Author Topic: Unpopular Opinions  (Read 276672 times)

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Offline Florestan

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Re: Unpopular Opinions
« Reply #2580 on: September 04, 2018, 05:51:18 AM »
If you have the complete boxes, most of the arseholery is missing. You need the individual volume booklets, which can be found on the Hyperion website.

I have the Faure series, where he manages to communicate which songs he thinks aren't really worth listening to but he included them in a complete collection, wasn't that nice of him?

But it's the Brahms series that has me seeing red at the moment. Volume 1 will do nicely to illustrate, but I think the first 6 all have the glaring example:

https://www.hyperion-records.co.uk/dc.asp?dc=D_CDJ33121

Each booklet starts with his condescending explanation of why he's right to not group songs together in opuses (the way that the DG and CPO sets of Brahms do). Each booklet is then rife with justifications for grouping songs together, including in opuses.

Starting with the first two songs on Volume 1, which he announces are clearly an intentional pair. He then goes on to convey what a genius Brahms was for putting op.48 together from songs that were composed at different times to different poets.

Ah, yes, now I remember and can see where you're coming from. Yes, splitting songs published as a single opus over several discs under the ridiculous pretext that they were not composed all at the same time is particularly annoying. And the comparison with collected poetry volumes actually only gives the lie to his idea.

Printed poetry collections are as lovingly assembled as an opus of a composer’s varied settings, but this does not mean the poems therein are designed to be read aloud from cover to cover: the compiler of these volumes, whether or not the poet himself, would expect items to be selected by the reader according to taste or need. The anthology (or indeed opus number) might be likened to a well-ordered jewel case from which precious items may be extracted for use, depending on the occasion: the wearing in public of every item therein on a single occasion would be both impractical and vulgar. There is little evidence, especially from concert practice of the time (where items from the Schubert and Schumann cycles were often ruthlessly excerpted), that Brahms’s publications were conceived within a spirit of cyclic unity that called for an integral performance of the entire group. (emphasis mine)

Well, precisely: just give us the whole opus as it was published and let us extract whatever we want, or even play them all in a row, if we so wish and spare us your arseholery --- indeed, an apt description.

At least in the Schumann box he had the decency not to split the great cycles (for lack of a better word). I once wanted to listen to the Kerner-Lieder and I was relieved to find them all, in order, on a single disc.

But now that I think of it, if you have enough patience you could reassemble the split opuses yourself.  :)

“Melody is the essence of music.”  --- Mozart

Offline Florestan

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Re: Unpopular Opinions
« Reply #2581 on: September 04, 2018, 05:53:20 AM »
Tell me your preferred plural of "octopus" and I'll tell you why it's probably wrong...

Octopussies?  :D
“Melody is the essence of music.”  --- Mozart

Offline Florestan

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Re: Unpopular Opinions
« Reply #2582 on: September 04, 2018, 06:02:44 AM »
the plural of opus is opera.

As per Merriam-Webster, opuses can be used as well.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/opus
“Melody is the essence of music.”  --- Mozart

Offline Brian

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Re: Unpopular Opinions
« Reply #2583 on: September 04, 2018, 07:11:39 AM »
What that is, is fake learning where people forget they're speaking English.

Tell me your preferred plural of "octopus" and I'll tell you why it's probably wrong...
According to Garner's Modern American Usage:

"Because this word is actually of Greek origin -- not Latin -- the classical plural is octopodes, not octopi. But the standard plural in American and British English is octopuses. Still, some writers mistakenly use the supposed latin plural. Occasionally the pedantical octopodes appears, but it is relatively rare."

However you may wish to temper your enthusiasm for Garner's Modern American Usage after reading this entry from the letter P:

"Pubes (pubic hair) has two syllables, pyoo-beez. It's sometimes mispronounced 'pyoobs'."

Shameful post.

I do like the booklet where Charles Mingus asked his psychoanalyst to try writing about music. And any where the musicians get to speak for themselves (again a luxury usually only afforded to Mingus).

Offline North Star

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Re: Unpopular Opinions
« Reply #2584 on: September 04, 2018, 07:19:58 AM »
According to Garner's Modern American Usage:

"Because this word is actually of Greek origin -- not Latin -- the classical plural is octopodes, not octopi. But the standard plural in American and British English is octopuses. Still, some writers mistakenly use the supposed latin plural. Occasionally the pedantical octopodes appears, but it is relatively rare."

However you may wish to temper your enthusiasm for Garner's Modern American Usage after reading this entry from the letter P:

"Pubes (pubic hair) has two syllables, pyoo-beez. It's sometimes mispronounced 'pyoobs'."

I do like the booklet where Charles Mingus asked his psychoanalyst to try writing about music. And any where the musicians get to speak for themselves (again a luxury usually only afforded to Mingus).
Garner's is right on both issues, but of course the frequency of the two-syllable pronunciation of pubis is about the same as the use of the Greek plural form 'octopodes'. And, yeah.. those old jazz liner notes can be painful/funny reading.
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