Saul's Music Space

[Luke]

That's OK, Saul, I didn't really expect you to. It's not meant to sound Baroque in any way, as I said; it just draws on some baroque techniques.

[Florestan]

Saul,

You seem to not being able to get the essential point: although your music can certainly sound pleasant and I'm sure there are many people who enjoy it, what you do is an exercise in futility. Everything that can be expressed in the style you're aiming at HAS BEEN ALREADY EXPRESSED at such a level of complexity and craftsmanship that you, with all due respect, will never attain even if you lived a thousand years from now on. Honestly, what new and interesting music do you think you can write in the style of Bach or Mendelssohn? Once again, your music is pleasant to the ear and I can easily understand why some certainly uneducated listeners (in the sense of not being familiar with the great tradition of classical music) find it appealing --- but no serious classical music afficionado will ever mistake it for something original and emotionally touching.

Ask yourself this simple question: is someone familiar with The Well-Tempered Clavier or Songs Without Words going to enjoy the music you write at the same level of complexity, originality and emotion? More general, is someone familiar with the music of the 1700-1850 timeframe, which you favor, going to find any genuine value in your own compositions?

You might delight in the fact that you sell your CDs to people, or that you receive enthusiastic appraisals on Youtube and it's a legitimate reaction --- but here pops up another question: are you pleased with the status of a Youtube composer, or are you willing to find your own voice, one that by originality and emotional content could make its way to the hearts and minds of serious listeners and, why not, even to the concert halls?

Oddly enough, I happen to know a Romanian composer who has exactly the same ideas and the same reactions to criticism as you have. It's like you two are twins. Just search for Marius Herea on Youtube.

[Szykneij]

Saul thanks for the suggestions.  Are there any free programs for Mac?  Money is a problem now, especially big-time money like $600-$700.

There are other programs available that aren't free, but cost much less and might do what you need. I have Sibelius and took a few courses on it offered by the Boston Symphony, but I'm not a composer and I don't require all of the bells and whistles that came with it. I mostly need a notation program to transpose orchestral parts or write out short exercises, so I usually find myself using an old program that I originally bought for my IBM 486 instead!

[Teresa]

There are other programs available that aren't free, but cost much less and might do what you need. I have Sibelius and took a few courses on it offered by the Boston Symphony, but I'm not a composer and I don't require all of the bells and whistles that came with it. I mostly need a notation program to transpose orchestral parts or write out short exercises, so I usually find myself using an old program that I originally bought for my IBM 486 instead!

Thanks, WOW a program to transpose orchestral parts would really be cool.  I use the Music Theory Dictionary by William F. Lee to find the interval to transpose an instrument's notation up or down and for the practical performing range.  Transposing is a real pain and I am sure it has slowed down my writing considerable.  It would be a godsend to have a program automatically do this for me.  Once I learn the programs I think I just might like moving to the computer.   

[Szykneij]

Thanks, WOW a program to transpose orchestral parts would really be cool. 

In my teaching, it's a real time-saver. For example, if I find an exercise for violin written in treble clef that I want to use with the full group, I just enter it into the computer and the program can then print it in viola clef for the violas and in bass clef for the cellos and basses. Or, if we're performing an orchestral piece that calls for a bassoon or French horn that I don't have, I can easily produce parts for a tenor or alto sax player to use instead.

[Franco]

Thanks, WOW a program to transpose orchestral parts would really be cool.  I use the Music Theory Dictionary by William F. Lee to find the interval to transpose an instrument's notation up or down and for the practical performing range.  Transposing is a real pain and I am sure it has slowed down my writing considerable.  It would be a godsend to have a program automatically do this for me.  Once I learn the programs I think I just might like moving to the computer. 

Better still; a computer program that actually composes the music. 

[Florestan]

Better still; a computer program that actually composes the music.

Excellent. Now all we have to do is to enter the "golden rules of classical music" and we'll get at the other side as much Mozarts and Beethovens as we want. Saul's dream came true! 

[Saul]

Saul,

You seem to not being able to get the essential point: although your music can certainly sound pleasant and I'm sure there are many people who enjoy it, what you do is an exercise in futility. Everything that can be expressed in the style you're aiming at HAS BEEN ALREADY EXPRESSED at such a level of complexity and craftsmanship that you, with all due respect, will never attain even if you lived a thousand years from now on. Honestly, what new and interesting music do you think you can write in the style of Bach or Mendelssohn? Once again, your music is pleasant to the ear and I can easily understand why some certainly uneducated listeners (in the sense of not being familiar with the great tradition of classical music) find it appealing --- but no serious classical music afficionado will ever mistake it for something original and emotionally touching.

Ask yourself this simple question: is someone familiar with The Well-Tempered Clavier or Songs Without Words going to enjoy the music you write at the same level of complexity, originality and emotion? More general, is someone familiar with the music of the 1700-1850 timeframe, which you favor, going to find any genuine value in your own compositions?

You might delight in the fact that you sell your CDs to people, or that you receive enthusiastic appraisals on Youtube and it's a legitimate reaction --- but here pops up another question: are you pleased with the status of a Youtube composer, or are you willing to find your own voice, one that by originality and emotional content could make its way to the hearts and minds of serious listeners and, why not, even to the concert halls?

Oddly enough, I happen to know a Romanian composer who has exactly the same ideas and the same reactions to criticism as you have. It's like you two are twins. Just search for Marius Herea on Youtube.

Maybe you didn't hear a word that I said but here it is again ...




I had a decent number of people who actually understand classical music, and are knowledgeable listeners, purchase my music. Here's an email  exchange between me and  a Canadian couple a few months ago...

This is just one example, please pay attention:

:"Hello,
I would like to purchase one of Saul's C.D.s. How can I do that ?
Thanks,
S. B
"

"Hello, Saul,

I'm the other half of the team, the one with the PayPal account! Sharon and I quite enjoyed listening to your music on line, and we would very much like to purchase one of your CDs. I'll submit payment via PayPal in the amount of USD$29.99 as soon as possible. I think that you should thereby receive our mailing address, but it is the same as the one on Sharon's email.
Best Wishes for a Happy New Year, and continued success!

G.B"


'Hello Again, Saul,
A short note to say that the required funds have been sent to you via PayPal.
Cheers!
G. B"


'Hello, Saul,

As newcomers, we're much looking forward to receiving your CD and to visiting your well-designed website more and more often. Best Wishes for continued success!'


'Hello  G.!
Thank you for your purchase!
I just finished packing your order and on my way to send it.
I will keep you posted on the status of the shipping.
I would like to ask you, how did you hear about me, my music?
I'm so pleased that my music has touched you and Sharon.
Kind Regards, and Best of Wishes to Both of You.

Cheers,

Saul '


'Hello, Saul,

We're glad to hear that our order is on the way. Thanks very much for your efforts on our behalf!
Now, regarding how we came to hear of your music. Sharon is not terribly thrilled with some of the music available these days, and she had the idea of searching the internet for music that she liked. Her idea was to find the music, download and pay for it, and make a CD of songs that she really wanted to hear. However, neither she nor I are terribly au fait with modern computer technology. Accordingly, it was a bit of a "hit and miss" effort on both our parts. Fortunately, she made a good hit: accessing YouTube, she came across one of your tunes and, by extension, your website. She then took the opportunity to listen to a number of pieces of music on your site. Enjoying what she heard (and bringing me to the computer to listen as well) she sent you the initial email asking about purchasing your CD. And the rest, as they say, is history!
We have also visited the iTunes website to see if we could buy any of your individual works, but we are unable to find you via their search engine. Perhaps you can advise us if you are indeed on that site. If so, we will continue our search. Alternatively, perhaps there is another site from which we can purchase some of your work. Again, if so, would you please advise us Thanks!

Best Regards!

S. and G. B.'

[Florestan]

Maybe you didn't hear a word that I said

Actually it's you who haven't read or haven't understood my post you quote.

Let me state it frankly: anyone who, like your Mr. Barling there, speaks about classical music in terms of "songs" and "tunes" knows nothing about it (except maybe compilations like Mozart for Babies or The Greatest Hits of Classical Music) and is hardly in a position to judge the quality of a composition.

But in the end, I'm glad you found a niche for your style. If it makes you happy (and, why not, rich) then it's just a decent job as anything else. Good luck!

[mc ukrneal]

Maybe you didn't hear a word that I said but here it is again ...[snipped]

I don't want to intrude on the discussion, but unless you have persmission to use those people's names, I would suggest hiding them or changing them. I know I would be very upset to find my name used in that way without permission (even if I was 110% in agreement with the poster). Anyway, it is more of an etiquette thing, and would suggest changing the names (unless they have given permission).

[Saul]

Actually it's you who haven't read or haven't understood my post you quote.

Let me state it frankly: anyone who, like your Mr. Barling there, speaks about classical music in terms of "songs" and "tunes" knows nothing about it (except maybe compilations like Mozart for Babies or The Best Classical Hits) and is hardly in a position to judge the quality of a composition.

But in the end, I'm glad you found a niche for your style. If it makes you happy (anmd, why not, rich) then it's just a decent job as anything else. Good luck!

You're so quick in making assumptions about people, and besides these two fine people I had many others who are also professional classical music lovers and listeners who purchased my music. I know this to be true and this is the reality I am exposed to.

[Saul]

I don't want to intrude on the discussion, but unless you have persmission to use those people's names, I would suggest hiding them or changing them. I know I would be very upset to find my name used in that way without permission (even if I was 110% in agreement with the poster). Anyway, it is more of an etiquette thing, and would suggest changing the names (unless they have given permission).

I don't think there anything negative here but I have changed their names to their initials only.

[Florestan]

You're so quick in making assumptions about people, and besides these two fine people I had many others who are also professional classical music lovers and listenrs who purchased my music. I know this to be true and this is the reality I am exposed to.

Fine. But don't forget that Brahms, a true classicist and an honest man, destroyed perhaps as much music as he published. And I'm sure that the compositions he committed to the flames were far superior to your own ones (because firstly they belonged to a genius and secondly they were of their own times) and more worth the money of Mr. Barling.

[Saul]

Fine. But don't forget that Brahms, a true classicist and an honest man, destroyed perhaps as much music as he published. And I'm sure that the compositions he committed to the flames were far superior to your own ones (because firstly they belonged to a genius and secondly they were of their own times) and more worth the money of Mr. Barling.

So youre saying that I should burn all my music and stop people from enjoying it?

Thank God youre not my mentor.

[Florestan]

So youre saying that I should burn all my music and stop people from enjoying it?

I'm saying that you should stop being a self-absorbed narcissist.

[Saul]

I'm saying that you should stop being a self-absorbed narcissist.

Self Absorbed Narcissit? Why because I pointed to you that some real music lovers enjoy my music?

[Florestan]

Self Absorbed Narcissit? Why because I pointed to you that some real musc lovers enjoy my music?

No, because you take the smallest criticism of your music and musical philosophy as a personal offense.

[Saul]

No, because you take the smallest criticism of your music and musical philosophy as a personal offense.

There was nothing 'small' in your 'criticism'.

[Florestan]

There was nothing 'small' in your 'criticism'.

Even if it was the harshest slaying of your works, which was not --- you can't expect people praising you to no end, can you? Not everyone has the good taste of Mr. Barling.

Besides, if you can't stand criticism then you have no business composing for the public.

[Saul]

Even if it was the harshest slaying of your works, which was not --- you can't expect people praising you to no end, can you? Not everyone has the good taste of Mr. Barling.

Besides, if you can't stand criticism then you have no business composing for the public.

Criticism that makes sense and is legitimate and true, I accept. If you note, I have accepted a nice amount of remarks pointed out by Luke and some others. But you suggest that anyone that likes my music can't know anything about music, and I pointed out to you that this is not the case.

I have no problem accepting critic from you, as long as it makes sense, I will accept it, but flat out over hyped assumptions on my music will be rejected by me.

Regards,

Saul