Gurn's Classical Corner

[mc ukrneal]

Perhaps I am late to the party, but did not see anything here on this new series by hyperion on the classical concerto:


It is scheduled for an August release. Very exciting!

[SonicMan46]

Perhaps I am late to the party, but did not see anything here on this new series by hyperion on the classical concerto:


It is scheduled for an August release. Very exciting!

Hi Neal - looking forward to the reviews on that new series - just curious about 'how many' Piano Concertos were composed by Dussek - list below from HERE; and just a few sentences from that article quoted immediately below - Dave

The Artaria Company published a thematic catalog of his works that is incomplete,[1] prompting Howard Craw to develop a new thematic catalog in 1964. Works are numbered in the order they were written prefixed by "C" or "Craw"; works of dubious origin are listed in a separately numbered section prefixed by "Craw D".

List of Piano Concerto by Dussek:
Op.1-1 (Craw 2) \ Piano Concerto No.1 (1783)
Op.1-2 (Craw 3) \ Piano Concerto No.2 (1783)
Op.1-3 (Craw 4) \ Piano Concerto No.3 (1783)
Op.3 (Craw 33) \ Piano Concerto No.4 (1787)
Op.14 (Craw 77) \ Piano Concerto No.5 (1791)
Op.17 (Craw 78) \ Piano Concerto No.6 (1792)
Op.22 (Craw 97) \ Piano Concerto No.7 (1793)
Op.27 (Craw 104) \ Piano Concerto No.8 (1794)
Op.29 (Craw 125) \ Piano Concerto No.9 (1795)
Op.40 (Craw 153) \ Piano Concerto No.10 (1799)
No opus number (Craw 158) \ Piano Concerto No.11 (1798?)
Op.49 (Craw 187) \ Piano Concerto No.12 (1801)
Op.70 (Craw 238) \ Piano Concerto No.13 (1810)
Piano Concerto Craw 1 (lost)
Piano Concerto Craw D7 (dubious)
Piano Concerto Craw D8 (dubious)

[mc ukrneal]

Hi Neal - looking forward to the reviews on that new series - just curious about 'how many' Piano Concertos were composed by Dussek - list below from HERE; and just a few sentences from that article quoted immediately below - Dave

List of Piano Concerto by Dussek:
Op.1-1 (Craw 2) \ Piano Concerto No.1 (1783)
Op.1-2 (Craw 3) \ Piano Concerto No.2 (1783)
Op.1-3 (Craw 4) \ Piano Concerto No.3 (1783)
Op.3 (Craw 33) \ Piano Concerto No.4 (1787)
Op.14 (Craw 77) \ Piano Concerto No.5 (1791)
Op.17 (Craw 78) \ Piano Concerto No.6 (1792)
Op.22 (Craw 97) \ Piano Concerto No.7 (1793)
Op.27 (Craw 104) \ Piano Concerto No.8 (1794)
Op.29 (Craw 125) \ Piano Concerto No.9 (1795)
Op.40 (Craw 153) \ Piano Concerto No.10 (1799)
No opus number (Craw 158) \ Piano Concerto No.11 (1798?)
Op.49 (Craw 187) \ Piano Concerto No.12 (1801)
Op.70 (Craw 238) \ Piano Concerto No.13 (1810)
Piano Concerto Craw 1 (lost)
Piano Concerto Craw D7 (dubious)
Piano Concerto Craw D8 (dubious)

He has at least one concerto for two pianos as well. I seem to recall I have a disc with that.

[clavichorder]

Anyone ever heard of Ernst Wilhelm Wolf?  Apparently there was a mutual admiration between him and C.P.E. Bach regarding each other's clavichord music.  There is a recording of some of his keyboard sonatas here, and I find them in an idiom very much informed by Carl Philip, lots to like here. 


Apparently he wrote symphonies too.  There is one recording of them, but they are not on period instruments.  There is however, a compilation CD of different obscure classical composers, with 2 of his symphonies, on period instruments, well performed.  I find them to be like a very baroque informed early-mid Haydn.  To be more precise, he doesn't do Haydn as well Haydn by a long shot, but there is surprisingly that aspect of the high baroque in them and a sturm und drang quality as well.  These were not the symphonies I expected from a composer of clavichord sonatas like CPE Bach.  Certain passages are almost like Concerto Grosso writing, but it is unmistakably classical at the same time.



I preferred his keyboard work to the symphonies, but nonetheless quality work in both.  The clavichord music is really worth getting excited over.

[Gurn Blanston]

Anyone ever heard of Ernst Wilhelm Wolf?  Apparently there was a mutual admiration between him and C.P.E. Bach regarding each other's clavichord music.  There is a recording of some of his keyboard sonatas here, and I find them in an idiom very much informed by Carl Philip, lots to like here. 


Apparently he wrote symphonies too.  There is one recording of them, but they are not on period instruments.  There is however, a compilation CD of different obscure classical composers, with 2 of his symphonies, on period instruments, well performed.  I find them to be like a very baroque informed early-mid Haydn.  To be more precise, he doesn't do Haydn as well Haydn by a long shot, but there is surprisingly that aspect of the high baroque in them and a sturm und drang quality as well.  These were not the symphonies I expected from a composer of clavichord sonatas like CPE Bach.  Certain passages are almost like Concerto Grosso writing, but it is unmistakably classical at the same time.



I preferred his keyboard work to the symphonies, but nonetheless quality work in both.  The clavichord music is really worth getting excited over.

I have that clavichord disk: it took emailing the performer and buying a copy out of his closet in Switzerland, but well worth the effort.  I collect keyboard sonatas from the Classic Era, and I found Wolf in this book, my bible for the genre:

[asin]0393006239[/asin]

Drat, no picture; here:



I haven't heard anything else by him though, although the symphonies sound interesting. Thanks for pointing them out, maybe I'll get lucky and find them! 

[SonicMan46]

Anyone ever heard of Ernst Wilhelm Wolf? 
 

Apparently he wrote symphonies too. 

I preferred his keyboard work to the symphonies, but nonetheless quality work in both.  The clavichord music is really worth getting excited over.

Ernst Wilhelm Wolf (1735-1792) - about Haydn's age - own nothing by this composer but love the clavichord - not sure about present availability?

However, I do have a half dozen discs of works by Joseph Wölfl (1773-1812) - SO many of these now little known composers - Dave

ADDENDUM: Just found the clavichord recording as a MP3 DL on Classicsonline for $8 - will do now!

[clavichorder]

I will have to invest in your bible, Gurn. 

I saw a while ago the works of Johann Melchoir Molter mentioned.  I fined this composer interesting, he was more of a baroque-classical transition figure, having been born in the 1690s.  He either sounds to me like Telemann with a very busy wind section in his works like overture suites, or more preclassical in his symphonies(similar feel but different in his concerti, maybe more of that brilliant baroque sound in some), but then there are these works of his called 'Sonata grossa', a type of piece he seems to have invented.  My favorite piece of his I've yet heard is one of these, on this disk, in G minor
.

Though that piece is more baroque, it has elements of the gallant in it.  I think Molter was a very inventive fellow with a charming style, and a knack for unpredictability, much like Telemann, only with a more progressive style being of a younger generation.

[clavichorder]

Another name I'd like to mention, though it may not be exactly at the heart of the repertoire that Gurn's classical corner is about, is Sebastian De Albero.  A younger Spanish contemporary of Domenico Scarlatti, who outlived him, Albero's sonatas are less virtuosic but sometimes very interestingly dissonant and quirkier yet than your usual Scarlatti.  The only recordings available in the Naxos Music Library are of his set of 30 sonatas, but Albero wrote some more works that are of an interesting form, a ricercar, fugue, and sonata.  Albero's ricercar is more or less a strange unmeasured piece that is hard to interpret, but an educated performer can do, though there will be much variation, his fugue's are interesting thematically but very long and thorny in the situations they get themselves into; but the sonatas of these groupings are somewhat more developed than the 30 sonatas from before, more like Scarlatti perhaps. 



My favorite sonatas on this disc are number's 4, 6, and 8.  Albero had really nice ideas and was not afraid to be very harmonically bold.  A very fun and rewarding composer to know and to play.

[Gurn Blanston]

I will have to invest in your bible, Gurn. 

Indeed, and worth your while. Hard to know what to hunt for without a program!

I saw a while ago the works of Johann Melchoir Molter mentioned.  I fined this composer interesting, he was more of a baroque-classical transition figure, having been born in the 1690s.  He either sounds to me like Telemann with a very busy wind section in his works like overture suites, or more preclassical in his symphonies(similar feel but different in his concerti, maybe more of that brilliant baroque sound in some), but then there are these works of his called 'Sonata grossa', a type of piece he seems to have invented.  My favorite piece of his I've yet heard is one of these, on this disk, in G minor
.

Though that piece is more baroque, it has elements of the gallant in it.  I think Molter was a very inventive fellow with a charming style, and a knack for unpredictability, much like Telemann, only with a more progressive style being of a younger generation.

Molter would be new to me, likely because of his time period, he was off my radar. Here is one who IS on my radar, and who should be of interest to you, given your apparent interests:



If you haven't run across him yet, you might well do; beautiful instrument too!

[Gurn Blanston]

Another name I'd like to mention, though it may not be exactly at the heart of the repertoire that Gurn's classical corner is about, is Sebastian De Albero.  A younger Spanish contemporary of Domenico Scarlatti, who outlived him, Albero's sonatas are less virtuosic but sometimes very interestingly dissonant and quirkier yet than your usual Scarlatti.  The only recordings available in the Naxos Music Library are of his set of 30 sonatas, but Albero wrote some more works that are of an interesting form, a ricercar, fugue, and sonata.  Albero's ricercar is more or less a strange unmeasured piece that is hard to interpret, but an educated performer can do, though there will be much variation, his fugue's are interesting thematically but very long and thorny in the situations they get themselves into; but the sonatas of these groupings are somewhat more developed than the 30 sonatas from before, more like Scarlatti perhaps. 



My favorite sonatas on this disc are number's 4, 6, and 8.  Albero had really nice ideas and was not afraid to be very harmonically bold.  A very fun and rewarding composer to know and to play.

Hmmm, that's interesting looking. I can easily see me tracking that disk down. I am not in a position to stream music, and I don't care for downloads unless that's all there is, but I will turn over plenty of stones to find an interesting CD...

[SonicMan46]

Well, I did a MP3 DL of the Wolf clavichord disc w/ Simmonds - on Classicsonline for $8 - now on my laptop, iPod, and burned to CD-R - listening to the latter @ the moment - the clavichord used is excellent and the sound is really 'up front' which I like; feel like I'm sitting next to the instrument - the music is enjoyable but just getting started - the booklet notes were part of the download - Dave

[Gurn Blanston]

Well, I did a MP3 DL of the Wolf clavichord disc w/ Simmonds - on Classicsonline for $8 - now on my laptop, iPod, and burned to CD-R - listening to the latter @ the moment - the clavichord used is excellent and the sound is really 'up front' which I like; feel like I'm sitting next to the instrument - the music is enjoyable but just getting started - the booklet notes were part of the download - Dave

I'm surprised I didn't post that disk here when I finally got it. Lord knows I worked at it long enough!    You were lucky to get the notes too, Dave. That's something which has made downloads more palatable these days (except when all it accomplishes is to tell you the notes really suck!  ) 

[SonicMan46]

I'm surprised I didn't post that disk here when I finally got it. Lord knows I worked at it long enough!    You were lucky to get the notes too, Dave. That's something which has made downloads more palatable these days (except when all it accomplishes is to tell you the notes really suck!  ) 

Hi Gurn - well, the notes were by Simmonds and are decent (Classicsonline does not always have the booklets but likely not under their control?) - but the clavichord is just excellent (still listening), so enjoying - decided to go ahead and order the Naxos symphony disc below (good review HERE)- the guy wrote a LOT of music, much lost and most not recorded - but we've been through this before!   Dave

[Gurn Blanston]

Hi Gurn - well, the notes were by Simmonds and are decent (Classicsonline does not always have the booklets but likely not under their control?) - but the clavichord is just excellent (still listening), so enjoying - decided to go ahead and order the Naxos symphony disc below (good review HERE)- the guy wrote a LOT of music, much lost and most not recorded - but we've been through this before!   Dave

Yes, I had a nice chat with Simmonds when I bought the disk. I wasn't kidding, he sold me one he had in his closet!!  I think he lives in Zurich, IIRC. Nice guy, anyway. I agree, the instrument itself is wonderful, and he plays it very well. Specialist, you know.

I really didn't know he wrote a lot or any of it was recorded. I think when I was hunting that keyboard disk, my search parameters were really narrow, mainly because his name is Wolf! So I didn't hit the symphonies, for example, although that disk may not have existed then either (2010?).

Yes, we have. When I go through that sort of travail to find some non-mainstream Haydn recording, one can imagine what it's like with a 'lesser' composer.

[SonicMan46]

Molter would be new to me, likely because of his time period, he was off my radar. Here is one who IS on my radar, and who should be of interest to you, given your apparent interests:



If you haven't run across him yet, you might well do; beautiful instrument too!

Gurn - I second the recommendation shown above - that 2-disc set was on my wish list for months and finally appeared @ a good price (can't remember where I bought it but was pleased w/ the price) - outstanding clavichord performance and well recorded!

Also, reviewed a 'short' Wiki article on Ernst Wolf - he was quite productive - below just a summary of his output (and who knows how much beyond what is known) - yet another of these forgotten composers that one could end up owning dozens of discs if available?  Dave

Symphonies 35+ (26 survived)
KB concertos 25 or so
KB sonatas 60+
Chamber works - numerous (survival?)

[Que]

Another name I'd like to mention, though it may not be exactly at the heart of the repertoire that Gurn's classical corner is about, is Sebastian De Albero.  A younger Spanish contemporary of Domenico Scarlatti, who outlived him, Albero's sonatas are less virtuosic but sometimes very interestingly dissonant and quirkier yet than your usual Scarlatti.  The only recordings available in the Naxos Music Library are of his set of 30 sonatas, but Albero wrote some more works that are of an interesting form, a ricercar, fugue, and sonata.  Albero's ricercar is more or less a strange unmeasured piece that is hard to interpret, but an educated performer can do, though there will be much variation, his fugue's are interesting thematically but very long and thorny in the situations they get themselves into; but the sonatas of these groupings are somewhat more developed than the 30 sonatas from before, more like Scarlatti perhaps. 



My favorite sonatas on this disc are number's 4, 6, and 8.  Albero had really nice ideas and was not afraid to be very harmonically bold.  A very fun and rewarding composer to know and to play.

Laure Colladant did a 2CD-set on the fortpiano: (unfortunately still on my wish list..)

[asin]B000025ZKX[/asin]
Q

PS Let me add my praise about the Muthel set by Menno van Dellft - love it, and one of the best recorded clavichord  discs I know.

[clavichorder]

What do you guys think of the symphonies of Dittersdorf? 



That CD probably has my favorite selection of symphonies of his I've heard.  I wasn't as fond of the Ovid Metamorphis symphonies.  I understand there is another CD, this one



and I am investigating it right now.

I've always been curious about Dittersdorf, because some of his music is admittedly formulaic and simplistic, but there is a certain inventiveness to it sometimes that is attractive. 

[SonicMan46]

What do you guys think of the symphonies of Dittersdorf? 

 

That CD probably has my favorite selection of symphonies of his I've heard.  I wasn't as fond of the Ovid Metamorphis symphonies.  I understand there
and I am investigating it right now.  I've always been curious about Dittersdorf, because some of his music is admittedly formulaic and simplistic, but there is a certain inventiveness to it sometimes that is attractive.

Dittersdorf (nee Carl Ditters before given a fake title - ) has his own thread HERE started back in 2009 - not much activity until the second page, BUT there is a link to a more thorough thread from the 'old' forum and also search my link to his autobiography (dictated to his son at the end of Dittersdorf's life) - a quick and interesting read.

As for me, I have about 8 CDs or so - Symphonies & Chamber Music mainly (plus his Giob oratorio) - I've enjoyed nearly all of Dittersdorf music, including the symphonies - I have the second Naxos CD shown above - and the 6 based on Ovid on the Chandos label (apparently there is another set on a different label - attached is a Fanfare review from 1990 comparing the two sets, if interested) - Dave

[Florestan]

I'm not familiar with his symphonies, but his string quartets and quintets are a delight.

[Gurn Blanston]

I have only a little Ditters, I have those Naxos disks and quite like them. Also, the Ovid disks by Cantilena:

[asin]B000LZLDPK[/asin]

which is really quite nicely played, whatever you think of the music. I like it, but hey, that's just me.

I also have these:



Also, this series, Baroque Bohemia & Beyond has quite a bit of Ditters blended in. Like the nice violin concerto on this one:



Ditters was a very highly esteemed composer in his time. It's true, his star faded in the 19th century, when only the more unusual composers survived the cut. Two composers from that time who are off the mainstream and who I can recommend are Ditters and Vanhal. Some other who are even more off the mainstream are Myslivecek and Georg Benda and Ignaz Beck. Of course, there are many others before and after, but I'm taking a very specific time period here, mainly the 1760's & '70's. You can feel confident you aren't wasting time and money if you reach out to these guys, they are always good, occasionally very good.