Author Topic: Beethoven PI Symphonies: Make believe it's a desert island  (Read 3179 times)

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Offline Gurn Blanston

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Beethoven PI Symphonies: Make believe it's a desert island
« on: August 07, 2019, 05:27:53 PM »
So I'm going on a voyage, bringing my music player with me, of course. I have a vague foreboding that I might not make it to my destination, and will get stranded on a desert island. As a result, In addition to my solar charger, I'm packing as much music as I can on my player, but only one version of a piece so I have room for plenty. I'm up to choosing Beethoven symphonies. I only have PI versions (see how well this mirrors real life for me?). I have a couple of singles that are favorites anyway, so I'm going to make those a given, written in stone. They aren't part of a cycle anyway. They are:

Symphony #3 - Savall
Symphony #9 - Herreweghe

In addition to these, I have exactly 7 PI cycles. and these are them:

Brüggen 1   (Utrecht 1994 Orchestra of the 18th Century)
Gardiner     (Orchestre Revolutionnaire)
Goodman    (Hanover Band)
Hogwood     (AAM)
Immerseel   (Anima Eterna)
Norrington   (London Classical Players)
Weil            (Tafelmusik)

So, this is a game, but it is also completely true. What you see is what I have, so if you start telling me I need Karajan or something, it isn't gonna happen. And I ain't gonna buy anything more, either! :D    Of the remaining 7 symphonies, I want 1 from each band to add to the 2 I've already chosen to make a complete cycle with 9 different bands. No more than 1 symphony per band, please.

Even if you only have 1 or 2 of these cycles, if you have a favorite among them, go ahead and name it. If it's your favorite 7th or 4th from this list, I'll take it.

At the end I will add up the votes and load them up accordingly.

Cheers,
Gurn  8)
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Offline JBS

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Re: Beethoven PI Symphonies: Make believe it's a desert island
« Reply #1 on: August 07, 2019, 05:51:07 PM »
Overall, Hanover Band does well, but the Ninth was underwhelming, seemed to be a case of too few performers in too big a recording space.  Bruggen 2 also does very well until the very last moment: lousy male singers in the finale of the Ninth, so it's like Usain Bolt slipping and breaking his coccyx just before he crosses the finish line.

No clear favorite among cycles. I prefer Gardiner, but Immerseel includes some overtures, so for desert island purposes he might be better. Don't recall if Bruggen 1 has extras. If it does, the same advantage applies.

No favorite individual performance either...all my favorites are actually MI performances.

You don't have Krivine listed. For me he's in the "good enough, but not better than the others" category. (Does this mesn I have two PI cycles you don't have.)

Hollywood Beach Broadwalk

Offline Gurn Blanston

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Re: Beethoven PI Symphonies: Make believe it's a desert island
« Reply #2 on: August 08, 2019, 03:15:29 AM »
Overall, Hanover Band does well, but the Ninth was underwhelming, seemed to be a case of too few performers in too big a recording space.  Bruggen 2 also does very well until the very last moment: lousy male singers in the finale of the Ninth, so it's like Usain Bolt slipping and breaking his coccyx just before he crosses the finish line.

No clear favorite among cycles. I prefer Gardiner, but Immerseel includes some overtures, so for desert island purposes he might be better. Don't recall if Bruggen 1 has extras. If it does, the same advantage applies.

No favorite individual performance either...all my favorites are actually MI performances.

You don't have Krivine listed. For me he's in the "good enough, but not better than the others" category. (Does this mesn I have two PI cycles you don't have.)

You must do: I don't have Krivine (except the 9th) and I don't have Brüggen 2 (except the 9th).

They don't have to be your favorite performance of all time, just your favorite among those listed. I can tell you a couple examples: Immerseel's 5th and Weil's 6th are both very fine. So even if the rest of the cycle sucks (which they don't), it doesn't matter since I am throwing it away (for this purpose). :)  Anyway, I'm damned if I'm buying any ore Beethoven symphonies, PI or not! :D :D

8)
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Offline Brian

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Re: Beethoven PI Symphonies: Make believe it's a desert island
« Reply #3 on: August 08, 2019, 04:25:28 AM »
It's been a while, but I have great memories of the AAM woodwinds in Hogwood's 4th. I love Immerseel's 5th just as you do. This is hard for me because Gardiner it's been a while, and some of these have been displaced in my collection by "HIP-ish" recordings (like Norrington I by Norrington II...also a fan of Dausgaard and P. Jarvi and Mackerras II). But those don't count.  :(

Offline Gurn Blanston

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Re: Beethoven PI Symphonies: Make believe it's a desert island
« Reply #4 on: August 08, 2019, 05:30:20 AM »
It's been a while, but I have great memories of the AAM woodwinds in Hogwood's 4th. I love Immerseel's 5th just as you do. This is hard for me because Gardiner it's been a while, and some of these have been displaced in my collection by "HIP-ish" recordings (like Norrington I by Norrington II...also a fan of Dausgaard and P. Jarvi and Mackerras II). But those don't count.  :(

Actually, it was one of your comments from about 8 or 9 years ago that turned me on to Immerseel's 5th. :)  I have lots of other symphony recordings too, and that's why this particular challenge is so... challenging for me. And you too, it seems. I can see myself slipping Hogwood into the 4th. I like that one a lot too. :)

8)
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Offline Wakefield

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Re: Beethoven PI Symphonies: Make believe it's a desert island
« Reply #5 on: August 08, 2019, 06:12:13 AM »
Actually, it was one of your comments from about 8 or 9 years ago that turned me on to Immerseel's 5th. :)  I have lots of other symphony recordings too, and that's why this particular challenge is so... challenging for me. And you too, it seems. I can see myself slipping Hogwood into the 4th. I like that one a lot too. :)

8)

Apparently, that message is a classic because I remember it too!   

I’ll always have a huge soft spot in my heart for Hogwood's 7th.
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Offline aukhawk

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Re: Beethoven PI Symphonies: Make believe it's a desert island
« Reply #6 on: August 08, 2019, 07:06:22 AM »
I've just listened to Gardiner's Pastoral - in one of those "I must listen to some music but I can't think what" moments - and really enjoyed it, kept my attention from first to last.

Offline Gurn Blanston

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Re: Beethoven PI Symphonies: Make believe it's a desert island
« Reply #7 on: August 08, 2019, 07:20:23 AM »
Apparently, that message is a classic because I remember it too!   

I’ll always have a huge soft spot in my heart for Hogwood's 7th.
I've just listened to Gardiner's Pastoral - in one of those "I must listen to some music but I can't think what" moments - and really enjoyed it, kept my attention from first to last.

Thanks to both for those votes. Actually, both of those cycles are huge favorites of mine, which is the hardest part of this exercise for me: choosing one symphony from each!! :-\  :)

8)
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Offline Sergeant Rock

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Re: Beethoven PI Symphonies: Make believe it's a desert island
« Reply #8 on: August 08, 2019, 07:23:28 AM »
I don't have a lot of PI Beethoven but what I have, and like from your list:

Brüggen 1
Immerseel 5
Goodman 6
Norrington 9 (you knew that was coming  ;) )

Sarge
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Offline Gurn Blanston

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Re: Beethoven PI Symphonies: Make believe it's a desert island
« Reply #9 on: August 08, 2019, 08:46:17 AM »
I don't have a lot of PI Beethoven but what I have, and like from your list:

Brüggen 1
Immerseel 5
Goodman 6
Norrington 9 (you knew that was coming  ;) )

Sarge

Thanks, Sarge! Yeah, I knew it was coming. I like your choices there.  Of course, that's my problem: I like all the choices so it's hard to make a final list!  :)

8)
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Offline Gurn Blanston

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Re: Beethoven PI Symphonies: Make believe it's a desert island
« Reply #10 on: August 08, 2019, 08:57:34 AM »
The votes so far:

1st - Brüggen
2nd -
3rd - Savall (written in stone)
4th - Hogwood
5th - Immerseel (X3)
6th - Goodman, Gardiner, Weil
7th - Hogwood
8th -
9th - Herreweghe (written in stone)

Obviously I have already given this a lot of thought, before I ever posted. It's a dilemma I've been trying to solve for a while. Gardiner's 2nd and 7th are both really nice, if you haven't heard them for a while, you should try them out. I haven't got an 8th in mind either, although there are several nice ones on the list. This is a good excuse to go back and listen to some PI Beethoven! :D

8)
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Offline Wakefield

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Re: Beethoven PI Symphonies: Make believe it's a desert island
« Reply #11 on: August 08, 2019, 09:17:04 AM »
I even heard out there that this poll will be void since it didn't include Brüggen 2.  ??? ;D
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Offline André

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Re: Beethoven PI Symphonies: Make believe it's a desert island
« Reply #12 on: August 08, 2019, 09:53:43 AM »
My favourite PI 9th is one YOU made me discover  ;)



Not to disparage Herreweghe, but I find Spering more revolutionary. Don’t like it anymore ?  8)

Offline Gurn Blanston

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Re: Beethoven PI Symphonies: Make believe it's a desert island
« Reply #13 on: August 08, 2019, 09:56:15 AM »
My favourite PI 9th is one YOU made me discover  ;)



Not to disparage Herreweghe, but I find Spering more revolutionary. Don’t like it anymore ?  8)

No, still like it a lot! Life is a series of difficult choices! I particularly like the singing in the Herreweghe. Otherwise, probably would choose the Spering... :-\

8)
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Offline Brian

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Re: Beethoven PI Symphonies: Make believe it's a desert island
« Reply #14 on: August 08, 2019, 10:01:20 AM »
Hmmm, Gardiner 2, Hogwood 7, and Spering 9 are all on streaming and that playlist is exactly long enough to get me to the end of the day...you know what this means...

Offline Gurn Blanston

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Re: Beethoven PI Symphonies: Make believe it's a desert island
« Reply #15 on: August 08, 2019, 10:47:52 AM »
Hmmm, Gardiner 2, Hogwood 7, and Spering 9 are all on streaming and that playlist is exactly long enough to get me to the end of the day...you know what this means...

Runh roh... Beethoven! :D

8)
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Offline Gurn Blanston

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Re: Beethoven PI Symphonies: Make believe it's a desert island
« Reply #16 on: August 08, 2019, 10:49:12 AM »
I even heard out there that this poll will be void since it didn't include Brüggen 2.  ??? ;D

Maybe next year... 7 PI cycles is all I can handle for now. :'(

8)
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Offline Brian

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Re: Beethoven PI Symphonies: Make believe it's a desert island
« Reply #17 on: August 08, 2019, 11:26:44 AM »
What's the flippy flappy flipper sound that comes in Hogwood's Seventh finale around 1:57-2:05 and 2:18?

Offline Wakefield

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Re: Beethoven PI Symphonies: Make believe it's a desert island
« Reply #18 on: August 08, 2019, 11:30:34 AM »
Maybe next year... 7 PI cycles is all I can handle for now. :'(

8)

No doubt, prompted by this thread today I listened to Immerseel's and Brüggen's 1st symphony. By the way, I hadn't heard Immerseel in a very long time, which it's weird because a few years ago I thought his cycle is perfect. 
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Offline (: premont :)

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Re: Beethoven PI Symphonies: Make believe it's a desert island
« Reply #19 on: August 08, 2019, 11:47:29 AM »
The votes so far:

1st - Brüggen
2nd -
3rd - Savall (written in stone)
4th - Hogwood
5th - Immerseel (X3)
6th - Goodman, Gardiner, Weil
7th - Hogwood
8th -
9th - Herreweghe (written in stone)

I have a weak spot for Goodman and Hogwood in general. On the other hand Weill's sleep-provoking Pastorale was the recording which convinced me not to acquire Weill's cycle.
So:

1: Hogwood
2: Hogwood
3: Savall (wins because of the prominent brass section and the general military air, because this is a militant symphony)
4: Hogwood
5: Immerseel (agree that this is an exiting interpretation, almost as tense as Klemperer's 1955 mono)
6: Goodman
7: Hogwood
8: Don't recall a satisfying HIP recording. Brüggen 1 may be closest (haven't heard Brüggen 2)
9: Herreweghe (agree fully - and his MI cycle is IMO most interesting. I prefer PI, but I am not fanatic about it  :)).
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