Masses in Classical Era Austria

Started by Gurn Blanston, June 10, 2012, 05:02:51 PM

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Gurn Blanston

I think this will be a good place to discuss sacred music, since the bulk of it is vocal, and in this case, some of it is darn near operatic too! 0:)

Masses in Classical Austria
Part 1 – Some background
I have recently (within the last year, let us say) gotten quite interested in the way that music was presented in Catholic churches in Austria in the 18th century.  I will say straight out here that I am presenting the facts as I have discovered them, but I also am putting some personal spin on it, because related facts have turned up in many different places and it has been hard to put things into context. So I am creating the context, not just for the reader, but also to help myself to understand all that I have found out.
That may not sound unique relative to other places in Europe or other times either, but actually it is. It was a confluence of culture and talent which enabled the people in the major Austrian population centers, and more surprisingly, the minor population centers too, to come to church and celebrate their faith in a liturgical display unlike any other!

Some Geography

Always useful to know where things are in relation to each other. I was surprised it was hard to find a good map online that represented the actual time and place, but I did grab this map which is of modern Austria. Since Salzburg, Vienna and Eisenstadt haven't moved too much, I guess it will have to do to be getting on with.


(Click image to make it larger)

The places that are circled are the ones of primary interest to us. Bear in mind that there were also dozens of monasteries throughout the countryside. These were hugely influential in influencing the music and disseminating it through the surrounding area. Without the monks, most of the music we know today, both sacred and secular, would be lost to us. Many boundaries that exist today as international ones were at that time more like state borders, since the Holy Roman Empire, which controlled most of what can be seen (and a lot that can't) was based in Vienna (Wien). So Hungary, Bohemia (now Slovakia) and much of Bavaria (north of Salzburg, so Munich then) were all under the same rule, although usually indirectly. These 'states' had an Elector in charge of them, and the Elector answered to the Holy Roman Emperor. It was a good system (if you were the HRE :) ).

Some time to go with that Space
Many of us still have the fairly rigid boundaries that we learned when we first started studying music, whether formally or informally. "If it's 1750 it's still Baroque" or "if it's 1770 it's Classical" are hard things to dispense from our brains. As we learned more about music we discovered that there was some overlap in time since not everyone, everywhere suddenly abandoned what they did and took up something new and stylish.

And so there was an intermediate period and then everyone was on board with the new way, right?

And everyone was very trendy and stylish and so they wouldn't listen to anything older than the latest Top 40, eh?

Well, in the world of secular music, this is all pretty true. People did want just the latest and greatest, and they also wanted that totally hip galant swinging dance music too. However, and this is a big however; they didn't want it so much in Church, at least not in early times. Change in church music came far more gradually than it did in secular music. People in Salzburg still happily listened to the 1730's organ music of Eberlin well into the 1770's. Galant was a dirty word on Sunday morning, although it was fine on Thursday afternoon. So we have to blur the lines a little bit. Baroque (which term hadn't been invented yet, of course) organ music was fine. Preferred in fact. It was called stile antico and was just right. And despite the fact that there was only a little bit of composition going on for trumpets and timpani, they were still being used in most masses. So what were they playing? Well, the old stuff was apparently just fine. Heinrich Biber was better known in Salzburg as a composer of masses and trumpet music than he was as a fiddler (which is how he is remembered today).

The big development, and the one that caused the most consternation among the conservatives, and eventually nearly brought about the demise of the genre, was the convergence of solo vocal music styles. Where there used to be distinct 'church music' and 'opera music', by the end of the 18th century, for all intents and purposes, the texts were being sung as opera arias and duets etc. The reactionary feeling was that there was too much beauty there (in a good performance) to allow the listeners to remember that they were in church.

I want to end Part 1 with the entry for Viennese masses from The New Grove. It pretty well describes the trends that were instituted. In Part 2, I will recap a discussion that we had in the Haydn Haus recently, and introduce some other music that complements the masses that we all know and enjoy, in such a way as to make a far more interesting experience out of listening to  disk of a mass. :)

From the article in the New Grove entitled "Mass", Section 2 "Viennese"
Quote
(ii) Viennese.
Even in Austria the stile antico persisted in the mid- and late 18th century, with examples by Reutter, Werner, Wagenseil, Albrechtsberger, Michael Haydn, Leopold Hofmann and Salieri, and the Missa 'Sunt bona mixta malis' by Joseph Haydn. Nevertheless, the mainstream of the Viennese tradition derives largely from the work at the Viennese court, early in the century, of the highly influential Kapellmeister J.J. Fux and his Venetian colleague Antonio Caldara. Of the three important composers of masses in the Austrian tradition in the later 18th century, both Joseph and Michael Haydn were pupils of Reutter, also a Viennese court Kapellmeister, whose work their early essays in the genre resemble. Michael's
Missa in honorem sanctissimae Trinitatis has the same busy violin figuration for solos and rather dull choral parts, while Joseph's Missa 'Rorate coeli desuper' and Missa brevis in F show the same technique, though occasionally investing such words as 'incarnatus' with deeper feeling. His Missa in honorem BVM (hXXII:4, by 1774) has a concertante part for organ, and uses the solo quartet as a concertino to be set against orchestra and tutti, which, together with some modern (as opposed to stile antico) counterpoint, puts more emphasis on the voice without being operatic. Mozart, whose complete masses all date from the period 1768–80, showed his operatic leanings in his earliest works (k139/47a and k66) by following the Neapolitan model closely, in the former even using the brass to give a theatrical atmosphere in the 'Crucifixus'. A similar influence may be seen in his treatment of the 'Et incarnatus', usually with a hushed tone, chromaticism and often a move to the minor mode. Mozart's main preoccupation in the early 1770s, however, was with the missa brevis, forced on him by the reforming taste of the Salzburg archbishop, sometimes resulting in polytextual word setting and in less fugal writing (most of his longer mass settings, in the Salzburg tradition of Eberlin and Michael Haydn, have extended fugues on 'Cum Sancto Spiritu' to end the Gloria and 'Et vitam venturi' to end the Credo). From this period come his 'Credo' masses (k192/186f and 257), in which he used the Austrian tradition of having a figure set to the word 'Credo' recur throughout an entire section. He also introduced symphonic devices, especially in the 'Coronation' Mass (k317), which has virtually a complete thematic recapitulation in the Gloria and music from the Kyrie returning in faster tempo at 'Dona nobis pacem'; however, the solo Agnus Dei, with its strong suggestion of 'Dove sono' (Le nozze di Figaro), serves to recall that his ecclesiastical and operatic idioms were close. Both Haydn and Mozart produced fine masses in the year before the abolition of elaborate church music by the Emperor Joseph II in 1783. Haydn's Missa Cellensis ('Mariazeller', hXXII:8 ) is notable for its imaginative treatment of sonata principles in the context of choral music and for its concertante interplay of solo quartet and chorus. Mozart's unfinished C minor Mass k427/417a is a 'Neapolitan' mass, but with the stile antico element now interpreted as the Handelian manner of choral writing, with Baroque dotted rhythms, ground bass techniques and the use of double choir.

Haydn resumed writing masses in 1796 as a direct result of new duties for the Esterházy household on the assumption of Prince Nicolaus II, and the six works he wrote, finishing in 1802, are among the greatest settings ever made. All are 'solemn masses' scored for medium or large orchestra and show an expansion of scale over previous masses in the Viennese tradition. Although there are operatic-style sections, notably at times in the 'Benedictus', the predominant manner is that of the symphony. Three of the Kyries have slow introductions which lead into Allegro movements, that of the 'Theresienmesse' being specially close to those of Haydn's London symphonies; and it is usual for the Sanctus to be similarly constructed, the Allegro arriving at the words 'Pleni sunt coeli' or 'Osanna'. The Kyrie is also often in a variant of sonata form, as in the Missa in tempore belli, where, after the slow introduction, the Allegro exploits the customary key structure. In both the Missa Sancti Bernardi von Offida and the 'Theresienmesse' a similar pattern is combined with fugal textures; and in the 'Nelsonmesse' (hXXII:11) the form is close to the concerto, with a ritornello section preceding the 'exposition'. In this work the concertante nature is emphasized by a florid part for solo soprano; but normally the soloists are used in the early Baroque manner as a quartet contrasting with the ripieno, rather than with individual roles. Other reminiscences of Baroque practice occur in the fugues that end both Gloria and Credo, although the counterpoint derives not from Palestrina as much as from the Fuxian fugal style of the Op 20 string quartets. The orchestra is used in the longer movements to provide continuity, and there are still relics both of trio textures and of the rapid violin figurations of Reutter. There are also dramatic moments, in the 'Nelsonmesse' as in the Missa in tempore belli, where trumpets and drums play fanfares at the climax of the Benedictus and Agnus Dei, a tradition dating to at least the Fux era in Austria. 

Well, I don't write that way, but if you wade in, you are bound to extract a lot of highly useful information.

I hope that this thread will become a gathering place for any of you that are interested in the time, place and music. Please contribute your knowledge, we are all here to learn, especially me. I will try to post one essay per week until I run out of resources, and between times I hope there will be plenty to discuss otherwise.

Cheers,
Gurn 
8)
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Haydn: that genius of vulgar music who induces an inordinate thirst for beer - Mily Balakirev (1860)

Leo K.

I've been waiting for a thread like this!

Great, great post there Gurn, I'm looking forward to exploring my love for the genre with friends here.

8)

There is so much to this subject, and so many great works!

I will report back soon.


Gurn Blanston

Quote from: Leo K on June 12, 2012, 10:05:57 AM
I've been waiting for a thread like this!

Great, great post there Gurn, I'm looking forward to exploring my love for the genre with friends here.

8)

There is so much to this subject, and so many great works!

I will report back soon.

Thanks, Leo. I am opening the door here for all you guys to share your knowledge. I have a long way to go to catch up. :)

8)
Visit my Haydn blog: HaydnSeek

Haydn: that genius of vulgar music who induces an inordinate thirst for beer - Mily Balakirev (1860)

Leo K.

#3
I suggest a couple of Johann Naumann masses to listen to alongside the more familiar works of Mozart and Haydn. Although these masses are from Dresden, I offer them as a study of Haydn's influence on the wider musical world. Also, Johann Hasse is responsible for furthering Naumann's career. It is interesting to note that although Naumann was a protestant, he worked at a Catholic court. The years we are considering here are 1786-1806. Mozart criticized Naumann's work as dull stuff, but I humbly disagree!



Johann Gottlieb Naumann: Mass No. 18, in D minor (1794), Mass No.21 in C Minor (1786-1806)
Collegium Instrumentale, Dir. Peter Kopp


These works are modest masses with great beauty. The period instruments, and the clarinets in particular, give the flavor of autumn to the orchestration. I really love this recording, and this is a very valuable addition to my 18th Century Mass collection, of which I turn to all the time for peace and reflection. Naumann's liturgical music is not flashy, but solid and very devotional.

Here is a review from fanfare:

Although little known today, during his lifetime Johann Gottlieb Naumann (1741–1801) occupied a very respected niche in the world of late 18th-century music. Born and raised near Dresden, his career was largely made there; after moving to northern Italy in 1757 for further musical training (his teachers there included Padre Martini), he was called to the Saxon imperial court in 1764 on the recommendation of Johann Adolf Hasse as second church composer, attaining promotion to Kapellmeister in 1776. Between 1777 and 1786 he was also active as a musical reformer of opera along Italian lines in Stockholm and Copenhagen; to retain him in Dresden, the Saxon elector promoted Naumann to Oberkapellmeister in 1786. Naumann remained there for the rest of his life, dying a wealthy and respected man. (For further details see Brian Robins's review of the composer's oratorio Betulia liberata in Fanfare 30:2.)

Much of Naumann's oeuvre remains unpublished; a catalog compiled by Heinrich Mannstein in 1841 lists 27 Mass settings, of which those in D and C Minor presented here are numbers 18 and 21. However, since it was a customary practice of the Hofkirche to combine parts to various masses by different composers for liturgical use, manuscript dates suggest that individual Mass movements may have been composed at various times and only later assembled into complete Mass settings. The D-Minor Mass is an apparent exception, with all its movements bearing the date of 1794; the various parts of the C-Minor Mass, by contrast, range from 1786 to 1801. The D Minor was once a well-established work; between 1876 and the mid 1930s it was performed almost annually on December 26, following a Mass on Christmas day by Hasse, and evidence suggests the practice may go back to Naumann's own lifetime. Psalm 96 dates from Naumann's return to Dresden in 1786, and Psalm 103 and the brief one-movement cantata Kommt herzu from 1790. While Naumann himself was a Protestant, the Dresden court was Catholic; Psalm 96 and the cantata are rare instances of Naumann having an opportunity to set German-language texts for Protestant devotions—the psalm for Duke Friedrich von Mecklenburg-Schwerin, and the cantata for the Herrnhuter Brüdergemeinde of the Moravian Church, inspired by a visit of Naumann to that devout Pietistic community (after its founding in 1727 it practiced an uninterrupted watch of prayer by its members for 100 years). Gustaf Wasa, an opera on the Swedish king who liberated his country from Danish thralldom, was for decades after its premiere the Swedish national opera (ArkivMusic has reissued the complete Virgin Classics recording with Nicolai Gedda). For unknown reasons the 1803 Breitkopf & Härtel edition of Psalm 96 included the opera's overture as a musical preface, and so it is offered here.

During a visit to Dresden in 1789, Mozart peremptorily dismissed a Naumann Mass as "very poor stuff," and doubtless that verdict affected Naumann's posthumous fortunes. A typical representative of the galant style, his music is neither fish nor fowl for typical expectations regarding either Baroque or Classical-era music; its straightforward simplicity lacks the complexity of the former's use of polyphony and the latter's emphasis upon extended thematic and formal development. Even in his own day, Naumann's music was stylistically in the conservative rearguard (which ideally suited him for the Dresden court); the Wasa Overture sounds startlingly like a work of Handel, and the various psalm and Mass movements demonstrate only a nodding acquaintance with the music of Haydn and no contact with that of Mozart. The harmonies are unenterprising, the melodies ordinary, the rhetorical gestures predictable. Somewhat surprisingly, however, Naumann's music is not dull; while only moderately pleasant rather than memorable, it fulfills its intended ecclesial functions ably and even winningly. Unlike, say, the Mozart, Berlioz, and Verdi Requiems or Beethoven's Missa solemnis, these are psalm and Mass settings that are subordinate to liturgical purposes; they do not draw attention to themselves in ways that distract one from devotional concentration, but rather humbly support it. They simply are not constructed to sustain the concentrated scrutiny of independent listening in the concert hall, and this as much as other factors explains why they have fallen largely into oblivion.

These two CDs are reissues, the first originally released in 1996 and the second in 1999. All the recordings are premieres and remain the sole versions available. The performances (by the same groups in both cases, despite their changes of names) leave nothing to be desired. The instrumental ensemble uses period instruments and plays with refined polish; the chorus is first-rate in every way; the soloists (Kai Wessel and Werner Güra having since achieved greater prominence) without exception all sing their brief parts ably. The digipaks contain informative booklets with texts in the original German and Latin with English translation. An online search has also located these two releases as a combined two-CD budget set for about the same price as each item individually, though I was not able to determine any product details such as inclusion of libretti. For those interested in filling in their collections with music from the secondary ranks of later 18th-century music in general and the galant composers in particular, these discs can be safely recommended.

FANFARE: James A. Altena


Karl Henning

Say, do you know that thar Sunt bona mixta malis Mass, O Gurn?
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Karl Henning

Quote from: karlhenning on June 12, 2012, 10:50:27 AM
Say, do you know that thar Sunt bona mixta malis Mass, O Gurn?

Hob. XXII:2, apparently.
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Gurn Blanston

Quote from: karlhenning on June 12, 2012, 10:50:27 AM
Say, do you know that thar Sunt bona mixta malis Mass, O Gurn?

Yes indeed, it is a little fragment in d minor. Haydn wrote on the first page "a little mass with some good mixed with some bad". I love that! Anyway, I think the entire remaining parts total less than 10 minutes. :-\

8)
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mc ukrneal

Quote from: Leo K on June 12, 2012, 10:29:26 AM
I suggest a couple of Johann Naumann masses to listen to alongside the more familiar works of Mozart and Haydn. Although these masses are from Dresden, I offer them as a study of Haydn's influence on the wider musical world. Also, Johann Hasse is responsible for furthering Naumann's career. It is interesting to note that although Naumann was a protestant, he worked at a Catholic court. The years we are considering here are 1786-1806. Mozart criticized Naumann's work as dull stuff, but I humbly disagree!



Johann Gottlieb Naumann: Mass No. 18, in D minor (1794), Mass No.21 in C Minor (1786-1806)
Collegium Instrumentale, Dir. Peter Kopp


These works are modest masses with great beauty. The period instruments, and the clarinets in particular, give the flavor of autumn to the orchestration. I really love this recording, and this is a very valuable addition to my 18th Century Mass collection, of which I turn to all the time for peace and reflection. Naumann’s liturgical music is not flashy, but solid and very devotional.

Here is a review from fanfare:

Although little known today, during his lifetime Johann Gottlieb Naumann (1741–1801) occupied a very respected niche in the world of late 18th-century music. Born and raised near Dresden, his career was largely made there; after moving to northern Italy in 1757 for further musical training (his teachers there included Padre Martini), he was called to the Saxon imperial court in 1764 on the recommendation of Johann Adolf Hasse as second church composer, attaining promotion to Kapellmeister in 1776. Between 1777 and 1786 he was also active as a musical reformer of opera along Italian lines in Stockholm and Copenhagen; to retain him in Dresden, the Saxon elector promoted Naumann to Oberkapellmeister in 1786. Naumann remained there for the rest of his life, dying a wealthy and respected man. (For further details see Brian Robins’s review of the composer’s oratorio Betulia liberata in Fanfare 30:2.)

Much of Naumann’s oeuvre remains unpublished; a catalog compiled by Heinrich Mannstein in 1841 lists 27 Mass settings, of which those in D and C Minor presented here are numbers 18 and 21. However, since it was a customary practice of the Hofkirche to combine parts to various masses by different composers for liturgical use, manuscript dates suggest that individual Mass movements may have been composed at various times and only later assembled into complete Mass settings. The D-Minor Mass is an apparent exception, with all its movements bearing the date of 1794; the various parts of the C-Minor Mass, by contrast, range from 1786 to 1801. The D Minor was once a well-established work; between 1876 and the mid 1930s it was performed almost annually on December 26, following a Mass on Christmas day by Hasse, and evidence suggests the practice may go back to Naumann’s own lifetime. Psalm 96 dates from Naumann’s return to Dresden in 1786, and Psalm 103 and the brief one-movement cantata Kommt herzu from 1790. While Naumann himself was a Protestant, the Dresden court was Catholic; Psalm 96 and the cantata are rare instances of Naumann having an opportunity to set German-language texts for Protestant devotions—the psalm for Duke Friedrich von Mecklenburg-Schwerin, and the cantata for the Herrnhuter Brüdergemeinde of the Moravian Church, inspired by a visit of Naumann to that devout Pietistic community (after its founding in 1727 it practiced an uninterrupted watch of prayer by its members for 100 years). Gustaf Wasa, an opera on the Swedish king who liberated his country from Danish thralldom, was for decades after its premiere the Swedish national opera (ArkivMusic has reissued the complete Virgin Classics recording with Nicolai Gedda). For unknown reasons the 1803 Breitkopf & Härtel edition of Psalm 96 included the opera’s overture as a musical preface, and so it is offered here.

During a visit to Dresden in 1789, Mozart peremptorily dismissed a Naumann Mass as “very poor stuff,” and doubtless that verdict affected Naumann’s posthumous fortunes. A typical representative of the galant style, his music is neither fish nor fowl for typical expectations regarding either Baroque or Classical-era music; its straightforward simplicity lacks the complexity of the former’s use of polyphony and the latter’s emphasis upon extended thematic and formal development. Even in his own day, Naumann’s music was stylistically in the conservative rearguard (which ideally suited him for the Dresden court); the Wasa Overture sounds startlingly like a work of Handel, and the various psalm and Mass movements demonstrate only a nodding acquaintance with the music of Haydn and no contact with that of Mozart. The harmonies are unenterprising, the melodies ordinary, the rhetorical gestures predictable. Somewhat surprisingly, however, Naumann’s music is not dull; while only moderately pleasant rather than memorable, it fulfills its intended ecclesial functions ably and even winningly. Unlike, say, the Mozart, Berlioz, and Verdi Requiems or Beethoven’s Missa solemnis, these are psalm and Mass settings that are subordinate to liturgical purposes; they do not draw attention to themselves in ways that distract one from devotional concentration, but rather humbly support it. They simply are not constructed to sustain the concentrated scrutiny of independent listening in the concert hall, and this as much as other factors explains why they have fallen largely into oblivion.

These two CDs are reissues, the first originally released in 1996 and the second in 1999. All the recordings are premieres and remain the sole versions available. The performances (by the same groups in both cases, despite their changes of names) leave nothing to be desired. The instrumental ensemble uses period instruments and plays with refined polish; the chorus is first-rate in every way; the soloists (Kai Wessel and Werner Güra having since achieved greater prominence) without exception all sing their brief parts ably. The digipaks contain informative booklets with texts in the original German and Latin with English translation. An online search has also located these two releases as a combined two-CD budget set for about the same price as each item individually, though I was not able to determine any product details such as inclusion of libretti. For those interested in filling in their collections with music from the secondary ranks of later 18th-century music in general and the galant composers in particular, these discs can be safely recommended.

FANFARE: James A. Altena


Very interesting. I would love to enjoy more music from this period, whether masses, choral, opera or whatever. This goes to my wishlist. I may have an occassional piece to add myself, but it is not really a time period I know all that well beyond some orchestral pieces and operas (at least, compared to the romantic period, which I know very well).
Be kind to your fellow posters!!

Gurn Blanston

Quote from: mc ukrneal on June 12, 2012, 12:00:37 PM
Very interesting. I would love to enjoy more music from this period, whether masses, choral, opera or whatever. This goes to my wishlist. I may have an occassional piece to add myself, but it is not really a time period I know all that well beyond some orchestral pieces and operas (at least, compared to the romantic period, which I know very well).

Ah, and precisely the reason for this thread, Neal. Hopefully, we shall all pool our knowledge and all know a bunch soon. :)

8)
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Haydn: that genius of vulgar music who induces an inordinate thirst for beer - Mily Balakirev (1860)

Gurn Blanston

I see Austria at the time as being dominated liturgically from 2 different centers; the first (but not necessarily the most important) was th Vienna/Eisenstadt axis. Vienna had all the composers of the Imperial Court, and they were a multitude;

Fux, Caldara, Hasse, Reutter, Wagenseil, Leopold Hoffmann, Florian Gassmann, Gottlieb Muffat the court organist  and several others. Eisenstadt had Haydn and Werner. Until <>1757 Vienna also had Michael Haydn who started young in the church music business.

Salzburg, on the other hand, was perhaps the world leader in church music from Baroque times until the beginning of the 19th century. Heinrich Biber, Georg Muffat (Gottlieb's father), Eberlin, Michael Haydn, Leopold and Wolfgang Mozart and numerous others.

These so-called "South German" composers were not culturally tied to the North German Berlin/Potsdam/Dresden group. In the musical publications of the times, the Germans totally belittled the Austrians as being not serious about composition (or anything else). The main influence then came from Italy. Most of Italy was under the control of the HRE, thus from Vienna. The style that prevailed was significantly Neapolitan with a small dose of French for good measure. In secular music, some German ideas made their way in, such as the minuet into the symphony.

It is a sad truth that there aren't a lot of recordings of these composers available. And in some cases, like Hasse, even though he wrote a lot of sacred music, the recordings available are mainly of his operas, oratorios and some chamber music. Some exceptions are the ever-popular Requiems. His is a typical case. Still, there is enough out there to collect a nice amount of masses, and as a side note, to get a nice sampling of sacred/secular music too. Sacred/secular? Well, that's coming along. The plan here is to make listening to a mass into a time-adventure. The means certainly exist to do that. :)

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Haydn: that genius of vulgar music who induces an inordinate thirst for beer - Mily Balakirev (1860)

Johnll

I suggest a couple of Johann Naumann masses to listen to alongside the more familiar works of Mozart and Haydn. Although these masses are from Dresden, I offer them as a study of Haydn's influence on the wider musical world. Also, Johann Hasse is responsible for furthering Naumann's career. It is interesting to note that although Naumann was a protestant, he worked at a Catholic court. The years we are considering here are 1786-1806. Mozart criticized Naumann's work as dull stuff, but I humbly disagree!

What a wonderful CD! I spent the last couple of days exploring Frank Martin, an exceptional composer, but it is great to come back to an earlier era.

Leon

I am glad you started this thread, but I will be doing more reading than posting because, while I like mass settings and I love Classical era music, I am not a fan of masses from that period.  I tend to prefer masses from the pre-Baroque.  But, I am open to learning more about Classical era masses - so I will be an avid lurker.

:)

Gurn Blanston

Quote from: Arnold on June 12, 2012, 06:18:35 PM
I am glad you started this thread, but I will be doing more reading than posting because, while I like mass settings and I love Classical era music, I am not a fan of masses from that period.  I tend to prefer masses from the pre-Baroque.  But, I am open to learning more about Classical era masses - so I will be an avid lurker.

:)

:)  Lurk away, Arnold. In any case there are some splendid masses in this era too. Actually, there is so much good mass music out there that this is why I delimited it to a certain place and time, else it would simply get out of hand! Also, I think that if one gains more familiarity with the masses of, for example, Michael Haydn, that interest will surely grow. Hope so. :)

8)
Visit my Haydn blog: HaydnSeek

Haydn: that genius of vulgar music who induces an inordinate thirst for beer - Mily Balakirev (1860)

Karl Henning

Quote from: Gurnatron5500 on June 12, 2012, 11:17:43 AM
Yes indeed, it is a little fragment in d minor. Haydn wrote on the first page "a little mass with some good mixed with some bad". I love that! Anyway, I think the entire remaining parts total less than 10 minutes. :-\

So inachevée, is it? Pity! (Though, to be sure, low in the rank of Things Haydn Which Might Have Been.)  A complete Mass by "Papa" in stile antico would be an interesting score to peruse.
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Gurn Blanston

Quote from: karlhenning on June 13, 2012, 04:32:59 AM
So inachevée, is it? Pity! (Though, to be sure, low in the rank of Things Haydn Which Might Have Been.)  A complete Mass by "Papa" in stile antico would be an interesting score to peruse.

Well, not so much incomplete as lost, as near as I can tell. Pages and whole sections of it gone off. The Mrs. probably used it for hair rollers, as I've heard she did with some of his manuscripts... :-\

8)
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Haydn: that genius of vulgar music who induces an inordinate thirst for beer - Mily Balakirev (1860)

Gurn Blanston

Part 2 - Outline of sacred and secular entwining

This essay, in its first form, was written for The Haydn Haus, and concentrated on the music of Joseph Haydn. I know that not everyone here who may be a fan of Sacred Music is also necessarily a fan of Haydn, and so may not have seen this. In any case, it is vital to my goal to review this material even with people who have seen some of it before. I have added some things and also made it less specifically Haydn, since the topic is way bigger than just him (as hard as that is for me to admit!  :) ).

One of many topics which is still a mystery to me is the way that secular music was incorporated into the celebration of the mass at that time. Where does one fit a symphony or concerto into a mass? After all, it has no liturgical significance. Or maybe it does and we just don't realize. ??

In any case, I decided to do some research and see if I could discover this out. It goes without saying that nowhere in any of my reading does it say 'and then after the Credo, we play the first movement of the symphony in c minor...'   ::)  The first question that I wanted to get answered was 'how many parts of the mass are there?'. And the answer, of course, was 'it depends'. But after various false starts, I came up with a solution that satisfied me. The level that I needed to start at, the top level as it were, is divided into two parts. They would be the 'Ordinary' and the 'Proper'. I don't know about you, but Ordinary seems very... common to me. And actually, that's exactly what it is. It contains the five or six parts (not everyone agrees that the Benedictus is a standalone part) that are common to every mass, which is to say, they are what makes a Full Mass. They didn't all start out being the Ordinary at the same time, but over the centuries, and by the time we are interested in (second half of the 18th Century in Vienna), the Ordinary consisted in the Kyrie, the Gloria, Credo, Sanctus, Benedictus and Agnus Dei. When you buy a recording of a mass from this era, no matter how many parts each of these is subdivided into, these six parts will be represented (of course, Requiems are a special case. Let's leave them out of this for now).  The subdivision into many parts was far more prevalent in the Baroque and before, but still persisted in the Classical Era. It seems to have disappeared by the Romantic.

The prevailing model for masses at the time was the Neapolitan Mass. As you can imagine, being from Baroque Naples, the opera capital of the world, these masses were rather ornate. And of course, in pre-Josephinian Vienna, gilding the lily was standard procedure. So in a big mass, you would have your 6 parts of the Ordinary divided into a total of as many as 18 parts in Haydn's Mass in C, Hob 22_05. This was Haydn's largest mass. However, it didn't set any records for size in general, just for him.

I will follow this with a list of the parts that would be played at a typical Missa longa, or what we would call at other times and places a Missa solemnis. Parts of the Ordinary are in CAPS, while parts or the Proper, which changed with every day of the Liturgical Calendar, and in lower case. In parentheses I put a typical piece or movement of secular music that would have been played at that point.  This might be a good time to point out that what we call Church Symphonies really were Church Symphonies!  Different ones for different times of year, like Lamentation (#26) probably for Holy Week. Some of these already don't have a minuet movement, but for those that do, it wasn't used in church, and probably was added as an option to make the work more flexible in its uses outside of church. Following is a layout of how a Solemn Mass (or as the Austrians called it, a 'Missa Longa').

•   Opening music:  Organ solos and/or trumpet/timpani fanfares. Toccatas are a good choice here.
•   Music (Ordinary): a 'Tantum ergo' or an 'Asperges me'
•   Music (Proper) and SPOKEN PRAYER: Introit simultaneously with penitential prayers
•   Music KYRIE:
  o   Kyrie eleison
  o   Christe eleison
  o   Kyrie eleison
•   Music GLORIA
  o   Gloria in excelsis Deo
  o   Laudamus te
  o   Gratias agimus tibi
  o   Domine Deus, Rex coelestis
  o   Qui tollis peccata Mundi
  o   Quoniam tu solus sanctus
  o   Cum Sancto Spiritu
•   Prayer: Collect
•   Reading: Epistle
•   Music: Gradual  (1st movement of a symphony or concerto) or an Epistle Sonata in a shorter mass (Missa brevis)
•   Music: Alleluia or Tract (could be a motet or an Alleluia)
•   Spoken: Gospel and Homily (Sermon)
•   Instrumental music: Trumpet & Timpani fanfares to remind people of the angels playing trumpets in heaven.
•   Music CREDO:
  o   Credo in unum Deum
  o   Et incarnatus est
  o   Et resurrexit
•   Music & PRAYER: Offertory  (2nd movement of symphony or concerto)
•   Prayer & Secret (Private Prayer)
•   Prayer: Preface (Public Prayer)
•   MUSIC: SANCTUS
  o   Sanctus, Sanctus, Sanctus
  o   Pleni sunt coeli
•   BENEDICTUS
•   PRAYER: Eucharist Prayer
•   PRAYER: Lord's Prayer
•   MUSIC: AGNUS DEI
  o   Agnus Dei
  o   Dona nobis pacem
•   Music: Communion  (3rd movement of symphony (Finale really, since minuet (if any) was removed) or concerto
•   Prayer: Post Communion
•   MUSIC: Dismissal ('Ite, Missa est') (often such a short piece that it was not written out. Very few are extant)
•   SPOKEN: Closing Blessing
•   Music: organ postludium and/or trumpet/timpani fanfares

Anyway, I think this gives a much better idea of what a great event was made out of going to mass. Unlike current liturgical practice, it seems like all this artistic splendor could have inspired a true spiritual experience. That was its intention anyway. Combined with the physical art, the church itself, the statuary, painting, stained glass etc, it had to be a mind boggling display!

I point out here that I collected information from several places and consolidated it into this list. So any mistakes or misunderstandings are my own. I hope that some of you whose knowledge is more in depth than my own will take this opportunity to expand this discussion. For myself, I intend to take a Missa brevis from the early period and couple it with an organ concerto in the appropriate sequence and see how it sounds. Also, it should be noted that it was not unusual to start off with a Te Deum either in the event that the mass was celebratory. And to make a more expanded and/or unusual (once a year) work, the entire Stabat Mater was played instead of the Tract on the Feast of the Seven Dolors, which must have been quite an experience!!

Next installment I want to talk about a few mass music recreations that I have put together. It is something that you could do yourself with minimal effort and suddenly discover that listening to a Mass is, in fact, a wonderfully enjoyable experience which spans an entire range of musical genres and experiences.

Please feel free to expand on this outline. I know it doesn't go into great depth, but maybe it is enough to pique your interest, as it did mine. :)
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Haydn: that genius of vulgar music who induces an inordinate thirst for beer - Mily Balakirev (1860)

Leon

QuoteAnyway, I think this gives a much better idea of what a great event was made out of going to mass. Unlike current liturgical practice, it seems like all this artistic splendor could have inspired a true spiritual experience. That was its intention anyway. Combined with the physical art, the church itself, the statuary, painting, stained glass etc, it had to be a mind boggling display!

I checked out the second Heartz book on Haydn, Mozart and the Viennese School, and have been reading the first chapter which covers the church music of the period 1740-1780.  You are right about the tendency to add spectacle to the event, and he quotes some contemporary critics who remarked on the aspect of bringing in operatic singers and style to liturgical music - something they did not like very much.  Their main complaint was that, to the contrary, this tendency did not enhance the spiritual experience and tended to undermine the atmosphere for contemplative prayer.

I tend to agree with them, and this is probably one reason why I am not as interested in the sacred music of this period (and later), and prefer to hear mass settings from the Baroque and before.  Not that I look to this music for a spiritual experience, but when I want opera I'll listen to one, and prefer sacred music to be distinct from that style.

:)

Gurn Blanston

#17
Quote from: Arnold on June 16, 2012, 07:03:48 PM
I checked out the second Heartz book on Haydn, Mozart and the Viennese School, and have been reading the first chapter which covers the church music of the period 1740-1780.  You are right about the tendency to add spectacle to the event, and he quotes some contemporary critics who remarked on the aspect of bringing in operatic singers and style to liturgical music - something they did not like very much.  Their main complaint was that, to the contrary, this tendency did not enhance the spiritual experience and tended to undermine the atmosphere for contemplative prayer.

I tend to agree with them, and this is probably one reason why I am not as interested in the sacred music of this period (and later), and prefer to hear mass settings from the Baroque and before.  Not that I look to this music for a spiritual experience, but when I want opera I'll listen to one, and prefer sacred music to be distinct from that style.

:)


Arnold,
I would reply thusly;

Because some conservatives in the 18th century claimed that masses had turned into operas, doesn't make it true. Neither are they 'concert masses' like Beethoven's Missa Solemnis', or Britten's 'War Requiem' or Bernstein's Mass. They are, and were always intended to be, masses. It would be fair, however, to call them 'Symphonic Masses' or 'Orchestral Masses' though, because it's true that they are 'style concertato' because there are independent instrumental parts playing along with the vocal and choral parts. This distinguishes them from the style called da Capella where the instrumental parts double the vocal parts. Most Baroque masses that used instruments were da Capella.

How are they not operatic? Let me count the ways;

1)   The text was totally unchanged from mass to mass. There was never any varying, they were liturgically constant and 'within the rules' of sacred music. And always in Latin, the sacred language.

2)   Choruses. They all have great sections of choral singing, a customary part of the mass but not part of the opera at that time.

3)   Contrapuntal style; by tradition, counterpoint was a huge part of sung and played church music. It is NOT a part of opera, except (oddly enough) when they are referring to its use in church music. Listen to the final parts of almost any Credo or Gloria and there is always a fugue.

4)   Operatic arias of that time nearly always included da capo repeats. Church 'arias' never include them.

5)   Coloratura; never in church, always in opera.

6)   Recitative; never in church, always in opera.

So, I am saying that Hearst is REALLY saying that this is what some people said back then, he is not saying that this is what actually was. Would you not agree on that basis?

FWIW, I am perfectly fine with your preference for Baroque and earlier church music. It is all and only a matter of personal preference after all. Just keep an open mind and in a few days I am going to post an idea here that I hope you will try. Maybe your feeling will change. Or not. :)


8)
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Haydn: that genius of vulgar music who induces an inordinate thirst for beer - Mily Balakirev (1860)

Opus106

I just require clarification, here, Gurn. In points 4 and 6, when you say church doesn't include a 'da capo' and "never in Church", do you actually mean "never in a mass"? I'm thinking particularly of Bach's Passions*, which were (meant to be) performed in a church and which include said features. Or am I simply comparing apples and oranges in a way that they shouldn't be?



*Since I'm most familiar with them, among similar works from the same period
Regards,
Navneeth

Gurn Blanston

Quote from: Opus106 on June 17, 2012, 09:18:15 AM
I just require clarification, here, Gurn. In points 4 and 6, when you say church doesn't include a 'da capo' and "never in Church", do you actually mean "never in a mass"? I'm thinking particularly of Bach's Passions*, which were (meant to be) performed in a church and which include said features. Or am I simply comparing apples and oranges in a way that they shouldn't be?



*Since I'm most familiar with them, among similar works from the same period

Yes, I do mean that. Oratorios, too, were sometimes performed in church, and had those features, but clearly weren't masses. My bad...  :-[

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Haydn: that genius of vulgar music who induces an inordinate thirst for beer - Mily Balakirev (1860)