Dumb newbie question - length of a work?

[Scarpia]

I'm going to look at Amazon this weekend and see how much they're charging for CDs.  Of course, I'll use the link from here so the site will get its cut.

Remember that almost always Amazon Marketplace sellers undercut Amazon proper dramatically.  I'd recommend visiting the on-line stores thread on this site to get a run down on different buying options.

Another thing I sometimes do is go to ebay.  If you look at the classical CD catagory you will see thousands of entries for mostly high prices.  But you can put in a cutoff of $1, $2, $3 and find great bargains.  Legit retail stores trying to make a profit sell for high-prices on ebay, but people trying to sell off grandpa's cd collection may set very low prices to move the stuff.  There's a risk of getting something in poor condition, but I've almost always had good experieces.

[bhodges]

I second trying eBay. Yes, there's a small risk of getting an unplayable CD, but I've never had a problem with anything I've bought, either.

--Bruce

[Scarpia]

Just did a check, saw some fine stuff (that I already have).  Anyone want Bartok String Quartets (Takacs) for $2, Complete Ravel Piano Music (Thibaudet) for the same price?  Many other prime recordings (that I already have) among the trashy stuff.

[Brahmsian]

Just did a check, saw some fine stuff (that I already have).  Anyone want Bartok String Quartets (Takacs) for $2, Complete Ravel Piano Music (Thibaudet) for the same price?  Many other prime recordings (that I already have) among the trashy stuff.

I would (the Bartok and the Ravel) 

[Scarpia]

I would (the Bartok and the Ravel) 

Bid away!  I have my bids in but I'm not telling where.   

[Palmetto]

Aw c'mon, guys; I've got enough on my plate already without taking on the task of learning how to use eBay too!  Especially since I discovered Amazon sells downloadable .MP3s.

Scarpia, what's 'Amazon Marketplace'?  I've only purchased from Amazon three or four times; maybe once every couple of years.

[Scarpia]

Scarpia, what's 'Amazon Marketplace'?  I've only purchased from Amazon three or four times; maybe once every couple of years.

For any item listed on Amazon if you use the generic "Add to Cart" button you will be purchasing from Amazon (shipped from their warehouse).  But if you look carefully you will also see a link saying for new and used copies from other sellers. 

For instance, I happened to be looking at this listing:

http://www.amazon.com/Bartok-Concerto-Orchestra-Percussion-Hungarian/dp/B000003FEJ/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1300991090&sr=8-1

And if I hit "Add to Cart" it costs $10.88 but I can click "23 new from $6.41" and "25 used from $4.50," which takes me to pages of listing independent sellers listing stuff to sell on Amazon's site.  The sellers can be major retailers, or they can be people like me trying to sell off a CD I didn't like.

[mc ukrneal]

For any item listed on Amazon if you use the generic "Add to Cart" button you will be purchasing from Amazon (shipped from their warehouse).  But if you look carefully you will also see a link saying for new and used copies from other sellers. 

For instance, I happened to be looking at this listing:

http://www.amazon.com/Bartok-Concerto-Orchestra-Percussion-Hungarian/dp/B000003FEJ/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1300991090&sr=8-1

And if I hit "Add to Cart" it costs $10.88 but I can click "23 new from $6.41" and "25 used from $4.50," which takes me to pages of listing independent sellers listing stuff to sell on Amazon's site.  The sellers can be major retailers, or they can be people like me trying to sell off a CD I didn't like.

One thing to keep in mind is sales tax and shipping. If you live in some states, sales tax are added to regular Amazon purchases. Shipping will be free if you buy over $25. When you buy from marketplace sellers, shipping is $2.98 for EACH ITEM. However, there is no sales tax.

[Palmetto]

"Maybe chamber music just isn't what you're looking for? Just for fun, see how this strikes you, a piece by Iannis Xenakis called Metastaseis 1953-54) for 61 musicians. The reason I mention it is that people with rock music backgrounds sometimes seem to gravitate toward his music. If you don't like it, no worries, but it's quite different from those Gardner concerts."

Congratulations!  You're the first one to suggest something I don't want to hear again!

[karlhenning]

Still . . . come back to it in 30 years, see if you hear it any differently then.  Hey, you never know . . . .

[Brahmsian]

Bid away!  I have my bids in but I'm not telling where.   

Sorry Scarpia.  I totally misunderstood your post.  I thought you were offering the Bartok and Ravel sets for $2 each, plus shipping.  My bad. 

[Scarpia]

Sorry Scarpia.  I totally misunderstood your post.  I thought you were offering the Bartok and Ravel sets for $2 each, plus shipping.  My bad. 

No, just advising you that you can find these deals, among many others, on ebay.

[eyeresist]

"Maybe chamber music just isn't what you're looking for? Just for fun, see how this strikes you, a piece by Iannis Xenakis called Metastaseis 1953-54) for 61 musicians. The reason I mention it is that people with rock music backgrounds sometimes seem to gravitate toward his music. If you don't like it, no worries, but it's quite different from those Gardner concerts."

Congratulations!  You're the first one to suggest something I don't want to hear again!

LOL. I've seen this a lot with classical fans proselytising to heavy metal listeners - the logic seems to be "Hey, metal is just crazy noise, so you'll LOVE this crazy noise!" Handily forgetting that metal may be wild and dissonant, but it's also highly rhythmic and consonant.

I think the most attractive classical genres for rock music fans would be late Romantic and early Modern orchestral music. (Plus highlights from Beethoven and Mozart, and some Vivaldi concertos.) This music is highly melodic and dramatic, plus has very lush and varied sound textures. Easy to follow, emotionally engaging and gratifying to the ear. Try a compilation that has complete symphonies by several different composers.

[Mirror Image]

Pandora has a Classical station.  You can listen to music from various periods - and when you find something that you like, you can find other things similar.

I forgot about Pandora. This is a very useful tool for a classical newbie. Hey Palmetto check this out:

Prokofiev: Scythian Suite - excerpt from the second movement. CHECK THIS OUT NOW!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfQb6BKq_ZU

If this doesn't attract and hold your attention I don't know what will! I think one of the biggest problems with new classical listeners is they go where they think they need to go. They may start off with someone like Mozart or Beethoven, but honestly that music never attracted me like late-Romantic and 20th Century music. I acknowledge the masters that came before with great respect, but I don't care for their music. I like music that's a bit more sinister and dissonant.

[Palmetto]

I've seen this a lot with classical fans proselytising to heavy metal listeners

I realize you're commenting on the suggestions of others.  I just don't know what I said that gave people the impression I listen to metal.

For the official record (tape, 8-track, cassette, CD, or .MP3), I don't.  Or 'hard rock' or 'Southern rock' or 'hair bands'.  I'm from a "Late '60s-thru-Early '90s" pop / Top 40 background; Meat Loaf and Tom Petty are about as wild as I get.  The only Kiss tune I like is 'Beth', and George Thorogood gives me hair balls.

MI, that's a bit, uh, ... bombastic for my tastes; would the word 'dissonant' also apply to the middle minute or so of this excerpt?  If John Williams leaves the radio on while he sleeps, this is what played the night before he wrote Vader's theme.  I might have used it for the final three minutes of a mix tape for running, back when the Army made me run.  I usually reserved the theme from the final fight in 'Rocky' for that honor.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3P7fucxdpc&feature=related

"Adriaaaane!"

[Mirror Image]

MI, that's a bit, uh, ... bombastic for my tastes; would the word 'dissonant' also apply to the middle minute or so of this excerpt?

Bombastic? I don't really care if you liked the excerpt or not because now I realize that no matter what I asked you listen to it wasn't going to be to your liking anyway. For someone who is "open-minded" about music, you sure do shoot down people's suggestions pretty quickly. You don't like this, you don't like that. Well I'll leave you to your exploration of whatever the hell it is you're trying to find because I give up. You're a hopeless case.

[Scarpia]

I realize you're commenting on the suggestions of others.  I just don't know what I said that gave people the impression I listen to metal.

For the official record (tape, 8-track, cassette, CD, or .MP3), I don't.  Or 'hard rock' or 'Southern rock' or 'hair bands'.  I'm from a "Late '60s-thru-Early '90s" pop / Top 40 background; Meat Loaf and Tom Petty are about as wild as I get.  The only Kiss tune I like is 'Beth', and George Thorogood gives me hair balls.

MI, that's a bit, uh, ... bombastic for my tastes; would the word 'dissonant' also apply to the middle minute or so of this excerpt?  If John Williams leaves the radio on while he sleeps, this is what played the night before he wrote Vader's theme.  I might have used it for the final three minutes of a mix tape for running, back when the Army made me run.  I usually reserved the theme from the final fight in 'Rocky' for that honor.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3P7fucxdpc&feature=related

"Adriaaaane!"

I think the best suggestion is just listen to a classical station, streaming or on the radio, and if something grabs you, find out what it was.  Pick a station that has a play list so that you will be able to find out what it was after you hear something you like.  Once you've identified something you like, then you can go into wikipedia, or whatever, and learn a little more about it, or just find more stuff by the same composer.

NPR stations tend to be a good choice because they are more likely to play a wide variety of music, and not just "lite classical" etc.  One station I like that plays classical for a fair chunk of the day is WSKG (they're in upstate NY so you'd get it by internet streaming).  I'm sure there are many others. 

[Opus106]

I think the best suggestion is just listen to a classical station, streaming or on the radio, and if something grabs you, find out what it was.  Pick a station that has a play list so that you will be able to find out what it was after you hear something you like.  Once you've identified something you like, then you can go into wikipedia, or whatever, and learn a little more about it, or just find more stuff by the same composer.

NPR stations tend to be a good choice because they are more likely to play a wide variety of music, and not just "lite classical" etc.  One station I like that plays classical for a fair chunk of the day is WSKG (they're in upstate NY so you'd get it by internet streaming).  I'm sure there are many others. 

Add WCPE and KING FM to that. Both have daily playlists, except when the former is in the midst of a fund-raiser or on a day when they are taking in user requests. But I don't remember them playing a lot of Twentieth Century music.

[mc ukrneal]

Bombastic? I don't really care if you liked the excerpt or not because now I realize that no matter what I asked you listen to it wasn't going to be to your liking anyway. For someone who is "open-minded" about music, you sure do shoot down people's suggestions pretty quickly. You don't like this, you don't like that. Well I'll leave you to your exploration of whatever the hell it is you're trying to find because I give up. You're a hopeless case.

There is really no need for this sort of post. You seem to be taking this personally, which this isn't.  Some of us find the going difficult, in some cases because we don't have the background or because we don't understand what we are hearing.  Patience and persistance are sometimes the only things that keep us in the game. Maybe Palmetto won't like any of the suggestions. Maybe he's just not ready for them yet. Whatever the case, we can help him along if we want to. If you feel you are not adding something, and want to bow out, there is no shame in that. That you even tried is appreciated (both by Palmetto and those of us participating as well).

[Palmetto]

I've been exploring this music for maybe six weeks.  With hundreds of years of history, I hardly think that's enough time for even a superficial search.  I am neither surprised nor discouraged by not finding anything that sets me on fire in that limited period.  It's early in my search; there are genres I haven't heard and probably some I haven't even heard OF yet. 

I've opened every single link and embedded video that folks have posted for me.  In retrospect, I find I may not have expressed my thanks enough, so, "Thanks, everyone."  With the exception of one work I noted, I've yet to hear anything I actively dislike.  Most of what I've listened to has been from pleasant to enjoyable.  I've learned I like brass, woodwinds, and piano more than strings.  I've learned there's are more ways to interpret a work than I imagined.  As side projects I've learned more about file formats and applications common to digitally stored media, things I've never had professional reasons to look at.  If nothing else I've learned some new concepts; that alone has been worth the time.  There just hasn't been anything I've felt compelled to replay more than a couple of time, much less purchase.

Apparently my not falling instantly in love with this music bothers you more than it does me.  I don't know "whatever the hell it is you're trying to find"; I don't know yet everything that the hell is available.  That's why I'm looking.  I'm in no hurry, and have no reason to conform to your schedules or expectations.  It may come as a shock, but many people lead happy, full lives without classical music.  I may finish this experiment and return to being one of them.  If that bothers you, I encourage you to ignore me.  This appears to be a big forum on an even bigger Internet; if you feel they aren't big enough for the both of us, I suggest you perform an anatomically impossible act of self-copulation.