Blind Comparison: R.Strauss - Also sprach Zarathustra

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

Something intervened today and I haven't been able to double-check again. Do I have the whole of 18 July still available? Then I can make it in time (just)....

[madaboutmahler]

Something intervened today and I haven't been able to double-check again. Do I have the whole of 18 July still available? Then I can make it in time (just)....

Don't worry, Johan - all of today until 10.00 pm. And if you need extra time after that, please let me know.

[Lisztianwagner]

Group B was very interesting, I enjoyed listening to it very much; I'll post all my comment this evening.

[zauberflöte]

The C group. Fun selection. For me the top and bottom picks were easy. The ones in between were really difficult to choose among. Each of the middle choices had qualities I liked but also things I didn't care for.

C1. Tops all around. I might have liked a little better definition in the opening fanfare but it was hard to complain while being swept right along. The rest of the excerpts were all thrilling. Clear top choice.

With C2, the older mono sound put it at a distinct disadvantage after the brilliant C1. The timpani sounded as if recorded in a bathtub, the thin oboe was distracting. But, in all, it's an wonderful performance. It had more than enough drive and variety. Ultimately I couldn't find anything in the performance to find fault with. This one started off low in my estimation - sorry, I'm shallow; for an orchestral blockbuster like Zarathustra I like a big sound.  But after several listenings I thought it an excellent performance and couldn't decide if it was my second favorite or third. It ended at number 3.

The opening to C3 is pleasant, if a bit too civilized. What follows starts off sounding uninspired but after a thrilling climax at the "great longing" everything falls into place beautifully. Second choice.

C4. Great fanfare, possibly the best,  but I would have liked just a bit more space between the last two chords in that opening. But I grew to like what the conductor did. (I'll bet the space I like isn't in the score anyway.) What keeps this from placing higher is the relentlessness, especially toward the end. It sounds the way I would imagine Solti conducting it.  (Not saying it's Solti!)

C5 has a good opening but the rest sounds rushed through. But I kept coming back to it because the individual voices in the orchestra are nicely displayed.

Finally, and this was a bit of a relief, C6 clearly brings up the rear. The opening is a bit plodding. I'm not at all fond of the organ sound. I'll give the conductor credit for trying different things but they don't really work for me, such as slowing down unexpectedly. With this one I could have used use some relentlessness.

Ranking, almost in order as heard:

1. C1
2. C3
3. C2
4. C4
5. C5
6. C6 

[madaboutmahler]

Thank you very much for your second vote, Jim!

Ok, another 4 hours or so to place your vote. Just waiting for 4 or 5 more.

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

Thy will be done, later tonight...

[madaboutmahler]

Thy will be done, later tonight...

Looking forward to seeing your thoughts, Johan!

And just so you all know what is happening at the end of this round: 2 recordings will be eliminated from each group, leaving 12 to go through to the next round.

[Sergeant Rock]

Looking forward to seeing your thoughts, Johan!

And just so you all know what is happening at the end of this round: 2 recordings will be eliminated from each group, leaving 12 to go through to the next round.

Daniel, I need another day. Sorry. So if you can put off tabulating until about four or five tomorrow afternoon?

Sarge

[madaboutmahler]

Daniel, I need another day. Sorry. So if you can put off tabulating until about four or five tomorrow afternoon?

Sarge

That's fine, Sarge, tommorow evening it is then.

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

I happen to be able to be just in (the original) time... First, very briefly, my thoughts on the six recordings, and then my verdict.


B1. Archaic-sounding. Opening fanfare too sluggish and ponderous. The second fragment is passionate enough, though.
B2. A slight 'grace-note' in the beginning, which I don't like - the tone must be 'there' from the start. Fanfare too slow. Sound better than in B1. Second fragment too 'beautiful', not fiery enough.
B3. Here another 'grace-note' at the start. The lightning flash, so to speak, is a tad too deliberate - especially at its first appearance it must sound almost frightening and very incisive. Second fragment not passionate enough.
B4. Opening correct. 'Lightning' okay. Timpani too weak. Organ a bit too loud, perhaps, at the end. Second fragment: excellent tension and build-up to the fiery outburst. Requisite passion.
B5. Opens correctly. Fanfare well-played, but too sluggish. Timpani too dull. Second fragment: build-up too beautiful, outburst itself okay.
B6. Most epic recording. Big sound. Perhaps interpretatively middling, but persuasive and thrilling.


My verdict: B6, B4, B5, B1, B2, B3.


But none of the performances blew me away.

[TheGSMoeller]

Greg                Neal.                        J.Z.
1. B6               1. B5                      1. B6
2. B4               2. B6                      2. B4
3. B5               3. B2                      3. B5
4. B2               4. B4                      4. B1
5. B3               5. B3                      5. B2
6. B1               6. B1                      6. B3

Here's the only results from the B group, myself, Johan and Neal. Interesting contrast. Nice write-ups on all your comparisons, Neal.

Intereting. Almost identical for Johan and myself. I think Sarge is in B group also.

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

You'll find I made a slight change, to acknowledge the fact that B1 got the second clip better than either B2 or B3 (B2 and B3 are equally good/bad)...


--Johan

[TheGSMoeller]

And I put the correct name in this time also!
Thanks, Johan. 

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

I didn't read the others' verdict until after I gave mine, so the similarities really do say something.

[madaboutmahler]

Sorry to hear that you did not enjoy Group B as much as you could have done, Johan. I hope you will be more impressed with the other recordings that get through to the next round!

Just awaiting two more votes now, as soon as they have been collected, I shall start work on posting the results, and sending out the links for part 2!

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

O, but I did enjoy it! It made some things clear about what I seem to like to hear in the piece, which is always interesting!

[madaboutmahler]

O, but I did enjoy it! It made some things clear about what I seem to like to hear in the piece, which is always interesting!

Glad to hear that, Johan!

[Lisztianwagner]

Hmm, I'm deeply sorry I can't post my thought this evening; if I may have some extra time, I'll write them tomorrow morning.

[madaboutmahler]

Hmm, I'm deeply sorry I can't post my thought this evening; if I may have some extra time, I'll write them tomorrow morning.

That's fine, Ilaria, don't worry - I shall collect in the results tommorow evening.

[Lisztianwagner]

Here are my votes for group B:

B1: Hmmm, a very old recording. In Einleitung the orchestral playing is nice, with a brilliant and emphatic introduction of double basses, contrabassons and organ for the dawn motif; overall the performance could be very thrilling and powerful if it didn't have a so slow tempo, which makes the piece lack some strenght. The rythm improves in the excerpt of Von den Hinterweltieren (like in the other parts), where the solemnity and the intensity of the whole section start to be perceived. The next two movements are very good, passionate and overwhelming, especially in Von den Freuden und Leidenschaft, where the strings arrive at the peak of tension. Lyrical, enchanting final part.
B2: The introduction is beautiful, rich of energy and expressive strenght; also the short part of the second movement is fine, creating a deep and involving atmosphere. The strings at the end of Von des grossen Sehnsucht are slightly too slow, I think they should be a bit more aggressive and powerful to introduce the following movement, which as a matter of fact sound lacking some passion and tension in the opening. Anyway dynamics and phrasing are very good overall, while the sound is excellent very clear.
B3: Powerful and intense opening, with strong blows of timpani; the tempo seems to be slightly faster compared to that of previous recordings, but it works very well, making the movement evocative and emphatic. Excellent use of strings and woodwinds (brilliant solo of brass too) at the beginning of Von den grossen Sehnsucht, very lyrical and suggestive, continuing in the following section as well: there the atmosphere is passionate, tense but moving. Lovely dynamics and phrasing amongs the themes, although I sometimes have the impression that some instruments are covered by the rest of the orchestra.
B4: Remarkable recording. All the piece is performed in a passionate, expressive way; the orchestral playing is gorgeous and powerful (although I didn't like the timpani in the opening), with a great sound and a particularly beautiful phrasing of the strings between the third and the fourth movement. Brilliant dynamics. The choice of tempo is maybe the weakest point, it sometimes seems that there are little variations of rythm, which changes a bit too much amongs some sections.
B5: Energetic introduction, where the atmosphere created is very intense and evocative (I appreciated the strong sound of the organ, the effect is majestic); the whole performance is pervaded by a great power and beauty thought, especially in Von den grossen Sehnsucht, which also shows a splendid, atmospehric opening, and in Von den Freuden und Leidenschaft, there the orchestral playing become quite involving and overwhelming. Excellent tempo and dynamics overall, although at the end of the third movement the rythm slows down too much before the following part starts, breaking the strong, thrilling. climax achieved and making the sectiong lack some intensity.
B6: Wow, regarding the expressive strenght, this is the most intense and emotionally powerful recording of the group; even too much, as the blows of timpani in Einleitung are slightly too vigorous and aggressive. But overall the piece sounds passionate and thrilling, very handled and playful; the sound of the instruments is very well balanced. I liked the choice of tempi.

In order:
B3
B6
B5
B4
B2
B1