Objective review of the US 2012 Presidential and Congressional general campaign

[Gurn Blanston]

Here's one article covering it.  It was an issue in the primaries.  The MA governor has line item veto power, which accounts for the high numbers.   

Just imagine if Presidents had line item veto power.

Don't tease me, Todd. A combination of line item veto and term limits and I would actually begin to have a vague glimmer of faith in our political system. Thanks for the link.

[ibanezmonster]

I voted for Romney. And I don't like him at all.
I don't see much of a bright future with more Obama. But Romney says he can do better. Go ahead, let's see how brilliant you can make everything. And if you fail, we won't laugh at you... 

promise... 

not. 

[Mirror Image]

I voted for Romney. And I don't like him at all.
I don't see much of a bright future with more Obama. But Romney says he can do better. Go ahead, let's see how brilliant you can make everything. And if you fail, we won't laugh at you... 

promise... 

not. 

Yeah, I guess we should take Romney's word for it, especially if he says "he can do better." It's not like he's changed his mind on every important political issue facing his campaign.

[ibanezmonster]

Yeah, I guess we should take Romney's word for it, especially if he says "he can do better." It's not like he's changed his mind on every important political issue facing his campaign.

You also have to remember that Obama was noted as a flip-flopper back in the day.
Changing one's mind can be good sometimes, but it's kind of hard to know which Romney will be president. I think that some of the stuff he said was just to get support among certain people, and he probably won't be far right, which is good.

Likewise, at first Obama was considered dangerously far left by many, but he didn't turn out to be that extreme (never banned guns, never legalized marijuana (although that would be a good thing), took 4 years to support gay marriage, etc.)

[mahler10th]

It's the stone-cold truth.

In Colorado, they'll soon be getting stoned-cold.  They have just legalized pot at the right time, when all the focus is elsewhere.


Democrats celebrate in Denver

[Daverz]

Hey Dave. Where did you get those numbers? Is it in a readily accessible place on the Interwebs?  I'm curious, since if those are solid numbers, why weren't they used during the campaign? Seems fair game to me...

Well, it's no longer a campaign issue, but I wanted to answer your query.

I think the numbers were from Wikipedia.  You can find many references on google to "over 800" vetoes which were "mostly" overridden.  There was a pretty good AP article which you should be able to find via google.

What would be nice to have are some veto numbers for the next governor for comparison.  But if most of your vetoes are being overridden, it indicates to me that you are just not working well with the legislature.  The obvious exception was "Romneycare".

[Florestan]

Is it true that under Obamacare plan one cannot choose what hospital to go to and which doctor to be treated by?

[Gurn Blanston]

Is it true that under Obamacare plan one cannot choose what hospital to go to and which doctor to be treated by?

No.

[Florestan]

No.

Thanks. I suspected that the moment I heard this "piece of information" offered this morning on a Romanian TV station by someone who pretended to be well informed and an avowed Republican supporter. I could not believe my ears and I had to know the truth. Thanks again for confirming my suspicion.

[Daverz]

Liberal Schadenfreude Hits Impossible Heights

[Scarpia]

Is it true that under Obamacare plan one cannot choose what hospital to go to and which doctor to be treated by?

As Gurn said, no.  But there are private insurance plans which would put restrictions on you, even before Obamacare.  Some plans require you to get permission before going to the emergency room, or coverage is denied.  Under Obamacare you can keep whatever insurance you have, although there are more regulations on private insurance. 

[Gurn Blanston]

Liberal Schadenfreude Hits Impossible Heights

[Sergeant Rock]

Liberal Schadenfreude Hits Impossible Heights

All together now!

Schadenfreude Götterfunken
Tochter aus Elysium,
Wir betreten feuertrunken...

[Gurn Blanston]

All together now!

Schadenfreude Götterfunken
Tochter aus Elysium,
Wir betreten feuertrunken...

Beethoven missed a great opportunity there.

[Todd]

One thing that disheartened Republicans can take solace in is that Obama basically has two effective years left in his presidency, barring another major war, and surprisingly (or not), this is partly his own doing.  In 2014, ACA goes fully into effect, the US withdraws combat forces from Afghanistan (though some "training" forces may remain, with high-end estimates of 20,000), and the mid-term elections will change the mix in Congress, after which he will largely be a lame duck as both parties start gearing up for 2016.  Obama will then be like every other two-termer in recent times and focus on legacy policies, possibly in foreign policy.  I'd say he'd work on peace in the Middle East, but that region is more complicated now.  Or maybe the environment.  After all, in 2008 he said it was the year the oceans would stop rising.  Time to get on that one.

Now's as good a time as any to flood McConnell's, Boehner's, and Cantor's offices with words of encouragement: Obstruct!  Obstruct like you've never obstructed before!  (But not until after the "fiscal cliff" situation is resolved, this time with a three year fix, please.) 

[Gurn Blanston]

Now's as good a time as any to flood McConnell's, Boehner's, and Cantor's offices with words of encouragement: Obstruct!  Obstruct like you've never obstructed before!  (But not until after the "fiscal cliff" situation is resolved, this time with a three year fix, please.)

Or you could say 'cooperate! Like you never have before. Without having to worry about reelection, Obama can take some political risks now, and since he is moving/has moved to the center now, it would be a good time to get some of your own agenda taken care of too..

Obama has already indicated that he has some commonality with the Republican agenda (which alienated some of the Democratic base 2 years ago), so why not try for a positive outcome instead of a negative one? There is a point where political gain becomes Pyrrhic when your gains leave you presiding over the figurative ashes of a once-strong economy.

Just sayin'...

[Todd]

Or you could say 'cooperate! Like you never have before.

Hey, I'm all for it.  Time to see what Obama will come up with on spending cuts and Republicans on raising taxes, at least longer term - now is not the time for austerity measures, as Europe's economies show.  If Obama and the Democrats won't agree to some long-term spending cuts, though, the Republicans should block everything.  If the Republicans won't agree to raise taxes, Obama should be all over them in the press, in the State of the Union, everywhere.  I want some bare knuckle brawling on this one.  The policy options are well known.  Time to make some choices.  Somehow, if there's a fix, I see one or more short-term fixes that don't really address the problems.  Kick the can down the road.  Maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised.

[kishnevi]

Thread reboot.

Discussion of the 2012 election seems to be carrying on excellently well at Snyprrr's.
http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,21125.0.html

The new thread, for what's coming up, including fiscal cliffs and other polidrama, starts here
http://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,21133.msg673530.html#msg673530