11, 2023, 08:27:13 AMVery disappointing! So much for my villa in the South of France ;D
If you have an air rifle, you could use the Peter Bonetti one for target practice >:D
Quote from: DaveF on June 13, 2023, 10:40:52 AMIf you have an air rifle, you could use the Peter Bonetti one for target practice >:D
HAHA. I still think that Bonetti was unfairly blamed for the debacle against West Germany.
What's up with the Norway women's? Some of the best players in the world, but no teamwork.
I see that the Hammers won in Serbia.
Suspect that there was some celebrating going on in Surrey the other night?
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on December 01, 2023, 05:49:53 AMI see that the Hammers won in Serbia.
Suspect that there was some celebrating going on in Surrey the other night?
PD
Yes and no, PD. Backa Topola are minnows compared to an EPL side. We brought on a substitute in the second half who barely gets a sniff of the first eleven, he cost three times that of the whole Backa Topola team. Our display was frankly awful until 2 minutes from time with a wonderful assist and goal.
Have just finished watching (on catch-up TV due to being at work) my beloved Coventry City beating near neighbours Wolverhampton Wanderers (from one division higher) to progress to the semi-finals of the FA Cup. I had managed to avoid seeing the result, and am still shaking from the experience. 2 goals in the 9th and 10th minutes of added time, the second from our devilishly good, and devilishly handsome, US international Haji Wright, to seal a 3-2 win. Possibly the best Coventry performance I've seen since the Cup Final win 37 years ago. Now we just need to draw Chelsea in the semi-final (assuming they also don't get stuffed at home by Championship opposition) for a bit of family interest - no.1 stepson is a huge Chelsea fan, as is our own
@vandermolen (although he's been keeping quiet about it this season ;)).
Quote from: DaveF on March 16, 2024, 12:00:23 PMHave just finished watching (on catch-up TV due to being at work) my beloved Coventry City beating near neighbours Wolverhampton Wanderers (from one division higher) to progress to the semi-finals of the FA Cup. I had managed to avoid seeing the result, and am still shaking from the experience. 2 goals in the 9th and 10th minutes of added time, the second from our devilishly good, and devilishly handsome, US international Haji Wright, to seal a 3-2 win. Possibly the best Coventry performance I've seen since the Cup Final win 37 years ago. Now we just need to draw Chelsea in the semi-final (assuming they also don't get stuffed at home by Championship opposition) for a bit of family interest - no.1 stepson is a huge Chelsea fan, as is our own @vandermolen (although he's been keeping quiet about it this season ;)).
Oddly enough I recently watched the Coventry FA Cup Final when they won the Cup - that was a most memorable Final.
Quote from: vandermolen on March 16, 2024, 10:23:47 PMOddly enough I recently watched the Coventry FA Cup Final when they won the Cup - that was a most memorable Final.
Yes, wasn't bad, was it? - played in a great spirit as well, with not a single booking. Since then we've been down to Division 4, been twice homeless (nearly as many times as Mahler), been knocked out of the Cup by Worcester City and been three hours from liquidation, so this success thing is quite disorientating.
Well, looks like we've avoided one another in the semis, so see you in the final :) (And, also oddly enough, I recently saw "highlights" of the 1970 Chelsea-Leeds final - perhaps not played in quite such a good spirit.)
Quote from: DaveF on March 16, 2024, 12:00:23 PMHave just finished watching (on catch-up TV due to being at work) my beloved Coventry City beating near neighbours Wolverhampton Wanderers (from one division higher) to progress to the semi-finals of the FA Cup. I had managed to avoid seeing the result, and am still shaking from the experience. 2 goals in the 9th and 10th minutes of added time, the second from our devilishly good, and devilishly handsome, US international Haji Wright, to seal a 3-2 win. Possibly the best Coventry performance I've seen since the Cup Final win 37 years ago. Now we just need to draw Chelsea in the semi-final (assuming they also don't get stuffed at home by Championship opposition) for a bit of family interest - no.1 stepson is a huge Chelsea fan, as is our own @vandermolen (although he's been keeping quiet about it this season ;)).
I think the last time I watched Coventry was when Gordon Strachan (was that the name) was still on the team.
Quote from: DaveF on March 17, 2024, 11:32:10 AMYes, wasn't bad, was it? - played in a great spirit as well, with not a single booking. Since then we've been down to Division 4, been twice homeless (nearly as many times as Mahler), been knocked out of the Cup by Worcester City and been three hours from liquidation, so this success thing is quite disorientating.
Well, looks like we've avoided one another in the semis, so see you in the final :) (And, also oddly enough, I recently saw "highlights" of the 1970 Chelsea-Leeds final - perhaps not played in quite such a good spirit.)
The re-play at Old Trafford was even worse - but at least the right team won ;D
Quote from: Irons on December 02, 2023, 01:01:01 AMYes and no, PD. Backa Topola are minnows compared to an EPL side. We brought on a substitute in the second half who barely gets a sniff of the first eleven, he cost three times that of the whole Backa Topola team. Our display was frankly awful until 2 minutes from time with a wonderful assist and goal.
I just now realized why you are "IRON"... (...while I wonder why not "bubbles"?)
Quote from: springrite on March 17, 2024, 09:27:55 PMI think the last time I watched Coventry was when Gordon Strachan (was that the name) was still on the team.
Yes, that was him - that's a year or two back now; he played for us in the late '90s before becoming manager and going down (all too literally) in history as the one who got us relegated from the Premier League. This is what we were up to this weekend:
And a story that may amuse a Gooner: after we won the FA Cup in 1987 by beating Tottenham, my hairdresser in East London, who was an Arsenal fan, treated me to a free haircut.
Quote from: DaveF on March 18, 2024, 01:28:45 PMAnd a story that may amuse a Gooner: after we won the FA Cup in 1987 by beating Tottenham, my hairdresser in East London, who was an Arsenal fan, treated me to a free haircut.
:laugh: Having lived a significant portion of my adult life in Arsenal territory, I know how deep and genuine a pleasure both Arsenal and Tottenham fans get from the other's failure. It's actually quite amusing at times.
Quote from: Iota on March 18, 2024, 02:13:02 PM:laugh: Having lived a significant portion of my adult life in Arsenal territory, I know how deep and genuine a pleasure both Arsenal and Tottenham fans get from the other's failure. It's actually quite amusing at times.
I stayed in Finsbury Park in 2019 - definitely Gooner territory but down the road at the Plimsoll pub in St Thomas' Rd you could see both Arsenal and Spurs supporters debating the merits of their teams.
Quote from: Iota on March 18, 2024, 02:13:02 PM:laugh: Having lived a significant portion of my adult life in Arsenal territory, I know how deep and genuine a pleasure both Arsenal and Tottenham fans get from the other's failure. It's actually quite amusing at times.
Indeed!
But one of my best friends among football fans is a Spurs' fan. It's a shame that I did not know him through all the years of Arsenal dominance. We met only after Arsene left and the start of Tottenham having better seasons than the gunners for several years in a row. It's about time that Arsenal regain the upper hand!
Quote from: Holden on March 18, 2024, 03:07:49 PMI stayed in Finsbury Park in 2019 - definitely Gooner territory but down the road at the Plimsoll pub in St Thomas' Rd you could see both Arsenal and Spurs supporters debating the merits of their teams.
I knew two brothers, avid Tottenham fans who would virtually salivate at the mention of any Arsenal misfortune, who lived a stone's throw from that pub. It's true that though the rivalry might be intense, it was generally amicable what I saw of it. The best kind ..
Quote from: springrite on March 18, 2024, 10:16:06 PMIndeed!
But one of my best friends among football fans is a Spurs' fan. It's a shame that I did not know him through all the years of Arsenal dominance. We met only after Arsene left and the start of Tottenham having better seasons than the gunners for several years in a row. It's about time that Arsenal regain the upper hand!
Such a thoughtful manager Wenger, I liked him. The best I think I've ever seen Arsenal was when Thierry Henry/Bergkamp were hitting their respective stellar peaks, some seriously wondrous football going on then! But I was only ever a very casual football fan, and even more so now, so know nothing really.
Quote from: springrite on March 18, 2024, 05:37:22 AMI just now realized why you are "IRON"... (...while I wonder why not "bubbles"?)
Bubbles is good. A song that is West Ham. "Irons" also goes deep in the club's history as do "Hammers" which is from the founding of the club as a factory team of Thames Ironworks in the East End of London.
Quote from: Irons on March 19, 2024, 09:06:00 AMBubbles is good. A song that is West Ham. "Irons" also goes deep in the club's history as do "Hammers" which is from the founding of the club as a factory team of Thames Ironworks in the East End of London.
I was wondering as the where the "Bubbles" came from. ???
This is the first Bubbles that came to my mind:
(https://iscale.iheart.com/v3/surl/aHR0cDovL2ltYWdlLmloZWFydC5jb20vV01HNC9UaHVtYl9Db250ZW50L0Z1bGxfUEMvV01HL01hcjE0LzAzMzExNC8wNzI0MzU4NjMxNzUzL3Jlc291cmNlcy9mOTE2YzA3NmEzMTk3MDU3NDhmYmMxZjEwYTM5ZDU1ZC5qcGc=?sn=eGtleWJhc2UyMDIxMTExMDqbwxZuuWPcFqV-9DQJPLRtmrEON_MizPG5ADYeX6y91A%3D%3D&surrogate=1cOXl179JY-syhxYSCX6Q1ahJ9ekBKwf7UslJDIRMVUNFyA2y3HRL2WpomQ9AI1z9btNfggTF0y6etweNqe8wUCQAvI08du-sTu_3G_xaecC0iMWjqnRNsvXL--yPwWuUFjtKDfN2qub4uv9BtM3T_mSwcFgtq9mNP0CQ4CE_KSp-r14jlKAuLlrRLKjMIo3DcNkxuhqfEA28Y6W48a_qQON-7zZCMYXyTp5TgKsxeCiDuVIKhhGxMQ3VuayNrTou2Qcq7rUCJWeOseckH1Ywel07_UIECBfT_Jlb9JAoSuYUuQfDKtKdn_1T6OYBPgaDMWAS5_wJYCO)
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 19, 2024, 09:25:59 AMI was wondering as the where the "Bubbles" came from. ???
This is the first Bubbles that came to my mind:
(https://iscale.iheart.com/v3/surl/aHR0cDovL2ltYWdlLmloZWFydC5jb20vV01HNC9UaHVtYl9Db250ZW50L0Z1bGxfUEMvV01HL01hcjE0LzAzMzExNC8wNzI0MzU4NjMxNzUzL3Jlc291cmNlcy9mOTE2YzA3NmEzMTk3MDU3NDhmYmMxZjEwYTM5ZDU1ZC5qcGc=?sn=eGtleWJhc2UyMDIxMTExMDqbwxZuuWPcFqV-9DQJPLRtmrEON_MizPG5ADYeX6y91A%3D%3D&surrogate=1cOXl179JY-syhxYSCX6Q1ahJ9ekBKwf7UslJDIRMVUNFyA2y3HRL2WpomQ9AI1z9btNfggTF0y6etweNqe8wUCQAvI08du-sTu_3G_xaecC0iMWjqnRNsvXL--yPwWuUFjtKDfN2qub4uv9BtM3T_mSwcFgtq9mNP0CQ4CE_KSp-r14jlKAuLlrRLKjMIo3DcNkxuhqfEA28Y6W48a_qQON-7zZCMYXyTp5TgKsxeCiDuVIKhhGxMQ3VuayNrTou2Qcq7rUCJWeOseckH1Ywel07_UIECBfT_Jlb9JAoSuYUuQfDKtKdn_1T6OYBPgaDMWAS5_wJYCO)
PD
Like my dreams they fade and die....
Quote from: Irons on March 19, 2024, 09:31:30 AM
Like my dreams they fade and die....
:(
You have got to keep the faith alive!
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on March 19, 2024, 09:37:48 AM:(
You have got to keep the faith alive!
PD
Following West Ham not easy!
To one of the best matches I've ever attended yesterday: FA Cup semi-final at Wembley. Coventry City 3, Man Utd 3 (Man U 4-2 on penalties) doesn't tell half the story. First half was like a practice match for Utd, as Cov had completely failed to turn up, and it could easily have been 6-0 at half time, rather than just 2. Another Man U goal at the start of the second half didn't help. But then the Sky Blue tap got turned on, and after wave upon wave of attacks we got it back to 3-3 at full time. No goals in extra time, apart from a "winner" for us that was judged offside (I can't see it, I really can't - definitely level.) Then penalties... At the end all Man U players and fans slunk away, probably ashamed to beat a lower-league team in such a way - we stayed for half an hour, singing and waving our flags. We liked some of the Man U songs, so sang them as well (somebody had to). Another day to go into Coventry folklore.
Quote from: DaveF on April 22, 2024, 12:36:19 AMTo one of the best matches I've ever attended yesterday: FA Cup semi-final at Wembley. Coventry City 3, Man Utd 3 (Man U 4-2 on penalties) doesn't tell half the story. First half was like a practice match for Utd, as Cov had completely failed to turn up, and it could easily have been 6-0 at half time, rather than just 2. Another Man U goal at the start of the second half didn't help. But then the Sky Blue tap got turned on, and after wave upon wave of attacks we got it back to 3-3 at full time. No goals in extra time, apart from a "winner" for us that was judged offside (I can't see it, I really can't - definitely level.) Then penalties... At the end all Man U players and fans slunk away, probably ashamed to beat a lower-league team in such a way - we stayed for half an hour, singing and waving our flags. We liked some of the Man U songs, so sang them as well (somebody had to). Another day to go into Coventry folklore.
As McGuire shook hands with Coventry players right after the last penalty kick giving United the victory, Antony, who came on at 3:0 and was -3 himself as a substitute, decided to taunt Coventry players in their faces. How pathetic!
Quote from: springrite on April 22, 2024, 01:52:29 AMAs McGuire shook hands with Coventry players right after the last penalty kick giving United the victory, Antony, who came on at 3:0 and was -3 himself as a substitute, decided to taunt Coventry players in their faces. How pathetic!
Bruno Fernandez, allegedly the captain of the shambolic Man U team, did the same to Brad Collins (goalkeeper) after the final penalty. No grace, no class. Difficult to imagine Cristiano Ronaldo, not always the least self-regarding of characters, behaving that way - not that the team he played in (first time round) would have had much difficulty overcoming a second-division outfit.
Quote from: DaveF on April 22, 2024, 12:36:19 AMTo one of the best matches I've ever attended yesterday: FA Cup semi-final at Wembley. Coventry City 3, Man Utd 3 (Man U 4-2 on penalties) doesn't tell half the story. First half was like a practice match for Utd, as Cov had completely failed to turn up, and it could easily have been 6-0 at half time, rather than just 2. Another Man U goal at the start of the second half didn't help. But then the Sky Blue tap got turned on, and after wave upon wave of attacks we got it back to 3-3 at full time. No goals in extra time, apart from a "winner" for us that was judged offside (I can't see it, I really can't - definitely level.) Then penalties... At the end all Man U players and fans slunk away, probably ashamed to beat a lower-league team in such a way - we stayed for half an hour, singing and waving our flags. We liked some of the Man U songs, so sang them as well (somebody had to). Another day to go into Coventry folklore.
Fabulous performance. The passing range and speed of counter attacks from a Championship club was a sight to behold after the crap served up by my so called 'big' club recently. I would take Everton reject Ellis Simms off you in a heartbeat. Seeing the joy (and tears) from Coventry fans was the one bright spot from my not very good weekend, that day will stay with you for ever. As for the (winning) goal I was convinced at the time it wasn't offside. My judgment based on position of players compared to the straight cut lines of grass of the Wembley pitch.
Quote from: Irons on April 22, 2024, 07:47:36 AMFabulous performance. The passing range and speed of counter attacks from a Championship club was a sight to behold after the crap served up by my so called 'big' club recently. I would take Everton reject Ellis Simms off you in a heartbeat. Seeing the joy (and tears) from Coventry fans was the one bright spot from my not very good weekend, that day will stay with you for ever. As for the (winning) goal I was convinced at the time it wasn't offside. My judgment based on position of players compared to the straight cut lines of grass of the Wembley pitch.
Thank you - and I hope your bad weekend was solely down to the thrashing doled out by your neighbours from SE25, rather than anything more serious (not a comment that Bill Shankly would have understood). Yeah, those 50 minutes from the third United goal up to the end of extra time were quite literally awe-inspiring - much the same as we played the whole game against Wolves in the previous round. Unfortunately, Cov being Cov, we can also be awe-inspiringly bad, as in last week's 3-0 drubbing by Birmingham.
Favourite non-football episode has to be singing our respective "anthems" before kick-off - ours is
We'll live and die in these towns by The Enemy - typical Cov humour; I guess it was a toss-up between that and The Specials'
Ghost town - while theirs apparently is
Take me home, United road, which neither makes sense nor scans, but which we also sing to the words
Take me home, Highfield Road, which does both. So we did -
ffff to their apologetic
mf.
I got talking to some Chelsea fans on the tube back to Uxbridge - they wanted Ellis Simms as well (apparently their nickname for Nicolas Jackson is "Bambi on Ice".) As Mrs Thatcher said - No! No! No!
Quote from: DaveF on April 22, 2024, 10:22:40 AMThank you - and I hope your bad weekend was solely down to the thrashing doled out by your neighbours from SE25, rather than anything more serious (not a comment that Bill Shankly would have understood). Yeah, those 50 minutes from the third United goal up to the end of extra time were quite literally awe-inspiring - much the same as we played the whole game against Wolves in the previous round. Unfortunately, Cov being Cov, we can also be awe-inspiringly bad, as in last week's 3-0 drubbing by Birmingham.
Favourite non-football episode has to be singing our respective "anthems" before kick-off - ours is We'll live and die in these towns by The Enemy - typical Cov humour; I guess it was a toss-up between that and The Specials' Ghost town - while theirs apparently is Take me home, United road, which neither makes sense nor scans, but which we also sing to the words Take me home, Highfield Road, which does both. So we did - ffff to their apologetic mf.
I got talking to some Chelsea fans on the tube back to Uxbridge - they wanted Ellis Simms as well (apparently their nickname for Nicolas Jackson is "Bambi on Ice".) As Mrs Thatcher said - No! No! No!
I like your manager (ex Man U). Arteta he ain't, thankfully.
Quote from: Irons on April 22, 2024, 11:13:16 PMI like your manager (ex Man U). Arteta he ain't, thankfully.
He's not for sale either ;) I think (hope) he's sensible enough to realise that if he went to a "big" club, and if he didn't get at least 13 points out of his first 15, he'd be packing his bags again soon enough.
Thank you West Ham and
@Irons 8)
Now, if you could do the same again on the last game of the season at the Etihad, this "Gunners" household would be grateful and possibly very happy by then*
;D
*subject to Spurs not spoiling our season tomorrow... :-X
Norf London Derby - anything can happen.
Quote from: Papy Oli on April 27, 2024, 05:32:26 AMThank you West Ham and @Irons 8)
Now, if you could do the same again on the last game of the season at the Etihad, this "Gunners" household would be grateful and possibly very happy by then*
;D
*subject to Spurs not spoiling our season tomorrow... :-X
Pleased to be of service, Olivier. 8)
Being a Chelsea fan I'm not talking about football at the moment!
:-\
Quote from: vandermolen on April 28, 2024, 01:19:10 AMBeing a Chelsea fan I'm not talking about football at the moment!
:-\
You've got no worries compared to me.
Until the debacle that was the Mason Greenwood affair I was a Man U supporter. I've never seen a sporting club in any discipline shoot itself in the foot so many times. With Greenwood they had a chance to stand up and state the obvious which was that the police and the original complainant (who is now the mother of his child) had dropped all charges so what's the issue? However, they let the woke brigade and the media vultures determine what was going to happen.
I watched the highlights, looks like Tottenham v Arsenal had its fair share of entertainment.
Having lived in Yorkshire for 8 years, I have a soft spot for Leeds United, who are likeley to be toppled from automatic promotion into the play-offs by Ipswich with a game in hand and all to play for. I watched Leeds knock the hellfire daylights out of Celtic in 72 or 73 on a black and white telly, so I shouldn't really like them, but COME ON THE LEEDS! :P :-\
Quote from: Holden on April 28, 2024, 12:59:13 PMYou've got no worries compared to me.
Until the debacle that was the Mason Greenwood affair I was a Man U supporter. I've never seen a sporting club in any discipline shoot itself in the foot so many times. With Greenwood they had a chance to stand up and state the obvious which was that the police and the original complainant (who is now the mother of his child) had dropped all charges so what's the issue? However, they let the woke brigade and the media vultures determine what was going to happen.
Yes, I understand, although the debacle at Stamford Bridge has been dispiriting.
Quote from: vandermolen on April 29, 2024, 12:01:12 AMYes, I understand, although the debacle at Stamford Bridge has been dispiriting.
...and all those decade-long contacts...
Almost forgot to celebrate St. Totteringham's Day!
This is wild:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-05-22/oaktree-says-it-has-taken-ownership-of-inter-milan-football-club (https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-05-22/oaktree-says-it-has-taken-ownership-of-inter-milan-football-club?fromMostRead=true)
Oaktree Capital Management took ownership of Italy's Inter Milan, one of the most storied football clubs in Europe, after its Chinese owner defaulted on a loan.
The US fund has taken control of the club as of Wednesday after conglomerate Suning Holding Group Co. failed to repay €395 million ($428 million), Oaktree said in an emailed statement. The collateral backing the debt was a majority stake in the football club.
Quote from: T. D. on May 22, 2024, 07:03:03 AMThis is wild:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-05-22/oaktree-says-it-has-taken-ownership-of-inter-milan-football-club (https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-05-22/oaktree-says-it-has-taken-ownership-of-inter-milan-football-club?fromMostRead=true)
Oaktree Capital Management took ownership of Italy's Inter Milan, one of the most storied football clubs in Europe, after its Chinese owner defaulted on a loan.
The US fund has taken control of the club as of Wednesday after conglomerate Suning Holding Group Co. failed to repay €395 million ($428 million), Oaktree said in an emailed statement. The collateral backing the debt was a majority stake in the football club.
That's interesting. Wonder whether or not they will keep it or try to find a buyer for it?
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on May 22, 2024, 07:51:52 AMThat's interesting. Wonder whether or not they will keep it or try to find a buyer for it?
PD
Per Wikipedia: Oaktree is an asset management firm specializing in "alternative investment strategies". They are the world's largest investor in distressed debt.
I would expect them to sell the interest in the football team. One might figure that they bought the distressed Chinese bonds because they were comfortable with the value of the collateral.
But they will surely go over the club's finances, now that they own such a big share. If the finances are not good, Oaktree might have to retain their interest for a while and try to effect a turnaround.
Quote from: T. D. on May 22, 2024, 08:50:19 AMPer Wikipedia: Oaktree is an asset management firm specializing in "alternative investment strategies". They are the world's largest investor in distressed debt.
I would expect them to sell the interest in the football team. One might figure that they bought the distressed Chinese bonds because they were comfortable with the value of the collateral.
But they will surely go over the club's finances, now that they own such a big share. If the finances are not good, Oaktree might have to retain their interest for a while and try to effect a turnaround.
Wonder how good they are at coaching football? ;)
And, yes, I would imagine that they did do some serious research before agreeing to go ahead with the deal.
PD
Quote from: T. D. on May 22, 2024, 08:50:19 AMPer Wikipedia: Oaktree is an asset management firm specializing in "alternative investment strategies". They are the world's largest investor in distressed debt.
I would expect them to sell the interest in the football team. One might figure that they bought the distressed Chinese bonds because they were comfortable with the value of the collateral.
But they will surely go over the club's finances, now that they own such a big share. If the finances are not good, Oaktree might have to retain their interest for a while and try to effect a turnaround.
I don't know know if Oaktree keeps the team or not. Howard Marks- chairman and owner of Oaktree- is a well-respected, long-term value investor, as well as very generous philanthropist. He is not a speculator. Marks values arts and science. He minored Japanese studies at college and he likes Zen and oriental philosophies. He is respected by many people, including Warren Buffet.
Well, three vacant EPL managers jobs but who would want them. All of them are what I would describe as poisoned chalices - quite simply you're on a hiding to nothing. Why?
Liverpool - Thousands of rabid scousers on your back who will never be satisfied with anything less than the treble
Chelsea - whose owner thinks he knows more about the transfer market than anyone else
Brighton - Once again, any new manager gets virtually no choice in the transfer market which is why de Zerbi left.
Chelsea, eh? And they were on a good run.
The Chelsea owner--who is also the majority owner of the Dodgers, thinks he can run a football team just like a baseball team. In baseball, you can build a winner by hoarding several star players, for in baseball, the individual--be it a hitter or a pitcher, can win the game for you individually, perhaps more than any other sport. If a pitcher is on, he can pitch a no-hitter. A hitter can hit three homers in a game, without the rest of the team doing much. BUT, football is a whole different game.
Now, winning the FA Cup presents more of a headache for United... What to do with ten Hag?
Quote from: springrite on May 26, 2024, 05:38:44 AMThe Chelsea owner--who is also the majority owner of the Dodgers, thinks he can run a football team just like a baseball team. In baseball, you can build a winner by hoarding several star players, for in baseball, the individual--be it a hitter or a pitcher, can win the game for you individually, perhaps more than any other sport. If a pitcher is on, he can pitch a no-hitter. A hitter can hit three homers in a game, without the rest of the team doing much. BUT, football is a whole different game.
Now, winning the FA Cup presents more of a headache for United... What to do with ten Hag?
Foreign owners of football clubs should heed the advice of Simon Jorden who lost a packet at Crystal Palace.
"If you want to make a small fortune owning a football club start with a large one!"
Well, Scotland were not great - unlike their traveling support. Their opponents Germany on the other hand, I thought very good indeed and nailed on for the final.
I had plans to go find a bar in Madrid to watch the Spanish play.
That plan didn't come to pass for a couple of reasons. I half-watched the 2nd half in my hotel room...
I'm realising it takes a LOT more concentration to watch a football match when you only understand about 2% of the commentary. I didn't have the focus yesterday once I saw the halftime score.
Quote from: Irons on June 15, 2024, 06:28:42 AMWell, Scotland were not great - unlike their traveling support. Their opponents Germany on the other hand, I thought very good indeed and nailed on for the final.
Supposedly one commentator said that Scotland did so poorly, it's hard to tell whether Germany was really that good...
Germany was rather mediocre in the last few test matches, so I am still wary. But they seem to be considerably better than their poor performances in 2018, 20, 22.
Spain was also better than expected, this seems the toughest group and could become quite exciting already in the group stage.
Quote from: Jo498 on June 16, 2024, 12:16:48 AMSupposedly one commentator said that Scotland did so poorly, it's hard to tell whether Germany was really that good...
Germany was rather mediocre in the last few test matches, so I am still wary. But they seem to be considerably better than their poor performances in 2018, 20, 22.
Spain was also better than expected, this seems the toughest group and could become quite exciting already in the group stage.
Yes, Spain are good. Being host nation will work to Germany's advantage I feel. I am very impressed with the German attacking four including the young lad on the wing who is mustard.
It is true Scotland were poor but you can only beat what is in front of you and Germany did that impressively.
Apparently it is more then possible that the top three (out of four) from a group can go through to the knockout stages
Yes, only 8/24 teams are eliminated in the group stage, the 6 on the last position in each group and the 2 worst of the 3rd placed teams. This is similar to the procedure in the World cup with 24 teams in 1986-94 It's a bit better now because with 3 points for winning it's difficult to advance without at least one win whereas back then teams could get 3rd place in a group with draws and advance.
Quote from: Irons on June 16, 2024, 12:33:10 AMYes, Spain are good. Being host nation will work to Germany's advantage I feel. I am very impressed with the German attacking four including the young lad on the wing who is mustard.
It is true Scotland were poor but you can only beat what is in front of you and Germany did that impressively.
Apparently it is more then possible that the top three (out of four) from a group can go through to the knockout stages
Er, "who is mustard"? What does that mean? "Hot", as in a good player? :-[ Oh, the differences in our languages. :(
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 16, 2024, 03:39:33 PMEr, "who is mustard"? What does that mean? "Hot", as in a good player? :-[ Oh, the differences in our languages. :(
PD
Not as different as you think! ;D
https://www.dictionary.com/e/cut-the-mustard/
Quote from: Irons on June 16, 2024, 11:17:14 PMNot as different as you think! ;D
https://www.dictionary.com/e/cut-the-mustard/
I read there that supposedly in the early 20th century, people would call(?) or describe other folks as mustard. I've only heard the phrase though in a negative sense...as in "that doesn't cut the mustard".
In any event, to whom were you referring? :)
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 16, 2024, 03:39:33 PMEr, "who is mustard"? What does that mean? "Hot", as in a good player? :-[ Oh, the differences in our languages. :(
PD
I'm not a big football follower nor familiar with the vernacular, but I think the reference was to Musiala being an excellent player.
Pleasantly surprised to see Toni Kroos playing so well, not just in Euros but in recent Champions League.
During Germany's bad 2022 World Cup showing, he was savaged by many critics and often called "washed up".
Quote from: T. D. on June 17, 2024, 05:21:19 AMI'm not a big football follower nor familiar with the vernacular, but I think the reference was to Musiala being an excellent player.
I'm pleasantly surprised to see Toni Kroos playing so well, not just in Euros but in recent Champions League.
During Germany's bad 2022 World Cup showing, he was savaged by many critics and often called "washed up".
Thanks (re which player).
PD
Following a sensational play with particularly impeccable defense, Romania beats Ukraine 3-0. 8)
They're getting raved about on the radio here.
Big surprise, Slovakia beats Belgium 1-0. Two Belgian goals were nullified by VAR (offside and handball).
Nice win for Janacek's team there... Cesar Franck, Guillaume Lekeu, Eugène Ysaye, Henri Vieuxtemps, Johannes Ockeghem, Henri Pousseur, your boys took a hell of a beating....
Quote from: Luke on June 17, 2024, 10:03:40 AMNice win for Janacek's team there... Cesar Franck, Guillaume Lekeu, Eugène Ysaye, Henri Vieuxtemps, Johannes Ockeghem, Henri Pousseur, your boys took a hell of a beating....
Ahem... Janacek is Czech. :D
Quote from: Florestan on June 17, 2024, 10:05:00 AMAhem... Janacek is Czech. :D
Well,
technically ... ;D but culturally Slovak at heart
Quote from: Luke on June 17, 2024, 10:09:32 AMWell, technically ... ;D but culturally Slovak at heart
Well then, Hummel was technically a Slovakian (born in Bratislava). :D
The Czech team will play tomorrow against Portugal.
Quote from: Florestan on June 17, 2024, 10:12:11 AMWell then, Hummel was technically a Slovakian (born in Bratislava). :D
The Slovaks should take everyone they can get. ;D
Quote from: Florestan on June 17, 2024, 09:59:29 AMBig surprise, Slovakia beats Belgium 1-0. Two Belgian goals were nullified by VAR (offside and handball).
First upset of the tournament. Slovakia had some lucky breaks but I thought they played well and pleased they beat the third favourites.
Big match for Scotland tomorrow. Will not be easy as the Swiss looked good against Hungary.
Very good match between Turkey and Georgia, 3-1. Two golazos scored by Turkey, the second almost identical with the first one scored by Romania yesterday.
I'm trying to keep up with the news, but am watching some of the grass court pre-Wimbledon tournaments. Wimbledon starts soon. Changing of the guard happening in tennis now. Hard to see the top three retiring/retired (Nadal, I expect soon and Federer, retired). (How much longer will Novak hang in there?) and also what Murray has been going through (and still fighting with a metal hip).
Who all do you think in terms of teams are most likely to win--and who would you like to win? :)
PD
I'm seeing bits and pieces of the tournament but missed 'my' Belgium falling over.
Given I'm in Spain and soon Portugal, I can adopt new teams... come the final I'll be in Cristiano Ronaldo's home town so it would be WILD if Portugal made it.
Quote from: Madiel on June 18, 2024, 12:04:11 PMI'm seeing bits and pieces of the tournament but missed 'my' Belgium falling over.
Given I'm in Spain and soon Portugal, I can adopt new teams... come the final I'll be in Cristiano Ronaldo's home town so it would be WILD if Portugal made it.
Had you been a big Belgium supporter for long Madiel? And between the two teams, who would you prefer wins?
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 18, 2024, 12:48:08 PMHad you been a big Belgium supporter for long Madiel? And between the two teams, who would you prefer wins?
PD
I've been a Belgium supporter since childhood.
These days my inclinations between most teams are fairly mixed and I'm not paying that much attention while travelling... I don't LIKE Ronaldo, I just think it's interesting to try and engage with the tournament while in Europe. And maybe once I'm in Portugal I'll really like the place and want to support them. But 7 weeks in Spain has certainly made me attached to the place. Same as my times in Denmark made me attached there. Visiting England doesn't seem to have the same effect...
Albania-Croatia 2-2, a very dramatic game, reflected in how the score evolved: 1-0, 1-1, 1-2, 2-2. Albania scored for draw towards the end of the extra-time, by the same player who scored an own goal for 1-2. I'm tempted to describe the match as a Balkan War. ;D
Quote from: Florestan on June 18, 2024, 10:24:15 AMVery good match between Turkey and Georgia, 3-1. Two golazos scored by Turkey, the second almost identical with the first one scored by Romania yesterday.
Great game, best so far. Score line flatters Turkey.
Quote from: Madiel on June 18, 2024, 11:13:53 PMI've been a Belgium supporter since childhood.
These days my inclinations between most teams are fairly mixed and I'm not paying that much attention while travelling... I don't LIKE Ronaldo, I just think it's interesting to try and engage with the tournament while in Europe. And maybe once I'm in Portugal I'll really like the place and want to support them. But 7 weeks in Spain has certainly made me attached to the place. Same as my times in Denmark made me attached there. Visiting England doesn't seem to have the same effect...
Hope that you continue to enjoy your travels. And [please folks don't shoot me here!], in the end, it's only a game. :) Meant respectfully, as you all know, I love my tennis. ;)
PD
Quote from: Madiel on June 18, 2024, 11:13:53 PMI've been a Belgium supporter since childhood.
They'll play the next game against Romania, so we'll be foes Saturday night. :laugh:
Quote from: Florestan on June 19, 2024, 12:03:40 PMThey'll play the next game against Romania, so we'll be foes Saturday night. :laugh:
Well won't THAT add to the fun, especially if Belgium doesn't bounce back.
Quote from: Florestan on June 19, 2024, 07:01:58 AMAlbania-Croatia 2-2, a very dramatic game, reflected in how the score evolved: 1-0, 1-1, 1-2, 2-2. Albania scored for draw towards the end of the extra-time, by the same player who scored an own goal for 1-2. I'm tempted to describe the match as a Balkan War. ;D
Well, today we had the Second Balkan War, Slovenia - Serbia 1 - 1, Serbia scoring in the last seconds of the extra-time. :laugh:
Also, Denmark - England 1 - 1.
England were second best in all departments. A poor performance and deservedly booed off at full time by the travelling support.
Quote from: Irons on June 20, 2024, 01:31:18 PMEngland were second best in all departments. A poor performance and deservedly booed off at full time by the travelling support.
That sounds pretty harsh at my end. :(
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 20, 2024, 02:02:53 PMThat sounds pretty harsh at my end. :(
PD
And yet it's the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.
Denmark were better overall. Much better.
Quote from: Florestan on June 20, 2024, 02:08:03 PMAnd yet it's the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.
Denmark were better overall. Much better.
No, it's the booing off part that I think was harsh.
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 20, 2024, 02:27:23 PMNo, it's the booing off part that I think was harsh.
PD
I disagree. People who paid admission tickets and had high expectations from their team are perfectly entitled to boo off if their expectations were frustrated. Booing off is a perfectly legitimate free speech.
Yeah England were an absolute disgrace yesterday and deserve all the criticism that's coming to them. We need to put like 6 or 7 on Slovenia to wash the foul stench of the last few weeks off.
As long as England wins their group and we don't get them in the next round, I am fine with any of their results :D
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on June 20, 2024, 02:27:23 PMNo, it's the booing off part that I think was harsh.
PD
May look harsh from afar PD but what needs taken in account these players - although I don't necessarily blame them - earn in a week what normal people earn in five years, lauded to the heavens and told by our press repeatedly how good they are. After the first game it felt like the whole country got on their knees and saluted the greatness of Jude Bellingham. A 20 year old boy! No wonder he was crap last night. The manager was tactically outthought which is a recurring situation in tournament football. Spain or Germany will win this.
Yes England were really poor, they seemed listless, predictable and hamstrung. Don't know much about football and have no idea how one overcomes such lethargy, but then neither apparently does Gareth Southgate.
I'm here for the 2nd half of Belgium v Romania...
Well I like the opening scoreline for one thing.
Quote from: Madiel on June 22, 2024, 12:07:04 PMI'm here for the 2nd half of Belgium v Romania...
Well I like the opening scoreline for one thing.
Belgium - România 2 - 0. A very good match. Belgium was clearly the better team and their victory is fully deserved. Nevertheless, România did not play that bad in the first half and not bad at all în the second one. We could have scored at least once. We lost but I dare say we played better than England în their draw with Denmark. All teams în this group have 3 points so all can advance to the next round. We must beat Slovakia, we can beat Slovakia.
Quote from: Florestan on June 22, 2024, 01:09:07 PMBelgium - România 2 - 0. A very good match. Belgium was clearly the better team and their victory is fully deserved. Nevertheless, România did not play that bad in the first half and not bad at all în the second one. We could have scored at least once. We lost but I dare say we played better than England în their draw with Denmark. All teams în this group have 3 points so all can advance to the next round. We must beat Slovakia, we can beat Slovakia.
I watched and enjoyed second half. A frantic game where both teams went for it. Romania should have scored with scoreline at 1-0, I would not have described it as a "sitter" but not far off. De Bruyne the difference with his cool head and passing, what a player!
I agree with you, Rumania played with passion and adventure unlike England.
Scotland and Hungary both need to win, so why are they being boring?
Wasn't boring at the end. Was brutal.
The Swiss almost won with only about 1/3 posession, corners etc. But they played very well with early defense and dangerous counters.
Germany showed some hints of their old problems, some defense weakness (another Swiss goal was offside by a hair's breadth) and poor ratio of goals/chances as well as little danger from corners and free kicks. Is there a common English expression for corners + free kicks? (In German it's "Standardsituationen")
Quote from: Jo498 on June 23, 2024, 01:11:01 PMIs there a common English expression for corners + free kicks? (In German it's "Standardsituationen")
They usually call them "set pieces".
Quote from: Luke on June 23, 2024, 01:06:30 PMWasn't boring at the end. Was brutal.
Credit to Hungary for at least constructing the goal well.
But both teams really rolled the dice on "we only have one goal in us, let's leave it until the end".
Scotland had a total of three shots on target over three games in their group. A miracle if they had gone through. Saying that they nearly did! Not sure if it was a pen when Armstrong was through on goal, but should have gone to VAR at least.
Last gasp goals two nights in a row!
That missed penalty and scored goal sequence by Modrić could have made the match of this tournament. Classic Italian equalizer in desperation though. All good fun on a Monday night.
Btw I doubt Norway would have made a better impression than Scotland, star players and all. Maybe after a crash course in Croatianism.
I rooted for Croatia and was very sorry for them. They worked hard and fought heroically to preserve their victory and would have deserved it, especially Modrić for whom this was the last tournament in his life. A real pity.
Felt sorry for the loyal Scottish fans. The team never ever looked like scoring (their only goals were an own goal and a deflection).
England are following the usual pattern of massive and unrealistic over-expectation followed by crushing disappointment. Still, it's been fun watching the players and TV pundits turn on each other ('Lineker, you should have stuck to selling crisps' etc)
If England perform tonight like the first two games my advice to both team and manager it may be a good idea not coming home. I have no love for the highest paid employee at the BBC but what Lineker said on his podcast is spot on, we were s---.
Watching Italy v Croatia, what a great advert for football! Bundles of skill, passion and excitement.
Quote from: Irons on June 25, 2024, 02:17:32 AMIf England perform tonight like the first two games my advice to both team and manager it may be a good idea not coming home.
And if they perform well I imagine all will be swiftly forgotten/forgiven, and we'll return to
@vandermolen's accurate assessment of 'the usual pattern of massive and unrealistic over-expectation followed by crushing disappointment.' ::)
Quote from: Irons on June 25, 2024, 02:17:32 AMWatching Italy v Croatia, what a great advert for football! Bundles of skill, passion and excitement.
I've been watching snatches of games here and there, but I saw the end of Italy/Croatia, what must that have felt like to Croatia! :o Crushing! I felt very sorry for them.
It was the toughest group where one cannot afford a 0-3 loss in the first game (although with 4/6 3rd placed advancing one shouldn't really complain). I hope the Swiss beat Italy.
Quote from: Irons on June 23, 2024, 11:36:30 PMScotland had a total of three shots on target over three games in their group. A miracle if they had gone through. Saying that they nearly did! Not sure if it was a pen when Armstrong was through on goal, but should have gone to VAR at least.
Yes, unlike the studio 'experts' I wasn't sure that it was a penalty either - but it should have gone to VAR at least.
Austria beats Netherlands 3-2 and wins the group. France comes second after a draw with Poland 1-1. Unbelievable, but then again that's the beauty of football, especially as of late.
Sigh....
:blank:
Quote from: Papy Oli on June 25, 2024, 10:11:38 AMSigh....
:blank:
Sorry, Papy!
Believe it or not, I actually watched the game (I seldom watch football.). Some nice twists and turns there. Also, I have never seen a case in which they had to retake a penalty kick because the goalkeeper didn't have one of his feet behind the line.
I thought that the Polish goalkeeper did a great job today too.
They showed Novak Djokovic at the match between Denmark and Serbia supporting his country's team.
PD
Lord but England are flat and boring this championship.
Quote from: Luke on June 25, 2024, 12:21:21 PMLord but England are flat and boring this championship.
Have they ever been otherwise? ;D
The matches earlier, on the other hand.... Wow! There was a five minute phase where goals and penalties and retaken penalties and more goals were flying in both matches. Quite something to hear
Quote from: Florestan on June 25, 2024, 12:22:56 PMHave they ever been otherwise? ;D
Now hang on, play fair, there have been the odd ten minutes here and there over the decades!
Quote from: Luke on June 25, 2024, 12:25:22 PMNow hang on, play fair, there have been the odd ten minutes here and there over the decades!
:laugh:
Rossini said similar things about Wagner, of course.
Quote from: Luke on June 25, 2024, 12:39:28 PMRossini said similar things about Wagner, of course.
If only England had the sparkling phantasy of the former and the solid construcțion of the latter...
That was 94 minutes of my life I'll never get back!
One positive, every sub improved performance. Ridiculous that Southgate entered this tournament without knowing the best partner for Declan Rice.
Listening on Talk Sport this morning to an interesting interview with Emmanuel Petit who makes the point France are as poor as we are (he forgets to mention France are in a much harder group)! The way the draw falls, although both teams have not played well a France v England final is not beyond impossibility. Can't see it myself.
Half time, Romania - Slovakia 1-1, Romania scoring for draw by a VAR penalty. Very lively and disputed match.
Belgium - Ukraine 0-0.
So far, so good. Romania wins the group and will meet either The Netherlands or Slovenia.
Quote from: Florestan on June 26, 2024, 08:52:47 AMRomania wins the group and will meet either The Netherlands or Slovenia.
Yessss, we did it! Hell, yeah! 8)
(My joy is due to the fact that we avoided Spain and France. :laugh: )
Now, if Slovenia, we have good chances. If The Netherlands, less so but then again, if Austria beat them, we could beat them too.
Truth be told, not even in my wettest dreams have I dreamed Romania would win the group. ;D
EDIT: Congratulations, Slovakia! I'm very pleased that they too will make it to the next round!
Some interesting matches coming up. Some teams that haven't performed well have a chance to recover (that's how tournament football works). Certainly, Romania and Austria have really shuffled the draw from what might have been expected.
Ralf Rangnick was treated poorly when appointed interim manager of Manchester United. He has certainly resurrected his reputation with Austria. The surprise team of the tournament.
Quote from: Irons on June 26, 2024, 03:05:21 AMThat was 94 minutes of my life I'll never get back!
One positive, every sub improved performance. Ridiculous that Southgate entered this tournament without knowing the best partner for Declan Rice.
Yes, very noticeable the difference the subs made. What I find bizarre, or at least don't really understand, is how we finished top of the group playing so poorly. Does this just mean the opposition were rubbish?
Perhaps we should just return to the tactics of the 1933 Arsenal team ..
Quote from: Iota on June 27, 2024, 10:23:55 AMYes, very noticeable the difference the subs made. What I find bizarre, or at least don't really understand, is how we finished top of the group playing so poorly. Does this just mean the opposition were rubbish?
Perhaps we should just return to the tactics of the 1933 Arsenal team ..
Something is wrong with this competition. How can it be right and fair that both England and Ukraine finished group stages with four points. England finished top and through to knockout stages while Ukraine finished bottom of their group and going home. I understand the way the other results panned out caused this but strikes me as unfair, especially as Ukraine were in a more difficult group and their points harder won.
It's the same rules for all. 4th place is out and there is a method for ranking the 3rd placed. UKR was not in a particularly hard but in an unexpectedly balanced group which led to the rare situation. The toughest group "on paper" was B, IMO.
FWIW this was even worse before one got 3 points for a win.
That's one reason I am against any 3rd placed advancing (although in theory a similar situation could occur with only 1+2 advancing). But because it's a billion$ business they blew up the Euros to 24 teams when 16 was the perfect size. And they want to go to 48? teams for the world cup that would last 6 weeks which seems madness! Again, 32 was the perfect number for the WC avoiding the trouble with 3rd placed teams
Quote from: Iota on June 27, 2024, 10:23:55 AMYes, very noticeable the difference the subs made. What I find bizarre, or at least don't really understand, is how we finished top of the group playing so poorly. Does this just mean the opposition were rubbish?
Perhaps we should just return to the tactics of the 1933 Arsenal team ..
I love that video!
Quote from: vandermolen on June 28, 2024, 01:36:45 AMI love that video!
Haha, so do I! Harry Enfield at the top of his game.
Quote from: Irons on June 27, 2024, 11:14:29 PMSomething is wrong with this competition. How can it be right and fair that both England and Ukraine finished group stages with four points. England finished top and through to knockout stages while Ukraine finished bottom of their group and going home. I understand the way the other results panned out caused this but strikes me as unfair, especially as Ukraine were in a more difficult group and their points harder won.
If you truly understand, then you understand that the requirement is to finish in a place, not to earn a certain number of points.
You're pointing at a group that ended up with a highly unusual result. Highly. I mean, I can't remember the last time in any competition I saw all 4 teams end up on equal points, but here we are.
But rare cases make bad rules. In nearly every tournament you can make arguments that one team was lucky or unlucky, but you can't go changing the rules after the fact. Ukraine was beaten more heavily than anyone else so that's why they were last in their group.
Quote from: Madiel on June 29, 2024, 09:06:36 AMUkraine was beaten more heavily than anyone else so that's why they were last in their group.
This.
And to be honest fully, as of late I've had the impression that Ukraine really felt entitled to whatever they wanted, from money and armament to winning the Euro 2024 just because they are victims of a Russian aggression. I'm sorry for them but it doesn't work like that. ;D
Also, England had FIVE points. Not four. So the entire premise of the argument was wrong. England had more points than every single team in that other group.
Well I know who I'm cheering tonight... but are Germany the kind of team who do well with a home crowd or feel the pressure?
Quote from: Madiel on June 29, 2024, 09:42:20 AMAlso, England had FIVE points. Not four. So the entire premise of the argument was wrong. England had more points than every single team in that other group.
The entire premise of the argument would have been wrong even had England advanced to the next stage with only two points. The rules are very clear: the first and second place go to the next stage automatically, the third place goes to the next stage only if such and such criteria are met. Any fuss and kerfuffle about these very clear and fair rules is nil and void.
Quote from: Madiel on June 29, 2024, 10:52:50 AMWell I know who I'm cheering tonight... but are Germany the kind of team who do well with a home crowd or feel the pressure?
I rooted for
Switzerland on behalf of
Croatia and was extremely satisfied.
Arrivederci,
Italia! 8)
I am absolutely neutral for
Germany -
Denmark.
Tomorrow, though, I will be all
Go, Slovakia!
Quote from: Florestan on June 29, 2024, 10:57:05 AMThe entire premise of the argument would have been wrong even had England advanced to the next stage with only two points. The rules are very clear: the first and second place go to the next stage automatically, the third place goes to the next stage only if such and such criteria are met. Any fuss and kerfuffle about these very clear and fair rules is nil and void.
Well yes, I quite agree, but just thought it worth noting that BOTH halves of "it's not fair because they got the same number of points" can be disagreed with. Not only was it fair, they didn't get the same number of points.
Germany - Denmark 2 - 0
Literally,
Unter Donner und Blitz ;D
Disappointed.
It was an exciting game and although Germany overall profited from dubious VAR decisions I think they deserved it overall for the dominance before the thunderstorm break.
But above all I think we really need a debate how VAR is destroying the sport. Without VAR there would very probably have been an early goal for Germany, the early goal after the break for Denmark and almost certainly no penalty (I honestly hoped they would not score in the penalty because I always found involuntary handball utterly unfair, even before VAR).
Quote from: Jo498 on June 29, 2024, 10:36:39 PMIt was an exciting game and although Germany overall profited from dubious VAR decisions I think they deserved it overall for the dominance before the thunderstorm break.
But above all I think we really need a debate how VAR is destroying the sport. Without VAR there would very probably have been an early goal for Germany, the early goal after the break for Denmark and almost certainly no penalty (I honestly hoped they would not score in the penalty because I always found involuntary handball utterly unfair, even before VAR).
I always thought unfairness was one of the main attractions of football, giving fans something to argue about for years afterwards and hopes for justice to come ;) .
Quote from: steve ridgway on June 29, 2024, 10:50:33 PMI always thought unfairness was one of the main attractions of football, giving fans something to argue about for years afterwards and hopes for justice to come ;) .
Not to mention that in the modern world fairness and honour were replaced with short-term profits and nonsense generated in campuses.
VAR is not in and of itself destroying the sport. It's important for offside which is objective. People wanting handball for everything is a problem. There are times whether I wonder if clubs are going to start scouting for talented amputees to play as defenders. And more generally, looking at everything in slow motion is altering the perception.
The language around VAR is a problem in that it strongly suggests to the referee they've made a mistake. And sometimes they clearly have. But in more ambiguous cases I'd like to see more examples of referees sticking to their original opinion.
Half time, England - Slovakia 0-1.
The English players seem not to be alive. ;D
Quote from: Luke on June 25, 2024, 12:21:21 PMLord but England are flat and boring this championship.
Quoting myself. This x 100
Fickle me. Scratch that. Bellingham overhead kick at 95 minutes
Quote from: Luke on June 30, 2024, 09:56:14 AMFickle me. Scratch that. Bellingham overhead kick at 95 minutes
It was THE FIRST shot on goal for England in 95 minutes. Unbelievable.
I hope Slovakia wins eventually, although they are obviously tired and demoralized.
It's now 2-1 England. To be fair I think Slovakia also only had one shot on target, didn't they? Or did I forget one?
Quote from: Luke on June 30, 2024, 10:05:06 AMIt's now 2-1 England. To be fair I think Slovakia also only had one shot on target, didn't they? Or did I forget one?
They had two.
England will win but of all the favorites they are clearly the most overrated.
The problem with extra time is there's no time between matches for dinner.
Quote from: Luke on June 30, 2024, 09:56:14 AMFickle me. Scratch that. Bellingham overhead kick at 95 minutes
That was amazing! What a bicycle kick! ;D
Looked to me like Slovakia was going to tie it at the end of the overtime, but the English goalie was able to grab it.
PD
Quote from: Luke on June 30, 2024, 10:05:06 AMIt's now 2-1 England. To be fair I think Slovakia also only had one shot on target, didn't they? Or did I forget one?
Stones almost gifted them a goal.
Quote from: vandermolen on July 01, 2024, 01:14:55 AMStones almost gifted them a goal.
Yes, that was absurd!
Commentators often refer to how superb people like Stones are in the Premier League, but playing in this setting with this group of players, seems to have stunted all their abilities, with the odd exceptional moments from Jude Bellingham e.g. I would have thought finding the right blend of players is down to the manager, and if they're not working, change them, but my knowledge is very limited. Frustrating to watch though.
Quote from: Iota on July 01, 2024, 02:06:16 AMfinding the right blend of players is down to the manager, and if they're not working, change them
Or rather him.
I do think it's remarkably difficult for national coaches to build a cohesive team and tactics, because they have much less time with the players together compared to club teams.
It's not so surprising when it doesn't work, to me it's more surprising when it DOES work.
Quote from: Florestan on July 01, 2024, 03:09:08 AMOr rather him.
That doesn't seem feasible in the middle of a tournament.
Quote from: Madiel on July 01, 2024, 03:43:01 AMI do think it's remarkably difficult for national coaches to build a cohesive team and tactics, because they have much less time with the players together compared to club teams.
It's not so surprising when it doesn't work, to me it's more surprising when it DOES work.
I'm sure that's true, and Southgate seems to have done some great things with the England team over the years, but when they're misfiring/under-producing in the manner they have been in this tournament, it does make one wonder if he is still the right person to be in charge.
Quote from: Iota on July 01, 2024, 04:46:38 AMThat doesn't seem feasible in the middle of a tournament.
I'm sure that's true, and Southgate seems to have done some great things with the England team over the years, but when they're misfiring/under-producing in the manner they have been in this tournament, it does make one wonder if he is still the right person to be in charge.
His record over his tenure doesn't stand up to scrutiny. Southgate has never won a game in tournament football upsetting the odds when the opponents were favourite to win. When the opposition get serious England are eliminated.
Slovakia were better organised and deserved to win. The one difference being England have world-class players and what Bellingham did in the 96 minute is world-class. A moment of brilliance. Southgate is the highest paid coach at this tournament and that he is unable to get a tune out of this group of exceptional players is damming.
I'm now getting to watch France v Belgium in the small but very pleasant rooftop bar of my hotel in Coimbra (I arrived today), sipping rum and Coke.
Life is good. It would get better if Belgium wins!
And Portugal winning later would make the locals happy so I have my loyalties for the evening.
Edit: France seems to be doing most of the attacking against Belgium, which doesn't make me happy.
Never in doubt :P or skin of teeth depends how you see it... :blank:
That'll teach Belgium supporters for booing the French anthem. Courtois and the others can be bitter and hate us for another 2 years now... :laugh:
That was a terrible match for several reasons. I shall try to forget it.
Disappointing match but France was dominant and not undeservedly the winner. I still hope they don't get much further with such a defense dominated style.
Quote from: Jo498 on July 01, 2024, 10:16:39 AMDisappointing match but France was dominant and not undeservedly the winner. I still hope they don't get much further with such a defense dominated style.
Going to quarter finals with only 3 goals, two of which were actually own goals... Just a little better than England. ;D
Quote from: Irons on July 01, 2024, 08:02:28 AMHis record over his tenure doesn't stand up to scrutiny. Southgate has never won a game in tournament football upsetting the odds when the opponents were favourite to win. When the opposition get serious England are eliminated.
Interesting to hear. The reason I got the impression that Southgate must have had some impressive moments in his managerial history is that the commentator in yesterday's match said (if I'm remembering correctly) that when Southgate took over, the team and the set up was in chaos, he had transformed it into a well-performing outfit.
Quote from: Irons on July 01, 2024, 08:02:28 AMSlovakia were better organised and deserved to win. The one difference being England have world-class players and what Bellingham did in the 96 minute is world-class. A moment of brilliance. Southgate is the highest paid coach at this tournament and that he is unable to get a tune out of this group of exceptional players is damming.
This was my gut feeling too. Slovakia seemed a lively, talented team who seemed set to win. And before Bellingham's amazing goal, England had started to look almost like a team that wanted putting out of their (and their fans) misery.
Quote from: Iota on July 01, 2024, 10:31:54 AMbefore Bellingham's amazing goal, England...
...seemed like they were barely alive. ;D
Quote from: Florestan on July 01, 2024, 10:37:53 AM...seemed like they were barely alive. ;D
Well their imagination certainly seemed on life support.
The first major tournament that Southgate was in charge, the team exceeded expectations.
Quote from: Madiel on July 01, 2024, 11:13:06 AMThe first major tournament that Southgate was in charge, the team exceeded expectations.
After "Big Sam" I could have done that.
Out of the big football nations - France, Germany and Italy - England are the only one without a trophy in 2000's. This is of course not all down to Southgate. Supposedly best league in world football and second best on the International stage is frustrating.
I would love Southgate make me eat my words!
Quote from: Irons on July 01, 2024, 11:14:34 PM... Supposedly best league in world football...
A quiet "ehem" could be heard coming from Spain... ;D
Quote from: ritter on July 01, 2024, 11:19:16 PMA quiet "ehem" could be heard coming from Spain... ;D
Fair enough. Thought may not get away with that one! ;D
My club have just appointed a Spanish coach - and he seems a very nice chap. Our Director of Football is German. ;)
Quote from: Irons on July 01, 2024, 11:24:25 PMFair enough. Thought may not get away with that one! ;D
My club have just appointed a Spanish coach - and he seems a very nice chap. Our Director of Football is German. ;)
So you're a Seagull?
Quote from: Irons on July 01, 2024, 08:02:28 AMHis record over his tenure doesn't stand up to scrutiny. Southgate has never won a game in tournament football upsetting the odds when the opponents were favourite to win. When the opposition get serious England are eliminated.
Slovakia were better organised and deserved to win. The one difference being England have world-class players and what Bellingham did in the 96 minute is world-class. A moment of brilliance. Southgate is the highest paid coach at this tournament and that he is unable to get a tune out of this group of exceptional players is damming.
I watched a 15 minute review of the game. The goal a minute and a half before the added time expired was a rapturous moment, that's what football is all about. The Slovakian team reminded me of the Soviet national teams (not so in football, but in ice hockey in the 60s and 70s). The same utter seriousness of people who realise that if they don't give their best, they will face the most serious consequences at home.
Quote from: Irons on July 01, 2024, 11:14:34 PMAfter "Big Sam" I could have done that.
Out of the big football nations - France, Germany and Italy - England are the only one without a trophy in 2000's. This is of course not all down to Southgate. Supposedly best league in world football and second best on the International stage is frustrating.
I would love Southgate make me eat my words!
Sacrebleu, it shouldn't be my job but I'll have to put a good word in for Southgate.
- in the 20 years prior to Southgate, you could always hear about club "cliques" and rivalries within the English camp. That stopped with him and the rivalries stayed out at the door.
- All you could hear about prior to any tournaments in England pre-2016 was "are we going to have another heartbreak on penalties", cue videos on repeat of Batty, Southgate, Waddle and the likes, again and again.
Him of all people demystified this shoot-out malarkey and England finally won one. And when England lost one, that was in the final of the euro and yet he backed up his team, and knowing what Saka was going through and the despicable pile up on this player, he defended him to the hilt. I have not seen any such penalty heartbreak video onslaught this year, have you ? He finally taught everybody to move on a bit. He had, ages ago.
- He has been the coach for what, 8 years? In that time, he reached a WC 2018 Semi-final, a Euro 2020 Final. Basically the 2 best results of an England team since Euro 1996 and Italia 90. best run in 20+ years. He is one game away from reaching another major Semi-final.
- Have you had a media circus around him or the team, like you've had around Allardyce, Hodgson, Capello, Eriksson, MacLaren, Hoddle ? Nope.
- England has not played great at all or unexciting football... but then again, in this Euro, who has besides Germany, Spain, Georgia, and Austria maybe so far ? France has not scored in open play yet, we got someone else to do it for us. Yesterday was was the first game with some semblance of phases and attacking spells, against a Belgian team that parked the bus. France got the job done. Just like England did on Sunday.
- Not everybody becomes a footballing force overnight and reach some consistency like Spain, Germany, Italy or Brazil. Italy has now gone home. Brazil never won one single Euro ( :P :P ). Heck, look at the doldrums some of them have been in in recent years as well. For an example closer to home: It took France 25 years to rebuild from a WC 1958 3rd place, 14 years to rebuild from the 82-84 Platini era... another 20 to rebuild from the 98-00 Zidane golden era. Deschamps has now been the French coach for 12 years. In that time, He won one WC, finalist in another, and a Euro semi-final. He's only won one title, even with the wealth of players he had at his disposition. In 1.5x the time of Southgate so far, he only won one title. One. That's how scarce these are.
- Consider what he has (re)built so far in his spell with players like Saka, Foden, now Bellingham. Consider what he could teach to players like Mainoo, Palmer, Guehi, Gordon, Wharton... all for whom it is their first major tournament.
- Sometimes, it doesn't matter if the best Bundesliga scorer, the best Liga player, the Premier League player of the year are in your team. On the day, sometimes you just get kicked out (e.g. France V Switzerland in the last 16 of the last Euro). Sometimes, in one tournament, it doesn't gel. it doesn't mean you have to throw the baby away with the bath water.
Just my 2 pennies. :)
Quote from: ritter on July 01, 2024, 11:19:16 PMA quiet "ehem" could be heard coming from Spain... ;D
Ahem... There are only 2 clubs in your league, and one of them isn't even Spanish... >:D :laugh: :blank:
Quote from: Papy Oli on July 02, 2024, 04:02:23 AMSacrebleu, it shouldn't be my job but I'll have to put a good word in for Southgate.
- in the 20 years prior to Southgate, you could always hear about club "cliques" and rivalries within the English camp. That stopped with him and the rivalries stayed out at the door.
- All you could hear about prior to any tournaments in England pre-2016 was "are we going to have another heartbreak on penalties", cue videos on repeat of Batty, Southgate, Waddle and the likes, again and again.
Him of all people demystified this shoot-out malarkey and England finally won one. And when England lost one, that was in the final of the euro and yet he backed up his team, and knowing what Saka was going through and the despicable pile up on this player, he defended him to the hilt. I have not seen any such penalty heartbreak video onslaught this year, have you ? He finally taught everybody to move on a bit. He had, ages ago.
- He has been the coach for what, 8 years? In that time, he reached a WC 2018 Semi-final, a Euro 2020 Final. Basically the 2 best results of an England team since Euro 1996 and Italia 90. best run in 20+ years. He is one game away from reaching another major Semi-final.
- Have you had a media circus around him or the team, like you've had around Allardyce, Hodgson, Capello, Eriksson, MacLaren, Hoddle ? Nope.
- England has not played great at all or unexciting football... but then again, in this Euro, who has besides Germany, Spain, Georgia, and Austria maybe so far ? France has not scored in open play yet, we got someone else to do it for us. Yesterday was was the first game with some semblance of phases and attacking spells, against a Belgian team that parked the bus. France got the job done. Just like England did on Sunday.
- Not everybody becomes a footballing force overnight and reach some consistency like Spain, Germany, Italy or Brazil. Italy has now gone home. Brazil never won one single Euro ( :P :P ). Heck, look at the doldrums some of them have been in in recent years as well. For an example closer to home: It took France 25 years to rebuild from a WC 1958 3rd place, 14 years to rebuild from the 82-84 Platini era... another 20 to rebuild from the 98-00 Zidane golden era. Deschamps has now been the French coach for 12 years. In that time, He won one WC, finalist in another, and a Euro semi-final. He's only won one title, even with the wealth of players he had at his disposition. In 1.5x the time of Southgate so far, he only won one title. One. That's how scarce these are.
- Consider what he has (re)built so far in his spell with players like Saka, Foden, now Bellingham. Consider what he could teach to players like Mainoo, Palmer, Guehi, Gordon, Wharton... all for whom it is their first major tournament.
- Sometimes, it doesn't matter if the best Bundesliga scorer, the best Liga player, the Premier League player of the year are in your team. On the day, sometimes you just get kicked out (e.g. France V Switzerland in the last 16 of the last Euro). Sometimes, in one tournament, it doesn't gel. it doesn't mean you have to throw the baby away with the bath water.
Just my 2 pennies. :)
"Not everybody becomes a football force overnight" sacrebleu ;D we invented the game! Tell that to Bobby, Geoff and Martin, did you know West Ham United won the World Cup in 1966? Southgate could not clean Sir Alf Ramsey's boots, or Terry Venables come to that. No prizes in football for coming second.
Thoroughly approve of Olivier's thoughts.
I think half the problem is that England think they inherently ought to be "one of the big football nations" because they invented the game. Well sorry, but that was a hell of a long time ago. It's not that kind of history that wins things, it's investment in the last 15-20 years or so. And yes, the Premier League is big, but is it big because of English players? All those overseas stars that English clubs can afford to buy maybe do a little bit to help elevate the standard of local play, but only a little bit.
Southgate really has done quite well in the scheme of things in my opinion.
Also, stop phoning in your Eurovision entries and then declaring there's a conspiracy involved when you get no points. Investment.
Quote from: Irons on July 02, 2024, 06:54:10 AM"Not everybody becomes a football force overnight" sacrebleu ;D we invented the game! Tell that to Bobby, Geoff and Martin, did you know West Ham United won the World Cup in 1966? Southgate could not clean Sir Alf Ramsey's boots, or Terry Venables come to that. No prizes in football for coming second.
Ah that old 1966 chestnut... :P
And yet, only one manager for England has given some kind of hopes to put these ghosts or demons of 1966 to bed and actually was at a game with the trophy sitting on its perch pitch-side for the team to see and maybe win. That was Southgate at the last Euros.
Credit where it is due: at least the English supporters and Press, for once, gave Southgate "some" time because everyone knew what a shambles the England set up was. That said, considering what he had to rebuild from scratch from and the change of mentality involved, 2 cycles of Euros/WC is really nothing.
I don't disagree that given the players at hand, Gareth should get more out of them but let's keep some perspective on what he has done for the national team.
By all means, they can always go back to flashy foreign coaches (that anyway "wouldn't know the English way"), they can all go crazy about healing someone's metatarsal by putting your hand on the front cover of a newspaper, talk about one coach's healers or another's Italian mistress...or, even better, let's focus on the WAGS and distract the team and everybody else...
Oh yes, the good old days... :laugh:
Quote from: Papy Oli on July 02, 2024, 07:37:10 AMAh that old 1966 chestnut... :P
And yet, only one manager for England has given some kind of hopes to put these ghosts or demons of 1966 to bed and actually was at a game with the trophy sitting on its perch pitch-side for the team to see and maybe win. That was Southgate at the last Euros.
Credit where it is due: at least the English supporters and Press, for once, gave Southgate "some" time because everyone knew what a shambles the England set up was. That said, considering what he had to rebuild from scratch from and the change of mentality involved, 2 cycles of Euros/WC is really nothing.
I don't disagree that given the players at hand, Gareth should get more out of them but let's keep some perspective on what he has done for the national team.
By all means, they can always go back to flashy foreign coaches (that anyway "wouldn't know the English way"), they can all go crazy about healing someone's metatarsal by putting your hand on the front cover of a newspaper, talk about one coach's healers or another's Italian mistress...or, even better, let's focus on the WAGS and distract the team and everybody else...
Oh yes, the good old days... :laugh:
Are you watching the turgid football played by England, Olivier? It takes effort to stay awake! Not me saying this but an ex-player pundit said last week that the best players currently in Germany (Kane), Spain (Bellingham) and England (Foden) are in this England team. They are showing nothing like their club form so who is to blame if not Southgate.
He will be gone after this tournament. Replacement? Not a clue.
After a fantastic quarter of an hour, Romania parked the bus after the Dutch goal and seems to have got back in the match during the last five minutes, including extra-time. I hope they'll repeat the second half with Belgium, when they played much better than in the first one.
Turgid football is not confined to the English in this tournament, from what I've seen.
Quote from: Irons on July 02, 2024, 08:00:47 AMAre you watching the turgid football played by England, Olivier? It takes effort to stay awake! Not me saying this but an ex-player pundit said last week that the best players currently in Germany (Kane), Spain (Bellingham) and England (Foden) are in this England team. They are showing nothing like their club form so who is to blame if not Southgate.
He will be gone after this tournament. Replacement? Not a clue.
I agree, it was turgid, dire, boring. Until Bellingham decided to turn up, nobody really tried to make runs or appeals. The only players I could see actually trying were Mainoo and Palmer.
I don't know mate... trust the process? :laugh:
If England reaches the final (and goes one better), you'll soon forget the dire early games.
Holland has decided to turn up today. Maybe your turn will come against the Swiss.
Anyway, enough about all those second tier teams. Allez La France!! :P
Quote from: Florestan on July 02, 2024, 09:03:48 AMAfter a fantastic quarter of an hour, Romania parked the bus after the Dutch goal and seems to have got back in the match during the last five minutes, including extra-time. I hope they'll repeat the second half with Belgium, when they played much better than in the first one.
Well, my hopes were bigger than their capabilities.
The Dutch were better, not least physically, and much more experienced. Their first goal is attributable to the goalkeeper, the second one to two defenders; a more alert and experienced team would have avoided both. The Dutch victory is fully deserved and I congratulate them.
There's a Romanian saying which is confirmed time and again:
This is who we are, that is all we can. Sigh. :(
Honestly, I don't even know whom to support for winning the tournament. The only teams who have not disappointed are Spain and Germany, and for various reasons which have nothing to do with them, I don't feel like rooting for them. :laugh:
Next match, Austria-Turkey --- at least in this match I do know I will root for Turkey. :laugh:
Quote from: Papy Oli on July 02, 2024, 09:57:18 AMIf England reaches the final (and goes one better), you'll soon forget the dire early games.
This I'm sure is true, any thoughts that Southgate was ever the wrong man for the job would be struck from the national memory (until the next time ..).
Quote from: Florestan on July 02, 2024, 10:24:03 AMNext match, Austria-Turkey --- at least in this match I do know I will root for Turkey. :laugh:
Well, I am pleased --- and found the team to support for the trophy:
Turkey!
Spain - Germany: I root for Spain.
England - Switzerland, I root for Switzerland.
France - Portugal, I root for Portugal.
Turkey - The Netherlands, I root for Turkey.
Spain v Germany in the quarterfinals is... well, it feels a couple of rounds too early from what I've seen.
Quote from: Florestan on July 02, 2024, 10:24:03 AMWell, my hopes were bigger than their capabilities.
The Dutch were better, not least physically, and much more experienced. Their first goal is attributable to the goalkeeper, the second one to two defenders; a more alert and experienced team would have avoided both. The Dutch victory is fully deserved and I congratulate them.
There's a Romanian saying which is confirmed time and again: This is who we are, that is all we can. Sigh. :(
Honestly, I don't even know whom to support for winning the tournament. The only teams who have not disappointed are Spain and Germany, and for various reasons which have nothing to do with them, I don't feel like rooting for them. :laugh:
Next match, Austria-Turkey --- at least in this match I do know I will root for Turkey. :laugh:
You are right about the first goal at this level a keeper should never be beaten at near post. Turning point of the game as after that goal the Dutch hit a purple patch and looked like world-beaters. I have seen passages like that in club football when it is very difficult for opposition. Rumania did well to reach knockout stage and a good experience for the players. They did more then OK.
The Turkiye - Netherlands game should be a cracker. Both teams are prepared to run with the ball and attack at pace. It will all boil down to defence.
Quote from: Irons on July 02, 2024, 11:26:23 PMRumania did well to reach knockout stage and a good experience for the players. They did more then OK.
Oh yes, they actually did a big and pleasant surprise by winning their group. The Romanian supporters and press are unanimous in praising them.
I have seen only a fraction of the games but NED ROM was probably my favorite so far.
A pity that Romania could not keep up in the 2nd half but the first half of the first half was closest to an exciting game with lots of situations (albeit only one goal) as I have seen in this Euros.
And because the Dutch missed quite a few strong scoring chances it remained somewhat exciting even when Holland was clearly superior in the 2nd half.
Half time Spain - Germany 0-0. Nothing of note, except that the English referee is imo the worst so far. Kroos should have seen at least a yellow card, while others, both German and Spanish, saw it for far less brutal fouls.
So what's the point of VAR if a referee can simply ignore the clearest handball in 50 years without even invoking VAR?
It wasn't a pretty game but this was really unfair, Germany would almost certainly have won with that penalty early in extra time. Spain was slightly better in the first half of the main match but not in extra time.
Referees don't invoke VAR.
If the VAR team didn't bring anything to the referee's attention, then the VAR team saw nothing wrong with the referee's call and therefore didn't agree with you about handball.
I don't even know what incident you're talking about. I just know that your interpretation of how VAR works is wrong.
Edit: A quick bit of googling reveals there was an offside beforehand. So there's your answer.
Quote from: Jo498 on July 05, 2024, 10:59:39 AMSo what's the point of VAR if a referee can simply ignore the clearest handball in 50 years without even invoking VAR?
I agree that in this match both the referee and the VAR were bad. Very bad.
I disagree that Germany would have won. Spain was better overall.
Absolutely undeserved qualification for France. I mean, come on: going to semi-finals with only 1 (one) goal scored from action in the whole tournament? Pathetic! Shameful!
I do hope Spain will beat the hell out of them.
It was never in doubt... :P
Awful...yes...
But hey-ho :laugh:
I pray for a Spain - Turkey final and a Turkish victory...
Quote from: Florestan on July 05, 2024, 01:50:10 PMAbsolutely undeserved qualification for France. I mean, come on: going to semi-finals with only 1 (one) goal scored from action in the whole tournament? Pathetic! Shameful!
I do hope Spain will beat the hell out of them.
Yes they might not be scoring, but if their opponents aren't scoring either, or are scoring in France's favour...
Quote from: Madiel on July 05, 2024, 02:49:43 PMYes they might not be scoring, but if their opponents aren't scoring either, or are scoring in France's favour...
True, but still...
What's concerning me having just watched Portugal/France is that sides are not going into the game to win but appear to be playing not to lose. This makes for very boring football. As a result I'll be plugging for either Turkiye or the Netherlands who do seem to interested in going forward and scoring.
Neither referee (both English) officiated well yesterday. The highlight of the France v Portugal borefest was when Michael Oliver all of a fluster dropped his yellow card on the pitch and a player gave it back as if booking him.
Quote from: Irons on July 06, 2024, 12:33:11 AMNeither referee (both English) officiated well yesterday. The highlight of the France v Portugal borefest was when Michael Oliver all of a fluster dropped his yellow card on the pitch and a player gave it back as if booking him.
;D
PD
It was unexpectedly gratifying to see England take their penalties so well.
Once again Stones gifted a goal to the opposition!
Ivan Toney's penalty taking is just so brutal - three steps and BANG!
Ah well. Switzerland and Türkiye both deserve some kudos for not being passive about their fate. They were going for it.
I didn't catch this live but in replay. From the commentators' perspective, they (the players) believed that due to the cheers from the crowd, England had beaten Switzerland in the Euros [happened in penalty kicks] and Novak ended up kicking a tennis ball over the net to his opponent (like as in a penalty kick) with his opponent, Popyrin imitating a goalie. https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/tennis/watch-novak-djokovic-hilariously-mimes-penalty-kick-as-his-wimbledon-3r-clash-interrupted-by-englands-euro-2024-qf-win-making-centre-court-erupt/ar-BB1pxslf
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 06, 2024, 07:47:04 PMI didn't catch this live but in replay. From the commentators' perspective, they (the players) believed that due to the cheers from the crowd, England had beaten Switzerland in the Euros [happened in penalty kicks] and Novak ended up kicking a tennis ball over the net to his opponent (like as in a penalty kick) with his opponent, Popyrin imitating a goalie. https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/tennis/watch-novak-djokovic-hilariously-mimes-penalty-kick-as-his-wimbledon-3r-clash-interrupted-by-englands-euro-2024-qf-win-making-centre-court-erupt/ar-BB1pxslf
PD
Kudos to both players at Wimbledon. I would have expected them to be annoyed but they took the interruption in good humour.
25 minutes in...
Well this IS fun. ;D
by far the best half I have seen so far in this tournament.
A post I saw on Twitter pointed out that the semi-finals and finals matchups have taken on a 16/17th century Wars of Religion look, what with one semi-final being the Catholics and one semi-final being the Protestants.
Never in doubt :laugh:
Really didn't deserve anything out of this. Too many approximations.
Maybe time for Deschamps to move on and freshen things up a bit.
Thank you for everything though 8)
Quote from: Papy Oli on July 09, 2024, 01:35:29 PMNever in doubt :laugh:
Really didn't deserve anything out of this. Too many approximations.
Maybe time for Deschamps to move on and freshen things up a bit.
Thank you for everything though 8)
I thought the French did alright considering some of the criticism.
This is a nice story. Nobody knew and sixteen years later the coincidence emerges.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c7206gj5w28o
Quote from: Irons on July 10, 2024, 12:40:45 AMI thought the French did alright considering some of the criticism.
It wasn't as bad as initially dreaded but it was still very clunky and approximate. Dembélé couldn't put a proper cross in. Too many squandered chances.
The early French goal was a bit lucky but they remained dangerous enough even after the 2:1 that the 2nd half was not completely boring. I still wonder if the increased pace and athletic abilities of the sport have sometimes the effect that after an exciting first half the teams are too tired in the second so not much happens or at least many imprecisions.
Both Spanish goals were fantastic, I think, candidated for goals of tournament.
Quote from: Iota on July 10, 2024, 01:11:17 AMThis is a nice story. Nobody knew and sixteen years later the coincidence emerges.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c7206gj5w28o
What a cool story! Must admit, I was surprised to read that the rules allow 16 year olds to be on the teams.
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 10, 2024, 06:39:07 AMWhat a cool story! Must admit, I was surprised to read that the rules allow 16 year olds to be on the teams.
PD
My wife watching the game said the same. I gave her a quote - I think Sir Alex, "If you are good enough you are old enough".
Quote from: Irons on July 10, 2024, 06:56:31 AMMy wife watching the game said the same. I gave her a quote - I think Sir Alex, "If you are good enough you are old enough".
Remember though, that his body is still growing and developing--as well as his brain. :(
PD
16 is probably the minimum age. In individual sports rules used to be quite loose, there were 12-13 year old (female) swimmers in the 1950s and later gymnasts or figure skaters but I think later 16 was set as minimum age in many sports for the international "senior" events, maybe even 18 in some of them.
Quote from: Jo498 on July 10, 2024, 09:39:52 AM16 is probably the minimum age. In individual sports rules used to be quite loose, there were 12-13 year old (female) swimmers in the 1950s and later gymnasts or figure skaters but I think later 16 was set as minimum age in many sports for the international "senior" events, maybe even 18 in some of them.
Tracy Austin (an American tennis player) won the US Open at age 16 (in singles). I know that they have changed the rules over the years as to things like ages and how early and how many professional WTA tournaments girls are allowed to play in. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tracy_Austin
In my earlier comment, I was thinking of football as a team sport with a lot of physical contact and that probably more players are stronger and more physically developed than a 16 year old. Also of the mental stress/pressure that playing at an event like the Euros would put on someone so young.
PD
And so the terrible Southgate takes England to the Euro final for a second time.
This being 2 more than any other England coach.
Amazing end to the 90 minutes....again
Allez Les bl... Blancs ;D
Well done England in a very even game. 8)
Shame the game was on ITV. It would have been pleasant to see Shearer etc. eating a large slice of humble pie after tonight.
Foden nearly outdid Yamal on his curler shot. It deserved better!!
Going to be interesting how Southgate approaches the Spain game now.
Quote from: Papy Oli on July 02, 2024, 09:57:18 AMI don't know mate... trust the process? :laugh:
If England reaches the final (and goes one better), you'll soon forget the dire early games.
Ahem.. ;D
Obviously delighted with result and England deserved it, just. We did get lucky with the penalty call though. I can only recall one occasion when a referee upheld his original decision after it being questioned by VAR and called to monitor review.
Quote from: Papy Oli on July 10, 2024, 01:57:27 PMGoing to be interesting how Southgate approaches the Spain game now.
¡¡¡Vamos a machacar a la pérfida Albión!!!
Quote from: Irons on July 10, 2024, 11:28:32 PMObviously delighted with result and England deserved it, just. We did get lucky with the penalty call though. I can only recall one occasion when a referee upheld his original decision after it being questioned by VAR and called to monitor review.
Yes, the penalty was lucky but they played with great resilience.
Quote from: ritter on July 11, 2024, 12:45:41 AM¡¡¡Vamos a machacar a la pérfida Albión!!!
Easy for you to say ;D
Quote from: Papy Oli on July 10, 2024, 01:57:27 PMAllez Les bl... Blancs ;D
Well done England in a very even game. 8)
Shame the game was on ITV. It would have been pleasant to see Shearer etc. eating a large slice of humble pie after tonight.
Foden nearly outdid Yamal on his curler shot. It deserved better!!
Going to be interesting how Southgate approaches the Spain game now.
What did Ed say/do?
Quote from: Irons on July 10, 2024, 11:28:32 PMObviously delighted with result and England deserved it, just. We did get lucky with the penalty call though. I can only recall one occasion when a referee upheld his original decision after it being questioned by VAR and called to monitor review.
I could hear the cheering from England here! ;D
When is the final?
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 11, 2024, 04:05:00 AMWhat did Ed say/do?
I could hear the cheering from England here! ;D
When is the final?
PD
On Sunday PD
Quote from: vandermolen on July 11, 2024, 06:23:52 AMOn Sunday PD
Thanks! I suspect that I'll be in the mood to sit/lounge around on Sunday--will tell you why later.
PD
Quote from: vandermolen on July 11, 2024, 01:45:53 AMYes, the penalty was lucky but they played with great resilience.
They did, even go as far to say played some good stuff in the first half. Embarrassing to see Kane poleaxed by a foot injury and get up to take the penalty.
Quote from: Irons on July 10, 2024, 11:28:32 PMObviously delighted with result and England deserved it, just. We did get lucky with the penalty call though. I can only recall one occasion when a referee upheld his original decision after it being questioned by VAR and called to monitor review.
I have to disagree with you regarding the penalty. Dumfries launched himself through the air at Kane, leading with his foot. This was a potential leg breaker and he should have got a yellow card IMO. What pundits and other critics have failed to see/mention is that he started this 'tackle' before Kane had made contact with the ball. This makes the fact that the 'tackle' occurred after the ball had gone immaterial. Now I'm not saying that Dumfries was trying to deliberately injure Kane, he was probably just trying to block the shot but it was rather reckless and a penalty was the correct decision.
What bugs me about all of this is that most of the pundits and other 'experts' (coaches/online contributors/etc) don't have a full knowledge of the laws of the game. And before you question my bona fides, I was a qualified referee for many years and I had to know the game inside out to function in that role.
Quote from: Holden on July 11, 2024, 12:51:48 PMI have to disagree with you regarding the penalty. Dumfries launched himself through the air at Kane, leading with his foot. This was a potential leg breaker and he should have got a yellow card IMO. What pundits and other critics have failed to see/mention is that he started this 'tackle' before Kane had made contact with the ball. This makes the fact that the 'tackle' occurred after the ball had gone immaterial. Now I'm not saying that Dumfries was trying to deliberately injure Kane, he was probably just trying to block the shot but it was rather reckless and a penalty was the correct decision.
What bugs me about all of this is that most of the pundits and other 'experts' (coaches/online contributors/etc) don't have a full knowledge of the laws of the game. And before you question my bona fides, I was a qualified referee for many years and I had to know the game inside out to function in that role.
Good point!
Quote from: ritter on July 11, 2024, 12:45:41 AM¡¡¡Vamos a machacar a la pérfida Albión!!!
¡Vamos, España! I watched the England-Holland semifinal in the central square of
Sighișoara (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sighi%C8%99oara). I rooted for Holland.
To my left there was an Englishman; in front of me there were two Dutch sisters. When Watkins scored, I kept my composure, the Englishman exulted and one of the Dutch babes leaned her head abruptly as if it were chopped by a guillotine. ;D
I do hope Spain will beat England, preferably beating the hell out of them! (with excuses and due respect to our British friends).
@ritter : Cucurella looks a bit like Velazquez, don't you think? :D
Meanwhile, in the tournament that's really important, Canada and Uruguay play tonight to determine third place, and Argentina faces Colombia tomorrow night in the final, which will be played in what is normally the Miami Dolphins' home stadium.
I heard on the radio today that tickets for the final are going for $6000US each. The official website is offering "hospitality packages" starting at $2621.50.
https://www.copaamericahospitality.com/ecommerce/buy-packages/single-match-packages/?utm_source=COPA+website+finals+&utm_medium=Web&utm_campaign=Final+push+_+semis+and+final
Quote from: JBS on July 13, 2024, 01:33:43 PMthe tournament that's really important
For whom? ;D
I mean, Canada, man? In soccer? That's like saying Zimbabwe is important for symphonies... ;D
Quote from: Florestan on July 13, 2024, 01:37:14 PMFor whom? ;D
I mean, Canada, man? In soccer? That's like saying Zimbabwe is important for symphonies... ;D
You need to catch up with what Canada has been doing lately. They clearly have the best team they've had in a long time, probably their best ever.
Quote from: Madiel on July 13, 2024, 02:26:54 PMYou need to catch up with what Canada has been doing lately. They clearly have the best team they've had in a long time, probably their best ever.
Their best ever --- kudos to them! 8)
Nobody ever cared about their best ever, afaik... ;D
Tickets on Stubhub for the Canada/Uruguay game and the Argentina/Colombia game are going for about $1350 and up.
For the Euro final the price is about $1150 and up.
The free market thinks the Copa América is more interesting.
Quote from: JBS on July 13, 2024, 02:57:56 PMTickets on Stubhub for the Canada/Uruguay game and the Argentina/Colombia game are going for about $1350 and up.
For the Euro final the price is about $1150 and up.
The free market thinks the Copa América is more interesting.
The free market is not always right. ;D
Arriba Espana! Una, grande, libre! 8)
Quote from: Florestan on July 13, 2024, 02:29:14 PMTheir best ever --- kudos to them! 8)
Nobody ever cared about their best ever, afaik... ;D
Well the USA and Mexico certainly did during the last World Cup qualification as the Canadians streaked past them.
But Canada got a horror draw in the tournament itself. I wouldn't be at all surprised to see them back in 2026 and knocking teams off.
Quote from: JBS on July 13, 2024, 02:57:56 PMTickets on Stubhub for the Canada/Uruguay game and the Argentina/Colombia game are going for about $1350 and up.
For the Euro final the price is about $1150 and up.
The free market thinks the Copa América is more interesting.
The free market thinks viewers of one cup have more money than viewers of another cup. The amount of money is irrelevant, the most interesting things in life are free ;)
Quote from: JBS on July 13, 2024, 01:33:43 PMMeanwhile, in the tournament that's really important, Canada and Uruguay play tonight to determine third place, and Argentina faces Colombia tomorrow night in the final, which will be played in what is normally the Miami Dolphins' home stadium.
I heard on the radio today that tickets for the final are going for $6000US each. The official website is offering "hospitality packages" starting at $2621.50.
https://www.copaamericahospitality.com/ecommerce/buy-packages/single-match-packages/?utm_source=COPA+website+finals+&utm_medium=Web&utm_campaign=Final+push+_+semis+and+final
Hilarious moment on one of the endless interviews with fans from Berlin on UK TV. A Scotsman who had a ticket for the final was asked how much would it take to sell it to an English fan. He thought for a moment and then said "Independence".
Quote from: Irons on July 14, 2024, 05:14:30 AMHilarious moment on one of the endless interviews with fans from Berlin on UK TV. A Scotsman who had a ticket for the final was asked how much would it take to sell it to an English fan. He thought for a moment and then said "Independence".
;D
One of the commentators at Wimbledon mentioned that Kate, her sister Pippa and Kate and Will's daughter Charlotte would be in the Wimbledon Royals' box; meanwhile, Will and their two sons will be at the football final in Berlin.
PD
The way the Wimbledon final went, there actually would have been time for the royals to fly to Berlin by private jet and see both together ;D
Quote from: Brian on July 14, 2024, 08:24:45 AMThe way the Wimbledon final went, there actually would have been time for the royals to fly to Berlin by private jet and see both together ;D
I know! Probably even figuring in the presentation ceremony and the chats before Carlitos went out onto the balcony...perhaps a bit tight time-wise, but I suspect would be doable. Oh wait, Berlin is also an hour ahead time-wise, so scrap that idea!
But seriously, I thought that it would be at least a four hour one--particularly given the two players involved.
To my very inexpert eyes, it seems that Spain is a lot more aggressive and in possession of the ball more often. Thoughts?
PD
I didn't watch the first half. Sitting down with about 15 at my hotel for the second.
It occurs to me that Portugal is probably one of the more neutral places to watch this final.
But I'm flying to Madrid tomorrow night, so... I want them to be in a good mood.
What a pity, even this time the cup hasn't come home. :(
2nd half was pretty entertaining.
1st half a bit disappointing (not unexpected in a final), 2nd half one of the best I saw in this tournament (with 1st half of ESP-FRA maybe even better). Overall England probably even better than vs. Netherlands (there weren't very good before that) but clearly beaten and Spain had far more decent chances than the 2 goals indicate.
Spain were the better team and deserved to win. Having said that, England did well to get back into the game and Col Palmer's goal was terrific.
Meanwhile at the more important game
https://www.espn.com/soccer/story/_/id/40563453/fans-storm-gates-miami-gardens-copa-america-final
This btw is about 15 minutes from my house. If the shouting gets really loud I might hear it.
But to put perspective on the crowd control problem;
Miami-Dade County has a population of over 2.6 million.
4.7% of them were born in Colombia.
1% of them were born in Argentina.
Those figures don't include Broward County [Fort Lauderdale and environs] which is where I live and where InterMiami FC has its home stadium*.
The team captain of InterMiami FC is an Argentinean forward named Lionel Messi. You may have heard of him. (You may have also heard of one of InterMiami's owners, a chap named David Beckham.)
Finally and most importantly, the halftime entertainment will feature Shakira.
*Miami City FC also plays in Broward County and not in Miami. A stadium for InterMiami is being built near Miami International Airport and will allegedly be ready for the 2025 season.
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/5/5c/Inter_Miami_CF_logo.svg/380px-Inter_Miami_CF_logo.svg.png)
Those are herons btw, not flamingos.
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/3/33/FC_Miami_City_logo.png)
Quote from: vandermolen on July 14, 2024, 01:46:40 PMSpain were the better team and deserved to win. Having said that, England did well to get back into the game and Col Palmer's goal was terrific.
We had a go to get back into the game but after Palmer's goal England retreated and defended far too deeply. For the whole game England were chasing shadows which is very tiring. Southgate should have refreshed the defence by bringing on Trippier and Konsa, I cannot understand the thinking of playing Shaw for 90 minutes in such a high level game after being out injured since February. The Spain second goal and a near miss both resulted from poor defending. The England defenders were tiring resulting in concentration levels slipping. Attack wise Southgate got it spot on as his two substitutions saved the game - for a bit. I'm convinced a more proactive coach would have made more. Made a difference? Probably not as Spain were a class above.
Argentina victory in the Copa America is a dream come true for Miami promoters.
Meanwhile... Spain has now won 3 of the last 5 Euros. That is a serious achievement.
Quote from: Madiel on July 15, 2024, 12:29:53 AMSpain has now won 3 of the last 5 Euros. That is a serious achievement.
Spain is the indisputable superpower of European football, a new and equally formidable
Armada Invencible before which all other powers cannot but capitulate one by one.
The final was like, the best team vs the luckiest team. The best one won, outdoing the other in every conceivable respect.
The streets of Madrid now, awaiting the arrival of La Roja (they're some 2.5 kms away from Cibeles Square).
(https://imagenes.elpais.com/resizer/v2/3P4KHLS3OB7TPY35N72LTS3SUU.jpg?auth=fb6b474c441dffa6f56eba77253b9b9d9359633531bd6f5c8e37d4cda29057ca&width=1200)
Quote from: ritter on July 15, 2024, 11:31:05 AMThe streets of Madrid now, awaiting the arrival of La Roja (they're some 2.5 kms away from Cibeles Square).
(https://imagenes.elpais.com/resizer/v2/3P4KHLS3OB7TPY35N72LTS3SUU.jpg?auth=fb6b474c441dffa6f56eba77253b9b9d9359633531bd6f5c8e37d4cda29057ca&width=1200)
¡Que comienza la fiesta! ¡Que viva España! ¡España es la mejor!
(https://www.monin.com/media/catalog/product/cache/086f110b92ec89cebc323a4780ab42bd/6/e/6eeb50f6-ae5b-4cce-91ce-176634fa46cf-1.png)
¡Pa arriba, pa abajo, pa'l centro, pa dentro! :laugh:
Quote from: ritter on July 15, 2024, 11:31:05 AMThe streets of Madrid now, awaiting the arrival of La Roja (they're some 2.5 kms away from Cibeles Square).
(https://imagenes.elpais.com/resizer/v2/3P4KHLS3OB7TPY35N72LTS3SUU.jpg?auth=fb6b474c441dffa6f56eba77253b9b9d9359633531bd6f5c8e37d4cda29057ca&width=1200)
Enjoy the celebration/win Ritter! :)
PD
I've just landed in Madrid. I'm just glad I picked a hotel on the airport side of the city... about 1.5 kilometres from the party.
Televisions in the baggage area showing the party.
Quote from: Irons on July 14, 2024, 11:41:37 PMWe had a go to get back into the game but after Palmer's goal England retreated and defended far too deeply. For the whole game England were chasing shadows which is very tiring. Southgate should have refreshed the defence by bringing on Trippier and Konsa, I cannot understand the thinking of playing Shaw for 90 minutes in such a high level game after being out injured since February. The Spain second goal and a near miss both resulted from poor defending. The England defenders were tiring resulting in concentration levels slipping. Attack wise Southgate got it spot on as his two substitutions saved the game - for a bit. I'm convinced a more proactive coach would have made more. Made a difference? Probably not as Spain were a class above.
I very much agree with this analysis. After Palmer equalised for England, instead of pressing forward on the new momentum, they retreated back, presumably hoping for Extra Time. But, as you say, Spain were the better team anyway. The England goal, however, was very special with Saka's run up the wing, his pass to Bellingham who set it up brilliantly for Palmer's clinically executed shot. If only ::)
tbh I think it is half unfair, half illusionary to make much of England losing that final. After the group phase very few would have bet on them getting near the semifinal!
They played a tournament in the way usually done by Germany & Italy, i.e. start rather poorly and by a combination of weak opponents, dumb luck (like the completely unfair penalty vs. Netherlands) and 2 good halves reach the final.
They got considerably better but were still quite lucky to get further than the quarter final. Within that frame they should not blame themselves for losing to the team that was clearly the best in the cup and had beaten the two teams that were probably the next best, France and Germany, in the earlier rounds.
Quote from: Jo498 on July 15, 2024, 10:54:13 PMtbh I think it is half unfair, half illusionary to make much of England losing that final. After the group phase very few would have bet on them getting near the semifinal!
They played a tournament in the way usually done by Germany & Italy, i.e. start rather poorly and by a combination of weak opponents, dumb luck (like the completely unfair penalty vs. Netherlands) and 2 good halves reach the final.
They got considerably better but were still quite lucky to get further than the quarter final. Within that frame they should not blame themselves for losing to the team that was clearly the best in the cup and had beaten the two teams that were probably the next best, France and Germany, in the earlier rounds.
Not so much losing the final, we lost to a better team and as you point out as did France and Germany. No shame there. The national frustration goes far deeper then that. Football in the UK is an obsession the one thing, possibly the only thing, we are good at and yet for 58 years at international level we have won bugger all! 'Football is not coming home' how many nations have tasted success in that 58 years? Leaving aside the big teams like Spain, Germany et al winning multiple times, smaller football nations have also got into the act, Greece and Denmark for example. The failure of the English side over such a long period is driving the fans nuts. That we keep getting so close makes it worse not better.
The whole "football is coming home" narrative seriously needs to end. Nobody else likes the sense of entitlement it conveys.
Football emigrated. Get over it.
Quote from: Madiel on July 16, 2024, 12:44:47 AMThe whole "football is coming home" narrative seriously needs to end. Nobody else likes the sense of entitlement it conveys.
Football emigrated. Get over it.
You don't get it. Believe me the term is laden with irony. The more it doesn't the more we will say it.
Quote from: Irons on July 16, 2024, 01:02:01 AMYou don't get it. Believe me the term is laden with irony. The more it doesn't the more we will say it.
And the more people from other countries will find it distasteful.
Quote from: Madiel on July 16, 2024, 01:14:30 AMAnd the more people from other countries will find it distasteful.
Yes, I understand that. Used far too often by commentators and pundits. Guilty myself, but as I say in an ironic way.
Following a "small" football nation (Wales in my case) is so much easier - granted, things have been grim even by our standards recently, the poor show in the last World Cup, the recent failure to beat Gibraltar - but when we do well, like in the 2016 Euros, joy is unbounded. Even Scotland seems to be getting infected by unrealistic expectations - wasn't this going to be the first team to get out of the group stage?
Quote from: Irons on July 16, 2024, 12:22:58 AMNot so much losing the final, we lost to a better team and as you point out as did France and Germany. No shame there. The national frustration goes far deeper then that. Football in the UK is an obsession the one thing, possibly the only thing, we are good at and yet for 58 years at international level we have won bugger all! 'Football is not coming home' how many nations have tasted success in that 58 years? Leaving aside the big teams like Spain, Germany et al winning multiple times, smaller football nations have also got into the act, Greece and Denmark for example. The failure of the English side over such a long period is driving the fans nuts. That we keep getting so close makes it worse not better.
I understand this and there is probably criticism due to such continous (near) failures. (The "best least successful" team is the Netherlands: 3 lost World cup finals (all others with >1 lost final have at least one title) and only one Euro title (1988) but they are of course not the motherland of football.)
But considering realistic expectations before the tournament and the poor performances in the first 4 matches, England did extraordinarily well getting into the final at all.
Quote from: Jo498 on July 16, 2024, 02:48:35 AMI understand this and there is probably criticism due to such continous (near) failures. (The "best least successful" team is the Netherlands: 3 lost World cup finals (all others with >1 lost final have at least one title) and only one Euro title (1988) but they are of course not the motherland of football.)
But considering realistic expectations before the tournament and the poor performances in the first 4 matches, England did extraordinarily well getting into the final at all.
Gareth Southgate has just resigned. Clearly a nice and decent man but not an elite football coach. With the talent at his disposal (and the money!) the English team
should do better. But is there an innovative/brave manager to take over in his place - neither Potter or Howe are special in an international/global sense.
Right, so the best England results in over 50 years and the response is "should've done better".
Again, the sense of entitlement. Southgate made you into regular contenders. Something you previously weren't.
Quote from: Madiel on July 16, 2024, 04:09:53 AMRight, so the best England results in over 50 years and the response is "should've done better".
Again, the sense of entitlement. Southgate made you into regular contenders. Something you previously weren't.
Ha Ha!! If in doubt try to stir the pot
Quote from: Madiel on July 16, 2024, 04:09:53 AMRight, so the best England results in over 50 years and the response is "should've done better".
Again, the sense of entitlement. Southgate made you into regular contenders. Something you previously weren't.
Coming second is best of the losers.
Interesting discussion on a sports radio station. Jurgen Klopp - if only and would he?
Quote from: Irons on July 16, 2024, 07:32:53 AMComing second is best of the losers.
Well, it might be probably better for the rest of Europe if England never qualified again for any final tournament. This way we'd never see again all this whining and hand-wringing. ;D
Seriously now, this all or nothing mentality is contrary to the sport spirit. Instead of being super-content that England made it to the final despite playing bad and ugly and unimaginative and as if on life support most of the time and with no little help of dumb luck, you lament their not winning the cup... They didn't win because they couldn't and didn't deserve it. End of story. ;D
Quote from: Roasted Swan on July 16, 2024, 04:15:46 AMHa Ha!! If in doubt try to stir the pot
Australia is not immune to the same problem. Though in different sports.
Nor is any country really. Or club. Everybody has expectations of what results they ought to achieve. The glaring problem with England is: you have one trophy from the 1960s, and your expectation is set at matching that result. So Southgate achieving the best results in a couple of generations is seen as inadequate.
Quote from: Florestan on July 16, 2024, 08:45:14 AMWell, it might be probably better for the rest of Europe if England never qualified again for any final tournament. This way we'd never see again all this whining and hand-wringing. ;D
Seriously now, this all or nothing mentality is contrary to the sport spirit. Instead of being super-content that England made it to the final despite playing bad and ugly and unimaginative and as if on life support most of the time and with no little help of dumb luck, you lament their not winning the cup... They didn't win because they couldn't and didn't deserve it. End of story. ;D
Oh, this is nothing! You should hear me going off about my club West Ham United. >:D That is something I
really care about.
Quote from: Irons on July 16, 2024, 11:07:20 PMOh, this is nothing! You should hear me going off about my club West Ham United. >:D That is something I really care about.
;D
Quote from: Florestan on July 15, 2024, 11:24:43 AMSpain is the indisputable superpower of European football, a new and equally formidable Armada Invencible before which all other powers cannot but capitulate one by one.
The final was like, the best team vs the luckiest team. The best one won, outdoing the other in every conceivable respect.
Ah yes, but England provided some special moments (Bellingham's over-head kick, Palmer's goal v Spain, Ollie Watkins's last minute goal v the Netherlands). To some extent you make your own luck.
Quote from: vandermolen on July 17, 2024, 02:10:42 AMEngland provided some special moments
True, but moments don't win the Euro Cup. Constantly excellent playing does.
Quote from: Madiel on July 16, 2024, 09:01:48 AMAustralia is not immune to the same problem. Though in different sports.
Nor is any country really. Or club. Everybody has expectations of what results they ought to achieve. The glaring problem with England is: you have one trophy from the 1960s, and your expectation is set at matching that result. So Southgate achieving the best results in a couple of generations is seen as inadequate.
The points you make are all true and fair. My comment tried - perhaps failed - to be an objective one. Simply in the sense that by general (expert - not me!) consensus the current group of young English players are some of the most technically gifted and individually brilliant that we have produced for some decades. Of course Gareth Southgate was part of the FA structure/management of youth teams structure that helped foster elite academies at club and regional level so it would make sense that we should see the benefit of that investment. Add to that a great deal of National Lottery funding having been funnelled into grass roots sport AND the fact the The Premiere League is the richest in the World you would hope/imagine that this level of investment literal and practical should produce a national team capable of being the best in a tournament. The fact that the English team is not able to make that last step is - I suspect - more a question of attitude rather than ability. I have no doubt the players deperately
want to win but there seems to be an edge missing that Latin American teams or Spain amongst others can tap into.
As it happens I did not watch the final - in all honesty I'm much more bothered if Liverpool win or lose than England! I find the whole "football's coming home" cringe-worthy and oddly entitled in a way that as a footballing nation we have done nothing to merit/claim
Quote from: Florestan on July 17, 2024, 02:23:12 AMTrue, but moments don't win the Euro Cup. Constantly excellent playing does.
I agree.
Bordeaux collapses with all player contracts terminated.
Sad news for the world of football and not least for our Papy Oli who I believe supports the club.
Quote from: Irons on July 28, 2024, 05:37:22 AMBordeaux collapses with all player contracts terminated.
Sad news for the world of football and not least for our Papy Oli who I believe supports the club.
Why did it "collapse"?
PD
Quote from: Irons on July 28, 2024, 05:37:22 AMBordeaux collapses with all player contracts terminated.
Sad news for the world of football and not least for our Papy Oli who I believe supports the club.
Heartbreak really but not a surprise after a decade of mismanagement or overspending. The buyer who saved the club from potential liquidation 2 years ago (after some American sharks milked the funds) put 40M € in last summer to make it allegedly the healthiest club in Europe (his words at the time)...then went on and spent 36M € in wages alone in the 2nd division (about 5x a Division 2 average budget)..and generated a 40-50M € loss in that year alone while being miles away from a promotion back to to top tier. The ladies team went from champions league football last season to 2nd tier). The owner is refusing to foot the new bill.
As a result of the huge financial losses, the financial federal instances then relegated us to third division for now.
The owner then decided to scrap the whole professional status of the club, which means all the players contracts (men and women) and coaching staff, are void overnight and all free to go (no gains from transfers). He basically did that to completely cancel the huge wage bill for the lower third tier. The club's academy is also closing overnight (70 youngsters to go). The club is now in receivership, all existing debts are frozen and will be spread over ten years.
Now, it is a case for him to present to the tribunal a suitable new reduced budget for tier 3 that he is happy to cover for. The tribunal can decide a further relegation to tier 4 if not satisfactory, restarting with an amateur team anyway, to rebuild from scratch for the new season starting mid august (most likely). Worst case, He or the tribunal can also decide to fully liquidate the club. That would mean the death of it as we've known it since 1881 (initial foundation , professional since 1937).
Under receivership, the current owner can still stay for minimum 6 months until maybe a takeover buyer can be found (he's refused to go so far or sell it, he feeling not being compensated enough).
If liquidated, the club disappears and could maybe come back under a new guise and ideally new local owners...but that would be in a regional tier, so something like tier 9 or 10...
Needless to say that seeing the opening segment of the Olympics ceremony Friday night with Monsieur Zidane appearing, was like a dagger through the heart after this last week and the loss of our professional club. :(
I'll still love that club whatever tier it's in.
Bordeaux, partout et tout le temps.
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 28, 2024, 07:54:31 AMWhy did it "collapse"?
PD
Money, no doubt. I see the club has applied to join a non-professional league, with the eventual hope of regaining its former glories. This is a big failure, no doubt, since Bordeaux was once one of France's top teams, with a host of great international names among former players. So huge sympathy to all their fans, especially
@Papy Oli - those of us who follow teams whose finances are not measured in £billions always have the fear of liquidation somewhere at the back of our minds. So far in the English league it hasn't befallen anyone really big, although a number of smaller clubs have collapsed and been reformed playing in lower, non-professional leagues - Hereford, Bury, Macclesfield, Scarborough. Even my own Coventry City were 3 hours away from extinction in 2007 before a buyer snapped us up at bargain price. And the disappearance of a club tears a huge hole in the hearts of all true fans. You can't just switch allegiance - although
@Irons has the mighty Orient just down the road in case West Ham fall on hard times ;D
Quote from: Papy Oli on July 28, 2024, 09:32:21 AMBordeaux, partout et tout le temps.
Sic transit gloria mundi.
Whenever I hear someone lamenting the disappearance of this or that entity, I am tempted to reply: "Well, the Roman Empire disappeared too." ;D
Yes, but for one of France's more successful clubs from one of France's larger cities, it's pretty terrible that it's come to this.
Quote from: Madiel on July 28, 2024, 09:04:47 PMYes, but for one of France's more successful clubs from one of France's larger cities, it's pretty terrible that it's come to this.
That's true.
Quote from: DaveF on July 28, 2024, 09:43:32 AMMoney, no doubt. I see the club has applied to join a non-professional league, with the eventual hope of regaining its former glories. This is a big failure, no doubt, since Bordeaux was once one of France's top teams, with a host of great international names among former players. So huge sympathy to all their fans, especially @Papy Oli - those of us who follow teams whose finances are not measured in £billions always have the fear of liquidation somewhere at the back of our minds. So far in the English league it hasn't befallen anyone really big, although a number of smaller clubs have collapsed and been reformed playing in lower, non-professional leagues - Hereford, Bury, Macclesfield, Scarborough. Even my own Coventry City were 3 hours away from extinction in 2007 before a buyer snapped us up at bargain price. And the disappearance of a club tears a huge hole in the hearts of all true fans. You can't just switch allegiance - although @Irons has the mighty Orient just down the road in case West Ham fall on hard times ;D
So basically, when the owners decide that there isn't enough money coming in, they declare?/spread the word?/post a notice? that the club is for sale and to contact xyz if they are interested?
PD
Quote from: Pohjolas Daughter on July 29, 2024, 06:05:22 AMSo basically, when the owners decide that there isn't enough money coming in, they declare?/spread the word?/post a notice? that the club is for sale and to contact xyz if they are interested?
PD
Bad, irresponsible owners more like! I'm not familiar with the particular situation at Bordeaux but even without Papy Oli's analyse I could guess. The owners of my club are pretty despicable, with the main shareholder making his fortune in the porn industry but the devil you know.... I would not swap with what is going on at Chelsea at the present time with new very rich American owners backed by Saudi money.
Clubs on the Continent are more vulnerable as they do not have the income of the Premier League. Nothing ever stays the same however, wheels spin and tables turn, so Premier League clubs need to be watchful if the gravy train hits the buffers!
Quote from: Irons on July 29, 2024, 07:52:47 AMBad, irresponsible owners more like!
I was just trying to understand the process.
PD
Quote from: Irons on July 29, 2024, 07:52:47 AMBad, irresponsible owners more like! I'm not familiar with the particular situation at Bordeaux but even without Papy Oli's analyse I could guess. The owners of my club are pretty despicable, with the main shareholder making his fortune in the porn industry but the devil you know.... I would not swap with what is going on at Chelsea at the present time with new very rich American owners backed by Saudi money.
Clubs on the Continent are more vulnerable as they do not have the income of the Premier League. Nothing ever stays the same however, wheels spin and tables turn, so Premier League clubs need to be watchful if the gravy train hits the buffers!
Do the owners/clubs do the American thing of trying to extort new stadiums* from the local municipalities?
*technically, try to force them to grant tax breaks, subsidies, special municipal bond issues, and otherwise finance new facilities the team could pay for on its own. The USA version relies on threats of the team packing up and moving to a city that will give them the money, which doesn't seem such a viable threat in the UK/Europe context.
Manchester United isn't about to become Salisbury United.
The USA franchise system doesn't have much of a parallel in Europe. Although the Wimbledon club moved to Milton Keynes, this seems to have been considered pretty shocking.
But it's worth noting that move was largely driven by issues with stadiums. So it can happen.
Quote from: JBS on July 29, 2024, 08:39:46 AMDo the owners/clubs do the American thing of trying to extort new stadiums* from the local municipalities?
*technically, try to force them to grant tax breaks, subsidies, special municipal bond issues, and otherwise finance new facilities the team could pay for on its own. The USA version relies on threats of the team packing up and moving to a city that will give them the money, which doesn't seem such a viable threat in the UK/Europe context.
Manchester United isn't about to become Salisbury United.
I'm not familiar with the American model. However, some extortion has taken place with my club and it is the taxpayer footing the bill so parallels, maybe. West Ham's home was a 35,000 stadium in Newham east London. For the 2012 London Olympic games a brand new 62,000 built a stone's throw away at Stratford. With some common sense and foresight the organisers should have built the stadium to be future-proof, instead in his wisdom, Sebastian Coe insisted in a stadium built to be the home of British athletics. A completely unworkable decision as unstainable. Post Olympics, the mayor of London invited a bidding process for the stadium's future, Spurs came up with a proposal to pull the thing down and build a purpose built stadium in its place. West Ham sent in a Director of the club, Karren Brady to negotiate a deal. Brady is a hard nosed negotiator up against the mayor of London Sadiq Khan who didn't stand a chance, bless him. Brady chewed him up and spat him out with a 99 year lease at a paltry £4 million annual rent (the club's turnover is over £300 million). The stadium is now costing the British taxpayer millions every year and West Ham's home is not really suitable for football. With some forethought from the Olympic committee and the Mayor of London this mess could have been avoided and saved the British taxpayer billions.
I can see in the not too distant future the London Stadium being offered to West Ham United for one English pound which for the British taxpayer would be the best course of action by far.
The coming down from glorious "Home" Olympics back to the Bordeaux daily grind is like a freefall.
I left it as administratively relegated to Tier 3 with a voluntary loss of its professional status.
So far, all the teams are being dismembered. All the Mens' professional players have gone (bar one I think).
The owner still had to appear in front of one of the federal control administration to present an adequate plan and budget for that tier 3 level. That was last Monday. It failed. The club suffered a second administrative relegation to Tier 4. The club made one last appeal to an upper commission (funnily enough, the French Olympic Committee) who rejected the appeal and upheld the Tier 4 decision.
The owner still had one possible appeal to the Sports Arbitration Tribunal but decided not to proceed.
As of today, the Ladies team has been sold and saved by an English Consortium. it will resume in Tier 2 (relegation on the pitch last season) in its own name.
The Mens team is due to start its season in Tier 4... tonight. They got an approval for postponing the first 3 games of the season, because, as it stands, it is reported that we only have about 25 players on the books and most of them are under 15, remnants of the dismantled academy.
We have about 2 weeks to build a main team...and an under-19, an under-17 and an under-15 team...because it is a legal required structure to play in Tier 4.
While being in receivership with an updated 90M Euros debt frozen (allegedly even more than that) for the season.
In a massive stadium that the city council apparently gave us rent grace for the season (rent which we weren't paying anyway). We'd still have to cover the operational costs on match days.
We have a hated disgraced owner that doesn't show his face at the club and refuses to liquidate the club because he is owed approx. 40M Euros that he put in the kitty (while he and his mates milked the club meanwhile) and he wants to recover it.
Nobody will obviously want to buy this club in that state, any local takeover obviously will wait for a liquidation.
Maybe this will be the next and last downfall. The local tribunal can still decide to proceed with this if it deems that the club can't survive under receivership.
A sad situation, Olivier.
Something to make
@Irons chuckle and an update:
Bordeaux is now playing in the 4th division.
it went as is:
- Game 1 - postponed as agreed with FA
- Game 2 - postponed as agreed with FA
- Game 3 - Home game in a small local stadium behind closed doors (due to tensions between two supporters group scaring the prefect). We draw 1-1 thanks to a goal in injury time by... our goalkeeper on a corner kick (note: - We somehow managed to scramble a team of players from the discontinued academy, some free players of div.2 to 4.
2 former players, aged 37 and 40 y.o. had to take a last minute license to make the numbers - 11+4 subs- to avoid the club to forfeit this game :laugh: )
- Game 4 - Away game in Brittany (20 minutes from where my parents live - my dad tried to get a ticket but it was sold out in an hour, all 2,500 of them). Bordeaux supporters were then banned from travelling the day before. On the day Game delayed 30 minutes due to heavy thunder. We lose 2-0 but we have a better structure and something resembling football (So far, the games are broadcast on YT by a Bordeaux local channel so I can watch them).
On the admin side:
- The Ladies team was sold a few weeks ago to a British consortium and thought to be saved. Turns out they didn't have the funds (a consortium created only 3 months prior. Dodgy ? I'll leave you to judge). Consequence: The Ladies team is removed from Div.2 and dismantled. A local Socios project is working on a takeover project to salvage it and bring them back in a Regional division. We can but hope.
- Our dodgy owner was again in front of the tribunal last night. They have for now decided to continue with the receivership and allow the Mens team to continue playing. Next review January end. At least, no liquidation until then.
- our dodgy owner was all smiles and cockiness coming out the tribunal last, not wanting to leave the club and wanting to rebuild what he has basically destroyed himself.
- Now to show his incompetence: he had been negotiating with the Main Stadium's management company for the last few weeks to try and get the team to play back there asap (guaranteeing some gates income)....without wanting to pay any rent (which incidentally he hasn't done for 3 years anyway)... To which the management company and the Mayor agreed!! as long as the owner pays the matchday charges (circa 40-50K Euros per game day). Which the owner refused to pay. Now for the incompetence bit: the owner and his dodgy accountants had forgotten that, thanks to the naming of the main stadium, they actually had a regular gameday cashback income...from the stadium's management company...roughly equivalent to those gameday charges anyway!!
- Which now means we will play game 5 on Saturday at home back in our proper stadium with a crowd of probably 20-25,000 home supporters, in division 4 (where the crowd capacities is usually a tenth of that).
- The team rebuilding is also continuing with some new signings this week to beef up the team (mostly players at about 3-4K Euros a month salary - the club's budget under receivership is currently at 8 millions Euros, most of it players wages and admin salaries). A big budget for Div.4 but a tight one for us to function.
- Now, that owner sunk us in the last 2 years by basically going all in and taking some financial gambles at high cost, never working. Guess what was announced this morning ? We have signed former Premier League 35yo player, Andy Carroll (remember him
@Irons ? ;D ). He could be a good signing, maybe a great one but do we really think he'll be paid 3-4K Euros a month only like the other players. The mind boggles but that means that the tribunal signed it off so it must be budgeted.
One last fun fact. In the last month, the team was build up from scratch by a renowned successful lower-tier coach (incidentally a Bordeaux fan) and his assistant. The club also hired on a temporary basis a recruitment specialist (an English guy called John Williams) from an other club to assist with scouting and pre-selecting potential players for the coach. We borrowed that recruitment fella from Amiens SC (div.2).
now have a guess in which club Carroll was contracted with...
Dodgy you said...? Did Carroll genuinely want to leave Amiens, or is it a forced hand to offload him to Bordeaux and get him off the Amiens books ? We'll see.
Anyway, nice to see some Football at last . I'll be watching youtube on Saturday 8)
All is not lost if Bordeaux have a bedrock of 20,000. A fanbase of that size will have appeal to a prospective owner. Many clubs have struggled this side of the channel and with administration sunk through the leagues but most have managed to survive. Wrexham, thanks to a couple of Hollywood stars a prime example. None though have the history or more importantly the fanbase of Bordeaux. Lets face it can't get any worse for your club.
Andy Carroll! Cost West Ham a fortune!! Good bloke though and scored the second best goal I have seen live following the Irons for a lifetime.
Quote from: Irons on September 18, 2024, 07:21:05 AMAll is not lost if Bordeaux have a bedrock of 20,000. A fanbase of that size will have appeal to a prospective owner. Many clubs have struggled this side of the channel and with administration sunk through the leagues but most have managed to survive. Wrexham, thanks to a couple of Hollywood stars a prime example. None though have the history or more importantly the fanbase of Bordeaux. Lets face it can't get any worse for your club.
Andy Carroll! Cost West Ham a fortune!! Good bloke though and scored the second best goal I have seen live following the Irons for a lifetime.
True, only the Damocles sword of a liquidation for the next season or two.
In the meantime, it's just a relief to see "our" team play, in whatever form. The excitement is weirdly, still the same on YT in 4th tier. Been Supporting it since 82, not going to stop now ;D
Re Carroll, I read similar reports from Amiens players, he seems to have a good reputation among his peers.
Quote from: Irons on September 18, 2024, 07:21:05 AMAll is not lost if Bordeaux have a bedrock of 20,000. A fanbase of that size will have appeal to a prospective owner. Many clubs have struggled this side of the channel and with administration sunk through the leagues but most have managed to survive. Wrexham, thanks to a couple of Hollywood stars a prime example. None though have the history or more importantly the fanbase of Bordeaux. Lets face it can't get any worse for your club.
Andy Carroll! Cost West Ham a fortune!! Good bloke though and scored the second best goal I have seen live following the Irons for a lifetime.
Bordeaux played in their own stadium last Saturday, with a max crowd gauge of 12,000. Nice to see a full kop back.
Went 2-0 down at HT after a dismal 45 minutes. Much better in the second half. Monsieur Carroll scored twice in the last 15 minutes to salvage a point. I think we already love him.
According to some local reports, he is on the fourth division pay level (3 to 4K euros) a month and playing for the sporting challenge of it all. He has been allegedly financially careful during his career and not been seeking paychecks like in Saudi. He just wants to have fun in his career end. Not sure how long that will go as his Family lives in London.
Still if he scores a brace at each game, we'll give him a statue :P
(Only our third Englishman ever after Clive Allen and Josh Maja...who now scores for fun in the championship. Damn, he was so badly used in his days at our club).
Quote from: Papy Oli on September 24, 2024, 01:45:56 PMBordeaux played in their own stadium last Saturday, with a max crowd gauge of 12,000. Nice to see a full kop back.
Went 2-0 down at HT after a dismal 45 minutes. Much better in the second half. Monsieur Carroll scored twice in the last 15 minutes to salvage a point. I think we already love him.
According to some local reports, he is on the fourth division pay level (3 to 4K euros) a month and playing for the sporting challenge of it all. He has been allegedly financially careful during his career and not been seeking paychecks like in Saudi. He just wants to have fun in his career end. Not sure how long that will go as his Family lives in London.
Still if he scores a brace at each game, we'll give him a statue :P
(Only our third Englishman ever after Clive Allen and Josh Maja...who now scores for fun in the championship. Damn, he was so badly used in his days at our club).
Reports in redtops today that Carroll's marriage to Billi Mucklow is over and they are seeking a divorce.
Quote from: Irons on September 29, 2024, 05:22:39 AMReports in redtops today that Carroll's marriage to Billi Mucklow is over and they are seeking a divorce.
Saw that this morning. The gods don't want anything touching Bordeaux to be happy :( :laugh:
(That said, we won our first FA cup round 5-0 today. Andy was rested. That was against a division 9 team...another 14 rounds and we could meet a Ligue 1 team.. :P )
PS: if you want Andy back at West Ham, it's 100 million euros >:D
Quote from: Papy Oli on September 24, 2024, 01:45:56 PMStill if he scores a brace at each game, we'll give him a statue :P
@Irons Guess who scored a brace in his 2nd game?
8)
Ps: not impressed with your team trashing Ipswich though >:D
Quote from: Papy Oli on October 05, 2024, 01:46:51 PM@Irons
Guess who scored a brace in his 2nd game?
8)
Ps: not impressed with your team trashing Ipswich though >:D
Good to hear that Olivier, tad early for a statue though. Carroll at no time relied on pace so passing years would not be that big an issue.
Cracking day at the London Stadium yesterday. The whole team played well and a fellow countryman of your good self, Jean-Clair Todibo with only his second start smashed it! A future French international, nailed on. He get's West Ham too which is not always the case with foreign players.
An Englishman abroad.
Who would have thought it :o
https://ligue1.com/articles/l1_article_1170-andy-carroll-bordeaux-s-saviour-once-again
Earlier this week I heard what might be my favourite piece of football commentary ever:
"They've been launching crosses like an angry priest."
Quote from: Irons on January 22, 2025, 01:54:00 AMAn Englishman abroad.
Who would have thought it :o
https://ligue1.com/articles/l1_article_1170-andy-carroll-bordeaux-s-saviour-once-again
He's become a loved legend of the club in only this matter of months by his attitude on and off the pitch, and how refreshing he is in his attitude. He's simply been that beacon of light shining out of 10 years of continued darkness ;D
We've somehow managed to climb back up to second in the table, within 5 points of the leader (halfway through the season), with only that top stop guaranteeing that much-needed promotion.
Sadly he got injured last weekend and could be sidelined for a while. We'll have to cope with him and without this over-reliability on his game impact.
The liquidation/debt management continues on the side. The dodgy owner still had to put his own money in to keep it going, for now.
Oliver Kahn is apparently linking with a Saudi fund and has started initial talks with the club's owner. Good news, bad news ? No idea.
Quote from: Papy Oli on January 23, 2025, 11:17:10 PMHe's become a loved legend of the club in only this matter of months by his attitude on and off the pitch, and how refreshing he is in his attitude. He's simply been that beacon of light shining out of 10 years of continued darkness ;D
We've somehow managed to climb back up to second in the table, within 5 points of the leader (halfway through the season), with only that top stop guaranteeing that much-needed promotion.
Sadly he got injured last weekend and could be sidelined for a while. We'll have to cope with him and without this over-reliability on his game impact.
The liquidation/debt management continues on the side. The dodgy owner still had to put his own money in to keep it going, for now.
Oliver Kahn is apparently linking with a Saudi fund and has started initial talks with the club's owner. Good news, bad news ? No idea.
I posted as his name came up in a "Hammers Chat" podcast last week. He is enjoying life in France and banging in goals. Love to know what the natives make of a geordie accent. ???
Quote from: Irons on January 24, 2025, 12:09:14 AMI posted as his name came up in a "Hammers Chat" podcast last week. He is enjoying life in France and banging in goals. Love to know what the natives make of a geordie accent. ???
How about them Hammers then ? You're level on points with the worst Man U team in 147 years so there's always that :P
Seeing some improvements under Graham Potter ? That's quite an appointment for you, I think.
or are you missing the Moyes Day already?
(I always had the impression Moyes was hard done by and found to be good in hindsight only. Case in point at Man U when he turned out to have had better results with that team than many bigger named coaches that replaced him).
in the Premier League, Arsenal is there or thereabouts but just not finding enough consistency. The injuries and lack of a proper striker are coming to bite us again. Liverpool looks unassailable though.
I am keeping an eye on my "other" team too, Ipswich town, I hope somehow they will scrape by and stay up this time.
Quote from: Papy Oli on January 24, 2025, 02:05:55 AMHow about them Hammers then ? You're level on points with the worst Man U team in 147 years so there's always that :P
Seeing some improvements under Graham Potter ? That's quite an appointment for you, I think.
or are you missing the Moyes Day already?
(I always had the impression Moyes was hard done by and found to be good in hindsight only. Case in point at Man U when he turned out to have had better results with that team than many bigger named coaches that replaced him).
in the Premier League, Arsenal is there or thereabouts but just not finding enough consistency. The injuries and lack of a proper striker are coming to bite us again. Liverpool looks unassailable though.
I am keeping an eye on my "other" team too, Ipswich town, I hope somehow they will scrape by and stay up this time.
Moyes days were done and frankly delighted to see the back of him. Only West Ham could go out and replace him with someone worse! Julen Lopetegui was a disastrous appointment in every respect and I feel sorry for Potter having to sort the mess Lopetegui left behind.
The story for me of the current EPL season is Nottingham Forest. I love the way they have crashed into the party of the greedy Sky six. My club had the opportunity to do the same a couple of years ago but lacked the ambition of NF owners. I hope and pray Nottingham Forest elbow one of the greedy six aside and qualify for Champions League next season.
Ipswich will stay up, if they don't their coach isn't as good as everyone says he is. Their forward line on paper is outstanding led by Liam Delap, who after Woods at Nottingham Forest, the most inform striker in the EPL.
Ipswich has definitely improved but it's unclear how much that will lead to improved results. Staying in the league is always challenging for newly promoted teams, and the last couple of years seem to have been particularly so.
Quote from: Madiel on January 24, 2025, 05:26:23 PMIpswich has definitely improved but it's unclear how much that will lead to improved results. Staying in the league is always challenging for newly promoted teams, and the last couple of years seem to have been particularly so.
Very true. Extremely difficult for promoted sides. Do they invest when they are likely to be relegated the following season? Leeds, Sheffield United and Burnley amongst others are yoyo clubs, too good for the Championship and not good enough for the Premier League. Clubs can buck the trend, Nottingham Forest managed to survive the first season of promotion and they are now in a Champions League place. Or it can go the other way, Huddersfield Town made it to the promised land and now a few short years later languishing in the third tier of English football.
Quote from: Irons on January 24, 2025, 07:48:41 AMIpswich will stay up, if they don't their coach isn't as good as everyone says he is. Their forward line on paper is outstanding led by Liam Delap, who after Woods at Nottingham Forest, the most inform striker in the EPL.
Well, they'll be "concentrating on the League" after the next round of the FA Cup ;D
Quote from: Papy Oli on January 24, 2025, 02:05:55 AMin the Premier League, Arsenal is there or thereabouts but just not finding enough consistency. The injuries and lack of a proper striker are coming to bite us again. Liverpool looks unassailable though.
As a long time Liverpool supporter, I can assure you there is no lead so large they cannot squander, and no 'certain thing' they cannot completely turn to dog gravy.
I watch with interest. Well, curiosity, at least.