Mahler Mania, Rebooted

[calyptorhynchus]

Re Boulez's opinion on the third hammer blow, I don't see why the third has to be associated with the same musical material as the first two. It is the charcteristic of hammer blows of fate, after all, to come unexpectedly.

[jlaurson]

Re Boulez's opinion on the third hammer blow, I don't see why the third has to be associated with the same musical material as the first two. It is the charcteristic of hammer blows of fate, after all, to come unexpectedly.

I feel the same way; Boulez' argument is dramatically weak. It is precisely the delayed onset of the third blow that makes it so effective, when used... you expect it at the 'usual' point... then you think, for a brief moment, that maybe everything will be alright after all... that just maybe, yes, perhapKRABBBBBUUUUM!. Oh. Never mind. [Dissipate into nothingness.]

But Boulez and HLdlG are pretty much lockstep on this issue and it's hard to tell who influences whom. I reckon HLdlG influences Boulez more than the other way around.

[EigenUser]

As usual, Boulez's argument is an intellectual one as opposed to a visceral one.

At first I liked the idea of three hammer blows, but now I'm not so sure. People always seem to refer to the 'hero' of the symphony. Perhaps he was so weak by the first two hammer blows that it didn't take a third hammer blow to kill him. Maybe all Bowser had to do was just throw a ball of fire and...

(I AM sorry, but I cannot listen to this movement without thinking about Mario vs. Bowser -- I suspect Greg would understand).

[Leo K.]

Listening to Mahler's 6th Symphony conducted by Mitropoulos/NYPO/1955.

Like Hermann Scherchen and Jascha Horenstein, Mitropoulos manages to be great and sloppy at the same time. Such a great and powerful performance!

[Pat B]

Second listen to Honeck's rarely-discussed first first, with the BBCSO, on a BBC Music Magazine disc.

It's slow, except in the Scherzo (total time is about 58:30 before applause), with more rubato than most. Dynamics are -- well, I'm not doing comparative listening, but I can say they're not understated. That's a good thing in my book. The third movement has less of a klezmer feel than I am accustomed to. The sound is probably about what you'd expect for a 1998 live performance in Royal Festival Hall, not known for spectacular acoustics. The finish is one of the more exciting ones I've heard.

Overall, not a primary recommendation, but an interesting alternative. I found it cheap locally and am glad I did.

[Leo K.]

Second listen to Honeck's rarely-discussed first first, with the BBCSO, on a BBC Music Magazine disc.

It's slow, except in the Scherzo (total time is about 58:30 before applause), with more rubato than most. Dynamics are -- well, I'm not doing comparative listening, but I can say they're not understated. That's a good thing in my book. The third movement has less of a klezmer feel than I am accustomed to. The sound is probably about what you'd expect for a 1998 live performance in Royal Festival Hall, not known for spectacular acoustics. The finish is one of the more exciting ones I've heard.

Overall, not a primary recommendation, but an interesting alternative. I found it cheap locally and am glad I did.

Thanks for the review - I have not heard it yet!

[Cato]

Via Bruckner's Abbey: assorted articles on Mahler and his works are available.


Quote

The abruckner.com website is now the official Internet home of the Bruckner Society of America. The organization has been legally reactivated as a non-profit organization. We are in the process of selecting members to the board of directors and we have completed our first project which was the digitalization of the society's journal, "Chord and Discord" which was published sporadically from 1932 to 1998. Those publications are now available in the Articles section of this website (see below).

Yes, they have scanned all the issues of Chord and Discord, a music journal that was published irregularly.  But, when it arrived, it was full of GREAT STUFF! 

I still have my copies from the 1950's and 1960's.  One of my favorite articles was not on Bruckner per se, but on Mahler's Das Klagende Lied by the great Jack Diether. 

Here is the pdf. link:

http://www.abruckner.com/Data/articles/thebrucknersociety2/1969/1969-c.pdf

And check out the Table of Contents from the 1950 issue!!!  Articles by Robert Simpson, Donald Mitchell, Desmond Taylor, and of course Jack Diether!  Are there things like this around today?

Instinct and Reason in Music - Ernest  M. Lert 1
Mahler's Eighth: The Hymn to Eros - Gabriel Engel 12
All in the Family - Philip Greeley Clapp 33
The Eighth Symphony of Bruckner -  Robert Simpson 42
Mahler's Third in Iowa City  - Charles L. Eble 56
An Introduction to Bruckner's Mass in E Minor - Jack Diether 60
Mahler Eighteen Years Afterward -  Parks Gran  66
The Songs of Alma Mahler  -Warren Storey Smith 74
Bruckner on Records - Herman Adler 79
Some Notes on Gustav Mahler (1860-1911) - Donald Mitchell 86
Bruckner and Mahler in Australia  - Wolfgang Wagner 92
The Length of Mahler - Desmond Shawe Taylor 104
Bruckner's Eighth in Chicago -  Charles L. Eble 107
Music of Gustav Mahler Ranks with the Greatest - Louis Biancolli 113
The Ninth Symphony of Anton Bruckner - Robert Simpson 11
Mahler's Eighth Cheered by 18,000 in Hollywood  - 118
Ovation for Mahler's Second by Tanglewood Audience - 127
American Premiere of Mahler's Tenth  - 129
New York City Opera Company as a National Cultural Institution - 130
A Memorable Elektra - Robert G. Grey 133
Symphonic Chronicle  137
A Memorable Ninth .

See:

http://www.abruckner.com/Data/articles/thebrucknersociety2/1950/1950-c.pdf

[jlaurson]

New Mahler Cycle
Paavo Järvi / Frankfurt RSO

[Cato]

From Stefan Zweig's memoirs The World of Yesterday, in comments about life in Vienna:

All of us who lived there in our youth have brought a stern and implacable standard of artistic performance into our lives from those years.  Those who saw discipline exercised down to the smallest detail at the Opera House under Gustav Mahler, and vitality combined with meticulous accuracy taken as the norm in music played by the Philharmonic, are rarely entirely satisfied with theatrical or musical performances today.

I am reminded of Rachmaninov's comments about his delight in working with Mahler in New York on the former's Third Piano Concerto, because Mahler was so meticulous in examining the score for details and in wanting to rehearse the work until things were just right.

[MishaK]

Jens,

Some of that Järvi/Frankfurt Mahler appears to be up on the HR Sinfoniorchester's youtube channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/hrSinfonieorchester/search?query=mahler

Misha

[jlaurson]

Another new Mahler cycle, it seems: Inbal, Tokyo:
http://www.octavia.co.jp/mahler.html

[Moonfish]

I hope these are good...
Has anybody here read Fischer's biography?


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[jlaurson]

I hope these are good...
Has anybody here read Fischer's biography?

I'm surprised Fischer (an insufferably pompous person) has been translated, but de La Grange not into German (where Fischer's presence might have prevented that for the time being).

I'm biased, because de La Grange is impeccably wonderful in correspondence... but I found that if you are willing to work your way through the massive de La Grange translation, there's nothing that Fischer offers that hasn't been already extolled, except his opinion. He has the advantage of being somewhat more concise, though.

[Moonfish]

I'm surprised Fischer (an insufferably pompous person) has been translated, but de La Grange not into German (where Fischer's presence might have prevented that for the time being).

I'm biased, because de La Grange is impeccably wonderful in correspondence... but I found that if you are willing to work your way through the massive de La Grange translation, there's nothing that Fischer offers that hasn't been already extolled, except his opinion. He has the advantage of being somewhat more concise, though.

Just starting out but Fischer is definitely...errr....very detailed! Could it possibly be the nature of the translation? The first chapter is completely focused on Mahler's body in terms of appearance/s and habits. An unusual approach!
Amazingly, the la Grange series is OOP and the first volume has yet to be republished by Oxford UP. I think I read somewhere that it will (could) happen in 2017. Otherwise these volumes are not exactly affordable so libraries can be a blessing at times.  Did you read the multivolume La Grange biography? Would you recommend any other Mahler biography?

[jlaurson]

Just starting out but Fischer is definitely...errr....very detailed! Could it possibly be the nature of the translation? The first chapter is completely focused on Mahler's body in terms of appearance/s and habits. An unusual approach!
Amazingly, the la Grange series is OOP and the first volume has yet to be republished by Oxford UP. I think I read somewhere that it will (could) happen in 2017. Otherwise these volumes are not exactly affordable so libraries can be a blessing at times.  Did you read the multivolume La Grange biography? Would you recommend any other Mahler biography?

I read La Grange 2-4; I have the old volume 1 which has overlap with the new volume 2, I think? Kindof still waiting for the new and revised volume 1. I find that all that I have read of it, has been essential.

[Moonfish]

I read La Grange 2-4; I have the old volume 1 which has overlap with the new volume 2, I think? Kindof still waiting for the new and revised volume 1. I find that all that I have read of it, has been essential.

Three thousand pages of pure bliss?     

[jlaurson]

Three thousand pages of pure bliss?     

Not a page-turner... but if you have some external motivation that keeps the pages turning, yes, something like that. :-)

What I like about HLdLG is that he gives you an immersion into the time. Rather than focus on Mahler in abstract, he gives you a time and environment in which Mahler could not have been... in other words, we are not as prone as we might otherwise be, to create our Mahler-as-if-today and think of him in present terms, which would be silly.

[Moonfish]

Not a page-turner... but if you have some external motivation that keeps the pages turning, yes, something like that. :-)

What I like about HLdLG is that he gives you an immersion into the time. Rather than focus on Mahler in abstract, he gives you a time and environment in which Mahler could not have been... in other words, we are not as prone as we might otherwise be, to create our Mahler-as-if-today and think of him in present terms, which would be silly.

So a complete culture/time immersion? Perhaps reading these volumes will provide an opportunity to listen through and/or revisit one's Mahler cycles/recordings? I do like biographers that allow the reader to enter a different time and space. Did you by any chance read Fischer's volume?

[jlaurson]

So a complete culture/time immersion? Perhaps reading these volumes will provide an opportunity to listen through and/or revisit one's Mahler cycles/recordings? I do like biographers that allow the reader to enter a different time and space. Did you by any chance read Fischer's volume?

I have peeked at a few chapters in my friend's copy (in German) but did not want to contribute to the book doing well by getting my own copy. Maybe I should have asked for one from the publisher and then just kept mum about it.  But it feels wrong to approach a book as prejudiced as I would have.

[Moonfish]

I have peeked at a few chapters in my friend's copy (in German) but did not want to contribute to the book doing well by getting my own copy. Maybe I should have asked for one from the publisher and then just kept mum about it.  But it feels wrong to approach a book as prejudiced as I would have.

I presume that every Mahler biographer has to tackle his life from a different perspective or by using "new" research to be able to have their own niche in the Mahler universe. I suspect that some of these books can be grueling depending on the perspective and writing style.