Unpopular Opinions

[jochanaan]

...In any case it seems that people underestimate the meteoric rise of Shostakovich's music in the last 30 years or so. When I started listening to classical music as a teenager in the mid/late '80s hardly anyone would have put him even remotely in the league of Ravel, Stravinsky, Bartok or Prokofieff.

That "meteor" had already risen.  I started my serious listening in the early 1970s, and already Shostakovich was counted among the greats, mostly for his Fifth and Seventh Symphonies and a few others.  Ormandy, Bernstein and Andre Previn were noted for programming and recording his music; it was Ormandy and the Philadelphia Orchestra who released the first non-Russian recording of Symphony #4 in the early '60s.  Certainly in Shostakovich's reputation, there was nothing like the truly meteoric rise of Mahler's musical reputation in the Sixties (although there were always conductors who programmed Mahler's music, most notably Bruno Walter, Mahler's disciple).

[jochanaan]

Here is maybe an unpopular opinion: most of the opinions expressed on this thread are fairly popular.

Indeed.

[Brian]

If anybody's been on the rise in the past 30 years, it would be Sibelius (more like on the rebound!), Martinu, and most of all, Janacek.

[Ken B]

If anybody's been on the rise in the past 30 years, it would be Sibelius (more like on the rebound!), Martinu, and most of all, Janacek.

Yes. And all worthy too.

[TheGSMoeller]

My biggest beef with Martinu is that many of his great works have flat, uninteresting codas/endings. I get really worked up and involved in Martinu's works, especially the works that have a constant drive throughout, and in some cases feel let down at the abrupt ending. I've felt this way with some of his chamber works and orchestral works.

But keep in mind, before I get attacked, that I did say many of his great works.

[Brian]

My biggest beef with Martinu is that many of his great works have flat, uninteresting codas/endings. I get really worked up and involved in Martinu's works, especially the works that have a constant drive throughout, and in some cases feel let down at the abrupt ending. I've felt this way with some of his chamber works and orchestral works.

But keep in mind, before I get attacked, that I did say many of his great works.

I initially didn't get the final chord of the Fourth Symphony. Seems a bit of a letdown vs. the triumph of the preceding bars. But the endings of 2 and 3 are perfect!

There is a really "motoric" activity in a lot of his chamber music finales where the motor stops and you don't feel a justification for why it ended there.

[Ken B]

My biggest beef with Martinu is that many of his great works have flat, uninteresting codas/endings. I get really worked up and involved in Martinu's works, especially the works that have a constant drive throughout, and in some cases feel let down at the abrupt ending. I've felt this way with some of his chamber works and orchestral works.

But keep in mind, before I get attacked, that I did say many of his great works.

Coda interruptus.

[Jo498]

I think this was rather different in Germany/Europe. Yes, Ormandy, Previn and a few others did Shostakovich already in the 60/70, but hardly any famous conductor from the German/Austrian tradition. Neither Abbado or Boulez. For the conservative he was a "Soviet musician", for the ones leaning to the Avantgarde he was hopelessly old-fashioned. I hardly encountered any of his music as a teenager in the late '80s. The sheer number of complete recordings of his symphonies and quartets clearly has exploded in the last 15-20 years.

[amw]

It seems like Shostakovich was sort of "rediscovered" around the time of Testimony, along with the defections of influential champions like Rostropovich, Maxim & Mullova. That made his music "cool" again because it was secretly anti-Communist and everything. And of course the fall of the Soviet Union opened the floodgates of ex-Soviet conductors and ensembles... plus the CD era massively increasing the amount of recorded music available.

Nonetheless, in the USSR Shostakovich was a superhero, and in the West he'd had his share of followers and detractors ever since Lennie brought the 5th over in 1940ish. His reputation's been solid for a while. For miracle-gro in the last 30 years Janáček is certainly a good example, also Szymanowski, Ligeti, Baroque composers not born in 1685, and Britten for some reason.

[Jo498]

Sure, he was not "re-discovered" like maybe Szymanowski, or even more Zemlinsky. (But neither of them has become remotely as popular as DSCH.)

[jochanaan]

If anybody's been on the rise in the past 30 years, it would be Sibelius (more like on the rebound!)...

True.  During Sibelius' lifetime he was considered among the very greatest composers, but after his death his reputation took a hit, and now it does seem to be rebounding.  In my knowledge and experience, the music of most composers, great or otherwise, goes through such cycles.

[Archaic Torso of Apollo]

If anybody's been on the rise in the past 30 years, it would be Sibelius (more like on the rebound!), Martinu, and most of all, Janacek.

I agree. Also, there seems to be a real uptick of interest in Vaughan Williams, at least in the USA (don't know about elsewhere). Just in the Chicago area, there have been several VW symphony performances in the last couple of years.

[Karl Henning]

I agree. Also, there seems to be a real uptick of interest in Vaughan Williams, at least in the USA (don't know about elsewhere). Just in the Chicago area, there have been several VW symphony performances in the last couple of years.

If Atlanta can get its merde together, I shall be there for A Sea Symphony, this November.

[TheGSMoeller]

If Atlanta can get its merde together, I shall be there for A Sea Symphony, this November.

That's one I had on my radar as well. But like you said, let's see if they can get it together.
This is the second lockout in 3 seasons for the ASO. Robert Spano and Runnicles even wrote a letter to the ASO board and the Woodruff Arts Board that the players have to meet with in support of coming to a swift conclusion. Most of Runnicles concerts are in September and Oct. which are in danger of being cancelled. I'm afraid if this trend continues then Runnciles might not want to make the trip to Georgia anymore.

[Ken B]

I'm all for expanding the orchestral repertoire to good less played music, so I approve the trends discussed here. But part of it I think stems from the retreat from HIP, as orchestras back away from Haydn, Mozart (and soon Beethoven?). Also you need to thank the minimalists for convincing the public that modern music doesn't have to be awful.

[Karl Henning]

Also you need to thank the minimalists for convincing the public that modern music doesn't have to be can be dull as well as awful.

Fixed.

(Oh I don't really think that, no.  Not most of the time.)

I'm all for expanding the orchestral repertoire to good less played music, so I approve the trends discussed here. But part of it I think stems from the retreat from HIP, as orchestras back away from Haydn, Mozart (and soon Beethoven?).

A respect for HIP, maybe.

I think there will always be "big band" LvB;  and it's a valid taste, there ought always to be.  Where, while I am glad to hear the occasional Haydn symphony (and Mozart pf concerto) at Symphony Hall, more often than not I feel that it's not 100% comme il faut.

[(poco) Sforzando]

Also you need to thank the minimalists for convincing the public that modern music doesn't have to be awful.

Agreed. By writing such god-awful music themselves, composers like Reich, Adams, and Co. have shown true masters like Carter and Boulez in a far brighter light.

[Karl Henning]

:-)

[Luke]

Agreed. By writing such god-awful music themselves, composers like Reich, Adams, and Co. have shown true masters like Carter and Boulez in a far brighter light.

Naughty, naughty!

[Mirror Image]

Agreed. By writing such god-awful music themselves, composers like Reich, Adams, and Co. have shown true masters like Carter and Boulez in a far brighter light.

Lol...