Vaughan Williams's Veranda

[vandermolen]

Dark Pastoral is what David Matthews could make of the slow movement, isn't it? But please tell me: what CD - I think there's one in the making, but don't know it yet - contains these incidental music compositions from 1913? 
(There are a number of earlier pieces still unrecorded, but the question was about 'major works').

Can't find your original post but you are quite right about 'The Bridal Day'. Can't understand how I missed this fine work before.

[Oates]

It's simple, in letters:
1914  A London  - the full score, lasting over an hour
1920  A Lnd_en  - drastic cuts in the slow movement and finale, but adding some new music to the scherzo
1934  A _Lden   - more drastic cuts in the slow movement and finale, about 20 minutes of the music in tot_al,

Can you clarify something for me please? Was the new music that was added to the 1920 version also retained in the 1934 version? Also, if we've heard the 1914 and 1920 versions, is there any material that remains exclusive to the 1934 version? 

[vandermolen]

Can you clarify something for me please? Was the new music that was added to the 1920 version also retained in the 1934 version? Also, if we've heard the 1914 and 1920 versions, is there any material that remains exclusive to the 1934 version?

No doubt Johan (Christo) will reply separately but my understanding is:

Original version from 1914 (lost in World War One, reconstructed in 1915)

1920 revised version (recorded by Eugene Goossens in Cincinnati in 1941)

1936 final version

In my opinion (and Richard Hickox's) VW cut out the most moving section of the Symphony (towards the end) in 1936 and should have kept the 1920 version as the final version.

There's some useful stuff here:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_London_Symphony

[relm1]

For what it's worth, I did not think very highly of the new Chandos Andrew Davis/Bergen Philharmonic recording of RVW Sinfonia Antartica.  The balance is quite of.  For example, if you follow along in the score, when there are climactic moments of fortissimo trombones and fortissimo violins, they will not be the same level.  The trombones are so recessed compared to other instruments that it is very unnatural.  This might be an overly produced recording but the musicality of the recording is quite weak compared to other recordings of Andre Previn and Sir Adrian Boult who set the bar very high in terms of musical interpretation and execution.  I believe I have heard every recording of this work (or at least own 15 recordings so far) and will say this is in the bottom third.  My favorites in terms of musical quality, atmosphere, interpretation, performance, recording quality are Sir Adrian Boult/LPO, Andre Previn/LSO, Kees Bakels/BSO.  I need to relisten to Bernard Haitink's LPO recording.  I find him inconsistent.  He was superb in the Sea Symphony and dreadful in Symphony No. 9 whereas Boult and Previn are consistently good.

I think my perfect version would be the Andre Previn/LSO in remastered/prestine sound but with Boult's LPO Landscape movement.  In my opinion, that would be the best interpreted and performed version of this work. 

[Mirror Image]

For what it's worth, I did not think very highly of the new Chandos Andrew Davis/Bergen Philharmonic recording of RVW Sinfonia Antartica.  The balance is quite of.  For example, if you follow along in the score, when there are climactic moments of fortissimo trombones and fortissimo violins, they will not be the same level.  The trombones are so recessed compared to other instruments that it is very unnatural.  This might be an overly produced recording but the musicality of the recording is quite weak compared to other recordings of Andre Previn and Sir Adrian Boult who set the bar very high in terms of musical interpretation and execution.  I believe I have heard every recording of this work (or at least own 15 recordings so far) and will say this is in the bottom third.  My favorites in terms of musical quality, atmosphere, interpretation, performance, recording quality are Sir Adrian Boult/LPO, Andre Previn/LSO, Kees Bakels/BSO.  I need to relisten to Bernard Haitink's LPO recording.  I find him inconsistent.  He was superb in the Sea Symphony and dreadful in Symphony No. 9 whereas Boult and Previn are consistently good.

I think my perfect version would be the Andre Previn/LSO in remastered/prestine sound but with Boult's LPO Landscape movement.  In my opinion, that would be the best interpreted and performed version of this work.

I can't say that I'm surprised as I've been thoroughly disappointed with Davis' RVW all-around. I hate to say this of course as I do feel like Davis, Elder, and Lloyd-Jones are really like the 'keepers of the British flame' so to speak, but I never have been so bored with RVW's music as I have with Davis' performances (whether on Warner or Chandos). Previn, Boult, and to a lesser extent, Thomson, have been my go-to RVW interpreters and it seems this won't change anytime soon. Now Davis' Elgar, on the other hand, is a whole other kettle of fish. Quite superb I must say.

[vandermolen]

I have the new CD but have only listened to it once. Actually it was the double piano concerto and Four Last Songs which appealed to me rather than the symphony. Boult's early Decca recording of Sinfonia Antartica is my favourite version. Boult's objective way with VW really suits this symphony in my view. I also greatly enjoyed the recently released complete film music for 'Scott of the Antarctic' on Dutton.

[vandermolen]

Saw a terrific semi-staged performance of the one act opera 'Riders to the Sea' in Waterloo, London tonight. It was terrific. The first time I have heard it live.

[Karl Henning]

Cool!

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

[Parsifal]

Any comments on the recently released 1920 version of the London symphony, compared with Hickox's recording of the original version? (which I have)

[Mirror Image]

Any comments on the recently released 1920 version of the London symphony, compared with Hickox's recording of the original version? (which I have)

Hopefully, eljr (I think this is his screen name) can chime in here since he recently listened to this recording.

[vandermolen]

Any comments on the recently released 1920 version of the London symphony, compared with Hickox's recording of the original version? (which I have)

I have the new version but haven't listened to it yet. Hopefully will do over the weekend. Reviews were very good. There are two other recordings of the 1920 version on Dutton and a historic one with the Cincinnati SO.

[vandermolen]

Cool!

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

Yes, it was indeed Karl. The inclusion of Walton's 'Henry V: A Shakespeare Scenario' in part two (which utilised some French folk songs recommended to Walton by Vaughan Williams) was the icing on the cake.

[Parsifal]

I can't say that I'm surprised as I've been thoroughly disappointed with Davis' RVW all-around. I hate to say this of course as I do feel like Davis, Elder, and Lloyd-Jones are really like the 'keepers of the British flame' so to speak, but I never have been so bored with RVW's music as I have with Davis' performances (whether on Warner or Chandos). Previn, Boult, and to a lesser extent, Thomson, have been my go-to RVW interpreters and it seems this won't change anytime soon. Now Davis' Elgar, on the other hand, is a whole other kettle of fish. Quite superb I must say.

My experience is different. I was very negative on VW after listening to Boult/EMI (as I recalled after reading old posts I made here many years ago) but discover a love for his symphonies after listening to Davis and Haitink.

Anyway, I'm leaning towards getting the new recording of the 1920 version from Hyperion.

[vandermolen]

My experience is different. I was very negative on VW after listening to Boult/EMI (as I recalled after reading old posts I made here many years ago) but discover a love for his symphonies after listening to Davis and Haitink.

Anyway, I'm leaning towards getting the new recording of the 1920 version from Hyperion.

I'm sure you won't regret it and there are some interesting shorter pieces on the CD.

Here is a review to help you make up your mind:

http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2017/Nov/VW_London_CDA68190.htm

[Mirror Image]

My experience is different. I was very negative on VW after listening to Boult/EMI (as I recalled after reading old posts I made here many years ago) but discover a love for his symphonies after listening to Davis and Haitink.

Anyway, I'm leaning towards getting the new recording of the 1920 version from Hyperion.

You and I are pretty much like polar opposites when it comes to recordings, so your opinion comes as no surprise to me. Let us know what you think of the Brabbins if you decide to get it.

[Christo]

My experience is different. I was very negative on VW after listening to Boult/EMI (as I recalled after reading old posts I made here many years ago) but discover a love for his symphonies after listening to Davis and Haitink.

Opinions on the Haitink series differ widely, but AFAIK the generally shared verdict on the Davis, here, has been very negative. I myself found them by far the weakest, underpowered and flat. Compare them with e.g. Thomson, Previn or even Slatkin.

[vandermolen]

Opinions on the Haitink series differ widely, but AFAIK the generally shared verdict on the Davis, here, has been very negative. I myself found them by far the weakest, underpowered and flat. Compare them with e.g. Thomson, Previn or even Slatkin.

Davis's No.6 was highly rated. Unfortunately, for many, the series went downhill from there. I have been listening to the new Davis Bergen versions of symphonies 7, 9 and Job which I prefer to his original versions. I think that both his versions, however, are incomparably better to the recordings of VW symphonies by Sir Roger Norrington which, with the exception of No.3, I think are unidiomatic and completely unengaging. Because I grew up with them I remain very attached to that first Boult Decca/Everest Cycle.

Fave versions:
No.1 Haitink
No.2 Previn/Boult EMI (1936), Brabbins/Goosens (1920) Hickox (1913)
No.3 Previn
No.4 Berglund
No.5 Barbirolli (EMI)
No.6 Boult (Decca)
No.7 Boult (Decca)
No.8 Previn
No.9 Stokowski

If I wanted a more modern cycle I'd opt for Thomson, whose performances I rate higher than many.

[vandermolen]

Let's get a closer look at the cover art and the track information:



http://www.hyperion-records.co.uk/notes/68190-B.pdf

This is a wonderful performance and I'd go as far as to say that if you only want one version of A London Symphony - this is the one. It has a great sense of urgency and is beautifully performed and recorded. There is a definite sense IMHO of 'end of Empire' and looming catastrophe (WW1) than in other versions. The booklet notes are good, making a plausible link with Delius's 'Paris' and featuring two fine photos of the grumpy looking composer. Plus you get some interesting shorter works - not least the charming and powerful 'Variations' of 1957 for brass band (which I had to play again as soon as I heard it). Why VW excised that beautiful section, about twelve minutes into the last movement of A London Symphony, I shall never understand - it's my favourite part of the symphony and one of the most moving things he wrote. Here you can hear it in its full glory.

[Mirror Image]

This is a wonderful performance and I'd go as far as to say that if you only want one version of A London Symphony - this is the one. It has a great sense of urgency and is beautifully performed and recorded. There is a definite sense IMHO of 'end of Empire' and looming catastrophe (WW1) than in other versions. The booklet notes are good, making a plausible link with Delius's 'Paris' and featuring two fine photos of the grumpy looking composer. Plus you get some interesting shorter works - not least the charming and powerful 'Variations' of 1957 for brass band (which I had to play again as soon as I heard it). Why VW excised that beautiful section, about twelve minutes into the last movement of A London Symphony, I shall never understand - it's my favourite part of the symphony and one of the most moving things he wrote. Here you can hear it in its full glory.

Sounds excellent, Jeffrey. Unfortunately, A London Symphony isn't one of my favorite RVW works. I'd put it on par with A Sea Symphony as being my two least favorite symphonies from him.

[vandermolen]

Sounds excellent, Jeffrey. Unfortunately, A London Symphony isn't one of my favorite RVW works. I'd put it on par with A Sea Symphony as being my two least favorite symphonies from him.

I think that having been born and brought up in central London gives this work an added appeal to me John. Having said that it was also Vaughan Williams's own favourite, of at least his first eight symphonies.