Havergal Brian.

[Philip Legge]

I'm puzzled now because the first ones I downloaded, shortly after they were originally posted, have a sample rate of 320k, whereas these new ones seem to be 128.  I haven't listened, but are they really better?

And sorry not to see anyone after the Prom - I took a look at the queue at the Queen's Arms, where there appeared to be one person serving, and thought a 2-hour Gothic was enough, without a 2-hour wait for a pint.  And had to keep myself fresh for a visit to Legoland the next day  - although I feel that as well as a Lego St Paul's and Houses of Parliament it needs a Lego Albert Hall - perhaps with 800 Lego choristers singing their heads off inside...

DF

Hi Dave,

these are better, despite the lower bit-depth of 256kbps compared to 320kbps. However they are not the best possible, because they are a stereo rip, and 4MBS recording engineer Mike Le Voi's article makes clear that the Brisbane Gothic would stand being released in the Super Audio CD format with 4.0 or perhaps 5.1 sound channels rather than the usual two. And the Brabbins recording similarly could be treated to a much better mix than what went out live over the airwaves.

Typing on iPhone last night, one thing I omitted was that English suite 4 was composed just before Brian commenced the orchestration of Part Two of the Gothic, and so some of the more unusual instrumentations (the Jingle) might have been trial runs for particular effects in the larger work. The sound of the orchestra on the 1977 LP is not up to the remarkable standards of the LSSO, but something of the work comes across. Unfortunately the African (or Indian?) long drum doesn't sound terribly well. When I heard the MGS Orchestra play through this circa 2004 Martin Rutherford had a pair of congas in addition to bass drum and side drum, which gives a much earthier "world music" sound than the military sounding bass and side drums would have by themselves.

It seems we are on the verge of 2,000 posts, but it's worth noting that 1,600 of these have been written in the last eight months since the subject "warmed up" with the Brisbane Gothic nearing its performance in December 2010. Have a look at about page 24 for the hilarious explosion of glee and excitement when news of the Proms Gothic came out.

Brian, your article on the critics of Havergal Brian is a very intelligently argued and good piece of work – would you have any objection to it being reprinted in the Havergal Brian Society newsletter if I were to point it out to the editor? (I gather he may already be aware of it.)

Cheers, Philip

[cilgwyn]

Regarding the quality of the Hull Youth SO uploads. Not knowing allot about bit rates,etc (yet!) I cannot vouch for the quality of those uploads. The sound of the actual cd's is pretty good. Hopefully,the uploads are good enough. If not,Johan might be able to help.
Meanwhile,I shall swot up on the subject,a bit.

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

The bitrate of the HYO's files is 128kbps.


There is an excellent (and free) music player, called foobar2000, with which you can rip your CDs to a great many formats (FLAC, mp3 et cetera). You might take a look at that. It will require a bit of study, though...

[John Whitmore]

Regarding the quality of the Hull Youth SO uploads. Not knowing allot about bit rates,etc (yet!) I cannot vouch for the quality of those uploads. The sound of the actual cd's is pretty good. Hopefully,the uploads are good enough. If not,Johan might be able to help.
Meanwhile,I shall swot up on the subject,a bit.

128 kbps is a bit on the low side but I've made CDs from your files and they sound fine through speakers. Very good results. Recording quality is really excellent. I've played the whole set through twice now and to be brutal about it I personally find it hard to enjoy listening to orchestral playing of this standard. There are obviously some good individual players in the band but the corporate sound, especially the strings, isn't very appealing. As a one off live event, OK, but for repeated listening I'm defeated. The whole thing is just too approximate and thin.

[John Whitmore]

128 kbps is a bit on the low side but I've made CDs from your files and they sound fine through speakers. Very good results. Recording quality is really excellent. I've played the whole set through twice now and to be brutal about it I personally find it hard to enjoy listening to orchestral playing of this standard. There are obviously some good individual players in the band but the corporate sound, especially the strings, isn't very appealing. As a one off live event, OK, but for repeated listening I'm defeated. The whole thing is just too approximate and thin.

PS In Memorium is actually OK (or at least most of it). It's not taxing to play and defeats the orchestra less than the rest.

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

In the past 33 years or so I have learned to cope with almost anything for the pleasure of listening to Brian's music - cassettes with monumental hiss, bad performances by professional orchestras, disappointing readings on good-sounding CDs et cetera. When I heard the Hull Youth Orchestra recordings in the 1980s I was both horrified and amused. Now that I know the pieces they are playing, I compensate mentally for the deficiencies that are there, so that the performances can still be enjoyed by me... But it's a desperate measure!

[cilgwyn]

When I first heard these recordings,all those years ago (!),I remember thinking that there was something wrong with the record or Brian's string section must be very strange,to say the least. But it was all there was,and I desperately wanted to hear more Brian & this was the only way! Also,the first record I had was the one with 'In Memoriam' and 'Festal Dance',not the more complex works,that stretch them  beyond their juvenile abilities. And I do,strange as it may seem,prefer these two particular to the Naxos performances.
On the other hand,if I was you John, coming to these performances,for the first time,with all the recordings that are now available,I would probably feel exactly the way you do. A bit like chalk on a school blackboard!
Imagine if they performed the Gothic like that?

Third edit: Sorry about the style of this post. I had to slip out for a moment.

[John Whitmore]

When I first heard these recordings,all those years ago (!),I remember thinking that there was something wrong with the record or Brian's string section must be very strange,to say the least. But it was all there was,and I desperately wanted to hear more Brian & this was the only way! Also,the first record I had was the one with 'In Memoriam' and 'Festal Dance',not the more complex works,that stretch them  beyond their juvenile abilities. And I do,strange as it may seem,prefer these to the Naxos performances.
On the other hand,if I was you John, coming to these performances,for the first time,with all the recordings that are now available,I would probably feel exactly the way you do.
Imagine if they performed the Gothic like that?

Third edit: Sorry about the style of this post. I had to slip out for a moment.

I find it hard listening to the LSSO at times but Hull is a bridge too far.

[cilgwyn]

Hull on earth,it appears!

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

I find it hard listening to the LSSO at times but Hull is a bridge too far.

Hull on earth, it appears!

[cilgwyn]

I like you're Shakespeare quote!

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

It's one of the great moments of Western drama - Cleopatra seeing Antony return from battle, thinking all has been won...

[John Whitmore]

It's one of the great moments of Western drama - Cleopatra seeing Antony return from battle, thinking all has been won...

Carry on Cleo. Now there's a work of art. Sid James RIP.

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

This thread could be called Carry On Brian.

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

A snippet from the Judex movement, taken with a mobile phone by another Brianite, unfortunately stopping just before the final cataclysm...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jmSL0lsHQZg


[corrected]

[John Whitmore]

A snippet from the Judex movement, taken with a mobile phone by another Brianite, unfortunately stopping just before the final cataclysm...


http://www.youtube.com/watch/v/jmSL0lsHQZg

The link isn't working.

[Dax]

I wonder - did you download the new, improved mp3s of the Brisbane Gothic? They're terrific.
http://www.mediafire.com/?km7z6cl54mpyv

Very many thanks for that!

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

Brian in The Economist.


http://www.economist.com/node/21524808

[John Whitmore]

This thread could be called Carry On Brian.

Maybe Ken Russell could make one of his fabulous composer films. What about "Life of Brian"? Has a ring to it.

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

I have heard that nice ring too many times already!  See the last link to The Economist article...