Mahler Mania, Rebooted

[MishaK]

I listened to the first few minutes...... the clips for the Mahler movie where also Haitink, I guess....
i get the impression that his Mahler is lifeless, so I ended up deciding not to check out his symphony cycle.

Your impression is mistaken. This is an approach to Mahler that requires a little more patience. Don't except it to grab you by the throat like Solti. Haitink's Mahler buids very gradually but becomes ever more inevitable and gut wrenching as it nears its climax.

[greg]

Well, I'll give him a shot eventually to see what you're talking about.

[jlaurson]

Well, I'll give him a shot eventually to see what you're talking about.

If and when you do: Stay away from his 8th (turned me off Haitink's Mahler--unjustly, except in this case--for YEARS), indulge in his latest Fourth!

[greg]

Oh, I will. Nice blog, btw.

[imperfection]

I listened to the first few minutes...... the clips for the Mahler movie where also Haitink, I guess....
i get the impression that his Mahler is lifeless, so I ended up deciding not to check out his symphony cycle.
I'm working on getting Bertini's...... have no idea what to expect there, all i hear is "classical approach" as a description... doesn't sound too promising, but why not, huh?

"Lifeless" is definitely not an adjective I would ever imagine of applying to Haitink's Mahler, at least to the BPO performances of the 1st, 2nd, 3rd and 7th I have watched on these excellent sounding DVDs they made:









In fact, I rank these first 3 symphonies among the best I have ever heard (and seen, in this case). The picture and sound quality of these DVDs are mind-blowingly awesome, with a soundstage as deep and impactful as Chailly's 5th on Decca...and that's saying a lot. Any self-respecting Mahlerite ought to give these DVDs an audition, in my opinion. If you want me to go more in-depth and give specifics of the spectacular performances or the recorded sound, let me know, I'll be more than happy to let more people know about this excellent, but perhaps under noticed series.

P.S. Note that all the above performances have nothing to do with the better known Christmas Mahler concerts series (also on DVD) that Haitink had also done. Those ones were done with the Royal Concertgebouw, and these ones were done with the BPO.

[DavidRoss]

If and when you do: Stay away from his 8th (turned me off Haitink's Mahler--unjustly, except in this case--for YEARS), indulge in his latest Fourth!

Well, Jens, almost anyone's eighth is enough to turn most folks off to Mahler!  Ever come across one you love truly, madly, deeply?  BTW, I love   Christine Schäfer, making Haitink's latest 4th nearly self-recommending.  Perhaps I will give it a hearing today.  (I was deeply pleased last night when, in casual discussion with my wife and me, our younger son said something to the effect that the 4th is under-appreciated and that he especially loves the 4th movement...clearly we must have done something right in raising him!)

However, I must take exception to one comment (what? only one?  ) in the capsule review you linked to: "only one Mahler recording issued in 2008 really, truly stands out among the lot."  I guess that means you missed the MTT/SFS DLVDE released last fall. 

[bhodges]

The New York Philharmonic just announced digital downloads of Maazel's Mahler cycle, made from live recordings over the last six years.  Information here.  I was in the audience for Nos. 1, 5 and 6, and enjoyed them very much.  The orchestra certainly played them magnificently. 

--Bruce

[jlaurson]

Well, Jens, almost anyone's eighth is enough to turn most folks off to Mahler!  Ever come across one you love truly, madly, deeply? 

However, I must take exception to one comment (what? only one?  ) in the capsule review you linked to: "only one Mahler recording issued in 2008 really, truly stands out among the lot."  I guess that means you missed the MTT/SFS DLVDE released last fall. 

1.) Yes, absolutely.
Haitink's 8th is not disatisfactory because it's the 8th. It's just not anywhere near the better recordings of this admittedly weird, "garishly divine" symphony.

Yes, I did miss the MTTSFSDLVDE.   
There are not many I missed, but that one I've not yet got.

[Renfield]

The New York Philharmonic just announced digital downloads of Maazel's Mahler cycle, made from live recordings over the last six years.  Information here.  I was in the audience for Nos. 1, 5 and 6, and enjoyed them very much.  The orchestra certainly played them magnificently. 

--Bruce

Interesting!

I still have Maazel's Vienna cycle to listen to (the sole unlistened-to Mahler cycle in my collection), but especially in FLAC, these downloads are enticing. Not to mention this is the only New York Mahler cycle besides the Bernstein, if I'm not mistaken.

Kudos to the NY Phil for the extensive selection of formats and sources.

[Opus106]

Not to mention this is the only New York Mahler cycle besides the Bernstein, if I'm not mistaken.

Well, since you didn't mention a conductor -- no, this is not the only New York Mahler cycle besides Bernstein's. There is this one also.

Okay, it's not a cycle per se. 

[Renfield]

Well, since you didn't mention a conductor

Cheating! It wasn't planned as an intégrale - therefore, it's a collection, not a cycle, even setting aside the conductor bit.

More seriously, that New York box is what I've promised myself I'll get one day, after I've completed my list of currently-available Mahler cycles (still missing Sinopoli, and maybe Solti). It looks like something to cherish. 0:)

[Opus106]

Cheating! It wasn't planned as an intégrale - therefore, it's a collection, not a cycle, even setting aside the conductor bit.

Duly noted.

[PerfectWagnerite]

I also have the Maazel/Vienna cycle...had it for years but still in shrinkwrap. I just can't bring myself to listen to it. For some reason Maazel and Mahler doesn't quite tingle my spine.

My wife almost got me the NYPO (the $225 one) Mahler cycle for Christmas. I caught her trying to order it online and promptly stopped her. It could be pretty nice but for $225 you can get 3 or 4 cycles, or 3 or 4 nice tickets to hear some Mahler.

[greg]

The New York Philharmonic just announced digital downloads of Maazel's Mahler cycle, made from live recordings over the last six years.  Information here.  I was in the audience for Nos. 1, 5 and 6, and enjoyed them very much.  The orchestra certainly played them magnificently. 

--Bruce

Aw, man..... for some reason, when I read "digital dowloads", I thought "free downloads." But it's not...

[DavidRoss]

1.) Yes, absolutely.
Haitink's 8th is not disatisfactory because it's the 8th. It's just not anywhere near the better recordings of this admittedly weird, "garishly divine" symphony.

Yes, I did miss the MTTSFSDLVDE.   
There are not many I missed, but that one I've not yet got.

Okay, Jens, I just ordered a 'like new' copy of Ozawa's Tanglewood 8th.  Like you, I'm a fan of the Nagano recording, and Sinopoli's, and the DGG Bernstein and Kubelik's are also better than most at making this awkward, ambitious monstrosity hang together.  And our tastes coincide closely enough that I'm happy to try discovering whether Ozawa's 8th hangs fire or catches fire.  (I've never heard Abbado's and have heard Wit's only via Naxos streaming.)

And I've cued up Haitink's latest 4th on Rhapsody but haven't thrown the go switch yet. 

[bhodges]

Okay, Jens, I just ordered a 'like new' copy of Ozawa's Tanglewood 8th.  Like you, I'm a fan of the Nagano recording, and Sinopoli's, and the DGG Bernstein and Kubelik's are also better than most at making this awkward, ambitious monstrosity hang together.

No Chailly?  (I haven't heard Nagano, Kubelik, Rattle/Berlin or Ozawa yet.)  Boulez?  Just curious...

--Bruce

[jlaurson]

No Chailly?  (I haven't heard Nagano, Kubelik, Rattle/Berlin or Ozawa yet.)  Boulez?  Just curious...

--Bruce

Nope... Boulez' Eigth is--and this coming from someone who loves, not likes, most of Boulez' Mahler--is by far his weakest of the 9+L (too bad he's not indulged us with a 10th). A really disappointment that I rank not much higher than Rattle. And that's one a pretty low rung of my Mahler-8th ladder. I've avoided passing 'official' judgment on it, so far, because I couldn't believe that I really did find it that lackluster. I'll get back to my comparative listening when the Gergiev 8th arrives. [I mightily fear a suckfest, but hey... surprise me, Gergiev.]

Chailly: Should be so good. But somehow it ain't. Mostly because the Chorus Mysticus stays strangely earthbound. That's the problem with Ozawa. No one... No one can do the Chorus Mysticus satisfactorily once you've heard that recording. 

Chailly, btw., is the conductor I would most love to hear Mahler live with (ahead of Boulez, new-and-improved-Barenboim, even Abbado). But live is not the same as on record. Speaking of live: Daniele Gatti delivered a Mahler 4th recently (with the Munich Phil) that knocked my socks off... it was so fu&*$&ing good that it absolutely, positively needs expletives to get the point across.

[knight66]

Fot the 8th, if Solti is too turbocharged, try Wyn Morris live, if you can get hold of it. The Witt is also VG as is Sinopoli.

Mike

[DavidRoss]

No Chailly?  (I haven't heard Nagano, Kubelik, Rattle/Berlin or Ozawa yet.)  Boulez?  Just curious...

Well, Bruce, you know what a fan I am of both.  Chailly's never quite engaged me and with Boulez I thought that he came closer than most, maybe close enough that I could learn to listen out of real desire to hear it rather than a sense of duty, but that fire didn't catch until I got Nagano's, which seems to be a love it or hate it recording, since which I've not listened to any competing versions but Sinopoli's.  Maybe when the Ozawa disc arrives I'll do a little "competitive" listening.

Of course, since I don't feel that I've ever quite fallen in love with the 8th as I have with the others, I'm hardly the best to judge, and I suspect that if I ever do really fall in love with it, then my feelings toward all of these recordings might change.

[greg]

Fot the 8th, if Solti is too turbocharged, try Wyn Morris live, if you can get hold of it. The Witt is also VG as is Sinopoli.

Mike

I still haven't heard a recording I liked, for sure, more than Solti's 8th (same with the 7th). I suppose they have to be 'turbocharged' for me, or else they're not very exciting.