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The Music Room => General Classical Music Discussion => The Polling Station => Topic started by: Mirror Image on March 08, 2014, 07:24:13 PM

Title: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on March 08, 2014, 07:24:13 PM
I'll start...

1. Ravel -

(http://redingote.fr/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/maurice-ravel.jpeg)

2. Bartok -

(http://www.fuguemasters.com/bartok_3.jpg)

3. Stravinsky -

(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-MDFdJmGtrIo/UaTiznAIi2I/AAAAAAAABUU/XOBXP8yUKY8/s1600/Igor+Stravinsky.jpg)

4. Poulenc -

(http://www.aveyron.com/histoire/pixs_histoire/poulenc.jpg)

5. Shostakovich -

(http://www.remusik.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/Dmitry-Shostakovich.jpg)

6. Villa-Lobos -

(http://burdelov.narod.ru/Musik/Foto/Vila-Lobos.jpg)

7. Vaughan Williams -

(http://www.thesundaytimes.co.uk/sto/multimedia/archive/00060/Ralph-Vaughan-Willia_60619a.jpg)

8. Szymanowski -

(http://www.patriciomolina.cl/images/H%20Szymanowski%201.jpg)

9. Janacek -

(http://assets5.classicfm.com/2009/05/leos-janacek-1233585104-view-1.jpg)

10. Berg -

(http://www.universaledition.com/tl_files/Komponisten/Berg/Alban-Berg-300px.jpg)

Of course, there have been many changes throughout the years, but these composers have always been pretty much on top for me. Okay, your turn! 8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on March 08, 2014, 07:29:32 PM
John, what is your email address? I want to send you my latest app. A button that reads "Press here to move Shostakovich down." It's still in beta testing but I can see you need one desperately.

 >:D >:D >:D :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: >:D >:D

 ;)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on March 08, 2014, 07:32:13 PM
John, what is your email address? I want to send you my latest app. A button that reads "Press here to move Shostakovich down." It's still in beta testing but I can see you need one desperately.

 >:D >:D >:D :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: >:D >:D

 ;)

:D Haha. I love Shostakovich's music, though, so I could never keep him below the 5th ranking. I'll be curious to see your list....
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on March 08, 2014, 07:45:44 PM
First place is easy. JS Bach.
So second place is empty. ;D
From there, you mean now or lifetime? Mozart would be next if we integrated over the past nearly 40 years. He'd be lower now since, knowing the music so well ( crack my skull and you will hear PC 21 leak out) I listen only occasionally. So my answer will lifetime. More or less this order, after Mozart.
Stravinsky.
Schubert.
Beethoven.
Palestrina.
Josquin.
Brahms.
Bruckner.
Schutz. Or maybe Glass or Nyman.
 Edited to fix typing oversight of Brahms

The most important in having changed my life and my musical listening are Tchaikovsky and Glass. Each has been for a while 1 or 2. I confess that for a brief period of madness Mahler was in top spot, but I'd better say no more on that topic  :)

In terms of this past few months Haydn makes top 3, but long term not.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: TheGSMoeller on March 08, 2014, 07:47:24 PM
Funny, there was a top 25 composers thread two years ago, and I found it! Here was my top 10 from 2 years ago...

Richard Strauss
William Byrd
Heinrich I. F. Biber
Jean-Philippe Rameau
Franz Joseph Haydn
Hector Berlioz
Charles Ives
Sergei Prokofiev
Benjamin Britten
Philip Glass

...and it's safe to say it has changed a bit. I would definitely remove Byrd and even Ives and replace them with Bruckner, Poulenc or Brahms.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on March 08, 2014, 07:51:15 PM
First place is easy. JS Bach.
So second place is empty. ;D
From there, you mean now or lifetime? Mozart would be next if we integrated over the past nearly 40 years. He'd be lower now since, knowing the music so well ( crack my skull and you will hear PC 21 leak out) I listen only occasionally. So my answer will lifetime. More or less this order.
Stravinsky.
Schubert.
Beethoven.
Palestrina.
Josquin.
Bruckner.
Schutz. Or maybe Glass or Nyman.


The most important in having changed my life and my musical listening are Tchaikovsky and Glass. Each has been for a while 1 or 2. I confess that for a brief period of madness Mahler was in top spot, but I'd better say no more on that topic  :)

In terms of this past few months Haydn makes top 3, but long term not.

Well, I'm really talking about your all-time favorites. Surprised to see Bruckner on your list. He used to be high on my list, but over the past couple of years I haven't been really interested in hearing any of his music. I do like his music a lot no question about it. Mahler I can take or leave. Mostly leave, although I do still love Symphonies 5 & 7.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on March 08, 2014, 07:52:56 PM
Funny, there was a top 25 composers thread two years ago, and I found it! Here was my top 10 from 2 years ago...

...and it's safe to say it has changed a bit. I would definitely remove Byrd and even Ives and replace them with Bruckner, Poulenc or Brahms.

Good to see Poulenc would be on your list. I, obviously, feel the same way. 8) Surprised that you would replace Ives, though, but our tastes seem to change and we really can't control them, so my hat is off to you for accepted those changes and moving on with it.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on March 08, 2014, 07:57:38 PM
Well, I'm really talking about your all-time favorites. Surprised to see Bruckner on your list. He used to be high on my list, but over the past couple of years I haven't been really interested in hearing any of his music. I do like his music a lot no question about it. Mahler I can take or leave. Mostly leave, although I do still love Symphonies 5 & 7.
Bruckner is another lifetime thing. I listen a lot less now, and there just isn't that much music.
But central for a long time.
Sibelius is off the list but he wrote my favorite piece (#7). I like his music but only love 5 and 7.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: TheGSMoeller on March 08, 2014, 07:58:01 PM
Good to see Poulenc would be on your list. I, obviously, feel the same way. 8) Surprised that you would replace Ives, though, but our tastes seem to change and we really can't control them, so my hat is off to you for accepted those changes and moving on with it.

You know as well as anyone here that tastes change.  ;)
And my omission of Ives doesn't in any way diminish my admiration for his music, but I have had a re-discovery of sorts of Bruckner's music and a new discovery of Brahms chamber works that have out weighed my Ives listening these past years.

Now looking at the rest of the 25 list I'm leaving out some heave hitters, honestly you could mix and match any of these with my top ten and I'd be pleased.  ;D

John Dowland
Claudio Monteverdi
J.S. Bach
Antonio Vivaldi
Georg Philipp Telemann
W. A. Mozart
Franz Schubert
Edward Elgar
Alban Berg
Francis Poulenc
Alfred Schnittke
Michael Nyman
Pascal Dusapin
David Lang
Paul Schoenfield
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on March 08, 2014, 08:05:22 PM
Now hang on, wasn't this Top Three before?

1. Beethoven
2. Dvorak
T3. Chopin
T3. Schubert
5. Ravel
6. Janacek
7. Berlioz
8. Haydn
9. Martinu
10. Tchaikovsky
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on March 08, 2014, 08:06:35 PM
You know as well as anyone here that tastes change.  ;)
And my omission of Ives doesn't in any way diminish my admiration for his music, but I have had a re-discovery of sorts of Bruckner's music and a new discovery of Brahms chamber works that have out weighed my Ives listening these past years.

Now looking at the rest of the 25 list I'm leaving out some heave hitters, honestly you could mix and match any of these with my top ten and I'd be pleased.  ;D

Very true. Tastes do change indeed. Like for example I left off Prokofiev, Martinu, Debussy, Sibelius, Koechlin, Hartmann, among others, but I still admire, and love, their music, but narrowing down my choices was pretty easy for me.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on March 08, 2014, 08:07:32 PM
Bruckner is another lifetime thing. I listen a lot less now, and there just isn't that much music.
But central for a long time.
Sibelius is off the list but he wrote my favorite piece (#7). I like his music but only love 5 and 7.

I love Sibelius but just couldn't include him on my top 10 because I love other composers much more.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on March 08, 2014, 08:08:31 PM
Now hang on, wasn't this Top Three before?

1. Beethoven
2. Dvorak
T3. Chopin
T3. Schubert
5. Ravel
6. Janacek
7. Haydn
8. Martinu
9. Tchaikovsky
10. Mingus

 :P

Nice list, Brian, especially Ravel, Janacek, and Martinu. 8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on March 08, 2014, 08:11:48 PM
Just realized Berlioz was missing and changed my list. I'm sad I had to give Charles Mingus the boot.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on March 08, 2014, 08:13:20 PM
:P

Nice list, Brian, especially Ravel, Janacek, and Martinu. 8)
Isn't that funny. I thought Nice list Brian, especially Schubert and Beethoven.
Must be the close birthdays explains why we think alike.  8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on March 08, 2014, 08:37:58 PM
Isn't that funny. I thought Nice list Brian, especially Schubert and Beethoven.
Must be the close birthdays explains why we think alike.  8)

Haha...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Dancing Divertimentian on March 08, 2014, 09:14:03 PM
I'm sad I had to give Charles Mingus the boot.

 :D +1


Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Dancing Divertimentian on March 08, 2014, 09:38:23 PM
...and a new discovery of Brahms chamber works that have out weighed my Ives listening these past years.

Brahms's chamber works with piano are some of my favorite pieces of all (along with the piano concertos). Brahms being a pianist himself it seems to me the whole piano/chamber group interacting thing was a big challenge to him and something he reveled in.

The piano quartets, the sonatas for clarinet and piano, the piano quintet, the piano trios, the sonatas for violin and piano...for me these works rank way up there as far as greatest works ever written.

I guess it helps that I love the piano.


Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Philo on March 08, 2014, 09:38:56 PM
01. Handel
02. Schumann
03. Satie
04. Lim
05. Gornicka
06. Messiaen
07. Haydn
08. Liszt
09. Berg
10. Ptaszynska
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Dancing Divertimentian on March 08, 2014, 09:43:20 PM
...and the sonatas for cello and piano...


Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on March 08, 2014, 09:44:01 PM
Brahms's chamber works with piano are some of my favorite pieces of all (along with the piano concertos). Brahms being a pianist himself it seems to me the whole piano/chamber group interacting thing was a big challenge to him and something he reveled in.

The piano quartets, the sonatas for clarinet and piano, the piano quintet, the piano trios, the sonatas for violin and piano...for me these works rank way up there as far as greatest works ever written.

I guess it helps that I love the piano.
Eek. I left Brahms off. That was an accident as I listed 9 spots.
I add Brahms ahead of Bruckner.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on March 08, 2014, 09:46:37 PM
...and the sonatas for cello and piano...
And the string quintets
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on March 08, 2014, 09:51:24 PM
This composer is slowly finding his way into my top 10...

(http://blogs.medici.tv/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/henri-dutilleux1.jpg)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on March 08, 2014, 09:53:30 PM
This man is slowly finding his way into my top 10...

(http://blogs.medici.tv/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/henri-dutilleux1.jpg)
My button is almost done; slot 5 should be available by morning.

  0:)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on March 08, 2014, 09:58:46 PM
My button is almost done; slot 5 should be available by morning.

  0:)

:D What do you think about Dutilleux's music, Ken? He's been a composer I've become more and more fascinated by throughout the years. Naturally seen as an extension of what Debussy and Ravel were doing, but it seems his star is still on the rise. So many box sets have already come out in the last few years. I think I own them all now. 8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Dancing Divertimentian on March 08, 2014, 10:21:20 PM
And the string quintets

Can't argue with that. :)


Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on March 08, 2014, 10:31:35 PM
:D What do you think about Dutilleux's music, Ken? He's been a composer I've become more and more fascinated by throughout the years. Naturally seen as an extension of what Debussy and Ravel were doing, but it seems his star is still on the rise. So many box sets have already come out in the last few years. I think I own them all now. 8)
He wasn't on my radar at all until about 2 years ago, just a name, until I picked up the symphonies used. I like the symphonies a lot. I see Honegger more than Ravel actually, and Roussell. But I haven't heard much beyond those and the cello concerto (which I wish sounf more like Honegger  :) ) so I can't say much. Any box you recommend, especially to a devotee of the SDCB?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on March 08, 2014, 10:33:43 PM
He wasn't on my radar at all until about 2 years ago, just a name, until I picked up the symphonies used. I like the symphonies a lot. I see Honegger more than Ravel actually, and Roussell. But I haven't heard much beyond those and the cello concerto (which I wish sounf more like Honegger  :) ) so I can't say much. Any box you recommend, especially to a devotee of the SDCB?

I think Dutilleux absorbed a bit of Bartok, too. 8) Which recording of the symphonies do you own? From here, I can give a recommendation for a box set.
Title: Re: Your Top 12 Favorite Composers
Post by: Moonfish on March 08, 2014, 10:34:38 PM
1. Bach
2. Haydn
3. Verdi
4. Wagner
5. Beethoven
6. Mozart
7. Schubert
8. Chopin
9. Debussy
10. Sibelius
11. Handel
12. Marais
 >:D

Traditional list, eh?

(http://www.orpheon.org/OldSite/Bildmaterial/MaraisBustsm.jpg)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: DavidW on March 08, 2014, 10:39:01 PM
In alphabetical order. :)

Bach
Beethoven
Brahms
Dvorak
Haydn
Mahler
Mozart
Schubert
Shostakovich
Stravinsky
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on March 08, 2014, 10:41:38 PM
I think Dutilleux absorbed a bit of Bartok, too. 8) Which recording of the symphonies do you own? From here, I can give a recommendation for a box set.
Tortelier, and Plasson on EMI, so I have them twice.
Title: Re: Your Top 12 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on March 08, 2014, 10:44:37 PM
1. Bach
2. Haydn
3. Verdi
4. Wagner
5. Beethoven
6. Mozart
7. Schubert
8. Chopin
9. Debussy
10. Sibelius
11. Handel
12. Marais
 >:D

Traditional list, eh?

(http://www.orpheon.org/OldSite/Bildmaterial/MaraisBustsm.jpg)

Even more so than mine!
You know Purcell's music for viola da gamba, or Locke's? I assume you know Saint Colombe ...
Excellent stuff, a Maraisian would like it.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on March 08, 2014, 10:47:04 PM
Tortelier, and Plasson on EMI, so I have them twice.

Okay, I would say go for the Graf on Arte Nova. This can actually be purchased as a set via Amazon France now. Graf brings a Boulezian sense of clarity to the music that you don't always get with say Tortelier. While I wouldn't want to be without Tortelier, I think Graf's performances bring the music into a sharper focus, but sometimes I like getting lost in the more dreamy, atmospheric performances of Tortelier. I had Plasson but I gave it away. I thought he didn't bring anything to the musical table at all. It just seemed like an underrehearsed, rush-to-get it recorded job to these ears.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: DavidW on March 08, 2014, 10:49:06 PM
I like your list Moonfish. :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on March 08, 2014, 10:50:39 PM
Okay, I would say go for the Graf on Arte Nova. This can actually be purchased as a set via Amazon France now. Graf brings a Boulezian sense of clarity to the music that you don't always get with say Tortelier. While I wouldn't want to be without Tortelier, I think Graf's performances bring the into a sharper focus, but sometimes I like getting lost in the more dreamy, atmospheric performances of Tortelier. I had Plasson but I gave it away. I thought he didn't bring anything to the musical table at all. It just seemed like an underrehearsed, rush-to-get it recorded job to these ears.
Merci beaucoup.
I got Plasson as part of his French music box, which my store sold me cheap. A useful way to get a lot of listen once music ...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: amw on March 08, 2014, 10:51:17 PM
From the other thread—this about covers it in terms of overall influence on my life & listening habits.
Quote
Beethoven (especially the late quartets & piano sonatas)
...
Schumann (early piano works, songs from 1840)
...
...
...
...
Schubert (late chamber music & piano sonatas)
...
Bartók (string quartets & orchestral music)
Brahms (chamber music & piano works)
...
...
...
...
Mozart (piano concertos, string quintets & quartets, Da Ponte operas)
Haydn (string quartets, piano trios & symphonies)
Bach (keyboard music)
...
Chopin (Ballades, Scherzi, Polonaise-Fantasie, Sonatas, Mazurkas, Preludes)
...
...
Dvořák (symphonies, concertos, chamber music)
Ligeti (orchestral works, chamber & electronic music)
Medtner (sonatas, chamber music, Forgotten Melodies)
Cage (prepared piano music, number pieces, etudes, String Quartet in Four Parts)
Webern (entire output)
Nono (orchestral, choral & electronic music)
Stockhausen (chamber & electronic music)
Stravinsky (middle & late works)
(etc)
Bach used to be in the top 5, but I'm not sure where. I think I just stopped listening to his music nearly as much after a while, allowing Brahms to creep in. The other top 4 have been steady for awhile.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Moonfish on March 08, 2014, 10:58:19 PM
I like your list Moonfish. :)

Thank you David!  :)  I always struggle with lists as there are so many amazing composers. I kind of wanted to toss in Liszt, Mahler, Bruckner and Vaughan Williams as well but.....    I realize that I need to expand (at least expose myself) to the 20th century a bit more. Your list is more balanced in that sense!!
Title: Re: Your Top 12 Favorite Composers
Post by: Moonfish on March 08, 2014, 11:31:33 PM
Even more so than mine!
You know Purcell's music for viola da gamba, or Locke's? I assume you know Saint Colombe ...
Excellent stuff, a Maraisian would like it.
They are all wonders. Purcell's chamber music can be quite pleasant, but Marais is the beauty of melancholy incarnated.  You seem to have a wide range of composers.  I like how you view your own list as extremely dynamic in the light of the years you have listened to classical music. It is strange how one's beloved works suddenly go "quiet" after having been examined so closely (like your PC 21). Perhaps one simply strives towards new musical experiences - the holy grail of music? The list keeps changing.....
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: EigenUser on May 17, 2014, 04:06:38 AM
New top 10:
1) Bartok*
2) Ligeti**
3) Ravel**
4) Debussy
5) Messiaen
6) Gershwin
7) Haydn***
8) Feldman
9) Mendelssohn
10) Schumann

*Never changes, though I haven't been listening to his music so much recently (because I pretty much know it all inside-out).
**2 and 3 are equal -- I just put them in alphabetical order to avoid bias.
***I've been discovering his symphonies and never cease to be impressed (far be it from me to say ;)).
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: EigenUser on May 17, 2014, 04:20:27 AM
Johann Sebastian Bach
Richard Wagner
Gabriel Fauré
Claude Debussy
Maurice Ravel
Igor Stravinsky
Béla Bartók
Anton Webern
György Ligeti
Karlheinz Stockhausen

Nice! I struggle Wagner, Webern, and Stockhausen, but that's an awesome list!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 17, 2014, 07:07:50 AM
New top 10:
1) Bartok*
2) Ligeti**
3) Ravel**
4) Debussy
5) Messiaen
6) Gershwin
7) Haydn***
8) Feldman
9) Mendelssohn
10) Schumann

*Never changes, though I haven't been listening to his music so much recently (because I pretty much know it all inside-out).
**2 and 3 are equal -- I just put them in alphabetical order to avoid bias.
***I've been discovering his symphonies and never cease to be impressed (far be it from me to say ;)).
A relief. I feared we were losing you to the Boulhausen crowd.
I really think you'd like medieval stuff, Leonin, Machaut, or some of the dissonant renaissance folks like Gombert or Richafort. I might start a thread on this ...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: EigenUser on May 17, 2014, 09:29:56 AM
Lol, I just realized that the combination of characters '8' + ')' = '8)' . So apparently Feldman is cooler than the others. 8).

I really think you'd like medieval stuff, Leonin, Machaut, or some of the dissonant renaissance folks like Gombert or Richafort. I might start a thread on this ...
I'll check it out. I've always found the idea of medieval music interesting for historical reasons, but I haven't really heard anything I've enjoyed.

A relief. I feared we were losing you to the Boulhausen crowd.
I've come to realize how important these guys were in music history. Furthermore, it isn't so much the music I enjoy as it is the ideas and the development. Plus, I always want to keep my ears open just in case there is something there for me. I can't ever imagine Stockhausen or even Boulez showing up on any finite-numbered list of favorite composers (I could be wrong), but it is fun to discover new things. There is also enough stuff going on in that music so that I don't get bored while exploring (even if there is stuff that I don't think sounds particularly good to me, either).
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 17, 2014, 09:45:34 AM
Lol, I just realized that the combination of characters '8' + ')' = '8)' . So apparently Feldman is cooler than the others. 8).
I'll check it out. I've always found the idea of medieval music interesting for historical reasons, but I haven't really heard anything I've enjoyed.
I've come to realize how important these guys were in music history. Furthermore, it isn't so much the music I enjoy as it is the ideas and the development. Plus, I always want to keep my ears open just in case there is something there for me. I can't ever imagine Stockhausen or even Boulez showing up on any finite-numbered list of favorite composers (I could be wrong), but it is fun to discover new things. There is also enough stuff going on in that music so that I don't get bored while exploring (even if there is stuff that I don't think sounds particularly good to me, either).
Well I am all for exploration. When I was in radio I was a bit notorious for avoiding standard repertoire. (I even programmed Le Marteau sans  Maitre). (And lots of Debussy piano.)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: EigenUser on May 17, 2014, 09:58:14 AM
Well I am all for exploration. When I was in radio I was a bit notorious for avoiding standard repertoire. (I even programmed Le Marteau sans  Maitre). (And lots of Debussy piano.)
I wish stations would play stuff like this! Not only does it do harm to this music (because it goes unheard by most), but it also is bad for what they do play because gives the false impression that the only thing useful in 'classical' era music is for background music. Especially now that I am exploring Haydn, I think that this might be why I was reluctant to do so in the first place.

Like Ives said, people have sissy-ears. Would the world really come to an end if, for once, the DC-area classical station aired "Lontano"? The most daring thing I've heard them play was the waltz from one of Shostakovich's jazz suites.

On the other hand, the radio station at my university had an hour (around 10AM) where they would play the most grating, jarring, and dissonant music known (usually string quartets -- probably Penderecki, Holliger, Kagel, etc.). This station was always playing in the machine shop all day, so whenever I was working during the "modern" hour this music was always accompanied by the sound of aluminum being milled and lathed. Often, the sounds were indistinguishable :).
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 17, 2014, 10:56:42 AM
I wish stations would play stuff like this! Not only does it do harm to this music (because it goes unheard by most), but it also is bad for what they do play because gives the false impression that the only thing useful in 'classical' era music is for background music. Especially now that I am exploring Haydn, I think that this might be why I was reluctant to do so in the first place.

Like Ives said, people have sissy-ears. Would the world really come to an end if, for once, the DC-area classical station aired "Lontano"? The most daring thing I've heard them play was the waltz from one of Shostakovich's jazz suites.

On the other hand, the radio station at my university had an hour (around 10AM) where they would play the most grating, jarring, and dissonant music known (usually string quartets -- probably Penderecki, Holliger, Kagel, etc.). This station was always playing in the machine shop all day, so whenever I was working during the "modern" hour this music was always accompanied by the sound of aluminum being milled and lathed. Often, the sounds were indistinguishable :).
I am a big believer in getting past the standard repertoire. There is great music over a span of more than 800 years. I sympathize with cautious concert goers. Concerts are expensive what with babysitting etc. But radio is free: the place to experiment and explore.
I was classical director of two radio stations, one the university and one commercial. For about a year, before the CBC was available in town, I semi controlled 100% of the classical radio. The U station had several people who did their own programming but would ask me for suggestions. Over 52 hours air time a week. I even played Stimmung. Twice. When I lived in Cincinnati the local classical station was all Mozart, and Appalachian Spring.  >:(
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: EigenUser on May 17, 2014, 11:57:58 AM
I am a big believer in getting past the standard repertoire. There is great music over a span of more than 800 years. I sympathize with cautious concert goers. Concerts are expensive what with babysitting etc. But radio is free: the place to experiment and explore.
I was classical director of two radio stations, one the university and one commercial. For about a year, before the CBC was available in town, I semi controlled 100% of the classical radio. The U station had several people who did their own programming but would ask me for suggestions. Over 52 hours air time a week. I even played Stimmung. Twice. When I lived in Cincinnati the local classical station was all Mozart, and Appalachian Spring.  >:(
That's awesome. Imagine turning on the classical station and getting a group of people singing AYE-EE-EYE-OO-AA-EE-AYE-YOU-EE-OH...

Concerts really irritate me, too, and the NSO has really suck-y repertoire. I love how they advertise an "all-Mozart concert" as if it is some huge feat that has never been done before. My ideal concert would be something traditional (i.e. a Haydn symphony), something perplexing (i.e. Ligeti), and something mildly-modern that most people will still enjoy (i.e. Bartok's CFO, or a PC).
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 17, 2014, 12:04:35 PM
That's awesome. Imagine turning on the classical station and getting a group of people singing AYE-EE-EYE-OO-AA-EE-AYE-YOU-EE-OH...

Concerts really irritate me, too, and the NSO has really suck-y repertoire. I love how they advertise an "all-Mozart concert" as if it is some huge feat that has never been done before. My ideal concert would be something traditional (i.e. a Haydn symphony), something perplexing (i.e. Ligeti), and something mildly-modern that most people will still enjoy (i.e. Bartok's CFO, or a PC).
Yes. And if you look at what major American concerts where like before the Boulez Stockhausen crowd got into positions of cultural influence that's what a lot of them were.
It's also what a lot of Berlin Phil concerts look like these days, if you check their schedule.
You may thank the minimalists for making modern music saleable again.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: EigenUser on May 17, 2014, 12:18:27 PM
Yes. And if you look at what major American concerts where like before the Boulez Stockhausen crowd got into positions of cultural influence that's what a lot of them were.
It's also what a lot of Berlin Phil concerts look like these days, if you check their schedule.
You may thank the minimalists for making modern music saleable again.
I think that any kind of group that goes far out (i.e. serialists) gives the need for another polar-opposite group (minimalists, in that case) to ensure that there is something for everything. One can only hope that most composers will find their niche somewhere in between, and at a healthy distance from each. It doesn't mean that each end of the spectrum is bad at all -- just that it's nice to have variety. This is one thing I love about Ligeti -- he wrote whatever the hell he wanted to. He didn't let himself get labeled (at least, not easily) and he had control over his style -- not the other way around.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jaakko Keskinen on May 20, 2014, 07:33:37 AM
1. Richard Wagner (what a surprise!)
2. Ludvig van Beethoven
3. Johannes Brahms
4. Pyotr Ilyich Tchaikovsky
5. Jean Sibelius
6. Giuseppe Verdi
7. Richard Strauss
8. Anton Bruckner
9. Franz Schubert
10. Claude Debussy

In short: I'm a big romantic fan. Not that I don't enjoy modernism, classicism, baroque (although that was unfortunately a blind spot for me yet few years back) but romanticism just blows my mind. And like with many composers, I believe my favorites can change a lot although top 3 usually stays the same.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: EigenUser on June 22, 2014, 02:06:48 PM
New top 10:
1) Bartok*
2) Ligeti**
3) Ravel**
4) Debussy
5) Messiaen
6) Gershwin
7) Haydn***
8) Feldman
9) Mendelssohn
10) Schumann

*Never changes, though I haven't been listening to his music so much recently (because I pretty much know it all inside-out).
**2 and 3 are equal -- I just put them in alphabetical order to avoid bias.
***I've been discovering his symphonies and never cease to be impressed (far be it from me to say ;)).
It has changed!
1) Bartok*
2) Ligeti**
3) Ravel**
4) Debussy
5) Messiaen
6) Gershwin
7) Haydn***
8) Mendelssohn
9) Schumann
10) Mahler (!)

 :'( :'( :'(

Sorry Morty (you're 11, if that makes you feel better)!

I would bump Gershwin considering his small (yet amazing) classical output, but I'd feel too guilty since his life was cut short at 38.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on June 22, 2014, 02:42:13 PM
It has changed!
1) Bartok*
2) Ligeti**
3) Ravel**
4) Debussy
5) Messiaen
6) Gershwin
7) Haydn***
8) Mendelssohn
9) Schumann
10) Mahler (!)

 :'( :'( :'(

Sorry Morty (you're 11, if that makes you feel better)!

I would bump Gershwin considering his small (yet amazing) classical output, but I'd feel too guilty since his life was cut short at 38.

Don't worry mine changes almost every week. :) It's no surprise to see yours change.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on June 22, 2014, 02:43:41 PM
Don't worry mine changes almost every week. :) It's not surprise to see yours change.
I was gonna say "a new John is born" but restrained myself!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sergeant Rock on June 22, 2014, 03:04:21 PM
10) Mahler (!)

(http://photos.imageevent.com/sgtrock/asheville/bUTTHEAD.gif)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on June 22, 2014, 03:05:52 PM
I was gonna say "a new John is born" but restrained myself!

It's okay I'll say it: A NEW JOHN IS BORN!!!! :P
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: EigenUser on June 22, 2014, 05:14:43 PM
(http://photos.imageevent.com/sgtrock/asheville/bUTTHEAD.gif)
Yes. I caved. I really like Mahler now. I just wish everything he wrote wasn't so long. It makes me less inclined to want to listen on an impulse. I was blown away by the 7th, though. Totally blown away. The 1st, too.

I am going on a long car trip (Northern Virginia to central Maine) for July 4th so I need listening material. If you had to recommend one (1!) Mahler box (1-9) that is relatively inexpensive, what would it be? I'd like it to include "Das Lied van der Erde" and possibly "Das Knaben Wunderhorn", though the latter isn't so important.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on June 22, 2014, 05:35:39 PM
I am going on a long car trip (Northern Virginia to central Maine) for July 4th so I need listening material. If you had to recommend one (1!) Mahler box (1-9) that is relatively inexpensive, what would it be? I'd like it to include "Das Lied van der Erde" and possibly "Das Knaben Wunderhorn", though the latter isn't so important.

I'm no Mahler expert, but will guess the answer turns out to be Bertini.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on June 22, 2014, 06:15:22 PM
Yes. I caved. I really like Mahler now. I just wish everything he wrote wasn't so long. It makes me less inclined to want to listen on an impulse. I was blown away by the 7th, though. Totally blown away. The 1st, too.

I am going on a long car trip (Northern Virginia to central Maine) for July 4th so I need listening material. If you had to recommend one (1!) Mahler box (1-9) that is relatively inexpensive, what would it be? I'd like it to include "Das Lied van der Erde" and possibly "Das Knaben Wunderhorn", though the latter isn't so important.
Chailly.
It was absurdly cheap in Canada. Try amazon ca or grigorian com

The old abravanel set is downloadable for about a buck.

Levine has all but 2 and 8 plus 10, for $20 delivered at amazon.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Moonfish on June 22, 2014, 09:01:13 PM
Yes. I caved. I really like Mahler now. I just wish everything he wrote wasn't so long. It makes me less inclined to want to listen on an impulse. I was blown away by the 7th, though. Totally blown away. The 1st, too.

I am going on a long car trip (Northern Virginia to central Maine) for July 4th so I need listening material. If you had to recommend one (1!) Mahler box (1-9) that is relatively inexpensive, what would it be? I'd like it to include "Das Lied van der Erde" and possibly "Das Knaben Wunderhorn", though the latter isn't so important.

If I were you I would pick up Bernstein's first cycle. I think it is a good baseline (and pretty well renowned as far as I can recall), but you will definitely take off in many different directions as you dig deeper into the Mahler abyss. I would have skipped the cycle approach if I could start over (perhaps with exception for Bernstein and Kubelik)

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on June 24, 2014, 02:19:23 AM
Rather boring list of mine:
Beethoven
J. Haydn
W.A. Mozart
J.S. Bach
Brahms
Schubert
Handel
Schumann
Bartok
Mahler
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: EigenUser on June 24, 2014, 05:08:30 AM
Rather boring list of mine:
Beethoven
J. Haydn
W.A. Mozart
J.S. Bach
Brahms
Schubert
Handel
Schumann
Bartok
Mahler
That better not be boring! Four out of ten are on my list ;D.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: EigenUser on July 02, 2014, 01:07:56 AM
(http://photos.imageevent.com/sgtrock/asheville/bUTTHEAD.gif)
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/q9qo5qfqw710qkl/IT1amVXJLCGE.gif)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sergeant Rock on July 02, 2014, 02:21:54 AM
Yes. I caved. I really like Mahler now. I just wish everything he wrote wasn't so long. It makes me less inclined to want to listen on an impulse. I was blown away by the 7th, though. Totally blown away. The 1st, too.

I am going on a long car trip (Northern Virginia to central Maine) for July 4th so I need listening material. If you had to recommend one (1!) Mahler box (1-9) that is relatively inexpensive, what would it be? I'd like it to include "Das Lied van der Erde" and possibly "Das Knaben Wunderhorn", though the latter isn't so important.

The EMI box of the complete works, including the songs, can be had for 31 bucks from several Amazon sellers.




Sarge
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on July 02, 2014, 03:00:13 AM
The EMI box of the complete works, including the songs, can be had for 31 bucks from several Amazon sellers.

Sarge

+1

10 Reason to buy it now:

1. Giulini & CSO, No. 1
2. Klemperer's 2 & DLvdE with Ludwig & Wunderlich
3. Barbirolli's No. 6 & No. 9, and Rückert-Lieder with Baker
4. Horenstein's No. 4
5. Tennstedt's No. 5 & No. 8
6. Ferrier, Walter & Wieners in Kindertotenlieder
7. Rattle & CBSO's No. 7
8. Des Knaben Wunderhorn with Schwarzkopf, DF-D & Szell
9. Songs Of A Wayfarer with DF-D & Furtwaengler
10. the box is also an excellent paperweight.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ChamberNut on July 02, 2014, 03:28:41 AM
+1

10 Reason to buy it now:

1. Giulini & CSO, No. 1
2. Klemperer's 2 & DLvdE with Ludwig & Wunderlich
3. Barbirolli's No. 6 & No. 9, and Rückert-Lieder with Baker
4. Horenstein's No. 4
5. Tennstedt's No. 5 & No. 8
6. Ferrier, Walter & Wieners in Kindertotenlieder
7. Rattle & CBSO's No. 7
8. Des Knaben Wunderhorn with Schwarzkopf, DF-D & Szell
9. Songs Of A Wayfarer with DF-D & Furtwaengler
10. the box is also an excellent paperweight.

Another reason:  It includes the Piano Quartet!  :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sergeant Rock on July 02, 2014, 03:43:47 AM
+1

10 Reason to buy it now:

1. Giulini & CSO, No. 1
2. Klemperer's 2 & DLvdE with Ludwig & Wunderlich
3. Barbirolli's No. 6 & No. 9, and Rückert-Lieder with Baker
4. Horenstein's No. 4
5. Tennstedt's No. 5 & No. 8
6. Ferrier, Walter & Wieners in Kindertotenlieder
7. Rattle & CBSO's No. 7
8. Des Knaben Wunderhorn with Schwarzkopf, DF-D & Szell
9. Songs Of A Wayfarer with DF-D & Furtwaengler
10. the box is also an excellent paperweight.

Yep, it's chock-full of classic performances that must be in a serious Mahler collection.

Sarge
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: vandermolen on July 03, 2014, 04:17:50 AM
Vaughan Williams
Miaskovsky
Bax
Bruckner
Sibelius
Shostakovich
Braga Santos
Copland
Rubbra
Walton
Title: Re: Your Top 12 Favorite Composers
Post by: Moonfish on July 03, 2014, 12:33:03 PM
1. Bach
2. Haydn
3. Verdi
4. Wagner
5. Beethoven
6. Mozart
7. Schubert
8. Chopin
9. Debussy
10. Sibelius
11. Handel
12. Marais
 >:D

Traditional list, eh?

Reassessing...... (and in no particular order/ranking)
Kicked out Debussy and replaced him with Mahler...  he he (even as I am listening to a wonderful La Mer with van Beinum and the CO!)

1. Bach
2. Haydn
3. Verdi
4. Wagner
5. Beethoven
6. Mozart
7. Schubert
8. Chopin
9. Mahler
10. Sibelius
11. Handel
12. Marais
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Papy Oli on July 03, 2014, 12:57:43 PM
let's see...

The unchallenged top 3 :

1. Mahler
1. Bruckner
1. Beethoven

then 2 proper newcomers in the last year, mostly thanks to Hogwood...

2. Haydn
2. Vivaldi

then 7 long-serving regulars.

3. D. Scarlatti
3. Satie
3. Schubert
3. Pärt
3. Chopin
3. Rameau
3. Loewe (could have possibly been Stravinsky)


The one that tantalizingly knocks at the door : JS Bach...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Scion7 on July 07, 2014, 06:04:37 PM
Vivaldi
Handel
JS Bach
Haydn
Mozart
Beethoven
Brahms
Schubert
Schumann
Tchaikovsky
Bartok
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sammy on July 07, 2014, 07:17:23 PM
Bach at the top with my remaining favorites in no particular order:

Scheidemann
Froberger
Handel
Mozart
Haydn
Brahms
Shostakovich
Schumann
Weinberg
Miaskovsky
Scriabin
Mahler
Zemlinsky

Forgot to add Dvorak.  I've likely forgotten others as well.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ChamberNut on July 08, 2014, 03:39:14 AM
Bach at the top with my remaining favorites in no particular order:

Scheidemann
Froberger
Handel
Mozart
Haydn
Brahms
Shostakovich
Schumann
Weinberg
Miaskovsky
Scriabin
Mahler
Zemlinsky

Forgot to add Dvorak.  I've likely forgotten others as well.

I thought Taneyev would be there too, Don.  Probably on the cusp.  :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on July 08, 2014, 03:40:30 AM
How can anyone keep such a list to 11? 8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Henk on July 08, 2014, 03:55:02 AM
Beethoven
Mozart
Mendelssohn
Chopin
Bach

Stravinsky
Sciarrino
Donatoni
Takemitsu
Feldman

+1 :) Birtwistle
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on July 08, 2014, 03:56:09 AM
How can anyone keep such a list to 11? 8)
Oh, very easily. It might be that such constraints make the list borderline silly, though.  0:)

Alkan
Bach
Chopin
Debussy
Elgar
Fauré
Gershwin
Haydn
Ives
Janacek
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ChamberNut on July 08, 2014, 04:00:00 AM
Oh, very easily. It might be that such constraints make the list borderline silly, though.  0:)

Alkan
Bach
Chopin
Debussy
Elgar
Fauré
Gershwin
Haydn
Ives
Janacek

No Sibelius?   :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Lisztianwagner on July 08, 2014, 04:04:36 AM
Mine could be:

1. Richard Wagner
2. Ludwig van Beethoven
3. Franz Liszt
4. Gustav Mahler
5. Sergei Rachmaninov
6. Johann Strauss II
7. Pyotr Ilyich Tchaikovsky
8. Maurice Ravel
9. Richard Strauss
10. Gustav Holst
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: mn dave on July 08, 2014, 04:08:39 AM
BEETHOVEN
Bach
Brahms
CHOPIN
Schumann
Schubert
Prokofiev
Haydn
Alkan
Sibelius

Or something like that.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on July 08, 2014, 04:12:26 AM
No Sibelius?   :)
Ray, it might be that this list isn't quite my actual top 10 - they're not all assigned to each of the first 10 letters of the alphabet.  8)

But perhaps I should make a go at a proper list..

Bach
Ravel
Chopin
Sibelius
Janáček
Rakhmaninov
Mozart
Stravinsky
Shostakovich
Prokofiev


(no room for Beethoven, Berlioz, Bartók, Schönberg, Schubert, Schumann, Britten, Berg, Debussy, Haydn, Martinů, Ligeti, RVW, Monteverdi, Vivaldi, Zelenka, Villa-Lobos, Pärt, Varèse Dutilleux or Satie, I see. I like the Top 30 Favorite Composers thread more  8) )
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Henk on July 08, 2014, 04:13:00 AM
Am I really the only one with good taste here?  :o $:)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: mn dave on July 08, 2014, 04:13:50 AM
Am I really the only one with good taste here?  :o $:)

According to you, it seems.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Henk on July 08, 2014, 04:27:37 AM
According to you, it seems.

No, I only keep wondering about it. :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: mn dave on July 08, 2014, 04:28:44 AM
No, I only keep wondering about it. :)

Always keep in mind: Mn Dave has the best taste.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on July 08, 2014, 04:29:55 AM
Always keep in mind: Mn Dave has the best taste.
Absolutely! At least when it's congruous with mine. ;)
(I haven't actually tasted Dave.)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: mn dave on July 08, 2014, 04:32:08 AM
Absolutely! At least when it's congruous with mine. ;)
(I haven't actually tasted Dave.)

 ;D Of course.

[I taste like strawberries.]
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on July 08, 2014, 04:37:45 AM
[I taste like strawberries.]
Thanks for putting me off of strawberries just before the season.  >:(  :P >:D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: mn dave on July 08, 2014, 04:41:44 AM
Thanks for putting me off of strawberries just before the season.  >:(  :P >:D

 >:D :'( $:) 0:) :laugh: :blank:
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Henk on July 08, 2014, 04:48:48 AM
Always keep in mind: Mn Dave has the best taste.

Sick.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on July 08, 2014, 04:49:50 AM
Am I really the only one with good taste here?  :o $:)
Sick.
I'm glad you noticed.  0:)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ChamberNut on July 08, 2014, 04:51:40 AM
Beethoven
Mozart
Mendelssohn
Chopin
Bach

Stravinsky
Sciarrino
Donatoni
Takemitsu
Feldman

+1 :) Birtwistle

Well, three of your ten favourites are on my list, so I have 30% good taste.  :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Henk on July 08, 2014, 04:53:57 AM
Well, three of your ten favourites are on my list, so I have 30% good taste.  :D

I admit that went through my mind.. :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Henk on July 08, 2014, 05:05:54 AM
Isn't that dissapointing? In all the years I'm active here, is this the result: 30% good taste? Bad learners or what else?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Henk on July 08, 2014, 05:21:53 AM
Well, the years are by that I cared about that.

I think however that most people here just are enjoying music, in the decadent sense, but one of my goals is to achieve good taste. :) And I have achieved that goal!!  ;)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ChamberNut on July 08, 2014, 05:23:40 AM
I think however that most people here just are enjoying music, in the decadent sense, but one of my goals is to achieve good taste. :) And I have achieved that goal!!  ;)

Well, that is your opinion, and you are surely entitled to it.  :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Henk on July 08, 2014, 05:38:43 AM
I repeat myself. I annoy myself.

I keep on trying listening to what other members like. Almost never statisfy me, but at least I have more knowledge about it then.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Henk on July 08, 2014, 06:20:08 AM
Always keep in mind: Mn Dave has the best taste.

Of course. But what now?, you show so much modesty Dave (only "best", not "superior"?), I get doubts. :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: mn dave on July 08, 2014, 06:43:59 AM
Of course. But what now?, you show so much modesty Dave (only "best", not "superior"?), I get doubts. :)

You are only allowed to address me once per week. Didn't you read the guidelines?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Henk on July 08, 2014, 06:49:21 AM
You are only allowed to address me once per week. Didn't you read the guidelines?

You listen too much Metal, Dave.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: mn dave on July 08, 2014, 06:52:12 AM
You listen too much Metal, Dave.

Perhaps. Some would say yes, some would say no.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Henk on July 08, 2014, 06:56:16 AM
Perhaps. Some would say yes, some would say no.

Let Judas Priest be your latest metal purchase. Then substitute the whole genre by the complete works of Rossini, Dave. Take this as a challenge!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: mn dave on July 08, 2014, 07:03:56 AM
Let Judas Priest be your latest metal purchase. Then substitute the whole genre by the complete works of Rossini, Dave. Take this as a challenge!

I was listening to classical long before I was listening to metal. Isn't that straaange?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Henk on July 08, 2014, 07:10:27 AM
I was listening to classical long before I was listening to metal. Isn't that straaange?

Did you try Rossini?

Me too, though I only listened to some metal. Listening to metal makes me feel like I'm in hell, shouting to and punishing other people. I hardly can listen to metal anymore without that perception, which makes me discard the whole genre.

Though Andy once make me notice a metal album, very intense, by which I had a different, almost the oppossite experience.

Andy however also made the impression on me metal fans are people who are highly bored with their life, as if you can put everything into expression in music, which I think is a wrong opinion, bad taste.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sammy on July 08, 2014, 07:30:58 AM
I thought Taneyev would be there too, Don.  Probably on the cusp.  :)

I do believe you have me pegged correctly.  For a top 15 or 20, I'm sure that I would have included Taneyev with Boris Tchaikovsky a little lower on the list.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Dancing Divertimentian on July 08, 2014, 07:32:38 AM
Well, the years are by that I cared about that.

I think however that most people here just are enjoying music, in the decadent sense, but one of my goals is to achieve good taste. :) And I have achieved that goal!!  ;)

Trolling about your "good taste" isn't in good taste.


Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Henk on July 08, 2014, 07:39:06 AM
Trolling about your "good taste" isn't in good taste.

I agree fully when you mean post like that are annoying, like I said myself already.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ibanezmonster on July 08, 2014, 07:54:34 AM
Andy however also made the impression on me metal fans are people who are highly bored with their life
I have to do boring stuff 50-60 hours/week, so maybe.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Henk on July 08, 2014, 08:07:57 AM
I have to do boring stuff 50-60 hours/week, so maybe.

Get a woman who's rich, Greg, and spend your time on composing. Some women like artistic men.

BTW do you know that passage in Also Sprach Zarathustra about a woman's hatred being a man who attracts, like a magnet, but doesn't attract enough to bind? Be sure you are not like that to women.

Still dating? Make composing your selling point..
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Dancing Divertimentian on July 08, 2014, 08:17:44 AM
I agree fully when you mean post like that are annoying, like I said myself already.

Good. Then we agree your "taste" needs a make-over.


Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ibanezmonster on July 08, 2014, 08:38:55 AM
Get a woman who's rich, Greg, and spend your time on composing. Some women like artistic men.
Even if I ever knew a rich woman, I wouldn't be a leech.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Henk on July 08, 2014, 09:01:06 AM
Even if I ever knew a rich woman, I wouldn't be a leech.

Who cares? More important is doing the thing you need to do.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: mszczuj on July 08, 2014, 09:23:46 AM
Beethoven
Bach

Haydn
Mozart

Chopin
Schubert
Handel
Ockeghem

Richard Strauss
Bartok
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: eoghan on December 09, 2014, 03:59:43 AM
Bach
Beethoven
Stravinsky
Debussy
Hindemith
Wagner
Shostakovich
Handel
Messiaen
Bartok
Mendelssohn (or maybe Liszt or Rachmaninov or Gesualdo)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Moonfish on December 09, 2014, 05:54:33 AM
Reassessing...... (and in no particular order/ranking)
Kicked out Debussy and replaced him with Mahler...  he he (even as I am listening to a wonderful La Mer with van Beinum and the CO!)

1. Bach
2. Haydn
3. Verdi
4. Wagner
5. Beethoven
6. Mozart
7. Schubert
8. Chopin
9. Mahler
10. Sibelius
11. Handel
12. Marais

It has been a while....

Now

1. Bach
2. Verdi
3. Wagner
4. Beethoven
5. Mozart
6. Richard Strauss
7. Bruckner  (new arrival on my list - spot number 6 - wonder why? Greg?)
8. Mahler
9. Chopin
10. Sibelius
11. Haydn
12. Schubert/Marais/Rameau

Last time Mahler sneaked in. This time Haydn descended. Schubert fell out of my top ten while Bruckner and R. Strauss made it in...   ??? ???
Clearly the summer "Brucknerized" me!!!!   
Rameau is barking at the door and wants to get into my "list"!

 ;D ;D ;D

Why does nobody like Verdi???    :'( :'( :'(
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on December 09, 2014, 09:19:39 AM
Why does nobody like Verdi???    :'( :'( :'(

I suppose I don't like Verdi due to his musical language in general, but I'm not a big opera fan either, so surely this must factor into my own reasoning.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Philo on December 09, 2014, 07:47:06 PM
01. Living
02. Brahms
03. Grieg
04. Turina
05. Chausson
06. Schoenberg
07. Beethoven
08. Rameau
09. Prokofiev
10. Sibelius

On the outside looking in:
von Weber, Schubert, and Schumann

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on December 09, 2014, 08:10:59 PM
01. Living


The forum's first Einaudi fan!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: amw on December 09, 2014, 08:32:53 PM
From the other thread—this about covers it in terms of overall influence on my life & listening habits.Bach used to be in the top 5, but I'm not sure where. I think I just stopped listening to his music nearly as much after a while, allowing Brahms to creep in. The other top 4 have been steady for awhile.
Slight revision:

1. Beethoven
...
3. Schumann
...
...
...
...
8. Schubert
...
10. Bartók
11. Brahms
...
...
14. Bach
...
16. Mozart
17. Haydn
...
19. Chopin
...
...
...
22. Dvořák
23 onwards: the rest

(Bach is gradually returning to the top 5, thanks in part to András Schiff's ECM recordings which I've been listening to a lot of, and Amandine Beyer. Cage has advanced to #23 ahead of the competition, I doubt he'll ever surpass Dvořák though. Also on the way up: Debussy, Sciarrino, Szymanowski, R. Barrett. On the way down: Messiaen, Ligeti, Xenakis. Holding steady: Stockhausen.)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jaakko Keskinen on December 10, 2014, 09:36:05 AM
Ok, let's try this again. See if anything's changed...

1. Wagner
2. Beethoven
3. Brahms
4. Sibelius
5. Puccini
6. Verdi
7. R. Strauss
8. Tchaikovsky
9. Rachmaninov
10. Mahler


... 11. Debussy
    12. Bruckner
    13. Mendelssohn
    14. Schubert
    15. Schumann
    16. Bach
    17. Dvorak
    18. Franck
    19. Grieg
    20. Fauré
    21. Ravel
    22. C.M.Weber
    23. Haydn
    24. Mozart
    25. Chopin
    26. Schostakovich
    27. Rimsky-Korsakov
    28. Massenet
    29. Gounod

May change today. Not even now so sure about this list. Gosh, it's so frustratingly hard to put them in order. Only around top 5 has usually remained same.
   





     


Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sergeant Rock on December 10, 2014, 10:20:39 AM
1. Mahler
2. Bruckner
3. Wagner
4. Haydn
5. Sibelius
6. Beethoven
7. Mozart
8. Vaughan Williams
9. Schoenberg and Brahms...tie
10. Havergal Brian
11. Elgar
12. Shostakovich

Sarge
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Trout on December 10, 2014, 11:24:54 AM
1. Mozart
2. Beethoven
3. Bach
4. Mahler
5. Brahms
6. Bartók
7. Messiaen
8. Ligeti
9. Finzi
10. Stravinsky
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jaakko Keskinen on December 10, 2014, 11:48:25 AM
Of course I forgot Schoenberg, let's say he's no 23.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ZauberdrachenNr.7 on December 10, 2014, 12:29:20 PM
   
Rameau is barking at the door and wants to get into my "list"!

 ;D ;D ;D

Why does nobody like Verdi???    :'( :'( :'(

I'm sympathetic, Moonshine, Rameau wants fiercely to break into my list o' Top Ten, too!  My Top Ten has changed quite a bit since last time I did this, mostly because of GMGers' influence. However, speaking of barking, Brahms is still top dog.

Johannes, the Love Dog God, Brahms.
Stravinsky
Sibelius
Mahler
Martinu
Poulenc
Debussy
Wagner
Berlioz
Duparc (on the strength of several of the greatest songs ever written!)

Sadly, Schubert & Bach have fallen off my list, not w/o tears, :'(  after being on it for decades. Still Top Twenty, though.

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on December 10, 2014, 12:31:26 PM
Schoenberg and Brahms...tie

My eyes! My eyes!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on December 10, 2014, 12:38:10 PM
Nobody tell Harry!  8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on December 10, 2014, 01:15:39 PM
Nobody tell Harry!  8)
I hope Sarge isn't on probation. That has got to be a violation.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on December 10, 2014, 08:28:59 PM
Top 10 Favorite Composers (revised):

1. Schnittke

(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4024/4402097334_fbf0050ec4.jpg)

2. Shostakovich:

(http://www.vinylrevinyl.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/dmitri-shostakovich.jpg)

3. Bartók:

(http://cdn2.newsok.biz/cache/r620-3ba9356341343fe0b863279e3bab4842.jpg)

4. Ravel:

(http://www.lamusiqueclassique.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/1310419-Maurice_Ravel.jpg)

5. Stravinsky:

(http://cdn2.greatsong.net/photo/ext/99991136/igor-stravinsky-133775.jpg)

6. Britten:

(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-wvKuihuaIfk/UbJZ9ivY5qI/AAAAAAAAK2o/C6coeNeuVZI/s1600/Benjamin+Britten1.jpg)

7. Sibelius:

(http://media.timeout.com/images/resizeBestFit/100197381/660/370/image.jpg)

8. Berg:

(http://hilobrow.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/berg-alban.jpg)

9. Prokofiev:

(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-YMXEbt2lxJU/T5WsuvTvHQI/AAAAAAAALxM/Xzo6NY3d0x4/s1600/sergei-prokofiev.jpg)

10. Schoenberg:

(https://s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/ljphotographie/photos/22377/med_065-schoenberg-arnold-1949-jpg.jpg)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on December 10, 2014, 08:46:26 PM
You forgot Boulez John.

I will bookmark your denial for future reference
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Moonfish on December 10, 2014, 08:47:39 PM
Top 10 Favorite Composers (revised):



RVW didn't make it ?!?!?!?!   ??? ???
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Moonfish on December 10, 2014, 08:49:39 PM
You forgot Boulez John.

I will bookmark your denial for future reference

You mean Boules...   ;D
I actually like boules... a glass of wine.... a  sunset... and a special person...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on December 10, 2014, 08:57:51 PM
You forgot Boulez John.

I will bookmark your denial for future reference

Lol..Ken. That's a good one! :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on December 10, 2014, 09:00:08 PM
RVW didn't make it ?!?!?!?!   ??? ???

As much as I love ol' Ralph, he simply didn't make the cut this time around. The newest arrival to my top 10 is Schoenberg and this has been because of my increasing interest in his music both from an emotional and intellectual point-of-view.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Fagotterdämmerung on December 11, 2014, 08:00:51 AM
  I'm always a bit hesitant on favorite composers lists: I always feel I'm loving these composers' works in different ways and for different reasons. Also, while choice number one is easy, I feel the rest could kind of be arranged in any way in the top fifteen or so.

  1. Olivier Messiaen
  2. Igor Stravinsky
  3. Arnold Schoenberg
  4. Richard Strauss
  5. Kaikhosru Shapurji Sorabji
  6. György Ligeti
  7. Ralph Vaughan Williams
  8. Béla Bartók
  9. Leoš Janáček
  10. Alexander Scriabin

 

   
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: jochanaan on December 11, 2014, 10:01:35 AM
Not even going to go here.  I'm way too much of a "Ruby Tuesday...change with every new day..." ;D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on December 11, 2014, 10:05:48 AM
Not even going to go here.  I'm way too much of a "Ruby Tuesday...change with every new day..." ;D

Aye . . . as soon as I come up with a list of ten, I think of an eleventh whom it pains me to have omitted . . . .
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on December 11, 2014, 10:09:12 AM
As I stated earlier, I like the top 30 thread more. ;)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Philo on December 11, 2014, 12:13:38 PM
As I stated earlier, I like the top 30 thread more. ;)

And I'd much prefer a top 5. I mean, I've loved all of the composers I've come across thus far (hundreds upon hundreds), but I like the task of distillation.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Fagotterdämmerung on December 11, 2014, 12:22:15 PM

  Top half a composer. I'll take the first half of Stravinsky, i.e. until 1926.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Philo on December 11, 2014, 12:23:29 PM
  Top half a composer. I'll take the first half of Stravinsky, i.e. until 1926.

HA! And I'd take the first half of Brahms's compositional output. ;D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ZauberdrachenNr.7 on December 11, 2014, 12:24:17 PM
  I'm always a bit hesitant on favorite composers lists: I always feel I'm loving these composers' works in different ways and for different reasons. Also, while choice number one is easy, I feel the rest could kind of be arranged in any way in the top fifteen or so.

  1. Olivier Messiaen
  2. Igor Stravinsky
  3. Arnold Schoenberg
  4. Richard Strauss
  5. Kaikhosru Shapurji Sorabji
  6. György Ligeti
  7. Ralph Vaughan Williams
  8. Béla Bartók
  9. Leoš Janáček
  10. Alexander Scriabin

 

Boy, do I like this tasty list...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on December 11, 2014, 12:25:44 PM
And I'd much prefer a top 5. I mean, I've loved all of the composers I've come across thus far (hundreds upon hundreds), but I like the task of distillation.
Yes, I like that more (most) too. Ten is just a weird compromise.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Philo on December 11, 2014, 01:09:34 PM
Yes, I like that more (most) too. Ten is just a weird compromise.

Agreed. Although, it is strange. I struggle much more with a list of 10 than I do with a list of 5. I enjoy the strictures of such a rigid delimit. And numbers higher than 10, I struggle with even more. I cannot think of a single composer who I don't enjoy who I've invested any sort of time into. There's just so much good stuff.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on December 11, 2014, 01:10:56 PM
Yes, I like that more (most) too. Ten is just a weird compromise.
Twelve is the right number. The metric system is a bad side effect of a bad radix.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on December 11, 2014, 01:28:10 PM
  Top half a composer.
That's easier than to chose a top 10 where I have to face tough decisions past the first 6 or 7

Beethoven 1809-1827 (or if pressed 1817-1827)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sergeant Rock on December 11, 2014, 01:33:18 PM
Twelve is the right number.

Quite right. And with twelve I get to include Elgar and Shostakovich.

Sarge
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on December 11, 2014, 02:02:42 PM
One's got to have something better for an extra slot than Elgar...  >:D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on December 11, 2014, 02:21:32 PM
One's got to have something better for an extra slot than Elgar...  >:D
I'm just thankful he didn't slot a rapper in there!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sergeant Rock on December 11, 2014, 02:24:35 PM
One's got to have something better for an extra slot than Elgar...  >:D

How about Franz Schmidt? ...or LL Cool J  8)

Sarge
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on December 11, 2014, 02:29:45 PM
Sure, one could do much worse! although I admit that a rapper was not in the realm of possibilities I entertained.
I know even less Franz Schmidt than Elgar, although I own two quintets and a symphony and have listened to them. It's your list, so do what you please, but what about Schubert, Schumann, Bartok or Bach?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Cosi bel do on December 11, 2014, 02:59:35 PM
I think it would be easier to say which is my one and only favourite composer. Or which are my three favourites. Ten is too much. And after 3 or 4, all the following are really very far and could more easily be replaced in the future. But let's try it.

1. Bach
2. Beethoven (until there, I think I'm really sure)
3. Mahler (ok, that's really tricky, I'm not that sure I really prefer Mahler to Mozart)
4. Mozart
5. Bruckner (probably)
6. Shostakovich (well, that's where I really start to feel names are from a different "league" in my personal ranking, if I have one)
7. Buxtehude
8. Tchaikovsky (does that sound a little too random yet ?)
9. Schumann
10. I have to think...

I love Wagner, or Sibelius, or Liszt, or Brahms, or Chopin, or Debussy, or Berg, or Haydn, or Frescobaldi... But compared to the previous ones, I guess I might be able to live without their music.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sergeant Rock on December 11, 2014, 03:11:26 PM
Sure, one could do much worse! although I admit that a rapper was not in the realm of possibilities I entertained.
I know even less Franz Schmidt than Elgar, although I own two quintets and a symphony and have listened to them. It's your list, so do what you please, but what about Schubert, Schumann, Bartok or Bach?

Well, we're talking about favorites. Bach is God. No question. And yet I rarely listen to him. I've been trying to become a Bartok fan for 50 years...it hasn't happened yet so I doubt it ever will. Not that I dislike everything, but little of his music moves me. Schubert should probably be in the Top 10 (he was for years)...but who would I kick out of my current list? (No, not Havergal. He's sancrosanct.) Schumann, once a strong favorite, has lost his luster after these many years. Perhaps a victim of familiarity. The composers I really regret not including are Prokofiev and R. Strauss.

Sarge
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sergeant Rock on December 11, 2014, 03:15:54 PM
Twelve is the right number. The metric system is a bad side effect of a bad radix.

When will we see your list of 12?

Sarge
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on December 11, 2014, 04:00:48 PM
When will we see your list of 12?

Sarge
I thought I posted a list once ... It's hard to distinguish right now from lifetime, from the past few years. I listen to Mozart a lot less than when I was younger, and usually enjoy it less, but largely that's familiarity. I know so much of his music backwards.  Over the long haul a few are clear

Bach
Mozart
Stravinsky
Brahms
Schubert
Beethoven
Palestrina
Schutz
Josquin

The guys sniffing around the final three spots are Nyman, Glass, Chopin, Bruckner, Handel, Haydn.  Virgil Thomson has two pieces in my top 10, but not a large body of stuff I love. Sibelius wrote my favourite piece.

These days Haydn, Nyman, Bruckner would make the cut.

The most significant, in terms of their effect on me and my involvement with music are Tchaikovsky, by a lot, and then Glass.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: EigenUser on December 11, 2014, 05:33:08 PM
My current top 12:
1. Bartok
2. Ravel
3. Ligeti
4. Messiaen
5. Haydn
6. Debussy
7. Mendelssohn
8. Gershwin
9. Schumann
10. Feldman
11. Mahler
12. Stravinsky, perhaps...

I feel like Feldman should be higher since I listen to him on a near-daily basis, but I like Schumann and Gershwin too much to raise him. 13 would probably be Webern, but I'd have to think about it.

Mendelssohn was my first favorite composer.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Moonfish on December 11, 2014, 06:04:26 PM
Twelve is the right number. The metric system is a bad side effect of a bad radix.

Copycat!  >:(
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on December 11, 2014, 06:12:09 PM
Copycat!  >:(

Note to self: beware of agreeing with Moonfish.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Moonfish on December 11, 2014, 06:16:42 PM
Note to self: beware of agreeing with Moonfish.

(http://cdn.rottmann.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/excelsis-copycat.jpeg?f329b7)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on December 12, 2014, 07:18:50 AM
Twelve? Let's see . . .

Stravinsky
Schoenberg
Prokofiev
Shostakovich
Chopin
Berlioz
JS Bach
Rakhmaninov
Sibelius
Nielsen

Brahms
D. Scarlatti
 
Getting the first ten is easy ... and then I wonder, whom am I leaving out, and I'll kick myself (figuratively) for the omission?...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on December 12, 2014, 07:24:33 AM
Twelve? Let's see . . .

Stravinsky
Schoenberg
Prokofiev
Shostakovich
Chopin
Berlioz
JS Bach
Rakhmaninov
Sibelius
Nielsen

Brahms
D. Scarlatti
 
Getting the first ten is easy ... and then I wonder, whom am I leaving out, and I'll kick myself (figuratively) for the omission?...

I didn't know Nielsen was so high on your list, Karl. That's excellent. I really do need to spend more time with his music. He was actually one of the first composers I explored.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on December 12, 2014, 07:48:36 AM
I played the Clarinet Concerto for my senior recital at Wooster, and I was hooked.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on December 12, 2014, 08:00:01 AM
I played the Clarinet Concerto for my senior recital at Wooster, and I was hooked.

'That's all she wrote..." as the old saying goes. :) That's certainly a fine work. I love the Flute Concerto as well. I haven't really spent a great deal of time with the Violin Concerto. I need to remedy this soon.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: PaulR on December 12, 2014, 08:03:42 AM
I played the Clarinet Concerto for my senior recital at Wooster, and I was hooked.
One of my friends is playing that in the concerto competition at bgsu today.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on December 12, 2014, 08:08:32 AM
I do not really distinguish right now from lifetime. Of course it's basically right now (so Tchaikovsky is out although some of his pieces were basically my intro into classical at about 15), but with at least some of the last 20-25 years kept in mind. Neither do I take what I listen to most right now as more important. There is music I have listened to much more frequently in earlier times, and I do not rate it as highly now, but there is also music I rate still very high despite not frequently listening to it.
There are "big works" like the Bach passions or Beethoven's Missa solemnis or some operas I hardly listen to because it is hard for me to focus for such a long time at home, but I still revere these pieces and am bowled over at the occasions I do listen to them. So I rather tend to think if I "could not live without a piece" in addition to the actual amount of pieces listened to. It's just a silly game, after all...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on December 12, 2014, 08:31:12 AM
It's just a silly game, after all...

Sure, this isn't to be taken as anything serious or something that's 'written in stone.' I'm curious about other people's favorites and in revealing some of their favorites gives each of us a better of idea of what a member prefers without having to dig the questions out of them. :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on December 12, 2014, 09:02:12 AM
One of my friends is playing that in the concerto competition at bgsu today.

It's cracking good fun to play.  Good luck to your friend!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on December 12, 2014, 09:09:55 AM
Sure, I do find interesting how people "update" their lists and how very different those lists can be. But for me personally it seems that what I am really very fond of in music has not changed so much in the last 10 years. I have been listening to classical for more than 25 years since I was about 15.

I posted the list below in summer. Beethoven, Brahms and Mozart were among my top when I was 17 I guess. Schubert came not much later. Haydn rose up in the late 90s when I finally got around to listen to more than a handful of his symphonies. I had always been impressed by a few works of Bach but it took me years to get into his keyboard music which I am now listening to much more than e.g. Brandenburgs (frankly, I do not care all that much for them, even less for the ouverture suites), I guess. Lots of organ and cantata stuff I still know only superficially or not at all. Handel would not have figured until about 12 years ago (although I have loved Messiah long before), Schumann also rose in appreciation in the 2000s. Bartok has been my favorite 20th century since I heard the "divertimento" in high school, even before I really got into classical, but of course it took a long time to explore his music and there is quite a bit I still do not know very well. The last spot could as well have been Chopin, Dvorak, Mendelssohn, maybe even Bruckner. Of Bruckner's and Mahler's I like some works tremendously and do not much care for others (Bruckner's 4th and <3, Mahler 3 and 8 ). Similarly with Wagner and Strauss, although I don't think I like any Strauss as much as, say Mahler's and Bruckner's 9th and there is a lot of Strauss I am not fond of or have just ignored for now. Shostakovitch is a similar case. The 7th symphony bores me to death, but I admire some string quartets or the 1st violin concerto. Music I came to love mostly in the last 10 years, e.g. Fauré's chamber music I do not rate high enough for top ten, but they probably rose from nothing to top 20. I also love some other baroque stuff, Purcell's Dido is my favorite opera, Vivaldi is much more than just the 4 seasons. Of 20th century music I often feel that I do not know it well enough to decide how much I like it. Besides Bartok I love e.g. Berg's Lyric Suite, but I don't know enough other Berg well enough to rate him this way or another (it is rather tough going). I prefer Nielsen to Sibelius, but not sure if either would make the top 20 of mine. There is just too much music and I admit that I am often to lazy and listen to "the same old stuff" I know I love.

Beethoven
J. Haydn
W.A. Mozart
J.S. Bach
Brahms
Schubert
Handel
Schumann
Bartok
Mahler
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on January 16, 2015, 08:07:57 PM
Newly revised list:

1. Elgar
2. RVW
3. Shostakovich
4. Ravel
5. Bartok
6. Stravinsky
7. Britten
8. Schnittke
9. Berg
10. Martinu

 8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ibanezmonster on January 16, 2015, 08:21:21 PM
Pretty sure my list has been the same for the last five years, but I will take a futile attempt at trying to remember the bottom half...


1. Mahler
2. Prokofiev
3. Brahms
4. Bruckner
5. Shostakovich
6. Stravinsky
7. Xenakis
8. Penderecki
9. Schnittke
10. Schoenberg

...

11. Berg/Rachmaninoff
12. Takemitsu




1. Elgar
New #1, huh? Whatever gets you through the tedium of everyday life...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on January 16, 2015, 08:25:26 PM
Newly revised [top 10] list:


The man who invented 10 sided dice has a lot to answer for.

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on January 16, 2015, 08:25:54 PM
Pretty sure my list has been the same for the last five years, but I will take a futile attempt at trying to remember the bottom half...


1. Mahler
2. Prokofiev
3. Brahms
4. Bruckner
5. Shostakovich
6. Stravinsky
7. Xenakis
8. Penderecki
9. Schnittke
10. Schoenberg

...

11. Berg/Rachmaninoff
12. Takemitsu



New #1, huh? Whatever gets you through the tedium of everyday life...

Well, these kinds of lists are just for laughs mainly, but I'm quite serious about Elgar being my #1. It seems I always return to his music with an even greater appreciation than I had the last time. I'm continuing to 'grow' with his music to where it's as natural to me as breathing. I can't say this has happened many times...oh...wait a minute yes I can! ;) ;D You see what I mean about the laughing? :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on January 16, 2015, 08:26:31 PM
The man who invented 10 sided dice has a lot to answer for.

 :P
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: edward on January 17, 2015, 05:37:38 AM
I've never been able to get conclusively beyond:

1. Beethoven
2. Mahler

For a top 5, I suspect I'd add a triad of Brahms, Sibelius and Ligeti, in that order.

What fills out the top 10 is mostly defined by what I've been listening to of late (late Liszt last night means he's on the list, for example).

There's so much good music out there and sometimes it takes a relistening to remind myself just how good it is.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: EigenUser on January 17, 2015, 11:54:05 AM
I've never been able to get conclusively beyond:

1. Beethoven
2. Mahler

For a top 5, I suspect I'd add a triad of Brahms, Sibelius and Ligeti, in that order.

What fills out the top 10 is mostly defined by what I've been listening to of late (late Liszt last night means he's on the list, for example).

There's so much good music out there and sometimes it takes a relistening to remind myself just how good it is.
Are we the only two people on GMG with Ligeti as a top 5?

Mine, currently (in rough order, but Ligeti and Ravel are tied):
1. Bartok
2. Ligeti
3. Ravel
4. Messiaen
5. Haydn
6. Mahler (I've been listening to a ton of Mahler recently)
7. Feldman
8. Gershwin
9. Debussy (guess what I'm listening to right now! ;D 0:))
10. Mendelssohn

After that would probably be Schumann, Stravinsky, Webern, Ohana, maybe Bruckner, maybe even late Boulez (i.e. not the strict serial stuff).
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: vandermolen on January 18, 2015, 02:41:52 AM
Today's list  8)

Vaughan Williams
Bruckner
Moeran
Miaskovsky
Shostakovich
Diamond
Bloch
Sibelius
Tubin
Copland
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: André on January 18, 2015, 02:30:51 PM
Show me yours, I'll show you mine  :laugh:.

My definition first : a composer whose works when heard impromptu stop me in my tracks. Have to find out who is playing. For it might lead to a future purchase. Because I can't get enough of his music !

Sibelius
Elgar
Wagner
Bruckner
Mahler
Brahms
Schubert
Vaughan-Williams
Verdi
Haydn
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Elgarian on January 19, 2015, 01:52:03 AM
I'm not sure I can do this! Certainly if I did it would change from month to month, maybe day to day ... and the whole business of deciding who's above whom feels like nightmare. And what does one do with composers who have written one work that is a lifetime favourite, but nothing else has quite caught on?
But I'm going to just do it, no revisions, letting the intuition take charge. Here goes.

1. Elgar
2. Wagner
3. Mozart
4. Puccini
5. Handel
6. Sibelius
7. Beethoven
8. Vaughan Williams
9. Haydn
10. Chopin

Listed among the One-Hit Wonders: Rimsky Korsakov, Holst (not that they ARE one hit wonders, but they are in terms of [personal favourites.

That looks like a stodgy list. Doesn't feel stodgy to me, but I think it might seem so to anyone else. And why isn't Massenet in that list? That's what I want to know. Or Rameau, for pity's sake? Or Lully?

I think I should declare this list invalid, as the outpourings of an unsound mind.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: vandermolen on January 19, 2015, 08:09:57 AM
Show me yours, I'll show you mine  :laugh:.

My definition first : a composer whose works when heard impromptu stop me in my tracks. Have to find out who is playing. For it might lead to a future purchase. Because I can't get enough of his music !

Sibelius
Elgar
Wagner
Bruckner
Mahler
Brahms
Schubert
Vaughan-Williams
Verdi
Haydn

 :)

Am just discovering Schubert  :o

Really enjoy the Unfinished Symphony.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sergeant Rock on January 19, 2015, 08:31:03 AM

1. Elgar
2. Wagner
3. Mozart
4. Puccini
5. Handel
6. Sibelius
7. Beethoven
8. Vaughan Williams
9. Haydn
10. Chopin

That looks like a stodgy list. Doesn't feel stodgy to me, but I think it might seem so to anyone else.


Six of those composers are on my list too....I don't think it stodgy at all. And I always regret not having room for Elgar  :(

Sarge
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on January 19, 2015, 08:35:27 AM
Chopin is the perfect antidote for stodgy, anyway.   :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: André on January 19, 2015, 09:55:41 AM
I could have added Chopin, Puccini and esp. Mozart, but if limited to 10, those will suffice. We have many things in common ! :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ZauberdrachenNr.7 on January 19, 2015, 11:28:50 AM
This is as of the minute and it could change in the next second (without notice) :

Brahms
Stravinsky
Debussy
Martinů
Janáček
Sibelius
Berg
Wagner
Mahler
Messiaen

A (digital) embroidery of the ones most special to me (fairly complete):
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Elgarian on January 19, 2015, 12:23:41 PM

Six of those composers are on my list too....I don't think it stodgy at all. And I always regret not having room for Elgar  :(

Sarge

Thanks Sarge. That's reassuring enough for me to cancel my order for a My classical tastes are stodgy T-shirt.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sammy on January 19, 2015, 01:27:23 PM
Okay, I'll do this in terms of which composers I listen to the most:

1.  JS Bach (about half my listening time).
2.  Shostakovich
3.  Schumann
4.  Weinberg
5.  Scriabin
6.  Mozart
7.  Haydn
8.  Ligeti
9.  Mahler
10.Scheidemann
11.Dvorak
12.Myaskovsky
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Linus on January 19, 2015, 01:58:34 PM
I'm in awe of all the Top 10 lists here.

I think I'll have come a long way once I actually have a Top 10 of my own to refer to.

Right about now, I think I've listened to just enough Beethoven to be able to say, with some confidence, that, "Yeah, that Ludwig fellow certainly is among the best for me". Heh. :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ibanezmonster on January 19, 2015, 08:02:25 PM
Here's a few questions...

is there a #1 favorite composer thread that doesn't have a pre-defined poll, but just people keeping track of a count #1 favorite composers? (Pretty sure there was years back, but don't remember...)

I believe Beethoven was the most favorited, so... I'm curious what was the most liked work of his? The 9th symphony? I just never understood how he could be anyone's top favorite... top 10, certainly, but his music just isn't extreme in any way... or is not everyone looking for something extreme?  :P Even after spending so much time a few years ago (finally) listening to his music, I found a lot of music I absolutely love, but none of it reaches those extreme heights that other music can, for me. What exactly is the appeal of his music to be a #1 favorite?...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jaakko Keskinen on January 20, 2015, 12:24:33 AM
I believe Beethoven was the most favorited, so... I'm curious what was the most liked work of his?

Not sure about his most liked one but the greatest one to me keeps changing. I guess today I lean towards C sharp minor string quartet.  8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on January 20, 2015, 12:55:05 AM
Beethoven's music is frequently more "extreme" than e.g. Haydn, Mozart, Mendelsssohn, Brahms, Elgar, Sibelius, Dvorak and others mentioned as tops in about every respect I can think of. In any case, I think many listeners find that Beethoven's music is both extremely good in the department of passionate emotions AND supremely and tightly constructed. So roughly, he wins contra Bach or Haydn according to the first criterion and against Schumann, Berlioz or Mahler according to the second. (Of course this is very rough and there are other composers about this could be said, e.g. Brahms, although I like Brahms, I can understand much easier someone disliking Brahms than disliking Beethoven.)

I am not surprised at all that Beethoven is frequently mentioned as a favorite composer. It's easy to fall in love with his music and it is also easier to STAY in love with it (than with e.g. Tchaikovsky, please no puns on sexual orientation).

As for works, I think there are dozens of Beethoven pieces that I find head and shoulders above anything I have heard from e.g. Elgar, Sibelius, RWV or even Tchaikovsky. All but a few of the string quartets are pinnacles of the genre (e.g. the op.18/1 would be one, had not Beethoven himself written about 10 better ones). The 3rd,5th,7th,9th symphony, the 4th and 5th piano concertos, Fidelio, Missa solemnis, about a dozen piano sonatas, several cello, violin sonatas, a few trios. There is hardly a genre of instrumental music when one would not have to name a Beethoven piece among the best.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: 71 dB on January 20, 2015, 05:21:00 AM
Elgar and J.S. Bach have been my two most favorite composers almost as long as I have listened to classical music. After these two there is a gap. The next 8 composers to fill my top 10 are not easily chosen.

For long I had Handel as my #3 composer, But I am afraid Handel has dropped on my list a bit. I think Rameau at the same level as Handel.

Taneyev has risen on my list very high.

Beethoven must be somewhere. Haydn? Mozart?

Bruhns is extremely important composer for me, even if his output is very limited. When there's Bruhns, there is Buxtehude. But I feel M.-A. Charpentier is at the same level as Buxtehude.

Carl Nielsen? Hector Villa-Lobos? Worth top 10?

I already have more names than top 10 can take. So, it's difficult.

Elgar
Bach

(gap)

Beethoven
Taneyev
Handel
Rameau
Buxtehude + Bruhns (considered one composer)
M.-A. Charpentier

No, it's not working... Haydn, Mozart, A. Scarlatti, Fasch, Graupner, Brahms, Liszt ...I am unable to give a top 10. Top 25 maybe...
...but here is my forced top 10 for today:

Elgar
Bach


(gap)

Beethoven
Taneyev
Mozart
Handel
Rameau
Buxtehude + Bruhns (considered one composer)
M.-A. Charpentier
Liszt


No Alban Berg, but what can you do when a top 10 doesn't take 100 composers...

Beethoven's music is frequently more "extreme" than e.g. Haydn, Mozart, Mendelsssohn, Brahms, Elgar, Sibelius, Dvorak and others mentioned as tops in about every respect I can think of. In any case, I think many listeners find that Beethoven's music is both extremely good in the department of passionate emotions AND supremely and tightly constructed. So roughly, he wins contra Bach or Haydn according to the first criterion and against Schumann, Berlioz or Mahler according to the second. (Of course this is very rough and there are other composers about this could be said, e.g. Brahms, although I like Brahms, I can understand much easier someone disliking Brahms than disliking Beethoven.)

I am not surprised at all that Beethoven is frequently mentioned as a favorite composer. It's easy to fall in love with his music and it is also easier to STAY in love with it (than with e.g. Tchaikovsky, please no puns on sexual orientation).

As for works, I think there are dozens of Beethoven pieces that I find head and shoulders above anything I have heard from e.g. Elgar, Sibelius, RWV or even Tchaikovsky. All but a few of the string quartets are pinnacles of the genre (e.g. the op.18/1 would be one, had not Beethoven himself written about 10 better ones). The 3rd,5th,7th,9th symphony, the 4th and 5th piano concertos, Fidelio, Missa solemnis, about a dozen piano sonatas, several cello, violin sonatas, a few trios. There is hardly a genre of instrumental music when one would not have to name a Beethoven piece among the best.

It's comes down to what we have learned to appreciate. To me Beethoven's music is about restrained emotions. Emotions don't burst out in his music, it's "behaving well". I guess that's what you want from your music. For me it is restrained. That's why for me Elgar's second symphony is more important work than all of the nine symphonies by Beethoven combined. However, many piano sonatas and string quartets by Beethoven are "towering" achievements, so Beethoven has a pretty secured place in my top 10.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on January 20, 2015, 05:47:40 AM
I don't get what's special about Elgar. To me he is second rate at best and his popularity seems a local phenomenon and I think that he would probably be about as famous as Draeseke or von Hausegger if he had been German or Austrian. A second rate Austrian like Zemlinsky is more interesting for me than stogdy Sir Edward; Brahms or Mahler an entirely different league and Beethoven or Bach a different galaxy...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on January 20, 2015, 05:56:17 AM

No Alban Berg, but what can you do when a top 10 doesn't take 100 composers...


Be like John: rotate.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: 71 dB on January 20, 2015, 06:00:08 AM
I don't get what's special about Elgar.

Well, it seems to be common to have "difficulties" with Elgar' music. For me it was quite easy to fall in love with his music, but according to what many GMG members write on this board, it takes years for many to really see the greatness in Elgar's music. I think it's when people start to believe Elgar's music is great, they are able to experience it in new way.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ibanezmonster on January 20, 2015, 07:57:47 AM
Not sure about his most liked one but the greatest one to me keeps changing. I guess today I lean towards C sharp minor string quartet.  8)
Hm, I wonder if that's more common than I think. He has such a well-rounded list of works that it's also hard for me to choose.



Beethoven's music is frequently more "extreme" than e.g. Haydn, Mozart, Mendelsssohn, Brahms, Elgar, Sibelius, Dvorak and others mentioned as tops in about every respect I can think of.
Yeah, though that's kind of like saying that some very mild hot sauce is spicier than that piece of lettuce over there.  ;D

I like my hot sauce like I like my music: needs to be overwhelmingly strong.

In any case, I think many listeners find that Beethoven's music is both extremely good in the department of passionate emotions AND supremely and tightly constructed. So roughly, he wins contra Bach or Haydn according to the first criterion and against Schumann, Berlioz or Mahler according to the second.
Well, obvious tight construction. Not sure about Schumann or Berlioz, but a lot of Mahler's stuff is way more tightly constructed than people think simply because he doesn't make it so obvious. And I think that's one appeal of late Beethoven to me- not being (or seeming) so tightly constructed as his early music, the music can feel a bit more of a challenge than a transparent structure like what the classical period goes for. And I tend to associate tight structures with cheery content sometimes to non-classical or pop music.  :-\
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on January 20, 2015, 08:03:57 AM
Newly revised list:

1. Elgar
2. RVW
3. Shostakovich
4. Ravel
5. Bartok
6. Britten
7. Stravinsky
8. Berg
9. Martinu
10. Sculthorpe
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jaakko Keskinen on January 20, 2015, 09:41:19 AM
What exactly is the appeal of his music to be a #1 favorite?...

Although Beethoven's on #2 in my list, I certainly can see why people put him on first place. I mean, Alex Delarge liked his music, that means it has to be good, right?  8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: springrite on January 20, 2015, 09:46:14 AM
New and revised:

1  Bach
2  Mahler
3  Beethoven
4  Brian
5  Haydn
6  Brahms
7  Feldman
8  Schubert
9  Berg
10 Rubbra
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: 71 dB on January 20, 2015, 09:46:41 AM
What the hell does ' tightly constructed ' even mean?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jaakko Keskinen on January 20, 2015, 10:00:30 AM
I like my hot sauce like I like my music: needs to be overwhelmingly strong.

I thought Beethoven was the one who "started" the overwhelmingly strong music.  ::) He can also be played by much larger orchestras than what was used in his time and pretty often has been. I remember video of Karajan conducting in the 60s 5th symphony with 8 french horns.


Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ZauberdrachenNr.7 on January 20, 2015, 10:07:21 AM

...but here is my forced top 10 for today:

Elgar
Bach


(gap)

Beethoven
Taneyev
Mozart
Handel
Rameau
Buxtehude + Bruhns (considered one composer)
M.-A. Charpentier
Liszt


No Alban Berg, but what can you do when a top 10 doesn't take 100 composers...


So exciting to see Charpentier (and when it comes to it, Rameau) in your Top Ten.  Good work!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on January 20, 2015, 10:13:39 AM
New and revised:

1  Bach
2  Mahler
3  Beethoven
4  Brian
5  Haydn
6  Brahms
7  Feldman
8  Schubert
9  Berg
10 Rubbra

Didn't know Rubbra scored so high on your list, Paul. That's wonderful! I love his music.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Robert on January 20, 2015, 10:19:10 AM
Okay, I'll do this in terms of which composers I listen to the most:

1.  JS Bach (about half my listening time).
2.  Shostakovich
3.  Schumann
4.  Weinberg
5.  Scriabin
6.  Mozart
7.  Haydn
8.  Ligeti
9.  Mahler
10.Scheidemann
11.Dvorak
12.Myaskovsky
Hi Don
Nice to see Myaskovsky and Vainberg on your list....I am not familiar with Scheidemann, What does he bring to the table?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ibanezmonster on January 20, 2015, 10:20:26 AM
I thought Beethoven was the one who "started" the overwhelmingly strong music.  ::) He can also be played by much larger orchestras than what was used in his time and pretty often has been. I remember video of Karajan conducting in the 60s 5th symphony with 8 french horns.
I mean strong more in the harmonic sense (although I do like "big" as well)... and for his time it was that as well, but compared to what came later, not so much.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Robert on January 20, 2015, 10:25:14 AM
Newly revised list:

1. Elgar
2. RVW
3. Shostakovich
4. Ravel
5. Bartok
6. Britten
7. Stravinsky
8. Berg
9. Martinu
10. Sculthorpe
Hi John
Like your list...Peter Sculthorpe?  I have most of his ABC discs.  What particular pieces of his do you like? I don't listen to  him that much....What am I missing here?

Robert
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: springrite on January 20, 2015, 10:27:20 AM
Didn't know Rubbra scored so high on your list, Paul. That's wonderful! I love his music.
I used to have him even higher but Brian moved up fast, as did Schubert whom I couldn't stand for so many years.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sammy on January 20, 2015, 10:39:41 AM
Hi Don
Nice to see Myaskovsky and Vainberg on your list....I am not familiar with Scheidemann, What does he bring to the table?

I'm a big fan of his organ works, an irresistible blend of severity and sweetness.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on January 20, 2015, 10:46:30 AM
I used to have him even higher but Brian moved up fast, as did Schubert whom I couldn't stand for so many years.

I really need to give Havergal Brian another chance. What would you recommend I listen to first? I have a decent sized Brian collection.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: 71 dB on January 20, 2015, 10:57:12 AM
So exciting to see Charpentier (and when it comes to it, Rameau) in your Top Ten.  Good work!

Thanks! My list is a result of desperation. Baroque composers seem to get on my top 10 list easier than composers of other periods.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: EigenUser on January 20, 2015, 10:59:38 AM
I really need to give Havergal Brian another chance. What would you recommend I listen to first? I have a decent sized Brian collection.
I've only heard a few Brian works, but the one that I remember enjoying is the Symphony No. 31. It's certainly short enough to not be a waste of time if you end up not liking it (single movement, c.a. 15 minutes).
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on January 20, 2015, 11:11:48 AM
I've only heard a few Brian works, but the one that I remember enjoying is the Symphony No. 31. It's certainly short enough to not be a waste of time if you end up not liking it (single movement, c.a. 15 minutes).

Cool, I'll check it out, Nate.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Elgarian on January 20, 2015, 12:14:33 PM
I don't get what's special about Elgar. To me he is second rate at best and his popularity seems a local phenomenon and I think that he would probably be about as famous as Draeseke or von Hausegger if he had been German or Austrian. A second rate Austrian like Zemlinsky is more interesting for me than stogdy Sir Edward; Brahms or Mahler an entirely different league and Beethoven or Bach a different galaxy...

I'd like to say several things in response to this:

1. These are lists of favourites, not attempts at some sort of objective assessment of greatness (the conclusions of which activity would in any case be questionable I think, as with art of any kind).
2. Elgar is up there for me (and others) quite simply because I've loved his music over most of a lifetime. I loved it when I first heard it at the age of 16. I still love it (in all sorts of ways, some the same, some different) more than 50 years later. I can't justify that in a way that would explain it to anyone else, any more than I could justify any other kind of love that wasn't shared.
3. So it's not about which league or galaxy his music might belong to in relation to other composers, but about impassioned and intuitive personal responses that I couldn't change if I tried. After all, the person you fall in love with may not be 'special' in anyone else's eyes but your own; but it hardly matters.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on January 20, 2015, 12:18:55 PM
I'd like to say several things in response to this:

1. These are lists of favourites, not attempts at some sort of objective assessment of greatness (the conclusions of which activity would in any case be questionable I think, as with art of any kind).
2. Elgar is up there for me (and others) quite simply because I've loved his music over most of a lifetime. I loved it when I first heard it at the age of 16. I still love it (in all sorts of ways, some the same, some different) more than 50 years later. I can't justify that in a way that would explain it to anyone else, any more than I could justify any other kind of love that wasn't shared.
3. So it's not about which league or galaxy his music might belong to in relation to other composers, but about impassioned and intuitive personal responses that I couldn't change if I tried. After all, the person you fall in love with may not be 'special' in anyone else's eyes but your own; but it hardly matters.

Great post, Elgarian! I completely concur.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: springrite on January 20, 2015, 12:21:40 PM
I really need to give Havergal Brian another chance. What would you recommend I listen to first? I have a decent sized Brian collection.
10 and 31.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on January 20, 2015, 12:42:03 PM
10 and 31.

Thanks, Paul. I'll definitely give these a listen soon.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: springrite on January 20, 2015, 12:54:56 PM
Thanks, Paul. I'll definitely give these a listen soon.
Remember me mentioning the 10th so many times as my air disaster symphony? Because as I worked on the victims of the air disasters, that symphony represented exactly how I felt -- the monumental task at hand, the weight, the loss, sadness, grit, determination and, not exactly hope but gradual … well, it's very personal for me.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: milk on January 20, 2015, 02:30:24 PM
Depends on the day...but...
Bach
Feldman
Debussy
Schumann
Shostakovich
Beethoven
Xenakis
Koechlin
L. Couperin
Mozart
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ibanezmonster on January 20, 2015, 02:47:49 PM
Xenakis
I wonder if we're the only two with Xenakis on our list...?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on January 20, 2015, 02:53:06 PM
I like my hot sauce like I like my music: needs to be overwhelmingly strong.
I like music to be varied, therefore I will probably always prefer Beethoven or Mozart to Mahler or Bruckner. I do not like spiciness for its own sake. And I find Beethoven often overwhelmingly strong; I am not sure if I find any Mahler symphony except maybe his 9th or 6th as overwhelmingly strong as e.g. Beethovens 3rd, 5th, 9th.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ZauberdrachenNr.7 on January 20, 2015, 02:57:43 PM
I'd like to say several things in response to this:

1. These are lists of favourites, not attempts at some sort of objective assessment of greatness (the conclusions of which activity would in any case be questionable I think, as with art of any kind).
2. Elgar is up there for me (and others) quite simply because I've loved his music over most of a lifetime. I loved it when I first heard it at the age of 16. I still love it (in all sorts of ways, some the same, some different) more than 50 years later. I can't justify that in a way that would explain it to anyone else, any more than I could justify any other kind of love that wasn't shared.
3. So it's not about which league or galaxy his music might belong to in relation to other composers, but about impassioned and intuitive personal responses that I couldn't change if I tried. After all, the person you fall in love with may not be 'special' in anyone else's eyes but your own; but it hardly matters.

Agree 110% (the extra is for enthusiasm), Elgarian, but I believe there's room here for the telling, however ob- or subjective, of one's loves.  You use the word justify in your explanation, which may be the crux of the matter; you are right - there's no need for justification.  Still, you can do justice to your love by telling us what you hear in Elgar - I'd be appreciative - and you may spur listens, as well as greater appreciation, perhaps conversions...  The difficulty of communication is no reason not to attempt it.  GMGers are empathetic, sensitive and capable of putting themselves in others' listening chairs (that's only a slight exaggeration :laugh:).  If your love is too personal, that I can well understand.  To me, Elgar is a composer of the first rank; I esp. enjoy Sea Pictures which is not a work often cited by his fans.  At the same time, much of his work seems to me to present a conundrum - one curiously mirrored by your comments above - he is one of the most extraordinarily personal of composers and yet his musical language is so reflexive that it presents impediments to those who make the attempt to "get him."  (I'm not thinking solely here of the Enigma Variations but it's a good example of his modus operandi).  One suspects he is saying things he would or could not say in any other way; I hope you're not subject to the same conditions! 
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on January 20, 2015, 03:00:35 PM
Remember me mentioning the 10th so many times as my air disaster symphony? Because as I worked on the victims of the air disasters, that symphony represented exactly how I felt -- the monumental task at hand, the weight, the loss, sadness, grit, determination and, not exactly hope but gradual … well, it's very personal for me.

Ah, yes. I do remember this now, Paul. Will keep this in mind as I listen. Not your experience per se, but the emotion that must have been in the air during this time.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: EigenUser on January 20, 2015, 03:53:32 PM
Depends on the day...but...
Bach
Feldman
Debussy
Schumann
Shostakovich
Beethoven
Xenakis
Koechlin
L. Couperin
Mozart
and I wonder if we're the only two with Feldman on our list...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: springrite on January 20, 2015, 04:12:56 PM
and I wonder if we're the only two with Feldman on our list...

Three. Feldman has always been on my list, from the first moment I heard his first note.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: EigenUser on January 20, 2015, 05:10:31 PM
Three. Feldman has always been on my list...
+1!

...from the first moment I heard his first note.
...and waited and waited for the next note? :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: springrite on January 20, 2015, 05:35:56 PM
...and waited and waited for the next note? :D

Well, that's what naps are for!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: mc ukrneal on January 20, 2015, 07:14:09 PM
I'd like to say several things in response to this:

1. These are lists of favourites, not attempts at some sort of objective assessment of greatness (the conclusions of which activity would in any case be questionable I think, as with art of any kind).
2. Elgar is up there for me (and others) quite simply because I've loved his music over most of a lifetime. I loved it when I first heard it at the age of 16. I still love it (in all sorts of ways, some the same, some different) more than 50 years later. I can't justify that in a way that would explain it to anyone else, any more than I could justify any other kind of love that wasn't shared.
3. So it's not about which league or galaxy his music might belong to in relation to other composers, but about impassioned and intuitive personal responses that I couldn't change if I tried. After all, the person you fall in love with may not be 'special' in anyone else's eyes but your own; but it hardly matters.
I would add that what attracted us to the music in the first place will also likely be a factor. When I was younger, I loved the loud/crass/breathless/brassy/etc type of classical music. Think full orchestra playing. Think Russian Sailor's Dance, Sabre Dance, Tchaikovsky's 5th symphony: last movement, Verdi's Requiem: Dies Irae, Prokofiev's Alexander Nevsky: Battle of the Ice, etc. This is what first attracted me and it remains a love to this day. I've grown into Baroque/Renaissance and Chamber, for example, but my first love will probably be these thrilling, soul-wrenching climaxes that are the thing I love most.

So depending how far we get from where we start is a factor, at least I think so. And this was why I had to wait quite a long time to really enjoy chamber music (but also explains my love of opera).  I never thought I'd enjoy chamber, but when I was ready I heard a Piano Trio from Brahms and it touched me as much as any piece of music I have heard. From there, I discoved Bach's Cello Suites, which helped open up another world I had not always enjoyed. And the journey goes on. But as our tastes expand, so does our appreciation of composers we once found wanting. It is why I hesitate to bash composers too much (or at all), because it reflects more on us than it does the composer at hand.

But it can also help us appreciate composers we thought we knew. I long liked Donizetti, but always felt there was a certain sameness to his music and stopped exploring after only a handful of operas. But as my tastes expanded and I heard new works, I could come back to Donizetti and realize the great skill he employed throughout his operas, so much so that I now have at least more than a dozen and try to acquire 1-2 new pieces of his every year.

WHich brings me full circle back to Elgar. Here is a composer who I have long enjoyed - one can blast those symphonies or the cello concerto, but there is so much more to his music. It is a rich tapestry, one that I have always gravitated towards. Today, I think I appreciate him (and dozens of others) far more just because my understanding and appreciation has expanded. The two pieces that helped open the door were the second symphony and the Music Makers (particularly the latter). But more importantly, appeciation of Elgar had opened the door to many other composers who I might never have discovered, like Foulds or Butterworth or Parry (just as my appreciation of Donizetti also led me back to Rossini and Bellini).

I just hope I never stop discovering new music or new aspects to music I already know. Personally, I'd never want to go back to a point where I was hearing a piece for the first time. I think life and appreciation make those pieces all the more close to my heart.

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on January 20, 2015, 07:39:40 PM
Which brings me full circle back to Elgar. Here is a composer who I have long enjoyed - one can blast those symphonies or the cello concerto, but there is so much more to his music. It is a rich tapestry, one that I have always gravitated towards. Today, I think I appreciate him (and dozens of others) far more just because my understanding and appreciation has expanded. The two pieces that helped open the door were the second symphony and the Music Makers (particularly the latter). But more importantly, appeciation of Elgar had opened the door to many other composers who I might never have discovered...

Bravo, Neal! Take a bow. Sorry, I had to single out this section about Elgar. :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on January 21, 2015, 02:07:45 AM
I did not mean to offend the Elgar lovers. However, after Greg expressed some puzzlement that Beethoven was so high on many peoples's lists I did likewise for Elgar. And I still find it surprising that Elgar is so highly esteemed. I would not have wondered too much if he had been on some lists hovering around positions 8-10, but for me it is astonishing that several have him as favorite or at least among the top positions. I would be similarly puzzled if a bunch of people had named Franz Schmidt, Reger or Pfitzner as their favorites. (But apparently everybody would be puzzled in such a case... I wonder if anyone here not from the Anglosphere has Elgar among his top ten.)

I like Sea pictures, the Enigmas and the Cello concerto (without finding any of it overwhelming or extraordinary), but the symphonies have been basically colossal bores to me so far, although I keep trying once in a while. I got the violin concerto last year but do not remember much about it (except that it is extremely long).
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on January 21, 2015, 02:30:20 AM
I wonder if anyone here not from the Anglosphere has Elgar among his top ten.
71 dB
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: milk on January 21, 2015, 02:32:21 AM
I wonder if we're the only two with Xenakis on our list...?
A badge of honor? 
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: 71 dB on January 21, 2015, 02:33:00 AM
And I still find it surprising that Elgar is so highly esteemed.
As an Elgarian I have always seen things from an another angle (meaning I don't see Elgar surprisingly highly esteemed).

I would not have wondered too much if he had been on some lists hovering around positions 8-10, but for me it is astonishing that several have him as favorite or at least among the top positions.
It's Elgarian and me having Elgar at the top spot. That's several to you? Most people here don't have Elgar's in their top 10 at all. Aren't you overstating Elgar success here a bit?

I would be similarly puzzled if a bunch of people had named Franz Schmidt, Reger or Pfitzner as their favorites. (But apparently everybody would be puzzled in such a case... I wonder if anyone here not from the Anglosphere has Elgar among his top ten.)
We like what we like. No need to get puzzled about it.

I like Sea pictures, the Enigmas and the Cello concerto (without finding any of it overwhelming or extraordinary), but the symphonies have been basically colossal bores to me so far, although I keep trying once in a while. I got the violin concerto last year but do not remember much about it (except that it is extremely long).
The symphonies seem to be 'difficult' for many. However, calling them colossal bores makes me puzzled.  ;)

Just know that we Elgarians really do find wonderful things in Elgar's music and that's why some may even put Elgar on top.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: milk on January 21, 2015, 02:36:07 AM
Three. Feldman has always been on my list, from the first moment I heard his first note.
I feel like most composers are like, "here's a violin! here's a piano." Whereas Feldman is like, "here's a sound." Anyway, it took me a little time, but once he clicked he really clicked with me.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sergeant Rock on January 21, 2015, 02:50:40 AM
A badge of honor?

A symptom of mental instability?  ;D ;)

Sarge
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on January 21, 2015, 02:58:34 AM
As an Elgarian I have always seen things from an another angle (meaning I don't see Elgar surprisingly highly esteemed).
It's Elgarian and me having Elgar at the top spot. That's several to you? Most people here don't have Elgar's in their top 10 at all. Aren't you overstating Elgar success here a bit?
And Mirror Image on 1, André had him second, but his list maybe was not ordered. Yes, compared to Magnard, Schmidt and Pfitzner (I think they were on nobody's) this is an astonishing success, I believe.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: 71 dB on January 21, 2015, 03:05:47 AM
And Mirror Image on 1, André had him second, but his list maybe was not ordered. Yes, compared to Magnard, Schmidt and Pfitzner (I think they were on nobody's) this is an astonishing success, I believe.
Oh, my mistake. 
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: milk on January 21, 2015, 04:05:12 AM
A symptom of mental instability?  ;D ;)

Sarge
Ha! That too!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on January 21, 2015, 02:46:59 PM
I did not mean to offend the Elgar lovers. However, after Greg expressed some puzzlement that Beethoven was so high on many peoples's lists I did likewise for Elgar. And I still find it surprising that Elgar is so highly esteemed. I would not have wondered too much if he had been on some lists hovering around positions 8-10, but for me it is astonishing that several have him as favorite or at least among the top positions. I would be similarly puzzled if a bunch of people had named Franz Schmidt, Reger or Pfitzner as their favorites. (But apparently everybody would be puzzled in such a case... I wonder if anyone here not from the Anglosphere has Elgar among his top ten.)

I like Sea pictures, the Enigmas and the Cello concerto (without finding any of it overwhelming or extraordinary), but the symphonies have been basically colossal bores to me so far, although I keep trying once in a while. I got the violin concerto last year but do not remember much about it (except that it is extremely long).

Ditto. He wrote some good tunes. The chamber music I have heard is excellent.  The cello concerto is very good, as are some of the Enigmas. Most of the rest is overblown, overlong. It's hard not to detect the pompous self importance so evident in his photos in his Important Big Works like the symphonies or Gerontius. He's better in the smaller stuff.

*runs for cover*
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on January 21, 2015, 02:52:35 PM
A symptom of mental instability?  ;D ;)

Sarge
Not that that's a bad thing!
I can totally see Feldman as a top tenner. He's not for me, but he takes an approach that can change the way you listen to music. Not just his music, but any music. Philip Glass had that effect on me. Gotta love that.

It's Elgar who's the puzzle wrapped in a mystery shrouded in an ... (you know the rest)  :laugh:
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: André on January 21, 2015, 04:40:45 PM
Elgar was indeed second on my list. Three new purchases pushed him up on my list: the Crown of India twofer on Chandos, the same label's Sea Pics + TDoG, and the 30 disc EMI box. That in itself should signal how much I revere him: where your money goes... ;)

Among my top works in their genres, which always stop me in my tracks when played on the radio: Symphony 1, Cello Cto, Violin Cto, Alassio, TDoG, Enigma. Hearing those make me stop everything else.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Bogey on January 21, 2015, 05:05:34 PM
Elgar was indeed second on my list. Three new purchases pushed him up on my list: the Crown of India twofer on Chandos, the same label's Sea Pics + TDoG, and the 30 disc EMI

Isn't that cool how that can happen when you keep listening to music.  Neat.
Title: Re: Your Top 15 Favorite Composers
Post by: Moonfish on January 21, 2015, 05:23:40 PM
Updating as the "list" changes every full moon.....

Bach
Elgar
Sibelius
R Strauss
Wagner
Verdi
Beethoven
Chopin
Bruckner
Mozart
Weiss
Marais
Haydn
Schubert
Mahler


I know - I'm cheating...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on January 22, 2015, 12:24:59 AM
Ditto. He wrote some good tunes. The chamber music I have heard is excellent.  The cello concerto is very good, as are some of the Enigmas. Most of the rest is overblown, overlong. It's hard not to detect the pompous self importance so evident in his photos in his Important Big Works like the symphonies or Gerontius. He's better in the smaller stuff.

*runs for cover*
There is not much chamber music, is there? I have never heard anything of it, but I will definitely check it out. As I said, to me the veneration of Elgar seemed a British (or at least Anglo) thing. I still think there are a bunch of more interesting composers from around 1900 who are comparably obscure, like some of the ones I mentioned. Of course, Pfitzner or Schmidt are even in Germany or Austria no way as popular as Elgar is in the Anglosphere (although they were never almost forgotten like Draeseke or Joseph Marx), but this is because of Mahler, Strauss, Schönberg etc.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Elgarian on January 22, 2015, 02:13:12 AM
Agree 110% (the extra is for enthusiasm), Elgarian, but I believe there's room here for the telling, however ob- or subjective, of one's loves.  You use the word justify in your explanation, which may be the crux of the matter; you are right - there's no need for justification.  Still, you can do justice to your love by telling us what you hear in Elgar - I'd be appreciative - and you may spur listens, as well as greater appreciation, perhaps conversions...  The difficulty of communication is no reason not to attempt it.  GMGers are empathetic, sensitive and capable of putting themselves in others' listening chairs (that's only a slight exaggeration :laugh:).  If your love is too personal, that I can well understand.  To me, Elgar is a composer of the first rank; I esp. enjoy Sea Pictures which is not a work often cited by his fans.  At the same time, much of his work seems to me to present a conundrum - one curiously mirrored by your comments above - he is one of the most extraordinarily personal of composers and yet his musical language is so reflexive that it presents impediments to those who make the attempt to "get him."  (I'm not thinking solely here of the Enigma Variations but it's a good example of his modus operandi).  One suspects he is saying things he would or could not say in any other way; I hope you're not subject to the same conditions!

If you look back through this thread you'll discover that I haven't been in any way reticent about writing about what I hear in Elgar's music over the years (possibly repetitively to the point of tedium!). There are lots and lots of things to be said. But when it comes down to this personal question of love - which is what I was discussing in this case - there's not much to be done except to declare it.

But for the rest - the intricacies of the violin concerto and the significance of its cadenza, the depth of feeling in The Spirit of England, the astonishing journey that is the 1st symphony ... I doubt I'll ever tire of discussing things like those.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Elgarian on January 22, 2015, 02:30:23 AM
It's hard not to detect the pompous self importance so evident in his photos in his Important Big Works like the symphonies or Gerontius. He's better in the smaller stuff.

I don't think it's so simple. Elgar was a very complicated chap, full of self-doubt, constantly afraid of failure, struggling against the disadvantage of being (a) self-taught, and (b) a Catholic. What you see in the photos is a man struggling to present a particular kind of image to the world, and all is not what it seems.

Thing is ... I agree with you that the chamber works etc are exquisite, but I don't hear pomposity or overblown-ness in the symphonies, or the violin concerto. I never have. They seem to me no less intensely felt than the smaller-scale works, though of course they do carry with them some of the period's Zeitgeist, which is unavoidable.

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Elgarian on January 22, 2015, 02:34:30 AM
But as our tastes expand, so does our appreciation of composers we once found wanting. It is why I hesitate to bash composers too much (or at all), because it reflects more on us than it does the composer at hand.

If I wore T-shirts, I'd be tempted to have one made with this printed on it. My quote of the week.

Spot on, Neal!!!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Christo on January 22, 2015, 02:41:17 AM
Probably posted some list here before, but today they are, in alphabetical order:

Arnold
Barber
Bate
Berkeley (père)
Braga Santos
Brian
Cooke
Dvořák
Falla
Guarnieri
Gershwin
Holmboe
Holst
Janáček
Kinsella
Nielsen
Pierné
Ravel
Respighi
Shostakovich
Tubin
Vaughan Williams
Villa-Lobos (to make it ten  ;))

Edit: forgot to mention my rising star:  Hindemith  :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Elgarian on January 22, 2015, 02:45:10 AM
I did not mean to offend the Elgar lovers. However, after Greg expressed some puzzlement that Beethoven was so high on many peoples's lists I did likewise for Elgar. And I still find it surprising that Elgar is so highly esteemed. I would not have wondered too much if he had been on some lists hovering around positions 8-10, but for me it is astonishing that several have him as favorite or at least among the top positions.

Oh gosh, no one is offended - well at least, I'm certainly not. I just wanted to clarify what was happening in these lists we're making.

I'm still mildly surprised by your surprise, though. I'd have thought that someone else's love for something we don't admire ourselves would often seem hard to empathise with, no matter what it might be. Elgar, abstract painting, blue cheese ...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: 71 dB on January 22, 2015, 03:54:57 AM
Ditto. He [Elgar] wrote some good tunes. The chamber music I have heard is excellent.  The cello concerto is very good, as are some of the Enigmas. Most of the rest is overblown, overlong. It's hard not to detect the pompous self importance so evident in his photos in his Important Big Works like the symphonies or Gerontius. He's better in the smaller stuff.

*runs for cover*

Imo, Elgar wrote one bad tune, Sevillana Op. 7. :)

This is rather common image of Elgar, but as a person who knows his music somewhat well, I don't agree to that image at all. What people describe as overblown I find rich and powerful. Listen to the quieter parts of Elgar's music and hear how rich they are. Elgar builds his fortissimos and climaxes on that "background" and when you do that, using your rich thematic material in sophisticated ways, it becomes what some people think is overblown. When you 'get' the music and what's going on you might find it heavenly.

I don't find Elgar's often long works (his Violin Concerto is among the longest ever I think) overlong at all. I could take 2 hours long symphonies from him anyday, because his music is so brilliant.

I understand Elgar can't be everybody's cup of tea, but it's sad if resilient steteotypic images prevent people to enjoy the music to it's full potential.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: vandermolen on January 22, 2015, 11:54:05 AM
Probably posted some list here before, but today they are, in alphabetical order:

Arnold
Barber
Bate
Berkeley (père)
Braga Santos
Brian
Cooke
Dvořák
Falla
Guarnieri
Gershwin
Holmboe
Holst
Janáček
Kinsella
Nielsen
Pierné
Ravel
Respighi
Shostakovich
Tubin
Vaughan Williams
Villa-Lobos (to make it ten  ;))

Edit: forgot to mention my rising star:  Hindemith  :)

I guessed who this list was from before I read the name.  :)

'Tubin, Braga Santos, Kinsella....' Were the giveaways.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: springrite on January 22, 2015, 12:07:26 PM
I guessed who this list was from before I read the name.  :)

'Tubin, Braga Santos, Kinsella....' Were the giveaways.

Not to mention the length...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: vandermolen on January 22, 2015, 12:35:27 PM
Not to mention the length...
:)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Christo on January 22, 2015, 12:45:26 PM
I guessed who this list was from before I read the name.  :)

'Tubin, Braga Santos, Kinsella....' Were the giveaways.

Happy I kept my anonymity as a member of the Alcoholics Anonymous.   :-X
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: springrite on January 22, 2015, 12:46:45 PM
I guessed who this list was from before I read the name.  :)

'Tubin, Braga Santos, Kinsella....' Were the giveaways.

Or should I also mention alphabetical ?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: PaulR on January 23, 2015, 11:34:18 AM
Swore I posted in this before.....Updated list regardless.....

1. Shostakovich
2. Weinberg
3. Schumann
4.  Biber
5. Haydn
6. Beethoven
7. Mussorgsky
8. Martinu
9. Corelli
10. Brahms
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: vandermolen on January 23, 2015, 12:59:57 PM
Today's list. If Christo can list 20 composers, so can I. 8) 21 actually.

Braga Santos
Bate
Miaskovsky
Bliss
Vaughan Williams
Kinsella
Rootham
Dyson
Copland
Rubbra
Shostakovich
Honegger
Bruckner
Bax
Gliere
Tubin
Glazunov
Sibelius
Klami
Madetoja
Rosenberg
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Christo on January 23, 2015, 01:08:27 PM
Today's list. If Christo can list 20 composers, so can I. 8) 21 actually.

 8) Cannot disagree with any of your choices, except that I know too little Rootham (missed the favoured Lyrita CD, so far). See that you dived deeper into Bruckner in between.  :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on January 23, 2015, 02:16:42 PM
Today's list. If Christo can list 20 composers, so can I. 8) 21 actually.

Braga Santos
Bate
Miaskovsky
Bliss
Vaughan Williams
Kinsella
Rootham
Dyson
Copland
Rubbra
Shostakovich
Honegger
Bruckner
Bax
Gliere
Tubin
Glazunov
Sibelius
Klami
Madetoja
Rosenberg

I do not know Klami, Rootham, Bate
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on January 23, 2015, 02:26:32 PM
I do not know Klami, Rootham, Bate
Klami thread (http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,15205)

https://www.youtube.com/v/ShEoY4XgSNg     https://www.youtube.com/v/vmXsPr8mEYU
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: André on January 23, 2015, 05:26:46 PM
I do not know Rootham, Bate.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on January 23, 2015, 06:38:24 PM
Klami thread (http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,15205)

https://www.youtube.com/v/ShEoY4XgSNg     https://www.youtube.com/v/vmXsPr8mEYU

Merci. I will check him out.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on January 23, 2015, 07:32:46 PM
Today's list. If Christo can list 20 composers, so can I. 8) 21 actually.

Braga Santos
Bate
Miaskovsky
Bliss
Vaughan Williams
Kinsella
Rootham
Dyson
Copland
Rubbra
Shostakovich
Honegger
Bruckner
Bax
Gliere
Tubin
Glazunov
Sibelius
Klami
Madetoja
Rosenberg

Okay, I'll play, too! 8) Top 21:

Elgar
Vaughan Williams
Shostakovich
Ravel
Bartok
Britten
Stravinsky
Berg
Schnittke
Villa-Lobos
Martinu
Delius
Janacek
Barber
Prokofiev
Respighi
Sculthorpe
Poulenc
Debussy
Szymanowski
Copland
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: EigenUser on January 24, 2015, 03:27:21 AM
Okay, I'll play, too! 8) Top 21:

Elgar
Vaughan Williams
Shostakovich
Ravel
Bartok
Britten
Stravinsky
Berg
Schnittke
Villa-Lobos
Martinu
Delius
Janacek
Barber
Prokofiev
Respighi
Sculthorpe
Poulenc
Debussy
Szymanowski
Copland
Top 22  >:D :P:
1. Bartok
2. Ligeti
3. Ravel
4. Messiaen
5. Haydn
6. Mahler
7. Feldman
8. Gershwin
9. Debussy
10. Mendelssohn
11. Schumann
12. Ohana
13. Ockeghem
14. Webern
15. Stravinsky
16. Bruckner
17. Boulez
18. Dvorak
19. Reich
20. Ades
21. Tchaikovsky
22. Beethoven

The last three are admittedly 'bottom of the barrel'. Not the composers (lol at the idea of calling LvB 'bottom of the barrel') -- just things I need to hear more of, but that have the potential of being top.

Based solely on the Op. 9b, Schoenberg is a possibility for 23. I think the world of that piece.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: The new erato on January 24, 2015, 03:34:23 AM
I'm so boring. My favorites are the great names, even though I listen mainly to lesser names, 
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on January 24, 2015, 04:51:05 AM
I'm so boring. My favorites are the great names, even though I listen mainly to lesser names,
I am even more boring; my favorites (see somewhere above) are all great names and I mainly listen to their music (although quite a bit of lesser names as well, lately I think Telemann might make it into my top 20  ::))
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: The new erato on January 24, 2015, 05:12:16 AM
Of course I stil take healthy doses of Bach cantatas, Beethoven string quartets and Brahms chamber music, but I know the canon quite well and have great joy in discovering less known music, even though I usually see quite clearly why it is less known. But it is a great pity that the great stuff put some "very good but not quite on that level" music in the shade. And the vagaries of musical history has a surpsing number of "might gave beens".
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on January 24, 2015, 11:45:46 AM
You "boring" guys sound a bit like Hugh Hefner lamenting he was never with any plain women.
 8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Christo on January 24, 2015, 03:33:28 PM
To some, 'great names' are not always the dearest composers they know. That's all.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: vandermolen on January 24, 2015, 04:17:19 PM
To some, 'great names' are not always the dearest composers they know. That's all.

Absolutely and nothing 'boring' about that too. Am just discovering Schubert.  ::)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Moonfish on January 24, 2015, 07:27:03 PM
Heck, I am doing 21 as well! Perhaps a bit traditional.  :-\ I need to bring in more Baroque composers into the 21 "realm"!

Bach
Elgar
Sibelius
R Strauss
Wagner
Verdi
Beethoven
Chopin
Bruckner
Mozart
Weiss
Marais
Haydn
Schubert
Mahler
Debussy
Rameau
Vaughan Williams
Brahms
Vivaldi
Dvorak

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: vandermolen on January 25, 2015, 12:01:06 AM
Heck, I am doing 21 as well! Perhaps a bit traditional.  :-\ I need to bring in more Baroque composers into the 21 "realm"!

Bach
Elgar
Sibelius
R Strauss
Wagner
Verdi
Beethoven
Chopin
Bruckner
Mozart
Weiss
Marais
Haydn
Schubert
Mahler
Debussy
Rameau
Vaughan Williams
Brahms
Vivaldi
Dvorak

No 'need' to do anything I would have thought. Your list features the composers whom many would consider 'greatest' I guess. I don't know Weiss and Marais so must investigate them. I recognise that many of my favourite composers ( those whose music means the most to me and that I find most enjoyable) are not necessarily 'great composers'. Very interesting to see peoples lists.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on January 25, 2015, 12:52:24 AM
You "boring" guys sound a bit like Hugh Hefner lamenting he was never with any plain women.
 8)
If I see lists of which I am not even familiar with some names and of several others I know nothing except the names, one could rather get the impression that I was only with blondes and missing a lot out there. But there is only so much time and energy to spend and as we know (some) gentlemen just prefer blondes...

[/sexist pig mode]
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Christo on January 25, 2015, 01:52:10 AM
one could rather get the impression that I was only with blondes and missing a lot out there. But there is only so much time and energy to spend and as we know (some) gentlemen just prefer blondes...

Interesting! A Top 21 from that perspective would perhaps look like:
(http://assets9.classicfm.com/2009/05/franz-liszt-1233586692-hero-wide-1.jpg)(https://mmpt-pictures.s3.amazonaws.com/edvardninagrieg.jpg)(http://b.bimg.dk/node-images/178/8/2200x/8178101-carl-nielsen-p-new-yorksk-thumb.jpg)(http://www.thestar.com/content/dam/thestar/entertainment/2011/12/07/tafelmusik_gets_a_handel_on_show/handel_sitting_by_toddkorol.jpeg.size.xxlarge.letterbox.jpeg)(http://gavlesymfoniorkester.se/images/segerstam_scary.png)(http://www.nwtv.nl/wp-content/uploads/Vivaldi.jpg)  ;)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on January 25, 2015, 02:19:42 AM
white = blonde?
It seems that more composers were dark-haired than blonde, although there are many where I do not have a clue. Vivaldi was the "red priest" and Mozart apparently also reddish-light brown, but all the other bewigged and powdered guys?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on February 06, 2015, 06:53:26 AM
Hmm. Somewhere along the line I managed a top 17 of this site, and I wrote it down... and now I can use that again for a top 10, but with one adjustment as a composer has done well enough with more recent purchases/discoveries to win a place higher up.

In chronological order:

Bach, J.S.
Haydn
Beethoven
Chopin
Brahms
Dvorak
Faure
Rachmaninov
Ravel
Holmboe
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on February 10, 2015, 01:08:01 PM
Now hang on, wasn't this Top Three before?

1. Beethoven
2. Dvorak
T3. Chopin
T3. Schubert
5. Ravel
6. Janacek
7. Berlioz
8. Haydn
9. Martinu
10. Tchaikovsky Schumann
Well, that was an easy update.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on February 10, 2015, 01:33:23 PM
A newly revised list:

1. Elgar
2. Delius
3. RVW
4. Bartók
5. Ravel
6. R. Strauss
7. Britten
8. Sibelius
9. Janáček
10. Villa-Lobos
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ibanezmonster on February 10, 2015, 01:39:50 PM
A newly revised list:

1. Elgar
2. Delius
3. RVW
4. Bartók
5. Ravel
6. R. Strauss
7. Britten
8. Sibelius
9. Janáček
10. Villa-Lobos
Maybe you should stop making lists... Shostakovich isn't even on that one.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on February 10, 2015, 01:49:10 PM
The axis of power has swung to the English.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on February 10, 2015, 01:50:18 PM
Well, that was an easy update.

Какой ужас!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sergeant Rock on February 10, 2015, 02:03:47 PM
Will the real MI please stand up  ;D :laugh:

I'll start...

1. Ravel
2. Bartok
3. Stravinsky
4. Poulenc
5. Shostakovich
6. Villa-Lobos
7. Vaughan Williams
8. Szymanowski
9. Janacek10. Berg
Top 10 Favorite Composers (revised):
1. Schnittke
2. Shostakovich
3. Bartók
4. Ravel
5. Stravinsky
6. Britten
7. Sibelius
8. Berg
9. Prokofiev
10. Schoenberg

Newly revised list:

1. Elgar
2. RVW
3. Shostakovich
4. Ravel
5. Bartok
6. Stravinsky
7. Britten
8. Schnittke
9. Berg
10. Martinu

 8)
Newly revised list:

1. Elgar
2. RVW
3. Shostakovich
4. Ravel
5. Bartok
6. Britten
7. Stravinsky
8. Berg
9. Martinu
10. Sculthorpe
A newly revised list:

1. Elgar
2. Delius
3. RVW
4. Bartók
5. Ravel
6. R. Strauss
7. Britten
8. Sibelius
9. Janáček
10. Villa-Lobos

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on February 10, 2015, 02:07:31 PM
Will the real MI please stand up  ;D :laugh:
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: mc ukrneal on February 10, 2015, 02:11:28 PM
Maybe you should stop making lists... Shostakovich isn't even on that one.
I am so confused. How can he fall that far?!?!? This adds to Sarge's list...

For DavidW:

1. Ravel
2. Bartok
3. Stravinsky
4. Poulenc
5. Shostakovich
...

Here's going to be a difficult list to make (for some), but narrow down your favorite composers to three choices and THREE CHOICES ONLY PLEASE!!!! No honorable mentions and no second guessing. This is your final list of three composers who you couldn't live without and that give you the most satisfaction of them all. Now go!!! :D

Mine would be the following:

Shostakovich:

(http://chicagoclassicalreview.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/Shostakovich.jpg)

Schnittke:

(http://24.media.tumblr.com/62d6d0b4a51a9d884f1126bde14da235/tumblr_mjjyrdSxZ61ri5efwo1_500.jpg)

Hartmann:

(http://notendatenbank.net/kbild/hartmann_karl_amadeus.jpg)
Abiding Bulldog's wishes to pick one and one only I choose Shostakovich. 8) I don't think I could ever be without his music and his music, especially over the past few months, has conjured up so many feelings for me.
:o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on February 10, 2015, 02:24:21 PM
The word that springs to mind is "flighty".
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Christo on February 10, 2015, 02:50:59 PM
If that's the true spirit here, my revised list may now look like:

1. Strauss (all of them)
2. Jenkins Karl
3. Stockhausen James
4. Schicklgruber
5. Pachelbel (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JdxkVQy7QLM)
6. Mozart (père)
7. Brahms (fils)
8. Bourgeois Derek
9. Schumann (the German, double n)
10. Nanes Richard
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on February 10, 2015, 03:03:16 PM
Oh, boy. I see I'm the butt of some jokes again. I love it! ;D I guess this just proves what a difficult task it is to narrow down your favorites to only 10 choices. :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sergeant Rock on February 10, 2015, 03:44:16 PM
5. Pachelbel (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JdxkVQy7QLM)

 :D :laugh: :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on February 10, 2015, 09:05:15 PM
Newly revised list....


JUST KIDDING!!!!!

;D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Dancing Divertimentian on February 10, 2015, 09:57:04 PM
Newly revised list....


JUST KIDDING!!!!!

;D

At least Britten was there every time. :)


Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on February 10, 2015, 10:08:12 PM
At least Britten was there every time. :)

Britten's music made quite an impression on me when I first heard it. I had bought that Rattle Conducts Britten 2-CD set on EMI and the rest was history. 8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: mc ukrneal on February 11, 2015, 03:57:18 AM
Oh, boy. I see I'm the butt of some jokes again. I love it! ;D I guess this just proves what a difficult task it is to narrow down your favorites to only 10 choices. :)
It's just such a surprise. For so long, Shostakovich was immovable on your lists. But then it was suddenly not even in the top 10! He hasn't gone the route of Delius has he?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on February 11, 2015, 07:23:43 AM
It's just such a surprise. For so long, Shostakovich was immovable on your lists. But then it was suddenly not even in the top 10! He hasn't gone the route of Delius has he?

Oh, no. I still love Shostakovich's music, it's just that it is so hard to pick just 10 which proves this is a difficult exercise to begin with or at least for me.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: TheGSMoeller on February 11, 2015, 07:38:07 AM
Oh, no. I still love Shostakovich's music, it's just that it is so hard to pick just 10 which proves this is difficult exercise to begin with or at least for me.

I can appreciate this. I love lists, creating them and reading others, but I know that every year can offer different results. Four years ago Bruckner wasn't even in my top 30 listened to composers, now he's who I listen to the most or at least in the past year. But I don't know if that means I need to change my list, but I can understand how listening habits alter.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on February 11, 2015, 07:41:47 AM
I can appreciate this. I love lists, creating them and reading others, but I know that every year can offer different results. Four years ago Bruckner wasn't even in my top 30 listened to composers, now he's who I listen to the most or at least in the past year. But I don't know if that means I need to change my list, but I can understand how listening habits alter.

Indeed. It's interesting you mention Bruckner because four years ago he was actually in my top 10. :) Yes, listening habits can certainly change, but I have found that the composers that we always return to are the ones that we truly love or at least that's the way I've started to feel about it.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ritter on February 11, 2015, 08:07:04 AM
I can only commend Mirror Image on his wise decision to drop DSCH form his list!  :D  Aplogies! That was an unnecessary remark form me  :-[, and de gustibus non est disputandum...

I once tried (in a Spanish language forum) to get people to say which composer's they thought  were their 10 "fundamental" ones. By "fundamental", I meant that the enjoyed there music (i.e., subjectively), and also they thought they were "objectively" (if there is such a thing) "great", "important" or "influential". A silly exercise, perhaps, but one that tried to avoid someone saying soemthing like "Gabriel Pierné is one of the greatest compsers ever"... The results were compared, and the outcome was quite interesting.

My contribution then (and it remains unchanged, I daresay), was--in chronological order:

Claudio Monteverdi
Johann Sebastian Bach
Wolgang Amadeus Mozart
Ludwig van Beethoven
Richard Wagner
Gustav Mahler
Claude Debussy
Igor Stravinsky
Alban Berg
Pierre Boulez

Of course, the lists of runner-ups were very long (and as revealing as was what we then called the "A-list").

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: DaveF on February 12, 2015, 11:20:54 AM
Oh, no. I still love Shostakovich's music...

The interesting thing about this exercise (for me) is not necessarily the composers (although some incredulous fun is to be had from those who claim to be unable to live without the music of Johann Gambolputty - Johann Gambolputty??, we all go), but the fact that (for me) the top 10 are not at all the same as the composers of one's favourite top 10 pieces.  Mine fall conveniently into two divisions: those I really can't live without and those I really really can't live without.  So top 5:

Byrd
Bach
Haydn
Nielsen
Stravinsky

and second-division 5:

Messiaen
Tallis
Mozart
Beethoven
Sibelius

with Schumann as a late tactical substitution.

(BTW, MI, your Delius avatar looks a lot like Martinů - keeping your options open?)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Cato on February 12, 2015, 12:01:51 PM
I can appreciate this. I love lists, creating them and reading others, but I know that every year can offer different results. Four years ago Bruckner wasn't even in my top 30 listened to composers, now he's who I listen to the most or at least in the past year. But I don't know if that means I need to change my list, but I can understand how listening habits alter.

Creeping Brucknerism is at least a benign disease!   0:)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on February 12, 2015, 07:26:32 PM
The interesting thing about this exercise (for me) is not necessarily the composers (although some incredulous fun is to be had from those who claim to be unable to live without the music of Johann Gambolputty - Johann Gambolputty??, we all go), but the fact that (for me) the top 10 are not at all the same as the composers of one's favourite top 10 pieces.  Mine fall conveniently into two divisions: those I really can't live without and those I really really can't live without.  So top 5:

Byrd
Bach
Haydn
Nielsen
Stravinsky

and second-division 5:

Messiaen
Tallis
Mozart
Beethoven
Sibelius

with Schumann as a late tactical substitution.

(BTW, MI, your Delius avatar looks a lot like Martinů - keeping your options open?)

I have always liked this picture of Delius as it was used for a Royal Mail stamp and postcard (of which I own). As for him looking like Martinu, I'll have to say there is only a passing similarity to me. Thanks for your list. Very interesting.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Walt Whitman on February 17, 2015, 06:42:46 PM
All Time Favorites:

1. J.S. Bach
2. Beethoven
3. Mozart
4. Haydn
5. Rameau
6. Vivaldi
7. Pärt
8. Schubert
9. Fauré
10. Händel
11. Brahms
12. Liszt
13. Bruckner
14. Copland
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Minor Key on March 22, 2015, 11:35:30 AM
In order:
1. Mahler
2. Schubert
3. Beethoven
4. J.S. Bach
5. Mozart
6. Dvorak
7. Sibelius
8. RVW
9. Brahms
10. Haydn
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: André on March 24, 2015, 09:14:54 AM
In order:
1. Mahler
2. Schubert
3. Beethoven
4. J.S. Bach
5. Mozart
6. Dvorak
7. Sibelius
8. RVW
9. Brahms
10. Haydn

I would replace Dvorak by Bruckner and leave all others in - although in no particular order. Methink we have good taste  :laugh:.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: EigenUser on May 03, 2015, 01:31:49 AM
New (replaced Mahler with Beethoven):
1. Bartok
2. Ligeti
3. Ravel
4. Messiaen
5. Haydn
6. Beethoven
7. Feldman
8. Gershwin
9. Debussy
10. Mendelssohn

I haven't really listened to Gershwin or Mendelssohn in ages, but I could never remove them. I still love their music.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Papy Oli on May 03, 2015, 10:42:42 AM
let's see...

The unchallenged top 3 :

1. Mahler
1. Bruckner
1. Beethoven

then 2 proper newcomers in the last year, mostly thanks to Hogwood...

2. Haydn
2. Vivaldi

then 7 long-serving regulars.

3. D. Scarlatti
3. Satie
3. Schubert
3. Pärt
3. Chopin
3. Rameau
3. Loewe (could have possibly been Stravinsky)


The one that tantalizingly knocks at the door : JS Bach...

hmmm.... time for some slight revisions..

1. Mahler
2. Beethoven
3. Bruckner
4. Haydn
5. Bach
6. D.Scarlatti
7. Vivaldi
8. Rameau
9. Chopin
10. Victoria or Tallis or Gesualdo.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jubal Slate on May 03, 2015, 10:53:36 AM
Um...
Beethoven
Chopin
Schubert
Brahms
Bach
Prokofiev
Haydn
Mozart
Sibelius(?)
Renaissance :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Dax on May 03, 2015, 11:52:10 AM
Ives
Alkan
Szymanowski
Medtner
Grainger
Ellington

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Moonfish on May 03, 2015, 12:08:26 PM
I think these lists are a cruel exercise. I can't sleep at night and if I do fall asleep the composers that didn't make my list haunt me in horrible nightmares!!!!!!    ::)

I think that is Stockhausen's ghost...

(http://a392.idata.over-blog.com/2/73/31/88/Divers/The_Nightmare-_1782.jpg)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sergeant Rock on May 03, 2015, 12:11:40 PM
I think that is Stockhausen's ghost...

He's haunting damn near everyone.

Sarge
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: vandermolen on May 03, 2015, 12:15:59 PM
I think these lists are a cruel exercise. I can't sleep at night and if I do fall asleep the composers that didn't make my list haunt me in horrible nightmares!!!!!!    ::)

I think that is Stockhausen's ghost...

(http://a392.idata.over-blog.com/2/73/31/88/Divers/The_Nightmare-_1782.jpg)

Fuseli's great painting 'Nightmare' featured on the cover of Bernard Herrmann's LP recording of Raff's fine Symphony 5 'Lenore' years ago. It also appeared on the CD.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 03, 2015, 01:09:34 PM
I think these lists are a cruel exercise. I can't sleep at night and if I do fall asleep the composers that didn't make my list haunt me in horrible nightmares!!!!!!    ::)

I think that is Stockhausen's ghost...

(http://a392.idata.over-blog.com/2/73/31/88/Divers/The_Nightmare-_1782.jpg)

If Stockhausen is anywhere near your Top 10 you don't deserve to sleep.

 8) >:D :blank: :laugh:
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 03, 2015, 01:11:00 PM
Ghosts?
"Forget Banquo, you have Stockhausen now."
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Moonfish on May 03, 2015, 01:17:55 PM
If Stockhausen is anywhere near your Top 10 you don't deserve to sleep.

 8) >:D :blank: :laugh:

Nah! It would probably be Marais that is haunting me...     0:)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Moonfish on May 04, 2015, 04:49:07 PM
I am starting to suspect that very few of us actually have a top ten list in our mind. Most likely it revolves around a top 30 or 40 (or even 50) batch that changes slightly as time goes by.    :P
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on May 04, 2015, 11:49:09 PM
I actually find a top ten much easier than top 30. With top 10 I have some trouble with the last two spots but with Top 30 the bottom 10 or 15 get quite random, I am afraid. Maybe top 50 is easy again because than I can name almost any composer I care about a little.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: NJ Joe on May 05, 2015, 04:00:01 PM
JS Bach
Mozart
Beethoven
Brahms
Debussy
Sibelius
Ravel
Bartok
Stravinsky

Choosing a 10th is too difficult right now.


Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on May 05, 2015, 04:09:08 PM
My list has changed quite a bit since last time (in no particular order):

Sibelius
RVW
Ravel
Bartok
Stravinsky
Britten
Shostakovich
Nielsen
Prokofiev
Tchaikovsky
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 05, 2015, 04:15:15 PM
My list has changed quite a bit since last time (in no particular order):

Sibelius
RVW
Ravel
Bartok
Stravinsky
Britten
Shostakovich
Nielsen
Prokofiev
Tchaikovsky
Barber
Koechlin
Delius
Schnitke
J L Adams
Elgar


RIP
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on May 05, 2015, 04:18:27 PM
Barber
Koechlin
Delius
Schnitke
J L Adams
Elgar


RIP

 :P Oh, you know my lists are never set in stone, Kenny. I do plan on keeping Sibelius on my top 10, though and Nielsen, too. Ravel and Bartok have always been in my top 10.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Moonfish on May 05, 2015, 09:31:43 PM
My list has changed quite a bit since last time (in no particular order):

Sibelius
RVW
Ravel
Bartok
Stravinsky
Britten
Shostakovich
Nielsen
Prokofiev
Tchaikovsky

John,
It is hard to believe that you removed your demigod Delius from your list (as well as Elgar for that matter).   :o :o :o :'( :'( :'(

This is why we need top 30 lists....!
 :D :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on May 05, 2015, 09:58:01 PM
Will the real MI please stand up  ;D :laugh:
8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 06, 2015, 03:19:45 AM
I'm going to post today first, and then go back and check however I posted earlier:

In alphabetical order...

Brahms
Chopin
Haydn
Prokofiev
D. Scarlatti
Schoenberg
Shostakovich
Stravinsky
Vaughan Williams
da Victoria
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 06, 2015, 03:25:29 AM
My next-earlier post seems to have been at a time when we were allowing an even dozen:

Twelve? Let's see . . .

Stravinsky
Schoenberg
Prokofiev
Shostakovich
Chopin
Berlioz
JS Bach
Rakhmaninov
Sibelius
Nielsen

Brahms
D. Scarlatti
 
Getting the first ten is easy ... and then I wonder, whom am I leaving out, and I'll kick myself (figuratively) for the omission?...

I was aware of "missing" Berlioz, Nielsen & Sibelius this go-around;  they have not fallen into "disfavor," strictly speaking . . . as the names came to my mind, though, I acknowledged that in fact I have not been listening to much (any) of their music of late.  Likewise, although they've been absent from my recent listening, Bach & Rakhmaninov remain best-loved composers.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on May 06, 2015, 04:35:39 AM
My next-earlier post seems to have been at a time when we were allowing an even dozen:

I was aware of "missing" Berlioz, Nielsen & Sibelius this go-around;  they have not fallen into "disfavor," strictly speaking . . . as the names came to my mind, though, I acknowledged that in fact I have not been listening to much (any) of their music of late.  Likewise, although they've been absent from my recent listening, Bach & Rakhmaninov remain best-loved composers.
I know just the thing for the lack of recent Sibelius listening. ;)

https://www.youtube.com/v/3S_ItXpjWNE


I think I'll join in the list-making & comparison.

Ravel
Bach
Sibelius
Chopin
Janáček
Brahms
Berlioz
Stravinsky
Prokofiev
Bartók


E: I don't seem to have posted in this thread before. Oh well, I don't think the list is that different from earlier ones.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 06, 2015, 04:50:42 AM
I know just the thing for the lack of recent Sibelius listening. ;)

https://www.youtube.com/v/3S_ItXpjWNE


An excellent suggestion!  8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on May 06, 2015, 05:21:00 AM
John,
It is hard to believe that you removed your demigod Delius from your list (as well as Elgar for that matter).   :o :o :o :'( :'( :'(

This is why we need top 30 lists....!
 :D :D

I still a lot of Delius' music, but he didn't make the cut this time around. I felt that Sibelius and Nielsen deserved the Top 10 spots this time.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: springrite on May 06, 2015, 05:23:05 AM
John is the Don Giovanni of music listeners!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on May 06, 2015, 05:24:55 AM
John is the Don Giovanni of music listeners!

 :P
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 06, 2015, 05:25:01 AM
John,
It is hard to believe that you removed your demigod Delius from your list (as well as Elgar for that matter).   :o :o :o :'( :'( :'(

This is why we need top 30 lists....!
 :D :D

Give Mirror Image enough time, and you will ascertain his top 30 from the names that have been included in his top 10 at various points.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: springrite on May 06, 2015, 05:27:25 AM
Give Mirror Image enough time, and you will ascertain his top 30 from the names that have been included in his top 10 at various points.

Much like The Pleasure Dome of Kubla Khan!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 06, 2015, 05:31:45 AM
John is the Don Giovanni of music listeners!

Mille e tre . . . .
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ZauberdrachenNr.7 on May 06, 2015, 06:08:11 AM
Brahms
Stravinsky
Debussy
Martinů
Janáček
Sibelius
Berlioz
Wagner
Mahler
Messiaen


VW is #11 and Scriabin #12 (sneaky, eh?)  The only change from my previous list, Berg fell to include Berlioz - was shocked to see he wasn't in my original.  Truth is I haven't listened to Alban much lately, except the VC.  I may appear to be a man of constant constancy, but I think about and listen to many more golden oldies than ever before : esp.  Marais, Scarlatti, Rameau, and that lesser known figure, J.S. Bach, so - underneath the surface - tumult reigns in the #13-25 spots. Among the moderns, I'll betcha Philip Glass will prob. become - in future - the acknowledged master of the late 20th/early 21st centuries.  Also, recently, I've growing appreciation for William Alwyn whose Sinfonia for String Orchestra is a must-hear
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 06, 2015, 06:31:41 AM
Among the moderns, I'll betcha Philip Glass will prob. become - in future - the acknowledged master of the late 20th/early 21st centuries. 

Are you talking (a) within your own personal canon, or (b) more generally?

My responses are (b) over my dead body and (a) my God man, you need help.

EDIT: You have reminded me though... Last week, after being subjected to an egregious bit of dance combined with minimalism (another composer, not Glass), my father reflected that Glass appeared to have got over his "boring period". This was on the basis of having not hated a film score, not from hearing any self-contained music that was tolerable. To the best of my recollection this is the first time we have swapped opinions on Glass - I'm pretty sure we reached the same dislike independently.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on May 06, 2015, 06:36:26 AM
Are you talking (a) within your own personal canon, or (b) more generally?

My responses are (b) over my dead body and (a) my God man, you need help.

EDIT: You have reminded me though... Last week, after being subjected to an egregious bit of dance combined with minimalism, my father reflected that Glass appeared to have got over his "boring period". This was on the basis of having not hated a film score, not from hearing any self-contained music that was tolerable. To the best of my recollection this is the first time we have swapped opinions on Glass - I'm pretty sure we reached the same dislike independently.

Yeah, I'm not fond of Glass or Minimalism in general, although I do love Part, but he's just a different kind of Minimalist to my ears.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 06, 2015, 06:43:49 AM
Yeah, I'm not fond of Glass or Minimalism in general, although I do love Part, but he's just a different kind of Minimalist to my ears.

I have had the occasional opportunity to compare Glass to other composers labelled as 'minimalist', and Glass has consistently lost those comparisons. I'm not wholly against minimalism, it's just that his particular brand of it completely uninspiring to me.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on May 06, 2015, 06:46:28 AM
I have had the occasional opportunity to compare Glass to other composers labelled as 'minimalist', and Glass has consistently lost those comparisons. I'm not wholly against minimalism, it's just that his particular brand of it completely uninspiring to me.

I like the kind of Minimalism like Part's where the music is laid bare and the music seems to get to the essential. There's a sparseness in Part that I admire. Glass is Glass...I can say not no more. Glass is Glass...I can say not more. Glass is Glass...... ;D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: mc ukrneal on May 06, 2015, 06:46:36 AM
John is the Don Giovanni of music listeners!
Now I am worried - that doesn't end well...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: springrite on May 06, 2015, 07:08:55 AM
Now I am worried - that doesn't end well...

Not necessarily so. I am reminded of a production in San Diego, where The Don was supposed to stand on one spot on stage where a square block is supposed to go down, taking him "down to hell". But there was a malfunction and it got stuck only a foot or two down. After two tries, The Don shouted: "This a great! Hell is full! Ha!"
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 06, 2015, 07:24:11 AM
(* chortle *)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jubal Slate on May 06, 2015, 07:28:36 AM
Spinal Don
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jaakko Keskinen on May 06, 2015, 07:43:24 AM
Not necessarily so. I am reminded of a production in San Diego, where The Don was supposed to stand on one spot on stage where a square block is supposed to go down, taking him "down to hell". But there was a malfunction and it got stuck only a foot or two down. After two tries, The Don shouted: "This a great! Hell is full! Ha!"

ROFL  :laugh:
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ZauberdrachenNr.7 on May 06, 2015, 10:45:02 AM
Are you talking (a) within your own personal canon, or (b) more generally?

My responses are (b) over my dead body and (a) my God man, you need help.

EDIT: You have reminded me though... Last week, after being subjected to an egregious bit of dance combined with minimalism (another composer, not Glass), my father reflected that Glass appeared to have got over his "boring period". This was on the basis of having not hated a film score, not from hearing any self-contained music that was tolerable. To the best of my recollection this is the first time we have swapped opinions on Glass - I'm pretty sure we reached the same dislike independently.

 :)Ans:  B. More generally - I believe he will be seen as revelatory of our age, the human expression of the digital age in which we're immersed.  You'll note he's not in my top 10, or 12, but I'm an antiquarian by nature and trade.  I do like much of his oeuvre, in particular his film work - The Thin Blue Line for example was extraordinarily, compellingly effective.  Am 'studying' hard his 2nd VC - collecting comments & reviews and hope to look at the score soon. 
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sergeant Rock on May 06, 2015, 11:02:35 AM
Not necessarily so. I am reminded of a production in San Diego, where The Don was supposed to stand on one spot on stage where a square block is supposed to go down, taking him "down to hell". But there was a malfunction and it got stuck only a foot or two down. After two tries, The Don shouted: "This a great! Hell is full! Ha!"

 ;D :D ;D

Reminds me of a Flying Dutchman I saw in Mannheim. Near the end, where the Dutchman's ship is supposed to disappear (it had appeared in quite spectacular fashion), the mechanism jammed shortly after the transformation began and half the ship stayed firmly onstage. Through the loud climactic orchestral passage we could quite clearly hear the curses of a stagehand as he whacked something metallic with a hammer to get it going  ;D

Sarge
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Moonfish on May 06, 2015, 01:49:50 PM
(http://www.delius.org.uk/images/delius1907.jpg)

"Did you forget me so quickly....?"   :'( :'(



I agree with everything you wrote about Delius. He was a composer I found completely by accident. I remember I was looking for Delibes on Google one night and you know how sometimes if you misspell something Google would ask you "Did you mean _____?" They suggested Delius to me and, me being the curious person I am, I started researching Delius instead of Delibes. This is where my curiosity paid I think. He's one of my absolute favorite composers and I don't think there's anything written by him that dislike. I do have some problems with A Mass of Life, but it contains lovely music. I loved the three operas I heard: A Village Romeo & Juilet, Fennimore and Gerda, and Koanga (awesome opera!). I love his orchestral music from his concerti to the tone poems. Sea Drift is gorgeous as are Songs of Sunrise, Songs of Sunset, Requiem, Idyll, etc. I have loved this composer's music from the very first listen. I believe the first work I heard was In A Summer Garden and this completely won me over.

Don't forget disengaging. ;) ;D Thanks, Ray. I haven't completely shut the door on Mozart like many people here have done with my favorite composer, Delius. I guess this shows that I continue to have an open-mind while these people simply do not. :)

It's that time of the year. Time to change the avatar to Elgar and with good reason. I LOVE this composer's music.

Crying my eyes out right now...Delius how could I have deceived you...listened to Songs of Sunset tonight and something just came over me. Such beautiful, evocative music.

Switched my avatar to Miles Davis as I'm leaving behind classical for an indefinite amount of time. Will definitely be visiting 'The Diner' a lot, though.

Certainly. Personally, I never understood the attraction to this composer but I'm sure many are wondering the same for my love of Delius' music. ;)

My list has changed quite a bit since last time (in no particular order):

Sibelius
RVW
Ravel
Bartok
Stravinsky
Britten
Shostakovich
Nielsen
Prokofiev
Tchaikovsky

(https://publicintelligence.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/mildec-cycle.png)  ;) ;) ;) ;) :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 06, 2015, 02:47:30 PM
Sounds like a movie, The Last Delian.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 06, 2015, 03:17:38 PM
Last Delian Napping
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Moonfish on May 06, 2015, 03:45:59 PM
The Clash of the Delians
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 06, 2015, 03:53:20 PM
The Clash of the Delians

(http://media.sdreader.com/img/events/2014/10376144_879705402044708_462938777969549573_n_t240.jpg?9b075e176a263354460210e5f64f6db9d4623575)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Moonfish on May 06, 2015, 03:54:51 PM
(http://media.sdreader.com/img/events/2014/10376144_879705402044708_462938777969549573_n_t240.jpg?9b075e176a263354460210e5f64f6db9d4623575)

Celibidache conducting?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Moonfish on May 06, 2015, 04:01:32 PM
The Last Temptation of Delius
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 06, 2015, 05:28:24 PM
The Last Temptation of Delius

This is the only time temptation and Delius have been used in the same sentence.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Moonfish on May 06, 2015, 05:29:04 PM
This is the only time temptation and Delius have been used in the same sentence.

Hey! Your post must be the second time!!!!  :P
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on May 06, 2015, 06:06:29 PM
Ouch...I've been slaving away all day at work and I have come to my home away from home to read this?!?!? I love it! :P Carry on! ;)

To steal a Karl phrase:

*munches popcorn*
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 06, 2015, 07:20:42 PM
:)Ans:  B. More generally - I believe he will be seen as revelatory of our age, the human expression of the digital age in which we're immersed. 

That's pretty much what Radiohead is for.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ZauberdrachenNr.7 on May 07, 2015, 03:11:20 AM
That's pretty much what Radiohead is for.

I make periodic attempts to grasp current pop culture and honestly wish I could understand - even just a smidgen of understanding - why this band is so popular.  I don't get it, nor Coldplay, or many others...If anyone can explain these, it would be so much appreciated.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on May 07, 2015, 03:29:04 AM
I think most of the popculture is too closely linked to a fleeting "zeitgeist" of a few years, or sometimes a particular subculture. Not to an "age" like a decade or three. I never really was interested in pop culture, but in my twenties I "listened along" with some friends and acquaintances. The music of the early/mid-90s, like Nirwana, often linked to the ominous "Generation X" now seems very distant, and of course, it's been about 20 years or more. But the wistful/depressive grunge style can hardly be said to have been relevant for the general mood around the turn of the millenium. It had expired a few years before.
Musically, I never found any of it interesting.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 07, 2015, 03:43:26 AM
I make periodic attempts to grasp current pop culture and honestly wish I could understand - even just a smidgen of understanding - why this band is so popular.  I don't get it, nor Coldplay, or many others...If anyone can explain these, it would be so much appreciated.

Ugh. The very fact that you linked together Radiohead and Coldplay is proof enough of your incomprehension.

But I'm certainly not going to get into a big discussion about pop music on this thread, in fact not on the forum in general because I've already seen what kind of reaction would occur. The sole reason for referencing Radiohead is that your claims for Glass, about expressing the digital age and so on, are eerily reminiscent of the kind of remarks that music journalists tended to make in relation to Radiohead, particularly around the time of their most heavily acclaimed albums in 1997 and 2000.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on May 07, 2015, 03:45:51 AM
But don't you think Cobain's achievement was tied rather closely to a certain zeitgeist or youth culture 20-25 years ago? Does anyone younger than 30 listen to this stuff (maybe they do not even know it)? How many 40somethings of 2015 still listen to Nirwana etc. frequently?

We probably have to wait another 3-5 years or so, as the 1980s have already had their revival, the 1990s are due next.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 07, 2015, 04:34:50 AM
But don't you think Cobain's achievement was tied rather closely to a certain zeitgeist or youth culture 20-25 years ago? Does anyone younger than 30 listen to this stuff (maybe they do not even know it)? How many 40somethings of 2015 still listen to Nirwana etc. frequently?

We probably have to wait another 3-5 years or so, as the 1980s have already had their revival, the 1990s are due next.

If you're talking to me, I'm going to make two related comments.

The first is that the pace of artistic and musical change has accelerated in exactly the same way as the pace of all societal change has accelerated.

The second is that I don't think you're showing a lot of awareness of the pace of musical change in previous eras when 'classical' music was actually the music of the day. Stuff went in and out of fashion pretty rapidly. Composers that we now admire were either considered old-fashioned by the end of their career or started off unpopular. Think about, for example, how much change there was in Beethoven's music in the space of 20 years or less, and how much change there was in the reactions to his music.

Nirvana is hardly a good example. They ended for a very obvious reason, and are no longer creating any new music. The connection to a specific time is because they were only creating at a specific time - in exactly the same way that there are a scattering of classical composers who are now minor figures because they died very young while showing 'potential'. Who the heck knows where Nirvana would have gone if Cobain wasn't dead? Dave Grohl spun off a second career as the lead of Foo Fighters instead. Meanwhile I'm going to Tori Amos concerts, 22/3 years after she started, and sometimes encountering fans who weren't even born when she started. I'm also listening to the music of Joni Mitchell, much of which was written before my own birth. And Nirvana's chief "rivals" at the time, Pearl Jam, are still around.

You simply cannot assess the long-range reaction to music within that kind of timeframe. You need longer, and you also need to recognise these assessments are almost always subject to change. J.S. Bach was largely ignored for a couple of generations by anyone except fellow-composers.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on May 07, 2015, 05:04:48 AM
Reminds me of a Flying Dutchman I saw in Mannheim. Near the end, where the Dutchman's ship is supposed to disappear (it had appeared in quite spectacular fashion), the mechanism jammed shortly after the transformation began and half the ship stayed firmly onstage. Through the loud climactic orchestral passage we could quite clearly hear the curses of a stagehand as he whacked something metallic with a hammer to get it going  ;D

A true Gesamtkunstwerk, if ever there was one!  ;D ;D ;D

TD


Joh. Sebast. Bach
Haydn
Mozart
Beethoven
Schubert
Schumann
Chopin
Brahms
Tchaikovsky
Rachmaninoff



Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ZauberdrachenNr.7 on May 07, 2015, 02:47:35 PM
Ugh. The very fact that you linked together Radiohead and Coldplay is proof enough of your incomprehension.

But I'm certainly not going to get into a big discussion about pop music on this thread, in fact not on the forum in general because I've already seen what kind of reaction would occur. The sole reason for referencing Radiohead is that your claims for Glass, about expressing the digital age and so on, are eerily reminiscent of the kind of remarks that music journalists tended to make in relation to Radiohead, particularly around the time of their most heavily acclaimed albums in 1997 and 2000.

Hey! Thanks for your insights! :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: NJ Joe on May 17, 2015, 07:40:52 AM
JS Bach
Mozart
Beethoven
Brahms
Debussy
Sibelius
Ravel
Bartok
Stravinsky

Choosing a 10th is too difficult right now.

Okay, until further notice I'm going with Vaughan Williams for my 10th.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: vandermolen on May 17, 2015, 10:47:32 AM
Okay, until further notice I'm going with Vaughan Williams for my 10th.

An excellent choice.  :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Christo on May 17, 2015, 11:57:41 AM
An excellent choice.  :)

Some of us need even less than ten options to choose him.  ;D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: sheri1983 on August 16, 2015, 04:07:46 AM
Beethoven
Mozart
J. S.Bach
Handel
Schubert
Wagner
Brahms
Telemann
Chopin
Haydn

I'm into the Baroque period to my bones I just love it! and also the Romanticism.

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on August 16, 2015, 05:18:57 PM
Beethoven
Mozart
J. S.Bach
Handel
Schubert
Wagner
Brahms
Telemann
Chopin
Haydn

I'm into the Baroque period to my bones I just love it! and also the Romanticism.

Just out of curiosity, no love for 20th Century composers?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on August 17, 2015, 05:17:57 AM
Just out of curiosity, no love for 20th Century composers?
There's certainly no requirement. The baroque is pretty freaking awesome.  :)

By the way, welcome to GMG, sheri1983!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jaakko Keskinen on August 17, 2015, 05:37:31 AM
The baroque is pretty freaking awesome.  :)

It took me a long time to learn to love baroque. One day I even mentioned to my friend, half-jokingly: "All the baroque music sounds the same."
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on August 17, 2015, 06:36:04 AM
It took me a long time to learn to love baroque. One day I even mentioned to my friend, half-jokingly: "All the baroque music sounds the same."

Even during the long-ish period when I was, so to say, sympathetic to that snark  ;) , I always had something of a foot in the door, thanks to (a number of items, really, but probably principally) the Bach I had performed (both as part of a chorus, and clarinet transcriptions of the solo sonatas, partitas, & suites).

Even my conditioned disdain for Le quattro stagioni proved to be more a function of unimaginative programming on the part of the local classical music stations (back when we had some)  8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on August 17, 2015, 06:41:37 AM
It took me a long time to learn to love baroque. One day I even mentioned to my friend, half-jokingly: "All the baroque music sounds the same."
;D Didn't Stravinsky allegedly say so, about Vivaldi?

For me that idea was exploded the first time I listened to Biber.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jaakko Keskinen on August 17, 2015, 07:05:11 AM
Even though baroque is still easily among those music eras that I know least about, I do like baroque nowadays. Bach's violin concertos, violin sonatas and partitas, cello suites, Kunst der Fuge and above all else Goldberg variations rarely fail to impress me. However, I don't really like the Passions. I'm sure there is nothing wrong with the compositions, it's just a matter of personal preference. Handel has several delightful operas, unfortunately most of them relatively rarely staged. Oratorios too, naturally, and Water music. Not sure if I've heard The fireworks.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: 71 dB on August 17, 2015, 07:55:18 AM
Baroque is so much more than J. S. Bach, Handel, Vivaldi and Purcell.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on August 17, 2015, 08:03:13 AM
Even though baroque is still easily among those music eras that I know least about, I do like baroque nowadays. Bach's violin concertos, violin sonatas and partitas, cello suites, Kunst der Fuge and above all else Goldberg variations rarely fail to impress me. However, I don't really like the Passions. I'm sure there is nothing wrong with the compositions, it's just a matter of personal preference.
The cantatas, dear fellow! The Passions were meant for special occasions and I certainly don't find myself listening to them more often than that, but the cantatas are ideal for daily consumption.

Quote
Handel has several delightful operas, unfortunately most of them relatively rarely staged. Oratorios too, naturally, and Water music. Not sure if I've heard The fireworks.
And don't forget the concerti grossi, organ concertos, trio sonatas, or the solo sonatas.


Baroque is so much more than J. S. Bach, Handel, Vivaldi and Purcell.
Yes, and more than even just Monteverdi, Schütz, Buxtehude, Sweelinck, Bononcini, Pergolesi, Zelenka, Lully, L & Fr. Couperins, Mondonville, Rameau.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on August 17, 2015, 10:07:43 AM
You consider Monteverdi a Baroque composer?  I always think of him more Renaissance

 :o

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: 71 dB on August 17, 2015, 10:18:40 AM
You consider Monteverdi a Baroque composer?  I always think of him more Renaissance, although I know chronologically he bridged the periods.
Monteverdi is a transitional late Renaissance/early Baroque composer. I don't count him a "pure" Baroque composer. I consider Schütz and Frescobaldi among the first pure early Baroque composers.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on August 17, 2015, 10:33:12 AM
You consider Monteverdi a Baroque composer?  I always think of him more Renaissance, although I know chronologically he bridged the periods.
Seconda prattica is certainly Baroque to me.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jaakko Keskinen on August 17, 2015, 10:20:50 PM
Yes, and more than even just Monteverdi, Schütz, Buxtehude, Sweelinck, Bononcini, Pergolesi, Zelenka, Lully, L & Fr. Couperins, Mondonville, Rameau.

I do like Monteverdi and Lully, somewhat...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: sheri1983 on August 18, 2015, 06:46:53 AM
There's certainly no requirement. The baroque is pretty freaking awesome.  :)

By the way, welcome to GMG, sheri1983!
Thanks, I listen to classical music from about 15 years, too late to join this great community.

About love for 20's century composer I'm really not into new movements and styles that came after Wagner, examples of music I listened to was Stravinsky and Shostakovitch but truly I didn't feel it and didn't feel in connection with it, Not trying to be judgmental But I love Spiritual music which I found in the Baroque style.

The classical Era with Haydn and Mozart which introduces a stable and more established music maybe because they didn't hit by the french revolution yet!

And I found the heroic Romantic music which Beethoven brought to the surface and Schubert resume it to a sorrow perfection are more enjoyable and personal to me, however I'm ready for any good recommendations!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: sheri1983 on August 18, 2015, 06:54:04 AM
Baroque is so much more than J. S. Bach, Handel, Vivaldi and Purcell.
Of course there is a gold mine in Albinoni, Telemann, Buxtehude, Monteverdi, Corelli, Scarlatti, Rameau, Couperin and Tartini Compositions
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jay F on August 18, 2015, 06:55:38 AM
1. Mahler
2. Beethoven
3. Schubert
4. Bach
5. Mozart
6. Shostakovich
7. Vivaldi
8. Bruckner
9. Brahms
10. Verdi (I'm not a big opera fan, but the man did give us "Di Provenza.")
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on August 18, 2015, 07:58:02 AM
Thanks, I listen to classical music from about 15 years, too late to join this great community.

About love for 20's century composer I'm really not into new movements and styles that came after Wagner, examples of music I listened to was Stravinsky and Shostakovitch but truly I didn't feel it and didn't feel in connection with it, Not trying to be judgmental But I love Spiritual music which I found in the Baroque style.

The classical Era with Haydn and Mozart which introduces a stable and more established music maybe because they didn't hit by the french revolution yet!

And I found the heroic Romantic music which Beethoven brought to the surface and Schubert resume it to a sorrow perfection are more enjoyable and personal to me, however I'm ready for any good recommendations!
Some suggestions, in no particular order, that might make you reconsider the previous century. There's plenty to connect everything here to traditions from earlier eras.

Rakhmaninov: All-night Vigil
Stravinsky: Symphony of Psalms, Apollo, Pulcinella
Sibelius: Lemminkäinen Suite, Symphonies nos. 2-7
Nielsen: Symphony no. 3, Clarinet Concerto
Ravel: Piano Trio
Pärt: Stabat Mater and Cantus in Memoriam Benjamin Britten

Shostakovich: Preludes & Fugues Op. 87
Britten: Ceremony of Carols and Cello Suites
Elgar: Violin Sonata
Debussy: Suite bergamasque, La cathédrale engloutie
Martinů: Nonet
Poulenc: Concerto for Two Pianos, Flute Sonata

Janáček: On the Overgrown Path
Bartók: Romanian Folk Dances, Rhapsodies nos. 1 & 2 for violin & piano / violin & orchestra.
Copland: Appalachian Spring
Villa-Lobos: Introduction to the Chôros, Chôros nos. 1-5, Five Preludes for guitar
Silvestrov: La Belle Dame Sans Merci (from the Silent Songs)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jaakko Keskinen on August 18, 2015, 08:24:09 AM
Sibelius: Lemminkäinen Suite,

Isn't Lemminkäinen from 19th century?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on August 18, 2015, 08:37:55 AM
Isn't Lemminkäinen from 19th century?
Sure, but it bridges the later Sibelius nicely.

I'll make use of this opportunity and add Prokofiev's Piano Concerto no. 3 to the list.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on August 18, 2015, 08:46:16 AM
And there are a lot of composers writing choral music today which invokes the great spiritual traditions of centuries past, like Morten Lauridsen, Eric Whitacre, Gyorgy Orban, Veljo Tormis, and Slawomir Czarnecki. :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on August 18, 2015, 08:47:16 AM
And there are a lot of composers writing choral music today which invokes the great spiritual traditions of centuries past, like Morten Lauridsen, Eric Whitacre, Gyorgy Orban, Veljo Tormis, and Slawomir Czarnecki. :)

I'm cryin', here.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on August 18, 2015, 08:48:28 AM
And there are a lot of composers writing choral music today which invokes the great spiritual traditions of centuries past, like Morten Lauridsen, Eric Whitacre, Gyorgy Orban, Veljo Tormis, and Slawomir Czarnecki and Henning :)
Absolutely. And the first two items, and the Pärt, on my list might have something to do with that, too.  ;)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: springrite on August 18, 2015, 08:49:01 AM
I'm cryin', here.

…and Karl Henning...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on August 18, 2015, 08:58:57 AM
(Well, fie on me for fishing.)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on August 18, 2015, 09:06:08 AM
(Well, fie on me for fishing.)
Well, and I was sticking to 20th century on my list. Which opp. are from the previous century? Henning's HQ (http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,92.msg915001.html#msg915001)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on August 18, 2015, 09:12:10 AM
Well, and I was sticking to 20th century on my list. Which opp. are from the previous century? Henning's HQ (http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,92.msg915001.html#msg915001)

Oh, his best work is 21st-c., no question!  Brian had specifically said composers writing choral music today  8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on August 18, 2015, 09:18:56 AM
I'm cryin', here.
d'oh!!  :( :(
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on August 18, 2015, 10:22:28 AM
Here's a list of 10 works that is slightly out of step with Karlo's current list for 20th Century recommendations for our new member:

Messiaen: L'ascension
Sculthorpe: Kakadu
Ligeti: Lontano
Panufnik: Autumn Music
Hartmann: Symphony No. 6
Xenakis: Hiketides
Scelsi: Konx-Om-Pax
Lutoslawski: Piano Concerto
Schnittke: Cello Concerto No. 1
Takemitsu: A String Around Autumn
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on August 18, 2015, 10:43:09 AM
Here's a list of 10 works that is slightly out of step with Karlo's current list for 20th Century recommendations for our new member:

Messiaen: L'ascension
Sculthorpe: Kakadu
Ligeti: Lontano
Panufnik: Autumn Music
Hartmann: Symphony No. 6
Xenakis: Hiketides
Scelsi: Konx-Om-Pax
Lutoslawski: Piano Concerto
Schnittke: Cello Concerto No. 1
Takemitsu: A String Around Autumn

Forgot SoLlong Shostakovich, It's Been Nice Knowing You But Don't Call Us, We'll Call You by some Georgian composer whose name escapes me.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on August 18, 2015, 10:58:47 AM
Here's a list of 10 works that is slightly out of step with Karlo's current list for 20th Century recommendations for our new member:

Messiaen: L'ascension
Sculthorpe: Kakadu
Ligeti: Lontano
Panufnik: Autumn Music
Hartmann: Symphony No. 6
Xenakis: Hiketides
Scelsi: Konx-Om-Pax
Lutoslawski: Piano Concerto
Schnittke: Cello Concerto No. 1
Takemitsu: A String Around Autumn
???  ??? why would you recommend these to somebody who prefers baroque music?!?!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on August 18, 2015, 11:11:13 AM
???  ??? why would you recommend these to somebody who prefers baroque music?!?!

I'm just gonna recommend Out in the Sun and leave the rest to you guys ....

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on August 18, 2015, 11:36:02 AM
???  ??? why would you recommend these to somebody who prefers baroque music?!?!

As I mentioned, my list is merely an extension, or 'side-step', from Karlo's list. There's more to the 20th Century then what happened in the first half of it.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on August 18, 2015, 11:44:56 AM
Forgot SoLlong Shostakovich, It's Been Nice Knowing You But Don't Call Us, We'll Call You by some Georgian composer whose name escapes me.

Kancheli? :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: sheri1983 on August 19, 2015, 06:15:06 AM
Some suggestions, in no particular order, that might make you reconsider the previous century. There's plenty to connect everything here to traditions from earlier eras.

Rakhmaninov: All-night Vigil
Stravinsky: Symphony of Psalms, Apollo, Pulcinella
Sibelius: Lemminkäinen Suite, Symphonies nos. 2-7
Nielsen: Symphony no. 3, Clarinet Concerto
Ravel: Piano Trio
Pärt: Stabat Mater and Cantus in Memoriam Benjamin Britten

Shostakovich: Preludes & Fugues Op. 87
Britten: Ceremony of Carols and Cello Suites
Elgar: Violin Sonata
Debussy: Suite bergamasque, La cathédrale engloutie
Martinů: Nonet
Poulenc: Concerto for Two Pianos, Flute Sonata

Janáček: On the Overgrown Path
Bartók: Romanian Folk Dances, Rhapsodies nos. 1 & 2 for violin & piano / violin & orchestra.
Copland: Appalachian Spring
Villa-Lobos: Introduction to the Chôros, Chôros nos. 1-5, Five Preludes for guitar
Silvestrov: La Belle Dame Sans Merci (from the Silent Songs)
Thanks for the list, will listen and give you my opinion also I found Debussy interesting as I have listen to some pieces I found profound
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jaakko Keskinen on August 19, 2015, 06:21:42 AM
Thanks for the list, will listen and give you my opinion also I found Debussy interesting as I have listen to some pieces I found profound

Debussy is definitely worth a few (thousand) listenings. Definitely one of my favorite French composers.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: sheri1983 on August 19, 2015, 06:22:34 AM
Here's a list of 10 works that is slightly out of step with Karlo's current list for 20th Century recommendations for our new member:

Messiaen: L'ascension
Sculthorpe: Kakadu
Ligeti: Lontano
Panufnik: Autumn Music
Hartmann: Symphony No. 6
Xenakis: Hiketides
Scelsi: Konx-Om-Pax
Lutoslawski: Piano Concerto
Schnittke: Cello Concerto No. 1
Takemitsu: A String Around Autumn
Thanks, happy to see work for Cello as it is my favorite instrument. will check it out.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on August 19, 2015, 06:42:44 AM
Thanks, happy to see work for Cello as it is my favorite instrument. will check it out.
Some more recommendations on that note:

Kodaly: Sonata for Solo Cello
Elgar: Cello Concerto
Pärt: Fratres for 12 Cellos
Debussy: Cello Sonata
Poulenc: Cello Sonata
Prokofiev: Violin Sonata no. 1 in F minor, Cello Sonata
Villa-Lobos: Bachianas Brasileiras nos. 1 & 5
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on August 19, 2015, 07:10:23 AM
*bangs head on desk quietly*

This thread has basically become "Hi, welcome! Please become more like me!". Complete with creepy smile.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on August 19, 2015, 08:10:29 AM
*bangs head on desk quietly*

This thread has basically become "Hi, welcome! Please become more like me!". Complete with creepy smile.

I am alive to your concern, here.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on August 19, 2015, 08:31:56 AM
Compiling this without looking at my previous list, I see I removed Berlioz to make room for Mozart.

Bach
Beethoven
Brahms
Chopin
Janáček
Mozart
Prokofiev
Ravel
Sibelius
Stravinsky
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on August 19, 2015, 09:36:49 AM
Since this thread began, Mirror Image has listed a total of 22 composers in his top 10.  8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on August 19, 2015, 09:42:29 AM
He's just warming up!  0:)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on August 19, 2015, 09:43:21 AM
Compiling this without looking at my previous list, I see I removed Berlioz to make room for Mozart.

Bach
Beethoven
Brahms
Chopin
Janáček
Mozart
Prokofiev
Ravel
Sibelius
Stravinsky


Of course, I cannot argue that Mozart does not belong there.  But Berlioz being dropped, hurts . . . .
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on August 19, 2015, 09:51:41 AM
Of course, I cannot argue that Mozart does not belong there.  But Berlioz being dropped, hurts . . . .
It was a hard choice.  :(
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on August 19, 2015, 10:03:52 AM
I should not have cast that stone, Karlo  0:)

My next-earlier post seems to have been at a time when we were allowing an even dozen:

I was aware of "missing" Berlioz, Nielsen & Sibelius this go-around;  they have not fallen into "disfavor," strictly speaking . . . as the names came to my mind, though, I acknowledged that in fact I have not been listening to much (any) of their music of late.  Likewise, although they've been absent from my recent listening, Bach & Rakhmaninov remain best-loved composers.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on August 19, 2015, 10:19:56 AM
I should not have cast that stone, Karlo  0:)
Ha! And yours was a list of twelve.  >:D
I was somewhat surprised that my list was so nearly identical to the earlier draft. And I feel sorry for Bartók.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on August 19, 2015, 10:22:23 AM
Ha! And yours was a list of twelve.  >:D

I know.

And it would be bad form to plead, Well, everyone was doing it . . . .

8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on August 19, 2015, 10:30:55 AM
I know.

And it would be bad form to plead, Well, everyone was doing it . . . .

8)
I meant merely that you dropped Berlioz from a longer list than I did. I suppose a smaller drop is a blessing.   0:)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ChamberNut on August 19, 2015, 10:41:55 AM
One change since my last list.  I'll buy the fellow who finds it a drink.   ;)

John Cage
Morton Feldman
Guillaume de Machaut
Franz Liszt
Igor Stravinsky
Claude Debussy
Guillaume Dufay
Johannes Ockeghem
Josquin des Prez
Olivier Messiaen


Ockeghem?  :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ChamberNut on August 19, 2015, 10:46:13 AM
Haven't looked at any previous lists' I might have made, but I don't think much has changed:

Ray's Mighty Top Three

Beethoven/Brahms/Shostakovich

plus,

Bruckner
Mozart
Prokofiev
Schubert
Schumann
Sibelius
Tchaikovsky
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ZauberdrachenNr.7 on August 19, 2015, 11:19:41 AM
*bangs head on desk quietly*

This thread has basically become "Hi, welcome! Please become more like me!". Complete with creepy smile.

Uh, oh!  I must have poor personality integration - I have a tendency to look at these lists and think, "Oh, maybe I should become more like you." :o Complete with creepy smile.  :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on August 19, 2015, 11:23:13 AM
No, he's been there all along.  But  I will buy you a drink anyway since you are the only one to answer.  Liszt is new to my list.

 :)
When this thread came up this morning I was thinking, "You know, sanantonio probably has Liszt on his list now with listening to the sonata so much." But I didn't see that you actually had written a new post. Oops!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: sheri1983 on August 19, 2015, 12:25:22 PM
Some more recommendations on that note:

Kodaly: Sonata for Solo Cello
Elgar: Cello Concerto
Pärt: Fratres for 12 Cellos
Debussy: Cello Sonata
Poulenc: Cello Sonata
Prokofiev: Violin Sonata no. 1 in F minor, Cello Sonata
Villa-Lobos: Bachianas Brasileiras nos. 1 & 5
Great!  :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on August 19, 2015, 01:49:00 PM
My new monthly 'Top 10' (in no particular order):

Nielsen
Sibelius
Vaughan Williams
Shostakovich
Bartók
Ravel
Takemitsu
Schnittke
Martinů
Koechlin
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on August 19, 2015, 03:14:59 PM
Since this thread began, Mirror Image has listed a total of 22 composers in his top 10.  8)
Now 23 or possibly 24, too lazy to check.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on August 19, 2015, 03:59:05 PM
Since this thread began, Mirror Image has listed a total of 22 composers in his top 10.  8)

He's just warming up!  0:)

Wow, you guys cut me no slack whatsoever. I like it! ;D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on August 20, 2015, 02:01:03 AM
Cheers!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on August 20, 2015, 02:38:17 AM
If one takes Mirror Image's  avatar volatility as a yardstick 22 for 10 is a remarkable display of constancy and restraint... ;)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on August 20, 2015, 02:42:09 AM
If one takes Mirror Image's  avatar volatility as a yardstick 22 for 10 is a remarkable display of constancy and restraint... ;)

I'm not anything unless I'm consistent. ;D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on August 20, 2015, 02:48:24 AM
Well, and Karlo & I are, I believe, affirming the impossibility of the endeavor  8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on August 20, 2015, 02:42:42 PM
Well, and Karlo & I are, I believe, affirming the impossibility of the endeavor  8)

 ;D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jaakko Keskinen on November 24, 2015, 08:12:51 AM
Wagner
Beethoven
Brahms
Debussy
Rachmaninoff
R. Strauss
Puccini
Korngold/Verdi
Tchaikovsky
Sibelius
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on November 24, 2015, 08:39:56 AM
What my 'Top 10' looks like for this month...haha...(in no particular order) -

Sibelius
Rachmaninov
Bartok
Ravel
Vaughan Williams
Elgar
Shostakovich
Prokofiev
Nielsen
Britten
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on November 25, 2015, 01:42:34 PM
What my 'Top 10' looks like for this month...haha...(in no particular order) -

Sibelius
Rachmaninov
Bartok
Ravel
Vaughan Williams
Elgar
Shostakovich
Prokofiev
Nielsen
Britten

Not only are you living in the past, it's possible to date fairly precisely which bit of the past you're living in.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Dancing Divertimentian on November 25, 2015, 02:17:16 PM
Not only are you living in the past, it's possible to date fairly precisely which bit of the past you're living in.

??


Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ibanezmonster on November 25, 2015, 07:24:15 PM
All music is from the past...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on November 25, 2015, 08:03:25 PM
Not only are you living in the past, it's possible to date fairly precisely which bit of the past you're living in.

And your point would be?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jaakko Keskinen on November 26, 2015, 12:21:51 AM
Not only are you living in the past, it's possible to date fairly precisely which bit of the past you're living in.

Hey now, it's even easier to date which bit of the past I'm living in. And I don't think that is a bad attribute at all.  :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on November 26, 2015, 01:55:51 AM
And your point would be?

Nothing beyond noticing that all 10 were alive simultaneously and a great many of them were active around the same early 20th century period. Although I admit that Britten is a bit of a young whippersnapper.

EDIT: Alberich, Beethoven does a rather effective job of ensuring this can't apply to your list.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on November 26, 2015, 08:44:43 AM
Whether I listen to music of the past or the present, I'll always listen to music that moves me and gives me gratification. I could really careless what the time frame is of the music I enjoy. It just so happens that the early 20th Century contains my most cherished composers and so what if it does?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Marsch MacFiercesome on November 26, 2015, 09:08:51 AM
Whether I listen to music of the past or the present, I'll always listen to music that moves me and gives me gratification. I could really careless what the time frame is of the music I enjoy. It just so happens that the early 20th Century contains my most cherished composers and so what if it does?

Precisely.

Excellence.

Excellence.

Excellence.

That's all that matters in human endeavor.

Everything else is just wind in the chimes.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on November 26, 2015, 09:42:59 AM
Precisely.

Excellence.

Excellence.

Excellence.

That's all that matters in human endeavor.

Everything else is just wind in the chimes.

No argument here. :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on November 26, 2015, 01:48:49 PM
Whether I listen to music of the past or the present, I'll always listen to music that moves me and gives me gratification. I could really careless what the time frame is of the music I enjoy. It just so happens that the early 20th Century contains my most cherished composers and so what if it does?

You seem to be under the impression I was offering a criticism. I wasn't.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on November 26, 2015, 08:25:13 PM
You seem to be under the impression I was offering a criticism. I wasn't.

Well, you should know as well as I do that sarcasm and what you really meant to say doesn't always come off well on the internet. No worries.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jaakko Keskinen on December 02, 2015, 08:02:26 AM
Substituting Tchaikovsky with Berlioz.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Dancing Divertimentian on December 02, 2015, 09:31:31 AM
Substituting Tchaikovsky with Berlioz.

Not a bad substitution...not that I don't like Tchaikovsky...I certainly do...just probably listen more to Berlioz...


Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ludwigii on April 15, 2016, 12:02:44 PM
These are the composers I most loved (I think), in descending order :

Schnittke
Prokofiev
Mozart
Schubert
Brahms
Shostakovich
Bartok
Mahler
J.S.Bach
W.Walton

 ;)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on April 15, 2016, 12:24:39 PM
These are the composers I most loved (I think), in descending order :

Schnittke
Prokofiev
Mozart
Schubert
Brahms
Shostakovich
Bartok
Mahler
J.S.Bach
W.Walton

 ;)
Nice list!

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on April 15, 2016, 01:59:31 PM
These are the composers I most loved (I think), in descending order :

Schnittke
Prokofiev
Mozart
Schubert
Brahms
Shostakovich
Bartok
Mahler
J.S.Bach
W.Walton

 ;)

Yes, very nice list indeed.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on April 15, 2016, 02:17:05 PM
1. Beethoven
2. Dvorak
3. Schubert
4. Chopin
5. Ravel
6. Janacek
7. Berlioz
8. Haydn
9. Martinu Brahms
10. Schumann Martinu

Well, that was an easy update.
Well that was another easy update.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on April 15, 2016, 03:26:11 PM
Well that was another easy update.
Gotta say it. Doesn't affect our friendship. (We're friends, right?)

NO RUSSIANS?

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on April 15, 2016, 03:31:07 PM
Gotta say it. Doesn't affect our friendship. (We're friends, right?)

NO RUSSIANS?
Huh, you're right, no Russians! I do love Rach, and Shosty, and Rimsky, and Borodin. And Tchaikovsky. Maybe some of them are in the top 20...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on April 15, 2016, 03:52:01 PM
Another feeble attempt at a 'Top 10' (in no particular order):

Ravel
Bartók
Sibelius
Nielsen
Vaughan Williams
Elgar
Rachmaninov
Schnittke
Martinů
Shostakovich

Five Honorable Mentions: Janáček, Prokofiev, Britten, Szymanowski, and Villa-Lobos.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Chronochromie on April 15, 2016, 08:39:58 PM
Why not.

In chronological order:

Monteverdi
Rameau
Beethoven
Schubert
Berlioz
Debussy
Schoenberg
Messiaen
Ligeti

...Bartók or Stravinsky? That's the question right now.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on April 15, 2016, 09:57:11 PM
For today, my ever changing list will be:

Boulez
Birtwistle
Monteverdi
L. Boulanger
Ferneyhough
Berio
H. Grime
Ligeti
Adès
Brett Dean
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on April 16, 2016, 01:47:13 AM
My list hasn´t changed and it is very unlikely it will ever change.

Bach
Haydn
Mozart
Beethoven
Schubert
Chopin
Schumann
Brahms
Tchaikovsky
Rachmaninoff


Now, what is ever changeable is my top 10 honorable mentions.  :D

As of now:

Telemann
Tartini
CPE Bach
D. Scarlatti
Franz Krommer
Louis Spohr
Felix Mendelssohn
Josef Rheinberger
Antonin Dvorak
Felix Weingartner



Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on April 16, 2016, 05:23:27 AM
Huh, you're right, no Russians! I do love Rach, and Shosty, and Rimsky, and Borodin. And Tchaikovsky. Maybe some of them are in the top 20...

My cavil aside, swapping Brahms in for Schumann was The Right Thing.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on April 16, 2016, 05:38:23 AM
Compiling this without looking at my previous list, I see I removed Berlioz to make room for Mozart.

Bach
Beethoven
Brahms
Chopin
Janáček
Mozart
Prokofiev
Ravel
Sibelius
Stravinsky
I do feel that Berlioz and Rakhmaninov ought to be on the list, but that would just mean extending the list to twelve. And I'm sure that nobody wants to see that happen.  0:)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on April 16, 2016, 06:15:47 AM
I do feel that Berlioz and Rakhmaninov ought to be on the list, but that would just mean extending the list to twelve. And I'm sure that nobody wants to see that happen.  0:)

If there were a thread about top 100 favorite composers I would sleep well over it.  :D :D :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on April 16, 2016, 07:26:13 AM
I do feel that Berlioz and Rakhmaninov ought to be on the list, but that would just mean extending the list to twelve. And I'm sure that nobody wants to see that happen.  0:)

Agreed, both that they ought to be on the list, and that there's no one presently on the list who should be displaced  8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: some guy on April 16, 2016, 10:26:46 AM
We seem to have veered a bit from "favorite."

Not entirely sure where we have veered to, but it's somewhere in the vicinity of "great" or "important."

Sure, one's favorites might be also on some list of "greats" or "important people." But that's as may be, no?

What possible matter if they are or are not? They're still favorites, right?

Michèle Bokanowski
Ludger Brümmer
Hector Berlioz
Beatriz Ferreyra
Luc Ferrari
Carl Nielsen
Serge Prokofiev
Otomo Yoshihide
eRikm
Andrea Neumann

Hmmmm. Nope. Ten is definitely a silly number. Nowhere near to being close.

Heigh ho.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: amw on April 17, 2016, 01:08:30 AM
Slight revision:

1. Beethoven
...
3. Schumann
...
...
...
...
8. Schubert
...
10. Bartók
11. Brahms
...
...
14. Bach
...
16. Mozart
17. Haydn
...
19. Chopin
...
...
...
22. Dvořák
23 onwards: the rest
Lifetime influence, this still stands.

Using favourites to mean "current, temporary obsessions" as many on this thread do I would have to go
1. Brahms [represented primarily by the piano works Op. 116-119, the chamber music, and Symphony No. 3]
2. Beethoven [represented primarily by the piano sonatas and concertos, occasional symphonies]
3. Bach [represented primarily by certain harpsichord works: Partitas, Inventions, Toccatas, Italian Concerto/French Overture]
-------------
4. Mozart [represented primarily by the string quintets and quartets]
5. Schumann [represented primarily by Kreisleriana, Davidsbündlertänze, Carnaval and the Fantasie]
6. Nielsen [represented primarily by the symphonies and the Chaconne]
7. Debussy [represented exclusively by the Preludes, Etudes and Images]
8. Chopin [represented primarily by the Ballades, Sonata No. 3, Scherzi and Polonaise-Fantaisie]
9. Fauré [represented primarily by the Barcarolles, piano quartets and violin sonatas]
and that's all I can fill out before the list becomes arbitrary. I don't know why, but for the last few months my musical tastes have become even more restricted. I used to be super enthusiastic about new music too, and I still enjoy it a lot when I do listen, but have the desire to do so very rarely. :(
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on May 17, 2016, 03:41:00 AM
for the last few months my musical tastes have become even more restricted. I used to be super enthusiastic about new music too, and I still enjoy it a lot when I do listen, but have the desire to do so very rarely. :(
Without wanting to scare you: as I hit my mid-twenties I definitely notice a drop in the results of obscure/new music explorations, and am mildly panicked over whether tastes start to "gel" or firm up at a certain age. Like, back in college, I checked half the CPO and Naxos catalogues out of the library and probably spammed GMG about how great all our favorite obscure composers are (let's pick on Joly Braga Santos). But now, half the time I listen to that stuff again, or half the time I try whatever weird new thing pops up on NML, or all the time in the case of Braga Santos, it makes me think "man I could be listening to Brahms right now." And it's much more frequent that my brain wants its "comfort food" music - the musical version of craving a toasty sandwich or mac 'n' cheese instead of some bold/clever new preparation. Which gives me a bit of "bad listener" guilt, but can you really fight that?

Not sure what happened, or why, or if aging/maturity/brain-wiring is really to blame, but...maybe?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 17, 2016, 03:46:31 AM
Well, if you want to listen to Brahms, don't put a Braga Santos disc in!  8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on May 17, 2016, 04:10:50 AM
If Brahms is comfort food, it's a perfectly seared beef tenderloin.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 17, 2016, 06:15:42 AM
Without wanting to scare you: as I hit my mid-twenties I definitely notice a drop in the results of obscure/new music explorations, and am mildly panicked over whether tastes start to "gel" or firm up at a certain age.

Meh. I'm probably more musically curious in the last 5 years than I've ever been.

My tastes have firmed up, in that I know what I'm looking for. The thing is, I'm increasingly curious about where I might find it.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on May 17, 2016, 07:00:04 AM
Meh. I'm probably more musically curious in the last 5 years than I've ever been.

My tastes have firmed up, in that I know what I'm looking for. The thing is, I'm increasingly curious about where I might find it.
Now that's an interesting way of looking at it! Thank you.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jaakko Keskinen on May 17, 2016, 07:47:54 AM
It may have been due to some unfortunate experiences I've had but my taste in music has narrowed down very much and I see myself returning to same pieces over and over again. Interestingly, absolutely music, with nothing literature-related topics, has slipped more and more away from my attention but program music still keeps me often interested. There are exceptions of course in absolute music and I did prefer program music to absolute one even before but that fact has increased very much during the last couple of years.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: nathanb on May 20, 2016, 08:21:26 PM
The more and more I evolve, the harder these ultimate lists become. Like, if I looked at only the last year and a half or so, Beethoven would have no place in the list. But all the same, I'd feel...dirty...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: 71 dB on May 20, 2016, 10:34:17 PM
The more and more I evolve, the harder these ultimate lists become.
I'm not much of a list maker anymore. I feel they are pointless and tell more about ourself than the composers listed. Are the lists we make reasonable?

For example: Why is J. S. Bach the only baroque composer making it to these lists if even him? Were baroque composers that much crappier than say romantic composers? Is Ravel really better than Rameau? Is Bolero better than Dardanus Suite? Why doesn't M.A. Charpenter or Buxtehude make it to our top 10 lists? I am not saying these composers particular deserve being on the list. I mean there are some strange biases in classical music and we don't even realise it. Is Haydn really superior to all composer before J. S. Bach? Really? You may say this a matter of taste, but why do you like Haydn more than every composer before Bach? Can you say you have never enjoyed Corelli or Handel as much as Haydn? Does the cultural environment we live in direct us to like some composer more than others? Are we encouraged to like Haydn more than Dittersdorf? I think we are.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on May 21, 2016, 12:07:38 AM
[These lists] tell more about ourself than the composers listed. Are the lists we make reasonable?
So you would like to see an objective ranking of all the greatest composers? I don't think that degree of objectivity is possible to achieve in as subjective a field as culture.
Quote
Is Bolero better than Dardanus Suite?
You know, Ravel did write other pieces, too.
Quote
I mean there are some strange biases in classical music and we don't even realise it.
Certainly.
Quote
Is Haydn really superior to all composer before J. S. Bach? Really? You may say this a matter of taste, but why do you like Haydn more than every composer before Bach? Can you say you have never enjoyed Corelli or Handel as much as Haydn?
Why pick Haydn and Baroque composers (especially Baroque composers who are not Zelenka or Vivaldi!  8) ), and not some Renaissance composers? You could come up with a very long list of them and be able to claim quite plausible that, using suitable parameters for the comparison, they are all superior to Haydn, and to Dittersdorf.
Quote
Does the cultural environment we live in direct us to like some composer more than others? Are we encouraged to like Haydn more than Dittersdorf? I think we are.
Much the same way the cultural environment we live in directs us to, apart from ignoring both, to prefer Renoir over Cabanel.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Autumn Leaves on May 21, 2016, 12:25:45 AM
Don't think I contributed a list to this thread - in no particular order:

Tchaikovsky
Sibelius
Shostakovich
Vaughan Williams
Chopin
Mendelssohn
Villa-Lobos
Mahler
Debussy
Brahms
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: amw on May 21, 2016, 01:09:14 AM
Without wanting to scare you: as I hit my mid-twenties I definitely notice a drop in the results of obscure/new music explorations, and am mildly panicked over whether tastes start to "gel" or firm up at a certain age. Like, back in college, I checked half the CPO and Naxos catalogues out of the library and probably spammed GMG about how great all our favorite obscure composers are (let's pick on Joly Braga Santos). But now, half the time I listen to that stuff again, or half the time I try whatever weird new thing pops up on NML, or all the time in the case of Braga Santos, it makes me think "man I could be listening to Brahms right now." And it's much more frequent that my brain wants its "comfort food" music - the musical version of craving a toasty sandwich or mac 'n' cheese instead of some bold/clever new preparation. Which gives me a bit of "bad listener" guilt, but can you really fight that?

Not sure what happened, or why, or if aging/maturity/brain-wiring is really to blame, but...maybe?
Haha, I mean the interesting thing is that since April I've even stopped listening to a lot of the works/composers I listed as current obsessions, (where listening meant basically comparing versions and looking for the best ones). Which means that 95% of the time recently music has been just something I put on in the background. I'm not at this point going to say "my musical tastes r over omg" but clearly I'm just at a particular point in my life at which I don't "need" music as much right now.

Presumably it'll come back, eventually. I think life events play a definite role, though—more than any maturation. For the past few years I'd developed a greater interest in exploration, wider definitions of acceptable taste and a more discriminatory understanding of quality. (This doesn't include just exploration of new works.) I have a more defined taste, and a better idea of what to look for to satisfy it. I assume that's the growing older thing, and will continue, underneath whatever emotional thing has taken me away from music at the moment. Hard to say though.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: 71 dB on May 21, 2016, 02:03:13 AM
So you would like to see an objective ranking of all the greatest composers?
No. How can such ranking even exist? There are no objective methods to rank art to my knowledge.

I don't think that degree of objectivity is possible to achieve in as subjective a field as culture.
Exactly.

You know, Ravel did write other pieces, too.
Sure, many. So did Rameau. What are the works that put Ravel above Rameau? Piano Concerto in G Major? If so, would we appreciate it as much as we do had Ravel not composed Bolero?

Why pick Haydn and Baroque composers (especially Baroque composers who are not Zelenka or Vivaldi!  8) ), and not some Renaissance composers?
I picked Haydn because his one of those composer on almost everyne's list. Baroque composers instead of Renaissance composers because of personal preferences. Monteverdi, Palestrina, etc. could have been mentioned, of course.
Why not Zelenka and Vivaldi? They are too far in the end of alphabets.  ;D
I needed only a few names to make my point. No need to go from A to Z.

You could come up with a very long list of them and be able to claim quite plausible that, using suitable parameters for the comparison, they are all superior to Haydn, and to Dittersdorf.
Perhaps. However, I don't make much lists these days.

Much the same way the cultural environment we live in directs us to, apart from ignoring both, to prefer Renoir over Cabanel.
My point is these lists tell mostly about our cultural environment. The problem here is that we tend to take these lists as quasi-objective ranks of composers rather than what they really are. 
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on May 21, 2016, 02:38:20 AM
No. How can such ranking even exist? There are no objective methods to rank art to my knowledge.
There are some (e.g. influence), but they have their limits, as e.g. circumstances affect influence, and in any case, there's little point in trying to measure who was more influential, Beethoven or Haydn, in order to name one of the two 'better' on account of that.

Quote
Sure, many. So did Rameau. What are the works that put Ravel above Rameau? Piano Concerto in G Major? If so, would we appreciate it as much as we do had Ravel not composed Bolero?
I'm not going to say which pieces "put Ravel above Rameau", but I suggest you listen to both Piano Concertos, the Piano Trio, L'Enfant et les Sortilèges, the songs, Miroirs, the String Quartet, Gaspard, Violin Sonata, Sonata for Violin & Cello, and Introduction et Allegro for harp, flute, clarinet & string quartet. Bolero is a delightful piece too, but your question is pretty much equal to asking whether we would appreciate Beethoven's Missa Solemnis, Ninth Symphony, the late Quartets and Piano Sonatas, had he not composed Für Elise.

Quote
I picked Haydn because his one of those composer on almost everyne's list. Baroque composers instead of Renaissance composers because of personal preferences.
That underlined bit might be significant.

Quote
My point is these lists tell mostly about our cultural environment. The problem here is that we tend to take these lists as quasi-objective ranks of composers rather than what they really are.
No, these lists tell mostly about our personal preferences. If that means that 17th century Baroque isn't represented all that extensively, that doesn't necessarily mean the cultural environment is biased against it more strongly than it is against other bygone eras.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: chadfeldheimer on May 21, 2016, 02:55:15 AM
So you would like to see an objective ranking of all the greatest composers? I don't think that degree of objectivity is possible to achieve in as subjective a field as culture.
So you think rating music or composers is 100% subjective and not objectifiable at all? I see that in a less distinct/binary way. A 100% objective ranking of the greatest composers also imo is not possible (of course), but at least I think there are criteria that would allow objectifying such kind of ranking at least to some degree. I'm thinking about criteria like influence on later generations of composers or inventions of compositional techniques. If there weren't such criteria, disciplinces like musicology wouldn't be worth a penny and a symphony of farts (forgot which member brought this one) or the latest Britney Spears album had the same musical value as say "Le Sacre Du Printemps" or "Die Winterreise". Musicology isn't of course no exact discipline like mathematics or physics, but even medicine is not.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: chadfeldheimer on May 21, 2016, 02:58:14 AM
There are some (e.g. influence), but they have their limits, as e.g. circumstances affect influence, and in any case, there's little point in trying to measure who was more influential, Beethoven or Haydn, in order to name one of the two 'better' on account of that.
Didn't see that before posting my last post. I'm glad you see things more differentiated, than I first thought you would. ;)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: 71 dB on May 21, 2016, 03:08:30 AM
Buxtehude had huge influence on Bach and Handel. C.P.E. Bach had huge infuence on Haydn, Mozart and Beethoven. Wagner is said to be the most influencial composer ever. Do we look at the influence of all composers equally? What does the level of influence to have with how much we enjoy the music? I don't think J. S. Bach was as influencial as his music is enjoayable.

No, these lists tell mostly about our personal preferences. If that means that 17th century Baroque isn't represented all that extensively, that doesn't necessarily mean the cultural environment is biased against it more strongly than it is against other bygone eras.

How do you define "bygone"? Haydn isn't "bygone" just yet, but Zelenka definitely is? Never realised the eras have an expiration date.

My taste is just as "biased" as yours. What is the point of comparing those two? These lists tell us how rebellious we are against the cultural influencies. So the title of this thread should be "How rebellious your taste is?"
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: 71 dB on May 21, 2016, 03:16:09 AM
If there weren't such criteria, disciplinces like musicology wouldn't be worth a penny and a symphony of farts (forgot which member brought this one) or the latest Britney Spears album had the same musical value as say "Le Sacre Du Printemps" or "Die Winterreise".

The funny thing is that for many Britney Spears has (much) more musical value than Stravinsky.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: chadfeldheimer on May 21, 2016, 03:16:28 AM
Buxtehude had huge influence on Bach and Handel. C.P.E. Bach had huge infuence on Haydn, Mozart and Beethoven. Wagner is said to be the most influencial composer ever. Do we look at the influence of all composers equally? What does the level of influence to have with how much we enjoy the music? I don't think J. S. Bach was as influencial as his music is enjoayable.
Enjoyability of course is a much criterium which is much more difficult to objectify.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 21, 2016, 03:18:54 AM
71 dB, you seem to have imported some notion of equity and fairness that simply has no place in a list of favourite composers. Quota systems might be all very well in some areas, but as far as I know no-one has ever suggested that anti-discrimination law ought to extend to the music that people like.

Nor can it be logically argued that the level of artistic achievement throughout the ages has been objectively constant. We celebrate particular eras precisely because they stand out to us from other eras.

Now, undoubtedly what stands out to us is dictated to a large extent by the values of our own culture. So there may well be things that we, in our culture, don't tend to think are all that fabulous that some other culture before or after ours thought/will think is top notch. But then they'll play down some other things that we do think are fabulous.

What they won't do is mark out a timeline of history and insist that artistic appreciation is doled out evenly across the centuries.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: chadfeldheimer on May 21, 2016, 03:20:18 AM
The funny thing is that for many Britney Spears has (much) more musical value than Stravinsky.
I guess that would be for other criteria than influence or invention, or?  :laugh:
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: 71 dB on May 21, 2016, 04:17:55 AM
71 dB, you seem to have imported some notion of equity and fairness that simply has no place in a list of favourite composers.
That's why I have been avoiding making these lists. I gain nothing with the lists, but equity and fairness is lost, as you elegantly put it.

Quota systems might be all very well in some areas, but as far as I know no-one has ever suggested that anti-discrimination law ought to extend to the music that people like.
Do you do every dumb thing not prohibited by the law?

Nor can it be logically argued that the level of artistic achievement throughout the ages has been objectively constant. We celebrate particular eras precisely because they stand out to us from other eras.
Stand out in what way? We choose subjectively the criteria of "standing out". C.P.E Bach was celebrated in the 18th century, then ignored in the 19th century and then "discovered again" in the 20th century. Similar fluctuation happenened to his father. Why? Because each century chose the different criteria for "standing out". Why would our criteria be any "better"? Maybe we have learned to avoid some mistakes made by earlier generations, but it only means the generations to come are likely to have better criteria than we have now.

Now, undoubtedly what stands out to us is dictated to a large extent by the values of our own culture. So there may well be things that we, in our culture, don't tend to think are all that fabulous that some other culture before or after ours thought/will think is top notch. But then they'll play down some other things that we do think are fabulous.
Yes, unless they are wiser than us.

What they won't do is mark out a timeline of history and insist that artistic appreciation is doled out evenly across the centuries.
How can you know that?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 21, 2016, 04:27:17 AM
No, I did not say equity and fairness is lost. I said it had no place.

People sometimes put such notions in places they simply don't belong. I once encountered a person who reasoned that in order to avoid being sexist one should be bisexual. Which is just muddle-headed.  A commitment to equality does not extend to something as personal and subjective as to which music or people you are attracted to, because the entire point is to be personal and subjective. Personal preferences aren't getting in the way of any higher, more desirable outcome.

As to "how can you know that"... I can know it because no logical human being operates in such a "logical" fashion.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on May 21, 2016, 04:48:21 AM
The funny thing is that for many Britney Spears has (much) more musical value than Stravinsky.

But these are people that have no taste or any clue about music. We (the classical community) justly ignore them and you should, too. Please don't ever put these two in the same sentence again! >:(
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: 71 dB on May 21, 2016, 05:25:22 AM
No, I did not say equity and fairness is lost. I said it had no place.
Really? That's unfortunate!

But these are people that have no taste or any clue about music. We (the classical community) justly ignore them and you should, too. Please don't ever put these two in the same sentence again! >:(

Sorry, but that statement makes you look like an elitistic jackass. Yes, I agree most of these people have no taste or clue about music. Should we despise them or try to understand them? Will they ever find Stravinsky if we keep calling them clueless morons? No wonder they find people who listen to classical music elitistic.

I don't know many songs by Britney Spiers. Those I know are crap in my opinion apart from one song, which I like:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzU9OrZlKb8

That is well produced and structurally efective dance pop written by Kesha, who I consider extremely talented and who is my favorite pop artist (currently unfortunately in legal shit and unable to release new music).

I don't tell you what to put in the same sentence so could you stop making those silly demands thank you.  ;)

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on May 21, 2016, 05:44:29 AM
Sorry, but that statement makes you look like an elitistic jackass. Yes, I agree most of these people have no taste or clue about music. Should we despise them or try to understand them? Will they ever find Stravinsky if we keep calling them clueless morons? No wonder they find people who listen to classical music elitistic.

I don't know many songs by Britney Spiers. Those I know are crap in my opinion apart from one song, which I like:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzU9OrZlKb8

That is well produced and structurally efective dance pop written by Kesha, who I consider extremely talented and who is my favorite pop artist (currently unfortunately in legal shit and unable to release new music).

I don't tell you what to put in the same sentence so could you stop making those silly demands thank you.  ;)

Sounds like you're inserting whatever words you want into my initial post. Where did I call the people who listen to Brittney Spears morons? Also, I love the part where you called me an 'elitist jackass' for having an opinion that differs from yours. Name-calling must be your new specialty? Anyway, if I sound elitist, then I suppose the same people who think pop music is the bee's knees and won't deviate on their opinion could be considered elitist as well. We're all elitists in some form or another.

P.S. You calling many of the songs you heard from Brittney Spears 'crap' only reinforces my opinion that we're all elitists in some way or form. :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on May 21, 2016, 06:01:27 AM
Does "favorite" mean "best"?

Should we refrain from listing our favorites when asked to?

No to both, if you ask me.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on May 21, 2016, 06:31:07 AM
Does "favorite" mean "best"?

Should we refrain from listing our favorites when asked to?

No to both, if you ask me.

I don't like lists of 'bests' as I don't believe there are any bests when it comes to music, there's only our preferences and what we get gratification from.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on May 21, 2016, 07:06:07 AM
I don't like lists of 'bests'

Neither do I, but the thread is about "top 10 favorite composers"

Quote
as I don't believe there are any bests when it comes to music,

There aren´t any bests when it comes to anything --- there are only favorites.

Quote
there's only our preferences and what we get gratification from.

Precisely.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: 71 dB on May 21, 2016, 07:26:11 AM
Sounds like you're inserting whatever words you want into my initial post. Where did I call the people who listen to Brittney Spears morons? Also, I love the part where you called me an 'elitist jackass' for having an opinion that differs from yours. Name-calling must be your new specialty? Anyway, if I sound elitist, then I suppose the same people who think pop music is the bee's knees and won't deviate on their opinion could be considered elitist as well. We're all elitists in some form or another.
I don't think you need to defend yourself this much. I said you look like an elitist jackass. I don't think you are one. I agreed with you quite a bit, so I wouldn't say your opinion differs from my opinion. The way you express it differs, however.

Most people like pop music because it is force-fed to them while alternatives are kept "secret". These people think we are trying to be better than other people we listen to classical music because of that. My message to all people is we all can expand our taste and learn to enjoy all kind of music. It's not dramatic to listen to "something different". Anyone can listen to Stravinsky and enjoy it. All without any elitism. We can also enjoy some pop tunes without being dumb, because sometimes fun and easy entertainment is what we want.

Classical music is like French cuisine, pop music is like strawberries and ice-cream for dessert.

P.S. You calling many of the songs you heard from Brittney Spears 'crap' only reinforces my opinion that we're all elitists in some way or form. :)
Come on man! If this isn't crap then I don't what is:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CduA0TULnow

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on May 21, 2016, 08:01:37 AM
What does the level of influence to have with how much we enjoy the music?
Nothing.
Quote
How do you define "bygone"? Haydn isn't "bygone" just yet, but Zelenka definitely is? Never realised the eras have an expiration date.
Much the same way as the dictionaries do: belonging to the past, like Dutilleux, Boulez, Wagner, or Josquin. The times are gone, but some of the art will remain.
Quote
My taste is just as "biased" as yours.
I'm glad you have realized this.
Quote
What is the point of comparing those two?
Nothing.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: 71 dB on May 21, 2016, 08:09:01 AM
I'm glad you have realized this.

Yes, long ago, long ago...  :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: 71 dB on May 21, 2016, 08:19:23 AM
My favorites lately have been Weinberg, Schumann, C.P.E. Bach, F. Couperin plus "contemporary stuff" such as Schwantner. That's the kind of list I can give...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on May 22, 2016, 07:51:06 AM
Most people like pop music because it is force-fed to them while alternatives are kept "secret". These people think we are trying to be better than other people we listen to classical music because of that.
Yes. How does this show we are elitist? It shows that other people are ignorant or uneducated. What should we do? Should we keep them in the dark out of fear to appear elitist? Should we deny that we listen to classical music not to be "better" but because it gives us more desirable aesthetic experience?

Quote
My message to all people is we all can expand our taste and learn to enjoy all kind of music. It's not dramatic to listen to "something different". Anyone can listen to Stravinsky and enjoy it. All without any elitism. We can also enjoy some pop tunes without being dumb, because sometimes fun and easy entertainment is what we want.
I agree insofar that "in principle" everyone can listen to X and enjoy it (some might not like Stravinsky, but classical music is broad enought that almost everyone should be able to find someting). But many people don't. They have heard bits and pieces, sometimes popularized stuff like Bocelli or Potts and everyone can listen to classical for free on youtube or the radio. But most don't. Because we as listeners of classical music are elitist? I don't think so.

(Would you find it elitist to claim that not everybody will be able to get a university degree in Electrical Engineering? Could it maybe the case that some people are "unmusical" in similar ways others are not sufficiently gifted for mathematical and technical thinking? To be sure, I think the overwhelming majority of people does not lack the ability for appreciating classical music. But there is also the point that if you never develop a way of listening and spend (formative) years listening to (mostly) crap you might actually lose that ability, maybe like doing drugs will make someone lose intelligence or the ability to focus so he cannot finish a degree.)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: 71 dB on May 22, 2016, 08:55:53 AM
Yes. How does this show we are elitist? It shows that other people are ignorant or uneducated. What should we do? Should we keep them in the dark out of fear to appear elitist? Should we deny that we listen to classical music not to be "better" but because it gives us more desirable aesthetic experience?
These ignorant or/and uneducated people don't realize they are ignorant or/and uneducated. For them popular commercial music is the "norm" and classical music something obsolete from the distant past only elististic people listen to pretending to be better than them.

Those people understand the real reason we listen to classical music only when they experience what we do. I tell people not into classical music that there's tons of all kind of stuff for everyone. If you don't like this, you may like that. Another thing is you don't need to choose between classical music and popular music; you can enjoy them both. The more we admit we enjoy popular music too, the less elitistic we appear to other people.

I agree insofar that "in principle" everyone can listen to X and enjoy it (some might not like Stravinsky, but classical music is broad enought that almost everyone should be able to find someting). But many people don't. They have heard bits and pieces, sometimes popularized stuff like Bocelli or Potts and everyone can listen to classical for free on youtube or the radio. But most don't. Because we as listeners of classical music are elitist? I don't think so.
If you don't believe you can enjoy music X you won't, no matter what. I myself found classical music some 20 years ago when I started to believe I can enjoy it. The image of classical music is such that it appears obsolete for many. The trick is to make people realize classical music is timeless rather than obsolete. Not an easy task in a superficial world.

(Would you find it elitist to claim that not everybody will be able to get a university degree in Electrical Engineering?
No, because getting the degree was 1000 times more difficult than getting into classical music.

Could it maybe the case that some people are "unmusical" in similar ways others are not sufficiently gifted for mathematical and technical thinking? To be sure, I think the overwhelming majority of people does not lack the ability for appreciating classical music. But there is also the point that if you never develop a way of listening and spend (formative) years listening to (mostly) crap you might actually lose that ability, maybe like doing drugs will make someone lose intelligence or the ability to focus so he cannot finish a degree.)
I think amusical people seek for pleasure elsewhere. Maybe some of them are into sports?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 23, 2016, 03:40:02 AM
These ignorant or/and uneducated people don't realize they are ignorant or/and uneducated. For them popular commercial music is the "norm" and classical music something obsolete from the distant past only elististic people listen to pretending to be better than them.

Emphasis added. This phrase rather screamed at me given that this particular limb of conversation started because you disliked the fact that people weren't picking composers from the Baroque or earlier.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 23, 2016, 03:46:37 AM
If there's one thing I dislike about GMG, it's the air of disdain around pop music and the assumption that people would prefer classical music if only they were educated in it.

Well sorry, but I'm extremely well versed in classical music and I still find there are many times when I prefer pop music. The two genres have different qualities and meet different emotional/intellectual needs.

To sing the praises of classical music in no way requires the denigration of pop music, and when posters on here pull down pop music they are being elitist. They are expressing satisfaction with how they know more than the masses and appreciate finer things.

Bugger that. I don't see why as a music lover I can't search through and find things I love in the musical culture of the last 50 years just as much as I can search through and find things I love in the musical culture of a couple of centuries ago. There are great things in both genres and frankly there are lousy things in both genres. People have just had longer to bury the lousy things in classical music.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on May 23, 2016, 03:57:59 AM
If there's one thing I dislike about GMG, it's the air of disdain around pop music and the assumption that people would prefer classical music if only they were educated in it.

Just to pick up on the last part of that sentence - all art is a matter of taste, and everybody is born with different taste, like it or not. The idea that, if everybody listened to a bunch of classical music, they'd eventually fall in love with it - is charming and nice, but a fallacy. Some people just won't. And that's not their "fault". They're not "missing out". They're just pursuing contentment in a different way from how you or I might pursue it.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on May 23, 2016, 04:15:46 AM
Those people understand the real reason we listen to classical music only when they experience what we do. I tell people not into classical music that there's tons of all kind of stuff for everyone. If you don't like this, you may like that. Another thing is you don't need to choose between classical music and popular music; you can enjoy them both. The more we admit we enjoy popular music too, the less elitistic we appear to other people.
If you don't believe you can enjoy music X you won't, no matter what. I myself found classical music some 20 years ago when I started to believe I can enjoy it. The image of classical music is such that it appears obsolete for many. The trick is to make people realize classical music is timeless rather than obsolete. Not an easy task in a superficial world.
No, it's not easy. But I do not think that the perception of elitism is the main problem. Because this could work also in the opposite direction: There are obviously people attracted to all kinds of things because they are exclusive, expensive etc. (So I am certainly not going to pretend I like popular music more than I do to avoid appearing elitist at all costs...)
Quote
(by Orfeo) If there's one thing I dislike about GMG, it's the air of disdain around pop music and the assumption that people would prefer classical music if only they were educated in it.

I, maybe naively, hope that the assumption in the last clause is true with the insertion of "considerably more than now" before people. Regardless and independent of my disdain and dislike for most pop music. ;) And I actually think that this is *less elitist* than it might appear. The more elitist (and somewhat depressing) stance would be the claim that many people really are too stupid/lazy/unmusical/unfocussed/... to appreciate classical music even if they were educated.

I think it is fairly obvious are that many people are "ignorant" (not in the sense of stupid but that they simply have encountered so little classical music and often in a distorted way that they are hardly aware of it) because popular music is so pervasive in our culture. It's playing everwhere in the background, on TV, in shopping centres etc.

I cannot prove it (there is some research but it is probably inconclusive) but I believe that it becomes harder for people to appreciate classical music after having listened to nothing but popular music since their early childhood (so often for several decades).

There is also the pseudo-pluralism of popular genres. Some people think they listen to a wide variety of music but of course it is all popular music from one tradition (the anglophone of the last 60 years), usually based on a common song structure with a small spectrum of harmonic patterns, often in the same language etc. That makes it even harder to see that there is a world of other music (not only classical but also Jazz and some ethnic music) that is very different.

But all this is basically off-topic here...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on May 23, 2016, 04:18:01 AM
The idea that, if everybody listened to a bunch of classical music, they'd eventually fall in love with it - is charming and nice, but a fallacy. Some people just won't. And that's not their "fault". They're not "missing out". They're just pursuing contentment in a different way from how you or I might pursue it.

That is true when we consider people past their secondary, or even primary, education. I think, though, that (very) early exposure to,  education about, and involvement in, classical music and musicmaking might yield quite different results.

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on May 23, 2016, 04:22:20 AM
I think it is fairly obvious are that many people are "ignorant" (not in the sense of stupid but that they simply have encountered so little classical music and often in a distorted way that they are hardly aware of it) because popular music is so pervasive in our culture. It's playing everwhere in the background, on TV, in shopping centres etc.

I cannot prove it (there is some research but it is probably inconclusive) but I believe that it becomes harder for people to appreciate classical music after having listened to nothing but popular music since their early childhood (so often for several decades).

This.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on May 23, 2016, 04:23:17 AM
Just to pick up on the last part of that sentence - all art is a matter of taste, and everybody is born with different taste, like it or not. The idea that, if everybody listened to a bunch of classical music, they'd eventually fall in love with it - is charming and nice, but a fallacy. Some people just won't. And that's not their "fault". They're not "missing out". They're just pursuing contentment in a different way from how you or I might pursue it.
It is of course not necessary that everybody enjoys everything. But this is not the claim. Only that most people could enjoy a far broader range of art than they actually do if they were educated/educated themselves.

And they are clearly missing out. (So am I because I will very probably never do a bungee jump.) And taste is not something mainly inborn but something that is developed. And like almost everything tastes takes time and some effort to develop and if it is never developed the potential might "wither". (E.g. if one is a strong smoker one WILL lose some of the ability to perceive different flavors of food.)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on May 23, 2016, 04:25:39 AM
It is of course not necessary that everybody enjoys everything. But this is not the claim. Only that most people could enjoy a far broader range of art than they actually do if they were educated/educated themselves.

And taste is not something mainly inborn but something that is developed. And like almost everything tastes takes time and some effort to develop and if it is never developed the potential might "wither".

And this.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: James on May 23, 2016, 04:29:08 AM
And they are clearly missing out.

Absolutely.

Anyone who can explore it all knows this.

Most conditioned pop consumers have little idea (or patience) of truly knowing what music is & can be.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 23, 2016, 04:31:09 AM
I cannot prove it (there is some research but it is probably inconclusive) but I believe that it becomes harder for people to appreciate classical music after having listened to nothing but popular music since their early childhood (so often for several decades).

This is true of any kind of music. People who grew up in the 1960s listening to 1960s pop music don't have nearly the same enthusiasm for 2010s pop music. The history of "classical" music is littered with people reacting against the music of a new generation coming through.

This isn't a quality of a genre of music, it's a quality of habits generally, of the way that brains work.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on May 23, 2016, 04:34:46 AM
Now I wanted to edit, but Florestan quoted already, so I'll add it here:
And like almost everything the development of taste takes time and some effort to develop and if it is never developed the potential might "wither".
The problem is that especially with music we mostly let popular media develop our tastes, even of the little children.
Imagine that the only books around were stuff like Dan Brown or so. Even in school children would usually encounter only such literature. It would be rather difficult to develop a taste for Shakespeare or even John Irving in such a world. And such a taste would doubtlessly be seen as exotic, esoteric and elitist by many.
The musical situation is still more difficult because Dan Brown's stumbling phrases are not blasted from speakers in shopping centres 24/7.

Nothing is so bad to be completely useless, it can still as a repulsive example:

http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/000844.html
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 23, 2016, 04:35:52 AM
Absolutely.

Anyone who can explore it all knows this.

Most conditioned pop consumers have little idea (or patience) of truly knowing what music is & can be.


Oh James. You are one of the worst offenders.

I can handle the notion of "missing out", in the sense of people simply not hearing a particular kind of music. But to take that into some statement of not "truly knowing what music is" is the worst kind of elitist crap that denigrates the incredible amount of skill and effort that the best pop musicians have put into their craft.

And frankly, if your beloved Stockhausen is what music is truly is, then I'm perfectly happy not being a fan of true music, thanks all the same. I have better ways to spend my life than to use up any more of it trying to grasp what anyone finds appealing in endless operas about new age gibberish. It's pretentious shite.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on May 23, 2016, 04:40:11 AM
This isn't a quality of a genre of music, it's a quality of habits generally, of the way that brains work.

Exactly. Do you think a cognitive system trained on 5 decades of popular music from *one* tradition ("western and anglophone") would be as flexible with regard to different music than a system trained on 5 centuries of a respective variety of styles and genres?
Do you think we should teach English literature with superhero comic books (because there are so many different ones and they span the last 80 years) instead of using material from Shakespeare through Irving or other contemporary authors? Or say, to be fairer to pop music, use only post war science fiction stories?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 23, 2016, 04:41:58 AM
The problem is that especially with music we mostly let popular media develop our tastes, even of the little children.

And the problem is the assumption that if other people like it, it mustn't be any good. This is exactly what elitism is. It's not true that if it's popular it's good, but neither is it true that if it's popular it's not good. It's actually more likely that it is good in at least some respect, that it has some quality that made it more successful than other things that were being broadcast.

No matter how much record company executives would like to be able to completely dictate what sells, things become popular because a lot of people enjoy them, not because people are completely brainwashed idiots.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: James on May 23, 2016, 04:49:21 AM
I cannot prove it (there is some research but it is probably inconclusive) but I believe that it becomes harder for people to appreciate classical music after having listened to nothing but popular music since their early childhood (so often for several decades).

True, no doubt at all. Simple sound bite format to something generally much more elaborate & involved musically. Not to forget the presentation/performance aspects too. But yea, it is quite an a adjustment to go from being raised on 3-4 minute simple song form, to what you find in Art/Classical music with all of it's musical information, 4 hour opera, 3 hour mass, 1 hour symphony etc., etc. People raised on pop music are more or less to conditioned to think that this is what music is. Again, most of them haven't go a clue about what music is and can be - just try talking to them about it, they know nothing about it, it can be an impossible task to navigate without having them perceiving you as being arrogant. Meanwhile it is them who are plain ignorant.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on May 23, 2016, 04:49:36 AM
The problem is that especially with music we mostly let popular media develop our tastes, even of the little children.


That´s the biggest problem, methinks --- and paradoxically, the easiest to solve. Anyone familiar with little children knows that toy instruments are among their favorite kind of toys. Nothing could be easier than to build upon this and start their musical education as early as feasible --- but for this one needs more than the oftenly absent parental willingness and consent, one needs a whole educational and social philosophy strikingly at odds with what currently passes as such.

Quote
Imagine that the only books around were stuff like Dan Brown or so. Even in school children would usually encounter only such literature. It would be rather difficult to develop a taste for Shakespeare or even John Irving in such a world. And such a taste would doubtlessly be seen as exotic, esoteric and elitist by many.

Precisely.

Quote
The musical situation is still more difficult because Dan Brown's stumbling phrases are not blasted from speakers in shopping centres 24/7.

This, and the inverted snobbery which paints every classical music fan or novice as a snob.  ;D

Quote
Nothing is so bad to be completely useless, it can still as a repulsive example:

http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/~myl/languagelog/archives/000844.html

Dan Brown´s Da Vinci Code is the only book I have ever regretted buying.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on May 23, 2016, 04:53:21 AM
You misrepresent the argument. [Many people like Beethoven as well, compared to e.g. the fanciers of Marenzio or Hartmann. But I would never argue that therefore Beethoven is bad.]

Food from McDonalds is not (at best) mediocre because many people like it. It is just mediocre, full stop.
The argument is that many people like Fast Food because they grew up with it and too rarely encountered anything else. And also that fast food tastes "good" in a certain way so it is seductive to stick with it but that one will not develop a taste for fresh, strange and different food eating only fast food.

The point is not to denigrate ALL popular music as the equivalent of fast food (although it is hard to deny that a lot of it is - most fans of popular music would even agree with that). The point is that the prevalence of popular music everywhere shapes what people think music is and mainly/only can be. It biases their musical cognition to some extent against different (and especially classical) music.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 23, 2016, 04:55:13 AM
Dan Brown´s Da Vinci Code is the only book I have ever regretted buying.

Have you bought 50 Shades of Gray?  8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on May 23, 2016, 04:58:09 AM
Have you bought 50 Shades of Gray?  8)

No but I might have stepped in one.  ;D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 23, 2016, 04:58:18 AM
Exactly. Do you think a cognitive system trained on 5 decades of popular music from *one* tradition ("western and anglophone") would be as flexible with regard to different music than a system trained on 5 centuries of a respective variety of styles and genres?
Do you think we should teach English literature with superhero comic books (because there are so many different ones and they span the last 80 years) instead of using material from Shakespeare through Irving or other contemporary authors? Or say, to be fairer to pop music, use only post war science fiction stories?

I don't think you're being much fairer to pop music, frankly. And this is one of the things that irritates me so much about GMG. My nephew, who is into what I merely call "heavy metal", can rattle off a heck of a lot of subgenres of heavy metal, in much the same way that people here can have discussions about whether it's best to have someone of Austrian background playing Mozart (as is currently happening in the Mozart thread).

It's an inherent cultural bias to subdivide what you know and care about in great detail, and to treat something that you only know sketchily as less diverse. It's exactly the phenomenon that allows people to talk about individual states of the USA but treat "Africa" as if it's a single undifferentiated culture. It's exactly why people distinguish people of their own 'race' far better than people of a different 'race'. It's exactly why I'm as interested in whether or not someone from my own city is a northsider or a southsider, but couldn't tell you much about the characteristics of different districts of Paris and absolutely nothing about the different districts of Lagos.

What you use to teach English literature is going to depend a great deal on the depth with which you're teaching it. You're unlikely to introduce kids to authors from previous centuries in primary school. When they're a bit holder you might throw them a few of history's greatest hits like Shakespeare, but you're still not going to introduce them to a range of authors from across the centuries, only the really huge names. Once someone gets to university and decides they're going to study literature as a dedicated subject they might end up in a course about Scottish authors during the Enlightenment.

But not everyone's going to spend their life studying literature. Frankly not everyone has time for it. Everybody specialises. Everybody who bothers to post on this message board is inherently a specialist, because you care enough about music to want to talk to other people about it. Should anyone who wants to specialise in music as an interest be aware of a wide range of traditions? Absolutely.

But does this mean the general masses ought to be instructed past being vaguely aware of a few really big names like Bach, Mozart and Beethoven? No. Because in the same way that some of my friends deeply into literature discover that I haven't read many of the great pieces of literature (hey, I've seen a movie version of some of them), anyone who is deeply into music is going to discover that a lot of their friends haven't heard many of the great pieces of music. It's simply not realistic to expect that everyone has the same knowledge and experience base. It's never going to happen because people are off exploring a hundred other things that I, personally, don't find as riveting as I find music.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: James on May 23, 2016, 05:05:01 AM
The point is not to denigrate ALL popular music ..

True. Only to highlight that their is so much more to music than it. So much more.

Speaking for myself, I have put my ears/mind through barriers and put in a lot of time exploring/learning, time most people wouldn't ..I simply didn't stop at the simple pop tunes I grew up on during youth & adolescence. If I did, I can say with absolute certainty that my musical experience & understanding would have been tremendously limited and impoverished. It was beneficial to explore everything that I could before 20th century pop music. And that stuff that came before is a lot of major, major human creativity.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on May 23, 2016, 05:07:42 AM
But does this mean the general masses ought to be instructed past being vaguely aware of a few really big names like Bach, Mozart and Beethoven?

Yes. People should be instructed to know and appreciate what is best in music as in all other arts.

And can one get more elitist than suggesting that "the general masses" (whatever this might mean) ought not to be instructed past a superficial and vague awareness that there is more to classical music than that Fuer Elise "song" composed by that funny named Baitoven guy?  ;D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 23, 2016, 05:08:15 AM
True, no doubt at all. Simple sound bite format to something generally much more elaborate & involved musically. Not to forget the presentation/performance aspects too. But yea, it is quite an a adjustment to go from being raised on 3-4 minute simple song form, to what you find in Art/Classical music with all of it's musical information, 4 hour opera, 3 hour mass, 1 hour symphony etc., etc. People raised on pop music are more or less to conditioned to think that this is what music is. Again, most of them haven't go a clue about what music is and can be - just try talking to them about it, they know nothing about it, it can be an impossible task to navigate without having them perceiving you as being arrogant. Meanwhile it is them who are plain ignorant.

James, your tone deafness for your own tone is bordering on legendary. You spent a considerable amount of your GMG career by copying and pasting material written by others, word for word, and you have the nerve to talk about how much more knowledgeable you are than other people?

I think you are far too proud of your own state of "knowledge" and actually don't know nearly as much about music as you like to claim that you know. You present the most simplistic caricatures both of the music that you like and of the music that you're denigrating.

I mean, reducing pop music to 3-4 minute soundbites... pop music includes great big sprawling concept albums that don't fit on a single CD. Meanwhile, you talk about multi-hour classical works while ignoring all the little songs and piano pieces that decorated the centuries. You basically pick what you consider the greatest of one genre and pit it against what you consider the worst of the other.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 23, 2016, 05:11:36 AM
I don't think you're being much fairer to pop music, frankly. And this is one of the things that irritates me so much about GMG. My nephew, who is into what I merely call "heavy metal", can rattle off a heck of a lot of subgenres of heavy metal, in much the same way that people here can have discussions about whether it's best to have someone of Austrian background playing Mozart (as is currently happening in the Mozart thread).

It's an inherent cultural bias to subdivide what you know and care about in great detail, and to treat something that you only know sketchily as less diverse. It's exactly the phenomenon that allows people to talk about individual states of the USA but treat "Africa" as if it's a single undifferentiated culture. It's exactly why people distinguish people of their own 'race' far better than people of a different 'race'. It's exactly why I'm as interested in whether or not someone from my own city is a northsider or a southsider, but couldn't tell you much about the characteristics of different districts of Paris and absolutely nothing about the different districts of Lagos.

What you use to teach English literature is going to depend a great deal on the depth with which you're teaching it. You're unlikely to introduce kids to authors from previous centuries in primary school. When they're a bit holder you might throw them a few of history's greatest hits like Shakespeare, but you're still not going to introduce them to a range of authors from across the centuries, only the really huge names. Once someone gets to university and decides they're going to study literature as a dedicated subject they might end up in a course about Scottish authors during the Enlightenment.

But not everyone's going to spend their life studying literature. Frankly not everyone has time for it. Everybody specialises. Everybody who bothers to post on this message board is inherently a specialist, because you care enough about music to want to talk to other people about it. Should anyone who wants to specialise in music as an interest be aware of a wide range of traditions? Absolutely.

But does this mean the general masses ought to be instructed past being vaguely aware of a few really big names like Bach, Mozart and Beethoven? No. Because in the same way that some of my friends deeply into literature discover that I haven't read many of the great pieces of literature (hey, I've seen a movie version of some of them), anyone who is deeply into music is going to discover that a lot of their friends haven't heard many of the great pieces of music. It's simply not realistic to expect that everyone has the same knowledge and experience base. It's never going to happen because people are off exploring a hundred other things that I, personally, don't find as riveting as I find music.

Thanks for the on-point rant.

James, your tone deafness for your own tone is bordering on legendary.

It's something, to excel at . . . something  8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 23, 2016, 05:13:19 AM
Yes. People should be instructed to know and appreciate what is best in music as in all other arts.

Okay, so which names should we cut out, and which other subjects will we shrink so that there's time to give people a proper grounding in, say, the 40 greatest composers (assuming we can cobble together a list that all us specialists are sufficiently comfortable with)?

How much time are we going to allocate to this instruction, for everyone, that we think is currently lacking? And what are we deciding people can do without? The day is not getting longer to accommodate this information we want to supply people with.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 23, 2016, 05:17:34 AM
Thanks for the on-point rant.

You're welcome. You'll have to excuse me, it's very late here and I should get to bed. Plus I wanted to explore another Prince album if possible while getting ready. Honestly, I had no idea before today how much good material there was on the Batman soundtrack.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on May 23, 2016, 05:24:12 AM
Okay, so which names should we cut out, and which other subjects will we shrink so that there's time to give people a proper grounding in, say, the 40 greatest composers (assuming we can cobble together a list that all us specialists are sufficiently comfortable with)?

First of all, given the presently miserable state of musical education at elementary, primary and secondary level in many regions of the Western world, to suggest that it would be necessary to shrink other subjects in order to familiarize people with Mozart or Beethoven sounds like involuntary humour.

Secondly, you don´t need 40 names to get people started and curious about classical music. 10 will suffice.

Quote
How much time are we going to allocate to this instruction, for everyone, that we think is currently lacking?

Ah, I see you actually got me wrong. I am not talking about grown up people who currently lack exposure to, and basic knowledge of, classical music --- moany (most?) of them might very well be hopeless in this regard. I am talking about a thorough and sustained musical education for kids and teens as part of a more general educational philosophy.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: James on May 23, 2016, 05:25:12 AM
Plus I wanted to explore another Prince album if possible while getting ready. Honestly, I had no idea before today how much good material there was on the Batman soundtrack.

I listened to this one a few days back. Horrid.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: (poco) Sforzando on May 23, 2016, 05:33:16 AM
No but I might have stepped in one.  ;D

I think you stole that line from someone . . . .
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on May 23, 2016, 05:42:02 AM
you don´t need 40 names to get people started and curious about classical music. 10 will suffice.

Heck, you don´t even need names. Give the kid as birthday present a violin or a flute or a guitar or a keyboard. That will suffice to trigger his interest. Now the question is how many parents, ie grown up people, realize the need for, and the importance of, classical musical education and are willing to provide it to their children...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 23, 2016, 05:46:26 AM
When the early English settlers arrived in America some communities almost starved because they would not eat the local produce, which was strange to them.
Imagine then a community living in subsitence unaware that the fruits around them are plentiful, flavourful, and and nourishing.
Jo498 and Florestan and James might suggest that these people are missing out, and that their lives would be enriched by partaking of the fruit.

I don't read that as Jo, Andrei, and James claiming that people who do are better people, only that they would have a better life, subjectively.
Some here, it appears, disagree with me. What food snobs you three are!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: James on May 23, 2016, 06:11:52 AM
Jo498 and Florestan and James might suggest that these people are missing out, and that their lives would be enriched by partaking of the fruit.

They are missing out. Anyone who really loves music can't overlook all that History in order to get a better & deeper sense of it. Pop music is just a little over a 100 years old .. that's nothing.

You are what you eat, I'm a big believer in that. And it is not just limited to actual food.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on May 23, 2016, 06:14:50 AM
In my own defense, let me say, yes, I do love a lot of 'pop music' (Bjork and Seal for example), but I'm a musical omnivore. I love all kinds of music, but classical music, for me, is like the final stop and what I enjoy the most, because of the range of emotions I receive from it. In terms of popular music, I tend to like music that requires a high level of musicianship like progressive rock, jazz, bluegrass, contemporary folk music, etc. I have specific tastes in all of these genres just like I do in classical music, but I think it's a shame that in some cases people who do listen to pop music never branch out and discover other genres, but, in hindsight, perhaps my initial opinion was rather harsh and, thus, I decided that the opinion I expressed was completely wrong-headed and, yes, elitist.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on May 23, 2016, 06:38:49 AM
You really think that Heavy Metal, because there are silly names for lotsa subgenres, is as diverse as, say 1800-1830 in classical music? Not to speak of ca. 1500-2000 in classical music? I don't really know what to say about that, it's too obviously wrong as far as I am concerned.

yes, there were a few concept albums 40 years ago. Most of them did not remain very popular and most of the guys (it's almost only guys) who dig that stuff are today around 50 now or older. And many of them were much closer to song cycles than to symphonies (not that there is anything wrong with that) and overall the format did not really catch on (now with mp3 single downloads it seems almost as obsolete as classical symphonies).

Again, the point is not that there might not be some worthwhile popular music. There are gourmet burgers as well but most people go to McDonalds so I think this is besides the point I was trying to make.
Namely, that popular music (mostly the stuff that the connoisseurs of concept albums consider crap as well) is pervading our culture to such an extent that most people think that the natural unit of music is a "song" and they are not even aware how incredibly parochial and narrow their musical socialization has been.

As for the "education of the masses". Of course we do it similarly to the other arts. We start with accessible stuff, do an outline of musical history, mostly stick to the great names and hope that they might discover others for themselves. We should also teach to play instruments, of course, although this is somewhat independent of music appreciation.

Why should we treat music differently from e.g. literature? The only reason we do it differently is that literature is more entrenched in curricula because it is somewhat loosely connected with being able to read and write on a certain level and we need this for some jobs. But a lot of that could be taught with non-literary texts as well.

And my second point was that we have, in a way, to do *more* in the case of music because "pop literature" is not blared from every speaker available and basic techniques in dealing with texts and language, including rudimentary appreciation of style etc. are still entrenched in all but the most elementary education.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: James on May 23, 2016, 07:03:01 AM
Oh James. You are one of the worst offenders.

I can handle the notion of "missing out", in the sense of people simply not hearing a particular kind of music. But to take that into some statement of not "truly knowing what music is" is the worst kind of elitist crap that denigrates the incredible amount of skill and effort that the best pop musicians have put into their craft.

And frankly, if your beloved Stockhausen is what music is truly is, then I'm perfectly happy not being a fan of true music, thanks all the same. I have better ways to spend my life than to use up any more of it trying to grasp what anyone finds appealing in endless operas about new age gibberish. It's pretentious shite.

Like I said many times before on this forum. Elitism is a useful & necessary reality. It shouldn't have negative connotations .. but in today's PC world, we tend to ignore reality. People want to believe that everything is on an even keel. We know this is bullshit. And just try talking to pop consumers to see what I'm saying, most of them have no sense of history and all the great work that occurred within. They really haven't put their ears through the wringer, not much thought goes into what they are actually listening to. The focus for them is rarely on the raw 'musical plane'. Their view & understanding is limited & narrow. They may have 'heard' of it, but nothing more, nothing deeper or more intimate. The majority I've confronted are only interested in going back about 5 years or less. They gotta be hip to their peers, this is very important.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on May 23, 2016, 07:03:22 AM
Like I said many times before on this forum. Elitism is a useful & necessary reality. It shouldn't have negative connotations .. but in today's PC world, we tend to ignore reality. People want to believe that everything is on an even keel. We know this is bullshit. And just try talking to pop consumers to see what I'm saying, most of them have no sense of history and all the great work that occurred within. They really haven't put their ears through the ringer, not much thought goes into what they are actually listening to. The focus for them is rarely on the raw 'musical plane'. Their view & understanding is limited & narrow. They may have 'heard' of it, but nothing more, nothing deeper or more intimate. The majority I've confronted are only interested in going back about 5 years or less. They gotta be hip to their peers, this is very important.

Thankfully, there are people who are interested in a wide spectrum of music and, yes, they do exist, which blows your whole theory to hell. The reality, from where I sit, is everyone has a limited and narrow range of musical tastes, including yourself, as we (people who enjoy a variety of music) have our favorites in each genre. It's like Duke Ellington said "There's good music, then there's the other kind." I mean I've never seen you once listen to late-Romantic composer, for example, but I think your empty ideas and notions about music are completely ridiculous anyway. For you, if it's not on the cutting edge, then it's inferior or in your case 'bad music.' I'm always glad I've never developed your kind of attitude about music, because this very attitude you've exhibited throughout your time here on GMG has been disgraceful and, in many ways, pathetic.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: James on May 23, 2016, 07:15:11 AM
Thankfully, there are people who are interested in a wide spectrum of music and, yes, they do exist, which blows your whole theory to hell.

Art/Classical music personifies breadth & depth (spectrum), well beyond popular music's relatively short history. And again, what I'm saying essentially is that exploring it will enrich one's musical experience & understanding tremendously .. well beyond what pop music is truly capable.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 23, 2016, 07:17:37 AM
Quote
Like I said many times before [...]

Exactly.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 23, 2016, 07:34:02 AM
Karl & James, folks. They're here all week! Please remember to tip your waitstaff.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on May 23, 2016, 08:02:28 AM
I think the point is not to denigrate popular musicians. Some of them are without a doubt very capable musicians.

But I find it difficult to deny both the overwhelming dominance of popular music in our culture (and that means that it enters our lives to a considerable extent even if we do not care for it because it simply blasts from some speaker in many public spaces very frequently) and its narrow spectrum. And I do think that both of these things actively work against the appreciation of classical (and other) music.

Again, we are talking about a tradition of only 50-60 years of anglophone popular music with its roots mainly in blues and some other (slightly older) genres. Despite concept albums and some other experiments etc. it is futile to deny that it was and is dominated by fairly simple 3-5 minutes songs that often share most structural features. There is nothing wrong with that and there might be some poetic and evocative or instrumentally brilliant pieces among them.  But that there are many names for sub-sub-genres like Death metal, Speed metal, Soft metal whatever can hardly hide the fact that the overall range of that popular music is fairly narrow. And this is partly because it usually has to have certain features to become or remain popular. There is also no denying that a large amount of that music is tied to thoroughly commercialized "youth cultures" with their own clothing, jargon etc.

Be that as it may, the problem is not that there is some popular music but that because of its pervasiveness and pseudo-breadth many people are hardly aware of other music. (Again this would also include a lot of instrumental Jazz and e.g. Indian Classical and some ethnic music most of which are even less known than classical.) Or if they encounter it they find most of it that does not confirm to the features of typical popular music strange and irritating. This is only to be expected if one's taste is formed in the way it is.

I am not quite as pessimistic that adults cannot overcome this conditioning. But I think it is one reason why in an age where the access, at least on youtube or radio is easier than ever classical music is probably less popular than 50 or 80 years ago. (Although I am not sure about that except for anecdotal evidence and the general complaints that the classical audience was "dying out")

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 23, 2016, 08:24:06 AM
Karl & James, folks. They're here all week!

No, I'm in and out through the course of the week.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 23, 2016, 08:27:11 AM
I do believe, though, if we ever have a lone parrot (if you have two birds, they are apt to communicate one with another, and not to respond particularly to attempts to have them imitate speech), one of the first phrases I'll teach him is, Like I said many times before.

No, but really.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 23, 2016, 08:29:39 AM
No, I'm in and out through the course of the week.

I'm in Fall River Wednesday through Friday nights.  May run out to the New Bedford Whaling Museum, too.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 23, 2016, 08:46:20 AM
John, what is your email address? I want to send you my latest app. A button that reads "Press here to move Shostakovich down." It's still in beta testing but I can see you need one desperately.

 >:D >:D >:D :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: >:D >:D

 ;)

(* chortle *)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on May 23, 2016, 08:48:17 AM
I love Webern, a master of miniatures. But there is a huge gulf between that and pop tunes. Same applies with Art song, piano pieces and all that mostly smaller scale stuff & instrumental music. But overall, yea .. it's longer and more involved. It has a richer History too.
Let's talk about an example here. Is there a "huge gulf" between the way Franz Schubert writes a song and the way Paul McCartney writes a song?

Part of the problem pop music faces is that, if you hear it on the radio 809523 times, you're going to start resenting it. The same holds true of classical music - which is why so many GMGers hate "over-played" works like Pachelbel's Canon or the Blue Danube waltz. If you look past that over-familiarity - if you look at the actual technique & skill & intention of the composition - is there such a "huge gulf," "longer and more involved and richer," when you consider Schubert lieder vs., say, Pet Sounds or Rubber Soul?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on May 23, 2016, 08:48:39 AM
I don't think you're being much fairer to pop music, frankly. And this is one of the things that irritates me so much about GMG. My nephew, who is into what I merely call "heavy metal", can rattle off a heck of a lot of subgenres of heavy metal, in much the same way that people here can have discussions about whether it's best to have someone of Austrian background playing Mozart (as is currently happening in the Mozart thread).

It's an inherent cultural bias to subdivide what you know and care about in great detail, and to treat something that you only know sketchily as less diverse. It's exactly the phenomenon that allows people to talk about individual states of the USA but treat "Africa" as if it's a single undifferentiated culture. It's exactly why people distinguish people of their own 'race' far better than people of a different 'race'. It's exactly why I'm as interested in whether or not someone from my own city is a northsider or a southsider, but couldn't tell you much about the characteristics of different districts of Paris and absolutely nothing about the different districts of Lagos.

What you use to teach English literature is going to depend a great deal on the depth with which you're teaching it. You're unlikely to introduce kids to authors from previous centuries in primary school. When they're a bit holder you might throw them a few of history's greatest hits like Shakespeare, but you're still not going to introduce them to a range of authors from across the centuries, only the really huge names. Once someone gets to university and decides they're going to study literature as a dedicated subject they might end up in a course about Scottish authors during the Enlightenment.

But not everyone's going to spend their life studying literature. Frankly not everyone has time for it. Everybody specialises. Everybody who bothers to post on this message board is inherently a specialist, because you care enough about music to want to talk to other people about it. Should anyone who wants to specialise in music as an interest be aware of a wide range of traditions? Absolutely.

But does this mean the general masses ought to be instructed past being vaguely aware of a few really big names like Bach, Mozart and Beethoven? No. Because in the same way that some of my friends deeply into literature discover that I haven't read many of the great pieces of literature (hey, I've seen a movie version of some of them), anyone who is deeply into music is going to discover that a lot of their friends haven't heard many of the great pieces of music. It's simply not realistic to expect that everyone has the same knowledge and experience base. It's never going to happen because people are off exploring a hundred other things that I, personally, don't find as riveting as I find music.
Agreeing with Karl that this is an outstanding post.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 23, 2016, 08:58:06 AM
Twelve? Let's see . . .

Stravinsky
Schoenberg
Prokofiev
Shostakovich
Chopin
Berlioz
JS Bach
Rakhmaninov
Sibelius
Nielsen
Brahms
D. Scarlatti

 
Getting the first ten is easy ... and then I wonder, whom am I leaving out, and I'll kick myself (figuratively) for the omission?...

Rhetorical q.'s:

Would I substitute LvB for D. Scarlatti?

Would I substitute Vivaldi for D. Scarlatti?

Is it odd to have Brahms there, but not LvB?

Shouldn't I make room for “Papa”?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 23, 2016, 08:59:31 AM
Part of the problem pop music faces is that, if you hear it on the radio 809523 times, you're going to start resenting it. The same holds true of classical music - which is why so many GMGers hate "over-played" works like Pachelbel's Canon or the Blue Danube waltz.

Very good point.  Baby, you're a firework.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 23, 2016, 09:12:10 AM
Resolved:  It is no particular virtue, just being scornful of a pop song, or of pop music as an industry.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: James on May 23, 2016, 09:47:33 AM
Let's talk about an example here. Is there a "huge gulf" between the way Franz Schubert writes a song and the way Paul McCartney writes a song?

Part of the problem pop music faces is that, if you hear it on the radio 809523 times, you're going to start resenting it. The same holds true of classical music - which is why so many GMGers hate "over-played" works like Pachelbel's Canon or the Blue Danube waltz. If you look past that over-familiarity - if you look at the actual technique & skill & intention of the composition - is there such a "huge gulf," "longer and more involved and richer," when you consider Schubert lieder vs., say, Pet Sounds or Rubber Soul?

In that prior post I was merely speaking to the suggestion that I somehow was overlooking shorter works within the vast 'written tradition' (as opposed to a oral or folk tradition) that Classical music is, and I pointed out Webern was a master of them (he's one of my favorite musicians ever) .. Webern wrote a lot of songs. You think the average pop consumer would 'get them', or anything else Webern wrote? How bout side by side with pop hits on the Radio? I say, nope. Large adjustment required, that is what I ment by gulf in that instance. That is perhaps an extreme example (but of the Lied tradition), I still believe it would be hard for people raised on only commercial pop music to get into the art songs & song cycles of Schubert, Schumann, Faure, Strauss, Mahler, Stockhausen etc, heck even Dowland (whom I love a lot) .. all of which have a lot of substance to them. More than you're average pop song .. which tends to border on adolescent, let's face it. Not to mention the performance aspects which tend to be, let's say "different" to put it gently.

But by & large Art music is more involved musically, yes. Even shorter, sung things. Pitting studio pop albums Rubber Soul or Pet Sounds against the much earlier nearly 600+ Franz Schubert 'art songs', cycles won't really change things.

And your point about familiarity breeding contempt may be true .. but more so for simple repetitive pop tunes which don't require much effort to absorb or get, and you're more likely to come by. Art song and all that that entails is foreign territory for most people, so are large choral edifices, symphonies, concertos, the world of chamber music, electro-acoustics, operas, secular/sacred music, heck most instrumental music ..  In general, Art/Classical music has a lot more mileage going for it, especially on the listening end of it - it will take many, many listens to absorb it's content before you reach the point of contempt or whatever, and even if you do - going through the musical anatomy of it all, you will come away from the experience 'learning' so much more.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on May 23, 2016, 10:31:51 AM
Let's talk about an example here. Is there a "huge gulf" between the way Franz Schubert writes a song and the way Paul McCartney writes a song?

Let´s actually talk about more than one example. In your opinion, which are McCartney´s equivalents of, say, Erlkoenig, Der Doppelgaenger and Der Wanderer?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 23, 2016, 10:35:10 AM
Let´s actually talk about more than one example. In your opinion, which are McCartney´s equivalents of, say, Erlkoenig, Der Doppelgaenger and Der Wanderer?
Spoilsport.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on May 23, 2016, 10:41:04 AM
Let´s actually talk about more than one example. In your opinion, which are McCartney´s equivalents of, say, Erlkoenig, Der Doppelgaenger and Der Wanderer?

Why must there be any comparisons made in the first place? These are two different genres that require a different set of ears for each.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 23, 2016, 10:44:24 AM
Are people not getting the word right? Great music from the past isn't great because it's "classical". It's "classical" because it's great and has lasted. If you try to define classical in value free terms and get in the wabac machine to any point in the past you'll find a lot of contemporaneous music meeting your definition which has since sunk without a trace, largely unlamented, and was no better or no worse than most contemporaneous music today.

Let's shift subject. I think the best theorem in mathematics is Cauchy's Analytic Function Theorem. This is a pretty widely held opinion amongst mathematicians. Now this theorem is till taught to every mathematician, and is central to vast branches of the subject. It's a classical theorem as it were. But lots of theorems from the same era are now forgotten.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on May 23, 2016, 10:49:03 AM
Getting back on topic for a change...

Another feeble attempt at a 'Top 10' (in no particular order):

Ravel
Bartók
Sibelius
Nielsen
Vaughan Williams
Elgar
Rachmaninov
Schnittke
Martinů
Shostakovich

Five Honorable Mentions: Janáček, Prokofiev, Britten, Szymanowski, and Villa-Lobos.

My list would look the same, although, now I would probably put my Top 5 in order:

Sibelius
Nielsen
Vaughan Williams
Bartók
Ravel
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on May 23, 2016, 10:58:33 AM
No. Same set of ears. But more demands placed on them for classical music in general. More effort required. Especially for those just raised on simple pop tunes.

What I'm saying, which is true whether you want to acknowledge it or not, is that you can't listen to either genre the same way. Both satisfy me, but where I prefer classical music as my 'final stop,' this shouldn't mean that popular music doesn't satisfy me in a completely different way. You'll never grow as a listener, James, if you continue to uphold this sense of superiority you seem to carry with each successive post you make. I still believe you're the most shallow listener I've ever met. Your growth as a listener is still in the kindergarten phase. How you will get out of this rut you're in is to stop being such a pompous jerk and accept that there's a lot of great music out there besides classical music.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on May 23, 2016, 11:16:04 AM
Interestingly, art songs, the genre that is closest to popular (and also folksy) music seem to be an acquired taste even among listeners of classical music. Sure, there have been several albums with songs by Schubert and others by pop or folk artists (Streisand, Baez, Sting, at least one German Folk Singer (Hannes Wader) and probably more. But generally, many people who are used to amplified voices find that classically trained voices sound unnatural or mannered.

I admit that I have not liked any of the classical pieces I have heard sung by the artists just mentioned (I got rid of a "Classical Barbra" Album many years ago and never bought the Sting/Dowland because I strongly disliked the samples). One reason is that their voices seem often overtaxed even by fairly "simple" songs. (And it is worse in more difficult music. I adore most of the 1960s albums of Joan Baez and own all of them but her voice that sounds so natural in folk songs sounds uncontrolled, the vibrato even ugly in the Bachiana Brasileira that is included on one of them and there is also a shipwreck on the Xmas album, I think) Apparently the vocal lines are often too difficult to be sung "naturally" with an untrained voice. Admittedly, this is speculative and there might be examples of similar crossover projects that worked better. (And I'll be the first to admit that some albums with opera singers trying Jazz or popular stuff might be even worse.)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Todd on May 23, 2016, 11:22:49 AM
Let´s actually talk about more than one example. In your opinion, which are McCartney´s equivalents of, say, Erlkoenig, Der Doppelgaenger and Der Wanderer?


Erlkoenig - Helter Skelter

Der Doppelganger - Eleanor Rigby

Der Wanderer - Yesterday


I forgot, did Schubert write his own lyrics?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on May 23, 2016, 11:45:28 AM
You only have 1 set of ears, that is the truth, you don't put on different ears to listen to something that may be different than what you're accustomed-to  or conditioned to hearing. And most people aren't too familiar with Art music at all, they are inundated with simple pop music from early on in most cases. Art music is uncharted territory for most pop consumers, they will have to rely on the ears-mind they have to get into it .. there is a learning curve required.

These are nothing but asinine generalizations that hold no water.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Todd on May 23, 2016, 11:46:23 AM
Thankfully no .. as most pop lyrics are pretty dumb.


It was a rhetorical question.  Schubert wrote only half-songs, really.  Same with most Lieder, Melodie, Art Song writers. 

Not all of Schubert's songs have particularly good lyrics, either.  Just because they were written a couple hundred years ago doesn't automatically make them good. 

Given that there are north of 50,000 albums released every year, no one is in a position to be able to assess "most pop lyrics".  The most you can say is that most pop lyrics you've heard are dumb, but you've heard a tiny fraction of what is out there.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on May 23, 2016, 11:59:11 AM
Oh so you have different pairs of ears at home? Each set specially tailored? I supposed you have different brains to connect to all those different sets too?

Get your shit together, boy.


What I'm saying, since apparently the idea of thinking, and more importantly comprehension, is beyond you, is that every genre of music has it's own language and like any language you can't just pick it up and understand it right off the bat. In other words, we listen to each genre of music differently hence why I enjoy listening to a wider spectrum of music and you'll continue to have a limited range and musical vocabulary because you can't separate one genre from the next.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Todd on May 23, 2016, 12:14:04 PM
Thankfully, there is more to those lied than just words. And the best of them have stood the test of time for many reasons. And he proved himself in lots of other areas too, of course.


There is more to art song than the lyrics, true, but not all the lyrics are great or even good.  The same applies to some pop music.



Yea .. that's one of the problems with pop entertainment, so much of it is dumped out there, as if that validates it, most of it shouldn't be put out. It's ephemeral by nature anyhow, mostly effluent .. . I don't listen to music for the words, most pop consumers do I noticed. A lot of the themes are the same.


How many art songs have been composed since the Renaissance, and how many have never been recorded, and how many are not performed today?  All you're doing is comparing a tiny fraction of art songs that still are performed and recorded to the very tiny slice of available pop songs that you have heard.  Your personal experience is very limited.

Time filters out the bad and the mediocre.  There are many bad and mediocre compositions from centuries past, and generally the best are remembered.  Something similar is already happening with pop songs from decades past. 
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on May 23, 2016, 12:19:31 PM
That's bull. The nuts & bolts of all music are the same, what is done with those raw materials is what we should be noticing. The creative scale. The musical plane. The time, the place too. And again, you aren't going to find a wider spectrum in music than Art music. It's been around a lot longer & covers more ground, musically. In a lot of cases 'genre' as it applies to pop music - should read, cliche. Stylistic cliche & trends, that most mold themselves into, which is a sad phenomenon and lacks creativity. You will always have a few that lead the way, but the rest just ride on the coattails.

The only thing remotely 'cliche' are your posts. There's good and bad music in all genres. Accept it or not, you're wrong and will always be wrong if you continue to flaunt the idea that whatever you say is some kind of universal truth.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on May 23, 2016, 12:21:21 PM
I don't listen to music for the words, most pop consumers do I noticed. A lot of the themes are the same.
"A lot of the themes are the same" - hah. And just how many "classical" songs do you think are about falling in love, getting dumped, and feeling blue? It's not like all of Hugo Wolf's songs are odes to Grecian urns and hymns on the praises of Aristotelian ethics.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Todd on May 23, 2016, 12:45:08 PM
But how many pop consumers are willing to absorb art lied to see if this is true or not ..  enrich their musical experience & understanding. Few.


Maybe, but what do you mean by few, and how do you know?



My personal experience with pop music isn't limited at all, I've heard all the main ones .. and at this point, most of it is the same. It's all been said and done it almost seems. And very, very little, if any of it, will have  much of an enduring life as performance music as the best Art music does.


Your personal experience with pop music is not just limited, it's very limited.  How many new pop albums did you listen to last year?  5?  50?  500?  5000? 

When you write the "main ones", I suspect you are referring only to the better known acts that are generally on major labels and get wide distribution and probably sell pretty well.  Again, that just points to how limited your experience is in the context of what is available. 
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on May 23, 2016, 12:53:06 PM
I doubt that even a professional pop music critic would listen to 500 or more new albums a year... What are these numbers supposed to tell us? That there is so much out there, therefore a lot (or a bit) of it must be really good? That one has to listen to 100s of obscure popular music albums before one is allowed to comment on popular music?

There is probably a Dan Brown novel every other year or so and dozens clones in between, I assume. There must be hundreds of similar books and some become bestsellers, like Brown. But it is enough to read two pages by Dan Brown (actually half a page suffices, see the link further above) to recognize it as poorly written.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 23, 2016, 12:56:21 PM
When the early English settlers arrived in America some communities almost starved because they would not eat the local produce, which was strange to them.
Imagine then a community living in subsitence unaware that the fruits around them are plentiful, flavourful, and and nourishing.
Jo498 and Florestan and James might suggest that these people are missing out, and that their lives would be enriched by partaking of the fruit.

I don't read that as Jo, Andrei, and James claiming that people who do are better people, only that they would have a better life, subjectively.
Some here, it appears, disagree with me. What food snobs you three are!

Except the local produce is pop music. And what's actually happening is that a bunch of people here who have discovered cuisines from far away and long ago are promoting them.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 23, 2016, 01:02:05 PM
You really think that Heavy Metal, because there are silly names for lotsa subgenres, is as diverse as, say 1800-1830 in classical music? Not to speak of ca. 1500-2000 in classical music? I don't really know what to say about that, it's too obviously wrong as far as I am concerned.

I doubt you know enough about heavy metal to make a proper assessment of it in comparison to 1800-1830 in classical music. Which is the whole point. Whereas I know that I don't know nearly enough about heavy metal to discuss it at the same level of detail that my nephew can (my nephew being quite musical), you just dismiss the very idea that it could be possibly as interesting as an intimate discussion about what was going on in Europe during a particular generation.

"Silly names"? Who cares what the names are, the point is that someone knowledgeable in the subject can pick up the distinctions. Meanwhile I can pick up at least 4 distinct phases in the career of Vagn Holmboe. Do those distinctions not exist merely because most of the rest of the world hasn't listened to enough Holmboe to be aware of them?  Do all Danish composers sound alike?

Statements like something being "too obviously wrong" are merely a way of avoiding a discussion you don't have something more to say in.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Todd on May 23, 2016, 01:12:46 PM
I doubt that even a professional pop music critic would listen to 500 or more new albums a year... What are these numbers supposed to tell us? That there is so much out there, therefore a lot (or a bit) of it must be really good? That one has to listen to 100s of obscure popular music albums before one is allowed to comment on popular music?


No, anyone can, and does, comment on pop music, and how it is inferior to art music.  It happens on this board regularly.  Classical fans here have found their tribe, that much is clear. 

The problem is such opinions rely on ignorance.  Not that there's apparently anything wrong with that.


I'm approaching 70 years of age .. I've watched the landscape for years. I can say with total certainty that being into Art lied is certainly very niche. Most people stick with pop music  pollution and are fond of the music of their adolescent years, which is pop-oriented.


An assertion based only on your experience.  My experience is that for most people, music is not particularly important, and it declines in importance as they age.  That has no bearing on what is good or bad or mediocre.



Do you honestly think it's a matter of numbers? Or quantity? When I say the main ones, I'm referring to trend setters & creative pilars of bygone eras .. You honestly think that what is being done today is that different, musically?


The numbers are important because opinions being offered here are based on very limited samples, and on top of that, very limited samples of western pop music.  I doubt many people here listen to much Afropop, or Indian pop music, or Cambodian pop music, yet they are content to say all pop music is the same lower quality, and that it has all been done, and so forth.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 23, 2016, 01:18:02 PM
There are plenty of niches within classical music as well. Heck, there are times when I find the general GMG focus on orchestral music rather fascinating. People are often more familiar with the orchestral version of a work that was originally written for some other forces than they are with the original.

I've gone onto some composer threads, in particular, and raised something about, say, chamber music or songs... and been met with complete silence. Everybody spends pages and pages discussing which are their top 5 symphony cycles, but talk about some non-orchestral work and they're struck dumb.

Heck, there are Beethoven pieces people don't know a lot about. Why are almost none of us familiar with op.6 and op.45? Is it because they're inferior music, or just because we don't have a million pianists blaring them at us?

Why do I notice these things? Because of my own particular interests and way of listening to things. Those who find orchestral music to be their "normal" don't notice. There's nothing objective about any of this. My biggest issue here is not that people prefer classical (orchestral) music, it's that some people treat a preference for classical (orchestral) music as some kind of objectively preferable state of affairs.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 23, 2016, 01:27:21 PM
Pop music is actually considerably influenced by African roots, but never mind that kind of detail...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Todd on May 23, 2016, 01:46:32 PM
Pop music was born and bred in the west


A dubious statement that relies on not listening to modern pop music and ignoring its history, especially given the very broad definition you have opted to give it elsewhere.  Again, how many new pop recordings released in the last five years have you listened to?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on May 23, 2016, 01:53:10 PM
Finding good pop music is a systematic process of trial and elimination. The same theory applies to all music. It's all subjective and as orfeo points out there's nothing remotely objective about any of this and I'm perfectly fine by that as I'll continue to listen to music that moves me while people like James thumbs their noses at something just because it doesn't coincide with their almighty opinion (aka THE UNIVERSAL TRUTH).
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Todd on May 23, 2016, 01:55:04 PM
I hear it every day .. it gives me a headache. And there is nothing 'modern' about it, btw. It's largely, kids stuff.


So how many?  And what artists, in particular, give you a headache?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 23, 2016, 02:01:45 PM
Most pop music is repetitive rhythmically & 4/4.

Well, I gather there are some types of heavy metal that avoid that problem. Or try math rock.

Or just try one of my favourite songs of all time. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jVMwDd8V_kY

EDIT: Pop music. So rhythmically uninteresting. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3M_Gg1xAHE4
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 23, 2016, 02:04:48 PM
I hear it every morning on the local radio station that plays all of the popular 'hits' of the day, or every time I go out driving ..

Oh man. If you're relying on a radio station to convey the sum total of pop music, that's your problem right there.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on May 23, 2016, 02:08:49 PM
I hear it every morning on the local radio station that plays all of the popular 'hits' of the day, or every time I go out driving .. have did this all my life. I follow the news and watch television to see what is going on .. I've never felt the need to keep track of it like this.

You're no better than an ostrich that has it's head buried in the sand. I don't believe for a second that you know anything about popular music other than what you've been exposed to via someone else. On your own, you haven't got a clue and it shows.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Todd on May 23, 2016, 02:11:41 PM
I hear it every morning on the local radio station that plays all of the popular 'hits' of the day, or every time I go out driving .. have did this all my life. I follow the news and watch television to see what is going on .. I've never felt the need to keep track of it like this.


So you're not really discussing pop music, but rather just the contemporary version of Top 40.  That explains a lot.  Assuming you are listening to something owned by Clear Channel or something similar, you are hearing an exceptionally small variety of pop music.

There are apps that let you listen to music from all over the world for free.  Pop music, classical music, Mongolian throat singing, whatever you want. 
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 23, 2016, 02:30:03 PM
I'm just wondering...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xcn4h1DiMWI

whether it's safe to say...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i1L6p4B2hBs

that all the great music...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nT7_IZPHHb0

is rhythmically interesting...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7pQytF2nak

or whether that is in fact...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgHxmAsINDk

a wild generalisation?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KK23BhEQVyU
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Todd on May 23, 2016, 02:33:13 PM
I am discussing pop music.


Not really, not if you are relying on one local radio station to form your opinion of current pop music.

I can't see any point in offering pop acts for you, specifically, to listen to. 
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: kishnevi on May 23, 2016, 02:45:00 PM
James, did you ever try what is called "world music"?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Todd on May 23, 2016, 02:46:46 PM
There is probably more variety found from 1965 thru to 1975 in popular musics than what is going on today!


Yes, yes.  In my day, and all that, I get it.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 23, 2016, 02:50:54 PM
There is probably more variety found from 1965 thru to 1975 in popular musics than what is going on today!

When I observed how a person who grew up in the 1960s would be far more comfortable with pop music from the 1960s, I genuinely had no idea that you were a walking, talking example of the effect.

That's the music you know.

If you're listening to a radio station that plays today's top 40 hits, you are never going to hear the variety of what is going on today, in exactly the same way that you have orchestras that turn out a steady diet of Beethoven and Brahms and wouldn't touch some of your preferred 20th/21st century classical with a 10-foot pole. Heck, many classical radio stations don't explore all that far. Trust me, I've had a look at how often the main Australian station plays Holmboe...

You're simply not making a fair comparison for all the reasons I've set out before. You're a specialist in what you like and a generalist in what you don't. And there's nothing wrong with that so long as you don't think that your generalisation is an accurate representation of what a person with a stronger interest in pop music of the last few decades will hear.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 23, 2016, 02:56:49 PM
Thankfully no .. as most pop lyrics are pretty dumb.

Yeah. (Yeah, yeah.)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: kishnevi on May 23, 2016, 02:57:34 PM
Like?

Are you a tourist on their first visit to a foreign country, in need of a tour guide to tell you what is and is not important? 


If you have such a lack of curiosity that you want us to tell you what is of interest instead of exploring on your own, then supplying you a list is a useless enterprise.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 23, 2016, 03:02:48 PM
I am discussing pop music. Instead of getting things wrong about me, (I mean really) why don't you tell me what you think are today's most outstanding pop songs, things that are doing something really fresh on a musical level, something that a highly versed musical individual may find interest in?

You misunderstand the purpose of thread, which is to sneer at anyone naive enough to believe in achievement or merit. Relativer than thou.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Todd on May 23, 2016, 04:24:44 PM
I'm waiting to be educated, I guess it is too hard for you to advocate the best of today's pop music to some old geezer like me, with those tastes.


Someone with such advanced and self-pronounced wisdom, knowledge, and taste as you can do some of your own homework and not rely on one local radio station or any forum member not up to your lofty aesthetic standards.  And you already know, and have repeatedly written, what you think of music you haven't even heard.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Todd on May 23, 2016, 04:32:03 PM
Actually, let me try a James:


"50 Best Albums of 2015

40 Songhoy Blues, 'Music in Exile'

To find the heaviest-hitting blues-rock of the year, take a sharp left at the Mississippi Delta until you're in the deserts of Mali. Though rooted in the nation's world-famous guitar lineage and chugging with the rollicking Saharan-rock rhythms made popular by contemporary bands like Tinariwen and Terakraft, Songhoy Blues are a far harder and punkier affair: Think Ali Farka Touré's iconic desert blues shredded out by kids raised on hip-hop and Jimi Hendrix. Their debut album, produced by Marc-Antoine Moreau and Yeah Yeah Yeahs' Nick Zinner, is the blazing solution to a year without a new Black Keys or Jack White album, full of lyrical solos, entrancing rhythms and melancholy lyrics like those of "Desert Melodie," a protest of the jihadists who outlawed music in the northern part of their country."


Let me know if you need a higher ranking one James, and I can cut and paste for you.  (I mean, come on, you mentioned Hendrix, the reviewer mentioned Hendrix ..)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on May 23, 2016, 08:15:32 PM

Erlkoenig - Helter Skelter

Der Doppelganger - Eleanor Rigby

Der Wanderer - Yesterday

Coming from you such brevity is a bit of a letdown. I should have expected one of your customary lengthy technical essays on Schubert recordings, this time elaborating on the above stated similitudes. Nevertheless, I´ll take your word for it.

Quote
I forgot, did Schubert write his own lyrics?

That´s a good point. Indeed, McCartney the composer stands in the same relation to Schubert as McCartney the poet stands to Goethe or Heine.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 24, 2016, 12:03:06 AM
Again, now is the chance to advocate, but you don't.

Fine, I'll advocate the following artists, almost none of whom I would expect to hear on radio any time soon.

Radiohead, Tori Amos, Something for Kate (or Paul Dempsey as a solo artist), george or any of the Noonan siblings' subsequent projects (Katie Noonan being more prolific), Patty Griffin, Beyoncé's last two albums, Fiona Apple (especially her last album), Janelle Monae, Moloko / Roisin Murphy as a solo artist, and the only album by the Dissociatives. That'll do for now.

There is of course not the slightest guarantee that you'll like any of this, any more than there is a guarantee that we will like the same classical composers. I think we've already established that one of your most beloved classical composers leaves me stone cold.

But, as others have said, if you actually had any kind of curiosity about these things you would go and explore yourself. I sure as hell didn't find out about many of my favourite pop artists by blindly following the radio. My sister and I used to regularly buy each other albums for Christmas and birthdays, and that largely died out because I kept coming up with wishlists with large numbers of performers my sister had never heard of and often albums that had never been released for sale in Australia. I'd been told about them by other music fans, I'd read articles that made me curious, I'd seen critics lists, I'd stumbled across a video somewhere on the internet or on the late night music clips show that runs for 7 or 8 hours.

Your protestations that you've heard it all are deeply unconvincing, because you wouldn't have heard most of it unless you went looking for it.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 24, 2016, 01:24:59 AM


Your protestations that you've heard it all are deeply unconvincing, because you wouldn't have heard most of it unless you went looking for it.

Deeply unconvincing, too, because it aligns with his history of intellectual lethargy.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 24, 2016, 01:28:40 AM
Coming from you such brevity is a bit of a letdown. I should have expected one of your customary lengthy technical essays on Schubert recordings, this time elaborating on the above stated similitudes. Nevertheless, I´ll take your word for it.

That´s a good point. Indeed, McCartney the composer stands in the same relation to Schubert as McCartney the poet stands to Goethe or Heine.
Is Satie's work, too, inconsiderable, because its simplicity compares so obviously to the, let us say, dexterity of the songs and piano music of Brahms?

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Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 24, 2016, 01:37:31 AM
Are people not getting the word right? Great music from the past isn't great because it's "classical". It's "classical" because it's great and has lasted. If you try to define classical in value free terms and get in the wabac machine to any point in the past you'll find a lot of contemporaneous music meeting your definition which has since sunk without a trace, largely unlamented, and was no better or no worse than most contemporaneous music today.

Excellent point, thanks.

There's no real purchase in present assertions that (say) "Yesterday" will sink without a trace. In the first place, the assertion is hostile and speculative; the question needs to be revisited a hundred years hence.

In the second, there is no present indication that "Yesterday" suffers any artistic ill health; I shouldn't be surprised if, somewhere in the world, someone performs the song to an audience who think well of it, each and every day. I do not think it a grave risk of error to surmise that it may become a classic.

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Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 24, 2016, 01:50:21 AM
I'm tempted, for the sake of fusing together the actual topic and the massive deviation that has now engulfed it, to try and come up with a list of favourite composers that combines classical favourites with pop music ones.

It's a scary thought, though. It's difficult enough trying to compare my reactions to Bach with my reactions to Faure. The prospect of trying to evaluate my taste for Rachmaninov compared to my taste for Radiohead is rather daunting.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on May 24, 2016, 01:55:37 AM
Is Satie's work, too, inconsiderable, because its simplicity compares so obviously to the, let us say, dexterity of the songs and piano music of Brahms?

My reply was to Todd´s claim that Paul McCartney´s Helter Skelter is the equivalent of Schubert´s Erlkoenig. I don´t quite get what Satie and Brahms have got to do with the issue.  :)

Anyway, here is McCartney himself on Helter Skelter:

"Umm, that came about just 'cause I'd read a review of a record which said, 'and [the Who] really got us wild, there's echo on everything, they're screaming their heads off.' And I just remember thinking, 'Oh, it'd be great to do one. Pity they've done it. Must be great – really screaming record.' And then I heard their record and it was quite straight, and it was very sort of sophisticated. It wasn't rough and screaming and tape echo at all. So I thought, 'Oh well, we'll do one like that, then.' And I had this song called 'Helter Skelter,' which is just a ridiculous song. So we did it like that, 'cuz I like noise." (emphasis mine)

I simply fail to see any similarity between a ridiculously noisy song written solely for the purpose of outdoing the competition in the genre (I use its composer´s own words) and Schubert´s Erlkoenig. That is all.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 24, 2016, 01:57:55 AM
I'm tempted, for the sake of fusing together the actual topic and the massive deviation that has now engulfed it, to try and come up with a list of favourite composers that combines classical favourites with pop music ones.

It's a scary thought, though. It's difficult enough trying to compare my reactions to Bach with my reactions to Faure. The prospect of trying to evaluate my taste for Rachmaninov compared to my taste for Radiohead is rather daunting.

That, for me, is the interest in the exercise. The truth cannot be well served by either the Horse Race, nor by Everything Is Beautiful, in Its Own Way; but, I think, by some humane balance of moderated models of both "extremes."
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on May 24, 2016, 02:03:46 AM
And here's me thinking classical referred to neoclassicism (or to the classical antiquity), and that if a sculpture or a piece of music was (or was not) in this style, it didn't necessarily tell us whether it has lasting aesthetic value.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 24, 2016, 02:11:38 AM
In chronological order:

Bach, J.S.
Haydn
Beethoven
Chopin
Brahms
Dvorak
Faure
Rachmaninov
Ravel
Holmboe

I'm damn glad I chose to go with chronological order.

Haydn
Beethoven
Brahms
Faure
Holmboe
Joni Mitchell
Tori Amos
Patty Griffin
Thom Yorke
Paul Dempsey
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 24, 2016, 03:39:26 AM
My reply was to Todd´s claim that Paul McCartney´s Helter Skelter is the equivalent of Schubert´s Erlkoenig. I don´t quite get what Satie and Brahms have got to do with the issue.  :)

Anyway, here is McCartney himself on Helter Skelter:

"Umm, that came about just 'cause I'd read a review of a record which said, 'and [the Who] really got us wild, there's echo on everything, they're screaming their heads off.' And I just remember thinking, 'Oh, it'd be great to do one. Pity they've done it. Must be great – really screaming record.' And then I heard their record and it was quite straight, and it was very sort of sophisticated. It wasn't rough and screaming and tape echo at all. So I thought, 'Oh well, we'll do one like that, then.' And I had this song called 'Helter Skelter,' which is just a ridiculous song. So we did it like that, 'cuz I like noise." (emphasis mine)

I simply fail to see any similarity between a ridiculously noisy song written solely for the purpose of outdoing the competition in the genre (I use its composer´s own words) and Schubert´s Erlkoenig. That is all.

A most interesting post, thanks, дорогой  :)

To work backwards, (1.) we can announce that Boléro is not music, using its composer´s own words:

Quote from: Ravel
I have written one masterpiece, and that is the Boléro. Unfortunately, it contains no music.

A simple illustration that it will not do simply to refer to the composer´s own words as a definitive indicator.

(2.) In neither case, though, is the context especially simple.  In both cases, meseems, we have a composer coping with his relations to the public.  Ravel was, perhaps, sniping at what the public has fixated upon, and complaining that other works of his, which cost him greater effort and of which the composer himself thought more highly, go unregarded.  McCartney, as any reasonably intelligent pop artist who has had more than one popular success, wrestled with the conflicting elements of the public´s expectations (expectations established by his own successes), and the artistic impulse of expanding one´s palette, of not simply repeating oneself.  What did he mean by this remark?  I don´t have the definitive answer.  There may be elements of modesty, of which (in the context of a discussion of a “classical composer”) we would typically speak well.

(3.) Your rhetorical dismissal, too, depends on regarding the two elements in a negative light.  Let´s concede for argument´s sake that it is a ridiculous song.  Why is that suddenly ineligible in vocal music?  Offhand, we should probably call Игорь Фёдорович´s Тилим-бом ridiculous, but not consider it anything negative.  And you´re really going to dismiss “Helter Skelter” as noise, dismiss McCartney´s exulting in cooperating in a song which is a celebration of noise?  What are you, your own grandmother, that we only allow songs which sound pretty?  ;)  In short, sure:  it´s ridiculous, and it´s noisy;  and that´s how it´s made.

(4.) Parenthetically, when one has written something ridiculous and noisy as a caprice (a time-honored musical occupation), and it is the material for an adaptation such as the following, we have the beginning of an argument that one has created a classic:

http://www.youtube.com/v/TywEOijcLDE

(5.) I am a little surprised to hear you, a fellow fan of the musical 19th century, pooh-poohing outdoing the competition, which (broadly interpreted) also enjoys an ancient musical pedigree.  But as I read it, McCartney was not trying to out-do The Who, but that he had formed a certain idea from a written review of the record (again: the faculty of imagination, which, if our subject were Schubert, we would be lauding); that on listening to the actual record, he found that it did not match his mental profile of the music — and so he set out to create a recording which matched his mental expectations.  I do call that drawing inspiration where one finds it.

(6.) As to Todd´s post, you asked for his opinion on an equivalent, without specifying what would satisfy you as equivalence.  I should have called it a suggestion, rather than a claim;  it´s true that he offered the suggestions without explanation, but I expect there could be reasonable and interesting discussion on the question.  Perhaps he will enlarge.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on May 24, 2016, 04:53:38 AM
Why, you supplied the essay I had been expecting from Todd. Thank you too.  :)

What did he mean by this remark? 

I don´t know. He made it two days before the release of The Beatles, which contained the piece.

Quote
Your rhetorical dismissal, too, depends on regarding the two elements in a negative light.  Let´s concede for argument´s sake that it is a ridiculous song.  Why is that suddenly ineligible in vocal music?

You read "ineligible" where I implied "non-similar"or "non-equivalent".


Quote
And you´re really going to dismiss “Helter Skelter” as noise, dismiss McCartney´s exulting in cooperating in a song which is a celebration of noise?

Thank you for producing further evidence for Helter Skelter not being anywhere near remotely similar /equivalent to Erlkoening, of which we might perhaps agree upon it not being a celebration of noise.

Quote
What are you, your own grandmother, that we only allow songs which sound pretty?  ;)

The idea that I allow only songs which sound pretty is false and I don´t know which part of my post lead you to infer it.

BTW, I have never talked with my grandmother(s) about music so I don´t know what songs they would have allowed. Anyway, I would much prefer leaving aside any further reference to one´s family´s members, especially those that are presumably long since dead. Thank you.


Quote
  In short, sure:  it´s ridiculous, and it´s noisy;  and that´s how it´s made.

In short, sure: that´s precisely why I fail to see any resemblance between it and Лесной царь

Quote
Parenthetically, when one has written something ridiculous and noisy as a caprice (a time-honored musical occupation), and it is the material for an adaptation such as the following, we have the beginning of an argument that one has created a classic:

http://www.youtube.com/v/TywEOijcLDE

No argument from me here.

Quote
I am a little surprised to hear you, a fellow fan of the musical 19th century, pooh-poohing outdoing the competition, which (broadly interpreted) also enjoys an ancient musical pedigree.

My dear Karl, I am (more than) a little surprised that you misunderstood my position completely. I should have thought anyone would understand that what I object to is not to Helter Skelter as such. Heck, I even like it, it clearly looked far ahead to the Heavy Metal genre of which I have been a fan in my early 20s. I object to it being offered as an equivalent (which is precisely what I asked for) to Erlkoening. I submit to your consideration that neither the history of their composition, neither their subject, neither their music nor finally their mood and atmosphere are in any way congruent. Musically, intellectually and aesthetically they inhabit different galaxies. You are of course free to disagree and adduce evidence to the contrary

Quote
But as I read it, McCartney was not trying to out-do The Who, but that he had formed a certain idea from a written review of the record (again: the faculty of imagination, which, if our subject were Schubert, we would be lauding); that on listening to the actual record, he found that it did not match his mental profile of the music — and so he set out to create a recording which matched his mental expectations.  I do call that drawing inspiration where one finds it.

Being inspired by something does not preclude trying to outdo it; oftentimes it is precisely the goal. The "Pity they´ve done it", "It wasn't rough and screaming and tape echo at all." and "So I thought, 'Oh well, we'll do one like that, then." sequence allows for interpreting it as "doing what the Who tried to do but did not really succeed", in other words "outdoing" them.

Parenthetically, I don´t know where you got the notion that I dismiss outdoing per se. I just pointed out one of the most blatant dissimilarities between Helter Skelter and Erlkoenig: the former was inspired by another musical work (your formulation) / trying to outdo another musical work (my wording), while neither applies to the latter.

Quote
(6.) As to Todd´s post, you asked for his opinion on an equivalent

Minor correction: I actually asked for Brian´s opinion.

Quote
without specifying what would satisfy you as equivalence.  I should have called it a suggestion, rather than a claim;  it´s true that he offered the suggestions without explanation, but I expect there could be reasonable and interesting discussion on the question.  Perhaps he will enlarge.

I certainly hope so but I don´t hold my breath.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on May 24, 2016, 05:03:27 AM
I simply fail to see any similarity between a ridiculously noisy song written solely for the purpose of outdoing the competition in the genre (I use its composer´s own words) and Schubert´s Erlkoenig. That is all.
The great thing about art is that it transcends, and leaves behind, the artists' original intentions, and can claim meanings, in the eyes/ears of its audience, which the artist did not imagine.

EDIT:
Minor correction: I actually asked for Brian´s opinion.
And also, the great thing about discussion boards is, anyone can answer your question.  0:)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on May 24, 2016, 05:05:49 AM
I'm damn glad I chose to go with chronological order.

Haydn
Beethoven
Brahms
Faure
Holmboe
Joni Mitchell
Tori Amos
Patty Griffin
Thom Yorke
Paul Dempsey

I really like this idea!!

Very rough draft:

1. Beethoven
2. Dvorak
3. Schubert
4. Mingus
5. Ravel
6. Janacek
7. Berlioz
8. Monk
9. Haydn
10. Lennon/McCartney
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on May 24, 2016, 05:11:32 AM
The great thing about art is that it transcends, and leaves behind, the artists' original intentions, and can claim meanings, in the eyes/ears of its audience, which the artist did not imagine.

Perhaps Imagine would have been a better choice than Helter Skelter?  :laugh:

Quote
EDIT:And also, the great thing about discussion boards is, anyone can answer your question.  0:)

Sure. And you know very well that I believe in absolutely free speech.  :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 24, 2016, 05:14:19 AM
Perhaps Imagine would have been a better choice than Helter Skelter?  :laugh:


Imagine there's no pointlessly repetitive debate on the same issues over and over on every damn GMG thread
You can do it if you try
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 24, 2016, 05:18:34 AM
I really like this idea!!

I'm still not sure that I do...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on May 24, 2016, 05:22:03 AM
You can do it if you try

You have no idea how many times I´ve said that to myself.  :laugh:
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on May 24, 2016, 05:26:08 AM
Perhaps Imagine would have been a better choice than Helter Skelter?  :laugh:
No, because Paul McCartney didn't write it. ;)

I'm still not sure that I do...
If there's one thing GMG specializes in, it's the ongoing comparison of apples, oranges, and a whole lot of other comestibles besides.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 24, 2016, 05:26:32 AM
My dear Karl, I am (more than) a little surprised that you misunderstood my position completely.

Well, that's why we chat. Or one reason, anyway.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on May 24, 2016, 05:28:09 AM
No, because Paul McCartney didn't write it. ;)

Imagine he did...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Todd on May 24, 2016, 05:28:19 AM
No, because Paul McCartney didn't write it.



Yep.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on May 24, 2016, 05:28:50 AM
Well, that's why we chat. Or one reason, anyway.

 :laugh:
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Todd on May 24, 2016, 05:30:49 AM
(6.) As to Todd´s post, you asked for his opinion on an equivalent, without specifying what would satisfy you as equivalence.



Nothing would or will.  Some people just want to harrumph from on high about plebeian pop music.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 24, 2016, 05:37:42 AM
If there's one thing GMG specializes in, it's the ongoing comparison of apples, oranges, and a whole lot of other comestibles besides.

My concern is that I'm moving out of the fruit group entirely.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on May 24, 2016, 07:52:40 AM
I doubt you know enough about heavy metal to make a proper assessment of it in comparison to 1800-1830 in classical music. Which is the whole point. Whereas I know that I don't know nearly enough about heavy metal to discuss it at the same level of detail that my nephew can (my nephew being quite musical), you just dismiss the very idea that it could be possibly as interesting as an intimate discussion about what was going on in Europe during a particular generation.
[...]
Statements like something being "too obviously wrong" are merely a way of avoiding a discussion you don't have something more to say in.
No. There can be no discussion, if only "experts" who have listened to 500 heavy (or doom/black/silly/...) metal albums and can name all the subdivisions are entitled to an opinion. And the mere existence of experts does not show anything. My cousin was an expert on Pokemon when he was seven or so.

I do not have to read more than a few pages of a superhero comic (and I certainly do not have to read 100s of them) to know that this genre will not be comparable to Russian novels in the second half of the 19th century or Greek tragedies or whatever. Even the best superhero comic that might rise far above the typical trash is extremely limited by the very genre.

But more importantly, throwing huge numbers around and claiming that one had listen to a considerably fraction of that music, like you and Todd seem to do, obviously proves too much. Noone of us can listen to 5000 albums per year (4900 of which we might not care for), not to mention the further 500,000 recordings by some garage band on myspace (or what this is called today). Or to hundreds of symphonies by Haydn's contemporaries.
We ALL rely on certain mechanisms filtering out worthwhile candidates from what is out there. And such mechanisms usually do not need hundreds of years to work. I claim no expertise but my brother is reasonably well versed and very interested in the last 4 decades or so of popular music and I am sure that he would have no problem to name what was the most important music of the 1990s and that most of those bands or songs were recognized as important in their day; so we do not have do wait even 20 years.

You apparently find some of these mechanisms unreliable and say that "popular" popular music gives a wrong or skewed impression. (Maybe not the mechanisms that lead from myspace to a buyable album but those from an album to a chart position.) And you seem to generally agree that a lot of what's in the charts is rather bad or forgettable.
So you should at least to some extent agree with my original point that the dominant popular culture does not help people developing their taste because otherwise the most popular stuff would be better or at least not so much of the bad stuff would be so popular. (Note that this "closing of the musical mind" was actually my point further above, not the absolute quality of some choice popular music.)

Nevertheless, I am also wary of the claim that there is some totally different "unpopular" pop music with lots of hidden gems.  I never was really into any popular music but I listened to some of the stuff that was supposed to be "better", e.g. Radiohead or REM or whatever back in the mid/late 1990s (when I was more sociable...). This stuff might be better, but it is/was both quite popular and not totally different at all. It usually follows very clearly the typical song patterns etc. (and at least in clubs or concerts it is almost always played so loudly that I can hardly bear it). Stuff called "alternative" or "underground" still sells half a million albums I guess and additional merchandise.

It is also hardly plausible that most would denigrate popular music to "look down on the plebs". First of all, you seem to do something very similar yourself if you claim that what is in the popular charts is usually bad. Secondly, if in a forum dedicated to classical music denigrators of pop are clearly in the minority it seems obvious that there is no social capital at all to be gained by such a position. So why not try the idea that this is really our honest opinion...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 24, 2016, 07:59:39 AM
Nothing would or will.  Some people just want to harrumph from on high about plebeian pop music.

Obviously, if any of us knew as much about music as James, or if we would simply read what he actually writes . . . .
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on May 24, 2016, 08:11:21 AM
if in a forum dedicated to classical music denigrators of pop are clearly in the minority it seems obvious that there is no social capital at all to be gained by such a position. So why not try the idea that this is really our honest opinion...

Amen, bruder!

To this, as well as to the rest of your post.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 24, 2016, 08:16:49 AM
Amen, bruder!

To this, as well as to the rest of your post.

You persist in not understanding the game. The game is to prove one's worth by denying any such opinion could possibly be honest. The Higher Being sees through you.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on May 24, 2016, 08:47:20 AM
You persist in not understanding the game. The game is to prove one's worth by denying any such opinion could possibly be honest.

All the more reason to appreciate and salute an honest opinion, methinks.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Todd on May 24, 2016, 08:48:03 AM
But more importantly, throwing huge numbers around and claiming that one had listen to a considerably fraction of that music, like you and Todd seem to do, obviously proves too much.


Looks like you missed my point.  The self-appointed cultural elites on this board seem to be unfamiliar with current pop music, and don't take the time to listen to any.  You're the one who came up with the magic number of 500; I asked 5, 50, 500, 5000.  If the number of pop albums one listens to is close to, or at, zero, then making a statement about the quality of current pop music is based on prejudice and ignorance, not knowledge.  Now, if you are not predisposed to listen to pop music, that's perfectly fine, but without actually listening, comments on quality are inherently uninformed; one needn't listen to hundreds of new albums a year, but it helps to listen to more than none.



So you should at least to some extent agree with my original point that the dominant popular culture does not help people developing their taste because otherwise the most popular stuff would be better or at least not so much of the bad stuff would be so popular.


What popular stuff is "bad", and how can it be "better"?  What evaluative criteria should be applied when making these determinations?  In addition to seeking out less popular pop music - and not multi-million sellers like Radiohead and REM, but actually less popular pop music - I also listen to truly popular pop music.  In that category, there's some entertaining, catchy, throwaway stuff (Taylor Swift, say), some stuff I can't stand but others love (eg, Adele), and so forth.  I have no expectation that the most popular pop music will display the musical sophistication of Schubert or Webern, and to compare such pop music to those types of composers is preposterous to begin with.  More serious, accomplished stuff - the Beatles, Tom Waits (writing, not singing), Lyle Lovett, Aimee Mann, Liz Phair, among others - can begin to compare to much vaunted art songs.  I can say with absolute honesty that a properly performed version of Long Way Home is superior to some songs I've listened to from even Schubert.  (I've not heard all of Schubert's songs, but only a few hundred.)

Also, I suppose I should inquire as to whether "dominant" popular culture, past, present, or future, is even supposed to be about, or ought to be about, helping people develop their taste.  What does that even mean, and would pop culture be able to do whatever it is you are proposing or hope for?  Ought it not be up to individuals to develop their taste?



Secondly, if in a forum dedicated to classical music denigrators of pop are clearly in the minority it seems obvious that there is no social capital at all to be gained by such a position. So why not try the idea that this is really our honest opinion...


It can be an honest opinion.  But the rhetorical questions posed, and the terms used, are undefined or ambiguous, and in extreme instances devolve into the cliché of the elderly not understanding the music of kids today. 
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 24, 2016, 09:01:56 AM
McCartney’s sheepish soft-pedaling notwithstanding, I think “Helter Skelter” is a fine specimen of a pop song.  Doesn’t mean that everyone (or anyone else) has to like it.  Without necessarily thinking less of his designedly ‘smoother’ songs (“When I’m Sixty-Four,” “Michelle,” “Maxwell’s Silver Hammer,” e.g.), I especially like that McCartney veered back toward the raw energy more typical of their earlier R&B numbers (covers, or original songs).

Further resolved:  That I’ve heard all of it is another of the sounds produced by a mind snapping shut   0:)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on May 24, 2016, 10:27:34 AM
I have no expectation that the most popular pop music will display the musical sophistication of Schubert or Webern, and to compare such pop music to those types of composers is preposterous to begin with

Finally, something we agree on! (rhetorical device --- we agree on many things, actually...)

But for God´s sake, it is not me, or Jo or James or whoever you think might belong to the "self appointed GMG cultural elite" (whatever this might mean) who makes such comparisons. On the contrary, if anything we reject such comparisons. There is no useful criteria for that. "Classical" music (in its broadest sense) and "pop" music (also in its broadest sense --- and please be aware that, for instance, hardcore Heavy Metal (and its subgenres) fans would strongly and unequivocally reject being lumped together under this umbrella) inhabit different galaxies. Their philosophical, intellectual and aesthetical points of intersection are few and far between.

Indeed the only (relatively) meaningful comparison that can be made is with the Lieder / Artsong genre. I say relatively because off the top of my head I can name no Lieder composer who did not tackle any other genre, while off the top of my head I can name no "pop" artist other than Frank Zappa who extended his interest and abilities beyond songwriting, concept albums notwithstanding. Heck, Carl Loewe wrote several piano sonatas and string quartets, a symphony and a piano concerto; Hugo Wolf composed a finished opera and two string quartets. With, and within, these qualifications, I agree that there are many "pop" songs who are of the highest musical quality; I agree that there are "pop"composers who can be considered as masterful in their art as Schubert. I name five such people in no particular order: Eric Clapton, Ray Charles, Sting, Mark Knopfler and Willie Nelson.

Trouble arises when some people try to extend this legitimate area of comparison and to put, for instance, Beethoven and Tori Amos on the same list. It is only then that we ask --- in vain --- to be presented with at least a modicum of evidence beyond the obviously incontrovertible and unfalsifiable "I like them both the same" that musically, philosophically, intellectually and aesthetically they can be compared and that the comparison yields none better than the other.

The most annoying thing in all is the following: we of the "self appointed GMG cultural elite" defend, promote and mainly listen to a type of music which spans more than 1,000 years, is divided in countless truly defined and definable genres and subgenres, is scored for tens of different instruments and voice types, its vocals are sung in at least ten modern languages and two dead ones, requires years, if not whole decades, of strenuous and dedicated effort from the musicians in order to properly master their instrument and play it properly both as solo and in ensembles, and also requires from its afficionados a patient, gratification-delaying, continuous cultivation and development of their taste while guaranteeing to them an ever-increasing widening of their cultural horizon ---- and for unabashedly acknowledging and relishing all that, we are  labeled snob, closeminded and elitist. But if a "pop" fan shows himself, as all too oftenly they do, (gladly and sneeringly) ignorant of all that, stubbornly unwilling to extend his musical horizon beyond his favorite band(s) / singer(s) and only too eager to dismiss the music we cherish as elitist stuff fit only for snobs --- then we are to keep silent for fear not to appear or being misconstrued as snob and elitist, or even are to have feelings of guilt for not being in tune with the people, or even are to internalize that we really are snob and elitist and must do penance for our sins. It is this double standard that I find repulsive and against which I will raise my feeble voice whenever the occasion presents.

Dixi et salvavi animam meam.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 24, 2016, 01:08:46 PM
No. There can be no discussion, if only "experts" who have listened to 500 heavy (or doom/black/silly/...) metal albums and can name all the subdivisions are entitled to an opinion. And the mere existence of experts does not show anything. My cousin was an expert on Pokemon when he was seven or so.

I do not have to read more than a few pages of a superhero comic (and I certainly do not have to read 100s of them) to know that this genre will not be comparable to Russian novels in the second half of the 19th century or Greek tragedies or whatever. Even the best superhero comic that might rise far above the typical trash is extremely limited by the very genre.

But more importantly, throwing huge numbers around and claiming that one had listen to a considerably fraction of that music, like you and Todd seem to do, obviously proves too much. Noone of us can listen to 5000 albums per year (4900 of which we might not care for), not to mention the further 500,000 recordings by some garage band on myspace (or what this is called today). Or to hundreds of symphonies by Haydn's contemporaries.
We ALL rely on certain mechanisms filtering out worthwhile candidates from what is out there. And such mechanisms usually do not need hundreds of years to work. I claim no expertise but my brother is reasonably well versed and very interested in the last 4 decades or so of popular music and I am sure that he would have no problem to name what was the most important music of the 1990s and that most of those bands or songs were recognized as important in their day; so we do not have do wait even 20 years.

You apparently find some of these mechanisms unreliable and say that "popular" popular music gives a wrong or skewed impression. (Maybe not the mechanisms that lead from myspace to a buyable album but those from an album to a chart position.) And you seem to generally agree that a lot of what's in the charts is rather bad or forgettable.
So you should at least to some extent agree with my original point that the dominant popular culture does not help people developing their taste because otherwise the most popular stuff would be better or at least not so much of the bad stuff would be so popular. (Note that this "closing of the musical mind" was actually my point further above, not the absolute quality of some choice popular music.)

Nevertheless, I am also wary of the claim that there is some totally different "unpopular" pop music with lots of hidden gems.  I never was really into any popular music but I listened to some of the stuff that was supposed to be "better", e.g. Radiohead or REM or whatever back in the mid/late 1990s (when I was more sociable...). This stuff might be better, but it is/was both quite popular and not totally different at all. It usually follows very clearly the typical song patterns etc. (and at least in clubs or concerts it is almost always played so loudly that I can hardly bear it). Stuff called "alternative" or "underground" still sells half a million albums I guess and additional merchandise.

It is also hardly plausible that most would denigrate popular music to "look down on the plebs". First of all, you seem to do something very similar yourself if you claim that what is in the popular charts is usually bad. Secondly, if in a forum dedicated to classical music denigrators of pop are clearly in the minority it seems obvious that there is no social capital at all to be gained by such a position. So why not try the idea that this is really our honest opinion...

I never suggested it wasn't your honest opinion. But it was at one point a highly dismissive opinion.

The rest of this I'm just not going to bother with any more. There is too much to unpick and it's not worth the time.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 24, 2016, 01:10:36 PM
Trouble arises when some people try to extend this legitimate area of comparison and to put, for instance, Beethoven and Tori Amos on the same list. It is only then that we ask --- in vain --- to be presented with at least a modicum of evidence beyond the obviously incontrovertible and unfalsifiable "I like them both the same" that musically, philosophically, intellectually and aesthetically they can be compared and that the comparison yields none better than the other.

No, trouble arises when you don't read the title of the damn thread. Because you can't possibly have had the title of the thread in mind while writing this absurd paragraph.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 24, 2016, 01:21:06 PM
PS But thanks all the same for highlighting these two. You've reminded me that I have both of their signatures in the same book. Beethoven's on the outside of a travel diary that my parents gave me before heading to Europe, and Amos' on the inside from when I met her in Vienna.

Musically, you're right though. I'd more readily compare Amos with Chopin, but he just fell off the draft list. It was a damn close thing though. If only his work had been a bit more varied.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 24, 2016, 03:08:03 PM
I won't give my list, just note that it incorporates men from multiple continents born centuries apart, who speak a variety of languages, none of them sharing a native tongue with me by the way, who wrote music for 1 to several hundred performers, dozens of kinds of instruments, with and without words in again a variety of languages, or varying lengths and forms using varied harmonic systems. Not a variety remotely comparable to that of pop music all written during my lifetime of course, but what can a narrow soul do?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Todd on May 24, 2016, 04:37:35 PM
On the contrary, if anything we reject such comparisons.


I suppose there's some truth to that: the self-appointed cultural elite of GMG (which is pretty self-explanatory if you have a dictionary handy) denigrate popular music as inferior, as "bad", as something that can be made "better", or perhaps something that could have been made better if it hadn't already been done much better in the past than can ever be done now or in the future, yet offering nothing substantive in terms of falsifiable (such fancy philosophizing) arguments as to what that means, or to what (objective?) evaluative criteria are used in making such assessments.  My bad, I mischaracterized what the self-appointed cultural elite wrote.  The self-appointed cultural elite have not made comparisons.  The self-appointed cultural elite have, without even deigning to so much as listen to much, if anything, in the way of modern pop music, already decided what it is and what it can be.  Had you not so expertly used bold type in your quote, I would amend the sentence, but alas, it is not to be.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on May 24, 2016, 11:30:56 PM
I regret having been drawn into that silly classical vs. popular discussion because I am not really very interested in that. As I mentioned several times, my original point was different. Namely that the absolute dominance of popular music is crippling for the development of musical tastes. It is a "closing of the musical mind" that music equals "music" in the framework of Anglo-american popular music of the last 60 years. Sure, present company is excluded because we here all listen to a broad spectrum.
But facts like that people refer to everything as "song", that the organization of downloads, databases etc. are all tailored to popular music based on songs are all evidence for that dominance. (Imagine that someone would expect all books to be like comic books and would be surprised about a book without illustrations and considerably exceeding the typical length of comic books. By the absurdity of such a scenario we see how much worse the situation is for music than for literature.)
The dominance can hardly be denied and the second claim is very plausible from what we know about cognitive development, imprinting etc. (Orfeo conceded the gist of that second claim as true, of course without my implication that it was "crippling".)

As for me not knowing what I am talking about wrt popular music. It is true that I never really was into popular music. There is obviously a lot I have never heard and of course I am not following any recent development (I am just too busy with music I care about for that).
But I think I have heard enough of the "classics" or well known songs/albums from the 1960s through the late 1990s to have a good impression. If I include folk (which is admittedly more than half of it), I have about 50 discs with popular music on my shelves and I have heard a much broader spectrum because there was a time when I went out more frequently and I also have a brother who is very interested in popular music beyond the "mainstream" (and we are both in our early/mid 40s, so no 60s nostalgia). On that basis I am rather unimpressed with the variety and the more sophisticated stuff I have heard, e.g. "The Wall" is still basically only songs (There is nothing wrong with "only songs" and I admittedly have not heard some of the other "Art rock" stuff from the 70s/80s, apparently it didn't really stick anyway and most pop reverted to the formats that fit its purposes better). 
There is a lot I do not dislike but hardly anything I care to listen to on a regular basis. (There is also stuff like most rap and some of the "screaming" heavy metal/punk/hardcore variety I absolutely detest and would switch off immediately. I also admittedly detest many more general aspects of current (popular) culture but that's beside the point.)

The "self-appointed cultural elite" nonsense I am not going to comment on. I never claimed any of that although I deplore that words like "intellectual" or "cultural elite" have become invective (and not only the words but the very concepts behind them).
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 25, 2016, 04:10:50 AM
. . . but what can a narrow soul do?

Enlarge, boy, enlarge!  8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 25, 2016, 04:15:16 AM
I regret having been drawn into that silly classical vs. popular discussion because I am not really very interested in that.

If the intent is immiscible contrast, I am not much interested in that, either.  There is a practical sense in which I am clearly "on one side," since my artistic endeavors are nothing like pop music. (Or, I don't know, maybe my recent dabbling in electronic efforts qualifies as a point of similarity.)

I find the comparison/contrast exercise of interest, even of quite practical interest, frequently.  I don't think there is any need to apologize for the activity.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on May 25, 2016, 04:27:29 AM
But I think I have heard enough of the "classics" or well known songs/albums from the 1960s through the late 1990s to have a good impression. If I include folk (which is admittedly more than half of it), I have about 50 discs with popular music on my shelves and I have heard a much broader spectrum because there was a time when I went out more frequently and I also have a brother who is very interested in popular music beyond the "mainstream" (and we are both in our early/mid 40s, so no 60s nostalgia). On that basis I am rather unimpressed with the variety and the more sophisticated stuff I have heard, e.g. "The Wall" is still basically only songs (There is nothing wrong with "only songs" and I admittedly have not heard some of the other "Art rock" stuff from the 70s/80s, apparently it didn't really stick anyway and most pop reverted to the formats that fit its purposes better).
And what about something like Charles Mingus' Black Saint and the Sinner Lady, then?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on May 25, 2016, 05:52:00 AM
And what about something like Charles Mingus' Black Saint and the Sinner Lady, then?
Still (in another thread) my nomination for the Great American Symphony  0:)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on May 25, 2016, 06:02:38 AM
Still (in another thread) my nomination for the Great American Symphony  0:)

Save that it is definitely a chamber ensemble  ;)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 25, 2016, 06:04:42 AM
Still (in another thread) my nomination for the Great American Symphony  0:)

In what sense is it current pop music? I mean, isn't it rather obviously art music? Form over 50 years ago? 
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on May 25, 2016, 06:25:05 AM
In what sense is it current pop music? I mean, isn't it rather obviously art music? Form over 50 years ago?
I think you must have quoted the wrong person, but Jo498 was talking about 70s rock albums, anyways.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 25, 2016, 07:27:59 AM
I think you must have quoted the wrong person

That would be true no matter whom I quoted on this thread.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Todd on May 26, 2016, 06:36:50 AM
Namely that the absolute dominance of popular music is crippling for the development of musical tastes.



What evidence do you have for this assertion?  And what, precisely, is meant by "musical tastes"?  Part of the point of what I wrote is that broad assertions are made without evidence, and then vague and intrinsically elitist proclamations are made, and the assertions, without objective or at least thoroughly reasoned arguments, appear to be nothing other than an "I have good taste (as I define it); I don't like it; therefore it's bad" type syllogistic argument.  This weak argument is exacerbated by the fact that it is based on little, if any, listening.

Now, of course, no one need like pop music, or movies, or pop culture generally, and that's quite fine.  As an example, I listen to almost no rap music, because my prior experience with it has not been positive.  That written, I know there are some musically substantive acts in the genre.  Some of the music has already lasted decades and receives accolades from the purported experts in modern music (ie, critics and academics), and some will last for decades, or centuries, more.  Some of it may well be contemporary high art.  I do not see any evidence that rap music's existence has been deleterious to society or culture, or that it has crippled the development of musical taste.  I just don't like much of what I've heard.  But my preference is purely subjective.  I know that.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on May 27, 2016, 02:11:09 AM
The overwhelming factual dominance of popular music is not in dispute, I hope.

In fact, almost everything else is so marginal compared to it, that this is already some evidence of the conditioning. The conditioning hypothesis also fits well with what we generally know about cognitive development, learning etc. It fits well with tons of anecdotal evidence, e.g. that many listeners of popular music stick to their teenage favorites, that most classical listeners start as teenagers and that the theory seems wrong that people somewhat "automatically" switch from popular to classical around 30-40 or so.

I do not know if there is conclusive scientific evidence. I am not even sure how this should look like and how it could be done without impossible "experiments on humans" (namely isolating children).
There is evidence that people who listen to classical and/or jazz usually have broader tastes, namely that they listen to popular as well (this also correlates with socioeconomic status, I read one such paper more than 10 years ago but I cannot find the link anymore). I you google "musical taste status" you will find both popular and scientific articles. There seems to be an ongoing debate in that branch of sociology whether "omnivorousness" or exclusiveness of musical tastes conveys more "cultural capital".

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/cars.12068/abstract;jsessionid=B40B548CDDE9CD526CF73CFB84EF744A.f01t02

But as we probably have discussed elsewhere a lot of that research is fairly shallow.
Actually those very studies show the incredible dominance of the forms of popular music. Because they also tend to have "classical" as one genre (sometimes opera as another which is also problematic because opera is not disjoint with but a species of classical) whereas pop, rock, christian music, whatever are treated as alternative genres, each supposedly of equal weight or relevance as classical.
This is like investigating reading preferences and grouping "highbrow literature" in one class and compare this to classes like superhero comic, franco-belgian comics, graphic novels, Science fiction, Fantasy, books with vampires etc. Namely you take "serious stuff" from many hundred years and cultures together in one block and compare it to lowbrow or middle brow genre stuff from the last 50-80 years and divide up the latter into many subgenres.
 
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 27, 2016, 02:22:29 AM
Actually those very studies show the incredible dominance of the forms of popular music. Because they also tend to have "classical" as one genre (sometimes opera as another which is also problematic because opera is not disjoint with but a species of classical) whereas pop, rock, christian music, whatever are treated as alternative genres, each supposedly of equal weight or relevance as classical.
This is like investigating reading preferences and grouping "highbrow literature" in one class and compare this to classes like superhero comic, franco-belgian comics, graphic novels, Science fiction, Fantasy, books with vampires etc. Namely you take "serious stuff" from many hundred years and cultures together in one block and compare it to lowbrow or middle brow genre stuff from the last 50-80 years and divide up the latter into many subgenres.

But this is exactly what I criticised you for doing in the opposite direction. You complain about the lack of division of classical, but up until now you've insisted on avoiding divisions of pop music. When I observed that my nephew can subdivide heavy metal, you dismissed the idea out of hand.

You can't have it both ways. If you want people to recognise all the variety within your preferred kind of music, you really ought to have the courtesy of recognising all the variety within the kind of music you don't prefer.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on May 27, 2016, 02:26:32 AM
I think you must have quoted the wrong person, but Jo498 was talking about 70s rock albums, anyways.
In any case I did say nothing at all about Jazz which is what Mingus is usually classified under.

Historically, Jazz from the 30s to the early 60s is probably what should be studied to understand how popular music in today's sense (pop, rock etc.) largely replaced Jazz as popular music. And at the same time some strains of Jazz became more and more esoteric. I wonder what happened earlier: (Some) Jazz becoming less popular and more difficult to appreciate or the popular (proto)Rock music of the 1950s being more popular than Jazz among younger people and then the arising of complex and less accessible Jazz because it had became a music for aficionados already.

And again, single examples cannot disprove general trends and tendencies. Correct my if I am wrong but my impression is that the 70s/early 80s "Art Rock" with concept albums and sometimes breaking up the typical "song" into freer and more adventurous forms remained or reverted to a niche thing. Some of the very musicians who were associated with that genre reverted to more traditional songs fairly soon (e.g. Genesis).
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on May 27, 2016, 02:40:26 AM
But this is exactly what I criticised you for doing in the opposite direction. You complain about the lack of division of classical, but up until now you've insisted on avoiding divisions of pop music. When I observed that my nephew can subdivide heavy metal, you dismissed the idea out of hand.

You can't have it both ways. If you want people to recognise all the variety within your preferred kind of music, you really ought to have the courtesy of recognising all the variety within the kind of music you don't prefer.
Sorry, but this has nothing to do with preference. The point is not the lack or overabundance of divisions. The point is that BECAUSE the general song format of Anglo-american popular music since the mid-20th century (for lack of a better term) with its standard features is so pervasive that small divisions become important (often in a tribalist way because there is an accompanying youth culture, many divisions are socially more important than musically - the same distorted shouting and brutal sounds are used in supposedly "leftist" punk and in neo-nazi leaning music of some Scandinavian or German groups).

If you don't agree that a Monteverdi Madrigal, a Bach Toccata, a Schubert song and a Wagner opera are objectively and obviously (far) more different from each other than song classified as "hard rock" and "death metal" I simply do not know how to explain this because for me this really is a obvious starting point and nothing I could offer as explanation or elaboration would be as obvious as this starting point.

(That said, there might be good sociological reasons for such classifying, although often they seem merely to be imported from the record selling business.)

 
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 27, 2016, 03:39:25 AM
If you don't agree that a Monteverdi Madrigal, a Bach Toccata, a Schubert song and a Wagner opera are objectively and obviously (far) more different from each other than song classified as "hard rock" and "death metal" I simply do not know how to explain this because for me this really is a obvious starting point and nothing I could offer as explanation or elaboration would be as obvious as this starting point.

Again, you deliberately pick two things from popular music you can regard as close together, and pick several things from classical music that are as far apart as you can think of.

This is my whole problem, the habit of making consciously unfair comparisons. You're not picking the popular musical examples to be far apart, you're picking them to be close together. The straw man nature of what you're doing is obvious.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 27, 2016, 03:42:52 AM
Heck, I can get further apart than that picking items from a single band.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2OmNmV3y4Y

vs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvYmxHN4z7k

vs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=552CM7Syslw


are a better representation of the width of popular music than anything you would offer when you're trying to prove your own argument that it all sounds the same.

That's one band and one singer on all those three tracks.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: James on May 27, 2016, 03:52:25 AM
Actually, let me try a James:


"50 Best Albums of 2015

40 Songhoy Blues, 'Music in Exile'

To find the heaviest-hitting blues-rock of the year, take a sharp left at the Mississippi Delta until you're in the deserts of Mali. Though rooted in the nation's world-famous guitar lineage and chugging with the rollicking Saharan-rock rhythms made popular by contemporary bands like Tinariwen and Terakraft, Songhoy Blues are a far harder and punkier affair: Think Ali Farka Touré's iconic desert blues shredded out by kids raised on hip-hop and Jimi Hendrix. Their debut album, produced by Marc-Antoine Moreau and Yeah Yeah Yeahs' Nick Zinner, is the blazing solution to a year without a new Black Keys or Jack White album, full of lyrical solos, entrancing rhythms and melancholy lyrics like those of "Desert Melodie," a protest of the jihadists who outlawed music in the northern part of their country."


Let me know if you need a higher ranking one James, and I can cut and paste for you.  (I mean, come on, you mentioned Hendrix, the reviewer mentioned Hendrix ..)

Pop music reviewers wouldn't know music if it came up and bit them right in the ass, based on the description I'm cringing. And really, another blues-rock effort? I'll sample it .. but seems like a lame suggestion in light of what has been done before, Todd.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 27, 2016, 03:55:24 AM
Heck, I'll even show some range in popular music with one song.

Here's the original version in 1995: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jSbSfYy2Tdg

And here's the live version in 1999: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=odHOOC2uNP8
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: James on May 27, 2016, 04:01:40 AM
Radiohead, Tori Amos, Something for Kate (or Paul Dempsey as a solo artist), george or any of the Noonan siblings' subsequent projects (Katie Noonan being more prolific), Patty Griffin, Beyoncé's last two albums, Fiona Apple (especially her last album), Janelle Monae, Moloko / Roisin Murphy as a solo artist, and the only album by the Dissociatives. That'll do for now.

I heard of many of them, on the radio and abroad. You're going to have to do much better than this, I'm afraid.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 27, 2016, 04:06:12 AM
I heard of many of them, on the radio and abroad. You're going to have to do much better than this, I'm afraid.

"Many"? Name which ones you've heard. Not "heard of", "heard". Because frankly, the odds of you having heard certain ones of them are quite remote. It's very easy for you to write such a sentence, and quite hard for me to believe you.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: James on May 27, 2016, 04:13:40 AM
"Many"? Name which ones you've heard. Because frankly, the odds of you having heard certain ones of them are quite remote. It's very easy for you to write such a sentence, and quite hard for me to believe you.

What are you kidding me .. Radiohead, Beyonce, Tori Amos, Fionna Apple .. this is yesterday's news. I've heard those, most people have. I quickly checked out a few of the others you mentioned, as I'm not always privy to 'names' .. and I recognized a few others, but overall .. none of this stuff is worth getting excited about.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: James on May 27, 2016, 04:23:03 AM
Heck, I can get further apart than that picking items from a single band.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2OmNmV3y4Y

vs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvYmxHN4z7k

vs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=552CM7Syslw


are a better representation of the width of popular music than anything you would offer when you're trying to prove your own argument that it all sounds the same.

That's one band and one singer on all those three tracks.

Omg .. what is this mediocre shit, in light of this discussion .. you've got to be kidding me.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: James on May 27, 2016, 04:26:43 AM
Heck, I'll even show some range in popular music with one song.

Here's the original version in 1995: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jSbSfYy2Tdg

And here's the live version in 1999: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=odHOOC2uNP8

?!?!?!?

This is the kind of stuff you're hinging your argument on? I knew I was wasting my time .. 
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 27, 2016, 04:29:33 AM
Omg .. what is this mediocre shit, in light of this discussion .. you've got to be kidding me.

Whether you like it is irrelevant to my argument.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: some guy on May 27, 2016, 04:32:14 AM
Karl, you were in charge of popcorn, right?

I'd like some, please.

(Who was in charge of drinks? I could use some root beer, too, if I may.)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 27, 2016, 04:35:51 AM
What are you kidding me .. Radiohead, Beyonce, Tori Amos, Fionna Apple .. this is yesterday's news. I've heard those, most people have. I quickly checked out a few of the others you mentioned, as I'm not always privy to 'names' .. and I recognized a few others, but overall .. none of this stuff is worth getting excited about.

Yeah, as I thought. All the big names. None of the Australian ones which I mentioned. None of the more recent ones or ones that don't make the top 40 radio.

The odds of you being familiar with george's superb "Unity" album or the bizarre Dissociatives song "Horror with Eyeballs" are remote indeed. These aren't terribly well known pieces of music in their own country, never mind anywhere else. It doesn't bother me whether you know them. It doesn't bother me whether you like them. The issue here is the attitude that you know anything and everything there is about music.

This, from a man who regularly showed himself incapable of even writing his own thoughts on music until myself and others started calling you out on it and identifying the sources you had copy-pasted from. I can't think of any other regular poster on the forum who is LESS qualified to hold themselves out as some kind of definitive expert on the state of music. The only things you've shown yourself to be an expert in are CTRL+C and CTRL+V.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on May 27, 2016, 04:40:36 AM
That's right, orfeo, James is the Copy-And-Paste King. He can't express any thoughts on music because he's too busy living vicariously through someone else's.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on May 27, 2016, 04:41:47 AM
Karl, you were in charge of popcorn, right?

I'd like some, please.

(Who was in charge of drinks? I could use some root beer, too, if I may.)

(Slides Some Guy a root beer in a chilled mug down the bar table) 8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: James on May 27, 2016, 04:42:52 AM
The odds of you being familiar with george's superb "Unity" album or the bizarre Dissociatives song "Horror with Eyeballs" are remote indeed. These aren't terribly well known pieces of music in their own country, never mind anywhere else. It doesn't bother me whether you know them. It doesn't bother me whether you like them. The issue here is the attitude that you know anything and everything there is about music.

Hey, I sampled the few I didn't know on YouTube as well .. you had your chance and totally blew it.

This stuff you are championing doesn't even approach the best pop music and it's (a little over) 100 year history. Never mind coming even remotely close to what the best Art music has on offer to someone.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: some guy on May 27, 2016, 04:47:26 AM
Thanks, Mirror!

I know we've had our differences in the past. And probably will in the future as well.

But that was some fine, refreshing root beer. Mmmmm.

Anyway, back to the show....

(Munch, munch, slurp, slurp.)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 27, 2016, 04:48:23 AM
Hey, I sampled the few I didn't know on YouTube as well .. you had your chance and totally blew it.

This stuff you are championing doesn't even approach the best pop music and it's (a little over) 100 year history. Never mind coming even remotely close to what the best Art music has on offer to someone.


Excellent. Post the links.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: James on May 27, 2016, 04:55:46 AM
Excellent. Post the links.

Go on YouTube .. take a few of the names you've suggestion and punch them into the search engine and sample. OR use Google Videos. I didn't save or favorite the links.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 27, 2016, 04:57:46 AM
Go on YouTube .. take a few of the names you've suggestion and punch them into the search engine and sample. OR use Google Videos. I didn't save or favorite the links.

ROFL. I don't need the links to hear the music. It's all sitting in my music collection. I'm sure you can figure out why I'm pressing you for specifics if you think about it.

It should all be in your recent browser history.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: James on May 27, 2016, 05:01:15 AM
ROFL. I don't need the links to hear the music. It's all sitting in my music collection. I'm sure you can figure out why I'm pressing you for specifics if you think about it.

It should all be in your recent browser history.

I browse Incognito .. so no, I don't have the history. Just punch in the names, and search for perhaps an official video of a single or whatnot. Or simply sample stuff that comes up top (usually highest view count) ..
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 27, 2016, 05:10:17 AM
Yeah.

We're done here.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Todd on May 27, 2016, 05:15:05 AM
It fits well with tons of anecdotal evidence...

I do not know if there is conclusive scientific evidence.


Lots of anecdotal evidence, no conclusive scientific evidence.  That renders the discussion nothing more than an exchange of opinions influenced by personal tastes and personal cultural/intellectual/ideological agendas. 

Something else that needs to be understood is that the "development of musical tastes" - I'm still not certain what that really means - may not even be important at all.  Why is it important, and what are the ramifications if the current stunted state of affairs continues?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Todd on May 27, 2016, 05:22:05 AM
https://www.youtube.com/v/pLqfXlIq6RE
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on May 27, 2016, 05:24:44 AM
Again, you deliberately pick two things from popular music you can regard as close together, and pick several things from classical music that are as far apart as you can think of.

This is my whole problem, the habit of making consciously unfair comparisons. You're not picking the popular musical examples to be far apart, you're picking them to be close together. The straw man nature of what you're doing is obvious.
Sorry. You introduced the finer shades of heavy metal as an example further above. I am not building up straw men. And I never claimed that it "all sounds the same".

Whatever the variety among popular music may be it is a simple historical fact that most of it shares features that both stem from its origination in certain forms of traditional black music and its co-evolution with mass media like the "single" and the Long Playing Record.
To deny this would be like denying that almost all baroque music shares figured bass as a key structural element.

I did not listen to all of it all through but your examples from "thrice" might superficially sound different but they obviously confirm to standardized models and patterns (angry, fast shouting in 1 vs. reflective ballad style in 2 etc.). They are clearly "songs", they are sung in English by an untrained voice into a microphone, they employ the typical range of sounds and instruments of anglo-pop/rock since the 60s, the first two have a continuous "beat" going through etc. There is nothing wrong with that, all music does conform to patterns. The point is that those patterns are actually largely the SAME ones for pop, rock, heavy metal, etc. Otherwise the audience would hardly recognize the music as "songs" and it would be virtually unmarketable.
(I grant that there is some electronic music, "ambient" or whatever, that is somewhat different. But almost everything is not.)

I grant that there can be quite a bit of variety within those constraints.
I also grant that Tintin comic books are rather different from superheroes and that more recent "graphic novels" are again different. But they are all comic books and it would be grotesque to give someone who wants to know about 20th century literature 6 different style comic books, one genre fiction (e.g. SF) novel and one "highbrow" novel. Leaving out poetry, drama and different styles of "highbrow" stories because that's all in one category "serious literature", but Franco-Belgian and Carl Barks comics would have to rate different categories because they are obviously different (and these two are originally in different languages as opposed to 90% or so of the contemporary popular music that determines what most people think of as "music" today). This would create the impression that it was odd for books to have no pictures in them (which is the case for instrumental music in the landscape of modern popular music) and to be longer than 100 pages or so. That's why I object to the record store categories in a sociological study.

And my hypothesis about the cognitive conditioning is that for about 5 decades most people have been raised with music as "songs" confirming (often very strictly and without a lot of variety, often the most impactful and popular music is not the subtle or sophisticated one) to the patterns mentioned above. They also take it for granted that some such music almost always plays in the background everywhere. Obviously there are some dedicated listeners of popular music and there is some of it that is more sophisticated. I never said that it destroys all possibility of appreciating (different) music.

But it can hardly be denied that there are plenty of factors that tend to fix a certain impression of what music is and a certain stance approaching music that is hardly conducive to appreciating classical music because the latter is often very different. As is only to be expected because despite a lot of both traditional/folksy and classical music that more or less follows patterns similar to popular songs there is also a lot that is organized rather differently.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Todd on May 27, 2016, 05:31:59 AM
Todd ..

Just listened to Irganda .. their official video, from Music in Exile. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2GC7BVcsTo

Please tell me you are damn well kidding .. you're goofing with us right?



"13, Tame Impala, 'Currents'

Tame Impala's Kevin Parker is the sort of psychedelic studio wizard who can make finger snaps sound like a spaced-out revelation. The Aussie dreamer packed Currents full of weightless vocals and synthesized funk, for a set that's both blissed-out and mournful, like a set of diary entries from an astronaut floating off into oblivion. Three years ago, Tame Impala broke through with the foot-stomping beats and dirty glam guitar of "Elephant." But this time out, Parker dialed down the amps and pumped up the keyboards. Songs like "Yes I'm Changing" and "'Cause I'm a Man" are slow-moving tales of personal metamorphosis, and when guitar thunder does break out on "Eventually," it quickly gives way to sunshine-y organ. Song after song address relationship challenges, but the album closer, "New Person, Same Old Mistakes," suggests Parker has an easier time remaking his music than himself. That musical rethink, though, is expansive, resulting in wide-screen adventures like "Let It Happen," which jumps off from a melody lifted from the Supremes, then sails into the cosmos, where everything is lonely but beautiful."
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on May 27, 2016, 05:45:46 AM

Lots of anecdotal evidence, no conclusive scientific evidence.  That renders the discussion nothing more than an exchange of opinions influenced by personal tastes and personal cultural/intellectual/ideological agendas. 
Except you. You have of course no agenda whatsoever, only the TRUTH...
What would be the kind of "scientific evidence" you would accept? Short of raising kids in different isolated situations. (I conceded already far above that there is no and not likely to be conclusive evidence.)

Quote
Something else that needs to be understood is that the "development of musical tastes" - I'm still not certain what that really means - may not even be important at all.  Why is it important, and what are the ramifications if the current stunted state of affairs continues?
What's deemed important depends on personal cultural/intellectual/ideological agendas, there is no way to get scientific evidence for what's "important".

Imagine a world where 99% of the populace are too stunted in their intellectual and aesthetic abilities to appreciate, e.g. Shakespeare or other classical/highbrow literature, but they are all immensely fond of certain animated cartoons their abilities are sufficient to appreciate vs. one where 50% can and do appreciate Shakespeare. Would you ceteris paribus prefer one situation?

It's back to the old question whether it's better to be a happy pig or a sad Socrates. If the only measure of happiness is that one feels somehow personally satisfied, regardless of fulfilling something like a potential, in our case experiencing and appreciating a certain range of aesthetic experiences, there is no reason to prefer the second scenario (vs. e.g. a Brave New World situation). If we do prefer the second scenario we have already implicitly granted that not all aesthetic pleasures are equal. The rest might need a dissertation length argument and still not convince everyone, but it does follow.

There is also the practical point that (most) classical music is expensive and needs a certain amount of friends to be economically feasible. If they die out, that's bad.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 27, 2016, 05:50:07 AM
There is nothing wrong with that, all music does conform to patterns. The point is that those patterns are actually largely the SAME ones for pop, rock, heavy metal, etc.

Yes, and I can go through about 150 years of classical music pointing out all the sonata forms. That's MY point.

Frankly, I've yet to hear any meaningful distinction between what classical music is capable of as opposed to what popular music is capable of beyond the fairly trite point that what people call "classical" extends over around 300 years and what people call "popular" only extends over around 60-70 years.  Even comparing the timespans is not a simple matter, given that the speed and forms of communication and travel has changed so much which inevitably alters the ways in which artistic currents move. We've gone from Bach journeying for days to hear Buxtehude to being able to stream live on the other side of the world.

Fundamentally what frustrates me about the various denigrations of popular music (and which would equally frustrate me about denigrations of classical music in some other forum) is that they are various methods of invalidating my own musical life. When James declares that popular music has nothing to offer someone, he is declaring that I am not someone. That I'm some kind of musical idiot in spite of the fact that I am well versed in a fair number of classical composers and have a diploma in piano, the result of many years of study up to near-concert level.

I've played a Bach prelude and fugue so well that someone who thought they didn't like Bach had to reevaluate, but there are times when certain people around here would treat me as if I don't have a clue about "real" music because I also get enormous pleasure out of certain things written in a verse-chorus-bridge format and sung in English. My old piano teacher recently told me I was one of the best 2 students he ever had in a career spanning... certainly over 30 years. But how can I be a decent classical musician? I like Beyonce and so therefore have poor musical taste because I've fallen for what's being shoved down everybody's throats.

My bewilderment from assertions that it's not possible to get this or that or the other from one of these kinds of music stems from the fact that I do get such a wide range of things, from both kinds of music. The whole reason I have a big (and regularly growing) music collection is so that I have this whole range of resources to tap into different moods and motivations and to enrich my inner life with them all.

I'm not some pop music fan coming in here with the intent of picking a fight with a bunch of classical listeners and showing them that classical music isn't all that great. I'm a classical music fan who has been taken to heights of ecstasy by it... and who has also been taken to heights of ecstasy by music that isn't classical. Invalidating my experience of one of those forms of music invalidates my experience of both of them. And in ways that are completely unnecessary. Expressing one's joy and pleasure in classical music does not, in any way or shape or form, require having digs at popular music.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Todd on May 27, 2016, 06:02:31 AM
Except you. You have of course no agenda whatsoever, only the TRUTH...


Nope, I'm very open about the subjective nature of what I write.  I explicitly stated so only a few posts ago in this thread.  You appear to be making considerable efforts to present your arguments as something more intellectually pure, more meaningful, more universal.  I'm not convinced.



Imagine a world where 99% of the populace are too stunted in their intellectual and aesthetic abilities to appreciate, e.g. Shakespeare or other classical/highbrow literature, but they are all immensely fond of certain animated cartoons their abilities are sufficient to appreciate vs. one where 50% can and do appreciate Shakespeare. Would you ceteris paribus prefer one situation?


A polemical thought experiment divorced from reality.  (And why would I not prefer being part of the 1%?)



It's back to the old question whether it's better to be a happy pig or a sad Socrates.


Not really.  Absurd dichotomies don't mean a whole lot.



If they die out, that's bad.


Why?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 27, 2016, 01:55:41 PM
he doesn't know what the hell he is talking about when it comes to music

You see? 17 years of classical lessons, another decade or so of playing after that, a diploma, various eisteddfod wins... and I don't know shit because James doesn't like the things that I like.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 27, 2016, 01:57:34 PM
You see? 17 years of classical lessons, another decade or so of playing after that, a diploma, various eisteddfod wins... and I don't know shit because James doesn't like the things that I like.

You must have forgotten it all. Early onset Alzheimer's?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 27, 2016, 01:58:44 PM
You must have forgotten it all. Early onset Alzheimer's?

Wasn't all this listening to classical music I've been doing supposed to prevent that kind of thing?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: (poco) Sforzando on May 27, 2016, 01:59:47 PM
You must have forgotten it all. Early onset Alzheimer's?

At least I now know what "eisteddfod" means.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on May 27, 2016, 02:01:36 PM
Wasn't all this listening to classical music I've been doing supposed to prevent that kind of thing?
What kind of thing? What were we Talking about?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on May 27, 2016, 02:02:47 PM
What kind of thing? What were we Talking about?

I think it was Britney Spears.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Christo on May 29, 2016, 09:46:03 AM
Then why do you argue? James no doubt adores Britney Spears.  :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: nathanb on June 12, 2016, 03:26:01 PM
See my post in "Composers You Are Currently Exploring" before judging me.

I guess, if I'm totally honest after having a glance at last year's listening habits, I'm feelin' like something along the lines of this haphazardly thrown-together buncha names:

1. Karlheinz Stockhausen
2. John Cage
3. Pierre Boulez
4. Iannis Xenakis
5. György Ligeti
6. Helmut Lachenmann
7. Luciano Berio
8. Luigi Nono
9. Richard Barrett
10. Francisco López
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on June 12, 2016, 03:34:05 PM
See my post in "Composers You Are Currently Exploring" before judging me.

I guess, if I'm totally honest after having a glance at last year's listening habits, I'm feelin' like something along the lines of this haphazardly thrown-together buncha names:

1. Karlheinz Stockhausen
2. John Cage
3. Pierre Boulez
4. Iannis Xenakis
5. György Ligeti
6. Helmut Lachenmann
7. Luciano Berio
8. Luigi Nono
9. Richard Barrett
10. Francisco López

Yikes! A lot of these composers would send me running for cover, but I do like some of Xenakis' music and I admire the hell out of Ligeti. He's really incredible. I love that Ligeti Project set on Warner. Essential stuff for people wondering where classical music headed after WWII. 8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Spineur on June 12, 2016, 03:45:11 PM
Yikes! A lot of these composers would send me running for cover
You are not the only one !  To illustrate the point, my favorite Berio piece is the ending he composed for Puccini Turandot !!
 https://www.theguardian.com/books/2002/jun/08/artsfeatures (https://www.theguardian.com/books/2002/jun/08/artsfeatures)
I do listen to Ligeti occasionally also, but not often.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on June 12, 2016, 03:49:54 PM
You are not the only one !  To illustrate the point, my favorite Berio piece is the ending he composed for Puccini Turandot !!
I do listen to Ligeti occasionally also, but not often.

I do want to say that it is my own failings as a listener that I do not connect with but one composer on nathanb's list. My comments aren't meant to ridicule or belittle his choices. My hats are off to him. He's a much more adventurous listener than I am. Gosh...I'm really turning into an old fuddy-duddy. ;D But, at the end of the day, we certainly can't help what we enjoy.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: The new erato on June 12, 2016, 08:19:16 PM
I do want to say that it is my own failings as a listener that I do not connect with but one composer on nathanb's list.
Very wise words.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: some guy on June 12, 2016, 11:44:00 PM
See my post in "Composers You Are Currently Exploring" before judging me.

I guess, if I'm totally honest after having a glance at last year's listening habits, I'm feelin' like something along the lines of this haphazardly thrown-together buncha names:

1. Karlheinz Stockhausen
2. John Cage
3. Pierre Boulez
4. Iannis Xenakis
5. György Ligeti
6. Helmut Lachenmann
7. Luciano Berio
8. Luigi Nono
9. Richard Barrett
10. Francisco López
Wow, nice list there nathanb. You know how lists make me break out in hives, but this one is pretty attractive, I have to say.

At the risk of giving myself the old urticaria, I'll offer up my own list of ten to balance out the whole gender thing I noticed here. If I may. :)

Michele Bokanowski
Beatriz Ferreyra
Emmanuelle Gibello
Natasha Barrett
Ana-Maria Avram
Maryanne Amacher
Diane Salazar
Alice Shields
Pauline Oliveros
Sachiko M

No necessary order. And pretty close to actually being a ten favorites list as well, come to think of it.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: (poco) Sforzando on June 13, 2016, 03:30:30 AM
Wow, nice list there nathanb. You know how lists make me break out in hives, but this one is pretty attractive, I have to say.

At the risk of giving myself the old urticaria, I'll offer up my own list of ten to balance out the whole gender thing I noticed here. If I may. :)

Michele Bokanowski
Beatriz Ferreyra
Emmanuelle Gibello
Natasha Barrett
Ana-Maria Avram
Maryanne Amacher
Diane Salazar
Alice Shields
Pauline Oliveros
Sachiko M

No necessary order. And pretty close to actually being a ten favorites list as well, come to think of it.

Thank you. I don't think I've heard let alone heard of most of these, but at least I now know what "urticaria" means.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on June 13, 2016, 05:03:44 AM
My current list (the composers in bold are ones that are quite close to my heart):

Nielsen
Sibelius
Vaughan Williams
Bartók
Ravel

Dvořák
Brahms
Martinů
Rachmaninov
Elgar
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on June 13, 2016, 05:06:55 AM
My current list (the composers in bold are ones that are quite close to my heart):

Nielsen
Sibelius
Vaughan Williams
Bartók
Ravel

Dvořák
Brahms
Martinů
Rachmaninov
Elgar

Remember all those times I said Shostakovich would drop out, and you told me "Never!"
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sergeant Rock on June 13, 2016, 05:26:48 AM
Remember all those times I said Shostakovich would drop out, and you told me "Never!"

The Russians took a big hit this round...with Schnittke and Prokofiev along with Shosty gone.

Sarge
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on June 13, 2016, 05:47:10 AM
The Russians took a big hit this round...with Schnittke and Prokofiev along with Shosty gone.

Sarge

(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/7b/94/13/7b9413c02e3b072931f010fc602f8841.jpg)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on June 13, 2016, 05:50:07 AM
Thank you. I don't think I've heard let alone heard of most of these, but at least I now know what "urticaria" means.
It's a memorably musical word; I must try to remember it.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: nathanb on June 13, 2016, 06:51:12 AM
Wow, nice list there nathanb. You know how lists make me break out in hives, but this one is pretty attractive, I have to say.

At the risk of giving myself the old urticaria, I'll offer up my own list of ten to balance out the whole gender thing I noticed here. If I may. :)

Michele Bokanowski
Beatriz Ferreyra
Emmanuelle Gibello
Natasha Barrett
Ana-Maria Avram

Maryanne Amacher
Diane Salazar
Alice Shields
Pauline Oliveros
Sachiko M


No necessary order. And pretty close to actually being a ten favorites list as well, come to think of it.

I have listened a fair bit to the bolded ones (well, not a ton to Beatriz or Emmanuelle yet), and most of these listenings were your fault :)

If I were to list a top ten females, I'm sure Natasha, Ana-Maria, Pauline, and Sachiko would be on there. Along with Olga Neuwirth, Rebecca Saunders, Adriana Holszky, Misato Mochizuki, maybe Jennifer Walshe? All that other stuff, you know, the people that have yet to reach the glorious heights of the pure waves.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on June 13, 2016, 08:07:45 AM
See my post in "Composers You Are Currently Exploring" before judging me.

I guess, if I'm totally honest after having a glance at last year's listening habits, I'm feelin' like something along the lines of this haphazardly thrown-together buncha names:

1. Karlheinz Stockhausen
2. John Cage
3. Pierre Boulez
4. Iannis Xenakis
5. György Ligeti
6. Helmut Lachenmann
7. Luciano Berio
8. Luigi Nono
9. Richard Barrett
10. Francisco López

I wish you would share your 15 favorite Cage pieces.

And cross-post to the Stockhausen thread  8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sergeant Rock on June 13, 2016, 08:13:57 AM
I wish you would share your 15 favorite Cage pieces.

And cross-post to the Stockhausen thread  8)

Wicked Karl  ;D

Sarge
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on June 13, 2016, 08:21:02 AM
The Russians took a big hit this round...with Schnittke and Prokofiev along with Shosty gone.

Sarge
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/7b/94/13/7b9413c02e3b072931f010fc602f8841.jpg)

Умирают в Россий страхи . . . .
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: André on June 13, 2016, 09:55:50 AM
Thank you. I don't think I've heard let alone heard of most of these, but at least I now know what "urticaria" means.

Very common term in French (urticaire), mostly used to indicate a stong dislike of something ("it gives me the urticaire)". Wich is sure to be my reaction to any extended listening of these composers  ;D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: nathanb on June 13, 2016, 12:02:45 PM
I wish you would share your 15 favorite Cage pieces.

And cross-post to the Stockhausen thread  8)

Cross-post what? And the "Wicked Karl" below makes me think I'm missing something. Am I?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on June 13, 2016, 01:06:08 PM
Cross-post what? And the "Wicked Karl" below makes me think I'm missing something. Am I?
There's a certain member who's quite active in the Stockhausen thread, and he rather dislikes Cage. I'm sure we'd all be delighted to see your favourite Cage works in the Cage thread at least.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: nathanb on June 13, 2016, 02:11:41 PM
Funny thing about Cage is that he's a little tougher to map out with a list because his works vary so much more widely between different performances than just about anything short of Stockhausen's intuitive texts or Cardew's most radical works. Exhibit A: Atlas Eclipticalis. You can play this piece with anywhere from, I believe, 1 to 87 instruments. And you have a pretty free range of tempo choices as well. On Mode records, we see three versions, two of which are accompanied by Winter Music. The two accompanied versions are not only played with smaller forces, but also at about half speed. This single piece can therefore be anything from a robust symphonic piece to a sparse meditation. There are some works that I wish would be recorded faster than is even available, or slower. Anyway, I'll try to base a list on what I feel are my favorite interpretations, just as we do with most music we love.

1. Atlas Eclipticalis
2. 108
3. Thirty Pieces For String Quartet
4. Roaratorio
5. Freeman Etudes
6. Music For Piano
7. Cartridge Music
8. Music Of Changes
9. Ryoanji
10. Etudes Australes
11. Some Of "The Harmony Of Maine"
12. Sonatas & Interludes
13. Souvenir
14. Europera 5
15. Bird Cage

Note: I have not listened to some of Cage's little niches and nooks as much as I would like to. Notably missing here are all the Variations pieces and the many percussion masterworks I haven't given enough attention to.

Note 2: Ok. List done for now. That was rough, lol. Pretty much neglect order and do what you want with it. Cage has too many good genres.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: some guy on June 14, 2016, 06:23:13 AM
Try the Cinncinatti percussion group's CD, then.

It's a lovely disc and has more than percussion on it.

They don't seem to have followed that thing, which they called "volume 1," with any other volumes, yet. Dunno what's up with that. They got a lot of praise for volume 1. Where's 2???
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: nathanb on June 14, 2016, 06:27:57 AM
Try the Cinncinatti percussion group's CD, then.

It's a lovely disc and has more than percussion on it.

They don't seem to have followed that thing, which they called "volume 1," with any other volumes, yet. Dunno what's up with that. They got a lot of praise for volume 1. Where's 2???

Well I have the three Mode volumes already, I just haven't listened to them a tenth as much as I have for the other Cage standards (Star Maps, I Ching, Number Pieces, Prepared Piano, Happenings, etc). Honestly the one I can remember most about is the third volume with the plant pieces and the composed improvisations, but I'm woefully unprepared to talk about the constructions, the credo, or the imaginary landscapes. Maybe I'll fix that today if I have time. Going over to a friend's place later. Might bring Birtwistle's The Minotaur.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: some guy on June 14, 2016, 09:15:39 PM
Ah, I see what they've done. Three Mode volumes of Cage percussion music. With three different groups of performers.

OK.

And yes, take the Minotaur, why not?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jaakko Keskinen on June 15, 2016, 06:36:17 AM
Not many changes, but thought I should post this anyway:

Wagner
Beethoven
Debussy
R. Strauss
Sibelius
Puccini
Rachmaninoff
Saint-Saëns
Berlioz
Verdi

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on June 15, 2016, 04:29:34 PM
Mine has gone through another metamorphosis:

Nielsen
Sibelius
Dvořák
Vaughan Williams
Bartók
Shostakovich
Elgar
R. Strauss
Rachmaninov
Brahms
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on June 15, 2016, 11:56:37 PM
Alas! Poor Ravel. From being close to your heart straight to being booted off the list.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: amw on June 16, 2016, 12:40:38 AM
Since apparently this just means "your top 10 composers over the past few days/weeks/hours" now, I will say the composers I've been listening to most lately include Dvořák, Schubert and Martinů, plus occasionally Beethoven (András Schiff's 2x Diabellis, several recordings of Op. 130, and much more of the Sixth Symphony than I've ever usually listened to) and way more Japanese gagaku music than usual. At the moment I have minimal interest in Brahms apart from the string sextets & the first two violin sonatas, find Chopin and Mendelssohn ok in the quieter kitschier pieces but less interested in their big works at the moment, prefer Mozart to Haydn, and have little time for Bartók, Stravinsky, Cage, etc—maybe too "objective", but I am pretty into Jo Kondo, who's even more so, so idk. Sciarrino and Nono make up most of my modernist listening, plus Sørensen, who's not a modernist but has a similar calming effect. I also opened the Parmegiani Box, but he's no Luc Ferrari *cough* er, yeah. I have not listened to any pre-1780 music in what feels like forever.

I guess that's a good list of current favourites plus unfavourites-that-are-normally-favourites.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: 71 dB on June 16, 2016, 03:39:15 AM
Mine has gone through another metamorphosis:

Nielsen
Sibelius
Dvořák
Vaughan Williams
Bartók
Shostakovich
Elgar
R. Strauss
Rachmaninov
Brahms

All of your top 10 composers lived between the years 1841 and 1975.  ;)

I wonder, who here have the shortest and longest "top 10 periods"?

My "top 10 period" is at least 1685-1934 and everybody knows why. If I force Buxtehude and Weinberg into my top 10, it's c. 1637-1996.  :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on June 16, 2016, 04:15:03 AM
Alas! Poor Ravel. From being close to your heart straight to being booted off the list.

A sad day indeed. I had to make room for others. :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on June 20, 2016, 05:53:55 PM
My current list:

Nielsen
Sibelius
Dvořák
Bruckner
Vaughan Williams
Bartók
Shostakovich
Elgar
R. Strauss
Rachmaninov

Basically, my list is getting to where it's becoming increasingly difficult to edit and, for me, that's a good thing. :) I feel bad for leaving Brahms off, though. :(
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: springrite on June 20, 2016, 06:11:58 PM
My current list:

Nielsen
Sibelius
Dvořák
Bruckner
Vaughan Williams
Bartók
Shostakovich
Elgar
R. Strauss
Rachmaninov

Basically, my list is getting to where it's becoming increasingly difficult to edit and, for me, that's a good thing. :) I feel bad for leaving Brahms off, though. :(

I once thought Berg would be safe…
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on June 20, 2016, 06:21:35 PM
I once thought Berg would be safe…

I love Berg, but he has no place amongst my 'Top 10' unfortunately.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: springrite on June 20, 2016, 06:26:37 PM
I love Berg, but he has no place amongst my 'Top 10' unfortunately.
John, you treat composers the way I used to treat my girlfriends, until I met and married Vanessa.  ;)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on June 20, 2016, 06:35:19 PM
John, you treat composers the way I used to treat my girlfriends, until I met and married Vanessa.  ;)

;D Hopefully, I'll meet my 'Vanessa' one day, too.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: some guy on June 20, 2016, 11:10:25 PM
Since apparently this just means "your top 10 composers over the past few days/weeks/hours" now...
But what else could it possibly mean? That you listen and listen and gradually settle on ten and then stop? You keep listening, but that original ten, which you got to by listening and reacting and thinking and listening some more, remains somehow the same? What happened to the whole process which resulted in the original ten? Was the whole point of that to get to a point and stop moving then forever?

"Over the past few days/weeks/hours" is the only thing that gives this fatally flawed concept even the remotest semblance of validity. Take that away, and....
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on June 21, 2016, 01:35:23 AM
Many of my top 10 composers are not ones I've listened to in the last few weeks.

But I have a long term memory.

There's no logic to saying that your best friends must be people you've seen in the last few weeks, or that the best experiences you've had must be ones that occurred in the last few weeks, so I completely fail to see why my favourite composers must be the ones I'm listening to within the last few weeks.

I might be focusing on some new music, like Nørgård, and I might be enjoying it a great deal, but does that mean that it MUST have supplanted in my affections music that I've known for years? No, of course it doesn't. One cannot listen to all music simultaneously, so at any given moment one must pick and choose. What I'm choosing right now doesn't logically imply anything about my long term choices.

If I spend two weeks regularly listening to Stockhausen in an attempt to understand why the hell anyone enjoys Stockhausen**, it would be nonsense to say that therefore Stockhausen is one of my favourite composers. It just makes him one of my most frequently listened to composers in a brief sample period. Favourites are things that you keep coming back to, repeatedly, over the longer term. Not things you're listening to right now but don't enjoy enough to want to repeat the experience.

There's a big middle ground in between total top 10 rigidity at one end, and constant top 10 fluidity at the other.

**This is basically what I did a few years ago.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on June 21, 2016, 01:43:02 AM
;D Hopefully, I'll meet my 'Vanessa' one day, too.

Musically I met Vagn.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: some guy on June 21, 2016, 03:02:07 AM
If the following is a response to my post to amw, then I have to say that it misses the point. Or, rather, that it replaces the points I did make with other, less valid points, and proceeds to criticizing those points.

So, for the record, I do not say that my best friends must be people I've seen in the last few weeks, or that the best experiences I've had must have been the ones that occurred in the last few weeks.

I was not talking about long-term and short term choices at all. Nor was I implying anything about today's choices--choice of inclusion on a list has been silently conflated with choice of what to listen to at this moment, by the way..., in case anyone missed that bit of sleight-of-hand--being logically related to long term choices.

I agree that listening to Stockhausen for two weeks [for all the wrong reasons], does not mean that it must have supplanted in one's affections music that one has known for years, but since no one has ever said that or even suggested it, but since this bit of nonsense is totally made up just in order to make a non-point, my agreement is really neither here nor there.

And, finally, I do not see any of this topic as being in any way a continuum, so I don't think the whole "middle ground" thing really applies.


Many of my top 10 composers are not ones I've listened to in the last few weeks.

But I have a long term memory.

There's no logic to saying that your best friends must be people you've seen in the last few weeks, or that the best experiences you've had must be ones that occurred in the last few weeks, so I completely fail to see why my favourite composers must be the ones I'm listening to within the last few weeks.

I might be focusing on some new music, like Nørgård, and I might be enjoying it a great deal, but does that mean that it MUST have supplanted in my affections music that I've known for years? No, of course it doesn't. One cannot listen to all music simultaneously, so at any given moment one must pick and choose. What I'm choosing right now doesn't logically imply anything about my long term choices.

If I spend two weeks regularly listening to Stockhausen in an attempt to understand why the hell anyone enjoys Stockhausen**, it would be nonsense to say that therefore Stockhausen is one of my favourite composers. It just makes him one of my most frequently listened to composers in a brief sample period. Favourites are things that you keep coming back to, repeatedly, over the longer term. Not things you're listening to right now but don't enjoy enough to want to repeat the experience.

There's a big middle ground in between total top 10 rigidity at one end, and constant top 10 fluidity at the other.

**This is basically what I did a few years ago.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on June 21, 2016, 03:19:00 AM
If the following is a response to my post to amw, then I have to say that it misses the point.

Well it wasn't a direct response.

It would've helped if you hadn't cut off your quote of amw's post where you did, because it feels like YOU somewhat missed the point by lifting one half of a sentence. amw wasn't suggesting that a top 10 should be fixed for all time, it was actually a post that went on to say "what I've been listening to lately", in reaction to some other posts (which I had similarly noticed) that based "favourites" on what had been recently listened to.

So I'm following on from that notion. Not from the direction you took it.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: amw on June 21, 2016, 03:46:08 AM
But what else could it possibly mean?
I've always taken it to mean Top 10 composers over your entire lifetime. As it happens, although I do keep listening to new stuff (all the time) that list hasn't really changed much since Schumann shot up the ranks about 4-5 years ago—there's simply very little new stuff I have discovered that's been as consistently important to me. So yeah, it does remain "somehow the same"—probably because of my particular psychology and musical interests. Maybe I should consider a voluntary moratorium on my "top 10" composers for, say, a few months and see what happens.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on June 21, 2016, 04:01:42 AM
Many of my top 10 composers are not ones I've listened to in the last few weeks.

But I have a long term memory.

There's no logic to saying that your best friends must be people you've seen in the last few weeks, or that the best experiences you've had must be ones that occurred in the last few weeks, so I completely fail to see why my favourite composers must be the ones I'm listening to within the last few weeks.

I might be focusing on some new music, like Nørgård, and I might be enjoying it a great deal, but does that mean that it MUST have supplanted in my affections music that I've known for years? No, of course it doesn't. One cannot listen to all music simultaneously, so at any given moment one must pick and choose. What I'm choosing right now doesn't logically imply anything about my long term choices.

If I spend two weeks regularly listening to Stockhausen in an attempt to understand why the hell anyone enjoys Stockhausen**, it would be nonsense to say that therefore Stockhausen is one of my favourite composers. It just makes him one of my most frequently listened to composers in a brief sample period. Favourites are things that you keep coming back to, repeatedly, over the longer term. Not things you're listening to right now but don't enjoy enough to want to repeat the experience.

There's a big middle ground in between total top 10 rigidity at one end, and constant top 10 fluidity at the other.

**This is basically what I did a few years ago.

I agree that, especially looking at my list now, that a 'Top 10' should be something that's stable. As I mentioned, the fact that my list is becoming increasingly difficult to alter is a sign that I'm on the right track. :) It absolutely killed me to let Ravel go since he had been a solid favorite for seven years now, but perhaps my tastes have changed? Unlike many listeners here, I'm still a relative newbie with only seven years of listening experience under my belt. I have so much more to learn and, thankfully, I'm in the right place.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on June 21, 2016, 04:15:50 AM
I agree that, especially looking at my list now, that a 'Top 10' should be something that's stable. As I mentioned, the fact that my list is becoming increasingly difficult to alter is a sign that I'm on the right track. :) It absolutely killed me to let Ravel go since he had been a solid favorite for seven years now, but perhaps my tastes have changed? Unlike many listeners here, I'm still a relative newbie with only seven years of listening experience under my belt. I have so much more to learn and, thankfully, I'm in the right place.

Tastes most definitely do change, whether it's been a short time or a long time. You can go on or off particular music, or composers, or whole genres, and then you may well get back on them again at some point. Sometimes a break makes a difference. And sometimes... it doesn't.

It is what it is. The one thing I'd say is that it's better to be at least open to the possibility that something or someone that doesn't meet your usual criteria will make a positive impression. There's a balance between using what you know about your own tastes to lead you towards other things likely to please you, but not refusing to even consider anything outside those parameters.

In the classical world, concerts and mixed programmes are a good way to discover pleasant surprises.

And, of course, there's no reason why the list of things you listen to can't be far, far wider than whoever makes your top 10.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on June 21, 2016, 04:44:30 AM
Tastes most definitely do change, whether it's been a short time or a long time. You can go on or off particular music, or composers, or whole genres, and then you may well get back on them again at some point. Sometimes a break makes a difference. And sometimes... it doesn't.

It is what it is. The one thing I'd say is that it's better to be at least open to the possibility that something or someone that doesn't meet your usual criteria will make a positive impression. There's a balance between using what you know about your own tastes to lead you towards other things likely to please you, but not refusing to even consider anything outside those parameters.

In the classical world, concerts and mixed programmes are a good way to discover pleasant surprises.

And, of course, there's no reason why the list of things you listen to can't be far, far wider than whoever makes your top 10.

Absolutely agreed. If we're not growing as listeners then we're forever doomed to remain in a state of stagnation. Of course, there's some music that I will never like because I just don't have the aptitude or really the interest to explore (e. g.  a lot of Baroque music and mostly post-WWII composers, although there are a few I like from each of these time periods), so, in this regard, I'll be happy to remain in that stagnated state. ;D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on June 21, 2016, 04:45:59 AM
there's no reason why the list of things you listen to can't be far, far wider than whoever makes your top 10.

I think this is the case with the vast majority of GMGers, except Gurn, of course, who has only a Top 1 list.  ;D  >:D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on June 21, 2016, 05:02:19 AM
I think this is the case with the vast majority of GMGers, except Gurn, of course, who has only a Top 1 list.  ;D  >:D

But, hey, at least Gurn's 'Top 1' is incredible! Got to love some Haydn. :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on June 21, 2016, 05:27:13 AM
I am not adding up listening hours over my lifetime. This is probably one factor but not in exact proportion. There is also "rise and decline" but only to some extent. If I look at a typical list of mine: Beethoven, Bach, Haydn, Mozart, Schubert, Brahms, Schumann, Händel... these are also the composers I have huge amounts of CDs of. And this is in some proportion to what I listened to over the 28 years I have been buying CDs.

If I had made a top ten list 21 years ago, in my early twenties, Händel and Schumann would certainly not have been in the top 10, not sure about Haydn or even Bach (I might have listed them out of reverence but not because I listened to a lot of their music). I am not even sure which composers would have been there instead, maybe Bruckner and Mahler although I always had a mixed "relationship" to both. Top 10 will hardly reflect what else listens to but back then I was fairly narrowly focussed on favorites, only slowly exploring other stuff, partly because there was so much Beethoven etc. I had not listened to yet. And while I listened to quite a bit of other stuff, this was too widely dispersed to have stable favorites. CDs were not so cheap and one could not just get all Shostakovich symphonies or quartets for the price of two full price discs, so exploration was slower. And I would not have nominated Shostakovich as a top 10 favorite after having heard 2 symphonies and 3 quartets or so.

So Mirror Image has certainly listened to far more (and more diverse) music in 7 years than I had in the late 80s/early 90s and it is understandable that his top 10 fluctuates.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on June 21, 2016, 06:55:27 AM
I am not adding up listening hours over my lifetime. This is probably one factor but not in exact proportion. There is also "rise and decline" but only to some extent. If I look at a typical list of mine: Beethoven, Bach, Haydn, Mozart, Schubert, Brahms, Schumann, Händel... these are also the composers I have huge amounts of CDs of. And this is in some proportion to what I listened to over the 28 years I have been buying CDs.

If I had made a top ten list 21 years ago, in my early twenties, Händel and Schumann would certainly not have been in the top 10, not sure about Haydn or even Bach (I might have listed them out of reverence but not because I listened to a lot of their music). I am not even sure which composers would have been there instead, maybe Bruckner and Mahler although I always had a mixed "relationship" to both. Top 10 will hardly reflect what else listens to but back then I was fairly narrowly focussed on favorites, only slowly exploring other stuff, partly because there was so much Beethoven etc. I had not listened to yet. And while I listened to quite a bit of other stuff, this was too widely dispersed to have stable favorites. CDs were not so cheap and one could not just get all Shostakovich symphonies or quartets for the price of two full price discs, so exploration was slower. And I would not have nominated Shostakovich as a top 10 favorite after having heard 2 symphonies and 3 quartets or so.

So Mirror Image has certainly listened to far more (and more diverse) music in 7 years than I had in the late 80s/early 90s and it is understandable that his top 10 fluctuates.

Thanks for this, but I highly doubt what I've listened to is that diverse as I'm mostly just plunging the byways and corners of the 19th and 20th Centuries. I really ought to know more Classical Era composers, but I just can't get onboard with Mozart, but, as I mentioned before, I do like Haydn a lot even though I seldom listen to his music. I just hope to keep growing as a listener. Beethoven and Brahms have certainly been more and more appealing to me over the past month or so. It seems I'm becoming more and more drawn to Germanic music and why wouldn't I be? It's absolutely glorious!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on June 21, 2016, 08:15:38 AM
I once thought Berg would be safe…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzw1_2b-I7A (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzw1_2b-I7A)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ChamberNut on June 22, 2016, 03:29:02 AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzw1_2b-I7A (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzw1_2b-I7A)

A recent favourite film of mine.  :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: vandermolen on June 22, 2016, 03:40:49 AM
A recent favourite film of mine.  :D
I'm going to the dentist tomorrow - so thanks for that!  ??? :P :-[
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Autumn Leaves on June 30, 2016, 10:31:22 PM
Not so long since my last list I guess but heres the latest one:

Bruckner
Chopin
Debussy
Mahler
Mendelssohn
Schumann
Shostakovich
Sibelius
Tchaikovsky
Vaughan Williams
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on July 02, 2016, 04:27:32 AM
^ Great list, Conor! 8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on July 17, 2016, 06:16:13 PM
1 to 10 as of today

Boulez
Dean
Pintscher
Liza Lim
Birtwistle
Olga Neuwirth
Carter
Isabel Mundry
Sculthorpe
Rebecca Saunders
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on July 17, 2016, 06:18:40 PM
I think I'll give this a try for today, too, Jessop (in no particular order):

Sibelius
Nielsen
Ravel
Bartok
Vaughan Williams
Bruckner
Dvorak
Schnittke
Takemitsu
Szymanowski
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brewski on July 17, 2016, 07:29:45 PM
1 to 10 as of today

Boulez
Dean
Pintscher
Liza Lim
Birtwistle
Olga Neuwirth
Carter
Isabel Mundry
Sculthorpe
Rebecca Saunders

A very unusual line-up, with some off-the-radar choices. Happy to see Dean, Pintscher, Birtwistle, Neuwirth, and Carter get some love, especially. Never heard anything by Mundry; in any case, nice to see her as one of four women on your list.

--Bruce
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on July 17, 2016, 08:49:53 PM
A very unusual line-up, with some off-the-radar choices. Happy to see Dean, Pintscher, Birtwistle, Neuwirth, and Carter get some love, especially. Never heard anything by Mundry; in any case, nice to see her as one of four women on your list.

--Bruce

My top 10 is always basically just a reflection of which composers I have been enjoying most of all lately. I really love Mundry's 'Ich und Du' for piano and orchestra, and I am also fond of arrangements she has made of music by Dufay which have been released on that wonderful Kairos label. :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: EigenUser on July 18, 2016, 02:36:24 AM
1. Bartok
2. Ligeti
3. Ravel
4. Messiaen
5. Haydn
6. Beethoven
7. Feldman
8. Gershwin
9. Mendelssohn
10. hmmmm...

Slot number 10 could be a number of things... Webern or Berg perhaps? I've really taken to Berg recently, especially the Chamber Concerto. And I managed to learn his Piano Sonata cover-to-cover on piano.

Or Debussy? Schumann? Hard decision.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: vandermolen on July 18, 2016, 03:05:36 AM
Today's list:

Miaskovsky
Vaughan Williams
Tubin
Rosenberg
Bax
Copland
Diamond
Sibelius
Shostakovich
Walton
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Christo on July 22, 2016, 01:07:36 PM
Tonight:

Vaughan Williams
Holst
Nielsen
Tubin
Shostakovich
Stravinsky
Respighi
Falla
Braga Santos
Barber
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on July 23, 2016, 06:50:09 AM
Time for an update:

Sibelius
Nielsen
Ravel
Bartók
Vaughan Williams
Shostakovich
Prokofiev
Martinů
Dvořák
Schnittke
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Scion7 on July 23, 2016, 06:58:07 AM
Time for an update

Schnittke

I really am worried about you.   ;D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on July 23, 2016, 06:59:31 AM
My current list:

Nielsen
Sibelius
Dvořák
Bruckner
Vaughan Williams
Bartók
Shostakovich
Elgar
R. Strauss
Rachmaninov

I think I'll give this a try for today, too, Jessop (in no particular order):

Sibelius
Nielsen
Ravel
Bartok
Vaughan Williams
Bruckner
Dvorak
Schnittke
Takemitsu
Szymanowski

Time for an update

Sibelius
Nielsen
Vaughan Williams
Bartók
Shostakovich
Prokofiev
Martinů
Dvořák
Schnittke
Szymanowski

I'm astonished to count as many as five same names on all of the three most recent lists: Sibelius, Nielsen, Vaughan Williams, Bartók, Dvořák. :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on July 23, 2016, 07:02:22 AM
I really am worried about you.   ;D

Hah! I love Schnittke, but it wasn't always this way of course. I think he's the best Russian composer to arrive after Shostakovich. That particular generation has some cool ones like Gubaidulina, Denisov, Firsova, Artyomov, but IMHO Schnittke leads the pack since I believe his music is a continuation of where Shostakovich left off and he, in his own way, upheld the tradition with his some downright zany polystylistic methods, which I find strangely compelling and he just made it work.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Scion7 on July 23, 2016, 08:38:21 AM
Hah! I love Schnittke, .

While that's a more frightening statement than Shrillary in her Chairman Mao unisex-suit giving her speech now at the DNC, I believe that inside, there is a man with a taste for the true greats (Bach-Beethoven-Mozart-Haydn-Handel-Brahms-Vivaldi) waiting to burst free . . . as violently as that hide-her-age-Darkman-one-hour-lasting-facemask that Clinton's got on at the moment.

You CAN be saved, MI - I just know you can!   It may take electro-shock treatments . . . it may take vision/sound depravation . . . it may take radical, untested drugs ... but I know we can get there!  Step into the light, MI, step into the light!    :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on August 01, 2016, 03:50:38 PM
Time for an update:

Sibelius
Nielsen
Ravel
Bartók
Vaughan Williams
Shostakovich
Prokofiev
Martinů
Dvořák
Schnittke

Time for some editing:

Sibelius
Nielsen
Ravel
Bartók
Vaughan Williams
Shostakovich
Prokofiev
Dvořák
Copland
Martinů
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on August 01, 2016, 10:41:21 PM
While that's a more frightening statement than Shrillary in her Chairman Mao unisex-suit giving her speech now at the DNC, I believe that inside, there is a man with a taste for the true greats (Bach-Beethoven-Mozart-Haydn-Handel-Brahms-Vivaldi) waiting to burst free . . . as violently as that hide-her-age-Darkman-one-hour-lasting-facemask that Clinton's got on at the moment.

You CAN be saved, MI - I just know you can!   It may take electro-shock treatments . . . it may take vision/sound depravation . . . it may take radical, untested drugs ... but I know we can get there!  Step into the light, MI, step into the light!    :D

Scion7, I have to say in all my honesty that it is actually THIS POST OF YOURS which is the most frightening thing I have ever read on the Internet!!!!  :o :o :o :o :o
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on November 07, 2016, 04:02:07 PM
I suppose a revision is in order:

Mahler
Sibelius
Nielsen
Vaughan Williams
Bartók
Dvořák
Bruckner
Shostakovich
Rachmaninov
Martinů

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on November 07, 2016, 04:32:55 PM
I suppose a revision is in order:

Mahler
Sibelius
Nielsen
Vaughan Williams
Bartók
Dvořák
Bruckner
Shostakovich
Rachmaninov
Martinů

John
Education is a wonderful thing but I do wish you'd never learned to count.

 ;) :P :laugh:
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on November 07, 2016, 04:38:40 PM
John
Education is a wonderful thing but I do wish you'd never learned to count.

 ;) :P :laugh:

 :P
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on November 08, 2016, 01:16:37 AM
At least he learned to count in English. I'm still trying to get to grips with it in Danish. Notoriously crazy system. The word for "fifty" is an abbreviated form of "halfway to three lots of twenty".
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on November 08, 2016, 11:47:51 AM
At least he learned to count in English. I'm still trying to get to grips with it in Danish. Notoriously crazy system. The word for "fifty" is an abbreviated form of "halfway to three lots of twenty".
Well, John does seem to have odd ideas about what's less than 10.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jay F on November 08, 2016, 01:36:28 PM
1: Mahler

2-5:
Schubert
Beethoven
Mozart
Bach

6-10:
Vivaldi
Sibelius
Tchaikovsky
Bruckner
Shostakovich
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: springrite on November 08, 2016, 01:38:35 PM

10. hmmmm...


That's my #11!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: arpeggio on November 08, 2016, 01:50:49 PM
I essentially answered this question in a post in my "Introductions" Thread": http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,26183.msg995821.html#msg995821 (http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,26183.msg995821.html#msg995821)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: André on November 08, 2016, 02:58:47 PM
Bruckner, Delius, Wagner, Sibelius, Shostakovich, Arnold, Vaughan-Willams, Bach, Mozart, Haydn.

Runner-ups: Beethoven, Verdi, Pettersson, Mahler, Elgar,  Brahms, Schubert, Chopin, Clementi, Prokofiev, Puccini , Dvorak and all the 20th century French composers taken together.

If I go by the number of discs owned and collected over the last 45 years, they would be Bruckner, Wagner,  Beethoven, Haydn, Bach, Mozart.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Androcles on November 09, 2016, 12:42:15 PM
1. Shostakovich
2. Berg
3. Messiaen
4. Bruckner
5. Nielsen
6. Simpson
7. Pettersson
8. Penderecki
9. Gubaidulina
10. Carter
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on November 09, 2016, 01:03:13 PM
I thought I had already posted in this thread, but can't find it.  I would probably argue with myself anyway since my list of favorite composers slightly changes over time depending upon which period I am focusing on. 

A mostly constant list:

Machaut
Bach
Beethoven
Brahms
Mahler
Debussy
Schoenberg
Stravinsky
Cage
Feldman


I just realized, since we discussed Dylan, Machaut is the only major composer also thought of as an important poet.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on November 10, 2016, 09:43:59 PM
10 composers I consider some of my most favourite today or just happen to be at the front of my mind:

Pierre Boulez
Pauline Oliveros
Brett Dean
Alban Berg
Charlotte Bray
György Ligeti
Helen Grime
Anna Thorvaldsdóttir
Dai Fujikura
Matthias Pintscher
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ghost Sonata on November 14, 2016, 12:06:28 PM
Some settling of contents may have occurred since last shipment :

Brahms
Sibelius
Debussy
Martinů
Igor
Couperin
Rameau
Miaskovsky
Poulenc
Malipiero

The ones I weep over not fitting into a stingy ten spots : Janáček; R. Strauss; Glass; Wagner; Mahler; Duparc; Franck; Saint-Saëns; Vieuxtemps; VW
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: vandermolen on November 15, 2016, 06:43:44 AM
Some settling of contents may have occurred since last shipment :

Brahms
Sibelius
Debussy
Martinů
Igor
Couperin
Rameau
Miaskovsky
Poulenc
Malipiero

The ones I weep over not fitting into a stingy ten spots : Janáček; R. Strauss; Glass; Wagner; Mahler; Duparc; Franck; Saint-Saëns; Vieuxtemps; VW
Great choices although I know little Rameau.
Malipiero Symphony 7 is a fine one and Poulenc's Organ Concerto.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: vandermolen on November 15, 2016, 06:45:42 AM
I'm interested in the admiration for Delius here. He is never a composer whose music I have 'got into'. Having said that I love 'In a Summer Garden' the Piano Concerto, in its various versions and the very moving ending of his underrated Requiem.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on November 15, 2016, 06:58:11 AM
1. Beethoven
2. Dvorak
3. Schubert
4. Chopin
5. Ravel
6. Janacek
7. Berlioz
8. Haydn
9. Martinu Brahms
10. Schumann Martinu

Well that was another easy update.
1. Beethoven
2. Dvorak
3. Schubert
4. Chopin Haydn
5. Ravel
6. Janacek
7. Berlioz
8. Haydn Chopin
9. Brahms
10. Martinu

My list turns over a whole lot less than MI's does!

Rachmaninov, Tchaikovsky, Bruckner, Mahler, and Sibelius are among some of the big names lurking in 11-20.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on November 15, 2016, 07:21:21 AM
Compiling this without looking at my previous list, I see I removed Berlioz to make room for Mozart.

Bach
Beethoven
Brahms
Chopin
Janáček
Mozart
Prokofiev
Ravel
Sibelius
Stravinsky


Time for some light editing.

Bach
Beethoven
Brahms
Chopin
Dvořák
Janáček
Mozart
Ravel
Schubert
Sibelius


Just outside the top 10: Prokofiev, Stravinsky, Haydn, Berlioz, Rakhmaninov, Schumann
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: André on November 15, 2016, 10:22:05 AM
I'm interested in the admiration for Delius here. He is never a composer whose music I have 'got into'. Having said that I love 'In a Summer Garden' the Piano Concerto, in its various versions and the very moving ending of his underrated Requiem.

Hi, Jeffrey!  Find all about Delius (and I mean ALL) in this indispensible 88 minute BBC documentary:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uTVhBhPzPQA

Arranged very loosely in a chronological order (starting bafflingly with his second burial in 1935), it contains many fantastic musical excerpts (live, not from discs) and made-for-the-film interviews with conductors Andrew Davis, Mark Elder, Bo Holten, baritone Thomas Hamson, violinist Philippe Graffin, Delius biographer Jerome Rossi as well as period interviews with Beecham.

Truly one of the most probing and fascinating musical documentaries ever made.

And of course, the  provocative, extraordinarily well acted 1968 Ken Russell biopic is a must: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Vyy2SagDwcY

But start with the BBC film. And then there is GMG's own Delius thread too !  :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on November 15, 2016, 10:23:28 AM
(starting bafflingly with his second burial in 1935)

Just so long as the first was not . . . premature.   0:)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ghost Sonata on November 15, 2016, 11:05:01 AM
Great choices although I know little Rameau.
Malipiero Symphony 7 is a fine one and Poulenc's Organ Concerto.

Thank you, Jeffrey. You remind me that I quite forgot Delius - i'm such a fickle listener,  :o esp. now with Malipiero being all the rage chez moi.  (might I recommend Delius' VC?  https://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=R5ylRLJQI4c my favorite performance of it.) BTW, I love his Requiem, too.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ghost Sonata on November 15, 2016, 11:07:06 AM
Hi, Jeffrey!  Find all about Delius (and I mean ALL) in this indispensible 88 minute BBC documentary:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uTVhBhPzPQA

Arranged very loosely in a chronological order (starting bafflingly with his second burial in 1935), it contains many fantastic musical excerpts (live, not from discs) and made-for-the-film interviews with conductors Andrew Davis, Mark Elder, Bo Holten, baritone Thomas Hamson, violinist Philippe Graffin, Delius biographer Jerome Rossi as well as period interviews with Beecham.

Truly one of the most probing and fascinating musical documentaries ever made.

And of course, the  provocative, extraordinarily well acted 1968 Ken Russell biopic is a must: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Vyy2SagDwcY

But start with the BBC film. And then there is GMG's own Delius thread too !  :)
    -Thanks for posting these, will watch tonight!-
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ghost Sonata on November 15, 2016, 11:18:47 AM
Delius fans and wanna-be's, esp. don't wanna be's - check out Tasmin Little's documentary https://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=0RocX8MvqcE
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: André on November 15, 2016, 11:49:00 AM
Just so long as the first was not . . . premature.   0:)

Delius was disinterred from his burial place in France and his remains transported to England to be reburied on english soil after his wife's death in 1935. It was a very peculiar event, as it took place privately at night, with lanterns, not a word being spoken. Almost a Harry Potter novel type of thing.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on November 15, 2016, 11:52:00 AM
Delius was disinterred from his burial place in France and his remains transported to England to be reburied on english soil after his wife's death in 1935. It was a very peculiar event, as it took place privately at night, with lanterns, not a word being spoken. Almost a Harry Potter novel type of thing.

Thanks.  I had envisioned a repatriation from Florida, but that is mostly because my sense of his biography is less than rudimentary.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ghost Sonata on November 15, 2016, 11:59:37 AM
Thanks.  I had envisioned a repatriation from Florida, but that is mostly because my sense of his biography is less than rudimentary.

That's "Delius: the Early Years." His Dad bought him an orange grove in FL, but he proved more interested in music and Floridians (female) than in fruit farming...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on November 15, 2016, 12:11:52 PM


My list turns over a whole lot less than MI's does!


Pfft. My tires turn over a whole lot less that MI's lists too.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: André on November 15, 2016, 12:17:12 PM
I was going to write that Delius was an apatride, but then had second thoughts about the translability of the word. Apparently it does not exist in English. The web translator's "stateless" is quite tasteless IMHO. But I'm sure you get the meaning  :D.

Briefly: Delius was born in England of German émigrés. The Delius household's spoken language was German. The composer changed his name from "Fritz" (as per his official papers) to Frederick only when his father died in 1902. When he was a very young man he tried every way and place to escape the paternal influence: Florida and Virginia, Norway, Germany, France. He would return to England only when summoned, and stopped that when his father died. His music was much played in Germany until WWI. He loathed the german music system ("scales, arpeggios, Beethoven, Brahms, Bruckner: throw that away", he said to the young Eric Fenby. He lived the last 30 or so years of his life in France. It's only through the tireless advocacy of Thomas Beecham (and him alone) that his music came to be played and heard in England.

My hunch is that Delius is as un-English as could be for someone who happened to be born there. Apatride is a legal, technical term that does not apply here, as he was officially an English citizen. In French we also use it to describe someone whose roots cannot be determined with any surety, and who does not want a label pinned to him (or her).

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on November 15, 2016, 01:11:44 PM
I'm still deciding exactly what my list will be, I get pedantic about these sorts of things.

I know without a doubt what my consistent favourite/(most important to me) composers are but then it's trying to not miss out other important ones  :laugh:
I don't think there's any need to have these set in stone. I have about 50 composers who are absolute favourites before anyone else and even that list changes from time to time when I get really into something different.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: vandermolen on November 15, 2016, 02:40:34 PM
Hi, Jeffrey!  Find all about Delius (and I mean ALL) in this indispensible 88 minute BBC documentary:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uTVhBhPzPQA

Arranged very loosely in a chronological order (starting bafflingly with his second burial in 1935), it contains many fantastic musical excerpts (live, not from discs) and made-for-the-film interviews with conductors Andrew Davis, Mark Elder, Bo Holten, baritone Thomas Hamson, violinist Philippe Graffin, Delius biographer Jerome Rossi as well as period interviews with Beecham.

Truly one of the most probing and fascinating musical documentaries ever made.

And of course, the  provocative, extraordinarily well acted 1968 Ken Russell biopic is a must: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Vyy2SagDwcY

But start with the BBC film. And then there is GMG's own Delius thread too !  :)
Andre! Thank you very much. I may well have been over-influenced by VW's negative assessment of Delius ('like a Curate improvising'). VW didn't always get it right - he was quite negative, for example, about the later work of Frank Bridge, whom I consider to be a very great composer. I shall need to consider Delius afresh starting with the documentaries you suggest.   :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: vandermolen on November 15, 2016, 02:44:23 PM
Thank you, Jeffrey. You remind me that I quite forgot Delius - i'm such a fickle listener,  :o esp. now with Malipiero being all the rage chez moi.  (might I recommend Delius' VC?  https://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=R5ylRLJQI4c my favorite performance of it.) BTW, I love his Requiem, too.
Thanks Ghost Sonata (sorry, don't know your real name). Delius's Piano Concerto, in its various manifestations, is a favourite of mine and although I rarely listen to Delius I find the very end of his Requiem incredibly moving.
 :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: vandermolen on November 15, 2016, 02:45:50 PM
I was going to write that Delius was an apatride, but then had second thoughts about the translability of the word. Apparently it does not exist in English. The web translator's "stateless" is quite tasteless IMHO. But I'm sure you get the meaning  :D.

Briefly: Delius was born in England of German émigrés. The Delius household's spoken language was German. The composer changed his name from "Fritz" (as per his official papers) to Frederick only when his father died in 1902. When he was a very young man he tried every way and place to escape the paternal influence: Florida and Virginia, Norway, Germany, France. He would return to England only when summoned, and stopped that when his father died. His music was much played in Germany until WWI. He loathed the german music system ("scales, arpeggios, Beethoven, Brahms, Bruckner: throw that away", he said to the young Eric Fenby. He lived the last 30 or so years of his life in France. It's only through the tireless advocacy of Thomas Beecham (and him alone) that his music came to be played and heard in England.

My hunch is that Delius is as un-English as could be for someone who happened to be born there. Apatride is a legal, technical term that does not apply here, as he was officially an English citizen. In French we also use it to describe someone whose roots cannot be determined with any surety, and who does not want a label pinned to him (or her).
Your hunch is v interesting and I suspect v true.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on November 15, 2016, 04:35:29 PM
There's way too much Sorabji in your list! :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: EigenUser on November 15, 2016, 05:01:26 PM
Hmmmm...

1. Bela Bartok
2. Maurice Ravel
3. Gyorgy Ligeti
4. Olivier Messiaen
5. Joseph Haydn
6. Ludwig van Beethoven
7. Morton Feldman
8. Alexander Scriabin
9. George Gershwin
10. Claude Debussy
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on November 15, 2016, 06:20:33 PM
Hmmmm...

1. Bela Bartok
2. Maurice Ravel
3. Gyorgy Ligeti
4. Olivier Messiaen
5. Joseph Haydn
6. Ludwig van Beethoven
7. Morton Feldman
8. Alexander Scriabin
9. George Gershwin
10. Claude Debussy
Sic transit gloria Ockeghem.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: nathanb on November 16, 2016, 04:33:37 PM
Ones that won't change:

Xenakis (#1)
Bartok
Messiaen
Webern
Kagel


The rest I'm struggling with:
Mahler
Varese (I'm a Vareseian but I don't listen to him every week)
Ives
Scelsi
Kate Soper
Schoenberg
Stockhausen (one of the most incredible composers but I still haven't gotten familiar with a large chunk of his work)
Wagner
Brahms
Stravinsky (he introduced me initially to classical but he doesn't generally interest me)
Ligeti
JS Bach
Palestrina
Perotin
Schnittke
Korndorf
Scriabin
Sorabji
Boulez
Liszt
Nancarrow
Zappa
Zorn
Rautavaara
Maja Osojnik
Telemann
Faure
Haas
Grisey
(Lou) Harrison
Murail
Kurtág
Riley
Goldsmith

And I'm still forgetting stuff  :laugh:

I could certainly think of some substitutions I would make ;)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sergeant Rock on November 18, 2016, 12:18:34 PM
Hi, Jeffrey!  Find all about Delius (and I mean ALL) in this indispensible 88 minute BBC documentary:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uTVhBhPzPQA

Arranged very loosely in a chronological order (starting bafflingly with his second burial in 1935), it contains many fantastic musical excerpts (live, not from discs) and made-for-the-film interviews with conductors Andrew Davis, Mark Elder, Bo Holten, baritone Thomas Hamson, violinist Philippe Graffin, Delius biographer Jerome Rossi as well as period interviews with Beecham.

Truly one of the most probing and fascinating musical documentaries ever made.

Thank you for that link. It rekindled my interest in the composer.

Sarge
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on November 18, 2016, 12:44:28 PM
Thank you for that link. It rekindled my interest in the composer.

Sarge

I should watch this, it could illumine the composer for me.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sergeant Rock on November 18, 2016, 12:53:25 PM
I should watch this, it could illumine the composer for me.

It might...but what is illuminated might not be your cuppa  ;D ;)  What surprised me was discovering the Elgar and Delius mutual admiration society. I hadn't known, or imagined, that.

Sarge
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on November 18, 2016, 01:54:23 PM
It might...but what is illuminated might not be your cuppa  ;D ;)  What surprised me was discovering the Elgar and Delius mutual admiration society. I hadn't known, or imagined, that.

Sarge
It's like learning of the deep respect between Xanax and Ambien.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sergeant Rock on November 18, 2016, 02:06:33 PM
It's like learning of the deep respect between Xanax and Ambien.

I shouldn't laugh, but I am laughing.


Sarge
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: André on November 19, 2016, 12:42:25 PM
At the beginning of the 1900-1910s Beecham went for Delius at the expense Elgar, while Boult did the opposite, championing Elgar (and Vaughan-Williams) at the expense of Delius.

It's like championing one was antithetical to an admiration for the other. Later on, Barbirolli went for all of them, although his Delius was rather scarce.

A generation earlier, Brahms and Brucker were similarly pitted against each other. Luckily, conductors  and audiences have come to embrace both.

The 1968 B&W Ken Russell film on Delius' last years is also a must:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Vyy2SagDwcY

Russell is a controversial but highly original filmmaker, the master of musical biopics (The Music Lovers - about Tchaikovsky, Mahler, etc). This Delius film is very special, with wonderful acting. Delius' house in Gréz-sur-Loing was fuul of paintings from his Paris years: Gauguin and Edvard Munch among others. And of course Jelka Rosen (Mrs Delius), herself a painter of some reknown.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on November 21, 2016, 02:50:23 AM
New list for today

Boulez
Brett Dean
Wagner
Ives
Oliveros
Mantovani
Coates
Nishimura
Aperghis
Neuwirth
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on November 21, 2016, 03:00:24 AM
New list for today

Boulez
Brett Dean
Wagner
Ives
Oliveros
Mantovani
Coates
Nishimura
Aperghis
Neuwirth

Well I recognise over half those names. I guess that's something...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ritter on November 21, 2016, 03:04:59 AM
New list for today
...
Wagner
...
:) :) :) Those performnaces of the Ring must really have gotten to you, jessop! Do share your feelings about them with us (if you are so inclined).

Cheers,
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on November 21, 2016, 03:15:28 AM
I am a sometime-Wagnerite ;D

I guess because it is the first time I have ever seen any Wagner on the stage it rekindled my passion for Wagner's music but also made me even more interested in the way he is able to write complex characters faced with complex decisions....

Act 3 of Siegfried has always been a big fat MEH to me because of how Brunnhilde changes after being 'saved' by stupid little Siegfried.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ahinton on November 21, 2016, 03:24:25 AM
Coates
Eric or Gloria?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on November 21, 2016, 03:44:00 AM
Eric or Gloria?
Gloria. I haven't heard anything by Eric Coates apart from one radio tune he did.....I thought he wrote popular music or something? I know very little about him.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on December 04, 2016, 02:25:32 PM
I suppose a bit of editing is needed for mine:

Mahler
Shostakovich
Sibelius
Nielsen
Vaughan Williams
Bartók
Prokofiev
Rachmaninov
Dvořák
Martinů
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on December 04, 2016, 02:42:49 PM
As of today:

Boulez
Pintscher
Saariaho
Bruckner
Wagner
Neuwirth
Steen-Andersen
Oliveros
Coates
Cage
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: NJ Joe on December 04, 2016, 03:40:18 PM
Bach
Mozart
Beethoven
Chopin
Brahms
Debussy
Sibelius
Ravel
Bartok
Stravinsky
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on December 04, 2016, 04:18:58 PM
Bach
Mozart
Beethoven
Chopin
Brahms
Debussy
Sibelius
Ravel
Bartok
Stravinsky

A fine list, Joe. 8) Great stuff.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Contemporaryclassical on December 08, 2016, 12:57:33 AM
Webern
Feldman
Dufay
Kurtág
Stravinsky
Brahms
Mahler
Telemann
Monteverdi
Stockhausen
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on December 08, 2016, 01:02:13 AM
Telemann
That pick rather stands out to me, as the only composer from the time between Brahms and Monteverdi. Not that there's anything wrong with that.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Contemporaryclassical on December 08, 2016, 01:07:48 AM
That pick rather stands out to me, as the only composer from the time between Brahms and Monteverdi. Not that there's anything wrong with that.

 :laugh:

Only top 10, what can I say?  ;)
On the contrary, I was considering putting Haydn in but I decided against
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on December 08, 2016, 01:40:06 AM
:laugh:

Only top 10, what can I say?  ;)
On the contrary, I was considering putting Haydn in but I decided against
Don't take the number 10 too seriously. In a 'top 3' thread I listed 45.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on December 08, 2016, 07:52:54 AM
I suppose a bit of editing is needed for mine:

Mahler
Shostakovich
Sibelius
Nielsen
Vaughan Williams
Bartók
Prokofiev
Rachmaninov
Dvořák
Martinů

For the first time, in a long time, I'm actually still completely satisfied with these choices. :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on December 09, 2016, 01:53:40 AM
After 3.5 days?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Overtones on December 12, 2016, 09:53:30 AM
This one is going strong for me:

1st tier
1a) Beethoven
1b) Prokofiev

2nd tier
2a) Mozart
2b) Liszt

3rd tier
3a) Shostakovic
3b) Schubert
3c) Bach

4th tier
4a) Schumann
4b) Bartok
4c) Debussy
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on December 12, 2016, 01:49:53 PM
Interesting mix there, Overtones. I'm just beginning to explore Prokofiev more.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on December 12, 2016, 03:49:43 PM
This one is going strong for me:

1st tier
1a) Beethoven
1b) Prokofiev

2nd tier
2a) Mozart
2b) Liszt

3rd tier
3a) Shostakovich
3b) Schubert
3c) Bach

4th tier
4a) Schumann
4b) Bartok
4c) Debussy

Great list, Overtones. Love most of those composers.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on December 12, 2016, 03:56:38 PM
most
Mirror Image doesn't like Mozart :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on December 12, 2016, 03:58:15 PM
Mirror Image doesn't like Mozart :D

I'm trying to like Mozart. Of course, I don't hate his music at all. It's just not my cup of tea (at the moment). Beethoven I've really come around to and I absolutely love now. He really should be in my 'Top 10' nowadays. :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on December 12, 2016, 04:01:05 PM
List today:

Pierre Boulez
Olga Neuwirth
Charlotte Bray
Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart
Witold Lutosławski
Thomas Adès
Pauline Oliveros
Brett Dean
Liza Lim
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on December 12, 2016, 04:02:15 PM
I'm trying to like Mozart. Of course, I don't hate his music at all. It's just not my cup of tea (at the moment). Beethoven I've really come around to and I absolutely love now. He really should be in my 'Top 10' nowadays. :)
I like Mozart a lot, definitely one of my top composers that he sometimes even makes it into my Top 10. But I find his music can sometimes be so...........idk.......academic?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on December 12, 2016, 05:54:30 PM
I like Mozart a lot, definitely one of my top composers that he sometimes even makes it into my Top 10. But I find his music can sometimes be so...........idk.......academic?

I'm not sure academic would be the right word here. Perhaps he's a bit too 'dry' sometimes?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on December 12, 2016, 08:34:42 PM
I'm not sure academic would be the right word here. Perhaps he's a bit too 'dry' sometimes?
Oh I wouldn't say dry, at least not the works from his final decade of composition..........
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on December 12, 2016, 08:48:39 PM
Oh I wouldn't say dry, at least not the works from his final decade of composition..........

Well, you certainly know more about his music than I do, so whatever adjective you choose I'm sure will be good enough. ;)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: springrite on December 13, 2016, 07:35:15 PM
Some updating: can't know why I left Liszt off this list  ;D  he's been almost an obsession for the last three years.  One of these days I will finish my critical discography of the B Minor Sonata.  Anyway ...

Machaut
Bach
Liszt
Debussy
Webern
Stravinsky
Cage
Feldman
Carter
Boulez


Awesome list!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on December 21, 2016, 02:14:03 AM
Im gonna have to make a new list since I had an early music day recently and rediscovered a whole heap of things I forgot I love

Boulez
Helen Grime
Machaut
Pauline Oliveros
Charlotte Bray
Olga Neuwirth
Ockeghem
eRikm
Dufay
Perotin
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: SymphonicAddict on December 21, 2016, 07:31:57 PM
1. Beethoven
2. Brahms
3. Tchaikovsky
4. Dvorák
5. Sibelius
6. Schubert
7. Prokofiev
8. Nielsen
9. Saint-Saëns
10. Vaughan Williams

Too hard question!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on January 13, 2017, 09:42:39 AM
A little bit of an update:

1. Sibelius
2. Nielsen
3. Ravel
4. Bartók
5. Vaughan Williams

6. Mahler
7. Stravinsky
8. Prokofiev
9. Martinů
10. Janáček

Edit: Mahler's losing a bit of steam amongst my list, so he'll probably be substituted for Elgar in due time.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on January 13, 2017, 01:55:03 PM
An update for me as well

Boulez
Ligeti
Cage
Helen Grime
Adam de la Halle
Kagel
Schumann
Soper
Neuwirth
Berg
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on January 13, 2017, 01:57:10 PM
I suppose a bit of editing is needed for mine:

Mahler
Shostakovich
Sibelius
Nielsen
Vaughan Williams
Bartók
Prokofiev
Rachmaninov
Dvořák
Martinů
For the first time, in a long time, I'm actually still completely satisfied with these choices. :)
Just one month later, three changes on this list...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on January 13, 2017, 02:02:31 PM
Just one month later, three changes on this list...

The sheer amount of listening that Mirror Image does creates significant evolutionary pressure on the list.

EDIT: It's worth noting, though, that the era his preferred composers come from tends to be highly consistent. The late 19th into the 20th century has a significant gravitational pull.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on January 13, 2017, 07:06:39 PM
Just one month later, three changes on this list...

Yep and expect another change next month! ;) ;D

The sheer amount of listening that Mirror Image does creates significant evolutionary pressure on the list.

EDIT: It's worth noting, though, that the era his preferred composers come from tends to be highly consistent. The late 19th into the 20th century has a significant gravitational pull.

You're absolutely right about my preferences. There's no hiding there. That's where my heart is or so it feels that way.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on January 17, 2017, 07:24:53 AM
I like Mozart a lot, definitely one of my top composers that he sometimes even makes it into my Top 10. But I find his music can sometimes be so...........idk.......academic?

I'm not sure academic would be the right word here. Perhaps he's a bit too 'dry' sometimes?

You guys are hopeless!  ;D

Mozart, dry and academic? Really? And which works of his display these traits, pray tell?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ritter on January 17, 2017, 07:35:15 AM
You guys are hopeless!  ;D

Mozart, dry and academic? Really? And which works of his display these traits, pray tell?
+1
Bună ziua, Andrei. Our friends really, really could profit from seriously listening to Don Giovanni, for instance...  :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on January 17, 2017, 07:50:23 AM
+1
Bună ziua, Andrei. Our friends really, really could profit from seriously listening to Don Giovanni, fro instance...  :)

¡Hola!, don Rafael. Indeed, full of life as Don Giovanni, witty as Figaro, jocund as Papageno and tempting as Despina --- such is Mozart´s music.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on January 17, 2017, 12:14:09 PM
You guys are hopeless!  ;D

Mozart, dry and academic? Really? And which works of his display these traits, pray tell?

I think it is rare for Mozart to come across as dry to me. But pieces like his last symphonies, the string quartets, fugues are great examples of innovation. I guess because his music when compared with other composers of his time is as complex as it is, it could come across to some people as innovation for the sake of innovation. It sounds great, interesting, different and sometimes completely throws me from my expectations, but there is always some kind of underlying logic to his music which makedoesn't it flow well. That's why I say it is academic.....every time I go back to his music there is just layer upon layer of hidden delights, further examples of weird deviations from the norm, bending of 'rules' etc etc
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on January 17, 2017, 01:03:46 PM
I think it is rare for Mozart to come across as dry to me. But pieces like his last symphonies, the string quartets, fugues are great examples of innovation. I guess because his music when compared with other composers of his time is as complex as it is, it could come across to some people as innovation for the sake of innovation. It sounds great, interesting, different and sometimes completely throws me from my expectations, but there is always some kind of underlying logic to his music which makedoesn't it flow well. That's why I say it is academic.....every time I go back to his music there is just layer upon layer of hidden delights, further examples of weird deviations from the norm, bending of 'rules' etc etc

In other words, in your book "hidden delights" and "weird deviations from the norm" and "bending of rules" and "completely throws me from my expectations" ---they all equal "academic"...

First time I was joking, but now I say it loud and proud: You, Sir, are a hopeless case.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on January 17, 2017, 01:39:45 PM
In other words, in your book "hidden delights" and "weird deviations from the norm" and "bending of rules" and "completely throws me from my expectations" ---they all equal "academic"...

First time I was joking, but now I say it loud and proud: You, Sir, are a hopeless case.
They equal 'academic' to me because finding this kind of enjoyment in the music alludes to the academic/analytical side of things. As you say, I am a hopeless case because there is no hope at trying to get me not to fall head over heels for his music. ;D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: (poco) Sforzando on January 17, 2017, 01:42:12 PM
Beethoven I've really come around to and I absolutely love now. He really should be in my 'Top 10' nowadays. :)

Yay!!!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on January 18, 2017, 02:19:29 AM
They equal 'academic' to me because finding this kind of enjoyment in the music alludes to the academic/analytical side of things.

Maybe, but in the end it´s the effect of music on the listeners that counts, and this is anything but academic.  ;D

Quote
As you say, I am a hopeless case because there is no hope at trying to get me not to fall head over heels for his music. ;D

That´s what I mean!  :laugh:
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: James on January 28, 2017, 05:50:07 AM
Here's my latest list in chronological order:

Anonymous. Plainchant from the 9th century, and before.
Anonymous, also Leonin/Perotin. Organa, sequentia and conductus from 10th - 12th century
Troubadours, trouvères.  Lyric poets or poet-musicians of France in the 12th - 13th centuries.
Machaut
Dufay

Some beauty to be found no doubt, but Zzzzz :P

Bach .. Stravinsky

Enter vital, joyous, life-giving motor rhythms, and further elaboration thereof .. more like it! 8)

Cage
Feldman

Then you head back into Z territory, naivety ..  and without the beauty. :(
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on February 02, 2017, 08:23:34 PM
HMMM lets see who my recent favourites are

Boulez
Aperghis
Mozart
Liza Lim
Birtwistle
Helen Grime
Rihm
Rautavaara
Penderecki
Schumann
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: nathanb on February 02, 2017, 08:34:21 PM
HMMM lets see who my recent favourites are

Boulez
Aperghis
Mozart
Liza Lim
Birtwistle
Helen Grime
Rihm
Rautavaara
Penderecki
Schumann

Ugh it's a good disc but why do people have such a hard on for Helen Grime???
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on February 02, 2017, 09:03:35 PM
Ugh it's a good disc but why do people have such a hard on for Helen Grime???

Do you think her compositions are overrated? Perhaps they are......I listen to her music often, and I think the fact that there isn't a lot to listen to just yet means that I have become very very familiar with 9 of her compositions (counting the violin concerto which can be heard on youtube). Maybe is this familiarity that gives me a sense of comfort in knowing her style as well as excitement when there is a new work of hers available that I hadn't yet heard—like when I listened to her violin concerto for the first time. Perhaps it is also the case that I find her orchestration extremely compelling, and I can hear things in it that already remind me of other composers I have grown up enjoying very much. As is usual for me, my top 10 favourite composers predominantly features Boulez, Grime, Lim, Birtwistle and others depending on what my recent mood for music has been......and then gradually my interests may change over a longer period of time when I may hardly listen to any Grime and instead you could be complaining about me always going on about, idk, Chris Dench or Caerwen Martin or another composer who hasn't had a huge amount of recorded releases.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on February 04, 2017, 07:03:40 AM
Let's see...

Sibelius
Nielsen
Vaughan Williams
Ravel
Bartók
Mahler
Martinů
Elgar
Ives
Rachmaninov
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: arpeggio on June 03, 2017, 10:07:09 PM
In another forum someone asked a similar question and I responded with a list of fifth-seven composers.  One person complained that Haydn was missing from the list.  Schubert, Handel and Mendelssohn were also missing from the list yet I listen to these composers all of the time.  So far no one has complained that Carter, Webern and Schoenberg are on the list.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: nodogen on July 05, 2017, 07:53:55 AM
I'm still a neophyte at this game, but even with my limited exposure I have now moved from struggling to come up with ten to struggling to reduce my list to ten.

Anyhoo, after some scribbling and teeth gnashing I've come up with (in no order, other than Scriabin plus nine)

Scriabin
Takemitsu
Ravel
Vaughan Williams
Kurtag
Ligeti
Murail
Scelsi
Szymanowski
Sorabji


Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: schnittkease on July 05, 2017, 11:23:57 AM
7/5/2017

Schnittke
Schmitt
Toch
Bentzon
Krenek
Nordheim
Tveitt
Myaskovsky
Jongen
Fibich
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: nodogen on July 05, 2017, 11:30:51 AM
7/5/2017

Schnittke
Schmitt
Toch
Bentzon
Krenek
Nordheim
Tveitt
Myaskovsky
Jongen
Fibich

Good grief me, I've only heard of two of these 😳
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Turner on July 05, 2017, 11:43:53 AM
7/5/2017

Schnittke
Schmitt
Toch
Bentzon
Krenek
Nordheim
Tveitt
Myaskovsky
Jongen
Fibich

Niels Viggo B is an unusual choice. Any particular, favourite works?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: schnittkease on July 05, 2017, 04:45:18 PM
Good grief me, I've only heard of two of these

First off, this is today's list, influenced by the past week's listening. Tomorrow may very well be a different story (although Schnittke, Schmitt, and Toch are constants). Which are the two that you have heard of? I can give you some recommendations for the other eight if you want to start exploring. :) 

Niels Viggo B is an unusual choice. Any particular, favourite works?

Bentzon's (The) Tempered Piano arrived a few days ago; I've been binge-listening to the 15-hour journey. Past favorites include piano sonatas nos. 3 & 5, which have apparently become staples of Danish piano literature (and it's not hard to see why, if the astringent tonality doesn't throw most listeners). Symphonies nos. 3 and 4 "Metamorphosen" are again classics - I return to them every once in a while. The violin and cello concertos are fine. Niels Viggo Bentzon has shown mastery in all the genres that shape his diverse oeuvre (including IMO one of the 20th century's most important piano works + 12 SQs yet to be recorded), making him one of my go-to composers.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on July 05, 2017, 05:26:44 PM
Let's work out an arbitrary list of 10 composers I enjoy very much at the moment

Boulez
Stockhausen
Mozart
Liza Lim
Reimann
Janacek
Henze
Neuwirth
Berio
Schreker
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Turner on July 05, 2017, 07:16:50 PM
Bentzon's (The) Tempered Piano arrived a few days ago; I've been binge-listening to the 15-hour journey. Past favorites include piano sonatas nos. 3 & 5, which have apparently become staples of Danish piano literature (and it's not hard to see why, if the astringent tonality doesn't throw most listeners). Symphonies nos. 3 and 4 "Metamorphosen" are again classics - I return to them every once in a while. The violin and cello concertos are fine. Niels Viggo Bentzon has shown mastery in all the genres that shape his diverse oeuvre (including IMO one of the 20th century's most important piano works + 12 SQs yet to be recorded), making him one of my go-to composers.

I like the relatively early piano works in particular, as you say it´s a pity he hasn´t yet been that much explored by the DaCapo label, or other ones. There´s a real lot missing in the discography, as illustrated by the WiKi list
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_compositions_by_Niels_Viggo_Bentzon,
and not much literature about him (he was a painter too, and worked with several artistic genres):
at least 16 string quartets, 31 piano sonatas, 24 symphonies, many concertos etc.

The lack of recordings and performances also makes it difficult to establish key works in this huge oeuvre consisting of at least 664 opuses. A good deal of the later works seem rather sketchy, but on the other hand, thorough Brahms was one of his favourites.

And then of course there´s "The Flight of the Meat Ball across the Fence"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3kXW0WGBfrc
played here during a long television programme portraiting Ole Schmidt.

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Alek Hidell on July 05, 2017, 08:04:42 PM
J.S. Bach
Mahler
Sibelius
Beethoven
Shostakovich
Feldman
Martinů
Haydn
Vaughan Williams
Bruckner

... I think. There's still so much I have yet to even listen to - including some pretty marquee works like Beethoven's late quartets (or Haydn's Paris and London symphonies!). Other composers who threaten to crack this very tentative list include Brahms, Messiaen, Debussy, Nielsen, Boulez - and I'm sure there are others I'm forgetting. (In the case of most of these, it's because I've liked what I've heard but have only scratched the surface of their works.)

And, boy, that list is sure tilted heavily toward the 20th century, isn't it? I really need to identify more faves in earlier periods ...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: schnittkease on July 05, 2017, 09:45:03 PM
I like the relatively early piano works in particular, as you say it´s a pity he hasn´t yet been that much explored by the DaCapo label, or other ones. There´s a real lot missing in the discography, as illustrated by the WiKi list
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_compositions_by_Niels_Viggo_Bentzon,
and not much literature about him (he was a painter too, and worked with several artistic genres):
at least 16 string quartets, 31 piano sonatas, 24 symphonies, many concertos etc.

The lack of recordings and performances also makes it difficult to establish key works in this huge oeuvre consisting of at least 664 opuses. A good deal of the later works seem rather sketchy, but on the other hand, thorough Brahms was one of his favourites.

Completely agree; I think that prolific composers like Bentzon and Hovhaness are further obscured by the fact that so little of their work has been recorded. In this regard, Bentzon has been more unfortunate. I like that you touched on trying to 'extract' the key works of such a large oeuvre - it gets to the point where, if it's on CD, it's considered a significant work. You'd think that record companies wouldn't waste their time with the theoretical "2-minute piano piece, op. 519b". In my experience, however, Bentzon's most important works are the symphonies, piano sonatas, and the Tempered Piano. But who knows? New gems keep 'popping up' every few years... 
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: nodogen on July 05, 2017, 10:38:27 PM
Amen to those in particular  ;)

Several on your list were ones I had to scribble out and gnash teeth over, especially Xenakis and Bartok.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: nodogen on July 05, 2017, 10:42:36 PM
For me currently, it's a bit of a transitional period with personal stuff, so it's rather different:

Lassus
Lutoslawski
Stockhausen
Herrmann
Bartok
Webern
Debussy
Mahler


(Overall in my whole life with music, it's still the previous list on the last page)

This list only contains 8, not 10, so it doesn't count! 🤓
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: nodogen on July 05, 2017, 10:47:44 PM
J.S. Bach
Mahler
Sibelius
Beethoven
Shostakovich
Feldman
Martinů
Haydn
Vaughan Williams
Bruckner

... I think. There's still so much I have yet to even listen to - including some pretty marquee works like Beethoven's late quartets (or Haydn's Paris and London symphonies!). Other composers who threaten to crack this very tentative list include Brahms, Messiaen, Debussy, Nielsen, Boulez - and I'm sure there are others I'm forgetting. (In the case of most of these, it's because I've liked what I've heard but have only scratched the surface of their works.)

And, boy, that list is sure tilted heavily toward the 20th century, isn't it? I really need to identify more faves in earlier periods ...

There's so much, it's a major endeavour to do more than scratch the surface! Our tastes seem quite similar.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: nodogen on July 05, 2017, 10:58:36 PM
Hope it goes well.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on July 06, 2017, 12:49:18 AM
It was a conscious decision for me, I'm on the down-low with classical at the moment, the main thing I'm listening to are string quartets in the present (as I am presenting one to a string quartet over here, which could get played)

Non-classical is my comfort food at the moment

https://media.giphy.com/media/11k4rk0VYsOUOk/giphy.gif

There's a new CD out of music by Arturo Fuentes played by Quatuor Diotima. Very excited by this. A great composer matched with a great ensemble.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: amw on July 06, 2017, 01:46:46 AM
Since apparently this just means "your top 10 composers over the past few days/weeks/hours" now, [....]
Top 10 list is still consistent, but here:

JS Bach - has dominated my listening lately to an unusual degree.
Froberger - particularly the "darker" pieces
Louis Couperin - an old favourite
Mozart
Janáček
Sibelius - the music for violin and orchestra & violin and piano, mostly
Yannis Kyriakides - works with voices. as mentioned before in this forum
Chaya Czernowin - music is sometimes a bit busy for my taste, but its expressiveness is appealing right now
Enescu - the mature & late chamber music. Has a really special elusive quality that sets it apart from the late-romantic milieu, particularly in e.g. the slow movement of the D major piano sonata which is the kind of thing I hope to accomplish when I write music myself
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: SymphonicAddict on July 06, 2017, 01:59:05 PM
It's a narrow list actually, but I think these ones work for me at this moment:

Beethoven
Brahms
Dvorák
Tchaikovsky
Sibelius
Nielsen
Shostakovich
Prokofiev
Respighi
Vaughan Williams
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Alek Hidell on July 07, 2017, 03:22:53 PM
It's a narrow list actually, but I think these ones work for me at this moment:
[...]
Respighi

Respighi is an interesting choice! I have a smattering of his music awaiting me - what works particularly tickle your fancy?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: SymphonicAddict on July 07, 2017, 04:11:01 PM
Respighi is an interesting choice! I have a smattering of his music awaiting me - what works particularly tickle your fancy?

Vetrate di Chiesa!!! It's my favorite work by him: I like the bombastic here, above all in San Gregorio Magno. Other works I like so much are Feste Romane, Pini di Roma, Sinfonia Drammatica, Trittico Botticelliano, Suite from Belkis, Metamorphoseon, Concerto Gregoriano, Poema autunnale, Ballata delle gnomidi, Lauda per la Natività del Signore, Ciaccona (after Vitali) for violin, strings and organ (it was a recent discovery) and ... many others ...  :)

What about you?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Alek Hidell on July 07, 2017, 04:21:52 PM
Vetrate di Chiesa!!! It's my favorite work by him: I like the bombastic here, above all in San Gregorio Magno. Other works I like so much are Feste Romane, Pini di Roma, Sinfonia Drammatica, Trittico Botticelliano, Suite from Belkis, Metamorphoseon, Concerto Gregoriano, Poema autunnale, Ballata delle gnomidi, Lauda per la Natività del Signore, Ciaccona (after Vitali) for violin, strings and organ (it was a recent discovery) and ... many others ...  :)

What about you?

Thanks! I'll make a note of those.

I can't say what I like - I've barely listened to anything by him at all (I can't remember if I've even heard the Pines and Fountains, those two warhorses). I was looking for a place to begin. I have some recordings but I haven't gotten to them yet.  :(  :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: kishnevi on July 07, 2017, 04:31:10 PM
Thanks! I'll make a note of those.

I can't say what I like - I've barely listened to anything by him at all (I can't remember if I've even heard the Pines and Fountains, those two warhorses). I was looking for a place to begin. I have some recordings but I haven't gotten to them yet.  :(  :)

Try the concertos: far less famous but as good or better than the warhorses.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Christo on August 10, 2017, 11:11:37 PM
Barber
Braga Santos
Falla
Guarnieri
Holmboe
Janáček
Nielsen
Respighi
Tubin
Vaughan Williams
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: SymphonicAddict on August 11, 2017, 05:58:56 PM
Barber
Braga Santos
Falla
Guarnieri
Holmboe
Janáček
Nielsen
Respighi
Tubin
Vaughan Williams

Mmm interesting list that is... but I don't see any Russian here:  ;)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on August 11, 2017, 06:42:43 PM
Be sure to kill me if you like, for coming back here again but at the moment I'm finding this: (which is quite odd for me)
More or less chronologically:

Hildegard
Dowland
Machaut
Lassus
Josquin
Gesualdo
Monteverdi
Beethoven (piano sonatas mostly)
RAVEL
Stravinsky (late "sacred" works exclusively)
John Cage


What's happening to me??????  ???

Experience  ;)

Also an evident taste for counterpoint. The complete Dowland box from L'oiseau lyre pops up at a good price periodically and is excellent in all ways.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: SymphonicAddict on August 11, 2017, 08:02:02 PM
I'd say almost the same, just with some changes (including Tchaikovsky, Beethoven, Brahms, Sibelius, maybe Villa-Lobos; excluding Falla, Guarnieri, Barber). Very do agree with Respighi, Nielsen, Holmboe, Braga-Santos, Tubin and Vaughan Williams

My list would be something like this:

Beethoven
Brahms
Dvorák
Tchaikovsky
Martinu
Vaughan Williams
Sibelius
Tubin
Shostakovich
Nielsen

I wouldn't be utterly satisfied, though. I'd want to include Bach, Atterberg, Respighi, Braga Santos, Holmboe, Strauss, Prokofiev, Janácek, Hindemith, Rimsky-Korsakov, Schubert, Schumann, Chopin, Rachmaninov, Taneyev, Schmidt, Bruckner, Mahler, Ravel, Schnittke, Novák, Szymanowski, Lutoslawski, Arnold, Simpson, Langgaard, Barber, Bantock, Stravinsky, Bartók... there are thousands, many, you wouldn't stop of writing

All this depends on your thinking, tastes, mood, good days, bad days. They can changed in the future.

... but at the last the list will have to be changed, there aren't perfect lists because of the number of composers there are, the huge list of works there are (symphonies, concertos, string quartets, masses, requiems, operas, piano sonatas, and so on...)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Christo on August 12, 2017, 02:26:29 AM
I'd say almost the same, just with some changes (including Tchaikovsky, Beethoven, Brahms, Sibelius, maybe Villa-Lobos; excluding Falla, Guarnieri, Barber). Very do agree with Respighi, Nielsen, Holmboe, Braga-Santos, Tubin and Vaughan Williams

My list would be something like this:

Beethoven
Brahms
Dvorák
Tchaikovsky
Martinu
Vaughan Williams
Sibelius
Tubin
Shostakovich
Nielsen

I wouldn't be utterly satisfied, though. I'd want to include Bach, Atterberg, Respighi, Braga Santos, Janácek, Holmboe, Strauss, Prokofiev, Janácek, Hindemith, Rimsky-Korsakov, Schubert, Schumann, Chopin, Rachmaninov, Taneyev, Schmidt, Bruckner, Mahler, Ravel, Schnittke, Novák, Szymanowski, Lutoslawski, Arnold, Simpson, Langgaard, Barber, Bantock, Stravinsky, Bartók... there are thousands, many, you wouldn't stop of writing

All this depends on your thinking, tastes, mood, good days, bad days. They can changed in the future.

... but at the last the list will have to be changed, there aren't perfect lists because of the number of composers there are, the huge list of works there are (symphonies, concertos, string quartets, masses, requiems, operas, piano sonatas, and so on...)
All very similar to my shorter and longer lists; with only one exception: somehow, from very early on, the German Romantics didn't do it for me and I never overcame that, how much I tried (played the Brahms symphonies for two weeks, a couple of years ago, the outcome: nope  :D) - but excluding Beethoven at the one end and Bruckner, Mahler, Schmidt and Hindemith at the other. So with the exception of Schumann, Brahms and Strauss, your list is very similar to mine. Feels good.  ;D

Mmm interesting list that is... but I don't see any Russian here:  ;)
My Russians are Tchaikovsky, Rimsky, Stravinsky and Shosta - more so than Prokoviev. One or two should be included, but who to leave out??  :-X

BTW: wow!, another Tubin enthusiast (please convince our exquisite Brian to have a second listening; his superfical glance over one of our most favourite symphonic cycles hurts.  :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: SymphonicAddict on August 12, 2017, 03:59:01 PM
All very similar to my shorter and longer lists; with only one exception: somehow, from very early on, the German Romantics didn't do it for me and I never overcame that, how much I tried (played the Brahms symphonies for two weeks, a couple of years ago, the outcome: nope  :D) - but excluding Beethoven at the one end and Bruckner, Mahler, Schmidt and Hindemith at the other. So with the exception of Schumann, Brahms and Strauss, your list is very similar to mine. Feels good.  ;D
My Russians are Tchaikovsky, Rimsky, Stravinsky and Shosta - more so than Prokoviev. One or two should be included, but who to leave out??  :-X

BTW: wow!, another Tubin enthusiast (please convince our exquisite Brian to have a second listening; his superfical glance over one of our most favourite symphonic cycles hurts.  :D

I have been able to see in other threads you don't like much the Romantic Germans (along with vandermolen)  ;D

Tubin is terrific in a high degree. Right now I'm playing the Sinfonietta on Estonian motifs. This work can't bore me, it's impossible!!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: musicrom on August 12, 2017, 06:40:27 PM
My top 10 based on my Pandora & Spotify likes:

1.   Ludwig van Beethoven
2.   Jean Sibelius
3.   Nikolai Rimsky-Korsakov
4.   Pyotr Ilyich Tchaikovsky
5.   Antonín Dvořák
6.   Frederic Chopin
7.   Sergei Prokofiev
8.   Felix Mendelssohn
9.   Dmitri Shostakovich
10.   Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Christo on August 21, 2017, 05:56:03 AM
Tubin is terrific in a high degree. Right now I'm playing the Sinfonietta on Estonian motifs. This work can't bore me, it's impossible!!
He is. Spread the news!  :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: NikF on August 21, 2017, 06:47:50 AM
Right now (and roughly in order) it is:

Brahms
Shostakovich
Ravel
Debussy
Mahler
Prokofiev
Stravinsky
Chopin
RVW
Bartok
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Autumn Leaves on August 23, 2017, 05:49:12 PM
Right now (and roughly in order) it is:

Brahms
Shostakovich
Ravel
Debussy
Mahler
Prokofiev
Stravinsky
Chopin
RVW
Bartok

Hey Nik - I like your list!; mine is a bit similar :):

Bach
Tchaikovsky
Sibelius
Shostakovich
Mahler
Chopin
Debussy
Mendelssohn
Brahms
Schumann
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on August 31, 2017, 04:56:54 PM
Right now (and roughly in order) it is:

Brahms
Shostakovich
Ravel
Debussy
Mahler
Prokofiev
Stravinsky
Chopin
RVW
Bartok

A fine list indeed. Many of my favorites mentioned.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: TheGSMoeller on August 31, 2017, 06:34:08 PM
I wrote this just over 5 years ago in 2012 in an old 25 Favorite Composers Thread...

Richard Strauss (Duett-Concertino for Clarinet and Bassoon))
William Byrd (Ye Sacred Muses)
Heinrich I. F. Biber (Violin Sonata No.3)
Jean-Philippe Rameau(Les Cyclopes)
Franz Joseph Haydn(Symphony No. 80 in D minor)
Hector Berlioz(Grande Messe des Morts)
Charles Ives(Piano Sonata No.2 "Concord")
Sergei Prokofiev(Symphony No.  6 in E flat Major
Benjamin Britten(Serenade for Tenor, Horn and Strings)
Philip Glass(Beauty and the Beast)   


This is my solid top ten, with R.Strauss being numero uno, the rest being chronological. R. Strauss' tone poems (Till Eulenspiegel in particular) initially sparked my interest in classical music. The rest of the list I'll present in chronological order...

John Dowland(Lachrimae)
Claudio Monteverdi(Orfeo)
J.S. Bach(Goldberg Variations)
Antonio Vivaldi(Mandolin Concerto)
Georg Philipp Telemann(Overture-Suite in C major, TV 55 no C 3 "Wassermusik")
W. A. Mozart(Die Zauberflöte)
Franz Schubert(String Quartet No. 15 in D minor)
Edward Elgar(Symphony No. 2)
Alban Berg(Wozzeck)
Francis Poulenc(Figure humaine)
Alfred Schnittke(Choir Concerto)
Michael Nyman(MGV)
Pascal Dusapin(A Quia, concerto for Piano and Orchestra)
David Lang(Little Match Girl Passion)
Paul Schoenfield(Vaudeville, for Piccolo Trumpet and Orchestra)


I would say it's still close, although it's shocking that Bruckner was excluded completely, and Byrd made my Top Ten  ??? 
Maybe I don't know the old me as well as I though I did.  ;D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on August 31, 2017, 06:46:48 PM
I think this thread needs no new Alien lists any time soon  :laugh: :laugh:

I don’t think I need to post a list either. Members here should know my favorites by now and if they don’t just look at my posting history.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: kyjo on October 24, 2017, 08:48:30 AM
In some sort of order:

Rachmaninoff
Sibelius
Shostakovich
Ravel
Atterberg
RVW
Elgar
Dvorak
Prokofiev
Hanson
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on November 15, 2017, 07:42:00 AM
I suppose it’s definitely time to do another one of these lists (in no particular order):

Shostakovich
Vaughan Williams
Bartók
Mahler
Sibelius
Nielsen
Martinů
Dvořák
Ives
Szymanowski
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on November 15, 2017, 07:48:44 AM
Let's see...

Sibelius
Nielsen
Vaughan Williams
Ravel
Bartók
Mahler
Martinů
Elgar
Ives
Rachmaninov
I don’t think I need to post a list either. Members here should know my favorites by now and if they don’t just look at my posting history.
I suppose it’s definitely time to do another one of these lists (in no particular order):

Shostakovich
Vaughan Williams
Bartók
Mahler
Sibelius
Nielsen
Martinů
Dvořák
Ives
Szymanowski

I think you're regressing again, John.  >:D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ritter on November 15, 2017, 07:55:12 AM
I suppose it’s definitely time to do another one of these lists (in no particular order):

Shostakovich
Vaughan Williams
Bartók
Mahler
Sibelius
Nielsen
Martinů
Dvořák
Ives
Szymanowski
Poor Koechlin, poor Delius... Thrown out into the cold, just like that... :(  :laugh:

I'm just kidding of course. My lists would also be subject to changes every once in a while.

Good day, John!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on November 15, 2017, 07:59:19 AM
Poor Koechlin, poor Delius... Thrown out into the cold, just like that... :(  :laugh:

I'm just kidding of course. My lists would also be subject to changes every once in a while.

Good day, John!

Hah! ;D Good day to you, too, Rafael. I’ve cooled on Delius for many years now and I don’t consider him an essential part of my listening or really much of an influence. Koechlin would definitely be in my ‘Top 20’ but not ‘Top 10’.

Would be curious to see your updated list.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on November 15, 2017, 08:35:09 AM
Time for some light editing.

Bach
Beethoven
Brahms
Chopin
Dvořák
Janáček
Mozart
Ravel
Schubert
Sibelius


Just outside the top 10: Prokofiev, Stravinsky, Haydn, Berlioz, Rakhmaninov, Schumann
1 year later...


Bach
Beethoven
Chopin
Haydn
Janáček
Mozart
Ravel
Schubert
Sibelius
Stravinsky


(Followed by Rakhmaninov, Martinů, Brahms, Liszt, Berlioz, Monteverdi)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ritter on November 15, 2017, 08:45:06 AM
My list then...

....
Claudio Monteverdi
Johann Sebastian Bach
Wolgang Amadeus Mozart
Ludwig van Beethoven
Richard Wagner
Gustav Mahler
Claude Debussy
Igor Stravinsky
Alban Berg
Pierre Boulez

..and my list now:

Johann Sebastian Bach
Wolgang Amadeus Mozart
Ludwig van Beethoven
Richard Wagner
Claude Debussy
Manuel de Falla
Arnold Schoenberg
George Enescu
Igor Stravinsky
Pierre Boulez

So out go (temporarily, I suppose) Monteverdi, Mahler and Berg, and in come Falla, Schoenberg and Enescu.




Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on November 15, 2017, 08:45:47 AM
I think you're regressing again, John.  >:D

:( Indeed, Karlo....indeed.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: bwv 1080 on November 15, 2017, 09:25:36 AM
right now

Mozart
Sor
Schumann
Schnittke
Henze
Carter
Brouwer
Terry Riley
Lutoslawski
Stravinsky
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: amw on November 15, 2017, 10:02:57 AM
Top 10 list is still consistent, but here:

JS Bach - has dominated my listening lately to an unusual degree.
Froberger - particularly the "darker" pieces
Louis Couperin - an old favourite
Mozart
Janáček
Sibelius - the music for violin and orchestra & violin and piano, mostly
Yannis Kyriakides - works with voices. as mentioned before in this forum
Chaya Czernowin - music is sometimes a bit busy for my taste, but its expressiveness is appealing right now
Enescu - the mature & late chamber music. Has a really special elusive quality that sets it apart from the late-romantic milieu, particularly in e.g. the slow movement of the D major piano sonata which is the kind of thing I hope to accomplish when I write music myself

the top 10 of the last..... few months? I guess comes out to be

Haydn almost exclusively for the string quartets, op. 20, 33 & 50
Beethoven
Julius Eastman. Not much (surviving) music but it's all great and has been listened to on repeat
Cage
JS Bach, as above, not listening so much as before
L Couperin. Mostly via Bob van Asperen's Aeolus recordings which are renewing my appreciation for the music.
Reich
Kurtág, spurred by the newish choral/vocal works release
Machaut. spent a fair amount of time with 14th century music lately in the hopes of eventually being able to tell apart different composers (lol) but Machaut still sounds more like music from the 24th century. sometimes when someone is incredibly famous for hundreds of years there's a good reason for it
Martinů, particularly very late & very early works (Fantaisies Symphoniques/Estampes/Parables/Fresques + Toccata discs of early orchestral music + early chamber music, eg Violin Sonata No.0)
Donatoni, somewhat of a "contemporary composer du jour" but also there's been a lot more of his music becoming available lately and I am definitely into it. the austerity in particular.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mandryka on November 15, 2017, 10:37:09 AM
These are just the things that popped into my head when I asked myself what I've really enjoyed hearing over the past few months.

Schoenberg - it all started with the new recording by Trio Zimmerman, then I found myself getting more pleasure than ever before from the last two quartets.

Feldman, the late music, I'm getting more and more stamina to enjoy the experience of FBM and Triadic Memories and piano, violin, viola, cello. I'm kind of amazed at myself, that I can enjoy this stuff!

Mozart, really the quartets for Haydn and the last two quintets, I got a CD from quatuor Cambini Paris and it revived my interest a lot, as did someone's transfer of Tatrai quartet playing the late quintets.

Haydn op 20 - just because of Chiaroscuro  quartet.

Charles Mouton, I like the very late pieces, really it's Toyohiko Satoh's way of voicing the music which I like.

The anonymous authors of the Codex Huelgas, as performed by Luis Lozano Virumbrales.

Frescobaldi, for some reason I'm appreciating his music more than ever before.

Ockeghem, I like his music more than any other Franco-Flem at the moment. It flows so naturally, and is so rich contrapuntally.

Lassus, or rather Hilliard's Lassus, which just seems so very beautiful and easy-listening.

Beethoven, just one thing though, Arrau's Appassionata DVD.

Francesco Landini, I love the way the timbres in the Anonymous 4 recording cohere, what they do is relaxing

Generally, I've been enjoying Glen Wilson and The Rose Consort in everything they've  ever recorded.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: You did it on November 16, 2017, 04:44:35 AM
I have no idea what I'd put at the moment.

(Gerard) Grisey and (Richard) Barrett are the only two that pop to mind that I don't have second thoughts on.

Medieval and Renaissance music have taken a turn for me (having been really into it at one stage this year).


Gotta gel over this longer  ::)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: vandermolen on November 16, 2017, 08:50:33 AM
Here we go, again ( ::))

Miaskovsky
Vaughan Williams
Bax
Shostakovich
Tubin
Braga Santos
Copland
Atterberg
Arnold
Sibelius

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: You did it on November 20, 2017, 01:29:08 AM
At the current, it is looking like:

Messiaen
Grisey
Stockhausen

Then the rest to varying extents:

Zorn
Stravinsky
Webern
Ives
Barrett
Varese
Scriabin

So it's all prett 20th/21st century right now, I've gone off early (Medieval/Renaissance) and romantic music lately.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: The One on January 22, 2018, 04:23:36 AM

Top 18 would have been a lot easier
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on January 22, 2018, 04:28:28 AM
  • Bach
  • Beethoven
  • Brahms
  • Chopin
  • Dvorak
  • Haydn
  • Mozart
  • Schubert
  • Tchaikovsky
  • Vivaldi

Top 18 would have been a lot easier

Welcome to our impossible polls!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: The One on January 22, 2018, 04:32:44 AM
Welcome to our impossible polls!

There are a lot of comparative listeners here. I wonder why there aren't any polls for recordings
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on January 22, 2018, 05:01:30 AM
There are a lot of comparative listeners here. I wonder why there aren't any polls for recordings

Sometimes there are blind listening galas.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on January 22, 2018, 05:04:25 AM
There are a lot of comparative listeners here. I wonder why there aren't any polls for recordings

There are definitely some polls for the favourite recordings of certain works, and then there's the GMG Members' Personal Essentials Lists (http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,17174.0.html) thread.

Sometimes there are blind listening galas.
And that, too.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: The One on January 22, 2018, 05:09:59 AM
There are definitely some polls for the favourite recordings of certain works, and then there's the GMG Members' Personal Essentials Lists (http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,17174.0.html) thread.
Doesn't serve the same purpose I think.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on January 22, 2018, 05:11:44 AM
Doesn't serve the same purpose I think.
Oh, indeed not.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: The One on January 22, 2018, 05:15:17 AM
Oh, indeed not.
I have started one. Let's see if it is meaningful or at least if it helps to lead to a proper one with feedbacks
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on January 22, 2018, 05:52:27 AM
Doesn't serve the same purpose I think.


Get it started, then!  :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on January 22, 2018, 06:24:58 AM
Let’s see what today’s ‘Top 10’ looks like:

(In no particular order) -

Shostakovich
Sibelius
Bartók
Stravinsky
Nielsen
Vaughan Williams
Debussy
Ives
Martinů
Szymanowski
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on January 22, 2018, 07:11:23 AM
Let’s see what today’s ‘Top 10’ looks like:

(In no particular order) -

Shostakovich
Sibelius
Bartók
Stravinsky
Nielsen
Vaughan Williams
Debussy
Ives
Martinů
Szymanowski

I found this cool portrait of Delius.

(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/Plo3ZehyeqQ/maxresdefault.jpg)

OOPS. Thought this was "Pictures I like"
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ritter on January 22, 2018, 07:48:31 AM
I found this cool portrait of Delius.

(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/Plo3ZehyeqQ/maxresdefault.jpg)

OOPS. Thought this was "Pictures I like"
I momentarily mistook the portrait for one of Villa-Lobos... ;D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on January 22, 2018, 10:53:18 AM
1. Beethoven
2. Dvorak
3. Schubert
4. Haydn
5. Ravel
6. Janacek
7. Berlioz
8. Chopin
9. Brahms
10. Martinu

My list turns over a whole lot less than MI's does!

Rachmaninov, Tchaikovsky, Bruckner, Mahler, and Sibelius are among some of the big names lurking in 11-20.
no change! Scarlatti is now also in the 11-20 range.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on January 22, 2018, 11:10:26 AM
Scarlatti is now also in the 11-20 range.

Good.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: André on January 22, 2018, 11:49:23 AM
Not even trying a comparison with any earlier list. Let’s see... In no particular order:

Reger
Delius
Elgar
Beethoven
J.S. Bach
Haydn
Prokofiev
Wagner
Bruckner
Arnold

Schubert, Verdi, Vaughan-Williams are busy fighting for a place on the list. Actually, places #  11-20 are a more interesting contest IMO  :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: amw on January 23, 2018, 12:49:40 AM
There are a lot of comparative listeners here. I wonder why there aren't any polls for recordings
Hmm, good idea. I'll do one for something where I know more about the recordings
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Christo on January 23, 2018, 12:58:55 AM
Probably posted some list here before, but today they are, in alphabetical order:

Arnold
Barber
Bate
Berkeley (père)
Braga Santos
Brian
Cooke
Dvořák
Falla
Guarnieri
Gershwin
Holmboe
Holst
Janáček
Kinsella
Nielsen
Pierné
Ravel
Respighi
Shostakovich
Tubin
Vaughan Williams
Villa-Lobos (to make it ten  ;))

Edit: forgot to mention my rising star:  Hindemith  :)
Another star risen since 2015: Tournemire  8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on January 23, 2018, 07:42:53 PM
Let’s see what today’s ‘Top 10’ looks like:

(In no particular order) -

Shostakovich
Sibelius
Bartók
Stravinsky
Nielsen
Vaughan Williams
Debussy Ravel
Ives
Martinů
Szymanowski

I got to thinking about this particular list and, while it would be quite difficult, especially at this moment, to drop and replace anyone on this list, I have to drop Debussy and replace him with Ravel for a few reasons: 1. Daphnis et Chloé is one of the most magnificent pieces ever composed IMHO and has been a constant in my life for the past eight years, 2. I love L'enfant et les sortilèges and only merely like Debussy's Pelléas et Mélisande, 3. Trois poèmes de Mallarmé!, and 4. Ravel’s two PCs, like Daphnis, are two of my favorite pieces that have been in my mind since I first heard them. I still love Debussy’s chamber music dearly, but, outside of his chamber music and a few select orchestral works, he doesn’t quite entice me the same way Ravel’s music has. So sorry Claude! :-\
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: SymphonicAddict on January 23, 2018, 08:54:57 PM
Right now, in alphabetical order:

Beethoven
Brahms
Dvorák
Nielsen
Prokofiev
Respighi
Saint-Saëns
Shostakovich
Tchaikovsky
Vaughan Williams
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on January 23, 2018, 11:18:08 PM
Currently Wagner and Strauss for me
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Josquin13 on January 24, 2018, 02:10:19 AM
My top ten:

Josquin Desprez
Guillaume Dufay
J.S.Bach
G.F. Handel
F. J. Haydn
W.A. Mozart
L.V. Beethoven
Claude Debussy
Maurice Ravel
Jean Sibelius

My 10 additional favorites (11-20): Ockeghem, Machaut, Ciconia, Tallis, Byrd, Prokofiev, Lassus, Schumann, Schubert, Mahler.

(21-25--Chopin, Wagner, Brahms, Bruckner, & De Vitry.)

(26-40--Faure, Liszt, Vivaldi, Biber, Monteverdi, Du Caurroy, G. Gabrieli, Obrecht, R. Strauss, Faugues, Dunstable, Stravinsky, Shostakovich, Mendelssohn, Martinu or Binchois.)

 
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: amw on January 24, 2018, 02:21:47 AM
Last couple months primarily:

Mozart
Beethoven
Haydn
Matteo da Perugia (even though I have no idea who he actually is)
Luca Marenzio
Jan Pieterszoon Sweelinck
Chaya Czernowin (again)
Janáček
Bach (mostly the passions though)
Christopher Tye
Brahms string sextets
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Christo on January 24, 2018, 02:44:16 AM
Right now, in alphabetical order:

Beethoven
Brahms
Dvorák
Nielsen
Prokofiev
Respighi
Saint-Saëns
Shostakovich
Tchaikovsky
Vaughan Williams
All personal favourites, except for Brahms (never attuned much to German 19th century Romanticism in general, but love Dvořák!)  ;D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jo498 on January 24, 2018, 05:10:30 AM
Paradoxically, I don't listen to some of my favorites all that much anymore because I spent so many years mostly listening to their music, e.g. Beethoven and Mozart. They are still absolute favorites and I love their music when I hear it.
E.g. since I got the Pro Arte Haydn and the Walcha Bach hpschd boxes before Xmas I listened to both all through within a week or so, subsequently probably another one or two times to the Bach and to another dozen of discs with Bach keyboard works but before that it might have been year or more since I had listened to any Haydn quartet or French suite.
So my favorites boringly stay mostly the same and there is a good chance that a piece by someone around 15-20 like Berlioz or Sibelius will currently receive more listening time than a perennial favorite.

Beethoven
Bach
Mozart
Haydn
Schubert
Brahms
Schumann
Chopin
Handel
Bartok
but the last three are already shaky, could as well be Mahler, Bruckner, Mendelssohn, Dvorak
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on January 24, 2018, 05:38:03 AM
Chopin, shaky?  Jamais!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ritter on January 24, 2018, 07:11:12 AM
I got to thinking about this particular list and, while it would be quite difficult, especially at this moment, to drop and replace anyone on this list, I have to drop Debussy and replace him with Ravel for a few reasons: 1. Daphnis et Chloé is one of the most magnificent pieces ever composed IMHO and has been a constant in my life for the past eight years, 2. I love L'enfant et les sortilèges and only merely like Debussy's Pelléas et Mélisande, 3. Trois poèmes de Mallarmé!, and 4. Ravel’s two PCs, like Daphnis, are two of my favorite pieces that have been in my mind since I first heard them. I still love Debussy’s chamber music dearly, but, outside of his chamber music and a few select orchestral works, he doesn’t quite entice me the same way Ravel’s music has. So sorry Claude! :-\
I thought Jeux would have (or actually had)  tipped the balance in Claude de France's favour...but no  :(. Still, you give perfectly legitimate reasons to prefer one composer over the other (even if I do  not share them   ;) ).

Good day, John!  :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Spineur on January 24, 2018, 07:14:07 AM
These lists are very undesirable, because of their exclusive nature.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: The One on January 24, 2018, 07:20:04 AM
These lists are very undesirable, because of their exclusive nature.

I think they are very desirable, because of their inclusive nature. :) Please, no offense
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on January 24, 2018, 09:56:07 AM
These lists are very undesirable, because of their exclusive nature.

By marrying the woman you married, you excluded all other women.

By choosing the profession you chose, you excluded all other professions.

Just saying.



Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Spineur on January 24, 2018, 10:05:26 AM
By marrying the woman you married, you excluded all other women.

You must  be kidding !!  You are talking to a frenchman

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on January 24, 2018, 10:13:15 AM
You must  be kidding !!  You are talking to a frenchman

Your reputation is greatly exaggerated.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: André on January 24, 2018, 01:17:56 PM
I got to thinking about this particular list and, while it would be quite difficult, especially at this moment, to drop and replace anyone on this list, I have to drop Debussy and replace him with Ravel for a few reasons: 1. Daphnis et Chloé is one of the most magnificent pieces ever composed IMHO and has been a constant in my life for the past eight years, 2. I love L'enfant et les sortilèges and only merely like Debussy's Pelléas et Mélisande, 3. Trois poèmes de Mallarmé!, and 4. Ravel’s two PCs, like Daphnis, are two of my favorite pieces that have been in my mind since I first heard them. I still love Debussy’s chamber music dearly, but, outside of his chamber music and a few select orchestral works, he doesn’t quite entice me the same way Ravel’s music has. So sorry Claude! :-\

+ 1

I admire Debussy (a lot), but I abandon myself to Ravel  :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sergeant Rock on January 24, 2018, 01:24:33 PM
You must  be kidding !!  You are talking to a frenchman

 ;D :D ;D

Sarge
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on January 24, 2018, 05:31:50 PM
These lists are very undesirable, because of their exclusive nature.

It's okay, you're still allowed to read other lists.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on January 24, 2018, 05:45:11 PM
I thought Jeux would have (or actually had)  tipped the balance in Claude de France's favour...but no  :(. Still, you give perfectly legitimate reasons to prefer one composer over the other (even if I do not share them   ;) ).

Good day, John!  :)

G’day to you, Rafael. I hope everything is well with you. Yeah, you know I do love Claude, but the balance was tipped in Ravel’s favor for the afore mentioned reasons. But, you know, we certainly can’t control what we like --- we just have to accept what are ears happen to be drawn to. :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on January 24, 2018, 05:46:36 PM
+ 1

I admire Debussy (a lot), but I abandon myself to Ravel  :D

Can’t argue with this! ;D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: kyjo on January 25, 2018, 09:21:28 PM
+ 1

I admire Debussy (a lot), but I abandon myself to Ravel  :D

+1  8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Undersea on January 25, 2018, 11:42:45 PM
At the moment:

Bach
Beethoven
Shostakovich
Prokofiev
Tchaikovsky
Sibelius
Chopin
Brahms
Mendelssohn
Debussy

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on January 27, 2018, 04:45:41 AM
In chronological order:

Bach, J.S.
Haydn
Beethoven
Chopin
Brahms
Dvorak
Faure
Rachmaninov
Ravel
Holmboe

I think this is the only previous attempt I've made. Today I came up with:

Haydn
Beethoven
Chopin
Schumann
Brahms
Dvorak
Faure
Sibelius
Ravel
Holmboe
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: schnittkease on February 01, 2018, 09:18:22 PM
....Today I came up with:

Haydn
Beethoven
Chopin
Schumann
Brahms
Dvorak
Faure
Sibelius
Ravel
Holmboe

You chopped off Bach!?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on February 02, 2018, 12:02:50 AM
Yes.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Christo on February 02, 2018, 02:45:26 AM
Yes.
Ohno! #onewordposts  ;D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on February 02, 2018, 02:50:01 AM
Ohno! #onewordposts  ;D

I need Karl to be here so he can ( *chortle* ) at that..........

Well I certainly chortled anyway. ;D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on February 02, 2018, 03:47:57 AM
I need Karl to be here so he can ( *chortle* ) at that..........

Well I certainly chortled anyway. ;D

Thanks for serving as back-up!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on February 02, 2018, 08:42:56 AM
Today's list, arranged chronologically

1-3    Mozart, Schubert, Chopin

4-5    Haydn, Beethoven

6-10  Mendelssohn, Schumann, Brahms, Tchaikovsky, Rachmaninoff

Didn't compare it with my previous list but I think Mendelssohn displaced JS Bach.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Christo on February 02, 2018, 08:49:23 AM
Mendelssohn displaced JS Bach.
Sibelius
You chopped off Bach!?
Yes.
Bach chopped off twice, and being replaced by Mendelssohn & Sibelius. Sic transit gloria mundi.  ;D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on February 02, 2018, 09:11:29 AM
Bach chopped off twice, and being replaced by Mendelssohn & Sibelius. Sic transit gloria mundi.  ;D

Nothing personal from my part, though. He's on my top 11-25 together with two of his sons.  :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: LKB on February 02, 2018, 09:12:52 AM
Yet another worthwhile thread discovered!  8)

The result has been somewhat unexpected. Rather than ruminating over my personal" top ten ", l've been sitting here in my favorite cafe thinking about how my musical preferences and priorities have changed over the last forty years or so.

Should the list reflect my estimation of a given composer's technical prowess, or his/her overall contribution to the advancement or evolution of serious Western music?

Or perhaps the parameters should be widened to encompass the artistic contributions to society in general, compositional efforts to move our species forward: Alle Menschen werden Brueder...

But the simple fact is that I'm not qualified to measure any artist's value to society at large, since my personal expertise is strictly limited to composing, performing and enjoying music. That makes things much simpler, and the question becomes, " Which composers have the greatest value for me today? "

On that basis, the list for today is:

Mahler
Beethoven
Bruckner
Tchaikovsky
J.S. Bach
Vaughan Williams
Schubert
Haydn
Shostakovich
Prokofiev

With an apologetic nod to Mozart, Schumann, Rachmaninoff, Vivaldi and Handel,

LKB
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: André on February 02, 2018, 12:48:12 PM
Yet another worthwhile thread discovered!  8)

The result has been somewhat unexpected. Rather than ruminating over my personal" top ten ", l've been sitting here in my favorite cafe thinking about how my musical preferences and priorities have changed over the last forty years or so.

Should the list reflect my estimation of a given composer's technical prowess, or his/her overall contribution to the advancement or evolution of serious Western music?

Or perhaps the parameters should be widened to encompass the artistic contributions to society in general, compositional efforts to move our species forward: Alle Menschen werden Brueder...

But the simple fact is that I'm not qualified to measure any artist's value to society at large, since my personal expertise is strictly limited to composing, performing and enjoying music. That makes things much simpler, and the question becomes, " Which composers have the greatest value for me today? "

On that basis, the list for today is:

Mahler
Beethoven
Bruckner
Tchaikovsky
J.S. Bach
Vaughan Williams
Schubert
Haydn
Shostakovich
Prokofiev

With an apologetic nod to Mozart, Schumann, Rachmaninoff, Vivaldi and Handel,

LKB

Beautiful !

Now, regarding Mozart, don’t forget he was Tchaikovsky’s favourite composer... :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on February 02, 2018, 01:37:21 PM
Bach chopped off twice, and being replaced by Mendelssohn & Sibelius. Sic transit gloria mundi.  ;D
I had two changes, not one. Don’t go blaming Sibelius, I expect Schumann was the real culprit.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: LKB on February 02, 2018, 03:35:21 PM
Beautiful !

Now, regarding Mozart, don’t forget he was Tchaikovsky’s favourite composer... :D

My respect for WAM is very great. In terms of sheer talent, only J.S. Bach ( imho ) seems to be at the same level.

So why does Bach have more value for me? Maybe it's the accessibility of his artistic process. You can hear the math in Bach, and while his use of sequences makes for short-term predictability, his structural planning is so mighty that by the time l reach the end of one of his major works, l experience the same sort of fulfillment which is provided by  Bruckner.

As for Mozart ( with whom l have spent a fair amount of time both performing and listening ), the music flows so naturally and beautifully, that l have trouble connecting. I need struggle, tension and a sense of victory or defeat in my music; with Mozart it just isn't there, at least not in the amounts required to keep me engaged.

LKB
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on February 02, 2018, 05:05:34 PM
Guillaume de Machaut (1300)
Guillaume Dufay (1397)
Johannes Ockeghem (1425)
Josquin des Prez (1450)
Matthaeus Pipelare (1450)
Giovanni Pierluigi da Palestrina (1525)
Tomás Luis de Victoria, (1548)
Maurice Duruflé (1902)
John Cage (1912)
Morton Feldman (1926)
Arvo Pärt (1935)

Nice to see Arvo on your list, David. 8) He wasn’t on there previously was he?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: André on February 02, 2018, 05:43:09 PM
My respect for WAM is very great. In terms of sheer talent, only J.S. Bach ( imho ) seems to be at the same level.

So why does Bach have more value for me? Maybe it's the accessibility of his artistic process. You can hear the math in Bach, and while his use of sequences makes for short-term predictability, his structural planning is so mighty that by the time l reach the end of one of his major works, l experience the same sort of fulfillment which is provided by  Bruckner.

As for Mozart ( with whom l have spent a fair amount of time both performing and listening ), the music flows so naturally and beautifully, that l have trouble connecting. I need struggle, tension and a sense of victory or defeat in my music; with Mozart it just isn't there, at least not in the amounts required to keep me engaged.

LKB

Very good arguments, sensibly reasoned. So we share 7 out of 10 composers. Not bad !
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Papy Oli on February 03, 2018, 01:37:04 AM
Top Tier

Mahler
Beethoven
Bruckner
Haydn (new addition to that tier)
Vivaldi (new addition to that tier)

Second tier

D. Scarlatti
Chopin
Rameau
Pärt
Bach
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Undersea on February 03, 2018, 02:14:37 AM
Haven't listened to Arvo Pärt in a long time - he was actually one of the first Composers of Classical Music I was interested in and this was the first Disc of his I bought for myself:



I think I am a bit tired of the minimalist/ambient aesthetic these days though.


Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Christo on February 04, 2018, 09:10:59 AM
I had two changes, not one. Don’t go blaming Sibelius, I expect Schumann was the real culprit.
Barter Bach for Schumann?!??  ??? >:D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on February 04, 2018, 09:31:41 AM
My previous list:

Shostakovich
Sibelius
Bartók
Stravinsky
Nielsen
Vaughan Williams
Ravel
Ives
Martinů
Szymanowski

Now, let's see if I can actually put my list in some kind of order:

Ravel
Bartók
Sibelius
Nielsen
Shostakovich
Vaughan Williams
Stravinsky
Ives
Martinů
Szymanowski
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on February 04, 2018, 04:08:56 PM
Boulez
Wagner
Strauss
Neuwirth
Ferneyhough
Hölszky
Elgar
Risset
Mozart
L. Boulanger


I think that basically sums up my interests in music at the moment.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Ken B on February 05, 2018, 01:49:11 PM

Didn't compare it with my previous list but I think Mendelssohn displaced JS Bach.

Jeez Louise! How about a trigger warning before you say anything so terrifying?

 ;) :laugh:
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Baron Scarpia on February 05, 2018, 02:00:19 PM
Boulez
Wagner
Strauss
Neuwirth
Ferneyhough
Hölszky
Elgar
Risset
Mozart
L. Boulanger


I think that basically sums up my interests in music at the moment.

Which Strauss?

Half of your list I've never heard a note of.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: bwv 1080 on February 05, 2018, 02:21:54 PM
almost all Germans at the moment

Bach
Mozart
Beethoven
Sor
Schumann
Mahler
Webern
Hindemith
Henze
Carter


Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on February 05, 2018, 03:44:52 PM
Which Strauss?

Half of your list I've never heard a note of.


Richard Strauss. Although I have enjoyed a bit of Johann the younger recently too. :)

Hölszky is my favourite composer of choral music, a genre I think is a little bit neglected in favour of opera, orchestral and chamber.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: amw on February 05, 2018, 06:17:18 PM
I just made a list and I guess it still stands, but honestly the only music I'm really listening to is Mozart. Everything else is alright but I have very limited patience for it.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Christo on February 05, 2018, 11:10:04 PM
Didn't compare it with my previous list but I think Mendelssohn displaced JS Bach.
Sang the Elias recently, now doing the Matthäus Passion; doesn't feel like a regression.  8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on February 06, 2018, 01:35:32 AM
Jeez Louise! How about a trigger warning before you say anything so terrifying?

 ;) :laugh:

You can find some comfort and hope here:

(https://stream.org/wp-content/uploads/Princeton-University-_Henn-1024x688-compressed.jpg)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on February 06, 2018, 01:38:24 AM
Sang the Elias recently, now doing the Matthäus Passion; doesn't feel like a regression.  8)

Who said anything about reggression?
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on February 06, 2018, 04:42:21 AM
Jeez Louise! How about a trigger warning before you say anything so terrifying?

 ;) :laugh:

(* chortle *)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jamie on February 06, 2018, 12:55:12 PM
An entirely different list to one I might have written a year ago, six months ago, ah well...

Debussy
Haydn
Stravinsky
Beethoven
Schumann
Ravel
Mahler
Sibelius
Tchaikovsky
Dvorak

and this is too short. Ten is simply not enough.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: SymphonicAddict on February 06, 2018, 08:24:16 PM
An entirely different list to one I might have written a year ago, six months ago, ah well...

Debussy
Haydn
Stravinsky
Beethoven
Schumann
Ravel
Mahler
Sibelius
Tchaikovsky
Dvorak

and this is too short. Ten is simply not enough.

Certainly your list looks interesting, various coincidences with mine btw  :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: k a rl h e nn i ng on February 13, 2018, 06:52:29 AM
[...] Ten is simply not enough.

Aye. Welcome to GMG  :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: North Star on March 27, 2018, 06:42:03 AM
Bach
Beethoven
Chopin
Debussy
Haydn
Janáček
Mozart
Ravel
Sibelius
Stravinsky
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Sammy on March 27, 2018, 07:12:45 AM
Bach
Cabezon
Haydn
Mahler
Mozart
Schubert
Schumann
Scriabin
Shostakovich
Silvestrov
Weinberg

Counting is my specialty!
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on March 29, 2018, 05:50:05 AM
Let’s see if I can try this again:

Debussy
Ravel
Bartók
Stravinsky
Janáček
Ives
Schoenberg
Berg
Martinů
Takemitsu
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jaakko Keskinen on March 29, 2018, 07:09:35 AM
Let’s see if I can try this again:

Debussy
Ravel
Bartók
Stravinsky
Janáček
Ives
Schoenberg
Berg
Martinů
Takemitsu

Sad to see Sibelius gone. :/ But glad to see Debussy prospering.  8)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on March 29, 2018, 07:24:08 AM
Sad to see Sibelius gone. :/

Ah. So that's why my subconscious wailed into the dark.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Mirror Image on March 29, 2018, 07:28:16 AM
Sad to see Sibelius gone. :/ But glad to see Debussy prospering.  8)

Well, there’s several composers that were on my list for many years that have vanished: Sibelius, Nielsen, and Vaughan Williams to give three examples.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: kyjo on April 18, 2018, 08:49:40 PM
Well, there’s several composers that were on my list for many years that have vanished: Sibelius, Nielsen, and Vaughan Williams to give three examples.

 :(
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on April 18, 2018, 09:08:08 PM
Updating my list as of the 19 April 2018

Boulez
Wagner
Mundry
Carter
Berio
Neuwirth
Andre
Barrett (N.)
Hölszky
Rykova
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: ComposerOfAvantGarde on April 18, 2018, 09:11:03 PM
Goodbye Strauss, Ferneyhough, Elgar, Risset, Mozart and Boulanger. I am quite glad that my list has changed once again. I think Rykova is the only different one whose music I have come across only this year rather than one whose music I have known for longer.

Boulez
Wagner
Strauss
Neuwirth
Ferneyhough
Hölszky
Elgar
Risset
Mozart
L. Boulanger


I think that basically sums up my interests in music at the moment.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: amw on April 18, 2018, 11:10:56 PM
Mozart
Beethoven
Haydn
Matteo da Perugia (even though I have no idea who he actually is)
Luca Marenzio
Jan Pieterszoon Sweelinck
Chaya Czernowin (again)
Janáček
Bach (mostly the passions though)
Christopher Tye
Brahms string sextets

Mozart [string quartets/quintets/piano concertos/piano quartets/violin sonatas]
Haydn [string quartets]
Cage [freeman etudes/prepared piano music/sonatas and interludes/string quartet/number pieces]
Donatoni [estratti/rima/souvenir/abyss/le ruisseau sur l'escalier etc]
Kurtág [....concertante/...quasi una fantasia/doppelkonzert/hipartita/kafka-fragmente/joszef attila fragments/scenes from a novel]
Schubert [D840/845/887/929/946/947/959/960]
Saunders (R) [most works but particularly molly's song 3/dichroic seventeen/solitude/fletch/cinnabar/a visible trace/stasis/skin]
Machaut [motets/messe de notre dame/lai de la fonteinne/lai de consolation]
Marenzio [madrigals books 1, 5, 6]
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Moonfish on June 03, 2018, 10:19:37 PM
Let’s see if I can try this again:

Debussy
Ravel
Bartók
Stravinsky
Janáček
Ives
Schoenberg
Berg
Martinů
Takemitsu

My list has changed quite a bit since last time (in no particular order):

Sibelius
RVW
Ravel
Bartok
Stravinsky
Britten
Shostakovich
Nielsen
Prokofiev
Tchaikovsky

John,
Comparing your 2015 list with your 2018 one. I note that almost all the composers on your 2015 list were eliminated. Only Ravel, Bartók and Stravinsky survived.    :(

 :'( :'(   Oh, woe Sibelius!!!    :'( :'(
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: vandermolen on June 03, 2018, 10:36:35 PM
List No. 37b

VW
Miaskovsky
Bruckner
Sibelius
Walton
Tubin
Bax
Shostakovich
Braga Santos
Copland

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: André on June 04, 2018, 05:15:42 PM
Jeffrey, what do you recommend from Braga Santos ? I yet have to hear a note from this composer...  :o


... apart from this disc, which I enjoyed very much indeed if I’m to believe my notes  ::)

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51SHtEXjRQL.jpg)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: kyjo on June 05, 2018, 04:38:03 AM
Jeffrey, what do you recommend from Braga Santos ? I yet have to hear a note from this composer...  :o


... apart from this disc, which I enjoyed very much indeed if I’m to believe my notes  ::)

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51SHtEXjRQL.jpg)

I’m not Jeffrey, but I’m a huge Braga Santos fan as well! Start with his Symphony no. 4 (one of my all-time favorite works), a thrillingly life-affirming work. Then try his symphonies nos. 1-3, which are in a similar style. The Marco Polo recordings (led by conductor Alvaro Cassuto) are all excellent.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: André on June 05, 2018, 04:55:19 AM
Thanks for the tip, Kyjo. Jeffrey will no doubt nod in agreement !  ;)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: kyjo on June 05, 2018, 04:59:42 AM
Thanks for the tip, Kyjo. Jeffrey will no doubt nod in agreement !  ;)

I’m sure he will! ;) Here’s the link to the fantastic recording of the 4th Symphony:

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: vandermolen on June 05, 2018, 05:47:03 AM
Thanks for the tip, Kyjo. Jeffrey will no doubt nod in agreement !  ;)

Absolutely!  :)

I would say symphonies 1,2,3 and 4 and this very nice Naxos CD for starters:

Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Chronochromie on June 07, 2018, 02:36:01 PM
Monteverdi

Rameau

Mozart

Beethoven

Schubert

Berlioz

Debussy

Schoenberg

Messiaen

Ligeti
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on June 07, 2018, 05:22:43 PM
Monteverdi

Rameau

Mozart

Beethoven

Schubert

Berlioz

Debussy

Schoenberg

Messiaen

Ligeti

Interesting and diverse list.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: kyjo on June 12, 2018, 06:00:51 PM
Time to (slightly) update my list:

Atterberg
Sibelius
Dvořák
Shostakovich
Brahms
Braga Santos
Vaughan Williams
Rachmaninoff
Ravel
Hanson

...in some sort of order.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on June 16, 2018, 06:30:27 AM
My list hasn't changed but I'll arrange it differently (by geography, not by order of preference, mind you!):

1. The Viennese Connection: Haydn, Mozart, Beethoven, Schubert, Brahms
2. The German Connection: Mendelssohn, Schumann
3. The Russian Connection: Tchaikovsky, Rachmaninoff
4. The Odd Man Out: Chopin

 :D
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: vandermolen on June 20, 2018, 03:38:28 AM
Time to (slightly) update my list:

Atterberg
Sibelius
Dvořák
Shostakovich
Brahms
Braga Santos
Vaughan Williams
Rachmaninoff
Ravel
Hanson

...in some sort of order.

V much agree although rarely listen to Dvorak and Brahms. My older brother greatly admires both of them.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: flyingdutchman on June 25, 2018, 03:50:37 PM
Tchaikovsky
Dvorak
Smetana
Schumann
Brahms
Mendelssohn
Sibelius
Schubert
Glazunov
Gade
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Jaakko Keskinen on August 28, 2018, 05:57:24 AM
A new list.

Wagner
Debussy
Berlioz
Nobuo Uematsu
John Williams
Puccini
Beethoven
Walton
Sibelius
Rachmaninoff
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: amw on August 28, 2018, 06:59:49 AM
Mozart [string quartets/quintets/piano concertos/piano quartets/violin sonatas]
Haydn [string quartets]
Cage [freeman etudes/prepared piano music/sonatas and interludes/string quartet/number pieces]
Donatoni [estratti/rima/souvenir/abyss/le ruisseau sur l'escalier etc]
Kurtág [....concertante/...quasi una fantasia/doppelkonzert/hipartita/kafka-fragmente/joszef attila fragments/scenes from a novel]
Schubert [D840/845/887/929/946/947/959/960]
Saunders (R) [most works but particularly molly's song 3/dichroic seventeen/solitude/fletch/cinnabar/a visible trace/stasis/skin]
Machaut [motets/messe de notre dame/lai de la fonteinne/lai de consolation]
Marenzio [madrigals books 1, 5, 6]
John Cage - pretty much the same things actually: prepared piano works, string quartet in four parts, number pieces, also some of the early non-prepared piano works and for some reason the organ works?
Domenico Scarlatti - mostly on piano, ideally an 18th century one
Johann Sebastian Bach - cantatas mostly with some harpsichord stuff
Chris Dench - various free stuff he put on his dropbox
Bent Sørensen - choral & chamber music
Guillaume de Machaut - all his stuff (looking into promoting Machaut into a permanent top 10 or 20 position)
Anon. - Ludus Danielis, Las Huelgas Codex, various Sequentia & Alla Francesca albums
Felix Mendelssohn - various compositions written by him between the ages of 16 and 21, also some of the Lieder ohne worte


Overall top 10:
Schumann
Beethoven
Schubert
Bartók
Mozart
Haydn
Dvořák
Brahms
Chopin
Cage
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: vandermolen on August 28, 2018, 08:00:24 AM
Favourites New List:

Vaughan Williams
Miaskovsky
Honegger
Braga Santos
Tubin
Rosenberg
Bax
Moeran
Diamond
Copland

+ Shostakovich  ::)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: SymphonicAddict on September 15, 2018, 12:06:50 PM
My current list:

Brahms
Dvorák
Tchaikovsky
Langgaard
Shostakovich
Puccini (yes, this one!)
VW
Martinu
Tubin
Villa-Lobos

Honorable mentions: Braga Santos and Rosenberg.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on September 15, 2018, 12:25:15 PM
My list of top 10 favorite composers (besides my top 10 favorite composers ---  :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: ) is currently this, in no particular order:

Gabriel Fauré
Moritz Moszkowski
Henri Vieuxtemps
Henri Herz
Pablo de Sarasate
Sergei Bortkiewicz
Luigi Boccherini
Francis Poulenc
Anton Arensky
Enrique Granados




Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Josquin13 on September 15, 2018, 06:16:44 PM
My 10 favorite composers:

1. J.S. Bach
2. Josquin Desprez
3. G.F. Handel
4. Guillaume Dufay
5. W.A. Mozart
6. F.J. Haydn
7. Claude Debussy
8. Maurice Ravel
9. L. V. Beethoven
10. Jean Sibelius

Honorable mention: Corelli, Lassus, Mahler, Schumann, Schubert, Du Caurroy, Prokofiev, Tallis, Byrd, Chopin, Wagner, Bruckner, Biber, Shostakovich, Brahms, & Vivaldi.

My 10 Favorite composers of the post WW2 generation (up to today):

1. Witold Lutoslawski: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oobR6rf_dns&frags=pl%2Cwn
2. Vagn Holmboe: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vz8PuRo8Xyo&frags=pl%2Cwn
3. Joonas Kokkonen: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkPXmUSdwqo&frags=pl%2Cwn
4. Samuel Barber: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oWtgxh34ifo&frags=pl%2Cwn
5. Einojuhani Rautavaara: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a159hrxRiso&frags=pl%2Cwn
6. Harri Vuori: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VrpZMz28fM4&frags=pl%2Cwn
7. Per Nørgard: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RY0F8D6lIkA&frags=pl%2Cwn
8. Robin Holloway: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dk2iSclrwzQ&list=OLAK5uy_kRrj25Hw-_Ub4nKsBymgAnS2sJcN84OPc
9. Paavo Heininen: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SORoR1wO76I&index=5&list=OLAK5uy_kZ1MZd1U-HeJstq4dAG1izXL75aidHfxs&frags=pl%2Cwn
10. Magnus Lindberg:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RqOg-uDSER4&frags=pl%2Cwn
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kLVH2hUbOdY&list=PLfGPNeCLLY6uOHT6z1flVgJOhlF1XG22I

Honorable mention: Messiaen, Dutilleux, Boulez, Part, Peterrsson, Schuman, Ligeti, Penderecki, Tavener, Moody, Knussen, Piston, Rochberg, Persichetti, Nørholm, Harbison, Stout, Glass, Sørenson, Hillborg, McCabe, Sessions, Rorem, Englund, Tüür, Abrahamson, etc..
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Florestan on September 22, 2018, 12:37:29 PM
Henri Herz?!  Beefing up on the Salonstücke, are we?

Charming as they are, I was thinking more about the piano concertos.

And yes, I do think that salon music is just like Schiller's Maria Stuart: besser als ihr Ruf.
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Christo on September 23, 2018, 11:42:26 AM
Favourites that we share are at least
Dvorák
Tchaikovsky
Langgaard
Shostakovich
VW
Martinu
Tubin
Villa-Lobos
Honorable mentions: Braga Santos and Rosenberg.
Vaughan Williams
Honegger
Braga Santos
Tubin
Rosenberg
Moeran
Diamond
+ Shostakovich  ::)
Dvořák
Shostakovich
Braga Santos
Vaughan Williams
Rachmaninoff
Ravel
.... and many more!~ :)
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Madiel on September 29, 2018, 05:06:55 AM
I popped in here just to see whether Sibelius had been on my list, given I'm going through an obsessive phase.

Indeed, he was there at the end of January. I'd completely forgotten the accusations that resulted about him having displaced Bach (though in truth he displaced Rachmaninov instead).  :D

I don't think I'm ready to try a complete revised list. Give me a couple of years...
Title: Re: Your Top 10 Favorite Composers
Post by: Brian on October 02, 2018, 08:06:53 AM