Vienna Philharmonic - Nazi History

[MishaK]

Call me any names you want, but I can't understand: why something that started in 1939, i.e. has the venerable age of almost 75 years, is a fake tradition?

Because Strauss's music is much older than that. The pretense surrounding the New years' concerts is that only the Viennese know how to play this authentically because thsy supposedly have a long institutional tradition of doing so. Turns out that tradition is not so old after all and in fact the VPO refused to play Strauss waltzes up until then as light entertainment music that was beneath them. This is just like them pretending that they have a meaningful Mahler tradition.

If anything that originated in the Nazi era of Germany/Austria is fake and should be abolished, then why stop at the Viennese New Year's Concert? Why not discontinue the production of Volkswagen cars, or raze to the ground the German highways? 

As for the idea of hearing Aryan supremacy in the waltzes of the Strauss family, my only comment is: you guys need medication under professional surveillance. 

You sound almost reasonable because the positions you opppose are really absurd. Unfortunately nobody here advocated such absurd positions as the abolition of anything, nor any ideas of aryan supremacy in Strauss waltzes (silly idea, really, given that Strauss had partially Jewish heritage).

[Florestan]

Because Strauss's music is much older than that.

Freiburger Barockorchester was founded in 1987, about 250 year after the Baroque was over. Is it fake too?

The pretense surrounding the New years' concerts is that only the Viennese know how to play this authentically because thsy supposedly have a long institutional tradition of doing so.

I don't remember anyone making this claim. Do you have an official VPO source for that?

Turns out that tradition is not so old after all

What exactly is the number of years that make a real tradition according to you?

in fact the VPO refused to play Strauss waltzes up until then as light entertainment music that was beneath them.

Source for this claim?

You sound almost reasonable because the positions you opppose are really absurd. Unfortunately nobody here advocated such absurd positions as the abolition of anything, nor any ideas of aryan supremacy in Strauss waltzes

Re-read, or rather read, the comments of that Lebrecht article.

[MishaK]

Freiburger Barockorchester was founded in 1987, about 250 year after the Baroque was over. Is it fake too?

Non sequitur, you realize? They make no claim of any institutional tradition as an ensemble. Has absolutely no bearing on the issues being discussed here.

I don't remember anyone making this claim. Do you have an official VPO source for that?

Read more carefully: "the whole pretense surrounding [the concerts]".

What exactly is the number of years that make a real tradition according to you?

You are just picking fights for the sake of it. There isn't even any substance here. Did I say anything about a fixed number of years? The orchestra largely refused to play JStr's music during his lifetime and for decades thereafter. They only have a limited tradition of playing his music since WWII. Any European spa town summer orchestra has a longer tradition with this repertoire than they do.

Source for this claim?

E.g. http://www.wienerphilharmoniker.at/upload/files/ns/ns_truem_05_repertoire_de_v03.pdf but I suspect you didn't actually read the historians' reports themselves.

Re-read, or rather read, the comments of that Lebrecht article.

You know, if you're going to throw reading comprehension issues at someone, you should first make sure that you really are beyond criticism on that point yourself. If you had read more carefully, you would have noticed that I said "nobody here advocated [etc.]". You even highlighted that in bold youself when you quoted me but managed to miss it anyway. Also, neither does Lebrecht advocate that in his blog post. He's often silly, but not that silly. I don't and didn't comment on the loonies who populate the comments section on Lebrecht's blog.

[Florestan]

E.g. http://www.wienerphilharmoniker.at/upload/files/ns/ns_truem_05_repertoire_de_v03.pdf

I don't read German that well and I don't trust Google Translate either. Could you please link to an English version? TIA.

[MishaK]

As I recall, they didn't have any female members until 1982, when Karajan hired the clarinetist Sabine Meyer.

The first female member of the BPO was Madeleine Carruzzo in 1982. http://www.tagesspiegel.de/kultur/pop/berliner-philharmoniker-hart-besaitet/1024734.html The disagreement over Sabine Mayer was a year later and she never actually got hired.