Stanley Bate(1911-1959)

[vandermolen]

Alcohol and lack of sleep? I know the feeling!!

Me too. 

[snyprrr]

C'mon, dundonnel- it should be obvious that this Thread is the 'Bate's Motel',... hmm?

[Scion7]

+1 "Bates Motel" - 

[Scion7]

Anyone else feel that his Viola Concerto is one fine piece of work?

[Christo]

Anyone else feel that his Viola Concerto is one fine piece of work?

It is. Every piece of him recorded over the past few years is sublime and I personally consider him the greatest 'dicovery' of the past five years. The latest addition is the 1953 Cello Concerto that I played this Summer, the only Bate to be found on Spotify. I'd say its a little bit less inspired than his best work so far (both symphonies and concertos released earlier), but perhaps there are more educated opinions on it?

[Scion7]

To date, I've never run across a single vinyl LP with any of his stuff on it - I think he was basically unrecorded until the CD recent issues.  And still there is no chamber music by him available.

[Christo]

There are a few piano pieces played by Jeffrey Wagner on Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q09OtXdv_K0

Apart from that, there are three or four more and less historical broadcast recordings, but only the one of the Piano Concerto No. 3 is an addition to the catalogue (there is also one of Bate playing the second concerto, and there are two earlier performances of the Third Symphony, both less impressive as the one by Yates on Dutton; I think most are also found on Youtube.)

[vandermolen]

Anyone else feel that his Viola Concerto is one fine piece of work?

Yes, it was the first of the Dutton releases to alert me of his importance. It clearly shows the influence of his teacher Vaughan Williams (more than the symphonies I think) but is an eloquent, poetic and moving work in its own right. Your post makes me want to play it again.

[cilgwyn]

Yesterday,I enjoyed listening to a cd-r I made of Bainton conducting his Second symphony. Not exactly hi-fi sound,as one might expect;but if you like this symphony definitely a must hear! A very enjoyable performance,with plenty of atmosphere. I think I actually,marginally,prefer it to the Chandos recording. As I did the Boult CBSO performance of Stanley Bate's third. Again,the sound was not exactly superb,but I felt the performance had more fire and conviction to it than the Dutton recording. Not entirely convinced by the Yates reading,this one really had me in it's grip. They also make great companions. It would be nice if someone could reissue these recordings on cd. I remember reading the review of the Dutton recording of the Bate in IRR (International Record Review) magazine where the reviewer expressed some reservations about the finale. I think he felt that it seemed to take a while to get going;as if the composer had had some problems there (I can't remember his exact words). The old Finale problem in other words. I think he felt it was like one of those old plane propellors that take a while to get going;but once they do it's brrrrrrm all the way!! Boult (at least to my ears) ,being the old trooper he was,makes a more convincing stab at the final movement,steering it with an aplomb that seems to elude Yates. The constricted sound quality also,curiously,adds an edgy quality,a feeling of duress,which really makes this performance for me.  Excellent!

[cilgwyn]

https://www.youtube.com/v/mrOnGinlWuI

[cilgwyn]

Of course,I am naturally biased towards any ancient sounding,old recording!
Incidentally.this is the first time I ever embedded a video!!

[relm1]

https://www.youtube.com/v/mrOnGinlWuI

Wow, that's a very powerful performance!  Thanks for posting. 

[vandermolen]

https://www.youtube.com/v/mrOnGinlWuI

What a TERRIFIC performance! Why is it not on CD? Thanks very much cilgwyn for posting it. It has much greater urgency than the performance recorded on Dutton but the two versions are complementary in many ways.

[cilgwyn]

Actually,I really should emphasise that the Stanley Bate video is from the 'James Stuart' Channel on Youtube and  I would urge members to view it there! There are allot of other 'Videos' of less well known composers there. I know that it has been brought up at the Art Music Forum. I am providing a link below,or you can just log onto Youtube!

The 'James Stuart' Channel on Youtube:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCfFPCgr45pH_pzslan4EriQ/videos

[cilgwyn]

Don't want him after me!!  
Yes,I think you're right,vandermolen. This one would be well worth transferring to cd. It has an urgency to me. At the very least it convinced nit-picking ingrates like me. The Dutton recording is obviously an excellent one,and you need a modern recording. Strangely,I think the harsh sound  actually adds a little more to the sense of urgency. An additional edge to the proceedings,so I don't think it's a bad thing,in a way. I wonder what they would couple it with,though?

[cilgwyn]

Enjoying a similar happy experience these days and in the meantime I'm haunted by some of his melodies - particularly the themes of th concerto's slow movement and grandiose finale. People may regard Bate a `derivative' composer, but then, he's the best derivative composer I've heard in years.

By chance, I typed his name in the search engine of Youtube - to find, to my suprise, his own performances of the second and third piano concertos there! Here's Bate as a soloist in his own Piano Concerto No. 2 in C major, Op. 28 (completed May 1940) - with the BBC SO under Stanford Robinson, a radio broadcast from 1958. To hear the same `grandiose' themes from the composer himself is quite an experience, IMHO: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ljA7d_PC2p0

And here's Bate playing the US premiere of his Piano Concerto No. 3, Op. 61 (completed August 1952) with the Oklahoma City SO under Guy Fraser Harrison, again a recording from 1958: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJABhvxdg0E
                                         

I agree with this. A lovely Piano concerto. Some of it even reminds me of Malcolm Arnold. I like the more grandiose Reizenstein too;which makes a greater opener. And I musn't leave out the Bate Sinfonietta No 1. I was rather hoping Dutton would give us his Piano concerto No 3 (if the parts are still extant?). Alas! They seem to have lost interest. Great cover art,too! Very eye catching (geddit?! )

[vandermolen]

I agree with this. A lovely Piano concerto. Some of it even reminds me of Malcolm Arnold. I like the more grandiose Reizenstein too;which makes a greater opener. And I musn't leave out the Bate Sinfonietta No 1. I was rather hoping Dutton would give us his Piano concerto No 3 (if the parts are still extant?). Alas! They seem to have lost interest. Great cover art,too! Very eye catching (geddit?! )

Yes, a clever play on words for those quick enough to spot it.

[cilgwyn]

I agree with this. A lovely Piano concerto. Some of it even reminds me of Malcolm Arnold. I like the more grandiose Reizenstein too;which makes a greater opener. And I musn't leave out the Bate Sinfonietta No 1. I was rather hoping Dutton would give us his Piano concerto No 3 (if the parts are still extant?). Alas! They seem to have lost interest. Great cover art,too! Very eye catching (geddit?! )

After posting this I had another listen to this cd. I enjoyed the Bate Piano concerto. I think it's the best of the three Dutton Bate' cd's. I preferred it to the symphonies. Bate seems a bit of a musical magpie here,but he assimilates it into something,delightfully,his own;so I don't have a problem with that. On the basis of the selection of music on this cd,I can't help feeling Bate was a better when he was being less serious!! I liked the Sinfonietta No 1 and the Russian influences just added to the fun. The performances and recording quality are superb. I must admit I didn't play the Reizenstein this time. Another time,perhaps?! I have to say here that,I do wish that Dutton had made these all Bate cd's! Oh,well?!! (I did make a cd-r of symphonies 3 & 4). This isn't,and won't be among my favourite Piano concertos,by a British composer,but it's a bit different to some others I've heard. A pity that Dutton seem to have lost interest!

[Christo]

After posting this I had another listen to this cd. I enjoyed the Bate Piano concerto. I think it's the best of the three Dutton Bate' cd's. I preferred it to the symphonies. Bate seems a bit of a musical magpie here,but he assimilates it into something,delightfully,his own;so I don't have a problem with that. On the basis of the selection of music on this cd,I can't help feeling Bate was a better when he was being less serious!! I liked the Sinfonietta No 1 and the Russian influences just added to the fun. The performances and recording quality are superb. I must admit I didn't play the Reizenstein this time. Another time,perhaps?! I have to say here that,I do wish that Dutton had made these all Bate cd's! Oh,well?!! (I did make a cd-r of symphonies 3 & 4). This isn't,and won't be among my favourite Piano concertos,by a British composer,but it's a bit different to some others I've heard. A pity that Dutton seem to have lost interest!

I find the slow movement one of the most moving I know - and that alone deserves it a place among the 'great'.

[cilgwyn]

Yes,the slow movement is a peach! The trouble is,if I bang on about something I like too much I can bet my bottom penny that someone will pop up and say that they don't think it's much cop (in no uncertain terms!). I'm just glad that someone else likes this piano concerto,Christo! It has a different quality to allot of other British works for piano and orchestra. It makes me think of some of those lighter soviet concertos like those of Kabalevsky,for example;yet quintessentially english. Bax's two big works for piano and orchestra have a special closeness to my heart,because I grew up listening to them. Ireland's Piano Concerto because of my interest in Celtic (particularly Welsh) folklore and Arthur Machen;but the Bate is a wonderful piano concerto. I like the Sinfonietta No 1,too;and it would be nice to hear No2,if it's still extant (and some other scores)?
I have to say I much prefer Boult's performance of the third symphony,to the Dutton recording. It has an intensity and atmosphere to it,which grabs me so much more than the new recording,despite the rough sound. I wish some recording label would transfer it to cd. I think it would be well worth the trouble!