Vagn Holmboe (1909-1996)

[Madiel]

Tangentially . . . on the Wikipedia page of his list of works . . . (and maybe you addressed this erewhile, and I was inattentive, sorry).

We read, e.g.:

Did I mistake, when forming an impression that, in fact, Kairos consists in a later-composed Preludio, two Interludi, and Postludio, which can either be played commingled with the Sinfonias I - III, or played together as Sinfonia IV (Kairos)?

That is, is the table wrong in this remark?

Kairos consists of all 4 Sinfonias, but in the sequence:

Prelude from Sinfonia IV
Sinfonia I
Interlude I from Sinfonia IV
Sinfonia II
Interlude II from Sinfonia IV
Sinfonia III
Postlude from Sinofnia IV.

That is, Sinfonia IV can be fractured and wrapped around the other 3.

It depends on which recording you have, the BIS or the Da Capo, on how this is offered to you. Da Capo's original issue gave you Kairos as an entire separate disc. The BIS recording gives you Kairos but then gives Sinfonia IV on its own so it can be listened to as a separate 4-movement work.

[Madiel]

Addendum: It's not clear to me just when Holmboe has this unusual idea. Sinfonia IV was written slightly later than the others and in fact it's a bit stylistically different as it's right around when he was transitioning to his "modern" phase.

I think it's most likely that the first 3 were each conceived as entirely separate pieces (they were all premiered separately), without an intention of joining them, and then he decided he could put them together and wrote the joining music.

[Karl Henning]

Thanks for the enlightenment!

[North Star]

Kairos consists of all 4 Sinfonias, but in the sequence:

Prelude from Sinfonia IV
Sinfonia I
Interlude I from Sinfonia IV
Sinfonia II
Interlude II from Sinfonia IV
Sinfonia III
Postlude from Sinofnia IV.

That is, Sinfonia IV can be fractured and wrapped around the other 3.

It depends on which recording you have, the BIS or the Da Capo, on how this is offered to you. Da Capo's original issue gave you Kairos as an entire separate disc. The BIS recording gives you Kairos but then gives Sinfonia IV on its own so it can be listened to as a separate 4-movement work.

The Da Capo box also gives Sinfonias 1-4 in order separately, as well as Kairos on a different disc. The liner notes say that "when the last of them, Sinfonia IV, was written in 1962, Holmboe realized that the four works together - in a different order - could be viewed as one large work".  Quoth Holmboe: "Kairos means 'time' in the psychological sense - that is, the passage of time that we sense - as opposed to Chronos, which is the name for the time that can be divided into seconds and minutes. Apart from the general variability of time that arises betwee concentrated and relaxed periods, I have further attempted to elucidate this among other ways through the alternation of objective-abstractive and subjective-expressive passages, through various simultaneously acting sequences and through the timelessness of the metamorphoses in the chronological sense."

[krummholz]

Addendum: It's not clear to me just when Holmboe has this unusual idea. Sinfonia IV was written slightly later than the others and in fact it's a bit stylistically different as it's right around when he was transitioning to his "modern" phase.

I think it's most likely that the first 3 were each conceived as entirely separate pieces (they were all premiered separately), without an intention of joining them, and then he decided he could put them together and wrote the joining music.

I agree, the styles of Sinfonias I through III are similar and they share important thematic material, but IV seems to inhabit a totally different, almost expressionistic (as in, 2nd Viennese School) world, even though it also shares some of the same material. I'm not completely sure the "joining" works, especially at the start of Sinfonia I (movement 2 in Kairos). There is a disconnect there that always bothers me; also to a lesser degree at the start of movement 4 (Sinfonia II). The movement-to-movement progress of Sinfonia IV, though, works MUCH better in my opinion in Kairos than in the standalone Sinfonia. So it does seem plausible to me that Sinfonia IV was written specifically to join the movements in Kairos, except for the fact that he published it as a separate work.

It's a very interesting an absorbing piece though. Sinfonia II is one of my very favorite Holmboe works, full of austere lyricism and some truly awesome polyphonic passages.

[SymphonicAddict]

I already had posted some impressions about the Symphony No. 8. Yesterday I listened to it again. I can't be wrong upon saying that it's truly an amazingly powerful piece, a pinnacle of the Nordic symphonic literature. It's the dark nature and the vibrant rhythms that appeal to me the most. Holmboe also used the timpani in a way that is not less than grandiose, accentuating emphatically some crutial moments. The way it ends is incredibly tense and dramatic, a tautly stirring struggle of significant proportions (I really love that!), one of the most draining endings I know, it keeps you at the edge of your seat!

In addition, I found out there is another recording of it, performed by the American S.O. and Botstein. Does anyone know it?

[Christo]

In addition, I found out there is another recording of it, performed by the American S.O. and Botstein. Does anyone know it?

I do, it's on Spotify (as are all or at least most of these Botstein recordings, often a daring repertoire). It's fine, but not as concentrated as the BIS recording, AFAIR.

[SymphonicAddict]

I do, it's on Spotify (as are all or at least most of these Botstein recordings, often a daring repertoire). It's fine, but not as concentrated as the BIS recording, AFAIR.

Thank you. Good to know it, then I've listened to the right performance all this time.

[Ghost of Baron Scarpia]

Prompted by some mention (maybe Symphonyaddict) I listened to the Concerto for Orchestra, which I didn't really like, but the other two piece on the disc, Violin Concerto No 2 and Viola Concerto, made a big impression. Both struck me as a departure from Holmboe's 'international' style, with some reference to national styles. They bother seemed to fit the definition of "neoclassical" rather than romantic, and both used dramatic orchestral effects. Glad that it was brought to my attention.

[Alex Bozman]

Thank you. Good to know it, then I've listened to the right performance all this time.

I always preferred the Jerzy Semkow version of Holmboe's 8th on Turnabout LP to the Arwel Hughes BIS version. It seemed to me the percussion, which plays an important part in this symphony, was sharper in the Semkow interpretation.

[Madiel]

Prompted by some mention (maybe Symphonyaddict) I listened to the Concerto for Orchestra, which I didn't really like, but the other two piece on the disc, Violin Concerto No 2 and Viola Concerto, made a big impression. Both struck me as a departure from Holmboe's 'international' style, with some reference to national styles. They bother seemed to fit the definition of "neoclassical" rather than romantic, and both used dramatic orchestral effects. Glad that it was brought to my attention.

I don't know that anyone ever considered Holmboe to be romantic, in terms of the classical-romantic spectrum.

[SymphonicAddict]

Prompted by some mention (maybe Symphonyaddict) I listened to the Concerto for Orchestra, which I didn't really like, but the other two piece on the disc, Violin Concerto No 2 and Viola Concerto, made a big impression. Both struck me as a departure from Holmboe's 'international' style, with some reference to national styles. They bother seemed to fit the definition of "neoclassical" rather than romantic, and both used dramatic orchestral effects. Glad that it was brought to my attention.

Yes, I was. I've seen through several posts you don't like noisy works that much (I remember Tubin for that matter), so that Concerto wasn't going to be a work of your tastes (however, I did like it a lot). As for the other concertos, according to my notes, they are very good indeed, above all the Viola one, being one of his last concertos, and curiously I was expecting something harsher and dissonant, but it turned out a vey nice surprise.

[SymphonicAddict]

I always preferred the Jerzy Semkow version of Holmboe's 8th on Turnabout LP to the Arwel Hughes BIS version. It seemed to me the percussion, which plays an important part in this symphony, was sharper in the Semkow interpretation.

I was born in the CD era, so I never had any LPs 

I don't know whether there is any recording on CD of it. I would like to hear it!

EDIT: BTW, welcome to this magnificent forum!

[vandermolen]

I always preferred the Jerzy Semkow version of Holmboe's 8th on Turnabout LP to the Arwel Hughes BIS version. It seemed to me the percussion, which plays an important part in this symphony, was sharper in the Semkow interpretation.

Totally agree with you - my first encounter with Holmboe's music. That and a Turnabout LP of Hilding Rosenberg's 6th Symphony made a big impression on my youthful self. I'm sorry that AFAIK the Holmoe recording, unlike the Rosenberg, was never released on CD.

[Madiel]

It would appear the Semkow version has been repackaged.

https://www.youtube.com/v/cb6IQNRiQ9M


Probably on download/streaming services?

The opening doesn't sound as intense to me as the BIS on a first very brief listen. Nevertheless, the mere fact of having multiple versions of a Holmboe work is always notable.

[Madiel]

Scratch that. It is only the first movement that's been made available. 

[vandermolen]

Scratch that. It is only the first movement that's been made available. 

Thanks for the info anyway.

It's great to hear that recording again, albeit just the opening movement.

I played it through twice with much pleasure.

I think that it has a greater sense urgency than the , very good, BIS recording.

Neither of the fine Holmboe LPs I had ever made it to CD.

[Ghost of Baron Scarpia]

Yes, I was. I've seen through several posts you don't like noisy works that much (I remember Tubin for that matter), so that Concerto wasn't going to be a work of your tastes (however, I did like it a lot). As for the other concertos, according to my notes, they are very good indeed, above all the Viola one, being one of his last concertos, and curiously I was expecting something harsher and dissonant, but it turned out a vey nice surprise.

I was (pleasantly) surprised by the viola concerto, in that it by incorporating ethnic elements and having what seemed like a more conventional harmonic underpinning, it seemed to go against the abstract style I had come to expect after listening to some of the symphonies in the BIS series (many years ago).

[vandermolen]

Actually I've been playing the BIS recording of Symphony 8 today and think it's a very fine performance. I also think that the symphony is one of the greatest of the 20th Century. The third movement seems to demonstrate the influence of Shostakovich but nothing takes away from the originality of this great work:

[SymphonicAddict]

Actually I've been playing the BIS recording of Symphony 8 today and think it's a very fine performance. I also think that the symphony is one of the greatest of the 20th Century. The third movement seems to demonstrate the influence of Shostakovich but nothing takes away from the originality of this great work:

I agree with all this. It's an exceptional symphony. This work doesn't seem to have any "happy moment", it's rather rigourous throughout. The slow movement contains a sort of melancholy tune I find a bit touching.