Joining the Navy

[tjguitar]

It's not so much avoidance as it is uncertainty and lack of opportunity. Who would want to hire someone whose last job was a Walmart Supercenter?

Don't you have a community college nearby? You can get a certificatation or AA in pretty much two years, and it is relatively cheap compared to "real" colleges (the classes cost less than the books!).  community colleges have degrees/certificaitons in EVERYTHING.  The local one here as an AA in photography, for instance.

All you need is a HS diploma to get accepted to a community college. If serving the country sounds interesting to you, that's awesome, but I wouldn't do it for any other reason...

Whats wrong with working at Walmart? My last job was delivering pizza and that was in 2004.

[PSmith08]

Listen, a community college is not just a way to get an associate's degree or a certification. It can also be the jumping-off point to a four-year degree. I recall reading, not too long ago, that an increasing number of students were going to a community college to get some grades and classes under their belts and then transferring or applying to prestigious universities. Indiana's system (Ivy Tech) prides itself on sending a lot of students both to the workforce and to four-year schools. That might not be your thing, but it's an option. Depending on your situation, furthermore, there is a lot of state and federal financial aid out there - for the taking, in many cases, and with little or no debt associated with it. There are always options, and there are plenty of steps along the way where you can say, "I've had enough" and still be ready to start work.

I'll say this, too, don't look at the military as a fall-back. It's not like working at a bookstore for a couple of years "to sort things out;" it's a real commitment that demands real sacrifice. I know young men and women who have gone into it for all sorts of reasons, and - almost to a person - the ones who want to do it have an easier and more productive time of it than the ones that don't. If you really want to do that, then go for it. If not, then think long and hard about it.

[tjguitar]

Listen, a community college is not just a way to get an associate's degree or a certification. It can also be the jumping-off point to a four-year degree. I recall reading, not too long ago, that an increasing number of students were going to a community college to get some grades and classes under their belts and then transferring or applying to prestigious universities. Indiana's system (Ivy Tech) prides itself on sending a lot of students both to the workforce and to four-year schools. That might not be your thing, but it's an option. Depending on your situation, furthermore, there is a lot of state and federal financial aid out there - for the taking, in many cases, and with little or no debt associated with it. There are always options, and there are plenty of steps along the way where you can say, "I've had enough" and still be ready to start work.

I'll say this, too, don't look at the military as a fall-back. It's not like working at a bookstore for a couple of years "to sort things out;" it's a real commitment that demands real sacrifice. I know young men and women who have gone into it for all sorts of reasons, and - almost to a person - the ones who want to do it have an easier and more productive time of it than the ones that don't. If you really want to do that, then go for it. If not, then think long and hard about it.

That is true.  Its also MUCH, MUCH cheaper to get your first two years done at a community college.   I'm not sure about other states but in CA, there's four year schools that are affordable (called the Cal State system). It's conceivable to get a bachelor's at a decent price. At least compared to private schools, and "University of California" 's

[XB-70 Valkyrie]

My dad owns a business...I think he'd have a clue.  The stats show that those with degrees end up making more. Of course stats dont necessarily mean anything, but what esle is there?

Those who have a degree are going to have a better chance of getting that job than someone who doesn't.  Of course experience means everything, but everyone has to start somewhere....thats the hardest damn part....

Well ask your dad if he'd hire someone with no experience and some degree not related to the business, simply because the applicant "applied himself". Maybe he would, but he's surely in the minority. I'm not trying to dissuade anyone from getting a degree. What I'm trying to caution against is just following the advice of some counselor who tells you to just major in anything and don't worry. (unless of course you and  / or your parents can afford to throw tens of thousands of dollars at some university every year for several years!)

And you have to remember that those statistics about graduates earning more are highly skewed by people with "professional" degrees (doctors, lawyers, dentists, etc.) Go ask some new assistant professor (or worse yet, a lecturer at some huge research institution) with a Ph.D. in English or History how lucrative education is!

[mahlertitan]

why are you talking to us? you should call the navy recruitment, i bet they will be very helpful.

[tjguitar]

Well ask your dad if he'd hire someone with no experience and some degree not related to the business, simply because the applicant "applied himself".

Thats not the point. The logic is that those with a degree from a college and no experience is more likely to get a position than those with no degree and no experience.  Obviously experience > degree. Though supposeldy a degree grabs you a higher salary. *shrug*

I'm not trying to dissuade anyone from getting a degree. What I'm trying to caution against is just following the advice of some counselor who tells you to just major in anything and don't worry.

What is your occupation if you don't mind me asking?

[PSmith08]

That is true.  Its also MUCH, MUCH cheaper to get your first two years done at a community college.   I'm not sure about other states but in CA, there's four year schools that are affordable (called the Cal State system). It's conceivable to get a bachelor's at a decent price. At least compared to private schools, and "University of California" 's

I think most states have either regional schools, or regional campuses of the major state university. The two big state schools in Indiana, Purdue University and Indiana University, have main campuses (West Lafayette and Bloomington, respectively) and then regional campuses sprinkled throughout the state. There are also regional schools like Ball State University, Indiana State University, and the University of Southern Indiana. Those schools do different things and offer different experiences than IU or Purdue.

You might see what your state offers from its major universities. I'll say this, most states want as many people to go to college as possible. You should plan what you want out of your college career (and your career in general) and what you'll need to go to the next level. If you don't know, think about what you'd like to do and go talk to people who do that. You'll find out real quickly what's needed.

[tjguitar]

You might see what your state offers from its major universities. I'll say this, most states want as many people to go to college as possible. You should plan what you want out of your college career (and your career in general) and what you'll need to go to the next level. If you don't know, think about what you'd like to do and go talk to people who do that. You'll find out real quickly what's needed.

The biggest problem is figuring out what you want to do.  Even worse when you essentially don't care.   I just want to be able to support myself, afford the cost of living, do something that doesn't require too much physical labor, etc.

[Tancata]

I really don't know what I want to do. I'm interested in history, languages, culture, and other general things like that, but there isn't anything that seems like it would make a viable career for me.

These are all interests that you could develop well in college, if you were prepared to work a little at it.

My advice here is worth very little, but I wouldn't imagine a stretch in the Navy would be the easy option in terms of workload...

[Soundproof]

Hi Kullervo,

Time for a reality check.
I'm sure you're figuring that going to the Navy will keep you from ground duty in Afghanistan or Iraq. It won't. To meet force quotas, a lot of sailors have found themselves sailing sand, not oceans.
That said, the Navy is a fine option. I'm an Air Force man myself, and we consider those tin cans the world's biggest targets, but they sure look good.

What you have to decide upon is your mindset. At present it is "that's the only kind of job you can get around here."

So - decision number 1 for you: Are you going to look for employment, or are you going to employ yourself? Ten years from now you could be ridiculously successful, if you have the right mindset. And success isn't necessarily measured in money, though that helps.

I like Wanderer's suggestion. Go through the yellow pages, from A-Z. Write down every profession that appeals to you, or where you think you might have a skill set that would help you get an entry level position - if your goal is to be an employee.

I like what M-Forever is telling you, which is get a damn rocket up your ass and get going. Yes, it's easy to get despondent. The educational system, as a general rule, is crap; and present day capitalism seems bent on keeping people sedentary and in a buying mode - whether you are playing games, watching movies, surfing the net, heating a seat at the movies or in a fast food restaurant.

BUT - the fact that you are here puts you apart from the rest of the drones out there. You've got art in your heart. Why don't you do something with that?
Not a good musician? Well, open a venue, start charging people who want to listen to good music. Book bands.
You already know your way around computers. Start a record label. Publish books about musicians. Your English is good, you can express yourself. You're doing ennui, remorse, melancholy and regret to perfection - now work on some other moods.

Keen on electronics? A huge field is opening up now when it comes to people storing their music in computers and wanting it available everywhere, at different levels of quality. You could aim for some opportunities there.

At no time previously have there been as many opportunities for people as there are today, and you don't need to go the traditional university route.

I also like O'Mensch's suggestion that you should look into available scholarships. There are lots out there. Also consider trade schools - you will be surprised at how that is going to open up in a few year's time. The present outsourcing development is going to head straight into a wall soon, for a variety of reasons, and if you posiiton yourself right, you stand to reap the benefits.

What I will not accept, at any moment, is that there are no opportunities out there. You're literally awash in opportunity - just don't be a drone.

And think twice before going to that recruiting office. You may be seeing yourself smartly dressed in profile against some Pacific island, on the deck of a navy vessel. I see you walking down a street in Haditha, wondering WTF?

[BachQ]

The educational system, as a general rule, is crap

(really?)

[Soundproof]

(really?)

Unless you can pay your way, and ensure you're going into excellent schools, at every single stage - yes.

[Choo Choo]

Kullervo, going to college has advantages beyond just getting a useful qualification.

1.  It buys you time.  Your profile says you are now 20.  That's not so old ...  but before long, people are going to expect you to have some idea what you're going to do for a living.  The 3 or 4 years you spend in college insulate you from that kind of pressure (including the kind of pressure you apply to yourself.)  You're just "a student."

2.  It opens up other opportunities.  At college, you don't just spend time studying for your chosen subject.  You meet people - and you get involved in stuff - and who knows what you might get interested in.  Yes, often you could do those things without going to college - but college may provide you with more available opportunities - and the fact is, you've already reached age 20 without doing them or even knowing what they are.  This is not unusual.  I went through a series of academic hothouses until at age 16 I went off to college - with everything all mapped out, supposedly - but where I discovered that what I really liked doing was stage lighting.  I only started into it at college, to help out a friend who was directing a student show.  Then I met other people - who knew other people - started doing jobs at weekends - and when I left, that's what I was doing for a living.  It would never even have occurred to me as a possibility before I went to college.

So I second those who suggest you really do explore every opportunity to go to college before dismissing it.  What you go to college for, is probably secondary.  No, college isn't everything - but in your position, I'd imagine 3 or 4 years at pretty much any college, studying anything, is going to look better than 3 or 4 more years bumming around in "crap retail jobs."

[BachQ]

As to the value of education, my general rule is simple: what you put into it, you get out of it.

You can attend the best colleges, but if you're indifferent to education and/or unmotivated to learn, then much of the schooling will be a waste.  On the other hand, if you're highly motivated, then the rewards of higher education could be immeasurably great.

[Soundproof]

As to the value of education, my general rule is simple: what you put into it, you get out of it.

You can attend the best colleges, but if you're indifferent to education and/or unmotivated to learn, then much of the schooling will be a waste.  On the other hand, if you're highly motivated, then the rewards of higher education could be immeasurably great.

We're in agreement.

[Kullervo]

Thanks, everyone. I don't think I see any bad advice here.

[greg]

interesting thread....
Kullervo, if you don't really want to go to the Navy and have no passion for it, then obviously you need to find something else, and yeah, that means going to school.

i can definetely relate with you in several ways- having an interest in culture, history, language, etc. but realizing there's no real careers that are easy to get into with those interests. And music, too, it's not very likely and too much of a risk. When you're 30 and starting to support a family, you need a reliable, steady job with a good pay.
it sounds like you're in nearly the same situation as i am, just that you're a year older. It's after high school and you don't have any scholarships or anything since you didn't really do that great, so you can't go to 4-year colleges either because financial aid only covers so much. So it's either community college or technical school.

this is what i'm doing- going to either technical school or community college and going into a computer-related program. When you get done, you take a certification test. Once you're certified in whatever program you're using, you can start getting jobs that start out at $30-40,000 dollars a year, and can end up being as high as $80,000 a year if you're very experienced a professional. This is according to my research.....

[Larry Rinkel]

this is what i'm doing- going to either technical school or community college and going into a computer-related program. When you get done, you take a certification test. Once you're certified in whatever program you're using, you can start getting jobs that start out at $30-40,000 dollars a year, and can end up being as high as $80,000 a year if you're very experienced a professional. This is according to my research.....

Another factor to consider: if you graduate from a 2-year school and get a decent entry-level position, many employers will provide tuition reimbursement so that you can continue your education once hired. There are strings attached, of course: you have to outlay the money, you may not be reimbursed 100%, and you will be required to earn a good enough grade to qualify for the reimbursement. But though a 4-year degree may be more lucrative at the start, I don't think the 2-year school option is necessarily a bad one. In the software firm where I work, we have 2-year degree people working in technical support, PC maintenance, networks, and related areas.

Like others here, I feel your notion of joining the Navy is more out of desperation than desire. Unless you're certain you want to serve your country in that way and take the obvious risks, I don't think it's the best idea for you.

Edited to add: Regarding the costs of higher education, you should also research the possible tax benefits to your family if you go to school. There are federal tax credits such as the Hope Credit and Lifetime Learning Credit that might help you and your family if you qualify.

[greg]

Another factor to consider: if you graduate from a 2-year school and get a decent entry-level position, many employers will provide tuition reimbursement so that you can continue your education once hired. There are strings attached, of course: you have to outlay the money, and you will be required to earn a good enough grade to qualify for the reimbursement. But though a 4-year degree may be more lucrative at the start, I don't think the 2-year school option is necessarily a bad one. In the software firm where I work, we have 2-year degree people working in technical support, PC maintenance, networks, and related areas.

Really? I didn't know that; that'd be pretty cool if you could end up making more money with a type of 4-year degree in that way......
hey, that's interesting that you mention that people are working in the jobs i'm aiming for at the very place you work

do you know if any of them went to technical school?

[Larry Rinkel]

Really? I didn't know that; that'd be pretty cool if you could end up making more money with a type of 4-year degree in that way......
hey, that's interesting that you mention that people are working in the jobs i'm aiming for at the very place you work

do you know if any of them went to technical school?

http://adulted.about.com/cs/financialaid/a/tuitionreimburs.htm