Havergal Brian.

[Sergeant Rock]

Go to this link and scroll down. You will find a free download of Scherchen's Westminster recording. Well worth getting. No catch. You don't have to sign up or even give an email address. I have all of this catalogue downloaded and transferred to CD. Take a browse.

http://www.rediscovery.us/conductors2.html

Wow...a treasure trove! Thanks for the link, John. I'm listening to Ristenpart's Haydn now (the Sinfonia Concertante) while waiting for the Gliere to download.

Sarge

[John Whitmore]

Wow...a treasure trove! Thanks for the link, John. I'm listening to Ristenpart's Haydn now (the Sinfonia Concertante) while waiting for the Gliere to download.

Sarge

If you go to conductors A - L you will find one of the great recordings by Anshel Brusilow. This is one of the gems in the Rediscovery catalogue. The Arensky is absolutely electrifyng.

[Sergeant Rock]

If you go to conductors A - L you will find one of the great recordings by Anshel Brusilow. This is one of the gems in the Rediscovery catalogue. The Arensky is absolutely electrifyng.

Brusilow...a conductor I've never heard of. I will check him out.

Sarge

[John Whitmore]

Brusilow...a conductor I've never heard of. I will check him out.

Sarge

He was Ormandy's leader at the Philadelphia. He played the solo on Ormandy's Scheherazade and Heldenleben to name but 2.

[cilgwyn]

Thank you John. As you can see I'm very pro Faberman. It was the first recording I ever heard of this symphony so I will always have a special affection for it! It's also great that there are sellers on Amazon who are prepared to offer the original Unicorn set for such a low,low price!! £2.74p! And I just looked on a whim!!
That said that,I've been looking for a cd of the Scherchen for a long time. I remember trying a link on one site a while back but to my dismay the download had been removed! Let's face it Scherchen got there first with a complete recording. In fact according to one Gliere pundit his recording is the best ever! I also have no problem with old recordings having a collection of early acoustic and electrical recordings dating back to the early years of the last century.

Cheers!

[cilgwyn]

Great sound,John! No worries about restrictive mono sound here,this is excellent. Plenty of perspective,a nice bass quality to the sound but not muffled or boomy. And unlike some transfers I can think of,none of that horrible airless 'under water' (as someone described it somewhere) sound quality. In other words any extraneous noise removed isn't at the expense of listening pleasure. Excellent,for it's period. I definitely prefer this to the Downes recording.
Still haven't got to the end of the symphony,I should point out.
Again,thank you and to 'ReDiscovery' of course! I'm glad I waffled on about Gliere,now,and hopefully 'Sarge' is too! (Well,for the link you provided not my waffle! )

No "overlong,fossilised dog turd" here!

[John Whitmore]

Great sound,John! No worries about restrictive mono sound here,this is excellent. Plenty of perspective,a nice bass quality to the sound but not muffled or boomy. And unlike some transfers I can think of,none of that horrible airless 'under water' (as someone described it somewhere) sound quality. In other words any extraneous noise removed isn't at the expense of listening pleasure. Excellent,for it's period. I definitely prefer this to the Downes recording.
Still haven't got to the end of the symphony,I should point out.
Again,thank you and to 'ReDiscovery' of course! I'm glad I waffled on about Gliere,now,and hopefully 'Sarge' is too! (Well,for the link you provided not my waffle! )

No "overlong,fossilised dog turd" here!

It is rather good especially for an ancient Westminster mono LP. Some restorations just go too far and get rid of all the vinyl background. Trouble is, the sound is also decimated and dessicated if you do this. David Gideon (ReDiscovery) and Curt Timmons (Klassic Haus) get it just right - reduced background, a wee tweak with the general sound quality but no destructive over-filtering. Most of my collaborations have been with Curt (around 40 so far) but if you go to "performers" on the ReDiscovery site you will find two of my efforts - Jenner's Brahms 2 (very rare WRC stereo) and a glorious Robert Gerle version of the Brahms Hungarian Dances (Westminster). Both of these came up as fresh as new paint. I'm no fan of Gliere - there are hints of dog poo about it I've just finished three titles for Curt, due for January release - WRC G and S overtures (RPO/Alwyn), WRC Beethoven Fiddle concerto and Piano concerto No.3 (Cyroulnik and Jenner respectively) and a superlative 1964 stereo Elgar collection by Weldon - just fantastic in all respects. The best Cockaigne I've come across. All good fun. Happy listening on ReDiscovery - get a spindle of blanks and some printer paper and you will soon have a magnificent collection for the cost of a few pints.

[cilgwyn]

Only hints of dog poo?
That's good!!
Too late for a detailed reply,I'm afraid;but I really did enjoy the Scherchen performance. The second movement with those sultry maidens was particularly arresting,the flow of the music voluptuously caressed and shaped.......not to mention those aforementioned sultry maidens!

http://www.clarihorn.freeserve.co.uk/gliere/

[springrite]

Only hints of dog poo?

Interesting how people feel the need to specify what kind of poo ...

I am in a hotel and after one night sleep, I see I have download 0.8% of  the Gleire. I think I will try when I get home.

[John Whitmore]

Only hints of dog poo?
That's good!!
Too late for a detailed reply,I'm afraid;but I really did enjoy the Scherchen performance. The second movement with those sultry maidens was particularly arresting,the flow of the music voluptuously caressed and shaped.......not to mention those aforementioned sultry maidens!

http://www.clarihorn.freeserve.co.uk/gliere/

Just been to the Gliere site from your link and within it there is a link to the ReDiscovery/Scherchen but it doesn't work properly. In Ireland they refer to this symphony as Gliere's Turd Symphony, hence the dog poo allusion

[cilgwyn]

But cats,lovable cuddly little creatures that they are (and of vastly superior intelligence to dogs who are,lets face it a few slices short of the proverbial sandwich) have the decency and consideration to dig a little hole in the ground after they've done their business,so people with big feet like me don't step in cat poo! All of which means that it's difficult to compare musical works with cat poo,because you don't really have the prerequisite mental image in your head to make the appropriate comparison in the first place.
All of which reminds me of a story about my grandfather who was very keen on cycling going out one day on his bicycle many years ago. Unfortunately for him the circus had been to town. The result,an unfortunate accident with an extremely large pile of elephant dung!
B***** council workers! You'd think they'd have cleaned it up!

Regarding that link. Yes,I tried that,John.
By the way,I'm listening to Gliere's thingummy right now!

Incidentally,after buying that s/h unicorn cd of Faberman's Gliere 3,I couldn't resist trying something else by the same conductor.More b***** expense! I knew I shouldn't have bought it!! Interestingly,although the cd booklet mentions him embarking on a mahler recording project,there is little sign of one in the form of available cds. I ended up buying his recording of Ives Fourth. Apparently he takes the second movement slower than anyone else. A slow conductor,it seems!! Unfortunately the same seller was flogging a cd of his first and second,so I ended up buying that cd as well!! Apparently,Faberman was the first conductor to record all four and they do get some praise on the 'Charles Ives' website;although the finale of No3 doesn't include bells!! Tut! Tut! I like mavericks,outsiders and unusual combos,so I had to buy these. Abravanel is another one! Sibelius in the desert?! That sounded pretty wierd,but he's actually very good!! I like his Mahler and Antar (Rimsky-Korsakov) too.
Faberman would have been an interesting choice for the Gothic if he'd ever been introduced to it. A slow Gothic? (Imagine sitting there for three hours?) or a slow 'Das Siegeslied?!'

Or no Das Siegeslied?!!

[cilgwyn]

Nearly 300 pages! I know,I'll list my favourite Brian works!

Symphony no 3 (my favourite! Endlessly fascinating,enigmatic)
Symphony No 2 (brooding,mysterious and tragic)
Symphony No 7  (Mysterious,full of atmosphere,enigmatic)
Symphony No 10 (Brian's best?)
Symphony No 11 (Pastoral,Brian at his most serene and beautiful)
Symphonies 13-14 (utterly absorbing,packed with imagination)
Symphony No 21  (Underrated,some wonderful music here)
Symphony No 22-24 (Craggy marvels packed with invention)
Symphony No 30 & 31 (Like cryptic puzzles,so absorbing)
Violin Concerto (one of the few Violin concertos I actually like)
The Tigers     (An eccentric masterpiece?!!)
English Suites (Full of inventive ideas & colour,find
                      the Second,please!)
Festal Dance (Hull Youth include the piano! Fair play!
             

Oops missed out No's 6 & 16 (but foods on the way!!)

Runner up:
the Gothic symphony!

Least favourite:

Das Siegeslied
The Jolly Miller Overture

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

I have been busy, hence my silence. I will check out that Scherchen Glière. I love the Third Symphony. Never had any trouble with Edward Downes, though. I also have Botstein and Ormandy. It's been a while, so I don't know exactly how good those other performances were. As for that Brian list, I think I must bow out. There are simply too many pieces I love.

[John Whitmore]

I have been busy, hence my silence. I will check out that Scherchen Glière. I love the Third Symphony. Never had any trouble with Edward Downes, though. I also have Botstein and Ormandy. It's been a while, so I don't know exactly how good those other performances were. As for that Brian list, I think I must bow out. There are simply too many pieces I love.

Beware with Scherchen. The Gliere is OK but other than that I've yet to hear a good performance from him but to be fair most of his Westminsters (also on WRC in the 1960s) were with that dreadful Vienna State Opera mob. Some of his horrors that spring to mind are Vltava, Bartered Bride, the Liiszt Hungarian Rhapsodies, an Espana that collapses, Manfred (Schumann), a Bolero that's all over the shop, some scrappy French overtures a peculiar set of Brandenburgs and some very shoddy Mahler. When I listen to him I wonder if he actually had a beat because there is just no clear direction that comes over to the listener. He doesn't seem to care about things such as ensemble and intonation. Was he Edward Heath or Lord Menuhin in disguise? Talking of Westminster/Vienna SSO I urge anyone that enjoys a good laugh to search out Boult's stereo Planets. Mars actually collapses and the 1st horn makes several mistakes throughout the work. Jupiter is beyond them. Maybe they were sight reading. Honestly - get hold of it. A real hoot.

[cilgwyn]

It's  nice to see people discussing music here. Everyone seems to be far more interested in discussing Marmite over at the Art Music Forum. Why don't they just rename it the Art Marmite Forum? And I started it! I just mentioned (in passing) the fact that I had stocked up with seven jars of Vegemite!! If it was corned beef or baked beans would they all be sitting around having heated debates about that? Well baked beans maybe?!!

The Scherchen Gliere 3 is highly rated by some from what I have seen on various threads and reviews in various parts of the web. I also gather Botstein on Telarc is supposed to be one of the worst. I see that Gliere actually recorded a cut version himself,which would be interesting to hear. No timing indications on the Gliere website and as far as I can make out you can't get it on cd;although No2,and No1 (I think?) have been available.

Disappointing that Scherchen's other recordings sound so dodgy! I really did enjoy the Scherchen;although Faberman's the only one who really makes this score sound good as far as I'm concerned.
One other point! It really is nice to have the original Unicorn cover artwork,with that strange looking horseman. Very eye catching,particularly on the original gatefold Lp sleeve;and imo,very well chosen. It's also nice not to have to program out that Cello Concerto! Why this mania for fill ups? I remember buying s/h copies of Elgar symphonies and VW's Job,so I could enjoy them without programing out fill-ups. I accept using the program button isn't exactly like having to build the Burma railway single handedly;but the Elgar symphonies and VW's Job are substantial works. I don't need fill ups!

Popular albums of bands and singers are even worse in this respect. Classic albums ruined by bonus tracks that were all too obviously left in the can for reasons other than Lp duration timings. Yes,they are occasionally interesting;but even then they spoil the balance of the original album. Again,it's often a good idea to look for the original cd release,which can often be much cheaper,because people want the remastered one with the bonus tracks.
Of course,I can make a cdr without the offending extras. But I don't always want to!

Not that I'm against fill-ups. It's just the need to fill every left over gap just in case someone gets worked up because there is a bit of left over! As a matter of fact,well chosen fill ups can be very rewarding. For example, Barbirolli's Elgar 2 coupled with Sospiri & Elegy,Barbirolli No1 with the 'Cockaigne Overture' or his recording of VW's Fifth Symphony with Bax's 'Tintagel' (Grrreeat!! )

As to the Brian list. I sympathise with your viewpoint. To be honest I was just trying to bring the thread towards the 300 page mark,although I do stand by the two 'least favourites' cited! The AMF forum had a thread on "What music couldn't you live without?". After much mulling over and pencil made lists,I decided there was no way I could possibly post such a list. I also pointed out that however much I like music I'm not going to stick my head in a gas oven,take an overdose,jump off a cliff or get a rope (any more suggestions?! ) because I can't listen to music! Quite frankly I'll just carry on trying to write fiction,paint,draw,read,watch dvds,videos,eat,drink,******** and sleep like I usually do!!

[John Whitmore]

It's  nice to see people discussing music here. Everyone seems to be far more interested in discussing Marmite over at the Art Music Forum. Why don't they just rename it the Art Marmite Forum? And I started it! I just mentioned (in passing) the fact that I had stocked up with seven jars of Vegemite!! If it was corned beef or baked beans would they all be sitting around having heated debates about that? Well baked beans maybe?!!

The Scherchen Gliere 3 is highly rated by some from what I have seen on various threads and reviews in various parts of the web. I also gather Botstein on Telarc is supposed to be one of the worst. I see that Gliere actually recorded a cut version himself,which would be interesting to hear. No timing indications on the Gliere website and as far as I can make out you can't get it on cd;although No2,and No1 (I think?) have been available.

Disappointing that Scherchen's other recordings sound so dodgy! I really did enjoy the Scherchen;although Faberman's the only one who really makes this score sound good as far as I'm concerned.
One other point! It really is nice to have the original Unicorn cover artwork,with that strange looking horseman. Very eye catching,particularly on the original gatefold Lp sleeve;and imo,very well chosen. It's also nice not to have to program out that Cello Concerto! Why this mania for fill ups? I remember buying s/h copies of Elgar symphonies and VW's Job,so I could enjoy them without programing out fill-ups. I accept using the program button isn't exactly like having to build the Burma railway single handedly;but the Elgar symphonies and VW's Job are substantial works. I don't need fill ups!

Popular albums of bands and singers are even worse in this respect. Classic albums ruined by bonus tracks that were all too obviously left in the can for reasons other than Lp duration timings. Yes,they are occasionally interesting;but even then they spoil the balance of the original album. Again,it's often a good idea to look for the original cd release,which can often be much cheaper,because people want the remastered one with the bonus tracks.
Of course,I can make a cdr without the offending extras. But I don't always want to!

Not that I'm against fill-ups. It's just the need to fill every left over gap just in case someone gets worked up because there is a bit of left over! As a matter of fact,well chosen fill ups can be very rewarding. For example, Barbirolli's Elgar 2 coupled with Sospiri & Elegy,Barbirolli No1 with the 'Cockaigne Overture' or his recording of VW's Fifth Symphony with Bax's 'Tintagel' (Grrreeat!! )

As to the Brian list. I sympathise with your viewpoint. To be honest I was just trying to bring the thread towards the 300 page mark,although I do stand by the two 'least favourites' cited! The AMF forum had a thread on "What music couldn't you live without?". After much mulling over and pencil made lists,I decided there was no way I could possibly post such a list. I also pointed out that however much I like music I'm not going to stick my head in a gas oven,take an overdose,jump off a cliff or get a rope (any more suggestions?! ) because I can't listen to music! Quite frankly I'll just carry on trying to write fiction,paint,draw,read,watch dvds,videos,eat,drink,******** and sleep like I usually do!!

Marmite or Dog Turd? tough choice

[springrite]

I have been listening to Brian everyday now. Can't get enough of this great composer. It more than clicked! Wow!

[Mirror Image]

I have been listening to Brian everyday now. Can't get enough of this great composer. It more than clicked! Wow!

I know that feeling finally, too.

[springrite]

I know that feeling finally, too.

I need to buy a good pipe...

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

Binge-listening to Brian - we've all done it.