Pollini and Beethoven

[Mandryka]

Yes.

I can see that what you like about them is what I don't like about them.

It's a question of interpretation for me. What I find interesting is trying to say just why someone woulf play Brahms or Beethoven like that. Of course you could just say that they made errors of judgement, but these guys, Pollini and Backhaus, had thought about it harder than me before they went into he studio. i want to understand their motivations.

By the way, I like the Backhaus. I don't like the Pollini as much.

[George]

Thanks. I don't think they sound obviously better than the old ones on Decca.

Do you like the performance more than his later recording?

[George]

It's a question of interpretation for me. What I find interesting is trying to say just why someone woulf play Brahms or Beethoven like that. Of course you could just say that they made errors of judgement, but these guys, Pollini and Backhaus, had thought about it harder than me before they went into he studio. i want to understand their motivations.

By the way, I like the Backhaus. I don't like the Pollini as much.

I'd never say that Backhaus or Pollini (or any other great pianist) made an error of judgement. I would say that they play the music in a way that I don't enjoy. 

Backhaus's motivations seem to be to emphasize structure, even when it is at the expense of other performance elements. He's like the grandfather of modern pianism, no?

Pollini (and many of his modern brothers and sisters) is totally of the modern school, eschewing beauty and romantic interpretation in favor of "sticking to the text." I almost always come away from his performances unsatisfied, feeling that while technically brilliant, the (for me) important emotional element is missing. I often wonder why he doesn't record more modern works.

[Mandryka]

I'd never say that Backhaus or Pollini (or any other great pianist) made an error of judgement. I would say that they play the music in a way that I don't enjoy. 

Backhaus's motivations seem to be to emphasize structure, even when it is at the expense of other performance elements. He's like the grandfather of modern pianism, no?

Pollini (and many of his modern brothers and sisters) is totally of the modern school, eschewing beauty and romantic interpretation in favor of "sticking to the text." I almost always come away from his performances unsatisfied, feeling that while technically brilliant, the (for me) important emotional element is missing. I often wonder why he doesn't record more modern works.

But the text of the Beethoven sonata doesn't say that you have to play it  so angrily, so hard. That was his decision. It could just be a romantic arbitrary one - he played it like that because he felt like it. Or it could be that he's saying something more interesting, about Beethoven's first  piano sonata, about Beethoven in relation to Clementi, Haydn, Mozart,  about classical style or something. The hunt for meanings is on.

The most annoying thing is that he doesn't say anywhere,  that I can't just phone him up and ask him.

The Backhaus question is different. My guess is that he was part of a tradition of hard fast Brahms playing which goes all the way back to . . . Brahms. That golden autumn style Brahms is a relatively modern invention, created because of the market for soothing recordings. Something to put on after a hard days work at the office.

[kishnevi]

I'd never say that Backhaus or Pollini (or any other great pianist) made an error of judgement. I would say that they play the music in a way that I don't enjoy. 

Backhaus's motivations seem to be to emphasize structure, even when it is at the expense of other performance elements. He's like the grandfather of modern pianism, no?

Pollini (and many of his modern brothers and sisters) is totally of the modern school, eschewing beauty and romantic interpretation in favor of "sticking to the text." I almost always come away from his performances unsatisfied, feeling that while technically brilliant, the (for me) important emotional element is missing. I often wonder why he doesn't record more modern works.

He's recorded enough to let DG issue a small boxset of 20th century works.

Naturally it's an individual thing, but I don't find the minimalization of emotional element to be a flaw.  I don't think he's eschewing beauty;  it's more a case of allowing the beauty that is "in the text" to be seen in its own right.

It's been a while since I played the Backhaus (the later stereo cycle),  but I seem to remember not liking Backhaus as much as Pollini.

[Mandryka]

He's recorded enough to let DG issue a small boxset of 20th century works.

Naturally it's an individual thing, but I don't find the minimalization of emotional element to be a flaw.  I don't think he's eschewing beauty;  it's more a case of allowing the beauty that is "in the text" to be seen in its own right.

It's been a while since I played the Backhaus (the later stereo cycle),  but I seem to remember not liking Backhaus as much as Pollini.

We were talking about a recording of Brahms Backhaus made in the 1930s, op 118.

In the op 2s it isn't true that Pollini is minimizing emotional content - the performance are stuffed with emotional content. It's just that the emotions evoked tend not to be very warm and fuzzy.

[Mandryka]

I found the Diabellis on Spotify and have just finished listening. I would agree that the sense of unity is an aspect that makes this an excellent recording. The somewhat limited dynamic range that Pollini uses for a lot of this recording is a bit of a concern as variations, for me, are all about colour and light, shade and texture. My top Diabelli is from Arrau who also achieves that unity. I can't think of another pianist that does.

The poetry is there for Pollini as well, as it was for Schnabel and one pianist you've not mentioned, Kovacevich. Pollini finishes this work better than any of the above, avoiding a tendency to rush towards the final notes.

All that said, Arrau still sits at the top for me.

The op 120  here, live from Tokyo, was made about 20 years before the DG. It is better in every way IMO, including sound. Well worth heating if you can, it's on symphonyshare.