Quiz: Mystery scores

Guido · July 09, 2008, 04:12:07 PM

Correct of course. I didn't realise that it was so strictly tintinabulum... I wouldn't have guessed just from listening, but luckily I have the score here to have a little look. Is Paul hillier a Part scholar? I'd like to read some stuff about Part's work, especially these really strict early works.

Do I need to give some clues to my other pieces?

Guido · July 09, 2008, 04:15:40 PM

Also Luke you haven't updated the list to include the Prokofiev Symphony Concerto that you guessed correctly (though this is from the coda of the last movement, rather than the second as you guessed.) and the William Schumann Song of Orpheus too.

lukeottevanger · July 09, 2008, 10:47:31 PM

Quote from: Guido on July 09, 2008, 04:15:40 PM
Also Luke you haven't updated the list to include the Prokofiev Symphony Concerto that you guessed correctly (though this is from the coda of the last movement, rather than the second as you guessed.) and the William Schumann Song of Orpheus too.

OK, I'll get onto that later - though don't forget, all you guys are 'allowed' to quote the list and modify it too.

Or is that letting a bunch of cats out of a bag.....?

Paul Hillier has written an excellent book on Part, one of the Oxford composer studies. Really illuminating reading, even if you feel as I did that you already 'get' Part pretty well.

J.Z. Herrenberg · July 10, 2008, 02:48:50 AM

First list, in two parts:
Part one
and
Part two

Second list (one long part)

New list:

Set by Luke
293 - Tchaikovsky - Festival Overture on the Danish National Anthem - (Sforzando)
294 - Tovey - Piano Concerto - (Johan)
295 - Wagner - Fantasy in F# minor - (Sforzando)
296 - Wagner-Wolf - Paraphrase über "Die Meistersinger von Nürnberg" - (Johan)
297 - Valen - Piano Sonata no 2 - (Johan)
298 - ? -
299 - Wolf-Ferrari - Violin Sonata in A minor - (Sforzando)
300 - Theo Ysaye - Piano Concerto op 9 - (Johan)
301 - Tchaikovsky - Piano Concerto no 2 - (revealed by Luke)
302 - Tchaikovsky - The Tempest - (Sforzando)
303 - Cage - from Songbooks - (Johan)
304 - Busoni - Concerto for piano and strings op 17 - (Johan)
305 - ? -
306 - Beethoven - Adagio (mandolin/piano) - (Sforzando)
307 - Berg - Four pieces for clarinet and piano - (Sforzando)
308 - Arensky - Piano Trio no 1 - (Sforzando)
309 - Antheil - Sonata no 2 'The Airplane' - (Greg)
310 - ? -
311 - Berstein - Wonderful Town - (Sforzando)
312 - Barber - Hesitation Tango - (Guido)
313 - Carpenter - Krazy Kat - (Sforzando)
314 - Bax - Harp Quintet - (Guido)
315 - Berg - Abschied - (Johan)
316 - Bernstein - La Bonne Cuisine - (Sforzando)
317 - Bruckner - Christus factus est pro nobis - (Johan)
318 - ? -
319 - ? -
320 - Heinrich - A Chromatic Ramble of the Peregrine Harmonist - (Johan)
321 - Lili Boulanger - Vielle priere bouddhique - (Johan)
322 - ? -
323 - ? -
324 - ? -
325 - ? -
326 - Prokofiev - Classical Symphony - (Sforzando)
327 - Shostakovich - Fugue in D flat major (from the 24) - (Sforzando)
328 - Sibelius - Symphony no 3 - (Mark)
329 - Copland - Piano Fantasy - (Sforzando)
330 - Stevenson - Prelude, Fugue and Fantasy on Busoni’s Faust - (Johan)
331 - Musgrave - Narcissus - (Johan)
332 - ? -
333 - Schubert - G major quartet - (Sforzando)
334 - Nielsen - Flute Concerto - (Johan)
335 - Haydn - Farewell Symphony - (Sforzando)
336 - Elgar - Gerontius - (Johan)
337 - Dukas - L'Aprenti Sorcier - (Sforzando)
338 - Strauss - Die Frau ohne Schatten - (Sforzando)
339 - Berlioz - Harold in Italy - (Sforzando)
340 - Stravinsky - Threni - (Sforzando)
341 - Schoenberg - Gurrelieder - (Johan)
342 - Kodaly - ? = (Johan)
343 - Berlioz - Romeo et Juliette - (Sforzando)
344 - ? -
345 - ? -

Set by Greta
1 - Berio - Sequenza IXb - (Luke)
2 - Dallapiccola - Quaderno musicale di Annalibera - (Luke)
3 - Stravinsky - Petrouchka - (Luke)
4 - Brahms - op 119/3 - (Luke)
5 - Adams - Harmonielehre - (Luke)
6 - Sibelius - Kullervo - (Luke)
7 - Grainger - Lincolnshire Posy - (Chrone)

Set by Chrone:
4 - Rogers - Guadalcanal March - (Mark)
5 - Hermann - Vertigo - (Luke)

Set by Sforzando
49 - Faure - Violin Sonata no 2 - (Luke)
50 - Sullivan - The Mikado - (Mark)
51 - Schutz - Ich ruf zu dir - (Luke)
52 - Puccini - La Rondine - (Luke)
53 - Puccini - Messa di Gloria - (Luke)
54 - Prokofiev - Piano Concerto 4 - (Luke)
55 - Peter Susser - Quatre Bêtises - (revealed by Sforzando)
56 - Copland - 8 Dickinson Songs - (Luke)
57 - Hindemith - The Four Temperaments - (Luke)
58 - Bernstein - Songfest - (Luke)
59 - Bernstein - Songfest - (Luke)
60 - Grieg - Slatter - (Luke)
61 - Beethoven - Kakadu Variations (Luke)
62 - Beethoven - Fugue for string quintet - (Luke)
63 - Prokofiev - Overture on Hebrew Themes - (Mark)
64 - Hindemith - Der Schwanendreher - (Luke)
65 - Verdi - Quartet - (Luke)
66 - Sullivan - Cox and Box - (Luke)
67 - Bernstein - Candide - (Luke)
68 - Sondheim - A Little Night Music - (Luke)
69 - Gershwin - An American in Paris - (Luke)
70 - Egge - Symphony no 3 (Louisville) - (Luke)
71 - Butterworth - A Shropshire Lad (Luke)
72 - Falla - El retabloe de Maese Pedro - (Luke)
73 - Wolf-Ferrari - IL segreto di Susanna - (Luke)
74 - Beethoven - Ah, perfido - (Johan)
75 - Berlioz - La Mort de Cleopatre - (Luke)
76 - Boyce - Symphony no 1 - (Luke)

Set by Guido
42 - Shostakovich - Symphony no 10 - (Johan)
43 - Part - Silouans Song - (Luke)
44 - ? -
45 - W Schuman - Song of Orpheus - (Luke)
46 - Ives - Sunrise - (Luke)
47 - Feldman - Cello and Orchestra - (Luke)
48 - Harrison - Suite for Symphonic Strings - (Luke)
49 - ? -
50 - ? -
51 - Prokofiev - Sinfonia Concertante - (Luke)
52 - ? -

Clues to Luke's remaining ones

lukeottevanger · July 10, 2008, 04:09:55 AM

Yes, like that!

Maciek · July 10, 2008, 08:57:59 AM

Stickied.

J.Z. Herrenberg · July 10, 2008, 01:12:53 PM

Just finished listening to Schoenberg's Gurrelieder for the first time. It's an extraordinary work - the variety is staggering, it is several genres telescoped into one, it looks back and it looks forward, the orchestra is immense and handled in the most inventive way imaginable. It really makes me want to reassess 'contemporary' works (temporally and/or ideally) on a similarly massive scale like Mahler's Eighth, Delius's Mass of Life, Brian's Gothic, Foulds's World Requiem, Korngold's Das Wunder der Heliane. Fascinating. The ending of the work is an ecstatic sunrise, but subtly tinged by melancholy (to these ears, at least).

Gielen's performance is excellent. The soloists are good, too. I don't know whether I like tenor Robert Dean Smith's Waldemar, though. His voice seems a bit constricted (although the tessitura of the part is rather high throughout).

Quote from: lukeottevanger on July 09, 2008, 03:18:22 AM
1 - Fool - IMO the fool needs a much more sardonic tone, complete with Mime-like ungainly hiccuping leaps - Craft's for the most part just sounds like a standard tenor: though his singing itself is nice enough it completely misses the implications of the music and the line of the plot as a whole - that everyone except Waldemar is getting rather tired with all this Romantic heroism and haunting stuff and yearns for a bit of context, and a bit of rest! (Listen to Waldemar's last outburst, straight after this - with the most unbelievable orchestral subtlety Schoenberg manages to bleach out the sound underneath him, so that we can't help but feel that whilst Waldemar still 'means it' everyone else, even the orchestra, is stepping back somewhat, deserting him as light seeps back into the darkness.) (...)

2 - speaker. I simply prefer something a bit more subtle, a bit more full of hushed wonder. Craft's speaker is accurate in terms of pitch (Schoenberg indicates it in a sprechgesang-like manner), and not everyone is in this section, although to be honest it doesn't matter that much. He also gets better as the music progresses, but it's a weak start - he's too perky! - and I find it hard to warm to him after that. (...)

Both Gielen's Fool and Speaker are excellent, IMO, and the orchestral playing is terrific, full of subtle detail and shading which never impairs the onward momentum. Waldemar's Men (track 4 in Part 3) could have more weight, though. The choir seems to be a bit too light. (Btw - I found that whole piece a sort of Schoenbergian 'Klagendes Lied'.)

P.S. It is a joy to read your thoughts about music, Luke. Shades of Wilfrid Mellers.

Guido · July 10, 2008, 04:57:09 PM

Very basic clues to mine:

44 - an early work by this composer, under the shadow of Brahms perhaps, but there is already individuality here.
49 - A fantastic score and one of the great cello concertos. The sense of power that builds through this phrase (and admittedly more so on the next page of the score) with such simple means allowing the cello to be clearly heard is every bit as impressive as the Prokofiev example I showed earlier.
50 - An incredible ethereal atmosphere is conjured here with quite unusual forces. There is a solo piano version too which I may like even more.
52 - A rather obscure piece by this composer but one of the very few that includes a solo cello part! It's a real gem though.

OK... these weren't really clues at all! I'll have to think up some better ones.

lukeottevanger · July 10, 2008, 09:16:21 PM

50 is Ruggles' Angels. I ought to have got that one a bit quicker....

lukeottevanger · July 10, 2008, 11:08:50 PM

And thanks, Johan, for a) your review of the Craft, and your thoughts on the piece in general (so glad you've found it so rewarding!); and b) your kind words.

lukeottevanger · July 11, 2008, 03:52:19 AM

Habit just took me to modify the list to include my identification of Angels (sorry not to wait for confirmation, Guido, but I'm positive, having listened along with the score sample) - but of course, I can't modify it, it being Johan's post. The only thing I can do is quote it, update it, and post it again - but then it appears too soon after its last appearance, I think. It's not fair to ask the last person to diddle with the list to keep it updated, as I was always doing before, so maybe, on second thoughts I ought to remain being the one taking that responsibility on, if no one minds.

lukeottevanger · July 11, 2008, 03:54:23 AM

So having said that, and just in order to get the list into a post of mine from which it can be modified in future, here we go:

First list, in two parts:
Part one
and
Part two

Second list (one long part)

New list:

Set by Luke
293 - Tchaikovsky - Festival Overture on the Danish National Anthem - (Sforzando)
294 - Tovey - Piano Concerto - (Johan)
295 - Wagner - Fantasy in F# minor - (Sforzando)
296 - Wagner-Wolf - Paraphrase über "Die Meistersinger von Nürnberg" - (Johan)
297 - Valen - Piano Sonata no 2 - (Johan)
298 - ? -
299 - Wolf-Ferrari - Violin Sonata in A minor - (Sforzando)
300 - Theo Ysaye - Piano Concerto op 9 - (Johan)
301 - Tchaikovsky - Piano Concerto no 2 - (revealed by Luke)
302 - Tchaikovsky - The Tempest - (Sforzando)
303 - Cage - from Songbooks - (Johan)
304 - Busoni - Concerto for piano and strings op 17 - (Johan)
305 - ? -
306 - Beethoven - Adagio (mandolin/piano) - (Sforzando)
307 - Berg - Four pieces for clarinet and piano - (Sforzando)
308 - Arensky - Piano Trio no 1 - (Sforzando)
309 - Antheil - Sonata no 2 'The Airplane' - (Greg)
310 - ? -
311 - Berstein - Wonderful Town - (Sforzando)
312 - Barber - Hesitation Tango - (Guido)
313 - Carpenter - Krazy Kat - (Sforzando)
314 - Bax - Harp Quintet - (Guido)
315 - Berg - Abschied - (Johan)
316 - Bernstein - La Bonne Cuisine - (Sforzando)
317 - Bruckner - Christus factus est pro nobis - (Johan)
318 - ? -
319 - ? -
320 - Heinrich - A Chromatic Ramble of the Peregrine Harmonist - (Johan)
321 - Lili Boulanger - Vielle priere bouddhique - (Johan)
322 - ? -
323 - ? -
324 - ? -
325 - ? -
326 - Prokofiev - Classical Symphony - (Sforzando)
327 - Shostakovich - Fugue in D flat major (from the 24) - (Sforzando)
328 - Sibelius - Symphony no 3 - (Mark)
329 - Copland - Piano Fantasy - (Sforzando)
330 - Stevenson - Prelude, Fugue and Fantasy on Busoni's Faust - (Johan)
331 - Musgrave - Narcissus - (Johan)
332 - ? -
333 - Schubert - G major quartet - (Sforzando)
334 - Nielsen - Flute Concerto - (Johan)
335 - Haydn - Farewell Symphony - (Sforzando)
336 - Elgar - Gerontius - (Johan)
337 - Dukas - L'Aprenti Sorcier - (Sforzando)
338 - Strauss - Die Frau ohne Schatten - (Sforzando)
339 - Berlioz - Harold in Italy - (Sforzando)
340 - Stravinsky - Threni - (Sforzando)
341 - Schoenberg - Gurrelieder - (Johan)
342 - Kodaly - ? = (Johan)
343 - Berlioz - Romeo et Juliette - (Sforzando)
344 - ? -
345 - ? -

Set by Greta
1 - Berio - Sequenza IXb - (Luke)
2 - Dallapiccola - Quaderno musicale di Annalibera - (Luke)
3 - Stravinsky - Petrouchka - (Luke)
4 - Brahms - op 119/3 - (Luke)
5 - Adams - Harmonielehre - (Luke)
6 - Sibelius - Kullervo - (Luke)
7 - Grainger - Lincolnshire Posy - (Chrone)

Set by Chrone:
4 - Rogers - Guadalcanal March - (Mark)
5 - Hermann - Vertigo - (Luke)

Set by Sforzando
49 - Faure - Violin Sonata no 2 - (Luke)
50 - Sullivan - The Mikado - (Mark)
51 - Schutz - Ich ruf zu dir - (Luke)
52 - Puccini - La Rondine - (Luke)
53 - Puccini - Messa di Gloria - (Luke)
54 - Prokofiev - Piano Concerto 4 - (Luke)
55 - Peter Susser - Quatre Bêtises - (revealed by Sforzando)
56 - Copland - 8 Dickinson Songs - (Luke)
57 - Hindemith - The Four Temperaments - (Luke)
58 - Bernstein - Songfest - (Luke)
59 - Bernstein - Songfest - (Luke)
60 - Grieg - Slatter - (Luke)
61 - Beethoven - Kakadu Variations (Luke)
62 - Beethoven - Fugue for string quintet - (Luke)
63 - Prokofiev - Overture on Hebrew Themes - (Mark)
64 - Hindemith - Der Schwanendreher - (Luke)
65 - Verdi - Quartet - (Luke)
66 - Sullivan - Cox and Box - (Luke)
67 - Bernstein - Candide - (Luke)
68 - Sondheim - A Little Night Music - (Luke)
69 - Gershwin - An American in Paris - (Luke)
70 - Egge - Symphony no 3 (Louisville) - (Luke)
71 - Butterworth - A Shropshire Lad (Luke)
72 - Falla - El retabloe de Maese Pedro - (Luke)
73 - Wolf-Ferrari - IL segreto di Susanna - (Luke)
74 - Beethoven - Ah, perfido - (Johan)
75 - Berlioz - La Mort de Cleopatre - (Luke)
76 - Boyce - Symphony no 1 - (Luke)

Set by Guido
42 - Shostakovich - Symphony no 10 - (Johan)
43 - Part - Silouans Song - (Luke)
44 - ? -
45 - W Schuman - Song of Orpheus - (Luke)
46 - Ives - Sunrise - (Luke)
47 - Feldman - Cello and Orchestra - (Luke)
48 - Harrison - Suite for Symphonic Strings - (Luke)
49 - Barber - Cello Concerto - (Luke)
50 - Ruggles - Angels - (Luke)
51 - Prokofiev - Sinfonia Concertante - (Luke)
52 - ? -

Clues to Luke's remaining ones

Clues to Guido's remaining ones

J.Z. Herrenberg · July 11, 2008, 04:04:35 AM

Quote from: lukeottevanger on July 11, 2008, 03:52:19 AM
Habit just took me to modify the list to include my identification of Angels (sorry not to wait for confirmation, Guido, but I'm positive, having listened along with the score sample) - but of course, I can't modify it, it being Johan's post. The only thing I can do is quote it, update it, and post it again - but then it appears too soon after its last appearance, I think. It's not fair to ask the last person to diddle with the list to keep it updated, as I was always doing before, so maybe, on second thoughts I ought to remain being the one taking that responsibility on, if no one minds.

I wouldn't have minded to 'diddle' on, nor do I mind you doing it, Luke. The list is communal property, as far as I'm concerned.

lukeottevanger · July 11, 2008, 04:16:55 AM

Yes, it is, but it's better not to have it as a new post every time a single score is identified. More aesthetically pleasing to keep on updating the last appearance of the list with new identifications until such a time - a page or two of thread, perhaps - when it needs to be TTT-ed. In which case the updating becomes the responsibility of the last person to post the list, who is the only one who can modify rather than quote. Simpler if that is one person, as it has been until now - but if you want to do it, please feel free!

I've done enough [.url][/url] posting for a lifetime

J.Z. Herrenberg · July 11, 2008, 04:27:13 AM

Quote from: lukeottevanger on July 11, 2008, 04:16:55 AM
Yes, it is, but it's better not to have it as a new post every time a single score is identified. More aesthetically pleasing to keep on updating the last appearance of the list with new identifications until such a time - a page or two of thread, perhaps - when it needs to be TTT-ed. In which case the updating becomes the responsibility of the last person to post the list, who is the only one who can modify rather than quote. Simpler if that is one person, as it has been until now - but if you want to do it, please feel free! I've done enough [.url][/url] posting for a lifetime

I can't compete with your experience and expertise, alas...

I'll step in as occasion arises.

Guido · July 11, 2008, 04:46:54 AM

Correct of course Luke. All 3 of my remaining scores are by Americans... Should narrow it down significantly...

lukeottevanger · July 11, 2008, 01:27:35 PM

49 is Barber's Cello Concerto (last movement). Of course it is!

Guido · July 12, 2008, 05:08:58 AM

Yes, correct of course. This is one of the finest final movement of a concerto that I know of - it has no less power or beauty than either of the previous movements and packs an incredible emotional punch into the relatively short eight minutes that it comprises. Some close friends of his once commented that this (along with the second Symphony) was a memorial to the holocaust and World War II in general - a claim that he never confirmed (or denied), but it is easy and tempting to see why.

lukeottevanger · July 12, 2008, 11:40:38 AM

BTW, re one of mine, it would be advisable to check out the busiest thread on the forum....

lukeottevanger · July 13, 2008, 05:44:06 AM

...but hurry up, before it slips too far back...

I've got lots more ready, some of them very easy (we're talking 'popular classics' here

)' a few of moderate difficulty, some looking quite hard but probably simple if you examine them correctly. Ready to go ahead with them, but do you want to identify my remaining ones first? And do you want more clues?