I was watching a video today of Sir Simon's BPO New Year's 2003 where he did a great La Valse and Daphnis, and really, I rather like his conducting, but don't have many of his recordings. The ones I do have I think are really nice, I have: his CBSO and Berlin Planets (not so much on the Berlin), his Adams' Harmonielehre, and his Mahler 3rd/CBSO (great), 5th/Berlin and Cooke 10th/Berlin (my only 10th but so lovely).
I know he can be controversial and hit or miss, but when it's hit, he's very fine indeed. He elicits an elegant, graceful sound from the orchestra and gives his readings a nice sensitivity and charm. Also I like his flow a lot, the way he balances push and pull.
What repertoire is he strongest in? His Mahler is very, very good so far for me, I'm curious about his M7 and his much heralded (at least by Gramophone) M8. And the 20th century stuff too, I didn't realize he had done so much of it. He has a huge discography spanning everything from Haydn to Szymanowski, not to mention a Beethoven cycle, there must be a few goldmines in there. ;)
What are your favorite recordings of his?
I find Rattle to be a mixed bag. He tends to be better with more modern stuff and rather aimless in the romantics. My favorite Rattle recordings are his CBSO Elgar Enigma Variations, BPO Messiaen Eclairs sur l'au-dela and his live BPO Mahler 6 from 1987.
I have the Rattle M8 and love it. Kind of a cross between Solti's Ecstaticus and Tennstedt's Profundus readings. And if I remember correctly, it fit onto a single CD.
I know he has a disc out with the BPO of Holst's The Planets. I heard Mercury, and Venus on the radio while driving, so admittedly not the ideal listening conditions, but it seemed a good solid choice,
Most of his Szymanowski recordings are very good. I'd also like to second O Mensch's rec of the Messiaen.
Maciek
I really like his Shostakovich 10th with the CBSO. And I think the previous opinions are spot on: strong with the 20th century, weaker with the romantics and classicists. I'd avoid his Beethoven symphony cycle and Schubert's 9th.
Quote from: Greta on April 29, 2007, 12:54:25 AM
I know he can be controversial and hit or miss, but when it's hit, he's very fine indeed... What are your favorite recordings of his?
I've been disappointed very often by Rattle. In forty years of collecting music, I've kept everything I've ever bought with the exception of several Rattle CDs I traded away because I really couldn't stand them. However, as you say, when he's good, he's very good. My favorites:
Shostakovich Symphony #4
Sibelius Symphonies 3, 5 & 7
Mahler Das Klagende Lied (this is the only Mahler from him I like)
Bartok Violin Concerto with Kyung-Wha Chung
Maxwell Davies Symphony #1
Gershwin Porgy and Bess
Messiaen Eclairs sur l'au-dela (I second O's recommendation)
The Jazz Album is a lot of fun with both pop and classical "jazz" pieces by Milhaud, Bernstein, Gershwin, Stravinsky.
Sarge
Quote from: Sergeant Rock on April 30, 2007, 12:55:40 PM
Bartok Violin Concerto with Kyung-Wha Chung
Oh, yes. That one's excellent! My brother in law had that on repeat in his car and I couldn't get enough of it. Reminds me I need to get a copy of my own.
I will second Sarge's recommendation for Shostakovich 4th symphony.
I just bought it (on Sarge's recommendation I think) and it is a great recording.
My reference for several years has been Kondrashin, and now I have a new
version in fabulous modern sound with a very satisfactory interpretation.
Highly recommended, if you like Shostakovich ....
The Szymanowski King Roger is excellent. I haven't heard the Porgy & Bess yet, but its in one of my "to be listened to" piles, and everybody says its the best one, so it probably is. Another one I like is a twofer Britten issue, which is on sale at ArkivMusic for $13.49 as I write this. http://www.arkivmusic.com/classical/album.jsp?album_id=9141
I didn't particularly care for the Beethoven symphony cycle, though. Nothing wrong with it, you understand, just nothing especially right about it.
I really like his Le Sacre du Printemps. It's more slow-going than some accounts, but he builds up bucketloads of tension. Great stuff.
Also, his double disc of Britten goodies and rare bits is a bargain!
Thanks for all the recommendations! Lot of great stuff to choose from. His Shostakovich, Sibelius, and Le Sacre really sound interesting. The Messiaen piece I'm not familiar with yet.
So on the flip side, what was wrong in the interpretations of the CDs of his that you really didn't like?
Also what about his CBSO recordings vs. his Berlin? They had a long and close working relationship and it seems like they connected a bit better than him and Berlin. While they can make some great music together, I don't know if he's best suited for the BPO...
Quote from: Greta on May 01, 2007, 03:36:43 PM
So on the flip side, what was wrong in the interpretations of the CDs of his that you really didn't like?
I can't speak as to
recordings I didn't like since I bought few of his CDs, but I heard a number of
live performances I didn't like. He conducted a Rite in Berlin that was reasonably well played, but dramatically flaccid. He conducted a Bruckner 9 on tour with the BPO that was plagued with intonation and coordination problems uncharacteristic of that orchestra and which never took off and went nowhere. He did a Mahler 2 with Philadelphia at Carnegie that was full of bizarre and illogical phrasings that were not followed consistently. Similarly, a lot of phrasings in the Schoenberg/Brahms Quintet on his DVD of the Athens Europa Konzert of the BPO seem like incoherent afterthoughts, not organically evolved from the rest of the music.
Quote from: O Mensch on May 01, 2007, 04:02:30 PM
I can't speak as to recordings I didn't like since I bought few of his CDs, but I heard a number of live performances I didn't like. He conducted a Rite in Berlin that was reasonably well played, but dramatically flaccid. He conducted a Bruckner 9 on tour with the BPO that was plagued with intonation and coordination problems uncharacteristic of that orchestra and which never took off and went nowhere. He did a Mahler 2 with Philadelphia at Carnegie that was full of bizarre and illogical phrasings that were not followed consistently. Similarly, a lot of phrasings in the Schoenberg/Brahms Quintet on his DVD of the Athens Europa Konzert of the BPO seem like incoherent afterthoughts, not organically evolved from the rest of the music.
That's not the only things he's butchered in Carnegie Hall, and next year we get him doing twice as much damage as usual. I heard his Mahler 4 which I can only describe in terms of the karate Kid: Wax on wax off. As soon as it picked up energy, he defused it with some strange rubato or dynamic shift. It was a frustrating evening. :(
Quote from: Greta on May 01, 2007, 03:36:43 PM
Thanks for all the recommendations! Lot of great stuff to choose from. His Shostakovich, Sibelius, and Le Sacre really sound interesting. The Messiaen piece I'm not familiar with yet.
So on the flip side, what was wrong in the interpretations of the CDs of his that you really didn't like?
Also what about his CBSO recordings vs. his Berlin? They had a long and close working relationship and it seems like they connected a bit better than him and Berlin. While they can make some great music together, I don't know if he's best suited for the BPO...
I know from personal exeperience that he hasn't rethought his Mahler since his days at CBSO. Also, he has worked hard to make the Berliners sound like the Birminghamians. If ever you have the occasion to go to a BP concert, be warned; that rich sound that everyone loved under Karajan is long gone. First Abbado slimmed off the fat from the sound and now Rattle has reduced it to anorexic proportions. Maybe the Berliners play better, but lately they haven't been sounding better.
Well, to his credit, I did hear him do some fantastic Ravel and Messiaen live in Berlin a couple of years ago.
His Beethoven symphonies are just odd. He seems to want bring a synthesis of HIP with modern performances, but ends up producing an undramatic reading of the works that stresses all the drawbacks of period style without any of its merits. When I compare it to Mackerras' Liverpool cycle, which manages to bridge the two styles (period style on modern instruments), it only stresses how dissapointing Rattle's reading is. Phrases are made without much rationale, as if he is only doing them to make his reading stand out. The readings lack any direction or warmth. The strings sound shrill and thin without sounding vibrant.
His Berlin Planets is extremely dissapointing. I've never heard such a polite and timid Mars. As someone already noted, the orchestra is perhaps more technically proficient, but this recording completely lacks any fire and energy.
QuoteHis Berlin Planets is extremely dissapointing. I've never heard such a polite and timid Mars. As someone already noted, the orchestra is perhaps more technically proficient, but this recording completely lacks any fire and energy.
I completely agree. It couldn't be more different from his CBSO Planets which is full of both. I don't get it. But you know, I don't think Berlin is particularly well suited to that work, because I'm not really fond of Karajan's Berlin Planets either, but I like his Vienna. Rattle recorded The Planets with the Philharmonia too, and it's also better than his recent one.
He worked wonders with Birmingham and took them to great heights, and he can be a fine conductor if you can get past his idiosyncrasies. I hear idiosyncrasies in the Mahler I've heard from him, but in the recordings I have I like that, they're not too radical and it gives it his own stylistic stamp.
CBSO was a dang fine orchestra under him, but what I've heard of Berlin with him, I also noticed they are starting to sound different than those full tones of the Karajan days. I think the conductor needs to adapt also to suit his orchestra, not bend them to his will. I believe that ensembles have their own unique characteristics which make them special. It's taking the identity away to try to radically change that.
He seems personally committed to Berlin and I applaud that but I think he'd do better somewhere else. Don't know where though. I think he'd be very interesting in America. I can think of a host of other conductors that would work better in Berlin.
Well, I'm a Rattle enthusiast and in addition to Sarge's excellent list Mahler's 7th, 8th and 10th although some might find the recording of the first two difficult.
Petrushka (1947) and Symphony in 3 Movements.
Adams' Harmonielehre etc.
Schubert's 9th. Not a first choice, perhaps, but a fascinating revelation of detail.
'The Cunning Little Vixen.'
'Porgy and Bess.'
The Ades disc that includes 'Asyla.'
Maw's 'Odyssey.'
Gurrelieder.
Beethoven's 1st and 2nd piano Concertos with Lars Vogt.
Quote from: nimrod79 on May 01, 2007, 10:08:50 PM
His Berlin Planets is extremely dissapointing. I've never heard such a polite and timid Mars.
Yes, Rattle made Mars sound like a negotiator.
Quote from: Don on May 02, 2007, 06:35:01 AM
Yes, Rattle made Mars sound like a negotiator.
Not like The Decider?
Quote from: Greta on May 01, 2007, 11:18:13 PM
CBSO was a dang fine orchestra under him, but what I've heard of Berlin with him, I also noticed they are starting to sound different than those full tones of the Karajan days.
The overall sound of the orchestra is not really that much different under Rattle than it was under Abbado. The change from Karajan to Abbado was more drastic.
Quote from: Hector on May 02, 2007, 06:31:26 AM
Well, I'm a Rattle enthusiast and in addition to Sarge's excellent list Mahler's 7th, 8th and 10th although some might find the recording of the first two difficult.
Petrushka (1947) and Symphony in 3 Movements.
Adams' Harmonielehre etc.
Schubert's 9th. Not a first choice, perhaps, but a fascinating revelation of detail.
'The Cunning Little Vixen.'
'Porgy and Bess.'
The Ades disc that includes 'Asyla.'
Maw's 'Odyssey.'
Gurrelieder.
Beethoven's 1st and 2nd piano Concertos with Lars Vogt.
That is probably one of the least appealing recordings of that work I've ever heard. It's not as bad as the Hurwitzer would suggest, but it's not anything that I would recommend that someone spend money on.
I think Rattle's Creation (w/ Arleen Auger) absolutely is good. It could be hard to find a better English language version of this piece as long as the Hogwood recording remains OOP.
(http://www.mdt.co.uk/public/pictures/products/standard/7541592.jpg)
QuoteHe seems personally committed to Berlin and I applaud that but I think he'd do better somewhere else. Don't know where though. I think he'd be very interesting in America. I can think of a host of other conductors that would work better in Berlin.
You know, I think that's the reason Rattle's qualities as a conductor are so often debated. His committment, enthusiasm, and charisma are impressive and admirable, and he is the kind of personality who has a way of reaching out to the public and making the orchestra a part of the cultural life of its home city (as he did in Birmingham and Berlin). Yet, the actual performances don't live up to the enthusiasm he brings to his work outside the concert hall. I think he would be great at one of the big American orchestras, and always thought it would be interesting to seem him in New York (where his skills as a conductor of Mahler and American music would fit in well).
I also have to wonder how much EMI's recording engineers are at fault sometimes. I heard the Berlin Philharmonic play Shostakovich's 10th symphony a month ago (though not conducted by Rattle) and it was amazing: visceral and vivid. The second movement was brutal and terrifying, exactly how it ought to be (and how Mars should have been). So the orchestra
can sound far more impressive than his recordings would let us believe.
Quote from: rubio on May 02, 2007, 07:33:40 AM
I think Rattle's Creation (w/ Arleen Auger) absolutely is good. It could be hard to find a better English language version of this piece as long as the Hogwood recording remains OOP.
(http://www.mdt.co.uk/public/pictures/products/standard/7541592.jpg)
It's hard to find another English language version of this work because I don't believe there are any. If everyone would just go to the Australian music site, Buywell.com and request that Eloquence reissue the Hogwood Creation then perhaps we might see it reissued and finally have a great alternative to Rattle's less than stellar effort.
Here's an excerpt from the review Hilary Finch wrote in Gramophone:
The real, resounding disappointment of Rattle's Creation is its air of impatience, rapid preparation, volatile pacing and poor balance.
Where Hogwood's rhythmic crispness gives impetus within and between movements, Rattle's, in its clipped chords, its over-phrasing and its garbled speeds, actually makes for a sense of creative stasis. Quote from: nimrod79 on May 02, 2007, 08:04:50 AM
You know, I think that's the reason Rattle's qualities as a conductor are so often debated. His committment, enthusiasm, and charisma are impressive and admirable, and he is the kind of personality who has a way of reaching out to the public and making the orchestra a part of the cultural life of its home city (as he did in Birmingham and Berlin). Yet, the actual performances don't live up to the enthusiasm he brings to his work outside the concert hall. I think he would be great at one of the big American orchestras, and always thought it would be interesting to seem him in New York (where his skills as a conductor of Mahler and American music would fit in well).
Thank you very much, but No Thank You! I think Rattle would be a disaster here, just going by how disastrous his guest performance with the Philadelphia was.
QuoteI also have to wonder how much EMI's recording engineers are at fault sometimes. I heard the Berlin Philharmonic play Shostakovich's 10th symphony a month ago (though not conducted by Rattle) and it was amazing: visceral and vivid. The second movement was brutal and terrifying, exactly how it ought to be (and how Mars should have been). So the orchestra can sound far more impressive than his recordings would let us believe.
EMI recordings can have good sound quality as well as indifferent sound quality. The sound quality of the Bertini Mahler cycle is amazing. I heard the BP live under Rattle and they don't sound as wonderful as they used to. Who knows, maybe they sound better recorded now. I will say that when I heard them with Rattle, they didn't sound bad, just less powerful, less sumptuous which was very different from how they sounded under Karajan years ago, and even from how they sounded under Abbado. Rattle prefers a leaner orchestral sound because he loves texture and transparency, but for some reason his sound lacks the power that everyone has come to love in the modern orchestra. Perhaps he should go to Minnesota and learn how Osmo Vänskä gets those qualities without sacrificing the lush, full orchestral sound of the modern orchestra. I will admit that the Minnesota players are not the virtuosi that the Berliners are, but the sound of the Minnesota SO under Vänskä is superior to the sound of the BP under Rattle.
There is another Creation in English, Willcocks Kings College, Heather Harper, Robert Tear. I saw it on sale a week or so ago on the net.
I could not take the hooty choral singing. The Rattle has one of the worst bass soloists I have heard. I have the set, but only listen to bits of it. Auger is excellent. Rattle makes it light and airy and dramatic, but no depth to it.
Mike
Rattle/Barenboim/BPO present an above-average performance of Brahms' first piano concerto for a Europa-Athens concert (DVD). Unhappily, Rattle's high-energy leadership is insufficient to compensate for Barenboim's lackluster performance in the first movement. Nevertheless, the visuals/acoustics of this DVD are stunning. 8)
The Rattle/Zimerman CD of Brahms PC 1 is much better.
Quote from: knight on May 02, 2007, 11:30:12 AM
There is another Creation in English, Willcocks Kings College, Heather Harper, Robert Tear. I saw it on sale a week or so ago on the net.
I could not take the hooty choral singing. The Rattle has one of the worst bass soloists I have heard. I have the set, but only listen to bits of it. Auger is excellent. Rattle makes it light and airy and dramatic, but no depth to it.
Mike
I really love Auger's voice. Some other recordings including her that are highly recommendable?
QuoteI think Rattle would be a disaster here, just going by how disastrous his guest performance with the Philadelphia was.
I'm just curious, what happened when he went to conduct Philadelphia?
Quote from: rubio on May 02, 2007, 12:37:29 PM
I really love Auger's voice. Some other recordings including her that are highly recommendable?
Mike told me the other day he read that she was the most recorded soprano in history. Funnily enough, I don't think I have a single recording (possibly because my collection generally isn't very impressive ::))...
Maciek
Quote from: nimrod79 on May 02, 2007, 01:11:47 PM
I'm just curious, what happened when he went to conduct Philadelphia?
Here's an excerpt from a review:
There was also bigness as in just plain big. Solo singing was reduced to heavy lifting for purposes of survival. Andrea Gruber (Tove) and Thomas Moser (Waldemar) labored admirably but labored nonetheless. The multitudinous men's choir, singing for all it was worth, sometimes found itself outmanned and fading out of earshot. A number of moments, one in Waldemar's ''Ross! Mein Ross!,'' were of astounding loudness. A tactful program insert inveighed gently against audience noisemakers, but the disruptive cough, if such existed, never had a chance against what was coming from the stage.
@Nimrod: I'm curious what he'd do in New York too. Yes, it would be controversial but it would be quite interesting! However.. I don't think he'd be interested, as Berlin, where the god Karajan held sway for so long, is still seen as about the top of the totem pole. I suppose he'll stay there as long as they'll have him.
Has anyone seen him conduct New York? When/if has he ever and what was the result? It's possible he and Philly aren't a good match, look at Eschenbach who was amazing here in Houston and what happened, I wouldn't have expected that.
Philly should probably have gone ahead and appointed Dutoit for good, lord knows he wants it, he's been conducting there for years and he's very solid.
Not a huge enthusiast of his but I am enamored of his Sibelius 5th. The transition in the Allegro Molto was a revalation after only having heard the Maazel before that.
Quote from: Greta on May 02, 2007, 11:47:33 PM
@Nimrod: I'm curious what he'd do in New York too. Yes, it would be controversial but it would be quite interesting! However.. I don't think he'd be interested, as Berlin, where the god Karajan held sway for so long, is still seen as about the top of the totem pole. I suppose he'll stay there as long as they'll have him.
Has anyone seen him conduct New York? When/if has he ever and what was the result? It's possible he and Philly aren't a good match, look at Eschenbach who was amazing here in Houston and what happened, I wouldn't have expected that.
The NYPO is harder on their conductors than the Philadelphia O. They need someone who is a diplomat as much as a musician; a stern but loving "Papa" to give them discipline with love. The NY MD will also have to deal with all the heavy hitters on the NYPO board as well as the big contributors. They won't care for Rattle's more experimental programming and they will want that gigantic hall sold out more often than not and I'm not sure Rattle could sell the tickets here.
QuotePhilly should probably have gone ahead and appointed Dutoit for good, lord knows he wants it, he's been conducting there for years and he's very solid.
And they will get a good bit of Argerich with him. Although they are divorced, they still really enjoy working together.
Quote from: Bunny on May 03, 2007, 05:18:32 AM
The NYPO is harder on their conductors than the Philadelphia O. They need someone who is a diplomat as much as a musician; a stern but loving "Papa" to give them discipline with love. The NY MD will also have to deal with all the heavy hitters on the NYPO board as well as the big contributors. They won't care for Rattle's more experimental programming and they will want that gigantic hall sold out more often than not and I'm not sure Rattle could sell the tickets here.
And they will get a good bit of Argerich with him. Although they are divorced, they still really enjoy working together.
They will not get Rattle or any other top Euro conductor and not, solely, for the reasons that you cite.
Unless, of course, it's an offer that cannot be refused! ;)
Quote from: Hector on May 03, 2007, 06:05:20 AM
They will not get Rattle or any other top Euro conductor and not, solely, for the reasons that you cite.
Unless, of course, it's an offer that cannot be refused! ;)
As we say in NY, "Money talks!"
Right now they have a caretaker director in Maazel. What they need is a Maestro with the chops to back up the hype, not a "sad rattle."
Quote from: Greta on May 02, 2007, 11:47:33 PM
Has anyone seen him conduct New York? When/if has he ever and what was the result? It's possible he and Philly aren't a good match, look at Eschenbach who was amazing here in Houston and what happened, I wouldn't have expected that.
I haven't seen Rattle with NYPO, not sure if he ever conducted them. I heard him do A Mahler 2 with Philly that was very well played, but interpretively a bit incoherent. I still don't understand the issue with Eschenbach in Philly. He was excellent with the CSO at Ravinia and everything I heard with him and Philly was outstanding as well. They did a teriffic Mahler 1 on tour in Germany a few years ago.
Quote from: Greta on May 02, 2007, 11:47:33 PM
Philly should probably have gone ahead and appointed Dutoit for good, lord knows he wants it, he's been conducting there for years and he's very solid.
He's much more than solid. He conducted some excellent Ravel, Prokofiev, Rimsky-Korsakov, Wagner, Goldmark and Tchaikovsky here in Chicago a few weeks ago.
Quote from: Hector on May 03, 2007, 06:05:20 AM
They will not get Rattle or any other top Euro conductor and not, solely, for the reasons that you cite.
Well, it is really mostly the reasons he cites. US orchestra boards have become just intolerable with their demands for the conductor to engage in non-musical activities like fundraising. That's really one of the main reasons why so many have left recently and why few are really attracted to coming back. I see an off-chance that Chailly or Muti could be lured back to these shores, but not any of the others at the moment.
Quote from: O Mensch on May 03, 2007, 08:06:51 AM
I haven't seen Rattle with NYPO, not sure if he ever conducted them. I heard him do A Mahler 2 with Philly that was very well played, but interpretively a bit incoherent. I still don't understand the issue with Eschenbach in Philly. He was excellent with the CSO at Ravinia and everything I heard with him and Philly was outstanding as well. They did a teriffic Mahler 1 on tour in Germany a few years ago.
He's much more than solid. He conducted some excellent Ravel, Prokofiev, Rimsky-Korsakov, Wagner, Goldmark and Tchaikovsky here in Chicago a few weeks ago.
Well, it is really mostly the reasons he cites. US orchestra boards have become just intolerable with their demands for the conductor to engage in non-musical activities like fundraising. That's really one of the main reasons why so many have left recently and why few are really attracted to coming back. I see an off-chance that Chailly or Muti could be lured back to these shores, but not any of the others at the moment.
I don't see Chailly leaving Leipzig in the near future and he doesn't seem like the type to enjoy jetting back and forth to NY every month or so. Muti would be another "safe" choice, but NY really needs to get over the reluctance to hire a ground breaker. Status quo in the music world doesn't attract lucrative recording contracts which is where the real money is. The NYPO needs to find a
young lion who can be assistant director for a few years, learn the ropes, and then take over the orchestra. Too often the board goes out to see just which hired gun they can get. I wish Barenboim were interested in the position, but that's really a pipe dream. And yes, I know, he's no spring chicken either.
My crystal ball shows Andrea Marcon heading for NY.
Bunny, Talking of recording contracts...I read a long time ago that New York, both as far as the Orchestra and the Met opera Co were concerned, were so expensive that recordings simply were not viable. Has all that problem been ironed out, at least as far as the orchestra is concerned?
The Met produces DVDs of live performances, but beyond Bernstein's Carmen, I cannot think of any recent full opera sets on CD. The Met orchestra seems to make discs OK with Levine though.
Mike
Quote from: Bunny on May 03, 2007, 09:14:50 AM
I don't see Chailly leaving Leipzig in the near future and he doesn't seem like the type to enjoy jetting back and forth to NY every month or so.
I didn't say NY. I think he could be interested in Philly or Chicago. I wouldn't bet on his attachment to Leipzig or his aversion to travel either.
Quote from: Bunny on May 03, 2007, 09:14:50 AM
The NYPO needs to find a young lion who can be assistant director for a few years, learn the ropes, and then take over the orchestra.
You mean Xian Zhang?
Quote from: Don on May 03, 2007, 09:20:52 AM
My crystal ball shows Andrea Marcon heading for NY.
Who?
Quote from: O Mensch on May 03, 2007, 10:49:04 AM
You mean Xian Zhang?
I mentioned her name on the old board as a possible successor and M Forever promptly responded with one of his scathing remarks about how I know nothing about the music industry (true BTW). But I DO think someone young is needed in NY. I wonder if they can get someone like Andrew Litton. He is homegrown, has had a good career and is just waiting for a big gig I think.
Quote from: PerfectWagnerite on May 03, 2007, 10:55:03 AM
I mentioned her name on the old board as a possible successor and M Forever promptly responded with one of his scathing remarks about how I know nothing about the music industry (true BTW). But I DO think someone young is needed in NY. I wonder if they can get someone like Andrew Litton. He is homegrown, has had a good career and is just waiting for a big gig I think.
Have you heard Zhang? How is she? I unfortunately moved away from NY before she started appearing more regularly, so I didn't get a chance to hear her.
Quote from: Don on May 03, 2007, 09:20:52 AM
My crystal ball shows Andrea Marcon heading for NY.
Quote from: O Mensch on May 03, 2007, 10:49:04 AM
Who?
To be accurate, Andrea Marcon was just in NYC at Zankel Hall. He may be coming through again on his return to Italy, or may have already departed these shores. He leads the Venice Baroque Orchestra with Giuliano Carmignola, conducting while standing and playing the harpsichord. I think this is an example of Don's humor; I can't imagine that he thinks the NYPO strings are trading their steel for gut anytime in the near future. hehe.
(http://cover6.cduniverse.com/MuzeAudioArt/Large/42/969942.jpg)
Quote from: O Mensch on May 03, 2007, 11:05:04 AM
Have you heard Zhang? How is she? I unfortunately moved away from NY before she started appearing more regularly, so I didn't get a chance to hear her.
Only once, and it was a warhorse program (with a Beethoven symphony - but for the life of me I don't recall which one !) so the orchestra was most likely playing on auto-pilot. In any case it was very good. Now I am just speaking in purely musical terms. Some will say there is no way she can deal with the NYPO trustees and what-not but you can say that about any young conductor you put in there: you have no way of knowing whether they will flourish or wilt. Plus if you give them a chance it is not like they are going to make millions like Maazel or possibly Chailly. If you don't like them you can always cut them loose.
Quote from: PerfectWagnerite on May 03, 2007, 10:55:03 AM
I mentioned her name on the old board as a possible successor and M Forever promptly responded with one of his scathing remarks about how I know nothing about the music industry (true BTW). But I DO think someone young is needed in NY. I wonder if they can get someone like Andrew Litton. He is homegrown, has had a good career and is just waiting for a big gig I think.
Fieldston and Juillliard should have molded him into a very liberal NYer. If he returns, he can host all the Hilary or Barack fundraisers à la Bernstein. Actually, he has a great feel for Mahler, and could do a lot to restore the standing of the orchestra as a Mahler band. He just conducted the Juilliard SO last month at Avery Fisher Hall, but I haven't seen anything about that in the papers. Another homegrown boy who gets mentioned for the job is Alan Gilbert, whose parents were string players in the NYPO. The other names mentioned are Ludovic Morlot (French) as well as Chailly (Italian) both of whom impressed the orchestra when they conducted recently according to a story in the Times.
Quote from: Bunny on May 03, 2007, 11:10:35 AM
He leads the Venice Baroque Orchestra with Giuliano Carmignola, conducting while standing and playing the harpsichord.
That harpsichord must have very long legs!
Quote from: O Mensch on May 03, 2007, 12:33:16 PM
That harpsichord must have very long legs!
It's propped up on a dais. None of the musicians sit in that group, and they were the best dressed ensemble I've ever seen. the women wore Italian designer dresses (I think Armani and Missoni) and men wore very natty suits with beautiful silk ties. Oh, and Carmignola was dressed-down, but so beautifully tailored. I should also mention that his shoes appeared to be custom made. Extremely elegant, and the music wasn't half bad either. ;)
Actually, having the harpsichord propped up made it considerably easier for Marcon to lead than it was for Rchard Egarr who sits at the harpsichord, moving his head to the left, to the right, up, down, and jerking spasmodically for emphasis. I have to say the view is extremely distracting. (I guess no one ever told him that he shouldn't lead with his head. >:D ) He reminded me of one of those bobble head dolls on the dashboard of a NY taxi.
Since we're on the subject of fashion...I noticed Sir Simon always wears a dove gray tie and cummerbund with his tails for concerts. Unique. Looks very nice I think, matches his hair. Has he always worn that?
My mom was over here and I showed her his BPO New Year's video. She's fairly musical but classical is really not her favorite, so we watched the Gershwin stuff. She thought he was great (and his Gershwin really is), and immediately said, "Oh, he's cute..." ;D
When I saw him conduct, he wore all black. Are you sure he was wearing a tailcoat? Cummerbunds are not worn with tailcoats, they are used with dinner jackets (tuxedos).
Yes, indeed, probably why I noticed it. Gray cummerbund only, white tie.
Screen cap from BPO 03' New Years iattached.
Berlin at Carnegie:
(http://image.guardian.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/arts/2002/10/10/APberlin3.jpg)
And also in the Gramophone featuring his CBSO M8, a pic of their performance.
I think it's nice when men add a touch of individuality to their standard formal dress. Quirky, yet classy. Esa-Pekka Salonen's creative suspenders come to mind... >:D
He's no Beau Brummel! A cummerbund with a tailcoat just isn't done; it looks sloppy. The traditional white waistcoat keeps the shirt looking very neat, especially if you have to wave your arms around. In the lower picture, the cummerbund hangs out under the coat breaking the lean line of the trousers. That cummerbund with a dinner jacket and a silvery pocket square would be very nice, indeed. He also should get a decent haircut. He could be quite a fine looking man if he got a good stylist. Perhaps we should call Trinny and Susannah to smarten him up. ;)
(http://www.bbcamerica.com/media/140/sm_maincontent_left_upperbkgd.jpg)
Quote from: Bunny on May 03, 2007, 11:10:35 AM
To be accurate, Andrea Marcon was just in NYC at Zankel Hall. He may be coming through again on his return to Italy, or may have already departed these shores. He leads the Venice Baroque Orchestra with Giuliano Carmignola, conducting while standing and playing the harpsichord. I think this is an example of Don's humor; I can't imagine that he thinks the NYPO strings are trading their steel for gut anytime in the near future. hehe.
(http://cover6.cduniverse.com/MuzeAudioArt/Large/42/969942.jpg)
Right, I wasn't being serious, although I personally would think it a fine idea for the NYPO strings to take the gut route.
I am surprised that O Mensch never heard of Marcon; he must not be a HIP fan.
Quote from: Don on May 05, 2007, 01:22:20 PM
Right, I wasn't being serious, although I personally would think it a fine idea for the NYPO strings to take the gut route.
I am surprised that O Mensch never heard of Marcon; he must not be a HIP fan.
I'd love to see all the strings go back to gut. I wouldn't mind a few portamenti along the way along with a lot less vibrato. Then we could all watch David Hurwitz implode as he realized that once again he had fired the hurwitzer in the wrong direction. >:D