Gurn's Classical Corner

[Gurn Blanston]

Out of the symphonies of Haydn and Mozart, which would you say are the most interesting (as you would define it)?

Edit: Please give the reason that it is interesting (to you).

Isn't that question more properly answered by someone who enjoys writing essays?  Like Mirror Image for example. He loves writing essays. Or Newman, maybe...   

Anyway, Leo is right, they are all good, and interesting in each their own way. I barely have a favorite.



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Now playing:
Le Concert des Nations / Savall - G 448 Guitar Quintet #4 in G "Fandango" 2nd mvmt - Allegro maestoso

[DavidW]

Edit: Please give the reason that it is interesting (to you).

Isn't this coming from the person that said that music is just pleasing sound, and doesn't read into anything?  Why are you asking us to read into why we like the music that we do, if you don't?

I'll tell you my favorites of Mozart: #25, 29, 35, 36, 38-41 and the Salzburg Symphonies.  Why those?  Who knows, I just like them.

I like all of Haydn's symphonies but my favorites are the Storm and Stress and the Paris symphonies.

[SonicMan46]

Well, the other day I received a small package from BRO which included the disc shown below (left) of a composer 'little known' to me (have just one other chamber recording of some of his works, shared w/ Conradin Kreutzer, no relationship!):

Kreutzer, Joseph (1790-1840) - Trios, Op. 9, Nos. 1-4 performed by the Gragnani Trio (includes flute, violin, & guitar) - Joe was the illegitimate son of a Wilhelm Kreutzer, and was adopted by his music teacher, Paul Kreutzer (apparently an uncle) - also, no relationship to the famous violinist of the time, Rodolphe Kreutzer, who Beethoven dedicated his No. 9 Violin Sonata.  So a LOT of unrelated Kreutzers floating around at that time!

Little is known about J. Kreutzer - he was a violinist, composer, and conductor; and also taught Norbert Burgmuller (who has come up in this thread); his compositions are few, i.e. mainly chamber works for solo guitar and strings w/ guitar; the only other 'shared' disc I have of his works is shown below (right).

I've listen to these Guitar Trios multiple times and thoroughly enjoy - just an interesting combination (published in 1823) but apparently not that unusual for the times - 

 

[Antoine Marchand]

I find this cover a bit disturbing; it looks like a very young person in what I would call a rather "sexual" attitude.

[Leo K.]

Well, the other day I received a small package from BRO which included the disc shown below (left) of a composer 'little known' to me (have just one other chamber recording of some of his works, shared w/ Conradin Kreutzer, no relationship!):

Kreutzer, Joseph (1790-1840) - Trios, Op. 9, Nos. 1-4 performed by the Gragnani Trio (includes flute, violin, & guitar) - Joe was the illegitimate son of a Wilhelm Kreutzer, and was adopted by his music teacher, Paul Kreutzer (apparently an uncle) - also, no relationship to the famous violinist of the time, Rodolphe Kreutzer, who Beethoven dedicated his No. 9 Violin Sonata.  So a LOT of unrelated Kreutzers floating around at that time!

Little is known about J. Kreutzer - he was a violinist, composer, and conductor; and also taught Norbert Burgmuller (who has come up in this thread); his compositions are few, i.e. mainly chamber works for solo guitar and strings w/ guitar; the only other 'shared' disc I have of his works is shown below (right).

I've listen to these Guitar Trios multiple times and thoroughly enjoy - just an interesting combination (published in 1823) but apparently not that unusual for the times - 

 

This sounds interesting! Thanks for the heads up. Classical guitar is something I want to try, especially in the early 19th century or round about there.

[Gurn Blanston]

I find this cover a bit disturbing; it looks like a very young person in what I would call a rather "sexual" attitude.

I actually had that precise thought. I'm not disturbed that an artist painted it, but rather that an art director found it suitable for a CD cover... 

[SonicMan46]

Now Antoine - you're reading too much into what I felt was a charming portrait of a young boy (but maybe I've visited too many art museums over the years?) - granted I'm not sure what the selection of this cover art has to do w/ the music, but that is quite common?

But out of curiosity, I looked up the artist in the liner notes - his name was Friedrich von Amerling (1803-1887) - he was the Austrian court painter for 45 years and specialized in portraits, and was considered one of two of the most important portrait painters of the 19th century in Austria - Wiki Bio HERE, for those interested.

And more information about the painting (available as a print apparently!) which is called A Portrait of a Boy from 1830 HERE - the painter would have been in his late 20s and before his court appointment, so not sure  whether this was a commissioned piece or one the artist just painted?  The information given states the painting is in the Biedermeier Style, which might explain the natural pose used? Dave 

[Leo K.]

Because of Easter, I'm suddenly in the mood for 18th century liturgical music, in particular, that of Michael Haydn, in this disk:



Missa 'Substitulo Sancti Francisci' (St Francis Mass)

Missa 'Pro Defuncto Archiepiscopo Sigismundo' (Requiem)

Michael Haydn's Requiem for Archbishop Sigismund Graf von Schrattenbach (1698 -1771) is a rather new work to me, as I'm on my second listen, but I'm happy to report this work is profoundly moving and I'm very happy to be discovering more great  sacred music from the 18th century. 

[Philoctetes]

Isn't this coming from the person that said that music is just pleasing sound, and doesn't read into anything?  Why are you asking us to read into why we like the music that we do, if you don't?

Mainly,  because I'm going to get a selection, and I sort of assume that other people have some sort of reasoning why they like the things they like. I have a feeling that most people probably don't listen to music the way that I do, and was just hoping that they would delineate, so I wouldn't have to get them all.

[Philoctetes]

Piloctetes, all of the symphonies of those composers are interesting! In particular, out of Haydn and Mozart, symphonies in minor keys are always an interesting listen, and the differences between Haydn and Mozart when writing in the minor key are interesting to consider too.

For Mozart, I tend to gravitate towards the late symphonies, starting with the Prague, and up to no.41 in C Major ("Jupiter"). For Haydn, I tend to listen to the Paris and London symphonies. Why? Thats a great question.

I like the sound world of Mozart's mature style. I also appreciate how, like Haydn, each work exists in it's sound world, it's own "gastalt" if you will. I also like the profound slow movements of Mozart and Haydn in thier later symphonic works. Also, in Haydn, it's fun to hear for his sense of humour in his Paris and London symphonies, where even some slow movements seem transcendent in wit and humor (The "Clock" movement in Symphony no. 101 to name an example, or the "Surprise" symphony), but there is that quality in all his works in some measure or quality.

Thats not to say I never listen to the earlier works, of course I enjoy those. For Mozart, I LOVE no.22, 25, and 29. As for Haydn, I still need to get to know his earlier symphonies. I've heard many, but there are so many to catch up on!

Thanks for some guidelines. I think I'm going to pick up a bunch of their minor symphonies and see how that goes. 

[Antoine Marchand]

Now Antoine - you're reading too much into what I felt was a charming portrait of a young boy (but maybe I've visited too many art museums over the years?) - granted I'm not sure what the selection of this cover art has to do w/ the music, but that is quite common?

But out of curiosity, I looked up the artist in the liner notes - his name was Friedrich von Amerling (1803-1887) - he was the Austrian court painter for 45 years and specialized in portraits, and was considered one of two of the most important portrait painters of the 19th century in Austria - Wiki Bio HERE, for those interested.

And more information about the painting (available as a print apparently!) which is called A Portrait of a Boy from 1830 HERE - the painter would have been in his late 20s and before his court appointment, so not sure  whether this was a commissioned piece or one the artist just painted?  The information given states the painting is in the Biedermeier Style, which might explain the natural pose used? Dave 

Maybe you're right. I don't have rational arguments to justify my reaction, but I swear that I hadn't left a son of mine alone with that guy (if I had a son!  ). I had a similar reaction some years ago when I saw those creepy pictures of little girls by Lewis Carroll.   

[Gurn Blanston]

Maybe you're right. I don't have rational arguments to justify my reaction, but I swear that I hadn't left a son of mine alone with that guy (if I had a son!  ). I had a similar reaction when some years ago I saw those creepy pictures of little girls by Lewis Carroll.

Despite all that. I still agree with your initial reaction. That was the pose they used to put me in back when I was a calendar model....



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Now playing:
Le Concert des Nations \ Savall - G 448 Quintet #4 in D for Strings & Guitar 1st mvmt - Pastorale

[Antoine Marchand]

Despite all that. I still agree with your initial reaction. That was the pose they used to put me in back when I was a calendar model....

Were you too a calendar model?

This is one of my pictures when I was younger:

[Gurn Blanston]

Were you too a calendar model?

This is one of my pictures when I was younger:

Pfff. Much younger, I would guess. I aged well though, although the shaggy hair on that painting eludes me now...   0:)





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Now playing:
Le Concert des Nations \ Savall - G 448 Quintet #4 in D for Strings & Guitar 3rd mvmt - Grave assai - Fandango

[Philoctetes]

Thanks for some guidelines. I think I'm going to pick up a bunch of their minor symphonies and see how that goes. 

Here's what I've got lined up for the next week:

Haydn
Davis/RCO: Symphonies 95, 96, 98, 102-104
Solomons/L'EA: Symphonies 35, 38, 39, 49, 58, 59
Amadeus Quartet: String Quartets Op. 55 and 74

Mozart:
Karajan/BPO: Symphonies 38-39
Levine/WP: Symphonies 25-27
Alban Berg Quartet: String Quartets 14-15, 18-19

Thanks again Leo.

[Leo K.]

Here's what I've got lined up for the next week:

Haydn
Davis/RCO: Symphonies 95, 96, 98, 102-104
Solomons/L'EA: Symphonies 35, 38, 39, 49, 58, 59
Amadeus Quartet: String Quartets Op. 55 and 74

Mozart:
Karajan/BPO: Symphonies 38-39
Levine/WP: Symphonies 25-27
Alban Berg Quartet: String Quartets 14-15, 18-19

Thanks again Leo.

Excellant choices Philoctetes! I'm a big fan of Levine's Mozart by the way, and the Alban Berg Quartet's Mozart string quartet box 

[Leo K.]

I really enjoying this disk this Easter morning (my first trek through it). This morning I started with Telemann's Matthew Passion, but decided I was in the mood for some galant goodness in the form of the early symphony!



Here is a short description from the Amazon product description:

Jan Willem de Vriend leads his orchestra with a flourish in these refreshing pieces that have an allure and style that cannot be missed.

For fourteen years Ricci (Como) was a regular guest at the court in The Hague. There he was a 'musicien particulier' and he wrote several works, chiefly instrumental, for the prince and other members of the court. Several of these compositions were published there, in Amsterdam or London. His opus 2, a volume containing six symphonies, was published in Amsterdam in 1766. The orchestra was a standard one as it had been used in Italy since 1720: two oboes, horn, violin, viola and double bass, and a harpsichord if desired. As to length, form and content, these works can hardly be likened to the symphonies of Mozart and Haydn. They are short pieces consisting of three movements, simple in tone, but very entertaining. Both harmonically and thematically, the music is very accessible. One or two passages, such as the first movement of the second symphony, present a small harmonic challenge to the listener. There is also variation in the instrumentation: in the minuet of the third symphony, Ricci suddenly presents a transverse flute. And the fourth and final symphony is even a violin concerto in disguise, including the cadenza at the end of the second movement.

The Radio Kamer Filharmonie (RKF) was founded in 2005 and is made up of a base of approximately sixty musicians that can when necessary be expanded to full symphony orchestra size or can be reduced to a chamber orchestra. Jan Willem de Vriend studied violin at the conservatories of Amsterdam and The Hague and founded the Combattimento Consort Amsterdam in 1982. As concert master and artistic director he has directed many extraordinary concerts and opera productions in the Netherlands and abroad.

[Gurn Blanston]

I really enjoying this disk this Easter morning (my first trek through it). This morning I started with Telemann's Matthew Passion, but decided I was in the mood for some galant goodness in the form of the early symphony!

Yup, I like that disk from time to time too. Certainly not heavyweight, which is perfect for those relaxed times. Ricci was a stranger to me before that, and otherwise still is. I think he is fairly similar to Sammartini in many ways, which can't be a bad thing.

For me, my weekly commune with the world beyond the stars, this week guided by Christoph Dohnanyi with the Cleveland Orchestra. A version with particularly good singing all round.



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Now playing:
Cleveland Orchestra/Dohnanyi - Op 125 Symphony #9 in d 3rd mvmt -  Adagio molto e cantabile

[Leo K.]

Yup, I like that disk from time to time too. Certainly not heavyweight, which is perfect for those relaxed times. Ricci was a stranger to me before that, and otherwise still is. I think he is fairly similar to Sammartini in many ways, which can't be a bad thing.

For me, my weekly commune with the world beyond the stars, this week guided by Christoph Dohnanyi with the Cleveland Orchestra. A version with particularly good singing all round.



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Now playing:
Cleveland Orchestra/Dohnanyi - Op 125 Symphony #9 in d 3rd mvmt -  Adagio molto e cantabile

I 've been getting a Ludwig Van No.9 inch again lately, so I may have to listen to my Furtwangler SACD release of the Lucerne 9 sometime soon 

[Gurn Blanston]

I 've been getting a Ludwig Van No.9 inch again lately, so I may have to listen to my Furtwangler SACD release of the Lucerne 9 sometime soon 

Yeah, I have to scratch that itch on occasion myself. Right now I have 82 versions that I rotate on a fairly regular basis. Got Furt in there somewhere...



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Now playing:
Cleveland Orchestra/Dohnanyi - Op 125 Symphony #9 in d 4th mvmt - Presto - Allegro assai / Recitative - Allegro assai