John Zorn is a multi-talented musician. He plays jazz (saxophone) and also composes classical music. Is anyone here familiar with his composed work? I'm now listening to this album, which I'm rediscovering:
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51Q1qtoFaFL._AA240_.jpg)
It's very good.
I would like to hear other people's experiences with Zorn as a composer.
Zorn's disc, Spillane, was one of the first CDs I ever bought--haven't heard it in awhile, but played it quite a bit at first. Also heard his Cat o' Nine Tails (1988) played by the Kronos Quartet several times, and it's a lot of fun.
You may know that he is also the Artistic Director of The Stone (http://thestonenyc.com/), a small performance space here in NYC that hosts a huge variety of new and experimental music.
--Bruce
He's prolific, isn't he?
Music for Children, Naked City and New Music for East Asian Bar Bands are my favorite Zorn projects
Torture Garden is one long evil black sabbath chord for rock band (with screaming) that keeps picking up steam.
lots of screaming in his pieces.
don't like the jazzy stuff.
i have the complete string quartets which is...really great. cat o nine tails should be thee post mod example of a str qrt. the dead man sounds like lachenmann/kagel on steroids...crystalline noise. memento mori is 30min of....well, it makes sense to me, though no one seems to get it. dark, morbid, occasional beautiful sounds, occasional ugly sounds...just a nyc elegy. the last piece, kol nidre, sounds JUST like arvo part, exactly. BUT BUY THIS IS YOU LIKE STR QRTS.
i just find this album thee great example of the downtown scene in the 80s. elliott sharp's quartets are a WHOLE lot more ear splitting and unrelenting.
and no screaming.
he is very interesting musician for me.
you can find everything about JOHN ZORN in this blog:
http://zornography.blogspot.com/
He also apparently loves S/M.
While I was at Buffalo, I was in an ensemble which was to play a piece of Zorn's. There was no score; there was a sort of 'set of directions' which was more like militaristic role-playing. At the time, I was simply in no mood for such rannygazoo, and I found it a dreadfully tedious affair.
Quote from: snyprrr on May 14, 2009, 11:41:47 AM
He also apparently loves S/M.
He definitely has a twisted side which I'm not too thrilled with. :-\
I don't have other Masada albums, but I love Volac: Book of Angels, Vol. 8 for solo cello, played by Erik Friedlander. Melancholic, beautiful.
[asin]B000U1ZJQE[/asin]
Rachsiel: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9LSKWThVlRg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9LSKWThVlRg)
zzz
Quote from: 7/4 on May 23, 2014, 02:37:09 AM
zzz
Boring? I hope you slept well. ;D
I am enjoying the string trios album by Masada String Trio (Book of Angels Vol. 2). They are more lively, containing folkish, jazzy, avant-garde styles. I am not familiar with Jewish music, so I don't know how the compositions are connected to / departed from traditional Jewish modes, scales, etc. Some of them sound Arabic.
I've played some Zorn charts in one of the bands I'm in (the one that plays for belly dancers ;D). They're very fun to jam to, and lend themselves well to outside-the-box improvisations. 8)
He's a bit overexposed in the NYC area.
That's all. Carry on. :laugh:
Quote from: jochanaan on May 23, 2014, 07:59:52 AM
I've played some Zorn charts in one of the bands I'm in (the one that plays for belly dancers ;D). They're very fun to jam to, and lend themselves well to outside-the-box improvisations. 8)
Is it a game piece with a prompter, like Cobra? If you recorded it, please upload it to youtube. ;D
Quote from: 7/4 on May 23, 2014, 11:07:04 AM
He's a bit overexposed in the NYC area.
I also feel he releases too many CDs, which somehow made me reluctant to check out his music.
Quote from: snyprrr on March 09, 2009, 08:12:57 PM
i have the complete string quartets which is...really great. cat o nine tails should be thee post mod example of a str qrt. the dead man sounds like lachenmann/kagel on steroids...crystalline noise. memento mori is 30min of....well, it makes sense to me, though no one seems to get it. dark, morbid, occasional beautiful sounds, occasional ugly sounds...just a nyc elegy. the last piece, kol nidre, sounds JUST like arvo part, exactly. BUT BUY THIS IS YOU LIKE STR QRTS.
i just find this album thee great example of the downtown scene in the 80s. elliott sharp's quartets are a WHOLE lot more ear splitting and unrelenting.
The string quartets Nos. 1-4 in the album below are really good. I have been interested in it for a long time, and thanks to your strong recommendation, I purchase it today.
Cat O'nine Tails is like randomly choosing radio channels. Yes, Lachenmann's name came to mind when hearing
The Dead Man and
Memento Mori. I am listening to it for the 2nd time today and like them very much. I have not heard
Necronomicon or
Forbidden Fruit. Zorn composed only 6 string quartets?
[asin]B00000JIQH[/asin]
Quote from: torut on May 23, 2014, 05:29:48 PM
The string quartets Nos. 1-4 in the album below are really good. I have been interested in it for a long time, and thanks to your strong recommendation, I purchase it today. Cat O'nine Tails is like randomly choosing radio channels. Yes, Lachenmann's name came to mind when hearing The Dead Man and Memento Mori. I am listening to it for the 2nd time today and like them very much. I have not heard Necronomicon or Forbidden Fruit. Zorn composed only 6 string quartets?
[asin]B00000JIQH[/asin]
'Memento Mori' sounds like a half hour SQ by some Avant Master- I like it. The whole album is a nice document. How about that nasty anal/scat drawering on the inside cover??? I'd be happy with some normal sex, thank you... hmmm...
I'm always wondering how depraved the Composers of some of my favorite music are :(.
Quote from: snyprrr on May 24, 2014, 07:14:49 AM
'Memento Mori' sounds like a half hour SQ by some Avant Master- I like it. The whole album is a nice document.
Have you heard
Necronomicon (in Magick) or
Forbidden Fruit (in Kronos's compilation album)?
QuoteHow about that nasty anal/scat drawering on the inside cover??? I'd be happy with some normal sex, thank you... hmmm...
I'm always wondering how depraved the Composers of some of my favorite music are :(.
Unfortunately, I purchased the mp3 album, so I cannot see the inside cover. Actually, those gross album covers are one of the reasons I hesitated to buy them.
I suspect his bad taste is just pretension. Or, does he really love and practice s&m? :-\
Quote from: torut on May 24, 2014, 08:52:08 AM
Have you heard Necronomicon (in Magick) or Forbidden Fruit (in Kronos's compilation album)?
Unfortunately, I purchased the mp3 album, so I cannot see the inside cover. Actually, those gross album covers are one of the reasons I hesitated to buy them.
I suspect his bad taste is just pretension. Or, does he really love and practice s&m? :-\
I'm thinking he's a typically depraved "nice boy from Brooklyn". Don't want to hear a piece by Zorn called 'Necronomicon'- yea, either he's a Kenneth Anger wannabe or a PikeBlavatskCrowlee wannabe- probably has "Chosen-itis"... dwelling on "expression" (acting out)... have you seen the video that shooter kid in Ca. posted?- that's the kind of attitude I feel from Zorn's kind. (not necessarily against "hot blondes", but more in the deist hate) If he were based in West Palm Beach they'd call it StormfrontMusic?
brrrrrr, yuk
If he's practicing it, he's probably alone when he is. :laugh:
Thought I would revive this thread and mention my love for Zorn's music, but I'm not a fan of his noisy, structureless recordings, but prefer the more Jewish and 'mystical' side of his musical persona with various ventures into dissonance which never looses sight of the lyrical content. Like anyone prolific, he's put out some really questionable material, but, hey, I'm not Zorn. My largest criticism of his music really comes down to releasing so much music. I mean I know the hardcore devotees of his music will probably have everything of his under the sun, but, for me, I prefer to pick and choose what I believe would show his music in the best possible light.
I'm actually quite excited that The Song Project will finally see the light of day and will be released next month. This is Zorn at his lyrical best.
I have one Zorn CD, Spillane/Godard. Anything more representative?
Quote from: Daverz on March 15, 2015, 05:36:03 PM
I have one Zorn CD, Spillane/Godard. Anything more representative?
The ten recordings he did as the group
Masada (Zorn + Dave Douglas, Joey Baron and Gregg Cohen):
Alef,
Bet,
Gimel, etc. (the titles are numbers 1-10 in Hebrew).
But, If I had to pick one from this band,
Live in Jerusalem is as good an introduction to this side of Zorn as any. A side I consider his best.
[asin]B00000IITS[/asin]
Quote from: Daverz on March 15, 2015, 05:36:03 PM
I have one Zorn CD, Spillane/Godard. Anything more representative?
'More representative' are scary words when trying to recommend a Zorn recording. :) I would say give
The Big Gundown: John Zorn Plays the Music of Ennio Morricone a listen. It's a solid album IMHO. Of course, I could recommend something like Naked City's
Radio (one of their less noisy outings), which is perhaps my favorite album from this group. Again, it's difficult to recommend just
one recording.
I like Zorn more for his noisier, more radical works and my favorite period of him is roughly from the Mid-80s to the Mid-90s, especially "Kristallnacht", "The Bribe", the soundtrack "Hex "Cynical History Hour", everything he did with with his bands Naked City and Painkiller and the Hat-Art-release of "Cobra". "Locus Solus" also is good, though particularly weird - I think of it as kind of a logical end-point of the No-Wave-movement. Have not yet listened to the SQ, but what I read in this threat sounds very interesting. Also I like the Elliott Sharp SQs quite a lot.
Quote from: Mirror Image on March 15, 2015, 06:15:31 PM
'More representative' are scary words when trying to recommend a Zorn recording. :) I would say give The Big Gundown: John Zorn Plays the Music of Ennio Morricone a listen. It's a solid album IMHO. Of course, I could recommend something like Naked City's Radio (one of their less noisy outings), which is perhaps my favorite album from this group. Again, it's difficult to recommend just one recording.
Yes!
Radio, the eponymous Naked City, and Naked City Live at The Knitting Factory are my three top NC choices. Don't listen to the others much although I have the complete recordings box set.
I also like Masada Live at Tonic and Live in Sevilla, as well as Electric Masada At the Mountains of Madness and 50th Birthday Celebration, and finally, Bar Kokhba, which takes pieces from the Masada songbook and rearranges them for various ensembles.
I haven't heard any of the Book of Angels series, but hope to check some of these out someday.
Quote from: NJ Joe on March 21, 2015, 08:09:44 AM
Yes! Radio, the eponymous Naked City, and Naked City Live at The Knitting Factory are my three top NC choices. Don't listen to the others much although I have the complete recordings box set.
I also like Masada Live at Tonic and Live in Sevilla, as well as Electric Masada At the Mountains of Madness and 50th Birthday Celebration, and finally, Bar Kokhba, which takes pieces from the Masada songbook and rearranges them for various ensembles.
I haven't heard any of the Book of Angels series, but hope to check some of these out someday.
I, too, own that Naked City box set and there are parts on
Grand Guigol that were particularly impressive. Like, for example, when they played some classical music from Satie and Debussy. The other half of the album sounds like leftovers from their self-titled debut. The only time I could get into this cut-up, collage style of writing was on
Spillane where these seems to be more cohesion and a stronger musical narrative happening. Need to give
The Bribe a spin as it received it in the mail not too long ago. I really like The Dreamers and the Gnostic Trio, so these remain my two favorite Zorn groups.
I listened to
Nosferatu the other night and quite enjoyed it. Have you heard this one, Joe?
Quote from: Mirror Image on March 21, 2015, 06:50:17 PM
I, too, own that Naked City box set and there are parts on Grand Guigol that were particularly impressive. Like, for example, when they played some classical music from Satie and Debussy. The other half of the album sounds like leftovers from their self-titled debut. The only time I could get into this cut-up, collage style of writing was on Spillane where these seems to be more cohesion and a stronger musical narrative happening. Need to give The Bribe a spin as it received it in the mail not too long ago. I really like The Dreams and the Gnostic Trio, so these remain my two favorite Zorn groups.
I listened to Nosferatu the other night and quite enjoyed it. Have you heard this one, Joe?
You're right, I forgot about the Satie and Debussy on Grand Guignol; I enjoy that a lot. I own Spillane as well, but don't enjoy that quite as much as the other recordings I listed. I have not heard Nosferatu, nor have I heard any of the other recordings or groups you mention. Maybe someday, who knows?
Quote from: NJ Joe on March 21, 2015, 08:03:04 PM
You're right, I forgot about the Satie and Debussy on Grand Guignol; I enjoy that a lot. I own Spillane as well, but don't enjoy that quite as much as the other recordings I listed. I have not heard Nosferatu, nor have I heard any of the other recordings or groups you mention. Maybe someday, who knows?
If anything, you should definitely checkout the album
The Goddess: Music for the Ancient of Days. This is one of Zorn's more impressive outings. Features some blistering guitar work from Marc Ribot.
John Zorn : happy birthday (https://musicakaleidoscope.wordpress.com/2015/09/02/john-zorn-happy-birthday/)
(http://www.clarin.com/espectaculos/John-Zorn_CLAIMA20120308_0018_4.jpg)
I first came to know John Zorn (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Zorn)'s music from his band Masada, a jazz quartet recalling Ornette Coleman, at least to my ears. He made a series of ten recordings, all named using the first ten letters/numbers of the Hebrew alef-bet (Alef, Bet, Gimel, etc.). He also released several live dates with this same line-up: Zorn (alto saxophone), Dave Douglas (trumpet),Greg Cohen (double bass), and Joey Baron (drum set). On occasion, different drummers filled in for Baron – most regularly Kenny Wollesen. These recordings were all released on Zorn's record label Tzadik.
Zorn's breakthrough recording was 1985's widely acclaimed The Big Gundown: John Zorn Plays the Music of Ennio Morricone, where Zorn offered radical arrangements of themes from The Big Gundown (1966), Once Upon a Time in the West (1968), A Fistful of Dynamite (1971), and Once Upon a Time in America (1984), that incorporated elements of traditional Japanese music, soul jazz, and other diverse musical genres.
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/512W8EJqj7L._SX225_.jpg)
Quote from: Thatfabulousalien on September 11, 2016, 01:27:49 AM
I need to bump this thread because I've been a fan of Zorn fir a long while and have quite a lot to say from the portion of his catalogue I've heard ;D
Just listened to some 'Solus Locus' Tracks....mm....not for me, thank you. And then 'The Big Gundown',...mm... maybe in my Zappa phase... used to have the first Naked City, raucous one-note metal ruined by the screamer...
The String Quartets stand apart for me.
Haven't tried Masada or other bands.
The anal/fecal sex drawing in the SQ insert telegraphs much...again I say. mmmm...
Quote from: Thatfabulousalien on September 11, 2016, 01:27:49 AM
I need to bump this thread because I've been a fan of Zorn fir a long while and have quite a lot to say from the portion of his catalogue I've heard ;D
Are you primarily a fan of his classical works or of Zorn in general? I will admit to being relatively inexperienced with jazz, and, in Zorn's case, while I'm already a big fan of his classical oeuvre, I've only listened to a couple of Masada discs and the Naked City disc, as far as the other stuff goes.
Quote from: Thatfabulousalien on September 12, 2016, 08:31:32 PM
Another thread I've barely started to let loose on ;)
I love his classical works, the "What Thy Wilt" CD, the (Pierrot Lunaire influenced) "Chimeras", "Rituals" "Christabel", (Angelus Novus CD), "The Alchemist" "Memento Mori" are my favorite of his classical output. All of which should be performed often alongside any other contemporary composers.
I love Naked City, Painkiller, Masada, The Moonchild Project, file card pieces like "Elegy" and "Spillane", Simulacrum.
Despite all of this, that is about 1/4 of his catalog :laugh:
Well I've heard most of the classical ones you mentioned, at least. Can't remember "Christabel".
Have you heard
The Hermetic Organ? Those discs are incredible.
I've been listening to Zorn all day.
Is it even possible that he wasn't influenced by Xenakis?
I heard a bit of this recently and liked it a great deal. Confusingly, there are two different discs available--which differ at least in cover art--with the same info and same track listing. I assume they are identical except for the cover art.
(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/71eNPzbT9jL._SY355_.jpg)
Quote from: XB-70 Valkyrie on September 18, 2016, 05:27:44 PM
I heard a bit of this recently and liked it a great deal. Confusingly, there are two different discs available--which differ at least in cover art--with the same info and same track listing. I assume they are identical except for the cover art.
(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/71eNPzbT9jL._SY355_.jpg)
Yes, it's rather strange. This recording was released on two labels: Nonesuch and Tzadik Records. I bought the Tzadik release of course because I'm a cool kid. 8)
Xenakiboy, I need ~3-5 top recs for Zorn discs. I am too intimidated by his oeuvre. I have many hours of his music already, but only because I've felt safe within the confines of the Tzadik "Composer Series", but eventually, one has to listen to jazz.
You may safely neglect (because I have them):
- All Tzadik "Composer Series" discs
- All "Hermetic Organ" discs
- "The Parachute Years"
I am not particularly interested in anything with a lot of heavy fusion/metal kind of stuff. I prefer my metal to just go ahead and be Incantation and Mayhem and Immortal type of stuff, tbh. I mean, I'll get there, but I'd prefer to hear pianos and synthesizers and violins and trombones and whatnot right now.
Quote from: Thatfabulousalien on September 21, 2016, 07:00:25 PM
Funny I only hear a little influence on some of his piano pieces (777).
I hear a lot more Webern, Varese, Carter, Cage, Kagel and Stockhausen in his music(as well as Carl Stalling). :o
I guess I hear it primarily in his violin stuff. That extremely calculated yet bold and aggressive playing is something very few composers can convey.
I'm going to try going through The Book Of Angels next, in a somewhat orderly fashion. I don't know what really qualifies as Masada Book One, whereas The Book Of Angels is very clearly marked in orderly volumes, so I guess that makes it more approachable for me. I'm a very systematic listener, if you haven't figured that out, lol...
That being said, I have already been listening to Zorn exclusively for several days, and American music exclusively for about 3 weeks, so I need to throw in some other binges as well.
I'll have to share my Zorn collection here at some point...
The guy puts out so many recordings a year that it's difficult to keep up with what he's doing.
Lately I'm enjoying his more serious music in the modern classical vein like on his discs "Fragmentations, Prayers and Interjections" and "Music and It's Double" quite a lot. Being also informed of/influenced by "lighter" musical forms like Jazz and Rock seems to prevent him from trapping into the pitfalls of overambition and pretentiosness, which composers with purely classical socialization and carreer more often have difficulties to bypass imo.
The latest addition to my Zorn collection
[asin]B0010WDDWO[/asin]
Like it quite a lot. Has the potential of becoming my favorite "classical" Zorn release. Only drawback is the short playing time with 26:34, which would rather go well with EP than with a full priced CD. On the other hand Zorn describes the work as an opera, and in that regard I doubt the EP format fits very well. :-\
Quote from: Thatfabulousalien on November 18, 2016, 12:37:50 AM
Great interview!
http://www.npr.org/templates/transcript/transcript.php?storyId=217195249
Thanks for the link. Very interesting. Must be the most personal Interview I read from him.
It's a pity that I didn't manage to get a ticket for the John Zorn marathon on 30.3.2017 in Hamburgs new concert venue Elbphilharmonie. It was sold out to quickly!
Quote from: Thatfabulousalien on November 25, 2016, 12:56:06 PM
You're welcome, but it is actually a audio interview you can listen to (see page, top right) - on desktop not mobile
Ok - thanks. I read it on the mobile but at opportunity I will also listen to it.
I don't think Zorn's classical works are particularly good, but his 'imaginary' film scores, jazz, and rock works are high quality.
For my part I would say I enjoy Zorns latest classical works more than his latest rock, surf, klezmer, film music or whatever outings, which all sound a bit too versed for me. My absolute favorites remain works from the period between ca. 1985 - 1995, which had an edge to them I miss a bit at later works. His "Masada with classical arrangements" like on "Bar Kokhba" and "The Circle Maker" are also great.
Quote from: Thatfabulousalien on December 09, 2016, 03:48:28 PM
I think many of his classical works deserve to enter the classical canon, alongside any other major 20th century composer.
I'm in love with his classical music, probably because I understand and relate completely to where he is coming from artistically and aesthetically. ;D
The 20th century and to a lesser degree the 21th are crowded with great works, so having a place in the canon is a great honour for a piece/composer. What Zorn works are you thinking of?
Quote from: Thatfabulousalien on December 12, 2016, 01:03:10 AM
Hey Chad man!
Well, in chronological order:
Christabel
Cat 'O Nine Tails
For Your Eyes Only
Dead Man Variations
Memento Mori
Rituals
Contes de Fées
Chimeras
Necronomicon
The Alchemist
All Hallows Eve
Suppots et Suppliciations
The Temptations of St. Anthony
Occam's Razor
The Aristos
8)
Cool - thanks. I'm always curious about Zorn recommendations, cause his output is that large and it also contains some discs/pieces that are less worthwhile imo.
Quote from: Thatfabulousalien on December 19, 2016, 04:02:08 PM
I'm really digging , Moonchild: Songs Without Words and Moonchild: Astronome, lately.
I've always loved Moonchild but I'm enjoying it immensely! :D
Btw, these aren't classical ones this time ;)
Perhaps I should give those moonchild records another chance. My first impression back in the day was not so great. Thought it paled compared to Naked City. I even sold the first moonchild album, which was the only one I purchased.
Quote from: Thatfabulousalien on January 02, 2017, 09:09:49 PM
Chad, have you heard Templars In Sacred Blood?
Each track has a more traditional "song structure" and Patton has text (aka lyrics).
It's more accessible in that way, I'm very sure in my opinion that Moonchild is one of the highlights of his non-classical music, it's really something special :D
Interesting. I heard it once in the record store. I remember it has some klezmer melodies in it, which I did not find very fitting in the extreme metal context, but that was just a first impression. On occasion I will give it another try if I find it on youtube or so. Spotify I thing does not have much Zorn. What would be your favorite album from the Moonchild trio?
Quote from: Thatfabulousalien on December 25, 2016, 09:56:36 PM
I absolutely love it, it's very different to Naked City though.
This is him really expressing the mystical/hermetic aesthetic through a metal/rock band essentially. One of the best ways to get a grasp of how to approach it, is directly through the three artists that the whole Moonchild project is dedicated to/inspired by.
Many of the abrasive musical elements are reminiscent of Edgard Varese (and the block form), the very intense vocals are influenced by Antonin Artaud's Theatre Of Cruelty (many of the drawings in some of the Moonchild albums are even Artaud's) and Aleister Crowley who is kind of obvious too through the occult themes throughout Moonchild (and many of Zorn's post-2000 music) :)
Thanks - knowing those influences could be my starting point for a better understanding of this music. Varese however is the only one of those I'm really familiar with.
Picked up The Crucible lately! Good album. Like it way more than the first Moonchild album, the only Moonchild album I owned and which I sold again, because it sounded a bit volitional in my ears.
[asin]B01N6LWH9E[/asin]
My favorite "late" Zorn remains the classical composer however.
Quote from: Thatfabulousalien on March 11, 2017, 04:22:50 PM
Yes, I love that album!
Have you heard any of the Simulacrum (project) albums?
The latest one "The Garden Of Earthly Delights is really impressive, as the rest of that project :)
...and the latest Book Of Angel's album? Volume 30; Leonard?
It's all very impressive. 8)
I once listened to one of the Simulacrum albums via Youtube, don't remember which one exactely. Instrumentally I found it quite good. Compared to the Moonchild Trio the members seem to have more of an extreme metal background. That's not a drawback for me - there are several Extreme Metal bands I like a lot and find interesting. But somehow I missed vocals, which I prefer to have in that kind of music.
Always loved this album
https://www.youtube.com/v/e_biryRi8xo
and a more mellow recent one
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/9c/The_Gnostic_Preludes.jpeg)
Lately bought "Dictee: Liber Novus" containing two of Zorn's latest works in the game piece genre, one of the genres where Zorn is at his most compelling imo. Good stuff.
Quote from: α | ì Æ ñ on June 29, 2017, 04:29:40 PM
You seem to be well-versed in contemporary music, what do you think of his quartet and ensemble works? :)
Not been that interested in his works for traditional ensembles, have only given Carny & Cat O' Nine Tails a real listen. Prefer the electric stuff like Naked City, Painkiller & Moonchild
Quote from: α | ì Æ ñ on August 20, 2017, 01:48:58 AM
Yo Chad, anything cooking lately? 8)
Not really. Hadn't bought some new Zorn for a while. Lately I thought about purchasing "Yankees", the album from the early 80s he did together with Derek Bailey and George Lewis. It seems quite unique in his oeuvre and I love Derek Bailey.
I was just looking through my Zorn collection the other day --- man, I've got a lot of his recordings. Last month, I bought four I didn't have (and wanted): Pellucidar: A Dreamers Fantabula, The Painted Bird, The Mockingbird, and True Discoveries of Witches & Demons. Looking forward to hearing these.
I'll have to list all of the Zorn recordings I own. I think I'll work on that now...
Let's see I own the following Zorn recordings (in no particular order):
Naked City: Complete Studio Recordings
Naked City: Live
At the Gates of Paradise
A Vision in Blakelight
O'o
News For Lulu
Transmigration of the Magus
IAO
The Goddess (Music for the Ancient of Days)
The Dreamers
Filmworks Anthology: 20 Years of Soundtrack Music 1986 - 2005
Bar Kokhba
Cartoon S & M
Godard/Spillane
The Circle Maker
Masada Guitars
The String Quartets
New Traditions in East Asian Bar Bands
Elegy
Mount Analogue
Bar Kokhba Sextet: 50th Birthday Celebration, Vol. 2
Electric Masada: 50th Birthday Celebration, Vol. 5
The Bribe
Filmworks X: In the Mirror of Maya Deren
Filmworks XIX: The Rain Horse
Filmworks XXIII: El General
Filmworks XIII: Invitation to a Suicide
Filmworks XXIV: The Nobel Prize Winner
Alhambra Love Songs
Dreamachines
Nosferatu
The Gnostic Preludes
The Mysteries
In Lambeth: Visions from the Walled Gardens of William Blake
The Book of Angels, Vol. 10 - Lucifer: Bar Kokhba Plays Masada Book Two
The Book of Angels, Vol. 20 - Tap: Pat Metheny Plays Masada Book Two
The Leaves of Grass
In Search of the Miraculous
The Big Gundown: John Zorn Plays the Music of Ennio Morricone
The Gift
The Mockingbird
Pellucidar: A Dreamers Fantabula
The Painted Bird
True Discoveries of Witches & Demons
Quote from: α | ì Æ ñ on September 04, 2017, 08:43:59 PM
MI, what do you think of those 'Simulacrum project' albums? I see you got The Painted Bird in there.
I bet you love the Gnostic Trio ;)
I loooove Nosferatu, such a great album (inspired by several great classic movies :D )
I don't know the Simulacrum project albums unfortunately --- I just bought
The Painted Bird on a whim (and liked what I heard via the audio samples). Oh yes, I love the Gnostic Trio, but The Dreamers are very good, too. I also like a good bit of Zorn's earlier work, especially
Godard/Spillane and
The Big Gundown. From the list above, what else do you know and love?
Quote from: α | ì Æ ñ on September 04, 2017, 08:53:34 PM
The Painted Bird is like the 3rd/4th album in that project, cool organ trio-ish concept series! (if you're into it)
I'll have to check out the rest of their recordings. Thanks for the heads up. I've been kind of out of the Zorn loop --- the guy just releases so much that it's difficult to keep track sometimes.
Quote from: α | ì Æ ñ on September 04, 2017, 08:53:34 PMBILL FUCKING FRISELL :-* :-*
Thankfully, the other musicians: Carol Emanuel and Kenny Wollesen are just as wonderful. :)
Quote from: α | ì Æ ñ on September 04, 2017, 08:53:34 PMAll of it :P (apart from a few of the filmworks ones...) :D
How much do you own of Zorn? Of course, I own the physical discs and I'm thankful that I do as so much of the packaging for these recordings is simply beautiful.
Quote from: Mirror Image on September 04, 2017, 08:10:14 PM
Let's see I own the following Zorn recordings (in no particular order):
...
Such a big list and not a single Masada (the group that is, and book one, that is) album? Still my favorite band of his, I think - followed by Bar Kokhba and The Dreamers I would say ... but I love Masada Book II as well, although I still miss plenty of volumes.
Just in case, here's my Zorn list (roughly by recording date, and clearly focused on jazz - not much of a surprise):
The Big Gundown - Zorn Plays the Music of Ennio Morricone
News for Lulu
Cobra
More News for Lulu
Filmworks III: 1990-1995
Masada 1 - Alef
Masada 2 - Beit
Masada 3 - Gimel
Masada 4 - Dalet
Masada 5 - Hei
Masada 6 - Vav
Masada – Live in Taipei 1995 (live)
Masada 7 - Zayin
Masada 8 - Het
Masada 9 - Tet
Masada 10 - Yod
Masada 1994-1997 - Sanhedrin - Unreleased Studio Recordings
The Circle Maker: Issachar / Zevulun
Taboo and Exile (Music Romance Series Vol. 2)
Filmworks IX: Trembling Before G-d
The Gift (Music Romance Series Vol. 3)
Cobra - Game Pieces Vol. 2
Filmworks XII: 2002 Volume Two, Three Documentaries
50th Birthday Celebration Vol. 4: Electric Masada (live)
50th Birthday Celebration Vol. 7: Masada (live)
50th Birthday Celebration Vol. 11: Bar Kokhba Sextet (live)
Flimworks XIV: Hiding and Seeking
Filmworks XVII: Notes on Marie Menken - Ray Bandar: A Life with Skulls
Filmworks XVIII: The Treatment
Bar Kokhba - Masada Book Two: The Book of Angels Vol. 10: Lucifer
Filmworks XIX: The Rain Horse
Filmworks XX: Sholem Aleichem
Alhambra Love Songs
Filmworks XXIII: El General
The Dreamers - O'o
Masada Quintet - Masada Book Two: The Book of Angels Vol. 12: Stolas
The Dreamers - Masada Book Two: The Book of Angels Vol. 14: Ipos
Nova Express
The Gnostic Preludes
plus more from Masada Book Two:
Blumenkranz, Shanir Ezra - Masada Book Two: The Book of Angels Vol. 19 - Abraxas
Cracow Klezmer Band - Masada Book Two: The Book of Angels Vol. 5: Balan
Klezmerson - Masada Book Two: The Book of Angels Vol. 24: Klezmerson - Amon
Metheny, Pat - Masada Book Two: The Book of Angels Vol. 20: Pat Metheny
Mycale - Masada Book Two: The Book of Angels Vol. 13: Mycale
Mycale - Masada Book Two: The Book of Angels Vol. 25: Mycale - Gomory
Ribot, Marc - Masada Book Two: The Book of Angels Vol. 7: Asmodeus
Rodriguez, Roberto - Masada Book Two: Book of Angels Vol. 23: Aguares
Saft, Jamie - Masada Book Two: The Book of Angels Vol. 1: Astaroth
Secret Chiefs 3 - Masada Book Two: The Book of Angels Vol. 9: Xaphan
Quote from: king ubu on September 04, 2017, 09:59:11 PM
Such a big list and not a single Masada (the group that is, and book one, that is) album? Still my favorite band of his, I think - followed by Bar Kokhba and The Dreamers I would say ... but I love Masada Book II as well, although I still miss plenty of volumes.
Masada were 'okay'. Not really my thing. I prefer either a guitarist or a pianist in any type of jazz group. I collect what interests me (obviously). :)
Quote from: Mirror Image on September 05, 2017, 08:03:15 PM
Masada were 'okay'. Not really my thing. I prefer either a guitarist or a pianist in any type of jazz group. I collect what interests me (obviously). :)
Okay, cool ... and myself I love the harmonically open atmosphere of piano- (and guitar)-less groups in jazz (i.e. Sonny Rollins playing in trio format, Ornette Coleman Quartet ... and Masada (which is a group heavily influenced by the OC4, for sure, though I'm not sure I ever heard Zorn talk about Ornette).
Btw, this is the programme I saw live just about a year ago - two blocks of roughly two hours, combining three 40 minutes sets (I guess Zorn - who sat at the stage entry, invisble for most of the audience, when he was not playing - was watching the clock), all of the stuff built up on stage and musicians just more or less leaving while the new ones arrived (and some horn mics and note stands were quickly brought to the centre or taken away). This was really really cool:
Masada QuartetJohn Zorn (as)
Dave Douglas (t)
Greg Cohen (b)
Joey Baron (d)
Banquet of the Spirits plays Masada — The Book BeriahShanir Blumenkranz (b)
Tim Keiper (d)
Brian Marsella (keys)
Cyro Baptista (perc)
Cleric plays Masada -The Book BeriahMatt Hollenberg (g)
Nick Shellenberger (keys, voc)
Dan Kennedy (b)
Larry Kwartowitz (d)
SimulacrumJohn Medeski (org)
Matt Hollenberg (g)
Kenny Grohowski (d)
Gyan Riley and Julian Lage play The BagatellesGyan Riley (g)
Julian Lage (g)
Asmodeus plays The BagatellesMarc Ribot (g)
Trevor Dunn (b)
Tyshawn Sorey (d)
John Zorn (cond)
I'm not particuarly into metal or hard rock or whatever you may call it, thus I found Cleric somewhat boring ... but I did enjoy Asmodeus, and Simulacrum as well. The other three sets were right down my alley anyway, with the guitar duo (two acoustics) being the pleasant surprise, as I had little idea what to expect (I knew Lage's trio before that, but never heard anything by Terry Riley's son before - or since, I'm afraid)
I've been listening to Momento Mori. It seems a really distinctive and original voice, serious and not unattractive. If there's more stuff like this, I'd like to know.
I'm not familiar with Zorn's music, never really thought I'd enjoy it (though I'd have purchased his Sonny Clark tribute stuff if reasonably available), but noticed an interesting disc at Berkshire today.
Sonic Rivers on Tzadik with Wadada Leo Smith and George Lewis.
I put it in a cart for my next (time and contents TBD) order.
The quartet I was listening, memento mori, seems at first glance very episodic and incoherent as a complete structure, but the episodes are attractive, bold in fact. There's no kitsch, no romanticism, it's not tonal; there's extreme instrumental techniques. A serious post 1968 anti-bourgeois statement à la Darmstadt!
Quote from: Mandryka on June 23, 2020, 11:44:36 PM
The quartet I was listening, momento mori, seems at first glance very episodic and incoherent as a complete structure, but the episodes are attractive, bold in fact. There's no kitsch, no romanticism, it's not tonal; there's extreme instrumental techniques. A serious post 1968 anti-bourgeois statement à la Darmstadt!
Zorn just writes whatever he feels like, from post-serial colouristic gestural music like this, to hard electronica/noise, to kitschy easy listening lounge stuff, to jazz and rock (often with extensive use of sampling), to vaguely Schoenbergian notes-and-rhythms early-20th-century sounding music, etc. From a composer's point of view, it's a very appealing approach. From a listener's point of view, it's impossible to know what to listen to next because at least half his genres are of minimal interest to me.
[What I have at the moment:
4 Quartets - Quatuor Moliniari
4 Quartets - Zorn Quartet
Pandora's Box - Arditti Quartet
For Your Eyes Only - Yuji Takahashi
Carny - Steffen Schleiermacher
Cobra [hatology]
Aporias
The Book of Heads
Chimeras
Enigmata
Goetia / Gris-Gris / Shibboleth [Tzadik]
The Gnostic Preludes
Apophthegms / Passagen / Ceremonial Magic [Tzadik]
Le Mômo / Untitled / Amour Fou [Tzadik]
Necronomicon / Sortilège [Tzadik]
The Tempest / All Hallows' Eve / The Temptations of St. Anthony [Tzadik]
Songs from the Hermetic Theatre
Rituals
Apart from the string quartets & sometimes Cobra or Aporias I honestly don't listen to the rest that often.]
Quote from: Mandryka on June 23, 2020, 11:44:36 PM
The quartet I was listening, momento mori, seems at first glance very episodic and incoherent as a complete structure, but the episodes are attractive, bold in fact. There's no kitsch, no romanticism, it's not tonal; there's extreme instrumental techniques. A serious post 1968 anti-bourgeois statement à la Darmstadt!
An engaging piece that Memento Mori! Thanks for posting. Listened to it on the Molinari Quartet recording, then heard Cat O'Nine tails on the same cd which I liked. A touch of Ives/Schnittke perhaps in its polystylism, though obviously very different.
The only John Zorn I can recall ever hearing was the Naked City album, which is completely different again.
Anyway, ta, will be checking him out further.
Am I right to think that Memento Mori is totally free form intuitive music, a chain of unrelated gestures?
I very much like it whatever it is. I guess I've got used to formless music, my standards are falling. ;)
Someone said to me that he thought that Lachenmann had taken instrumental musique concrète to its limits - listening to this I'm not sure, Zorn has his own voice, and it's an attractive one.
Quote from: king ubu on September 05, 2017, 11:58:46 AM
Masada 1 - Alef
Masada 2 - Beit
Masada 3 - Gimel
Masada 4 - Dalet
Masada 5 - Hei
Masada 6 - Vav
Masada – Live in Taipei 1995 (live)
Masada 7 - Zayin
Masada 8 - Het
Masada 9 - Tet
Masada 10 - Yod
Masada 1994-1997 - Sanhedrin - Unreleased Studio Recordings
For me what
king ubu posted here are the John Zorn I listen to, these and there are a few more live Masada albums. And all of these are excellent, IMO.
Quote from: Old San Antone on June 25, 2020, 11:42:41 AM
For me what king ubu posted here are the John Zorn I listen to, these and there are a few more live Masada albums. And all of these are excellent, IMO.
What's Zorn's contribution there - is it freely improvised, has he written some sort of framework for improvisation, composed a traditional score, or what?
Quote from: Mandryka on June 27, 2020, 08:30:54 AM
What's Zorn's contribution there - is it freely improvised, has he written some sort of framework for improvisation, composed a traditional score, or what?
I am not interested how the music was conceived, or even what Zorn's role was, although I would imagine that as leader his contribution was considerable. I just enjoy the music by this group.
Although I have listened to much of his recorded music (I probably have over 50 different recordings), most of it does not interest me nearly as much as his recordings with the original Masada.
Quote from: Old San Antone on June 27, 2020, 09:31:33 AM
I am not interested how the music was conceived, or even what Zorn's role was
Oh
Quote from: Old San Antone on June 27, 2020, 09:31:33 AM
I am not interested how the music was conceived, or even what Zorn's role was ...
Quote from: Mandryka on June 27, 2020, 10:37:05 AM
Oh
Well, yes. My interest is in the
music, not in how or why it came into existence or who was more or less responsible. None of that information is relevant, for me, when I listen to a piece of music, or experience any work of art. In fact it gets in the way of hearing the music or seeing a painting.
(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/71vgWeLCZCL._AC_SL1200_.jpg)
This album, called What Thou Wilt, is very much worth a listen I think. Normally I don't like piano music but the long piece here, fay ce que voudras, isn't bad at all.