Amanda Knox

[Wakefield]

No, she can't. The US doesn't recognize convictions that violate double jeopardy. If Italy applies for an extradition writ, it will be denied. Rightly so, they have no grip on how to run a court system apparently.

This strikes me as impossible. I don't know any specifics about Italian law of criminal procedure, but I don't simply believe that it doesn't recognize the double jeopardy principle.

A criminal trial after another, both of them about the same facts are not always an indication of violation of the double jeopardy. For instance, if the first trial has become null and void.

That said, Italians are not a primitive tribe in the heart of a lost jungle, these guys (to mention only the XXth C.) were the greatest professors of procedure in all Europe (Carnelutti, Calamandrei, Chiovenda and so). 

[Sef]

This strikes me as impossible. I don't know any specifics about Italian law of criminal procedure, but I don't simply believe that it doesn't recognize the double jeopardy principle.

A criminal trial after another, both of them about the same facts are not always an indication of violation of the double jeopardy. For instance, if the first trial has become null and void.

That said, Italians are not a primitive tribe in the heart of a lost jungle, these guys (to mention only the XXth C.) were the greatest professors of procedure in all Europe (Carnelutti, Calamandrei, Chiovenda and so).

This is true - I'm no expert either, but I saw it reported that this latest part of the trial should be considered a continuance of the original trial, not a new one.

I too wonder is there would be such a fuss if the defendant was someone who was less photogenic/ pure/ innocent looking!

[Daverz]

I doubt if Amanda Knox will ever be extradited but I do not think that being 20 years old is too young to be responsible for your actions,

She served 4 years of a prison sentence.  There's no evidence she had any responsibility for her roommate's death.

[amw]

I too wonder is there would be such a fuss if the defendant was someone who was less photogenic/ pure/ innocent looking!

Well the only people making a big deal about that seem to be those who are pro extradition... the anti extradition people seem to be more concerned with things like "double jeopardy" and "law enforcement procedure" and "DNA evidence" and so on...

[Wakefield]

It's interesting to see how Alan Dershowitz comments all these same issues:

http://www.newsmax.com/NewsmaxTv/alan-dershowitz-amanda-knox-murder-trial/2014/01/31/id/550244

[Brian]

It's interesting to see how Alan Dershowitz comments all these same issues:

http://www.newsmax.com/NewsmaxTv/alan-dershowitz-amanda-knox-murder-trial/2014/01/31/id/550244

"I would say that there are thousands of Americans in jail today on the basis of far less evidence than there is against Amanda Knox," Dershowitz, a Harvard Law professor, said.

Of course, anyone who's done some reading on America's prison system would agree that this says a lot about American jails, where minor drug possession crimes result in hefty sentences and many states will refuse to stop the executions of inmates who are known to be innocent.

[Sef]

Well the only people making a big deal about that seem to be those who are pro extradition... the anti extradition people seem to be more concerned with things like "double jeopardy" and "law enforcement procedure" and "DNA evidence" and so on...

From the article:

"I have to tell you, in 50 years of practicing law, I had never seen a more one-sided presentation by the media in the United States of the case. Everybody is saying there's no evidence against her and she's totally innocent. It's just not true."

In America, everybody's ignoring the victim, everybody is pretending as if the Italian court system is the Iranian court system, and as if they made up all of the evidence against her."

As to why he believes that is so, Dershowitz said:

"One word: she's pretty and she doesn't look like she did it and Americans care about what people look like. She's the all-American young woman and we don't care about the evidence."

I suggest that the "pro-extradition" people either don't live in the States or refuse to be hoodwinked by the media.

[vandermolen]

She served 4 years of a prison sentence.  There's no evidence she had any responsibility for her roommate's death.

Presumably there must have been some evidence otherwise she would not have been convicted in the first place. If she is innocent of course she should be free, but the fact that she kept changing her story and blamed an innocent party does not show her in the best light (unlike the photos and stage-managed media appearances).

[Todd]

I suggest that the "pro-extradition" people either don't live in the States or refuse to be hoodwinked by the media.

It seems to me that in order to be pro-extradition, extradition needs to be requested by the Italian government.  Otherwise, pro-extradition people are really advocating extraordinary rendition.

[Sef]

It seems to me that in order to be pro-extradition, extradition needs to be requested by the Italian government.  Otherwise, pro-extradition people are really advocating extraordinary rendition.

Indeed. Due process MUST take place. I only advocate that the court of public opinion should not determine the USA's response to any request, particularly since the public have been led by a less than impartial media campaign.

[Sammy]

So Americans are free to murder all over the world as long as they can make it to home base before being caught? I hope that isn't your general position but only referring to this case since you consider he evidence weak?

Relax - it's one case.

[Todd]

I only advocate that the court of public opinion should not determine the USA's response to any request, particularly since the public have been led by a less than impartial media campaign.

Public opinion may or may not be especially important.  Other US-Italy relationship issues may end up being far more important.  And there is always the chance that the Italian government requests extradition, the US federal government is willing to extradite, but a US court blocks it, in which case, due process will be served, and Ms Knox will be free even with a murder conviction in Italy.  I wonder if all people who advocate due process but secretly, or not so secretly, want Ms Knox to go to prison will call that due process, or something else.  You might be fine with it, but would everyone?

[Daverz]

Presumably there must have been some evidence otherwise she would not have been convicted in the first place.

You can't seriously be that naive.

[The new erato]

You can't seriously be that naive.

You mean naive as in assuming there are better systems of justice than in the US? Yeah, we all know how OJ was innocent.

[knight66]

Over here in the UK it is being reported as a hearts and minds media campaign in the US, with her retaining the services of a spin doctor and carefully staging her appearances. Seemingly it is working with even some on this thread claiming there is no evidence against her. Meaning they cannot have been reading the trial progress with any real attention, as whether accepted as vital or not, there was certainly evidence leading to a cause for a trial.

I don't think the UK opinion is calling for blood at all. But there has been comment that the victim gets lost in the PR battle.

Mike

[Wakefield]

You mean naive as in assuming there are better systems of justice than in the US? Yeah, we all know how OJ was innocent.

I was sure, sooner or latter O.J. Simpson's trial would be mentioned here.

BTW, maybe is worth to recall that Alan Dershowitz was appellate adviser for the defense of O.J. (not to mention the von Büllow case).

[The new erato]

I was sure, sooner or latter O.J. Simpson's trial would be mentioned here.

BTW, maybe is worth to recall that Alan Dershowitz was appellate adviser for the defense of O.J. (not to mention the von Büllow case).

Someone had to do it. The point being that no system of justice is infallible, and that a LOT of other factors than pure evidence are at play when the object is rich, famous or beautiful - some of these factors of course being closely connected.

[Todd]

Someone had to do it.

The glove did not fit.  The jury had to acquit.

[amw]

I suggest that the "pro-extradition" people either don't live in the States or refuse to be hoodwinked by the media.

Well, it's convenient to blame "the media" for things; it's abstract and nicely vague.

Journalism however serves an important purpose—it remains the most reliable way for the average person to get information about world events they are unable to witness personally. Unless you are actually involved with this case, you also got all your information about it from "the media". The article you quote comes from "the media" as well, for instance.

I suggest that people avoid assuming others hold dissenting views because they are less intelligent, or more suggestible.

[Sef]

Well, it's convenient to blame "the media" for things; it's abstract and nicely vague.

Journalism however serves an important purpose—it remains the most reliable way for the average person to get information about world events they are unable to witness personally. Unless you are actually involved with this case, you also got all your information about it from "the media". The article you quote comes from "the media" as well, for instance.

I suggest that people avoid assuming others hold dissenting views because they are less intelligent, or more suggestible.

I think you misunderstand me. My point is that there are opposing views, and what you might have heard might not be true. In fact the only thing I wanted to say about this whole affair is that Justice should prevail - and I don't think many people would argue with that.