Blind Comparison: Ravel's Gaspard de la Nuit

[mc ukrneal]

Its scores for the third movement:

8
10
8.5
10
3.5 - that's you!
9
8
10



Personally, I like the performance a lot but feels it lacks a little bit of wildness and darkness which you can find more prominently in, say, 1 or 13 or Pogo. I'd probably give it an 8 myself.

I'm an outlier!

[Sergeant Rock]

I'm an outlier!

And not only in this comparison! 

Sarge

[mc ukrneal]

And not only in this comparison! 

Sarge

Nice one!

[MishaK]

OK. I'm afraid I didn't have the optimum surroundings for listening and was interrupted quite a bit, so FWIW here are my Scarbo verdicts.

1. No complaints apart from sound quality which makes the playing sound more muddled than it is. What was still fine for Ondine unfortunately renders bits of Scarbo unintelligible though it's still clear from the recording that it's not the pianist's pedaling that's causing this. Rhythmically superb. Wonderful drama, spontaneity and atmosphere.  9

3. Nicely economical use of pedal, great virtuosity. This is quite a different way of doing this, but I think it works very well nonetheless. Fine dynamic control. Very well articulated and rhythmically differentiated. Perhaps a tad too careful and pretty. Could hang together a bit better. Nice buildup to the final climax. But altogether excellent interpretation and great pianism. 7.5

10. Again similar to 1. More restrained, however, not as spontaneous and willing to let loose. Remarkable precision for a live occasion. 7.5

13. Remarkable dynamic control. Very free phrasing. A few slightly imprecise spots though. Very good and atmospheric but doesn't quite bowl me over. The part that starts around 7:20 starts unnaturally slow. But the intensity after that is very good. 7

14. Wow dares to play at a faster tempo and with what kind of precision and perfect dynamics! Remarkable performance. 8.5

17. Very well played but doesn't quite hang together as well as the others. A bit episodic at first, though the last two minutes are handled magnificently. 6.5

19. Very spontaneous and impulsive, but with a completely coherent narrative. Not as "clean" and virtuosic. Great risk taking. A number of sloppy spots and quite a few wrong notes. But what energy! Intense performance. Really makes you sweat. Would love to have witnessed this live even though as a recording it is not ideal. Still: 8.5

PS: I can now see why you kept "hyping" 19. That Scarbo is amazing, even if the first two movements didn't really convince me.

[Brian]

Heh, guess I'll listen to 19 again... I included it for the Gibet!  0:)

[Brian]

LAST CHANCE TO VOTE
RESULTS IN 24 HOURS

And if you don't mind, we'll eschew the run-off finale considering the entire work all at once. Pianist #17 has won a decisive victory over the competition; only pianist #14 comes close.

OVERALL LEADERBOARD
#....Ondine....Le Gibet....Scarbo...Total....Overall Rank
1....8.20........6.53........6.83......21.56...third
3....7.25........6.94........7.28......21.47...fifth
10..7.50........7.38........6.67......21.55...fourth
13..7.75........6.58........6.89......21.22...sixth
14..8.50........7.00........7.77......23.27...second
17..8.13........8.75........8.17......25.05...FIRST
19..7.38........6.75........6.28......20.41...seventh

[Brian]

Two notes before we start with the results show.
1. First you'll see the results for "Scarbo." At the very bottom, I've tabulated overall results based on all three movements, so the bottom of the post has the "final standings". The top two pianists are the same as the top two for "Scarbo" by itself.
2. As I mentioned previously, the #1 pianist is a runaway winner, of sorts, placing first in two of three movements and beating out #2 by a wide margin. So, we'll crown a winner right here and declare the game finished!

RESULTS: "Scarbo"

A word about the scores offered: these are averages on a scale of 1-10 across all voters! Each pianist received 9 votes.

Without further ado...

Seventh place: Pianist #19 (6.277)

"That Scarbo is amazing" "Not as "clean" and virtuosic. Great risk taking....Really makes you sweat." "Pianist is keen on control, which is impressive, though some playing sounds mannered." "more formal than mischievous" "Seems out of control sometimes" "some scary sounds, but felt a bit rushed." "Some very impressive technique, but doesn't sound as if at home in Ravelian spirit, lack of refinement" "Fast, lacks some nuances" "Not very virtuosic." "too upright, straightforward"

The pianist who provided the fastest of our seven Scarbos is...


CLAUDIO ARRAU
live, May 20, 1963

According to Claudio Arrau's discography, the pianist recorded "Ondine" and "Le gibet" for Columbia in 1949, and broadcast tapes survive of the complete Gaspard from this concert in Italy and exactly one other concert, in Norway on August 22, 1962. According to this site, concert programs attest to six years in which Arrau performed Gaspard.

Although the Ermitage label once released this performance on CD, it is now almost impossible to find, and I found the recording (by mistake) on YouTube.

Sixth place: Pianist #10 (6.666)

"not as spontaneous and willing to let loose" "dull" "very haunting, mysterious opening.... Not as structurally compelling, nor with the urgent excitement I expect" "I couldn't find anything here that stood out from the crowd." "Wonderful! This one gets the mischief down" "much of the playing borders on stiff" "thoughtful and restrained but committed, great virtuosity in service to an active intelligence, judicious timing"

Pianist #10 is...

[asin]B00005A8FG[/asin]

ARTURO BENEDETTI MICHELANGELI
live, June 30, 1959, London

What can I say? A great recording. But we found five we liked better, starting with...

Fifth place: Pianist #1 (6.833)

"Rhythmically superb. Wonderful drama, spontaneity and atmosphere." "not malevolent or mischievous enough.  Could have been more intense" "boy is he (or she) in total control - very well disciplined. I was riveted." "terrifying and suspenseful sound" "much drama and a sinister atmosphere" "lacking menace" "Tune often lost. Feels like it runs out of steam." "nothing subtle about it"

Pianist #1 is...

[asin]B009AE7186[/asin]

ARTURO BENEDETTI MICHELANGELI
live, May 22, 1960, Prague

Double 'Detti! And recorded live in the same city just 11 months apart. MishaK noticed that the two Michelangeli recordings were the same pianist very early on in the competition, and Michelangeli's readings got similar scores on nearly every ballot. Ironically, it was MishaK who broke the tie between these two Michelangelis - before his, the last vote, they had identical scores.

NOTE: If you can find a different CD version of this performance, consider buying that one instead. The Praga disc couples Gaspard to a shamelessly, obviously pirated copy of the EMI piano concerto recording. I mean, unless that EMI concerto is somehow out of copyright, but I doubt that.

Fourth place: Pianist #13 (6.888)

"Remarkable dynamic control. Very free phrasing." "plenty of menace in this one, even violence" "Overall, this takes a very dark, aggressive take which I like very much." "the sound was too bright and splashy" "Overly dramatic at times" "Seems too straight-forward much of the time" "Love the rhythmic sensitivity, the slight syncopation, the clarity, the full tones, the sustained low tones, the dreaminess, the building tensions" "tempos generally quite slow. Shame piano is horribly out of tune. Really bashes many of the notes. Dynamics don't have much range. Not much sensitivity. Not a fan of this at all."

Pianist #13 is...

[asin]B000001K24[/asin]
ABBEY SIMON

Another all-time great performance and one of my personal favorite Scarbos.

Third place: Pianist #3 (7.277)

"Overtly virtuosic.  Mischievous, almost menacing, and energetic" "is this Ravel? It seems somehow missing that atmospheric coloring that we associate with Ravel, rather it is more modern sounding in its approach" "a great manic and frenzy dance" "I love the great surges of colour built by the very fast crescendos!" "virtuosic, dramatic, great buildup. All in all, superb!" "Feel like pianist is a little too obsessed with technique at expense of communicating structure." "spontaneous, effortless, inhabiting the music, inherently dramatic"

Pianist #3 is...

[asin]B0000041ZK[/asin]

JEAN-YVES THIBAUDET

In the battle of the Jean-Hyphens, Thibaudet beats Bavouzet with another unique, remarkable Gaspard (but unique and remarkable in different, and evidently more popular, ways).

Second place: Pianist #14 (7.777)

"dares to play at a faster tempo and with what kind of precision and perfect dynamics!" "Great tone, touch, dynamics and virtuosity, but not over-the-top" "Great energy, full of thrill and menace" "nice sense of character. If it had more contrast and mood, I would have score it higher" "what a joy to listen to this one" "lost a bit of momentum" "Tending toward prim and proper playfulness" "More gorgeous tones but a little soft and even slushy" "a bit lacking in charisma, colour and character."

Pianist #14 is...

[asin]B0000942JN[/asin]

MICHAEL ENDRES

Wow! I'm surprised, and I presume you are too. Endres, admired for his Schubert and Mozart, is our unexpected silver medalist. But is he as unexpected as the pianist who's won it all?

FIRST PLACE: Pianist #17

"perfectly judged pauses.  Superb dynamic control, plenty of attention to detail, excellent independence of hands, great forward momentum." "Pauses in the middle are too long again - loses momentum and does not add to the tension, just misjudged by a bit. And from there on, it was not as interesing (lost all the magic in the climaxes). I can see why this may have been a popular choice, as the pianist is a marvelous player, but I think he/she makes too many problematic decisions "  "Very colourful and good phrasing. The sound is a bit too pretty though, and not scary enough." "quite exciting with good fluency and great Ravelian grandeur" "contrasts, virtuosity, and playfulness" "damned near faultless: articulation, tone, timing, incredible virtuosity coupled with extraordinary musical judgment, bell-like clarity against effortless dreaminess" "Not as virtuosic & fast as some performances, but by far the best so far. Great phrasing." "doesn't quite hang together as well as the others. A bit episodic at first"

Over the course of this competition, eleven ratings of "10" were awarded to a performance. Five of those eleven were awarded to Pianist #17. Of course, three of those five were awarded by Todd, who thus gave this pianist a remarkable perfect score, 30 out of 30.

Pianist #17 and Michelangeli 1960 were the only competitors to receive multiple 10s in a round, and Pianist #17 and Michelangeli 1960 were the only competitors to receive 10s from more than one judge.

And finally, there's the issue of almost nobody disliking pianist #17. Neal gave its Scarbo a 3.5, but its next-lowest score, in the entire competition, was a 6; just three ballots all game long rated pianist #17 below a score of 7. The number of sub-7 scores this pianist got from the group is the same as the number of 10s (s)he got... from Todd.

Pianist #17 is...

[asin]B004K4T6DO[/asin]
STEVEN OSBORNE

Whoa. Raise your hand if you predicted the pianist to outlast Argerich, Pogorelich, Bavouzet, Casadesus and Francois and then best Michelangeli, Michelangeli again, and Abbey Simon in head-to-head combat, all while earning only one failing vote out of 20... would be Steven Osborne, born in 1963 and recorded in 2010.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

OVERALL LEADERBOARD
Name...................Ondine....Le Gibet....Scarbo.....Total....Overall Rank
Arrau..................7.38........6.75........6.28......20.41.....seventh
Simon.................7.75........6.58........6.89......21.22.....sixth
Michelangeli 59....8.20........6.53........6.67......21.40.....fifth
Thibaudet............7.25........6.94........7.28......21.47.....fourth
Michelangeli 60....7.50........7.38........6.83......21.71.....third
Endres................8.50........7.00........7.77......23.27.....second
Osborne..............8.13........8.75........8.17......25.05.....FIRST

RANKINGS IN EACH MOVEMENT
Name...................Ondine......Le Gibet....Scarbo....overall
Arrau...................ninth..........fifth........seventh....seventh
Simon..................fifth...........sixth........fourth......sixth
Michelangeli 59....seventh...seventh.....fifth.......fifth
Thibaudet.............tenth........fourth........third....fourth
Michelangeli 60....third........second........fifth......third
Endres.................first.........third........second....second
Osborne..............fourth........first........first.......first

(In Ondine, Pogorelich ranked second, Bavouzet sixth, and Schuch eighth.)

[Todd]

Well, it looks like I'll be buying Osborne's Ravel.  Sure shows more promise than his Debussy.  Good to see Endres make such a strong showing.

[Dancing Divertimentian]

Cool, the results are in.

I'm happy to see my fave - Thibaudet - earn the bronze. I've raved about his Gaspard in the past. Too bad his set is so expensive now (outside of an Arkiv burn).

[DavidRoss]

Unlike Todd, I like Osborne's Debussy Preludes very much. I also like his Rachmaninoff Preludes. I sampled his Ravel on the hyperion site not long ago, but chose his stablemate, Hewitt, instead. (And Bavouzet.) Nice to see my old standby, Abbey Simon, do well. (No wonder it sounded so right to my ears!) Only 0.01 point separates him from Thibaudet. It's not surprising that Michelangeli fared well. The BBC disc is a benchmark performance.

On the other hand, Endres is a surprise, though I wasn't wowed enough to want it.

Too bad Hewitt and Rogé weren't included.  Guess I'll have to do my own comparison at home! 

Thanks, Brian, for setting this up. It rekindled my love for Ravel and increased my appreciation of this piece very much.  Given my short attention span, something has to be pretty darned good to hold my interest through so many repeated hearings!

[MishaK]

Nice work everyone. Never heard Osborne, Simon or Endres before in any repertoire. Will have to check these guys out. That's the wonderful thing about music: there can always be a performer out there who you've never heard of who has poured his or her heart and soul into one work and is more than ready to take on and beat the greats up in the pantheon, and these sorts of blind comparisons help us hear what we otherwise might not because we are biased to dismiss unknown "lesser" performers. Wish we could have included Naida Cole as well. I recall hearing excerpts of her recording once, but then the release was deleted from the catalog before I got around to buying it.

Good to see Thibaudet. He's a very fine pianist and has a unique (and telltale) economic use of pedaling that I've found very interesting and illuminating. He's made me revisit and reconsider my interpretive and technical decisions in French repertoire many times. Arrau is somewhat unexpected but now makes some sense in light of the very individual take.

Michelangeli to me has always been a master in this repertoire and it was hard not noticing in every bar that it's him. He's got that inimitable control of timbres and completely coherent line from beginning to end. I wasn't aware of this 1960 London recording and will have to see if I can get a hold of it in some incarnation. I have the 1959 in both the BBC and a Music & Arts release. But in any case the best of his Gaspards that I have heard is a live 1960 Prague Spring performance, which also benefits from better sound that does his incredible timbral control more justice. There was once a wonderful Music & Arts 2CD set that had this performance among stupendous accounts of the Bach/Busoni Chaconne and the Brahms Paganini variations. One of my desert island discs.

[ASIN]B000001OG7[/ASIN]

There is also a fine live Warsaw version I think from around the same time that someone once sent me in MP3 format but which I now can't find for the life of me, as well as a later live Vatican version, which I have, however, never heard.

PS: I'm still miffed that Gulda got kicked out so early. He's truly brilliant. I'll eventually break down and buy that big RIAS recordings set from which this performance came.

[mc ukrneal]

Two notes before we start with the results show.

Sixth place: Pianist #10 (6.666)

"not as spontaneous and willing to let loose" "dull" "very haunting, mysterious opening.... Not as structurally compelling, nor with the urgent excitement I expect" "I couldn't find anything here that stood out from the crowd." "Wonderful! This one gets the mischief down" "much of the playing borders on stiff" "thoughtful and restrained but committed, great virtuosity in service to an active intelligence, judicious timing"

Pianist #10 is...

[asin]B00005A8FG[/asin]

ARTURO BENEDETTI MICHELANGELI
live, June 30, 1959, London

What can I say? A great recording. But we found five we liked better, starting with...

Fifth place: Pianist #1 (6.833)

"Rhythmically superb. Wonderful drama, spontaneity and atmosphere." "not malevolent or mischievous enough.  Could have been more intense" "boy is he (or she) in total control - very well disciplined. I was riveted." "terrifying and suspenseful sound" "much drama and a sinister atmosphere" "lacking menace" "Tune often lost. Feels like it runs out of steam." "nothing subtle about it"

Pianist #1 is...

[asin]B009AE7186[/asin]

ARTURO BENEDETTI MICHELANGELI
live, May 22, 1960, London

Double 'Detti! And recorded live in the same city just 11 months apart. MishaK noticed that the two Michelangeli recordings were the same pianist very early on in the competition, and Michelangeli's readings got similar scores on nearly every ballot. Ironically, it was MishaK who broke the tie between these two Michelangelis - before his, the last vote, they had identical scores.

NOTE: If you can find a different CD version of this performance, consider buying that one instead. The Praga disc couples Gaspard to a shamelessly, obviously pirated copy of the EMI piano concerto recording. I mean, unless that EMI concerto is somehow out of copyright, but I doubt that.

Fourth place: Pianist #13 (6.888)

"Remarkable dynamic control. Very free phrasing." "plenty of menace in this one, even violence" "Overall, this takes a very dark, aggressive take which I like very much." "the sound was too bright and splashy" "Overly dramatic at times" "Seems too straight-forward much of the time" "Love the rhythmic sensitivity, the slight syncopation, the clarity, the full tones, the sustained low tones, the dreaminess, the building tensions" "tempos generally quite slow. Shame piano is horribly out of tune. Really bashes many of the notes. Dynamics don't have much range. Not much sensitivity. Not a fan of this at all."

Interesting that I liked both not knowing it was the same pianist (or that both were him). I guess I like his approach!

Michelangeli's got that inimitable control of timbres and completely coherent line from beginning to end.

This is one of the things I found so helpful. I found learning this piece hard and Michaelangeli's approach makes it much easier to understand for me. You've said it so succinctly - well worth highlighting!

[BobsterLobster]

Funny, I was listening to Osborne's very disappointing Rachmaninov Preludes last night.
I'm seriously disappointed though to see all my favourite recordings of Gaspard missing from the selection- I'm not sure I've really learnt anything as a result.

[Octave]

I'm seriously disappointed though to see all my favourite recordings of Gaspard missing from the selection- I'm not sure I've really learnt anything as a result.

Which are your favorites, BL?

And thanks Brian for all the work tabulating and laying everything out so nice; I've enjoyed reading the comments even without having specific points of reference.  Sounds pointless, but it's been instructive nonetheless.

[Beale]

Never heard Osborne, Simon or Endres before in any repertoire. Will have to check these guys out. That's the wonderful thing about music: there can always be a performer out there who you've never heard of who has poured his or her heart and soul into one work and is more than ready to take on and beat the greats up in the pantheon, and these sorts of blind comparisons help us hear what we otherwise might not because we are biased to dismiss unknown "lesser" performers.

I think Steven Osborne is far from unknown. He has won Gramophone awards. When he toured here last year he was touted as a British superstar soloist. This is an extract from a concert review (http://www.thebarefootreview.com.au/music/reviews/620-rbs-morgans-international-piano-series.html)

"Steven Osborne is a remarkable musician.  When he plays it is almost as if the piano is a medium that allows him to establish direct contact with the composer, because he always manages to extract some new meaning from what ever piece he is playing.  Put simply, it just doesn't sound 'mainstream';  when he plays, the result is somehow different, and this is somewhat disarming, but in a most enjoyable way."

I think that would be a fair description of what we heard from #17.

BTW Thank you Brian for a most fun and educational experience with Ravel.

[DavidRoss]

Funny, I was listening to Osborne's very disappointing Rachmaninov Preludes last night.
I'm seriously disappointed though to see all my favourite recordings of Gaspard missing from the selection- I'm not sure I've really learnt anything as a result.

I am grateful to have you with us, Bob. (Hmmm, "Swedish Bob" ... wasn't that a character in a recent movie?) So far you're proving a reliable reverse barometer for me, since our tastes seem so far apart. That's not to say you're wrong and I'm right. Some like sports cars and some like luxury sedans. One person's "forceful explosion of passionate music-making" is another's "uncontrolled ham-fisted keyboard pounding."

Edit: Whoops ... that's "English Bob" I'm thinking of, Richard Harris's character in a movie recently mentioned elsewhere around these parts.

[madaboutmahler]

Very very interesting, Brian! I'll definitely be getting the Simon, really enjoyed his scarbo! Thank you for a wonderful comparison, very well organised!

I'll be starting my next comparison after exams in around a month, so, would people like to do another Mahler symphony, or another surprise?

[Beale]

I'll be starting my next comparison after exams in around a month, so, would people like to do another Mahler symphony, or another surprise?

Yes to Mahler symphony, but I hope not number 7. 

[MishaK]

I think Steven Osborne is far from unknown. He has won Gramophone awards. When he toured here last year he was touted as a British superstar soloist. This is an extract from a concert review (http://www.thebarefootreview.com.au/music/reviews/620-rbs-morgans-international-piano-series.html)

"Steven Osborne is a remarkable musician.  When he plays it is almost as if the piano is a medium that allows him to establish direct contact with the composer, because he always manages to extract some new meaning from what ever piece he is playing.  Put simply, it just doesn't sound 'mainstream';  when he plays, the result is somehow different, and this is somewhat disarming, but in a most enjoyable way."

With all due respect, that is typical meaningless PR BS. It can apply to almost anything and anyone at any time. You also have to distinguish between national and regional "markets" and international markets. Osborne might be well known in the UK and the related Commonwealth (I have an Aussie musician friend who categorizes celebrity performers into two groups: too expensive for Australia and the rest  ). But Osborne certainly isn't a pianist of international stature. And you can see that also by the record labels that give these guys contracts (or don't and just do one-offs). There is a difference in relative fame in being on Universal vs. a small label like Oehms or Hyperion. Again, this has nothing to do with interpretive quality in a given piece. And that is precisely what these sorts of blind comparisons help elucidate.

So now as a result of this exercise I'll have to buy Gulda, Endres and Osborne and maybe find that 1960 London Michelangeli. Oy!

[Sean]

Not sure where the net links are here but the DG Pogorelich remains one of the most transcendental piano recordings of all time, sounding like something from an ideal impressionistic nightmare, finding the essence of the work entirely beyond the limits of the keyboard; dark blood-red in the zone painting as I've never heard.

Also heard him live but time changes things...