database for your classical music collection

[nico1616]

I would like to have a computer database to organise my collection, in which it would be easy look up all works in which a particular singer appears, or all my versions of a symphony of Haydn...
Currently I have a trial version of CATraxx, but this seems not to be made for classical music, and it looks quite complex.

Can some of you share your experiences? Do you work with your own Excell files? With a program you bought on the net?

I'm sorry if this subject was covered before, but I did not find answers when I searched GMG...

[Mirror Image]

This is a good topic, because I, too, have been trying to find a good cataloging software program. Many of the ones I've seen looked too complicated. It would be difficult for me to catalog anything now because I've acquired so much music in the past few years. I used to keep a Microsoft Word list of all of the recordings I owned under each composer and it was in alphabetical order, but once I lost track of entering the new recordings I have bought, the list became obsolete and would take an incredible amount of time to update.

I would really like to find a program that is image based. Like, for example, under Shostakovich there is a list with pictures of all the covers of the recordings I own.

[Willoughby earl of Itacarius]

Because this kind of software simply doesn't exist that caters for all needs a classical music lover needs.

[Opus106]

I'm sorry if this subject was covered before, but I did not find answers when I searched GMG...

Some relevant threads here:

http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,1153.msg27702.html
http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,18008.msg490854.html

[Sergeant Rock]

I use Microsoft Works Data Base. It's simple and cheap (always comes packaged with the PC). Click picture to enlarge.




Sarge

[nico1616]

I use Microsoft Works Data Base. It's simple and cheap (always comes packaged with the PC). Click picture to enlarge.




Sarge

That looks very user-friendly and would certainly cover some needs I have, thanks!
Some questions:can you find all entries that have Eaglen as a performer, since now this entry is coupled with other soloists?
And what about box sets with multiple composers? Do you split them up in different entries?

And I would like to have the artwork (cover) of the cds included, I don't think you have that.

[Sergeant Rock]

That looks very user-friendly and would certainly cover some needs I have, thanks!
can you find all entries that have Eaglen as a performer, since now this entry is coupled with other soloists?

Yes, there is a search function that you can use in one of two ways: type in Eaglen and hit either "next data record"--which takes you to each Eaglen entry in turn--or hit "all data records" which then shows you a list with all the Eaglen entries.

And what about box sets with multiple composers? Do you split them up in different entries?

I split them up. All my jewel cases are marked with a number and placed on shelves in numerical order. A CD or a box of CDs with multiple composers gets multiple entries in the data base but each entry has the same number.

Sarge

[DieNacht]

I use Word & a laborious system:

1. Composer name, dates & places of birth & death
2. Biography, maybe list of works or other interesting information, from wikipedia & other sources
3. hard-disk collection
4. collection in old media (LPs, CDs, MCs)

The good thing is that this is very flexible & you can insert all sorts of material and remarks.

An example (the original has clearer fonts and various colours etc. to make everything more easily read):


JEZEK, Jaroslav (25/9 1906 Praha – 1/1 1942 New York):    
                                                                     
(Biografi: Czech composer, pianist and conductor, author of jazz, classical, incidental and film music. Ježek was born in the Prague quarter of Žižkov to the family of a tailor. He was almost blind from a young age. He studied composition at the Prague Conservatory as a pupil of Karel Boleslav Jirák (1924–1927), at the master school of composition with Josef Suk (1927–1930), and shortly also with Alois Hába (1927–1928). Ježek met the playwrights/comedians Jan Werich and Jiří Voskovec (aka George Voskovec), leaders of the Osvobozené divadlo (Prague Liberated Theatre) in Prague, and took up the post of main composer and conductor for the theatre. During the next decade (from 1928 to 1939), he com-posed incidental music, songs, dances, and ballets for the comic and satirical plays of Voskovec and Werich. In 1934 he became a member of Czech Group of Surrealists. Forced to leave Czechoslovakia following the Nazi occupation, Ježek, Voskovec and Werich went into exile in New York City. He worked as a piano teacher and choirmaster there, and conti-nued to work with Voskovec and Werich. In 1942, the long-ill Ježek died of chronic kidney disease in New York. On December 29, 1941, two days before his death, Ježek married Frances Bečáková. He collaborated with many avant-garde artists of pre-war Czechoslovakia, such as Vítězslav Nezval and E. F. Burian.
His musical output is commonly divided into two parts.[1] The first part of his work consists of chamber, piano and concer-tant compositions, created first under the influence of Stravinsky, of the Parisian Les Six and of Arnold Schönberg. Later he found his own, specific and modern expression. He also became a popular jazz composer in pre-war Czechoslovakia. He composed songs and dances for the revue plays of the Prague Free Theatre (The Ass and the Shadow, Caesar, The Headsman and the Fool e.g.) and also for the films of Voskovec and Werich (The Powder and the Gasoline, The World Belongs to Us, Stand and Deliver! e.g.). His innovative melodies are well-known in the Czech Republic to this day. Ježek was also evidently fascinated by American jazz. Between 1929 and 1936, possibly earlier, he organized and conducted an orchestra featuring his original jazz compositions and arrangements.Billed variously as "Ježek's Jazz" and "Ježkův swingband" they recorded for the Czech Ultraphon label, making some of the most original music in Europe. A few of these sides deserve special mention. "Bugatti Step" (1930; Ultraphone A10166) is an up-tempo number for piano and jazz orchestra, enjoying enduring popularity as a hot jazz piano solo. "Teď ještě ne" (Not Yet) (1931; Ultraphon A10217) is rousing dance music in the Jean Goldkette or Coon-Sanders' Nighthawks style. "Rubbish Heap Blues" (1937; Ultraphon A11421) shows that Ježek not only listened to Duke Ellington's records, but was keeping up with Duke's very latest work. "Rubbish Heap" features a Johnny Hodges-like alto sax and a Cootie Williams-like growl trumpet, plus a three-trombone section to complement the three trumpets. Ježek's composition titled simply "Polonaisa" (1931; Ultraphon A10355) is a traditional Polonaise clothed in modern instrumentation, harmony and textures. It is as if Chopin and Gershwin had collaborated, the Polish dance rhythms mingling easily with hot syncopation. Ježek also turned the boys loose in records of his arrangements of well-known hot jazz standards, such as "Tiger Rag," "Dinah" and "Chinatown, My Chinatown." These recordings, very few of which could have survived the Nazi occupation and World War II, are almost completely unknown, at least in the U.S.A. Selected works: Concert for Piano and Orchestra (1927); Fantasy for Piano and Orchestra (1930); Concert for Violin and Orchestra (1930); Symphonic Poem (1936); Chamber: Serenade for Wind Quartet (1929); Wind Quintet (1931); String Quartet No. 1. (1932); Sonata for Violin and Piano (1933); Duo for 2 Violins (1934); String Quartet No. 2. (1941); Piano: Suite for Quarter-tone Piano (1927); Sonatina (1928); Petite Suite (1928); Capriccio (1932); Etuda (1933); Bagatelles (1933); Rhapsodie (1938), Toccata (1939); Grande valse brillante (1939); Sonata (1941))

"Klaverkoncert" (1927)(18min) HD
01 I (8:14)                                                                                                                                                 
02 II (6:04)                                                                                                                                                               
03 III (3:38)                                                                                                                 
- I.Ardasev,L.Svarovsky,BrnoState PO/fra supraphon dwl

"Nerves", Ballet f.Kor & Orkester (1928) lp-mp3 HD                                                                                             
- Fischer, Musici di Praga/fra panton lp

"Fantasi for Klaver & Orkester" (1930)  lp-mp3 HD                                                                                                                           
- Fischer, Jan Novotny, Musici di Praga/fra panton lp

"Koncert for Violin og Blæsere" (1930)  lp-mp3 HD                                                                                                               
- P.Messiereur, J.Belohlavek,Prague SO/fra panton lp

"Blæserkvintet" (1931)  lp-mp3 HD
(Andante. Alllegro moderato 4:22 – Lento e religioso 4:36 – Allegro 2:06)                                                                                                    
- Czech Wind Quintet/fra panton lp

"Strygekvartet" (1932)  lp-mp3 HD                                                                                                                                         
(Andante quasi adagio 7:37 – Andante triste 6:21 – Quasi scherzo. Allegro vivace 3:18 – Adagio rubato – Allegro 6:28)                           
- Suk Quartet/fra panton lp

"Sonate for Violin & Klaver" (1932)  lp-mp3 HD                                                                                                                       
(Allegro vivace 4:04 – Lento 4:59 – Largo 2:54 – Allegro 6:29)      
- A.Novak, J,Vrana/fra panton lp

"Symfonisk Digt" f.Orkester (1936)  lp-mp3 HD                                                                                                             
- Konvalinka, BrnoPO/fra panton lp
............................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................

"Bugatti Step" (1931)(2:37) dwl-mp3 HD                                                                                                                           
"Happy Feet" ()(2:49) dwl-mp3 HD                                                                                                                                               
"Bloody Moon Rhapsody" ()(3:32) dwl-mp3 HD                                                                                                                             
"Opium – Chinese Intermezzo" ()(4:37) dwl-mp3 HD                                                                                                                       
"Rubbish Heap Blues" ()(3:27) dwl-mp3 HD                                                                                                                                 
- J.Jezek & hans jazzorkester/ 

GAMMEL SAMLING:

LP  Jezek:"Nerves", Ballet for Ork. (1928)/Fischer,Musici di Praga/pan 11 0336
LP  Jezek:"Koncert f.Violin & Blæsere" (1930)/Messiereur,Belohlavek,PragueSO/pant 11 0681
LP  Jezek:"Fantasi for Klaver & Orkester" (1930)/Novotny,Fischer,MusiciDi praga/pant 11 0336
LP  Jezek:"Blæserkvintet" (1931)/Czech Wind Quintet/panton 81110 0254                                   
LP  Jezek:"Strygekvartet" (1932)/Suk Quartet/panton 11 0681
LP  Jezek:"Violinsonate"  (1932)/A.Novak, J.Vranka/panton 81110 0254                                   
LP  Jezek:"Symfonisk Digt" f.Ork. (1936)/Konvalinka,BrnoStatePO/panton 81110 0254                                     

[mc ukrneal]

Word is not really a great system for a database. Ideally, we would use some sort of data base software, but they usually cost a lot. I assume Works is basically a simplified (or basic) version of excel. This is what I use. Excel is not necessarily ideal, but it certainly allows you to make all sorts of analyses that I like. Word does not allow for the same manipulation of data. The drawback with excel is text, but I don't enter much of that. Mixing artwork with any of these programs is a recipe for disaster, in my opinion. The level of detail can be adjusted to the need, so this is really up to each individual.

[Willoughby earl of Itacarius]

Word is not really a great system for a database. Ideally, we would use some sort of data base software, but they usually cost a lot. I assume Works is basically a simplified (or basic) version of excel. This is what I use. Excel is not necessarily ideal, but it certainly allows you to make all sorts of analyses that I like. Word does not allow for the same manipulation of data. The drawback with excel is text, but I don't enter much of that. Mixing artwork with any of these programs is a recipe for disaster, in my opinion. The level of detail can be adjusted to the need, so this is really up to each individual.

Agreed its not at all easy, and doesn't come close to what I need.

[DieNacht]

Word is not really a great system for a database. Ideally, we would use some sort of data base software, but they usually cost a lot. I assume Works is basically a simplified (or basic) version of excel. This is what I use. Excel is not necessarily ideal, but it certainly allows you to make all sorts of analyses that I like. Word does not allow for the same manipulation of data. The drawback with excel is text, but I don't enter much of that. Mixing artwork with any of these programs is a recipe for disaster, in my opinion. The level of detail can be adjusted to the need, so this is really up to each individual.

True about the limits of Word concerning search and editing functions etc.

In my case I started with LPs and only slowly supplemented with CDs and Hard-Disk downloads & it would be too much work to start registering all over again in a new system. But with time I´ll be developing the accompanying texts with further articles, comments on the recordings and perhaps pictures etc., and then Word is OK for a "collage" of detailed information.

[Papy Oli]

I use an excel spreadsheet (simplified version of Anthony Athletic's database...cheers mate  ) in a similar format to Sarge which allows an easy drill-down for specific search through the recordings. I only use fields like No of CD's in the set, composer(s), works, conductor, orchestra, labels, soloists. I don't worry about the CD numbering or its reference itself.

However, I have not always gone into too much details in the entry of the works in the above (e.g. for boxsets - I just use the main title of the set and that's it). To counter that flaw, I have recently made a separate works-only spreadsheet with composer name, first name, birth/death year, musical period, genre (orchestral, chamber,  piano solo, etc....), Opus numbers if any, and finally full work name/details.

Benefits found :

- better tracking of composers available, which otherwise could be forgotten about (e.g in the Celi boxsets where I have some Stravinsky, Bartok, Roussel but nowhere else....)

- better view of where a composer sits on the general timeline

- where opus numbers are available, a view where this particular works sits among the others by this composer. Probably handy in the future, the more I learn about classical music and if I go more in depth in a particular composer's output

- easy filtering of the collection by periods or work types.

- As I am mostly expanding the collection with maiden composers this year, this will help me keep a nice tab of its evolution as well.

- Adds familiarity with opus numbering formats, Key of works etc....

Nice learning tool overall, putting a visual structure to the music collection.

[Geo Dude]

Delicious Library 2, while not perfect, is an interesting app.  Scan the bar code off of your discs (books, etc.) and it reads it and places it into a visual 'library.'  You can try it for free, too.

[nico1616]

Thanks for the replies!

I also tried Music Collector (trial version) but again, not tailor made for classical music. The complexity of it really made me nervous.

So I will keep it simple to start with: Excell 

[Mirror Image]

The problem with these CD cataloging software programs is they're not user friendly. They need to be image based where all you do is enter in the composer's name and you can search images via Amazon, Barnes & Noble, etc. and select the recordings you own and then once you've found all of the recordings you own for this composer you choose how you want these recordings to be organized.

[Mirror Image]

My database is my brain .. i know my music collection like the back of my hand.

How large is your collection?

[nico1616]

My database is my brain .. i know my music collection like the back of my hand.

I thought I did too, until I bought a cd I already had.
Moreover, I doubt if you could name all the recordings you have in which the Chicago Symphony Orchestra play, or in which von Karajan or Solti direct.
Unless your have none or very little of those 

[Ataraxia]

It all ends up in iTunes, so...iTunes. 

[KeithW]

OK, as a librarian, I can't resist engaging with this topic.  Despite my professional prejudices, I use iTunes, since I haven't found anything that does the job more satisfactorily at this stage, and which accords with the way in which I listen to my music (more at the end on this).  Proper use of iTunes with classical music demands a fair amount of retagging, best achieved by using programs that sit outside iTunes.  I use a Mac and find MediaRage indispensable for a whole range of tasks.

My broad approach in cataloguing in iTunes is:

For multi-movement/part works the work is identified in the album field, with sufficient information to distinguish one recording from another (35 Beethoven VCs and counting)
Beethoven: Violin Concerto in D major, Op. 61 [Faust, 2007]

Mozart: Don Giovanni, K527 [Giulini, 1960]

Where an album is a compilation, I tend to leave it well alone

Wagner: Orchestral Music [Karajan]
Rosso: Italian Baroque Arias

The artist is presented as soloist 1 / soloist 2 / chorus / orchestra / conductor

Isabelle Faust / Prague Philharmonia / Jiří Bělohlávek

The 'song' represents each movement of the work:

I.  Allegro
II.  Adagio
III. Rondo. Allegro

or each part of an opera, cantata etc

If a CD contains two separate works (eg two Mozart symphonies) I use an applescript (from Doug's Applescripts) to albumise each - this resets the track listing to begin at number 1 for each new work.

I note the details of the source CD (including ASIN) in the grouping field.

The composer's name goes, well, in the composer field:
Surname, first name (dates)

Beethoven, Ludwig van (1770-1827)

I also use the genre tag as a way of improving browsing - I use this at a fairly granular level - either for series (Hyperion Romantic Piano Concerto) or themes (Early French Polyphony)

This whole system has served me well, but it does have limitations - a large database (mine has 100,000 'songs' and is rapidly approaching 2TB in size) isn't portable - so if I ever manage to find a record store, I can't guarantee having access to my database to check whether I already own a particular disc.  I do think there is a market for an app which allows the index from iTunes to be exported to an iPhone/iPod without the music files.  I know I can export a flat listing of files, but I'd like to keep the artwork as that represents my principal form of recall.

I also debate from time to time what to do with my growing collection of FLACs: should I convert them to the least space intensive MP3 format and import them into iTunes, simply to have them catalogued alongside everything else?  Or should I convert them to Apple lossless and treat them in the same way as the files I rip from CDs?  The jury is still out.

There have been a number of interesting posts in recent years about tagging classical music - some of the most useful ones I have found are:
http://oakroadsystems.com/genl/itunes.htm
http://www.ilounge.com/index.php/articles/comments/the-complete-guide-to-album-tagging-art-and-playlists-in-itunes/
http://charuzu.wordpress.com/2011/02/05/managing-classical-music-itunes/
http://www.scene24.net/1203.html

Of course, my system is shaped by the way in which I access music - which can be a different location from one day to the next.  Rather than carrying (and risking loss or damage) CDs around the world with me, I take an external drive with a copy of my library - this allows me to listen to my music at CD quality wherever I am.  If I sought a system which essentially catalogued a physical CD collection, and for which I had no need to rip CDs, I would look for something very different.  There are a number of very cheap library catalogue systems which would do a much better job than Excel or Access.  If anyone is interested, I'll dig out some details.

[Gurn Blanston]

Keith,
I won't quote your whole post, since I don't use iTunes and thus much of it isn't germane to my requisite. But vis-a-vis this:

There are a number of very cheap library catalogue systems which would do a much better job than Excel or Access.  If anyone is interested, I'll dig out some details.

certainly I am interested. I am planning on using Excel. For many years I used Lotus Approach, which is a lovely piece of software, but it hasn't been updated in 10+ years and isn't happy on Win7 (nor was it on XP, for that matter). This leaves me Access, which I really find difficult to work with, or Excel. I found some instructions for writing a GUI for data entry, but we all know that this will be a lot of work and bother (for 5000+ CD's). So if there are alternatives out there as you believe, then I will hold off and have a look. Best to find this stuff out before doing the work.