Just a little history - I started off in 1980 w/ an Apple II+ computer, which lasted 6 yrs (the longest that I've ever had a computer!) - loved the initial experience (and even did some programming in Applesoft Basic); then in the mid-80s switched to PCs (mainly a work decision), so I've been w/ DOS/Windows ever since, and still a Windows user (XP & VISTA at present) - :)
Well, a month or so ago, the HD on my 'lovable' IBM laptop (ThinkPad X40) died! My son, an IT person In Indiana got me a new Dell Latitude @ a great price w/ VISTA - works fine; but I was about to just junk the IBM and thought that I would like to possibly 'play around' w/ a Linux clone - what the hell!
So, ordered a new HD (only $50) and added more RAM (about $24), and loaded Ubuntu, the most popular Linux clone at the moment - I've been having an absolute BALL exploring this OS - years ago (80s) I used UNIX (the parent OS), but I was really impressed w/ this new OS - quickly recognized all of my hardware & connected immediately to my Linksys router wirelessly (shocking!) - came w/ plenty of FREE software duplicating most of the offerings by MS$$; plus, installed w/ a great firewall - virus protection not needed - plus, I've been trying out the BASH shell (like the old days w/ DOS programming - more complicated & much to learn for me!).
Not sure 'what' the main emphasis of this thread should be? But, if you might be interested in this UNIX-based OS, just google 'Ubuntu' - also, check out the www.ubuntuforums.org - tha activity is hard to believe - I've joined but can't keep up! But, please provide your comments if using or are interested in this OS - and REMEMBER - this is FREE 'open source' software - an absolutely refreshing thought - ;D
I also started with an Apple ][, though my brother had a TRS-80 before that. I guess that really dates us.
I've been using Linux since about 1994. I just switched back to Fedora (the newest version, 8 ) after using Ubuntu for about a year. I used Redhat/Fedora for years, so I'm really more comfortable with it (know where everything is and how to use the tools). I suspect Ubuntu has forced Fedora to improve somewhat, though.
Nowadays I'm in front of a Mac running OS X most of the time, but I'm usually ssh'ing to my Linux box in the other room for news and mail. The Linux box is also where all my digital music files are. I NFS mount the Linux drives on the Mac and use the optical digital out on the Mac to interface to my audio equipment.
Dave - sorry for the delay in response, but are you & I the only ones trying out this Unix cloned software? :o
I know that we have a lot of 'young' people on this forum who might be struggling w/ purchasing MS & Apple hardware & software, but this Linux based OS & its many programs are absolutely FREE! I've played around w/ the Ubuntu OS for nearly a month now - came w/ plenty of 'free' software in the installation package, e.g. Open Office (by Sun Microsystems) duplicates all of the programs in MS Office (the Word, Excel, & Powerpoint files are read directly into their programs - my only problem has been w/ the Access database); currently, I'm playing around w/ a program called the GIMP (GNU Image Manipulation Program) - this is pretty much like Photoshop which costs hundreds of dollars - GIMP is FREE! I can go on (but believe me I'm just a beginner!), but for those interested, please respond (and check out the links given previously!) - this is cool stuff! 8)
opus67@GMG:~$ sudo apt-get more_posters --yes
:D
Couple of useful links if you are either new to Linux or trying to choose a 'distro' (short for distribution)
http://distrowatch.com/ - Keep up-to-date with the latest releases (development and finished ones)
http://www.desktoplinux.com/ - news from the world of Linux
Quote from: opus67 on July 03, 2008, 06:50:28 AM
opus67@GMG:~$ sudo apt-get more_posters --yes
Couple of useful links if you are either new to Linux or trying to choose a 'distro' (short for distribution)
http://distrowatch.com/ - Keep up-to-date with the latest releases (development and finished ones)
http://www.desktoplinux.com/ - news from the world of Linux
Opus67 - hey, thanks for reactivating this thread - maybe we'll get some more 'takers'? ;D
Currently on my Ubuntu laptop - using
Ubuntu 7.10, nicknamed 'Gusty Gibbon' - as already pointed out, esp. if the link above is followed, there are many 'distros' of the Linux kernel; Ubuntu is just one option (and the only one that I've used) - a book that helped me last year w/ this program is shown below.
There is a 'newer' version of Ubuntu out, i.e. 8.04, named 'Hardy Heron' (the '8' is the release year & the .04, the month of release, i.e. April - there will be an 8.10 out later in the year) - books have already appeared on this newest Ubuntu distro (checkout Amazon or Bookpool.com, if interested).
Hope that others will join in - :D
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/518zTdPNo5L._SL500_BO2,204,203,200_PIsitb-dp-500-arrow,TopRight,45,-64_OU01_AA240_SH20_.jpg)
I haven't yet bought a book, but I do have the PDF's from TLDP (http://tldp.org/), a useful link I forgot to mention earlier. Click on 'Guides' and there you will online book on introduction to Linux, bash scripting, and also advanced guides for administration, etc. While I'm one of those persons who can't read a book completely online, I do find it a useful reference to have it in the hard disk. Also, as opposed to printed books, you can immediately download the book with the most recent revisions.
I use Hardy, by the way. :)
Almost forgot: If you think that Linux has only to do with a screen with cursor blinking at a drab terminal, I'm sorry to say that you're mistaken. :D
http://www.youtube.com/v/IKiksY13mUw
Will Ubuntu run the Adobe Creative Suites 2 and 3? (Actually, all I really need is Illustrator, Photoshop, Acrobat professional, and Lightroom)
What's the feasibility of having a dual boot machine (Vista and Ubuntu)? I'm planning on getting a new computer with two hard drives (or possibly even RAID)
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on July 03, 2008, 09:38:37 PM
Will Ubuntu run the Adobe Creative Suites 2 and 3? (Actually, all I really need is Illustrator, Photoshop, Acrobat professional, and Lightroom)
Maybe you could, with WINE. I haven't tried.
http://appdb.winehq.org/search.php (search for 'adobe')
QuoteWhat's the feasibility of having a dual boot machine (Vista and Ubuntu)? I'm planning on getting a new computer with two hard drives (or possibly even RAID)
I have a dual-boot, with XP and Ubuntu, and with each OS in a different hard-disk. Doing it this way is a lot simpler because you need not worry about one OS (Windoze) wiping out another.
This is a great resource on dual-booting Ubuntu with Windows - http://users.bigpond.net.au/hermanzone/
What about Mandriva? Does it support Realtek HD audio? How are the graphics drivers? Can I play my games?? ???
Quote from: drogulus on July 04, 2008, 12:49:10 PM
What about Mandriva? Does it support Realtek HD audio? How are the graphics drivers? Can I play my games?? ???
Sorry, I haven't tried Mandriva. You can find links to reviews of the latest version at Distro Watch, the link to which is available in my first post.
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on July 03, 2008, 09:38:37 PM
Will Ubuntu run the Adobe Creative Suites 2 and 3? (Actually, all I really need is Illustrator, Photoshop, Acrobat professional, and Lightroom)
What's the feasibility of having a dual boot machine (Vista and Ubuntu)? I'm planning on getting a new computer with two hard drives (or possibly even RAID)
Just getting back to this thread after a few days - believe that your questions have already been addressed by
Opus67 - check out the Wine HQ (http://www.winehq.org/) - this is a 'Windows simulator' that can be used in an UNIX enviroment - I've not used the program, but have read some 'mixed' reviews on the Ubuntu Forums (links above), and likely not all Windows software is going to work; obviously, you're using a lot of pretty powerful software, so I would certainly review others' experience; plus, there may be some LINUX software that can 'replace' one or more of the programs mentioned, e.g. I've been using GIMP (http://www.gimp.org/), which is a Photoshop clone (doesn't seem as easy to use for me, but it is a powerful program and is FREE!).
As already mentioned, 'dual booting' is not a problem at all if you want to run different OSs on a hard drive w/ multiple partitions or on different physical drives - again, plenty of information in the LINUX/Ubuntu/ect. forums - hope to see you posting your experiences back here!
Just had my 'old' Ubuntu laptop on the road (an overnight trip - hotel had 'free' wireless in the room) - don't take my VISTA laptop w/ me on trips - Ubuntu has an excellent 'built-in' firewall (iptables (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iptables) and viral/malware software is NOT needed) - a LINUX distro really seems like an advantage to me in using these 'open & unprotected' hotel networks! :D
Just returned from a long weekend in Asheville, NC - stayed @ the Inn on Biltmore Estate - 'wired' internet in the room, but I had taken along an Asus 'wireless' AP (shown below), which I've had a number of years - but never gave it a try on my Ubuntu system - well, hooked the Asus to the wired ethernet cable in the room, added power, and tried to connect - the adapter was recognized by the IBM/Ubuntu system w/o a problem, and I was up & running immediately! Now I had the luxury of toting the computer to any place in the room - just another success story w/ this Linux clone! :D
(http://reviews.designtechnica.com/images/firstlook/asus/wl-330/wl330.jpg)
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on July 03, 2008, 09:38:37 PMWill Ubuntu run the Adobe Creative Suites 2 and 3? (Actually, all I really need is Illustrator, Photoshop, Acrobat professional, and Lightroom)
This is the right question. Let me add: Will Wlan run out of the box? Will it run my favourite audio players (fb2k, winamp)? Does it have decent audio software? Wave editors, vst fx and instruments? The question is: No. When it comes to audio, linux distributions (I cannot blame anybody though) do not play a role. 99.999% of all software is running on Windows/MacOS there.
Ubuntu: Great. But only with a Windows Virtualbox (http://virtualbox.org) in it. Btw I can recommend anybody trying Ubuntu or better Xubuntu in such a virtual Machine and judge yourself.
My first computer was an "Apricot F1".
@Sonicman: Do you know ONE professional using Gimp? It's got terrible usability.
And: The "Open unprotected hotel networks" isn't mainly a firewalling/packet filtering issue. It's rather about letting unencrypted traffic run over foreign hardware, sniffing.
Quote from: Wurstwasser on July 29, 2008, 08:22:05 PM
This is the right question. Let me add: Will Wlan run out of the box? Will it run my favourite audio players (fb2k, winamp)?
Another poor victim of Microsoft lock-in.
Back in the eighties there were multiple personal computing systems with their own software. This was a healthy market IMO. It's only because of the lock-in effect of Microsoft's de facto monopoly on the desktop that people now expect something like this.
Quote
Does it have decent audio software? Wave editors, vst fx and instruments? The question is: No.
You're not even able to google, apparently.
Quote from: Daverz on July 29, 2008, 10:11:35 PMYou're not even able to google, apparently.
Apparently you know only theory. Have a look at kvraudio.com and you'll see, there are myriads of instruments, Linux does not play a role, not even in a niche. I use a lot of vst instruments and some fx. Of course there's no Linux equivalent for any of them. Really no need to discuss about it. Waste of time. Or do you have, just one example, replacements for http://linplug.de/ instruments? RM IV for Linux? Tell more.
Quote from: Wurstwasser on July 29, 2008, 10:29:34 PM
Apparently you know only theory. Have a look at kvraudio.com and you'll see, there are myriads of instruments, Linux does not play a role, not even in a niche.
This is silly. Why are you pretending this was your only claim when it's right down there for everyone to read? It's not arguing in good faith.
Linux is missing software for a lot of niche stuff like this (or rather, the niche software makers are missing Linux support). For example, I still have to run win32 for Code Composer, needed for working on some embedded DSPs. They've got the customers locked in, so what the hell do they care if it doesn't run on Linux. I'd rather my employer avoided this extreme lock in in the first place, but it's their choice.
Also, one of the DAQ cards we use claims to have Linux drivers, but they seem to have been written by an idiot, so we can really only use these cards on XP.
Most (I'd say 99%) of people don't need this kind of niche software or hardware.
Quote from: Wurstwasser on July 29, 2008, 08:22:05 PM
This is the right question. Let me add: Will Wlan run out of the box?.......
Btw I can recommend anybody trying Ubuntu or better Xubuntu in such a virtual Machine and judge yourself.
@Sonicman: Do you know ONE professional using Gimp? It's got terrible usability.
And: The "Open unprotected hotel networks" isn't mainly a firewalling/packet filtering issue. It's rather about letting unencrypted traffic run over foreign hardware, sniffing.
Boy, the purpose of this thread was not to be a
diatribe over the Linux OS, regardless of its shortcomings. As
Daverz has already stated, 'niche' Windows software (whether 'pet' graphics or audio programs), just do not run easily, if at all, on a Linux system - but as indicated, those who need this software should stick to Windows and/or Mac OSs. And of course, if you want the latter, 'dual booting' is also an option rather than running a 'virtual box' w/i Linux or other mimicry software.
As for
Gimp, I never claimed that the program was great, just that I've used it to do 'simple' photo editing (mainly to crop & re-size my images to put on the web, thus no expert by far) - I even bought a book on GIMP, and found the program difficult to use (maybe better w/ practice?) - now I do have a lot of years using Photoshop, and if I had to do graphic editing on a daily basis, I would use either Windows or a Mac - don't believe there is a major argument here; but, I'm sure that GIMP would be adequate for many once the program is learned well and used daily (like any other complex software); since only a couple % of computer users employ a Linux system, then of course there will not be many 'professional' people using GIMP - however, for a 'free piece' of software, the program can be impressive.
Your point about 'unprotected' hotel networks is important for those using them and, of course, is completely independent of the OS being used to access them; the information passing through cyberspace is certainly 'unencrypted' unless using special software (VPNs) or specific sites. But I must say that of the two laptops that I carry on the road (IBM w/ Ubuntu & a newer Dell w/ VISTA), I feel more comfortable w/ the Linux laptop, the built-in
iptables firewall is excellent and virtually Linux viruses/malware are non-existent in the wild. But 'packet sniffers' could be lurking in the IT department of the hotels (or public hot spots) making 'wireless' connections in particular hazardous - my main rule is to never pass personal information over these connections (like credit card numbers, etc.), but this may still not be enough protection.
Well, thanks for your 'contrarian' opinion - all of these current OSs have their positive & negative aspects, and must be chosen for the prices one is willing to pay, the software & hardware that can be used, and the features that are needed whether from a personal or professional standpoint. :)
I prefer Debian Linux, and use online sources for information, but it's good people are exploring this. These operating systems are "robust" and seriously fun!
I have never seen, let alone use, a front end Linux client, but I am very happy with Linux as the web server OS of choice. All the hosts I use for the websites I have use Linux, and they run very fast with no problems at all.
Boldly going where no Ibex has gone before.
http://www.ubuntu.com/
IOW, Ubuntu 8.10 - codenamed Intrepid Ibex - was released today.
Quote from: opus67 on October 30, 2008, 11:33:34 AM
Boldly going where no Ibex has gone before.
http://www.ubuntu.com/
IOW, Ubuntu 8.10 - codenamed Intrepid Ibex - was released today.
And as with any software, I'll be waiting a few weeks before upgrading.
I've had nothing but good results with Ubuntu (my machines are dual-boot Windows and Linux boxes) and I have to say that when taking a laptop around and plugging it into other people's hardware I've often found fewer compatibility issues with Ubuntu than with Windows. Back in the day I rather despaired of Linux ever being a good choice for a home machine, but I'd have no qualms about recommending it for non-specialist uses these days (with a windows partition available for specialist software, games and the like).
I decided I'm not upgrading except for LTS editions. I found that as I upgraded, I had more and more problems that ever really got resolved. I am happy with things just working and being stable (that's why I don't use Windows, right?).
Is there any significant reason to upgrade from the LTS edition?
Quote from: Catison on October 30, 2008, 02:26:47 PM
Is there any significant reason to upgrade from the LTS edition?
I'm asking myself the same question. Anyone have any experience in these matters? The machine I'm currently using (which isn't really mine) is not even a dual-boot. (I've set an NTFS partition aside to install Windows later, but then changed my mind.)
One usually upgrades to have bleeding-edge software, that's all. :D While it may be the latest, it need not always be the greatest version, but the reviews of the RC have been quite promising.
http://www.linuxformat.co.uk/static/ubuntu810.html
http://www.dedoimedo.com/computers/ubuntu-8-10-review.html (A more detailed test than the previous one.)
Thanks for the links. The tabbed Nautilus looks good.
Quote from: Maciek on October 31, 2008, 03:15:18 AM
Thanks for the links. The tabbed Nautilus looks good.
You're welcome. :) Yes, tabs rule! ;D I will most probably be upgrading tomorrow.
This one's is a little silly, still... Ubuntu 8.10 Outperforms Vista (http://www.crn.com/software/211800390).
That title was actually taken from the Slashdot entry in which the report appeared. ;D
Currently running Ubuntu 7.10 (Gusty Gibbon) on my old IBM laptop - decided not to upgrade to Ubuntu 8.04 despite being offered that option in 'Upgrade Manager' - the newest release 8.10 (Intrepid Ibex) is enticing but just curious - what is the best option, i.e. just upgrade over the previous Ubuntu edition (once offered in 'Update Manager') or save my data files (which I do to an external USB HD), and then do a 'new' install? Thanks - :)
Quote from: SonicMan on October 31, 2008, 03:06:18 PMwhat is the best option, i.e. just upgrade over the previous Ubuntu edition (once offered in 'Update Manager') or save my data files (which I do to an external USB HD), and then do a 'new' install? Thanks - :)
Hi, Dave.
Save your data files no matter what! ;D I have been upgrading to new versions by using the "alternate" CD. (It helps to have a copy of the install CD around.) I am not sure if popping in that CD in 7.10 will let you upgrade directly to 8.10. If I were to upgrade, I would not to do a fresh install, unless something has gone awfully wrong and the current installation has become uselss. Too much work, IMO.
There are instructions available at the Ubuntu website on how to "jump" from one version to another. Hope these help. :)
Upgrading to 8.04 LTS (http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/upgrading-8.04)
Upgrading to 8.10 (from 8.04 LTS) (http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/upgrading)
Community Doc: UpgradeFromOldVersion (https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/UpgradeFromOldVersion)
I'm back! Running Ubuntu 8.10. The upgrade was smooth and successful, but it took longer than usual - about 4.5 hours, which also included 20-30 minutes to download updates on a 1.7Mbps connection.
The only problem which has been carried over from the previous version is that of kernels 2.6.22-15 and upwards. It never boots into the desktop with those kernel images. But thankfully, the working version has been retained. :)
Quote from: opus67 on November 01, 2008, 12:04:48 AM
Save your data files no matter what! ;D I have been upgrading to new versions by using the "alternate" CD. (It helps to have a copy of the install CD around.) I am not sure if popping in that CD in 7.10 will let you upgrade directly to 8.10. If I were to upgrade, I would not to do a fresh install, unless something has gone awfully wrong and the current installation has become uselss. Too much work, IMO.
There are instructions available at the Ubuntu website on how to "jump" from one version to another. Hope these help.............. :)
Opus - thanks for the advice & information; I second your first statement - all of my computers are attached to external HDs for backup purposes, so will have my data/music/image files stored! :D
Also, I'll check out those links shortly - I've been to those sites, esp. when getting started last year w/ 'Gusty Gibbon', but have not returned much lately - Dave :)
Well, since my last post, I decided to upgrade to Hardy Heron, i.e. Ubuntu 8.04 - took a while but went well and rebooted fine - loaded on the most recent release of Firefox - this is a LTS version, so will likely stick w/ this for a while! :)
Currently reading the book shown below: How to do Everything - Ubuntu by Jeffrey Orloff - released just a few months ago w/ coverage of Ubuntu 8.04, i.e. Hardy Heron - nice introduction (300+ pages) and up-to-date; not for those who already know Ubuntu fairly well and want to delve into specific issues, such as BASH; but a recommendation for 'newbies' to Ubuntu who may like a 'text in hand' vs. finding & reading the information from the web (and plenty is available!) - :D
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51MAQ37kC-L._BO2,204,203,200_PIsitb-sticker-arrow-click,TopRight,35,-76_AA240_SH20_OU01_.jpg)
Quote from: SonicMan on November 09, 2008, 02:03:20 PM
Well, since my last post, I decided to upgrade to Hardy Heron, i.e. Ubuntu 8.04 - took a while but went well and rebooted fine - loaded on the most recent release of Firefox - this is a LTS version, so will likely stick w/ this for a while! :)
Glad to know it was a smooth upgrade. :)
Update on my side: Since my last post about the kernel, I have now a working version of 2.6.27-7... most of the other Kernels have been removed (except 2.6.22-), and the grub menu looks a lot less cluttered now.
I'm a member of the Linux/Ubuntu club as of recently too! And it's been a great experience so far. :)
Quote from: ChamberNut on January 20, 2009, 04:22:14 PM
I'm a member of the Linux/Ubuntu club as of recently too! And it's been a great experience so far. :)
Ray - thanks for the update! :D Just brought that old IBM laptop on a recent trip to the Raleigh-Durham area (free 'wireless' in the room - of course, the room isn't cheap!) - no problem at all connecting - the Ubuntu computer is my 'on the road' laptop' - even starting to take it on the planes (Memphis, Orlando, et al) - easy to pack in my regular 'carry-on' - even if one is into only a Windows OS, putting a 'free' Linux OS on a 'cheap' laptop is worth the extra assurance just to have a 'back-up' - plus, I really feel 'safer' to take this older machine on the road! ;D
Quote from: Catison on October 30, 2008, 02:26:47 PM
I decided I'm not upgrading except for LTS editions. I found that as I upgraded, I had more and more problems that ever really got resolved. I am happy with things just working and being stable (that's why I don't use Windows, right?).
Is there any significant reason to upgrade from the LTS edition?
I think this is very sensible. If you want to upgrade specific software that has features that you desire you can do without feeling like you should upgrade the entire OS. Windows and Mac users would say duh!, but for some reason linux users feel the urge to upgrade versions for every release, as if everything gets magically better.
I used to use linux alot, there was programming I did that was linux friendly in grad school... but now honestly office and latex are all that I use now so I just stick with Windows.
It's sad to see that Ubuntu must have won, it's now considered (at least by this thread) synonymous with linux as if there were no other flavors. I find Debian, Slackware, Fedora, Mandriva, Arch, and Gentoo to all have their merits and many of them I prefer to Ubuntu, which I find to be too dumbed down and harder to tweak.
Quote from: DavidW on January 21, 2009, 02:31:10 AM
............It's sad to see that Ubuntu must have won, it's now considered (at least by this thread) synonymous with linux as if there were no other flavors. I find Debian, Slackware, Fedora, Mandriva, Arch, and Gentoo to all have their merits and many of them I prefer to Ubuntu, which I find to be too dumbed down and harder to tweak.
David is quite right in the increasing popularity and dominance of
Ubuntu - I like the GNOME GUI which provides a 'familiarity' for those coming from Windows and who might not be able to delve into the shell and re-programming; plus, for myself the computer I'm using has to be used easily by my wife 'on the road' - so she needs icons, clicks, and a mouse. OTOH, for those who may dislike slow bootups, the need for more RAM, and a desire to do some shell programming, there are innumerable Linux versions out there, some of which are listed above - check HERE (http://distrowatch.com/) for even a longer listing the the various 'distros' - :D
I know a lot of people preferring openSUSE. I personally prefer having a small linux running in a virtual machine, because naturally I use windows for most things. Basically audio stuff is important to me. So there's no need for performance. I do some compiler building things with yacc and haskell. I let TeX run on windows (miktex).
Nobody loving opensuse 11.1? Tried it once, I must say I have never seen a sexier and more functional installer before. Many things worked out of the box, even my printer was able to print double sided.
Ubuntu Pocket Guide and Reference (http://www.ubuntupocketguide.com/) - an e-book that you can download free of cost.
Oh, and I also just discovered ( :-[) that Linus runs a blog (http://torvalds-family.blogspot.com/).
Quote from: opus67 on February 02, 2009, 12:13:55 AM
Ubuntu Pocket Guide and Reference (http://www.ubuntupocketguide.com/) - an e-book that you can download free of cost.
Oh, and I also just discovered ( :-[) that Linus runs a blog (http://torvalds-family.blogspot.com/).
Opus - thanks for those links above - book is less than $10 on Amazon v.s. a free PDF download! :D
In a few hours, the (Unix) time (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unix_time) will be 1234567890.
To find out when this occurs in your time-zone, open up a terminal in your Linux box and paste the following command. [This assumes that Perl is installed in your computer. Most modern distros come with it.]
perl -e 'print scalar localtime(1234567890),"\n";'
And a little more info and links (http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS9473991308.html).
I downloaded Ubuntu a couple of days ago. It fits on a single CD. I have never used anything other than MS Windows, so the open source stuff is completely new. I went to download another Linux flavour (Debian), but the download was 3 dvd's, so I steered clear.
Ubuntu only 600 odd mb. If I get rid of Vista and install Ubuntu, what risk is there of everything going pear shaped? Drivers, etc? How difficult is it to have everything working through Ubuntu? Can I use windows apps or does it ALL have to be Linux? Or am I just old fashioned, as the last time I tried to install a Linux OS (2000) it was just plain unacceptably rubbish! But I do like the Ubuntu idea, I even downloaded the manual stated below, I just need a little reassurance!
Quote from: John on February 14, 2009, 08:35:22 AM
I downloaded Ubuntu a couple of days ago.
Nice. :)
QuoteIf I get rid of Vista and install Ubuntu, what risk is there of everything going pear shaped? Drivers, etc? How difficult is it to have everything working through Ubuntu? Can I use windows apps or does it ALL have to be Linux?
You can use (some) Windows apps. in Linux using another program called Wine (http://www.winehq.org/). Some like it, some don't. I have a some programs under Wine, but I rarely use them. But for the most basic tasks, you have a great, if not better, counterpart application in Linux. Or you could go the VMWare way and control your Windows desktop from inside Linux, or the Linux desktop from Windows. (Which I haven't tried it.) Or you could play safe and have a dual-boot system (http://users.bigpond.net.au/hermanzone/).
Re:hardware, Ubuntu (and Linux distros, in general) is becoming pretty good at identifying devices connected to the computer out of the box. I've had iPods, external hard-drives, printers, modems, etc. detected immediately. And reviews state, that even Bluetooth-enabled phones are not a big deal.
If you downloaded the LiveCD, you can boot from it to see if things like peripheral devices and your internet connection are detected.
QuoteOr am I just old fashioned, as the last time I tried to install a Linux OS (2000) it was just plain unacceptably rubbish! But I do like the Ubuntu idea, I even downloaded the manual stated below, I just need a little reassurance!
Oh, it's come a loong way since then. Just make sure you have a back-up of all your important files before installation. (This is just a general tip, rather than something to be told to only to new users of Linux. :))
Quote from: opus67 on February 14, 2009, 09:42:18 AM
Nice. :)
You can use (some) Windows apps. in Linux using another program called Wine (http://www.winehq.org/). Some like it, some don't. I have a some programs under Wine, but I rarely use them. But for the most basic tasks, you have a great, if not better, counterpart application in Linux. Or you could go the VMWare way and control your Windows desktop from inside Linux, or the Linux desktop from Windows. (Which I haven't tried it.) Or you could play safe and have a dual-boot system (http://users.bigpond.net.au/hermanzone/).
Re:hardware, Ubuntu (and Linux distros, in general) is becoming pretty good at identifying devices connected to the computer out of the box. I've had iPods, external hard-drives, printers, modems, etc. detected immediately. And reviews state, that even Bluetooth-enabled phones are not a big deal.
If you downloaded the LiveCD, you can boot from it to see if things like peripheral devices and your internet connection are detected.
Oh, it's come a loong way since then. Just make sure you have a back-up of all your important files before installation. (This is just a general tip, rather than something to be told to only to new users of Linux. :))
Great, thank you very much indeed for that. That was all the reassurance I needed. I will now be offline for a day or two ( ;D ;D)whilst I give this a shot. I used VMware in the past to test Vista from XP, but it's too klunky, so I'll be doing a peoper job. I'm looking forward to this now, freedom from a plethora Licenses and serial numbers.. :o
Quote from: John on February 14, 2009, 09:57:34 AM
I will now be offline for a day or two ( ;D ;D)whilst I give this a shot. I used VMware in the past to test Vista from XP, but it's too klunky, so I'll be doing a peoper job. I'm looking forward to this now, freedom from a plethora Licenses and serial numbers.. :o
Super! Good luck and good riddance (to proprietary licences and serial numbers and blue screens and... ) ;D
From Ubuntu Website:
"Need more software? Simply choose from thousands of software packages in the Ubuntu catalogue, all available to download and install at the click of a button. And it's all completely free!"
Mouthwatering. What am I doing with all these licenses? Putting them in the bin, thats what. :o Ubuntu's one small step for freedom; one giant leap for freedomkind! :o
Here goes...
;D
Quote from: John on February 14, 2009, 08:35:22 AM
I downloaded Ubuntu a couple of days ago. It fits on a single CD. I have never used anything other than MS Windows, so the open source stuff is completely new. I went to download another Linux flavour (Debian), but the download was 3 dvd's, so I steered clear.
Ubuntu only 600 odd mb. If I get rid of Vista and install Ubuntu, what risk is there of everything going pear shaped? Drivers, etc? How difficult is it to have everything working through Ubuntu? Can I use windows apps or does it ALL have to be Linux? Or am I just old fashioned, as the last time I tried to install a Linux OS (2000) it was just plain unacceptably rubbish! But I do like the Ubuntu idea, I even downloaded the manual stated below, I just need a little reassurance!
You're wrong about Debian, they have cd images as well as dvd images.
You should get this straight about wine-- it works well for some apps, okay with some bugs with others, and not at all for other apps.
This might come too late, but you're going about this completely the wrong way. You should use the live cd to make sure that all of your hardware works correctly before you install. You can also install software, drivers etc from live (it's wiped out when you reboot)... so you can at least figure out how to make everything work right before you install. That way if you can't figure out something vital, you know before you make the mistake of installing the OS. It doesn't make much sense to figure out all of that *after* you've done the install.
Since you have almost no prior linux experience, you really should take it much slower than you are.
Quote from: John on February 14, 2009, 10:15:09 AM
Ubuntu's one small step for freedom; one giant leap for freedomkind! :o
The puritan would prefer GNU/Linux, but if it's Ubuntu that's helping make Linux a popular desktop choice, then meh...
Quote from: opus67 on February 14, 2009, 10:21:38 AM
The puritan would prefer GNU/Linux, but if it's Ubuntu that's helping make Linux a popular desktop choice, then meh...
Well Ubuntu is the most popular Linux flavor, but it's not making Linux popular for the desktop, Linux as always remains ridiculously unpopular. I'm surprised to even see Linux and popular in the same sentence! :D
Quote from: John on February 14, 2009, 08:35:22 AM
I downloaded Ubuntu a couple of days ago. It fits on a single CD. I have never used anything other than MS Windows, so the open source stuff is completely new......................
Hi
John - big Ubuntu fan here; if you've looked at some of the previous posts, I went to 8.04 LTS at the end of October (as 8.10 was coming out). Of course, there are plenty of configuration options, such as 'dual booting' w/ Windows, but I had my previous 7.10 version installed on an old IBM laptop (using right now, in fact!). Check out the 'free' PDF guide mentioned by Opus by Keir Thomas; I actually bought the book from Amazon (only $10) and started to read it last night; concise and a great beginner's guide w/ plenty of discussion on the installation options.
Concerning hardware issues, when I loaded 7.10 on this machine at the end of '07, all of my hardware was recognized by the Ubuntu drivers which had been loaded (I have no proprietary drivers on the machine); the program recognized all of the IBM hardware, connected to my 'wireless' router w/o a problem (8.10 is suppose to be even much better w/ 'wireless' issues), detected all of my USB sticks, recognized my older external hard drive, Iomega CD burner (also external), Brother Laser printer, & HP scanner - I was rather flabbergasted (which is a frame of mind that I'm rarely in!); only hope the experience goes as easy for you.
Ubuntu comes w/ a plethora of 'free' software, including Open Office, graphics programs (GIMP is there more advanced imaging editing program), sound & audio options, plenty of games, and the option to download a bunch of other software. Now if you really need specific 'high-powered' Windows programs (which I don't for this laptop), then that might be a problem, e.g. some of the Windows Office features, Photo Shop, etc. But again I was amazed at what came w/ this Ubuntu package.
Now, there are plenty of other Linux distros, but I really like Ubuntu, and my wife uses this computer 'on the road' - I travel w/ it (just no virus, firewall, or other malware issues), so I needed a GUI that was like Windows - she has had no major issues. As to running Windows programs under Linux, there are a number of options, including WINE as already discussed (mixed reviews from my readings), but I've not given them a try. Good luck - Dave
Quote from: DavidW on February 14, 2009, 10:28:28 AM
Well Ubuntu is the most popular Linux flavor, but it's not making Linux popular for the desktop, Linux as always remains ridiculously unpopular. I'm surprised to even see Linux and popular in the same sentence! :D
Oh, I didn't mean 75%-market-share popular! :P But certainly more people - and not just geeks alone - are aware of and use Linux on the desktop today (of course, thanks largely due to Ubuntu) than any time since 1991.
Quote from: SonicMan on February 14, 2009, 10:32:01 AM
Concerning hardware issues, when I loaded 7.10 on this machine at the end of '07, all of my hardware was recognized by the Ubuntu drivers which had been loaded (I have no proprietary drivers on the machine); the program recognized all of the IBM hardware, connected to my 'wireless' router w/o a problem (8.10 is suppose to be even much better w/ 'wireless' issues), detected all of my USB sticks, recognized my older external hard drive, Iomega CD burner (also external), Brother Laser printer, & HP scanner - I was rather flabbergasted (which is a frame of mind that I'm rarely in!); only hope the experience goes as easy for you.
All of that hardware excepting the wireless are easily compiled as kernel modules, which is why I bet you'd find them working in any major distro. But the wireless issue is always tricky, because some of them require proprietary drivers, or tricky workarounds and then it's mostly an issue of did the devs decide it was important enough to conquer that issue for that specific bit of hardware? This issue also rears it's heads with video cards.
Anyhoo... the awesome approach is just to figure out exactly how to diy. The lazy approach (my favorite) is to simply try distros until you find the os that magically makes the tricky hardware work! :D
Quote from: opus67 on February 14, 2009, 10:35:25 AM
Oh, I didn't mean 75%-market-share popular! :P But certainly more people - and not just geeks alone - are aware of and use Linux on the desktop today (of course, thanks largely due to Ubuntu) than any time since 1991.
That's not even largely due to Ubuntu.
Innovation (firsties): Easy to use installer was done by Slackware. The live cd was around way before Ubuntu existed, can't recall who was first on that. The easy breesy package installer-- that's Debian. Did Ubuntu make gnome? Nope. XFCE? Nope. KDE? Nope. Open Office? Nope. Anything? Scratches head.
First popular Linux: Nope. That's Mandrake, Suse and Red Hat. I especially remember Mandrake, because it marketed itself the same way that Ubuntu does now-- as an easy to use, take you bye the hand Linux OS. And it sure did, it rocked!
Don't put too much on the shoulders of what is merely a Debian branch. It's the most popular Linux flavor now, but it had almost nothing to do with the success of Linux.
Quote from: DavidW on February 14, 2009, 10:41:53 AM
The lazy approach (my favorite) is to simply try distros until you find the os that magically makes the tricky hardware work! :D
Really, is that your idea of being lazy? Downloading, checking, burning (at 4x!), verifying, rebooting... ugh, and if it doesn't come with an Live CD, then installing!!! Of course, if checking out distros, like classical music fans do recordings, is your thing, then that's probably a good way to while away time. :D
As for me, Google is my friend. 0:)
NERDS!!!
(http://www.ugo.com/movies/dont-sweat-it/movies/images/revenge-of-the-nerds.jpg)
(http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/cautionary.png)
http://xkcd.com/456/
This proves I'm onto a good thing. From the Ubuntu CD, there's an option to boot the disk and run the OS without installing it, just to try it. I have sound, vision, and I am connected. All from a CD. Now I'm going to install it.
I'll be back on this post when it's done. ;D ;D
Quote from: opus67 on February 14, 2009, 10:53:48 AM
Really, is that your idea of being lazy? Downloading, checking, burning (at 4x!), verifying, rebooting... ugh, and if it doesn't come with an Live CD, then installing!!! Of course, if checking out distros, like classical music fans do recordings, is your thing, then that's probably a good way to while away time. :D
As for me, Google is my friend. 0:)
That is my idea of being lazy. It took me a weekend to get a winmodem working right with linux. I didn't jump around I just made it work on what I had at the time (that was either Red Hat 7 or 8, I don't recall now). In the past, I've had to recompile kernels, edit conf files and do all sorts of things to debug hardware issues in the past. Figuring out a hardware issue and fixing it can take much longer than hopping around.
Seriously, if you're so lazy that checking out a few distros seems like too much time, then you really shouldn't be using linux anyway, no matter how glamorous it appears now, it's still a diy os.
Yep, installed, updated, etc. :D
Hmm. My initial excitement may be premature. :-\ I had to run cock-a-hoop through a terminal to install ATI drivers using a 'superuser' command string. >:(
I'm Microsoft Certified Professional, know all that stuff inside out and back to front, nothing alien in it at all. But I knew this OS would be a whole new ballgame which would probably get one hell of a lot of getting used to. But I'll stick with it. ;D
I go to websites and they say such and such software runs under...unix, KD*, etc, and I only know what I have is Linux. Does it matter? I think I'll have to wave goodbye to Pro Evolution Soccer too! :'(
Quote from: John on February 14, 2009, 04:14:05 PM
Yep, installed, updated, etc. :D
Hmm. My initial excitement may be premature. :-\ I had to run cock-a-hoop through a terminal to install ATI drivers using a 'superuser' command string. >:(
I warned you! :D
Did you install a proprietary ati driver? You only need that for 3d acceleration, the open source driver (usually) works fine for 2d acceleration.
Quote
I go to websites and they say such and such software runs under...unix, KD*, etc, and I only know what I have is Linux. Does it matter? I think I'll have to wave goodbye to Pro Evolution Soccer too! :'(
Anything that runs under kde runs under linux. Linux refers to the kernel, kde is one of the desktops. The three main desktop flavors are Gnome, KDE and XFCE. If you installed plain old Ubuntu, then you are running gnome. If you want to try other desktops you can try apt-get install kubuntu-desktop as superuser for kde, and apt-get install xubuntu-desktop as superuser for xfce. Doing it that way will make sure that you don't start cluttering everything up with multiple desktops.
For installing software, most software will be in ubuntu's repo, for example if you want firefox just go apt-get install firefox (as superuser).
Revise: What I meant by Linux is that GNU software can be found on many flavors of Linux and Unix. The Linux operating systems are different from Unix operating systems in many ways, the primary difference being the kernel, the heart of the OS. The Linux kernel is GNU software, first created by Linus Torvald. Even though the BSD, Solaris etc operating systems stand apart proudly by having different license agreements, outside of the kernel, they still mostly use GNU software! :D
I mean...
WTF??? Below are the guidleines for installing 'Wine.'
Why can't anything just simply be double clicked on and it will install...this is getting me angry. I don't want to have to pre-program the OS with command line shit, I left all that behind with DOS and Windows 95. Windows already has command line built into it, with the run command and you can even browse to whatever it is you want to run. With this, one has to open a 'terminal' and issue commands, which if you're not familiar with the syntax protocols of Linux, is not user friendly at all.
My mouth is no longer watering, it has gone as dry as hell.
And it's maybe not one small step for freedom, one giant leap for freedomkind. More like one small step for freedom, one giant leap to get f**c*ed up. Things better improve with this, I tell ya, cos I'm not going through all the following kind of stuff every time I want to install something:
Yes Dave, I installed the proprietary ati drivers.
[I don't expect anyone to read the following spaghetti, but it's here just to let folks know that running this stuff is more complicated than a standard MS OS.] Pah! >:( >:(
Ubuntu and other Debian-based distributions utilize a special tool for managing packages known as APT. APT is able to automagically install all of the needed dependencies for a software package, as well as keep the package up to date, by scanning what are known as APT repositories. Ubuntu has its own repository of software that includes Wine, however we keep our own repository of the latest available beta packages here for download.
Warning: These are beta packages
The packages here are beta packages. This means they will periodically suffer from regressions, and as a result an update may break functionality in Wine. If the latest stable release of Wine (currently Wine 1.0.1) works for you, then you may not want to use these beta packages.
Adding the WineHQ APT Repository:
Open the Software Sources menu by going to System->Administration->Software Sources. Then select the Third Party Software tab and click Add.
System->Administration->Software Sources->Third Party Software
Then, copy and paste one of the lines below depending on which version you are running.
For Ubuntu Intrepid (8.10):
deb http://wine.budgetdedicated.com/apt intrepid main #WineHQ - Ubuntu 8.10 "Intrepid Ibex"
For Ubuntu Hardy (8.04):
deb http://wine.budgetdedicated.com/apt hardy main #WineHQ - Ubuntu 8.04 "Hardy Heron"
Trusting the WineHQ APT Repository and installing Wine:
After adding the repository, you also need to add the key for the repository to your system's list of trusted keys.
Download and save Scott Ritchie's key (right click -> save as) to your desktop. Then open the Authentication tab, click import key file, and select the key file you just saved (Scott Ritchie.gpg). It is safe to delete this file after doing this step.
System->Administration->Software Sources->Authentication
Click close to finish, and then reload the package information when prompted. If you have Wine installed, the system's update manager will now inform you of the latest Wine beta release and prompt you to upgrade. If you haven't installed Wine yet, go to Applications->Add/Remove and search for Wine or just click this link.
Upgrading to a new version of Ubuntu
If you are upgrading the entire system, such as going from Ubuntu 8.04 to 8.10, you will need to come back to this page and add the repository for the new version above. The built in update manager will not switch the Wine repository automatically.
Older .deb packages
Since the APT repository can only hold the latest packages, older versions of the packages are available at the WineHQ .deb packages archive.
You can install downloaded packages by double-clicking on them.
Alternative command Line Instructions for Installing Wine:
It is also possible to add the Wine repositories and install via the command line, as follows. These may be useful on Kubuntu, Xubuntu, and other Ubuntu derivatives.
First, open a terminal window (Applications->Accessories->Terminal). Then add the repository's key to your system's list of trusted APT keys by copy and pasting the following into your terminal:
wget -q http://wine.budgetdedicated.com/apt/387EE263.gpg -O- | sudo apt-key add -
Next, add the repository to your system's list of APT sources:
For Ubuntu Intrepid (8.10):
sudo wget http://wine.budgetdedicated.com/apt/sources.list.d/intrepid.list -O /etc/apt/sources.list.d/winehq.list
For Ubuntu Hardy (8.04):
sudo wget http://wine.budgetdedicated.com/apt/sources.list.d/hardy.list -O /etc/apt/sources.list.d/winehq.list
Then update APT's package information by running 'sudo apt-get update'. You can now install Wine normally or by typing 'sudo apt-get install wine' into the terminal.
Very fast and reliable webhosting for the APT repository is graciously provided by budgetdedicated.com.
WTF??
Well with kde you can have a run in the menu, and a run keyboard shortcut just like in windows, I had mine set up that way.
Anyway welcome to linux! :D That's why I said that it's still really a diy os. ;D
Hey there are *nix OSs that have click to install packages (and in fact wine has one for them)-- it's called pc-bsd. Now you wouldn't be using linux though, but it's still pretty cool.
In general, there are distros that try to make it easy for windows user, I'll post 'em and what's cool about 'em in a second.
Alright
Pioneer Linux-- http://www.tapioneer.com/index.php (http://www.tapioneer.com/index.php) because it comes with wine. Also it has support (if you pay) for Crossover Office.
Pioneer is a branch off of Mepis which is now a branch off of Ubuntu.
Linux Mint-- http://www.linuxmint.com/index.php (http://www.linuxmint.com/index.php)
Mint (full version) comes with proprietary goodies to get the video drivers working, wireless, play mp3s, dvds etc all the stuff that vanilla distros don't do. Mint is a branch off of Ubuntu.
Mandriva-- http://www.mandriva.com/ (http://www.mandriva.com/)
Mandriva (One) includes the propriety stuff again including drivers and it's wine rpm is a one click install. Mandriva used to be Mandrake, which is a branch off of Red Hat.
Click to install is available in Ubuntu. John, you can install anything available in the repository by going to System->Administration->Synaptic Package Manager. There you will find the list of all packages available, installed or not. You can search for a package with its name or description. After selecting the packages, it takes only a couple of clicks to have them all installed. (This is probably the same or less than the number of clicks it takes, in MS, to go to a website of the software provider, then to the download page, click on the link to the install file, save it somewhere, then run the installer, answer umpteen questions, and finally click Finish. Oh, and don't forget that .dll that you may have to download from some other site that for this program to run.) APT usually takes care of dependencies, asking you for nothing more than your permission to install them.
Personally, I do away with clicks, and simply type (actually, simply press Ctrl+R to find the command from the terminal's history) and insert the appropriate package name(s) and hit enter.
sudo apt-get update
sudo apt-get install <package1> [<package2> ...]
Moreover, if some software is not supported or not available in any of the repositories, it is likely that they will have a .deb package installer (similar to the double-click .exe installer in Windows.)[Example (http://www.opera.com/browser/download/)], and even better they may have a repository that you can add to Synaptic, so that the software will be updated when a new version is out without you having to go to their website to download it. [Example - the Wine page linked to below] (Do check for reviews before adding new programs/repositories, though. There was once a program called Automatix, which could install many oft-used programs and plugins not supported by Ubuntu by the "select and click" method, and it had to be added through a repo. While I personally did not have any problems with it, there were some complaints. Eventually, the project was discontinued.)
Here's a simpler HOW-TO (http://www.psychocats.net/ubuntu/wine) I found for installing Wine. Also, the stuff you posted in small font is NOT recommended for all users. [A note for those who didn't read the spaghetti: it's various (sometimes unrelated) sections all put into one paragraph, giving you the illusion of a long process. Here's the actual page: http://www.winehq.org/download/deb.]
P.S.: With regard to Pro Evolution Soccer, I did tell you that dual-booting was an option.
I am sorry for ranting last night. :o
I woke up this morning, switched my PC on, everything came up and, by all the megabytes, I thought to myself, how bloody ungrateful can I get? I've done away with Windows (for sure) and joined and expanding Worldwide community who use this software developed gratis and for gratis by well meaning, hard-working programmers all over the World.
So I played with it a little bit, looking around some more, playing music (must get a nicer Media Player for Ubuntu, it's built in player is fully functional, etc, but lacks aesthetics). I downloaded Mandriva Linux overnight too, I'll install it for dual boot. And I like the look of Mint, so I'll get that today too and have a triple booting system! Over a while I'll try these three OS's, and eventually settle on my favourite. I am NOT going back to Windows.
There's no point in my complaining already. It's free, I just have to accept that there is a slight learning curve involved. So I'll install Mandriva on dual boot, see how that is, and when I get used to it, I'll probably be hanging from the chandeliers singing it's praises again.
Point of fcat, it was Mandrake that I had in 2000 and was thoroughly appalled with - but Opus, you are right, things have come a long, long way since then.
Thank you Opus and Dave for all your guidance, patience and comments. I am growing happier again by the minute.
5 mins on: Ha! Ha Ha! How silly of me. On that spaghetti page which you kindly linked to again below Opus, there is a wee hyperlink saying "Click here if you want to install Wine" or something like that. I clicked it, and about 20 seconds later Wine was installed, no need for spaghetti, no hassle, nothing. I want to remove that ranting post below now, but I won't, because prospective Linux users can see how easy it is to get into a flummox over nothing - all one has to do is PAY ATTENTION to the guidelines and it can be as simple as just one click!
Cool John, good that you got it set up. If you haven't already, I would register on the Ubuntu forums and then you can jump on with questions and get things solved fast. Have fun! :)
Yes, now things are going swimmingly well, but if I hadn't you guys initially, I would still be using Windows.
Initial Notes about this OS:
1. Integrated Firefox is a breeze, not overloaded, and very fast indeed.
2. There seems to be an array of things you can do with the sound - at least for my card anyway.
3. I know the temperature and weather for Glasgow without installing 3rd party apps!
4. Spellchecking Spell checking is fantastically integrated.
5. Ooodles of things one can do with it to suit oneself without having to install other apps to do the same - do it your way, not the way a program wants you to do it.
6. Evolution email is good, and like everything else seems to be as easy as 1+1.
7. The stretch icon function is fabulous, one can decorate ones desktop with pictures in any way you want, etc, again without the need for other apps to do it for you.
Och I'm very happy now. As for Pro Evolution Soccer, that's for the PS2 now. Other than the little bundled games (GNU Chess!), I've decided that a PC is not the ideal gaming device anyway, and I can dedicate the system more to what I love, music, writing, and other stuff.
I have gone all soft. :-*
Thanks for everybodys help. Now I'm going to sign up to an Ubuntu forum as you suggested David, and tackle any snags from there.
Quote from: John on February 15, 2009, 06:50:17 AM
Yes, now things are going swimmingly well, but if I hadn't you guys initially, I would still be using Windows.
Initial Notes about this OS:
3. I know the temperature and weather for Glasgow without installing 3rd party apps
John - been reading your posts (and the helpful ones by
David) - glad that all is working out w/ your Ubuntu experience! Love the ability to add the little applets on the top panel line - at the moment in Piedmont, NC - 43 degs F & sunny; may have a little snow tonight? Dave
I'm glad that installation was smooth, John. :) Re: music player, give Amarok a try. Not the latest (version 2.0), which has received mixed reviews, but the earlier 1.4.10, which is available in the repo.
sudo apt-get install amarok
(That can be done through Synaptic as well.)
Since Amarok is a KDE app., there is the need to install other files related to that environment, but that little command above will take care of all that.
And, since you are new user, you would need the help of this site. It was very helpful when I first installed Ubuntu, and even today l sometimes go back to it for reference.
http://www.psychocats.net/ubuntu/index.php
sudo apt-get install amarok
Thanks Opus. Happening now as I type!
Actually, after playing around, installations are so easy! I have all manner of wee toys and things on my top bar now. Another thing, system resources are not in any way swallowed up by the OS and its gadgetry, leaving a MASS of HD space for music files, etc.
I am so into this now! ;D
Dave: Piedmont, NC - 43 degs F & sunny; may have a little snow tonight?
An OS integrated with the Worldwide weather system. This is so cool!
EDIT: Amarok - that's more like it. Just what I had in mind.
In other news, Debian rolled out their latest version - that would be 5.0 for those keeping count - codenamed Lenny.
http://www.debian.org/
The next(-to-next) version in the line of Ubuntu releases has been announced.
Let me introduce to you - drum rolls, please - Karmic Koala! ;D ;D
This will be Ubuntu 9.10. 9.04 is, of course, Jaunty Jackalope.
Announcement (https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-announce/2009-February/000536.html)
Quote from: opus67 on February 21, 2009, 07:17:35 AM
The next(-to-next) version in the line of Ubuntu releases has been announced.
Let me introduce to you - drum rolls, please - Karmic Koala! ;D ;D
This will be Ubuntu 9.10. 9.04 is, of course, Jaunty Jackalope.
Announcement (https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-announce/2009-February/000536.html)
This is dictionary abuse.
New to the wonderful world of Linux? Looking for an easy way to get started? Download our complete 130-page guide and get to grips with the OS in hours rather than weeks or months. We show you how to install Linux onto your PC, navigate around the desktop, master the most popular Linux programs and fix any problems that may arise.
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Ta.
???
*Wikis it*
Thank You in British, Australian, New Zealand and South African English
:)
Yu wuh (I just made that up... :D)
FINALLY...
An Ubuntu package for Google Chrome... actually it's a pre-alpha (read very early, not ready for market) version.
Details here: http://www.downloadsquad.com/2009/03/17/google-chrome-on-linux-progressing-screenshots-inside/
The release candidate for Ubuntu 9.04 (a.k.a Jaunty Jackalope) has been announced. [Link (https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-announce/2009-April/000121.html)] The RC is usually as good as the official release on release day. But I would ask first-timers to wait for at least a week until after release date (23 April 2009) before trying the new version out. There will be enough reviews written by then. Of course, you can always download the LiveCD and do a test run without it affecting your existing installation.
As CmdrTaco (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rob_Malda) put it: gentlemen, start your torrents.
Ubuntu 9.04 has been released.
http://www.ubuntu.com
Commander Taco on seeing the first iPod: No wireless. Less space than a nomad. Lame.
He was right. I hope he bought a ton of Apple stock.
Tip for the day: If you have a set of files which was originally a single file but which was then split into so many parts for whatever reason, and now you want to join them back, enter this nifty little command using the cat utility at a terminal.
cat <common name of the files>.<extension>.* > <Somename. Anyname>.<extension:same as the original>
So, if you have a file split into three parts, e.g., ViolinConcerto.rar.001, ViolinConcerto.rar.002 and ViolinConcerto.rar.003, then you'd have to enter the command as follows
cat ViolinConcerto.rar.* > ViolinConcertoJoined.rar
Of course, this assumes that your current working directory is the one in which you have stored the split files. If not, you can either 'cd' into it or mention the complete path of the source and destination files in the command itself.
My experience with trying Linux:
I tried the Ubuntu Live CD maybe a year ago but could not get my laptop to connect to my wireless network because it needed to download and install a driver (which didn't work for me in the Live environment). Based on my Live CD experience, I gave up on Linux (for a while). A few weeks ago I decided to give it another try by installing Ubuntu 9.04 in Windows Vista using Wubi, which was less of a commitment than installing it in its own partition because I could uninstall it like any other Windows program. This time the wireless network driver downloaded and installed perfectly, and everything worked great. I liked it so much that I decided to install it into its own partition on my hard drive. This weekend I reinstalled Windows (I couldn't get Vista SP1 to install, so I thought this would help, which it did) and have my empty partition ready to go. Tonight I'll install Ubuntu and hopefully everything will go as smoothly as when I installed it into Windows. :)
*Sips a cup of Keemun tea* ;)
For those who do such things, mark your calendars for the 29th of October, 2009. The latest instalment of Ubuntu (9.10 if you're keeping track) will become available for download. Since this will not be a "long-term support" release, a lot of new software and changes have been brought to the Koala. And most (all?) are for the better.
Found a quick overview of the new features from a user's point of view here (http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2009/10/ubuntu-910-review-karmic.html). (Screenshots included.)
The release candidate has been available for nearly a week and can be downloaded from locations listed at Ubuntu's website (http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/releasenotes/910overview#Download).
And as we enter November, we can expect the final releases of two other major distros: Fedora (http://fedoraproject.org/) (12) and Mandriva (http://www2.mandriva.com/) (2010).
Just reading the newest issue of PC World the other day which had a tip to add a 'dictionary check' to your Ubuntu desktop - by highlighting a word (e.g. in a web page, document, etc.) and then clicking on the 'new' dictionary icon, the word is checked at the Merriam-Webster web site and the definition of the word pops up in a new page; easy to add - not sure 'how much' I'll use this function, but may be useful to some - CHECK HERE (http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/171440/add_a_desktop_dictionary_to_ubuntu.html), if interested. :D
Pah, Linux is for losers, real men use BSD. ;D
Personally, if it wasn't for my nostalgic clinging to video games i would have kissed windows good by a long time ago. As it were, i'm forced to keep a dual boot installation.
Currently, my favored distribution of Linux is Mint, which is a nice smoothed out version of Ubuntu.
Quote from: SonicMan on October 26, 2009, 04:25:34 PM
Just reading the newest issue of PC World the other day which had a tip to add a 'dictionary check' to your Ubuntu desktop - by highlighting a word (e.g. in a web page, document, etc.) and then clicking on the 'new' dictionary icon, the word is checked at the Merriam-Webster web site and the definition of the word pops up in a new page; easy to add - not sure 'how much' I'll use this function, but may be useful to some - CHECK HERE (http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/171440/add_a_desktop_dictionary_to_ubuntu.html), if interested. :D
Thanks for the tip, Dave. :) I use this add-on (http://www.dictionarytip.com/) in Firefox. (And if I'm far away from the mouse -- read: too lazy to use one -- I just use the search bar. ;D)
Quote from: Josquin des Prez on October 26, 2009, 08:03:02 PM
Pah, Linux is for losers, real men use BSD. ;D
Personally, if it wasn't for my nostalgic clinging to video games i would have kissed windows good by a long time ago. As it were, i'm forced to keep a dual boot installation.
Currently, my favored distribution of Linux is Mint, which is a nice smoothed out version of Ubuntu.
You know that frequent release cycle is BS, it destroys confidence in having a stable OS for years. Go with BSD model with continuous updates, and have it be stable and secure enough you could for years without distro hopping. But make it actually easy to use. ;D Gentoo Linux is cool for being closest to that model but they piss on newbs, they're like the anti-Ubuntu. :D
Debian and Red Hat are good examples of offering up stable releases, instead of this cutting edge every 6 months nonsense. But this upgrade your OS (which I know is really optional) every few months and having so many incompatible versions is a sign that these distros are not meant for serious work, just messing around. People that want to use their computers to you know actually get work done don't want to mess with their OS besides turning on and logging in.
I installed 9.10 on a brand new computer yesterday. Installation went well, and the two times I timed it, a cold boot took around 27 seconds -- pretty close to the value of 25 promised by devs. But I seemed to have a BIG problem in terms of Internet connectivity. :( It just doesn't work as it should. Many people are reporting the same/similar problem(s) on Ubuntu Forums. I used a fix for Firefox (setting network.dns.disableIPv6 to true in about:config), but I have been unable to find a solution/fix for the rest of the system.
Well, I found a work-around for system-wide Internet. I edited the /etc/resolv.conf file by manually specifying DNS server addresses.
What I want to know is not if Linux/Ubuntu is easy, but does it do anything I can't do in Windows. I know all the reasons for disliking Windows, and it would be great if I could use an OS that just worked the way I wanted it to for audio/video/games. Since Windows does most of this well, the biggest thing for me would be a system that does it better, with fewer problems. One thing that I'd like is native rate audio, where you get out what you put in with no resampling. Another thing is better color controls for desktop and video, with easy to use controls for both.
Quote from: opus106 on May 08, 2009, 06:53:20 PM
Tip for the day: If you have a set of files which was originally a single file but which was then split into so many parts for whatever reason, and now you want to join them back, enter this nifty little command using the cat utility at a terminal.
cat <common name of the files>.<extension>.* > <Somename. Anyname>.<extension:same as the original>
So, if you have a file split into three parts, e.g., ViolinConcerto.rar.001, ViolinConcerto.rar.002 and ViolinConcerto.rar.003, then you'd have to enter the command as follows
cat ViolinConcerto.rar.* > ViolinConcertoJoined.rar
Of course, this assumes that your current working directory is the one in which you have stored the split files. If not, you can either 'cd' into it or mention the complete path of the source and destination files in the command itself.
Or, in Windows, select the files and extract with WinRar to a folder. They're joined. It isn't an advantage if you can do this
almost as easily, or
just as easily. If that's the case there's not much reason to switch. Maybe I'm not a good candidate because of my interests. I'll still keep an open mind, though. Now I'm wondering if I should download the CD that runs in Windows like David suggested, in preference to setting up a dual boot. If I get intrigued by it, who knows? If I'm lucky I'll develop an unhealthy obsession with it and start spamming the board with "you gotta try this!" sermons.
:D Quote from: opus106 on November 03, 2009, 10:11:20 PM
Well, I found a work-around for system-wide Internet. I edited the /etc/resolv.conf file by manually specifying DNS server addresses.
Now I'm convinced.
;D (sorry, couldn't resist)
QuoteOr, in Windows, select the files and extract with WinRar to a folder. They're joined. It isn't an advantage if you can do this almost as easily, or just as easily. If that's the case there's not much reason to switch.
Well, tell me how you would do the same for, say, avi files that were split in the same way. Does WinRar help you with that? (And, BTW, that tip was not a
sermon; I was sharing information with others in this forum who use Linux -- and there are a few -- about a useful feature. I know Windows users use HJSplit to achieve that, and that that program can be run under WINE in Linux.)
In any case, a Windows installation does not come with any utility that opens an archive -- correct me if I'm mistaken. (You'll have to go to Winrar's site, download the installer and do the clickity-click thing to install it.) Let me just briefly explain what that command does, for those not-in-the-know: The
cat command is part of BASH (http://linuxcommand.gds.tuwien.ac.at/learning_the_shell.php) (Bourne-Again SHell) which is a part of almost every Linux distro out there. What it does is to redirect the content of the argument (the filename that follows cat) to the standard output (IOW, prints the stuff out onto your monitor).
A command like
cat file.txtwould print the contents of the text file in your terminal. But since we are dealing with a rar file (or avi, or mpeg, or zip or whatever), which when "printed" would appear like gibberish, we instead redirect that output using the redirection operator (>) to a file which we call whatever we want. (It will be automatically created.)
The * acts as a wild-card operator collecting all files with the names that has the string preceding/succeeding it.
First, I wasn't accusing anyone of sermonizing, I was suggesting that if I really liked it I might go off the deep end, since I sometimes do with things.
I've only joined audio files so I don't know about other files split into .rar files or other compression schemes.
Quote from: opus106 on November 03, 2009, 11:21:37 PM
Well, tell me how you would do the same for, say, avi files that were split in the same way. Does WinRar help you with that? (And, BTW, that tip was not a sermon; I was sharing information with others in this forum who use Linux -- and there are a few -- about a useful feature. I know Windows users use HJSplit to achieve that, and that that program can be run under WINE in Linux.)
In any case, a Windows installation does not come with any utility that opens an archive -- correct me if I'm mistaken. (You'll have to go to Winrar's site, download the installer and do the clickity-click thing to install it.) Let me just briefly explain what that command does, for those not-in-the-know: The cat command is part of BASH (http://linuxcommand.gds.tuwien.ac.at/learning_the_shell.php) (Bourne-Again SHell) which is a part of almost every Linux distro out there. What it does is to redirect the content of the argument (the filename that follows cat) to the standard output (IOW, prints the stuff out onto your monitor).
A command like
cat file.txt
would print the contents of the text file in your terminal. But since we are dealing with a rar file (or avi, or mpeg, or zip or whatever), which when "printed" would appear like gibberish, we instead redirect that output using the redirection operator (>) to a file which we call whatever we want. (It will be automatically created.)
The * acts as a wild-card operator collecting all files with the names that has the string preceding/succeeding it.
Are you explaining how this works to convince everyone that this process is easier than downloading WinRar? Or that if it's understood better then it's OK if it's more difficult? Look, I was trying to make the point (when you thought I was accusing you of something) that if I learned how to use this OS I might feel the same sense of accomplishment that you do. Thing is....right now I don't want to learn this unless it gets me something more useful than pride in learning something hard, though if I did I'd probably flip and try to get everyone on board.
Windows opens some archives. I haven't needed Winzip in ages. For joining split and compressed files WinRar is pretty standard I think.
Quote from: drogulus on November 04, 2009, 12:47:45 AM
First, I wasn't accusing anyone of sermonizing, I was suggesting that if I really liked it I might go off the deep end, since I sometimes do with things.
I thought I detected a bit of
snarkiness, that's all.
QuoteAre you explaining how this works to convince everyone that this process is easier than downloading WinRar? Or that if it's understood better then it's OK if it's more difficult?
You were hanging onto my example of joining a rar file and I was just pointing out that the command applies to any type of file that was split. The explanation was free -- take it or leave it. ;)
QuoteLook, I was trying to make the point (when you thought I was accusing you of something) that if I learned how to use this OS I might feel the same sense of accomplishment that you do. Thing is....right now I don't want to learn this unless it gets me something more useful than pride in learning something hard, though if I did I'd probably flip and try to get everyone on board.
Right, you're not interested in it right now: I get it.
Quote from: opus106 on November 03, 2009, 08:51:29 PM
I installed 9.10 on a brand new computer yesterday. Installation went well, and the two times I timed it, a cold boot took around 27 seconds -- pretty close to the value of 25 promised by devs. But I seemed to have a BIG problem in terms of Internet connectivity. :( It just doesn't work as it should. Many people are reporting the same/similar problem(s) on Ubuntu Forums. I used a fix for Firefox (setting network.dns.disableIPv6 to true in about:config), but I have been unable to find a solution/fix for the rest of the system.
The guy who installed Ubuntu on my machine last year left me a voice mail last night, saying not to upgrade to 9.10, as users were experiencing problems. He told me to wait awhile until they work out the glitches before upgrading.
Quote from: opus106 on November 04, 2009, 05:05:31 AM
Right, you're not interested in it right now: I get it.
No, I just have questions about whether I
should be interested, given my particular needs. My questions about what Linux/Ubuntu is good for are real questions, not rhetorical. If I wasn't interested I'd just stay on the Windows thread.
Quote from: drogulus on November 03, 2009, 10:22:47 PM
Now I'm wondering if I should download the CD that runs in Windows like David suggested, in preference to setting up a dual boot. If I get intrigued by it, who knows? If I'm lucky I'll develop an unhealthy obsession with it and start spamming the board with "you gotta try this!" sermons. :D
DL'ing Mint 7 now.
:o
Posting from within Mint 7 (CD, not installed yet):
I'm going to need a little time to figure this out. I don't know how to enable S/PDIF out yet. My music plays but I can't hear it.
Currently running Ubuntu 8.04 on my old IBM laptop - LTS for this release, so probably will not upgrade to the '09 releases - happy at the moment - :)
But I did just purchase the 4th edition of the book shown below by Keir Thomas et al - had this book in the 2nd edition - excellent introduction to this OS & Distro - includes a disc w/ Ubuntu 9.04 (and other offerings on the included CD) - for those just getting into Linux and liking the Ubuntu Distro, and also wanting a 'book' - a recommendation - :)
(http://i35.tinypic.com/70usjk.jpg)
Quote from: Josquin des Prez on October 26, 2009, 08:03:02 PMCurrently, my favored distribution of Linux is Mint, which is a nice smoothed out version of Ubuntu.
Interesting one!
http://www.linuxmint.com/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9kq3k4AkNc
Google Chrome is now available for Linux (and Mac). (As Beta, of course. ;))
http://www.google.com/chrome/intl/en/w00t.html
I have been using Chromium, the foundation from which Chrome is built, for a while and it's quite good. It's the functionalities provided by extensions in Firefox that makes me stick with the browser for the most part. Third-party add-ons not endorsed by Google are available for Chrome, e.g. AdBlock+ (http://www.chromeextensions.org/appearance-functioning/adblock/), but still they are a long way away from many of the features I have taken for granted in Fx.
Quote from: Opus106 on December 08, 2009, 09:26:48 AM
Google Chrome is now available for Linux (and Mac). (As Beta, of course. ;))
What is the anti-virus software for this? Chrome Dome? ;D
Quote from: Brahmsian on December 08, 2009, 09:28:34 AM
What is the anti-virus software for this? Chrome Dome? ;D
Dude, we're talking Linux (and Mac) here!
[One more pop. culture reference that flew over my head. ;D]
Quote from: Opus106 on December 08, 2009, 09:26:48 AM
It's the functionalities provided by extensions in Firefox that makes me stick with the browser for the most part. Third-party add-ons not endorsed by Google are available for Chrome, e.g. AdBlock+ (http://www.chromeextensions.org/appearance-functioning/adblock/), but still they are a long way away from many of the features I have taken for granted in Fx.
Update: Google-approved extensions are available for Linux and Windows.
https://chrome.google.com/extensions/
Curious issue arose on my OLD IBM laptop running Ubuntu 8.04 (discussed in the OP I started this thread about 2 1/2 yrs ago!) - the laptop was 'freezing up' and would not run programs nor connect to the web - checked the HD disc space and was @ maximum capacity! Now, this is only an 18 GB HD but usually was only half filled - what the HELL filled up the HD?
Well, I left a post on the UbuntuForums.org - great place for quick responses - a bunch of suggestions were made (from experienced BEANERS there!) suggesting a bunch of BASH command checks (now I'm pretty much a bashful BASH user at the moment) - but one was to check for files > 1 GB in size (obviously a half dozen or more of these would fill up my limited HD).
Bottom line - a bunch were found embedded deeply into apparent TAR backup files - I suspect that my 'backup' configuration has been routinely making these LARGE files (because I never checked to see what the default settings might have been - dummy!) - I was able to delete a number of these TAR files/folders and recover a lot of disc space - decided to update to Ubuntu 8.10 and immediately went to the backup option and reset not to do 'automatic' periodic backups (just not needed for me on this computer).
So, now back in business w/ this 'ancient' laptop which I love to take 'on the road' - small, works w/ hotel wireless, no fear of malware, and if lost or damaged, I'll get a new one! Happy again - ;D
Good to know that your old lappy is up and running again, Dave. (Hey, BTW, the next LTS is upon us -- 10.04; and Ubuntu is getting a cosmetic mac-over. ::))
Another space occupier are the updates from Canonical and third parties (if any). All of that are stored as deb files in /var/cache/apt/archives. Unless you want some of those installers for some other reason (back-up or for your personal set of packages) you can clear that directory to make some space.
apt-get clean
gets the job done. Also,
apt-get autoremove
removes installed packages that are no longer required. :)
Quote from: Opus106 on March 14, 2010, 08:48:51 PM
Good to know that your old lappy is up and running again, Dave. (Hey, BTW, the next LTS is upon us -- 10.04; and Ubuntu is getting a cosmetic mac-over. ::))
apt-get clean
gets the job done. Also,
apt-get autoremove
removes installed packages that are no longer required. :)
Hi
Navneeth - yep, I tried those two commands first - removed about 80 MB only! Curiously, these multiple dated folders (each had one big TAR file - some a GB + a bunch of smaller text files) were buried in media/disc..... - not sure if my previous BU program had that set as default or what?
Well, I knew that 10.04 was about to be released but could not wait and was able to bump up the OS 6 months at least - we're going on a short vacation in a few days, so I wanted to take the laptop along w/ us! Thanks for the suggestions - Dave :)
Dave, perhaps you are already familiar with some or all of them, but I'm posting it here so that in case you didn't, you may find it interesting/useful. :)
7 of the Best Free Linux Medical Imaging Software (http://www.linuxlinks.com/article/2010030916055813/MedicalImaging.html%5C)
EDIT:
Quote from: Opus106 on October 26, 2009, 11:11:04 AM
8<
And as we enter November, we can expect the final releases of two other major distros: Fedora (http://fedoraproject.org/) (12) and Mandriva (http://www2.mandriva.com/) (2010).
I'm using Mandriva One. Works fine, it connects with the wireless network, couldn't achieve that with Ubuntu. Quite essential, which makes it imo a good alternative for Windows. Anything else just works too. Disadvantage that I can't use Emusic on it, but I can do that with an other computer. Google also made a Linux version: gOS. Has anyone already used it?
Henk
Quote from: Henk on March 17, 2010, 10:30:28 AM
I'm using Mandriva One. Works fine, it connects with the wireless network, couldn't achieve that with Ubuntu. Quite essential, which makes it imo a good alternative for Windows.
I have a wireless router, but my Desktop which runs Ubuntu is actually connected via ethernet, so I can't comment on that.
QuoteAnything else just works too. Disadvantage that I can't use Emusic on it, but I can do that with an other computer.
Banshee (http://banshee-project.org/) has an emusic plugin.
QuoteStill waiting for Chrome OS, which is announced to be ready late 2010, but I don't know if that's a reliable announcement. Is there someone who can tell more about it?
Huh? See the top-most post on this page (http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,4630.msg376637.html#msg376637). :) Or is the Beta label that is putting you off? I've been using Chrome (Chromium, actually) since prior to the official launch and I have not had problems with it all. Oh, so sorry about that. Chrome
OS is still at a very early stage -- I don't think it's even meant to be built on a regular machine right now, and their eventual target is the netbook.
Quote from: Opus106 on March 17, 2010, 10:16:37 AM
Dave, perhaps you are already familiar with some or all of them, but I'm posting it here so that in case you didn't, you may find it interesting/useful. :)
7 of the Best Free Linux Medical Imaging Software (http://www.linuxlinks.com/article/2010030916055813/MedicalImaging.html%5C)
Navneeth - thanks for that link - some interesting programs; of course, at work we are completely digital w/ DICOM PACS system, voice recognition dictating system, and more! I've not explored the Linux options but will take a look - Dave :D
Has anybody used Opensuse? Heard good things about it and may install it on my laptop with the Live cd.
Linuxables: Intro to Linux Command Line (http://www.linux.com/learn/tutorials/320914:linuxables-intro-to-linux-command-line)
Quote from: Jack WallenThis is the first in a series of a "Linuxables," short, quickly consumable tutorials that can provide easy reference while at work or at home. We hope they're useful for you.
Ah, the Linux command line - that of which myths and legends are made. It is that frightening beast that keeps so many users from trying Linux. After all, everyone knows you MUST use the command line if you want Linux as your operating system. Not so. In fact, you could install Linux, never touch the command line, and have an amazing experience. But there are times when you will want to have that extra power at your fingertips. And when that time comes, you want to be prepared for it. The Linux command line is not all that difficult...you're not programming in assembly after all.
It is my intent, in this first series of "Linuxables," to introduce you to the Linux command line interface (often referred to as the CLI) in such a way as to alleviate any hesitations related to this versatile, powerful administrative tool.
BOY, over a year since a post here - and just to think this OS and its programs are free! ;D
My old IBM laptop may have seen its end (dates to 2005)? A couple of nights ago I tried to upgrade from an 09 Ubuntu version to 10.04LTS - received a 'bug' issue, saved a text file (w/o reading it) - installation seemed to complete but on the reboot, the OS got to loading the GUI and stalled. I could get into the command terminal and the OS stated was indeed the new one, but I've just not learned enough about BASH to do much w/o a lot of help.
So, is there a way to recover w/i BASH from this stalled installation or should I try to boot an iso image and just wipe out the HD? I got into the IBM BIOS was able to re-arrange the boot order to start w/ an external CDR/RW or a USB thumb drive (needed to disable the internal HD because the boot kept defaulting to that drive).
Now I made several different 10.04LTS iso CD-Rs, and tried to boot from an external Iomega drive - but kept getting a 'PXE-E61 - Media test failure, check cable' error message, regardless of the iso image used and also w/ a USB thumb drive attempt. I'm about ready to give up and junk this computer at its age - talked into getting an iPad2 which I've added a keyboard & other accessories, so will give that a try 'on the road' - not sure that I need Ubuntu any longer? But if someone out their can help to salvage this old IBM w/o further investment, I'm still willing to give it a try - been quite happy in this alternate OS universe! Thanks all - Dave :)
If it's fine on the command line but won't load the gui it sounds like it's loading the wrong video driver or resolution. X doesn't use a configuration file (xorg.conf) anymore does it? Which is a shame, because I used to manually fix that file when it didn't work right. Anyway you might want to try reconfiguring X.
Did you do a reinstall or did you use apt-get to upgrade? If your external drive doesn't work look for a usb version of Ubuntu or any modern linux distro.
Re: Upgrading to Ubuntu 10.04LTS!
Hi David - I left posts in 3 different forums, including here w/ varied responses - seems like Ubuntu (esp. this latest LTS) has been a PITA for many - just numerous complaints and problems; I spent a number of hours today just trying to get my external CD to boot into a live CD of this distro w/o luck! I was ready to just trash the computer - it's old and I really don't need it but playing w/ Linux is fun - :(
Well, on a thread that I left on the Cybertechhelp Forum, a responder had the same issues - just became frustrated w/ Ubuntu and went to another Linux option, i.e. PCLinuxOS (http://www.pclinuxos.com/) - seemed quite 'happy' w/ the distro, so I downloaded the Gnome version w/ an installer - damn thing booted up into a live CD, I was able to get on the web via Wi-Fi, and the GUI look familiar, so went for the installation - so NO MORE Ubuntu for me @ the moment - will need to explore over the next few days.
My first major issue is that I could not get the install to use my entire HD (18 GB) - picked only half that amount, so will have to figure out what the rest of that space is being used for? But there is a forum on that website which I'll give a try. Dave :D
Quote from: Josquin des Prez on October 26, 2009, 08:03:02 PM
Pah, Linux is for losers, real men use BSD. ;D
lol I wonder who even uses that... and what advantage it would actually have?
Quote from: Josquin des Prez on October 26, 2009, 08:03:02 PM
As it were, i'm forced to keep a dual boot installation.
I have that, too (Vista + Ubuntu), but I can't figure out how to get Ubuntu online. It would be fun to learn shell scripting, plus, it's useful for stuff like LAMP (Linux + Apache Server + MySql + PHP).
Awesome Dave, that is a pretty cool but not well known distro. I think that the easiest to use (works with proprietary drivers for wifi, graphics etc, has flash etc) is still Mandriva (http://www.mandriva.com/en/), but PCLOS is still darned good. That would be funny if you ended with up something hard like gentoo, arch, or slackware. ;D ;D ;D
Quote from: Greg on May 28, 2011, 04:33:43 PM
lol I wonder who even uses that... and what advantage it would actually have?
Security, stability and support for many more architectures other than OS.
OpenBSD is the most secure OS out there. NetBSD can be installed on almost anything and their motto is "of course it runs on NetBSD" and FreeBSD for the slightly more user friendly OS.
Also BSD doesn't operate under the GNU license, helpful for people who don't want to share their code but still build off of bsd. ;D
Quote from: SonicMan46 on May 28, 2011, 04:23:31 PM
My first major issue is that I could not get the install to use my entire HD (18 GB) - picked only half that amount, so will have to figure out what the rest of that space is being used for? But there is a forum on that website which I'll give a try. Dave :D
Dave did you custom partition or did you just let the installer do all of the work?
Quote from: mozartfan on May 28, 2011, 04:34:26 PM
Awesome Dave, that is a pretty cool but not well known distro. I think that the easiest to use (works with proprietary drivers for wifi, graphics etc, has flash etc) is still Mandriva (http://www.mandriva.com/en/), but PCLOS is still darned good. That would be funny if you ended with up something hard like gentoo, arch, or slackware. ;D ;D ;D
Well, I hope not - :D This Linux OS is just a hobby for me to explore - Susan is pretty much fixed on MS applications; our next DT will be Windows 7 (unless 8 comes out soon) w/ Office - don't think that she wants to change. Now, I have this Apple iPad2 (son an IT guy w/ all of these MS initials after his name, bought 2 iPads and talked her into getting one!) - well, we're having some fun w/ it - my main reason to have a Linux lappie was to take on trips when hooked up to these unprotected hotel Wi-Fi networks; well if we can be happy w/ an iPad (Wi-Fi) w/ the bluetooth keyboard, then well do I now need Linux? Dave :D
I mostly use Windows 7 too, Dave this is what I do and you might consider it... run Linux virtually. So no booting into the distro, you just fire up a program (vmware) and load linux and you have a virtual desktop that runs like you had a computer inside a computer. And anything saved on your virtual workstation is in this funny file, and nothing gets out into windows. So basically you have what you need without having two operating systems or two computers. :)
Quote from: mozartfan on May 28, 2011, 04:38:42 PM
Security, stability and support for many more architectures other than OS.
OpenBSD is the most secure OS out there. NetBSD can be installed on almost anything and their motto is "of course it runs on NetBSD" and FreeBSD for the slightly more user friendly OS.
Also BSD doesn't operate under the GNU license, helpful for people who don't want to share their code but still build off of bsd. ;D
In other words... the government uses this? ;)
I can see why they would if it's the most secure OS. For a normal user on a home computer, just be safe. I have had Vista on my laptop for probably 2 years now, without any viruses. Or if you don't think you can do that, just use some form of Linux.
Yeah governments do use it, as well as universities and private companies. A common practice is to use OpenBSD to run firewalls. It's also common to use FreeBSD to run servers since it's insanely stable.
http://www.openbsd.org/users.html (http://www.openbsd.org/users.html)
8)
Ah... well... time to write a bunch of BSD viruses, then.
>:D ;)
Quote from: Greg on May 28, 2011, 05:32:13 PM
Ah... well... time to write a bunch of BSD viruses, then.
>:D ;)
:D I dare you to just install one of them! ;D
http://xkcd.com/349/ (http://xkcd.com/349/) (and it really is a pain in the butt)
Quote from: mozartfan on May 28, 2011, 05:37:48 PM
:D I dare you to just install one of them! ;D
http://xkcd.com/349/ (http://xkcd.com/349/) (and it really is a pain in the butt)
lol
I wonder if Dave felt that way today? ;D
Happy 20th!
Quote
From: torvalds@klaava.Helsinki.FI (Linus Benedict Torvalds)
Newsgroups: comp.os.minix
Subject: What would you like to see most in minix?
Summary: small poll for my new operating system
Message-ID: <1991Aug25.205708.9541@klaava.Helsinki.FI>
Date: 25 Aug 91 20:57:08 GMT
Organization: University of Helsinki
Hello everybody out there using minix -
I'm doing a (free) operating system (just a hobby, won't be big and
professional like gnu) for 386(486) AT clones. This has been brewing
since april, and is starting to get ready. I'd like any feedback on
things people like/dislike in minix, as my OS resembles it somewhat
(same physical layout of the file-system (due to practical reasons)
among other things).
I've currently ported bash(1.08) and gcc(1.40), and things seem to work.
This implies that I'll get something practical within a few months, and
I'd like to know what features most people would want. Any suggestions
are welcome, but I won't promise I'll implement them :-)
Linus (torvalds@kruuna.helsinki.fi)
PS. Yes – it's free of any minix code, and it has a multi-threaded fs.
It is NOT protable (uses 386 task switching etc), and it probably never
will support anything other than AT-harddisks, as that's all I have :-(.
Holy cow! Already 20 years!! :) How far linux has come. I was just thinking the other day of installing linux on a spare pc... and found that Ubuntu has completely changed with their unity interface, most of the Mandriva devs have left to be replaced with cheaper labor in Brazil, and one of my favs Arch is so popular that it is in the top 10 on distrowatch now.
I think I will install archlinux on that old pc. :)
For the more casual pc users out here, this explains the coolness of linux pretty well:
http://www.youtube.com/v/5ocq6_3-nEw
Hi Guys - thanks for the reminder about 20 yrs! :o
David - nice video about Linux - must admit since getting Susan & I the e-readers (iPad2 & Color Nook) in the spring that I've not even booted my Linux laptop for a long time! But just turn it on and am downloading over 700 upgrade package files! Hope the thing still works after these changes are made - still using the PCLinuxOS.
Neither have I kept up w/ the other update and/or new Linux distros - am curious - any good 1-stop websites that bring together the new developments in Linux and its distros over the last year or so? I could probably use a simpler distro but still would like a nice GUI - just don't need all of the redundancy I guess. Dave :D
Quote from: SonicMan46 on August 26, 2011, 10:38:52 AM
Neither have I kept up w/ the other update and/or new Linux distros - am curious - any good 1-stop websites that bring together the new developments in Linux and its distros over the last year or so? I could probably use a simpler distro but still would like a nice GUI - just don't need all of the redundancy I guess. Dave :D
Hi, Dave. Try Distrowatch.com. (Link is on the first page.) It usually contains information on all distros, big and small, and updates you on the release of alpahs, betas and final containing excepts from the release announcements with links to reviews, if any. They also have a useful weekly newsletter with updates, interviews and usually a review of some distro. If you want that along with some opinions there are just too many sites on the web. :)
Navneeth have you used the new Ubuntu? What do you think of there new fangled unity?
Quote from: DavidW on August 26, 2011, 11:08:40 AM
Navneeth have you used the new Ubuntu? What do you think of there new fangled unity?
Nope. This is the first time in 5 years that I haven't updated to the bleeding edge. I did/do have plans to switch to some other distro. That's why I tried Fedora 15 (live CD) and was repulsed by GNOME 3. The fact that one has to install an application to change themes wasn't the worst thing about it!
Quote from: Opus106 on August 26, 2011, 11:16:26 AM
Nope. This is the first time in 5 years that I haven't updated to the bleeding edge. I did/do have plans to switch to some other distro. That's why I tried Fedora 15 (live CD) and was repulsed by GNOME 3. The fact that one has to install an application to change themes wasn't the worst thing about it!
I always thought that gnome was a bit too dumbed down but that is ridiculous!! Apparently this unity thing is even more restrictive. Well I like kde and I like the light weight desktops... hopefully those are still cool.
Quote from: DavidW on August 26, 2011, 12:58:13 PM
I always thought that gnome was a bit too dumbed down but that is ridiculous!! Apparently this unity thing is even more restrictive. Well I like kde and I like the light weight desktops... hopefully those are still cool.
The worst thing about Unity is that in trying to be clever they've made it unintuitive and difficult to use. Two cases in point are trying to do menus like a Mac (and not well), and making scrollbars appear and disappear. If you're Apple you can get away with the menu thing because that's the way you've done it since the early 80s and people like your hardware. The scrollbar thing is just stupid nerd cool factor getting in the way of common sense. I went back to "classic Gnome" and turned of the scrollbar thing as soon as I could, so I didn't see any other things that might have been stupid.
Quote from: Opus106 on August 26, 2011, 10:57:57 AM
Hi, Dave. Try Distrowatch.com. (Link is on the first page.) It usually contains information on all distros, big and small, and updates you on the release of alpahs, betas and final containing excepts from the release announcements with links to reviews, if any. They also have a useful weekly newsletter with updates, interviews and usually a review of some distro. If you want that along with some opinions there are just too many sites on the web. :)
Hi
Navneeth - thanks for that link; just the way to START for me! :D
I updated my
PCLinuxOS and after a reboot seems to be working fine - still seems to require resources beyond the limitations of my old IBM lappie, i.e. often just slow - there are SO many distros available (I guess the reflection of an 'open' OS) - will take a good look at that site. Thanks for the link and advice - Dave :)
Dave you probably want distros meant for older hardware. It's been awhile since I've used Puppy Linux, but I remember it even breathing new life into a PC that used to run windows 97. It couldn't boot windows but it could run puppy just live from cd faster than it ever ran windows! It's meant to be lean, fast, small but doesn't do much besides internet browser, email and office. Maybe not enough for you? You can use it as a live cd or usb without having to install anything and it should be real fast.
http://puppylinux.org/main/Overview%20and%20Getting%20Started.htm (http://puppylinux.org/main/Overview%20and%20Getting%20Started.htm)
:)
Anyone an expert at working the Linux shell? How long would it take me to become proficient?
Quote from: Greg on August 26, 2011, 06:58:08 PM
Anyone an expert at working the Linux shell? How long would it take me to become proficient?
Well I'm still learning new things after 15 years or so of using the Bash shell, but I hate reading manuals. My unix experience goes back 25 years, but I can't remember what shell I started with. It's not just the shell, but all the unix commands: find, grep, sed, awk, etc. I'd say give yourself several months of daily usage to become proficient.
(Even though I'm on a Mac most of the time, I always have a terminal window open with several tabs running bash.)
Quote from: Daverz on August 26, 2011, 07:26:26 PM
Well I'm still learning new things after 15 years or so of using the Bash shell, but I hate reading manuals. My unix experience goes back 25 years, but I can't remember what shell I started with. It's not just the shell, but all the unix commands: find, grep, sed, awk, etc. I'd say give yourself several months of daily usage to become proficient.
(Even though I'm on a Mac most of the time, I always have a terminal window open with several tabs running bash.)
Hmmm... thanks. Sounds more difficult than what I was hoping. I get the impression that it blows away the MS command prompt, which isn't that hard to use.
Learning Bash isn't all that difficult, Greg. Yes, it has MANY commands, but unless you were forced to remember the syntax for every one of them by heart, you can do just fine. Virtually every command is just a 'man page' (online documentation) away. As Dave (the one with the Z) says, using it frequently will make it second nature... unlike programming languages, you are not restricted to use it for specified tasks, but are free to use it for mundane, day-to-day tasks as well. (Not that high-level languages can't be used for mundane, day-to-day tasks, but there is a reason why no one in his right mind would do so. ;D) Sometimes I feel it's just faster the run a command than to use the GUI.
For an easy start, I'd recommend this place: http://linuxcommand.org/. After that you can have a look at the Beginner's and Advanced BASH scripting guides from TLDP (again, link is on the first page). Oh, and if you do learn BASH, be wary of 'rm -rf'. ;)
Quote from: Opus106 on August 27, 2011, 12:48:19 AM
Oh, and if you do learn BASH, be wary of 'rm -rf'. ;)
I think I would modify this to simply not use wildcard until you're ready. A move command can be just as deadly! :D
I think that you can pick up the basics of bash in an afternoon. In fact that was the very first thing we had to do back when I took C programming. The advanced stuff follows later with experience, but the simple stuff is not difficult at all.
Quote from: Opus106 on August 27, 2011, 12:48:19 AM
Learning Bash isn't all that difficult, Greg. Yes, it has MANY commands, but unless you were forced to remember the syntax for every one of them by heart, you can do just fine. Virtually every command is just a 'man page' (online documentation) away. As Dave (the one with the Z) says, using it frequently will make it second nature... unlike programming languages, you are not restricted to use it for specified tasks, but are free to use it for mundane, day-to-day tasks as well. (Not that high-level languages can't be used for mundane, day-to-day tasks, but there is a reason why no one in his right mind would do so. ;D) Sometimes I feel it's just faster the run a command than to use the GUI.
For an easy start, I'd recommend this place: http://linuxcommand.org/. After that you can have a look at the Beginner's and Advanced BASH scripting guides from TLDP (again, link is on the first page). Oh, and if you do learn BASH, be wary of 'rm -rf'. ;)
Sweet- thanks for the link! :)
Navneeth - thanks for the additional link on the Linux command site; also, thanks for that great link on Distrowatch - looks like a great place to keep tract of the latest news on MANY different distros.
Greg - I purchased a few books (small ones!) on BASH when I first installed Ubuntu - indeed there are MANY commands and switches (along w/ long manuals) - not hard to get a couple of dozen basic commands down but for an in-depth knowledge (easy to make silly mistakes just w/ the wrong switch), much more study and constant usage would be needed for me (esp. at my age - use to be better at this stuff 30 yrs ago!).
DavidW - well, I got my old IBM updated w/ PCLinuxOS (I needed different repositories selected in the preferences area of the update manager) and after a re-boot, seems to be working, but I'll certainly go to something simpler if I decide to make a switch. Dave :)
Cool beans, glad to know that pclos is still working for you Dave! :) I was afraid that you thought it too slow now.
Quote from: Greg on August 27, 2011, 05:25:59 AM
Sweet- thanks for the link! :)
Quote from: SonicMan46 on August 27, 2011, 05:43:30 AM
Navneeth - thanks for the additional link on the Linux command site; also, thanks for that great link on Distrowatch - looks like a great place to keep tract of the latest news on MANY different distros.
Pleasure's all mine, guys.
Linux.com has some very good, bite-sized
tutorials (http://www.linux.com/learn/tutorials) suited for beginners. Especially look for the ones by Joe 'zonker' Brockmeier.
I am using Ubuntu at the moment...I tried it a few years back (probably posted earlier in this thread...) but couldn't get used to it...now I am checking it again, this time in its later incarnation. Only thing is, the damn desktop seems to be hiding icons on the left and a bar or something at the top. I can only access these things by hovering at the top and sides, changing resolution only brings them partially into view. Harrumph! Still...I will work on it...
Quote from: John of Clydebank on September 23, 2011, 08:21:58 AM
I am using Ubuntu at the moment...I tried it a few years back (probably posted earlier in this thread...) but couldn't get used to it...now I am checking it again, this time in its later incarnation. Only thing is, the damn desktop seems to be hiding icons on the left and a bar or something at the top. I can only access these things by hovering at the top and sides, changing resolution only brings them partially into view. Harrumph! Still...I will work on it...
Welcome to the New Age of Unfamiliar Desktops, John. ;D I suppose you're using the current stable release (Natty Narwhal/11.04). The next version, Oneiric Ocelot - 11.10, is supposed to feature a smoother version of the Unity interface (that's the name of the fancy new UI), and its second beta was released today. Final release is next month.
Regarding the hiding icons, I use an application called Docky (https://launchpad.net/docky), which is similar, at least in appearance and gimmicks, to the Mac dock. I have opted for it to hide whenever a window is open, and is visible only when there are no active windows. That gives me a lot more space to work with applications.
Quote from: Opus106 on September 23, 2011, 08:29:00 AM
Welcome to the New Age of Unfamiliar Desktops, John. ;D I suppose you're using the current stable release (Natty Narwhal/11.04). The next version, Oneiric Ocelot - 11.10, is supposed to feature a smoother version of the Unity interface (that's the name of the fancy new UI), and its second beta was released today. Final release is next month.
Regarding the hiding icons, I use an application called Docky (https://launchpad.net/docky), which is similar, at least in appearance and gimmicks, to the Mac dock. I have opted for it to hide whenever a window is open, and is visible only when there are no active windows. That gives me a lot more space to work with applications.
Thank you Navneeth. Ubuntu updated my graphics driver (proprietry) and everything is good and vsible now. Ubuntu has come I long way from where it was in 2008, when I tried it last! Installing stuff is much easier...the apps are endless...the interface is outstanding....download speeds have increased by ...er... an awful lot.... security does not require third party applications..., so the hell with my Avast Internet Security subscription next month...I no longer play games so gaming is not an issue and don't know if it would be anyway... Celtx (software for writers) is MADE for it... I like it very much NOW. Unfortunately, I have installed it alongside windows, but as I can do everything I want with it now, I WILL format my drive and install Ubuntu only...Astronomy software galore.... no need to fanny around with all manner of third party dependencies....it is CLEAN and, I think (correct me if I am wrong), self 'cleaning' ... 6 monthly cycle of new versions, which it presumably prompts when available, and does not mess with things when it updates...WHAT MORE CAN I ASK FOR? Great stuff. Free from Licenses, agreements, subscriptions...and it LOOKS AND FEELS much better than the Microsoft monopoly. I am now DEDICATED to this stuff.
Thanks Navneeth.
Good times, John! :) If you are dedicated, then have a look at OMG! Ubuntu!: a very up-to-date, and arguably the most popular, blog on the distro. Oh, and also Full Circle (http://fullcirclemagazine.org/), on online Magazine with articles, tips and tricks and stuff on the *buntu line.
Well, "Desktop Linux" is going places now (where people other than geeks may notice! ;)). There has been talk of Ubuntu phones, tablets and TVs for many months now, but Canonical, the company behind Ubuntu, has just demostrated a prototype of Ubuntu TV at the Consumer Electronics Show in Las Vegas.
http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2012/01/ubuntu-tv-unveiled-at-ces
Quote from: John of Clydebank on September 23, 2011, 10:06:26 AM
Free from Licenses, agreements, subscriptions...
Free from the quality, professionalism and INNOVATION commercial products bring to the table as well. But we are not supposed to mention that.
BSD is the way of the future, Linux can never progress further due to the limitations of the stupid GNU licence.
Quote from: Opus106 on September 23, 2011, 08:29:00 AM
Welcome to the New Age of Unfamiliar Desktops, John. ;D
Or rather, welcome to the age of retarded desktops. Of course, considering that Unity is merely a propped up Gnome 3, the fault isn't entirely due to Canonical, even though they took this retarded idea of having one single interface for TVs, tablets and desktops (what could possibly go wrong, right?) by heart. Even Linus Torvalds reputed the abomination that is the Gnome 3/Unity shell.
With Gnome 3 being the idiotic piece of crap it is and with KDE suffering from an acute case of Windows envy (which has resulted in an extremely pretty but heavy and buggy as hell interface), all we are left with in the realm of sensible desktop interfaces are Xfce and Lxde.
Quote from: Josquin des Prez on January 09, 2012, 01:39:06 AM
Free from the quality, professionalism and INNOVATION commercial products bring to the table as well. But we are not supposed to mention that.
Ooh, letters in caps!
By letting you have the source, you're opening up the application to anyone (or a group) to innovate. For all their "professionalism", when was the last time MS made something innovative on the desktop? (Don't tell me they made the taskbar glossier. ::)) BTW, Android runs on top of Linux as does the Chromebook.
Quote
BSD is the way of the future, Linux can never progress further due to the limitations of the stupid GNU licence.
::) We will await you here in the present as soon as the Time Machine is invented (and capable of contacting the past), the first model of which, I'm sure, will be running Linux somewhere inside. ;D
Quote from: Josquin des Prez on January 09, 2012, 01:49:13 AM
Or rather, welcome to the age of retarded desktops. Of course, considering that Unity is merely a propped up Gnome 3, the fault isn't entirely due to Canonical, even though they took this retarded idea of having one single interface for TVs, tablets and desktops (what could possibly go wrong, right?) by heart. Even Linus Torvalds reputed the abomination that is the Gnome 3/Unity shell.
With Gnome 3 being the idiotic piece of crap it is and with KDE suffering from an acute case of Windows envy (which has resulted in an extremely pretty but heavy and buggy as hell interface), all we are left with in the realm of sensible desktop interfaces are Xfce and Lxde.
I'll give you that. But in comparison, I prefer, after running them on live CDs, Unity to Gnome 3. The latter is simply bad in so many respects. Linux Mint's customised transitional UI got a lot of press in the last two months, but I haven't tried it yet.
Quote from: Opus106 on January 09, 2012, 01:56:19 AM
Ooh, letters in caps!
By letting you have the source, you're opening up the application to anyone (or a group) to innovate.
Innovation doesn't come from unorganized groups, it doesn't come from the collective effort of some anonymous conglomerate of lowest common denominators. Its comes from the exceptional, the single individual who is at once better endowed then most and also has a greater commitment to his field of interest. It also comes from specialized teams, or is at least realized by such, and which are generally led by individuals of special talent in the first place. An hobbyist environment can never favor the exceptional, it can only favor mediocrity.
For the record, the problem with the GNU licence is not that the code is open source. There is nothing precluding innovation in an open source environment in and of itself. The problem is that the GNU licence discriminates against every other model, which is pointlessly limiting. Any company that wants to produce commercial or proprietary software contrary to the principles of the GNU licence is essentially precluded from developing on the Linux platform. That, to me, is a needless restriction.
Quote from: Opus106 on January 09, 2012, 01:56:19 AM
For all their "professionalism", when was the last time MS made something innovative on the desktop? (Don't tell me they made the taskbar glossier. ::))
Innovations in what sense? Microsoft specializes in producing a commercial operating system which aims at being easy to use and "open" to a large variety of software and hardware products. In that, i think they have little competition, or at least did until very recently. But that's besides the point because we are not talking about Microsoft per-se, but innovation in the world of open source versus innovation in the world of commercial software, which includes every single commercial company in existence, not just Microsoft. The irony here is that while proprietary or closed commercial applications cannot be easily developed or ported on the Linux platform, the other way around is generally not a problem. That is, Microsoft does not discriminate on which type of software you want to run on their operating system, thus, many free or open source applications are available on both platforms. So not only is Windows open to most commercial applications, which are generally superior to their open source counterpart, but its also open to open source applications as well, making the argument moot. The truth is that from the perspective of a software developer, Windows is actually a more open and accommodating platform then Linux. The irony is, as they say, delicious.
Quote from: Opus106 on January 09, 2012, 01:56:19 AM
BTW, Android runs on top of Linux as does the Chromebook.
::) We will await you here in the present as soon as the Time Machine is invented (and capable of contacting the past), the first model of which, I'm sure, will be running Linux somewhere inside. ;D
Like i said, i think as time goes by BSD is going to supplant Linux in the realm of open source operating system. Not only is the BSD licence less restrictive then that of Linux, but the kernel is actually less of a mess.
Quote from: Opus106 on January 09, 2012, 02:03:00 AM
I'll give you that. But in comparison, I prefer, after running them on live CDs, Unity to Gnome 3. The latter is simply bad in so many respects. Linux Mint's customised transitional UI got a lot of press in the last two months, but I haven't tried it yet.
Well, considering i still run XP on my desktop (dual booted with openSUSE running Xfce) and i use Crunchbang for my laptop, you can tell i'm a bit asinine when to comes to computer interfaces. If i have to fight for more then two seconds against the interface i go into instant rage mode.
Mint offers an interesting compromise. All they did was integrate the old mint menu in the lower Gnome 3 bar. Its functional, but if you are using the mint menu bar you won't be using the top Gnome 3 shell, or vice versa, making each sort of redundant to the other. I was also a bit disappointed with the mate rollback, which, similarly to the Gnome 2x rollback found in the latest Ubuntu release, is more or less similar to the old interface, but not quite
completely so. Its also buggy.
On a more positive light, i was very much impressed with both Xubuntu and Lubuntu, both of which are light and functional without being necessarily uneasy on the eye. Mint Debian running Xfce is also pretty good, but the rolling release update method makes me a bit nervous.
I like the Linux Mint Distribution pretty much, because it's user friendlyness. But anyway, I don't need Linux as an OS, only inside a VM for some testing purposes. Too much of my prefered software runs on windows. Additionally, music production is completely on Windows or MacOS, but not Linux. Also, games. The Linux desktops fonts never convinced me. Not sure if this is an issue on high resolution screens though. Oh I can tell you, it's pure bliss having a 15" notebook screen at 1920x1200, the fonts are very sharp, you almost don't need edge smoothing stuff like cleartype, which is rather for crappy screens with low resolutions.
You can install Windows fonts rather easily:
http://community.linuxmint.com/tutorial/view/29
In other news, FreeBSD 9.0 is finally out:
http://www.freebsd.org/releases/9.0R/announce.html
This is actually big news in the world of open source operating systems. PC-BSD 9.0 should follow shortly as well, if anyone wants to try it.
Haha, links for PC-BSD 9.0 RELEASE available at distrowatch:
http://distrowatch.com/
Quote from: Josquin des Prez on January 13, 2012, 08:01:22 AM
Haha, links for PC-BSD 9.0 RELEASE available at distrowatch:
What's "haha" about that?
Haha meaning:
1) Its finally here
2) Links are still not available on the mainsite (though they probably will within the next few hours)
Nevermind, they updated the mainsite as well.
EA Games Arrive in Ubuntu Software Centre (http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2012/05/ea-games-arrive-in-the-ubuntu-software-center)
I'm not a gamer, but still it is nice to see a company like EA take at least a little interest in the Linux world. The latest offerings don't quite hold up to the expectations that were built up during the last week or so, ever since news of the company's participation in the Ubuntu Developer Summit was made public; yet, as had been made clear in the blog post, it is a start. One of the reasons why some people still maintain a dual-boot with 'Doze, is gaming. Perhaps, with enough support, if even one or two popular games are ported to the Linux environment, we could probably expect a slightly greater adoption of Linux-based OSs.
I hate Ubuntu just for unity. And gnome 3 shipping with Fedora and Mint is just as bad. I recently revisited linux and found that Debian was the only major distro with a decent usable default desktop. I wonder if the next release will embrace the steaming pile of gnome 3 or switch to xfce.
Quote from: DavidW on May 09, 2012, 03:57:28 AM
I hate Ubuntu just for unity. And gnome 3 shipping with Fedora and Mint is just as bad. I recently revisited linux and found that Debian was the only major distro with a decent usable default desktop. I wonder if the next release will embrace the steaming pile of gnome 3 or switch to xfce.
Yeah, the situation on the desktop is just bad when it comes to most of the major Gnome-based distros. But I'm considering to 'up'grade to 12.04 just for HUD... I probably don't need to bother with the Unity bar, if I could control things from the keyboard, which is something I prefer in any case. Have you tried Mint's own implementation of Gnome 2-ish features built over Shell?
Quote from: Opus106 on May 09, 2012, 05:50:49 AM
Have you tried Mint's own implementation of Gnome 2-ish features built over Shell?
Yeah but it still didn't do it for me. We're building up to a serious dilemma, gnome is becoming too simplistic, xfce was never fully functional, and kde went down the style over substance route awhile ago.
Alot of the issues with unity and to a lesser extent new gnome (3.x) is that they are trying to develop a good ui for tablets and phones, and then subjecting desktop users to it. An interface for a tablet doesn't work for a desktop and vica versa. They should have just split the teams instead of taking a page from Windows 8.
I think I should just get a Mac and forget about all of this crap. :-\
Quote from: DavidW on May 09, 2012, 06:05:55 AM
Alot of the issues with unity and to a lesser extent new gnome (3.x) is that they are trying to develop a good ui for tablets and phones, and then subjecting desktop users to it. An interface for a tablet doesn't work for a desktop and vica versa. They should have just split the teams instead of taking a page from Windows 8.
Windows 8 was rather late into the game. Unity was developed and has been out in the wild, so to speak, a few releases ago, initially aimed at net-books long before Metro was made public. I haven't been following MS's development closely, but I'm curious about whether they're going to offer the same boxes of apps strewn across the screen to business users as well.
Quote
I think I should just get a Mac and forget about all of this crap. :-\
Zen within the walled garden, eh? 0:) ;D
So it looks like you have to be a near expert to even get Ubuntu online in the first place, but to become an expert on Linux you have to have internet with Linux.
I need to learn Linux...
Quote from: DavidW on May 09, 2012, 07:05:55 AM (http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php?topic=4630.msg627674#msg627674)
Alot of the issues with unity and to a lesser extent new gnome (3.x) is that they are trying to develop a good ui for tablets and phones, and then subjecting desktop users to it. An interface for a tablet doesn't work for a desktop and vica versa. They should have just split the teams instead of taking a page from Windows 8.
I recommend Cinnamon to everyone who finds Unity obnoxious like I do.
Quote from: Greg on August 14, 2012, 09:25:25 AM
So it looks like you have to be a near expert to even get Ubuntu online in the first place, but to become an expert on Linux you have to have internet with Linux.
I need to learn Linux...
Premise wrong. Conclusion wrong.
Thumb-up for seemingly unrelated statement. ;D
Not sure what you're talking about... my router is unsupported by Linux, so I would have to install a driver, which involves extremely long tutorials that say it's difficult. Every step of the way when I tried it, there was an error I couldn't understand or look up properly because I don't know Linux, and I can't look it up anyways, because Linux can't go online.
So I'd have to buy a supported router, which I can't see happening because my mom needs the internet for work- unless there is a way around that, like having 2 routers.
Quote from: Greg on August 16, 2012, 04:47:32 AM
Not sure what you're talking about... my router is unsupported by Linux, so I would have to install a driver, which involves extremely long tutorials that say it's difficult. Every step of the way when I tried it, there was an error I couldn't understand or look up properly because I don't know Linux, and I can't look it up anyways, because Linux can't go online.
I installed Ubuntu first, having known nothing previously, and then started learning about what things were. That's a counter-argument to your statement that one needs to be an expert just to get things up and running. Not always at least. It's just that some are unfortunately stuck with proprietary hardware. (That's not to say I didn't have problems initially; but I now look back upon that time with a tinge of nostalgia -- things have been working all too well since then. :D) If you still have a Windows box running and connected to the Web, I'd suggest you ask for help at the Ubuntu Forums or at the IRC (#ubuntu-beginners and #ubuntu) about the things which you don't understand. I'm willing to help if it's not too hardware-specific and is, of course, within my grasp. :) Or perhaps one of the other members who visit this thread might be able to, even if it is very specific.
(As an aside: since you have Ubuntu, you could have tested the Live CD first to check if things worked with your hardware.)
Quote from: Opus106 on August 16, 2012, 06:39:34 AM
I installed Ubuntu first, having known nothing previously, and then started learning about what things were. That's a counter-argument to your statement that one needs to be an expert just to get things up and running. Not always at least. It's just that some are unfortunately stuck with proprietary hardware. (That's not to say I didn't have problems initially; but I now look back upon that time with a tinge of nostalgia -- things have been working all too well since then. :D) If you still have a Windows box running and connected to the Web, I'd suggest you ask for help at the Ubuntu Forums or at the IRC (#ubuntu-beginners and #ubuntu) about the things which you don't understand. I'm willing to help if it's not too hardware-specific and is, of course, within my grasp. :) Or perhaps one of the other members who visit this thread might be able to, even if it is very specific.
(As an aside: since you have Ubuntu, you could have tested the Live CD first to check if things worked with your hardware.)
I have a dual-boot, and the only other computer in the house is my mom's, which she is often using for work, and my brother will be sharing it when he starts school Monday (and I start school Monday, too). It's not like I didn't try- I wasted an entire morning working on this and wanting to smash in the monitors because I didn't know anything.
These are all good suggestions... if I had easy internet access side by side with it. The only thing possible is to either 1) buy another computer and work on installing the driver or 2) get an Ubuntu-compatible router. 1) I'll have to do anyways when I start experimenting with writing Linux server programs, so that part is inevitable, eventually. But yeah, if I don't get a router and decide to install the driver, I will indeed need and appreciate the help.
Is this the router that everyone uses for a dual-boot Windows/Ubuntu?
Linksys WRT54GL Wireless Broadband Router
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16833124190
$50, 5 star average with 3,725 reviews, and it is "Linux-based"... so I assume that if I just used this router instead, I'll just be able to connect to the internet easily on Ubuntu?
As far as I can know, what router you have shouldn't matter, since all OS-es support the same standards. I've never heard of a computer being incompatible with the router.
On the other hand, the computer might be incompatible with the wireless card on that machine. This is a driver issue, which could be a problem. Anyway to tell what wireless card you have installed?
Quote from: Greg on August 14, 2012, 09:25:25 AM
So it looks like you have to be a near expert to even get Ubuntu online in the first place, but to become an expert on Linux you have to have internet with Linux.
I need to learn Linux...
If your wifi card requires a proprietary driver, then yes! Else no. Ubuntu, actually does NOT have the best hardware support. I find that Open Suse does (Mandriva One also does, don't know if it is still around).
Quote from: Daverz on August 14, 2012, 10:05:50 PM
Quote from: DavidW on May 09, 2012, 07:05:55 AM (http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php?topic=4630.msg627674#msg627674)
Alot of the issues with unity and to a lesser extent new gnome (3.x) is that they are trying to develop a good ui for tablets and phones, and then subjecting desktop users to it. An interface for a tablet doesn't work for a desktop and vica versa. They should have just split the teams instead of taking a page from Windows 8.
I recommend Cinnamon to everyone who finds Unity obnoxious like I do.
Thanks!
I'm tired of Windows, but I think I'm going to ditch Windows for a Mac, at least at home.
Quote from: liuzerus87 on September 19, 2012, 01:25:00 PM
As far as I can know, what router you have shouldn't matter, since all OS-es support the same standards. I've never heard of a computer being incompatible with the router.
On the other hand, the computer might be incompatible with the wireless card on that machine. This is a driver issue, which could be a problem. Anyway to tell what wireless card you have installed?
Wireless card: Dell Wireless 1397 WLAN Mini-Card
Router: D-Link
It's a dual boot (Vista/Ubuntu) and I go online using Vista. Internet with Ubuntu does not work. Installing a driver is a solution, but I tried it and it is not doable (to put it plainly).
Quote from: DavidW on September 19, 2012, 03:46:07 PM
If your wifi card requires a proprietary driver, then yes! Else no. Ubuntu, actually does NOT have the best hardware support. I find that Open Suse does (Mandriva One also does, don't know if it is still around).
So the problem is my wifi card instead of my router?
Quote from: Greg on September 19, 2012, 08:08:28 PM
Wireless card: Dell Wireless 1397 WLAN Mini-Card
Router: D-Link
A quick Google search shows that your wireless card is actually a Broadcom card, and that Broadcom has not released an open source driver for this card, so Ubuntu is not allowed to install it by default. Therefore, you're missing the card.
If you can get an Internet connection, though, it should be pretty easy to fix; for example, see http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1352270 (http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1352270). Do you happen to have a spare ethernet cord that you could use to temporarily connect the machine to the internet? If not, if you have the Ubuntu cd lying around, there's also a link in that thread for installing the driver from cd.
Quote from: liuzerus87 on September 19, 2012, 08:22:40 PM
A quick Google search shows that your wireless card is actually a Broadcom card, and that Broadcom has not released an open source driver for this card, so Ubuntu is not allowed to install it by default. Therefore, you're missing the card.
If you can get an Internet connection, though, it should be pretty easy to fix; for example, see http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1352270 (http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1352270). Do you happen to have a spare ethernet cord that you could use to temporarily connect the machine to the internet? If not, if you have the Ubuntu cd lying around, there's also a link in that thread for installing the driver from cd.
Thanks, this looks very helpful.
I'll try it and let you know how it goes. 8)
Quote from: Greg on September 20, 2012, 04:51:09 AM
Thanks, this looks very helpful.
I'll try it and let you know how it goes. 8)
Forgot how this even went... :-X
well... I have ArchLinux almost installed on my flash drive. Someone put it on there (I think he basically made some partitions), but it was getting late, so I have to look up some instructions on how to finish the process. He said getting wireless to work is a bit tricky. :P
ArchLinux looks really cool, though...
Quote from: Greg on November 01, 2012, 07:06:33 PM
Forgot how this even went... :-X
well... I have ArchLinux almost installed on my flash drive. Someone put it on there (I think he basically made some partitions), but it was getting late, so I have to look up some instructions on how to finish the process. He said getting wireless to work is a bit tricky. :P
ArchLinux looks really cool, though...
You'll probably learn your way around a Linux-based OS better by using Arch, Debian or Slackware. They are not as dumbed down as Ubuntu, say. ;)
In other news: I recently moved to 12.04. :-[
Greg,
Arch has a very steep learning curve. They assume that you are already familiar with how linux works, and their documentation is not that great. Try Debian instead. Debian is very stable (which arch is not), flexible and has a great community with fantastic documentation (again which arch does not).
By having someone install Arch for you, you've already failed the crucial step to know if it's for you-- can you install it yourself? If you can with ease, it's for you. If it gives you a headache then you're not ready. Try to install it yourself.
Quote from: Opus106 on November 01, 2012, 10:13:21 PM
You'll probably learn your way around a Linux-based OS better by using Arch, Debian or Slackware. They are not as dumbed down as Ubuntu, say. ;)
Ubuntu has conveniences, it's not "dumbed down". One can always just open a terminal window to access the command line.
What I don't like is the default user interface they push. But it's easy enough to install Cinnamon instead.
Quote from: Daverz on November 02, 2012, 04:59:41 AM
Ubuntu has conveniences, it's not "dumbed down".
I know; hence the wink. But my point stays: one is likely to learn more about the nitty-gritty by sweating over an installation that when presented with a clean and smooth desktop, ready to show you videos of singing cats. ;D
Oh, and Greg, have you considered installing any distro in a virtual machine?
QuoteWhat I don't like is the default user interface they push. But it's easy enough to install Cinnamon instead.
I'm getting used to Unity despite not liking the 'pushing'. There are things I like, such as how keyboard-friendly it has been so far. But then the app menu (accessed via mouse, not HUD) sometimes seems stupid. I also spent some time with Mint 13 (Cinnamon). A slight lack of polish in comparison, but quite usable.
Quote from: Opus106 on November 02, 2012, 07:01:37 AM
I know; hence the wink. But my point stays: one is likely to learn more about the nitty-gritty by sweating over an installation
Unless you're creating some kind of embedded product and need to know these details, who cares? Leave the sweating over installation back in the 1990s where it belongs.
Quote from: Opus106 on November 02, 2012, 07:01:37 AM
Oh, and Greg, have you considered installing any distro in a virtual machine?
Um... I guess not.
I'm not even really sure what types of virtual machines are out there- never used them.
Quote from: Greg on November 02, 2012, 03:06:09 PM
Um... I guess not.
I'm not even really sure what types of virtual machines are out there- never used them.
Basically, it's a program that lets you run one or more OSs (guests) within another (host) and with the ability to run them simultaneously. Check out VirtualBox or VMWare.
Quote from: Opus106 on November 03, 2012, 12:06:59 AM
Basically, it's a program that lets you run one or more OSs (guests) within another (host) and with the ability to run them simultaneously. Check out VirtualBox or VMWare.
Ah, okay. Probably Windows Virtual PC would be another one of those...
I might mess around with virtual machines when I build my own computer, since I'll have more space. My laptop is destined to always be low on space, since I have so many large programs I need to keep installed on it.
Quote from: Opus106 on November 02, 2012, 07:01:37 AM
But my point stays: one is likely to learn more about the nitty-gritty by sweating over an installation that when presented with a clean and smooth desktop, ready to show you videos of singing cats. ;D
On everything but Slackware installing software is easy thanks to package managers. When you can install a complete desktop with one single command, it's not much of a sweat! :D
Finally, Ubuntu for tablets is here.
http://www.youtube.com/v/h384z7Ph0gU
http://www.ubuntu.com/devices/tablet
http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2013/02/ubuntu-for-tablet-unveiled-by-canonical-nexus-7-download-coming-thursday
It will be interesting to see how well the phone and tablet versions take off, if ever.