The Men's Rights Movement

[Purusha]

That's not a doll, that's an ACTION FIGURE.

[Rinaldo]

That's not a doll, that's an ACTION FIGURE.

[North Star]

That's not a doll, that's an ACTION FIGURE.

[Ken B]

Proving my point about anecdotes and selection bias.

[ZauberdrachenNr.7]

Wait a minute! Are you making a case for facts being more pertinent than ideology?

[amw]

What we are witnessing here is actually a nominalist world view prevailing over a realist world view for the first time in history [...]
At any rate, this is pretty much all there is to those arguments. That, and the fact that masculinity is "naturally" realist and femininity is "naturally" nominalist,
[...]
What is of interest to the present argument is the fact masculinity is essentially the manifestation of the principle of being, where as femininity is pure potentiality, [...]

When you're done with your mental masturbation exercises perhaps you could actually show us some differences between the sexes that are more significant than variations within them.

[Ken B]

When you're done with your mental masturbation exercises perhaps you could actually show us some differences between the sexes that are more significant than variations within them.

Wrong question. If there are differences in the distribution functions between the sexes period then that can have an effect on demographic measures. And he has cited a general effect: for many variables the variance is wider in males than females. (The opposite may well be true for other variables; I do not know).   

Here is the principle. Divide a large population into 2 comparably sized groups according to any criteria. Allow the groups to have different means or variances on any measure theta. If theta is causal on another measure pi you will see a difference in pi between these groups. 
Hence any argument from a difference in pi must correct for the difference in theta.

[ibanezmonster]

Or "Black people just don't seem to be interested in information technology/politics/well-paid jobs".

Meh, doesn't have quite the same effect IMO. Everyone is interested in well-paid jobs, but there may be some truth in the lack of interest in IT, especially compared to, for example, Indians. Of course, statistics may be needed to back that up to verify, overall. And it doesn't quite have the same negative rings as telling a demographic not to commit crimes.

You don't think it's a big deal that women have to work two weeks more per year to make the same amount of money for the same work?

Well, if you look at it like that, sure.
And if it can be verified that the 5% difference can be explained by solely being caused by sexist employers, then that needs to be dealt with. I'm not sure how, though, since it's already illegal.
And I'm not sure if pay will ever be 100% equal; what happens when men are paid 3% less on average? Or 5%? What is the point when people need to start complaining?

[Ken B]

Some charts and numbers. These were certainly selected for tendentious effect, but that doesn't mean they aren't true or relevant.

http://www.aei.org/publication/top-ten-gender-charts-year-2014/

[Karl Henning]

The reduction in rape incidents is good.  Not that you nor the article is suggesting otherwise, but I should think that further reduction is the goal in everyone's best interest.

[Ken B]

The reduction in rape incidents is good.  Not that you nor the article is suggesting otherwise, but I should think that further reduction is the goal in everyone's best interest.

It is good news, but the point is that it is widely denied news. Accuracy is also a goal that is in everyone's best interest. (Well actually not, now I think about it. Accuracy is not in the best interest of those driving agendas using false claims. But it benefits the rest of us, which is the vast majority.)

[Karl Henning]

It is good news, but the point is that it is widely denied news.

That I can not answer to;  nor is it my experience.  If zero tolerance of rape be an agenda, I should think there is no honor in protesting it.

[Ken B]

That I can not answer to;  nor is it my experience.  If zero tolerance of rape be an agenda, I should think there is no honor in protesting it.

Karl, the country has been filled with false statistics for the past year or more. That has served as the basis of hysteria and rules which violate due process. Neither can reasonably be portrayed as just "zero tolerance of rape".

[lisa needs braces]

Here is a feminist accusing someone of rape. This piece was cited quite a few times as defense of California's "Yes means Yes" law on college campuses, a bill that feminists are quite eager to use as testing ground for state legislation (and recall that we already do have some limitation on due process on when it comes to rape cases -- eg rape shield laws.)

Anyway this is the piece. Was this Canadian woman really raped multiple times?

https://medium.com/human-parts/we-dont-have-to-do-anything-9148a953f39d

[Purusha]

The reduction in rape incidents is good.  Not that you nor the article is suggesting otherwise, but I should think that further reduction is the goal in everyone's best interest.

I think you are all missing the point here. The issue is whether there is a rape "culture" in our nations. The truth is that there isn't. Whether the number of rape is on the rise or not is irrelevant. The existence of rape does not mean there is a culture of rape. You might as well talk about a "robber" culture, or a "picking your nose" culture. Feminists say that we should teach men not to rape. I suppose since we are at it we should teach mothers not to murder their children. The logic is the same, is it not?

And the issue is not just that the feminist argument is fallacious or downright bigoted (how about we teach black people not to commit drive by shootings? How about we teach Jews not to hoard money?), it is also fundamentally duplicitous, because the underlying motive here is to hold men accountable for the irresponsibility of certain women, since this idea of teaching men not to rape arose as a response to the suggestion that women should be careful not to put themselves at risk of sexual assault. Apparently, this is "blaming the victim" as opposed to just being good old common sense. I guess other forms of "blaming the victim" include telling children not to accept candy from strangers (we should teach sexual predators not to pray on children instead!). After all, women have a right to be "sluts" (what a wonderful spectacle of themselves have feminists made here), it is not their fault if behaving badly increases the likelihood of bad things happening to them.

[Purusha]

When you're done with your mental masturbation exercises perhaps you could actually show us some differences between the sexes that are more significant than variations within them.

Those mental masturbation exercises seem to have a point considering you just made a classic nominalist fallacy.

[ibanezmonster]

I think you are all missing the point here. The issue is whether there is a rape "culture" in our nations. The truth is that there isn't. Whether the number of rape is on the rise or not is irrelevant. The existence of rape does not mean there is a culture of rape. You might as well talk about a "robber" culture, or a "picking your nose" culture. Feminists say that we should teach men not to rape. I suppose since we are at it we should teach mothers not to murder their children. The logic is the same, is it not?

And the issue is not just that the feminist argument is fallacious or downright bigoted (how about we teach black people not to commit drive by shootings? How about we teach Jews not to hoard money?), it is also fundamentally duplicitous, because the underlying motive here is to hold men accountable for the irresponsibility of certain women, since this idea of teaching men not to rape arose as a response to the suggestion that women should be careful not to put themselves at risk of sexual assault. Apparently, this is "blaming the victim" as opposed to just being good old common sense. I guess other forms of "blaming the victim" include telling children not to accept candy from strangers (we should teach sexual predators not to pray on children instead!). After all, women have a right to be "sluts" (what a wonderful spectacle of themselves have feminists made here), it is not their fault if behaving badly increases the likelihood of bad things happening to them.

Yep, pretty much what I was saying earlier.


btw, anyone hear about the "man tax" that was proposed in Sweden by feminists in 2004?
http://taxfoundation.org/blog/externalities-and-swedish-man-tax

Now that's some amusing stuff..

[snyprrr]

Those mental masturbation exercises seem to have a point considering you just made a classic nominalist fallacy.

I just can't fap to this Thread.



tried!





failed

[snyprrr]

"All this rape talk makes me hot"

Col. Rickhart

[snyprrr]

I'm reminded of all raping and horror as the Russians pursued the retreating Germans... Nanking... "The Rape of the Virgins"...

what horror!! brrrrrr,,,...