Cato's Grammar Grumble

[kishnevi]

When they are trying to sound smarter than they are, my less intelligent 6th, 7th, and 8th Graders too often choose "which" to refer to people.  One would think that it is an easy distinction to keep straight: one would be wrong!

The inarticulate nature of some of our young people, and middle-aged ones as well, with their constant: "Yeah, well, you know, it was kind of like, I don't knoooow, somethinnnnn', you know?  And so I was like, I don't knoooow, it was just...kind of ....weird...I guess."

That is an actual quote from one of 14-year old girls not long ago!  Again, she is not one of the higher wattage students, but there are a good number similar to her.

"Which" in place of "who" can claim the authority of one of the most famous passages in the King James Bible--Luke 2:11

For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

The RV kept "which" while rewriting the first part of the verse in slightly more modern fashion, which means the RV revisors intentionally kept it in.

for there is born to you this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

Most other translations seem to stick to "who".

[Karl Henning]

Guitarists of the world 'Unite!'

[kishnevi]

Guitarists of the world 'Unite!'

......you have nothing to lose but your punctuation.

[eyeresist]

For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

Admittedly the KJV has some expressions which wouldn't parse today. I think in this case we could say "Saviour" is an object rather than an entity, so technically correct?

BTW, a nice new annotated King James has been in my wish list for ages, but keeps getting bumped in favour of CDs and DVDs    (As a writer, I think a good bible is more vital than Shakespeare.)

[Karl Henning]

So a generation of Americans are confused about which, in part, because as children they heard Linus cite the King Jas Version in Merry Christmas, Charlie Brown!

[Lethevich]

Is there any way to more clearly distinguish these two works without using itallics?

"Dvořák - The Wild Dove and The Golden Spinning Wheel from these discs:"

I tried placing a comma before the 'and' but it looked odd. Maybe that is perfectly okay and my brain is simply not switched on today. It almost looks better if I remove the 'and' and use the comma.

[Opus106]

Is there any way to more clearly distinguish these two works without using itallics?

"Dvořák - The Wild Dove and The Golden Spinning Wheel from these discs:"

I tried placing a comma before the 'and' but it looked odd. Maybe that is perfectly okay and my brain is simply not switched on today. It almost looks better if I remove the 'and' and use the comma.

Don't fret over it. Anyone who is likely to be a recipient of such a message will surely understand what you're referring to. 0:)

[Cato]

Is there any way to more clearly distinguish these two works without using italics?

"Dvořák - The Wild Dove and The Golden Spinning Wheel from these discs:"

I tried placing a comma before the 'and' but it looked odd. Maybe that is perfectly okay and my brain is simply not switched on today. It almost looks better if I remove the 'and' and use the comma.

Is there some reason why you do not want to use italics?

You could try a different font, but that is more work than italics.

A comma after "Dove" and then after "Wheel" does seem clumsy.

[Lethevich]

Is there some reason why you do not want to use italics?

Non, just curiosity. I'm glad it isn't just me who noticed the awkwardness of trying to punctuate it, thanks!

[kishnevi]

Is there any way to more clearly distinguish these two works without using itallics?

"Dvořák - The Wild Dove and The Golden Spinning Wheel from these discs:"

I tried placing a comma before the 'and' but it looked odd. Maybe that is perfectly okay and my brain is simply not switched on today. It almost looks better if I remove the 'and' and use the comma.

Quote marks around the the titles, or single quote marks if part of a larger quote.

"Dvořák - 'The Wild Dove' and 'The Golden Spinning Wheel' from these discs:"

That's how I was taught back in high school,  if the preferred alternatives of italics or underlining were not available.

[oyasumi]

Fewer? I hardly know 'er!

[Cato]

Quote marks around the the titles, or single quote marks if part of a larger quote.

"Dvořák - 'The Wild Dove' and 'The Golden Spinning Wheel' from these discs:"

That's how I was taught back in high school,  if the preferred alternatives of italics or underlining were not available.

True: these days with a button and mouse-slide italics are preferred.

Last night, on my favorite local news station, which is infamous for grammatical curiosities, I heard:

"The company bidded on a state contract..."   

So I wonder whether they "losted" or "wonned" the contract!   0:)

[Opus106]

"The company bidded on a state contract..."   

...

[Karl Henning]

As my sis is wont to say: Woof a doodle.

[Cato]

As my sis is wont to say: Woof a doodle.

Is it possible to doodle a woof?    

Actually, that sounds like dangerous territory!   0:)

[North Star]

Is it possible to doodle a woof?    

Actually, that sounds like dangerous territory!   0:)

That sounds like a beige alert.

[kishnevi]

True: these days with a button and mouse-slide italics are preferred.

This was well before computer days:  we were taught to underline because our typewriters couldn't supply italics. 

At the time,  I had a manual typewriter and liquid white-out to cover the frequent typing mistakes.   Those kids from more affluent families had IBM Selectrics with the special white ribbon that allowed you to type corrections.  We thought that was technologically awesome, of course.

[Cato]

This was well before computer days:  we were taught to underline because our typewriters couldn't supply italics. 

At the time,  I had a manual typewriter and liquid white-out to cover the frequent typing mistakes.   Those kids from more affluent families had IBM Selectrics with the special white ribbon that allowed you to type corrections.  We thought that was technologically awesome, of course.

To quote Maurice Chevalier, "Ah yes!  I remember it well!"    

Not to mention carbon paper for making copies!

[eyeresist]

"The company bidded on a state contract..."   

So I wonder whether they "losted" or "wonned" the contract!   0:)

This sounds fine to me. I mean, you can't really say "bade" in this context  

"Bidded" is certainly preferable to "spit" used as a past tense verb IMO.

[DavidW]