Beethoven's Piano Sonatas

[André]

Release date: 04.01.2015. In another forum I read that a new LL disc containing Nono and Xenakis is also issued on the same date.

[Todd]

Release date: 04.01.2015.

Ah, I see.  It kind of loses its value without the date thing being included, or being posted on the first.  I would think an LL LvB cycle is a very real possibility sometime closer to 2020 or 2027.

[Todd]

I don't think Yoshihiro Kondo has been mentioned before, but in any event, it looks like he's approaching the finish line of his cycle.  I'm inclined to wait for the box, or maybe not.

[André]

The Malcolm Binns set of late sonatas has arrived.  I look forward to listen to that !

[Brian]

A new installment in James Brawn's cycle, which is definitely one of the most exciting ongoing series (to me).



"James Brawn views the programme of volume 4 as "lyrical and life affirming". He feels that these sonatas "exhibit Beethoven's lighter, more positive nature"."

No. 9 (Op. 14/1)
No. 15 "Pastorale"
No. 24 (Op. 78)
No. 25 (Op. 79)
No. 27 (Op. 90)

[(poco) Sforzando]

A new installment in James Brawn's cycle, which is definitely one of the most exciting ongoing series (to me).



"James Brawn views the programme of volume 4 as "lyrical and life affirming". He feels that these sonatas "exhibit Beethoven's lighter, more positive nature"."

No. 9 (Op. 14/1)
No. 15 "Pastorale"
No. 24 (Op. 78)
No. 25 (Op. 79)
No. 27 (Op. 90)

I looked at this from Amazon and am ROFLMAO:
"He takes us on a journey through the various keys of the album, beginning with Sonata No. 9 in the spirited key of E major, followed by Sonata No.15 (Pastorale) in the key of D major, which is also the key of Johann Sebastian Bach's glorious and joyful Magnificat."

What utter nonsense. E major is only as "spirited" as the music written in it. I could just as well say E major is the gentle and pastoral key of the prelude from Book I of the WTC, or the serene slow movement of the LvB quartet op. 59/2, or the variations from op. 109, or the Bruckner 7th. And what earthly difference does it make that op. 28 is in the same key as the Magnificat? It is also the same key as the Mahler 1st and 9th, the Strauss Don Quixote, and the Brahms and Tchaikovsky violin concertos. The real reason those concertos are in D, by the way, is that the chords in those keys allow for the maximum number of open strings on the solo violin, thus maximizing the brilliance of the instrumental sound. And then we have the "divine" key of F# major. Divine my ass. It was a rarely used key in Beethoven's day due to the vagaries of his tuning system. Chopin's Barcarolle is in F#, but does that make it any more "divine" than any of his other divine works?

Beethoven showed how much he cared about the "spiritedness" of E major by transposing op. 14/1 to F when he transcribed it for string quartet. Why? Because in that way he could use the cello's low C string as the dominant of the key.

I should like to know what the keystruck Mr. Brawn makes of the first movement of op. 90, which to my ears is the most snarling, nasty, bitter little movement in Beethoven's output.

ETA: One version of the glorious and joyful Bach Magnificat is in Eb major. Let's now start making comparisons between that work and Beethoven's Les Adieux and op. 31/3 sonatas, not to mention the op. 127 quartet and the Eroica symphony.

[Brian]

I should like to know what the keystruck Mr. Brawn makes of the first movement of op. 90, which to my ears is the most snarling, nasty, bitter little movement in Beethoven's output.

Hmm, I'd have chosen something from Op. 95 for that honor (or the Grosse Fuge).

I assume Mr. Brawn did not write those marketing materials. MSR Classics is one of those labels where an artist pays the label for marketing/distribution and then gets royalties back (if they do). It says a lot about today's classical recording market that that's not considered a scam - and that MSR has some serious artists in its fold. (I recently reviewed one from the Orpheus Chamber Orchestra bassoonist.)

[(poco) Sforzando]

Hmm, I'd have chosen something from Op. 95 for that honor (or the Grosse Fuge).

I assume Mr. Brawn did not write those marketing materials. MSR Classics is one of those labels where an artist pays the label for marketing/distribution and then gets royalties back (if they do). It says a lot about today's classical recording market that that's not considered a scam - and that MSR has some serious artists in its fold. (I recently reviewed one from the Orpheus Chamber Orchestra bassoonist.)

Well, your two pieces are certainly in the running. I remember a recorded performance of 90 however by Brendel, where he completely downplayed the snarling minor ninths, dissonant suspensions, and sforzandos (that word again!) that I see as so essential to that angry little movement. But it's also interesting that each of these pieces in its own way finds a way out of the initial nihilism: op. 90 through its quasi-Schubertian second movement in a serene (not "spirited") E major, the GF by resolving the dissonant chromaticism of most of the piece through a purely diatonic ending, and 95 by evaporating the tragic intensity of virtually the entire work via a coda of pure Rossinian comedy. As with the 5th and 9th symphonies, Beethoven never ends any of his works on a note of unresolved tragedy.

I have no idea if Brawn wrote the materials or approved them. But you haven't rebutted my points about the key structures, and at the very least I think the artist would have to have seen the materials attached to his recordings. (Charles Rosen started writing his own liner notes when he decided that the notes written for him were so incredibly stupid.)

[Brian]

But you haven't rebutted my points about the key structures,

You know nobody can rebut those! I do comment on idiotic marketing and liner notes when they come my way (e.g. paragraphs 4-), so if the physical CD has that stuff, I'll let you (and the public) know.

[(poco) Sforzando]

You know nobody can rebut those! I do comment on idiotic marketing and liner notes when they come my way (e.g. paragraphs 4-), so if the physical CD has that stuff, I'll let you (and the public) know.

Yes, I read your essay. It's hilarious. I wish I could read the whole set of notes, but I'm not going to waste my money on an unpromising recording.

Regarding keys, there is in fact a long history in musical aesthetics of attributing various emotional characteristics to various keys. See:
http://biteyourownelbow.com/keychar.htm

The problem is two-fold, however: none of the characteristics alleged by various commentators agree with each other, and none of the them is consistently borne out by the musical literature. Nor can it be shown that the character of a particular key is inherent, or simply the result of a tradition. C minor for example: since at least Beethoven's time (5th symphony, Pathetique, op. 18/4 quartet, C minor violin sonata, op. 111) and possibly before (Mozart C minor fantasy/sonata), this has been considered the Sturm und Drang key (think Brahms 1 and his first quartet, Schubert C minor sonata, Mahler 2, Bruckner 8, Death and Transfiguration). But I doubt there's anything intrinsic to C minor that might not have been true of A minor or F# minor had a tradition started that way.

Key characteristics include color-values for keys, and I confess I associate colors with various keys myself. But my colors vary completely from Scriabin's, for example. I think I had a recording of Mahler 4 where the album color was blue; hence I consider G major light blue. C major for me is slate-blue, Eb dark green, D a rich red, A a bright red, E green, Db a rich wine-red, Bb brown. But I'm under no illusion that these associations are anything but subjective and personal.

[amw]

I do comment on idiotic marketing and liner notes when they come my way (e.g. paragraphs 4-)

lol, I have two recordings by Valery Afanassiev and his piano playing style is exactly like that as well

*plays the piano part of Brahms Op. 100 for 30 seconds* "ok I'm bored, I'm going to just play whatever I feel like for the next 20 minutes while Gidon does his thing" *every phrase has stream of consciousness articulation and/or tempo relations that makes no sense* "heeey get this, what if Brahms was actually a practitioner of tantric yoga?" *incredible slowness*

(It's actually pretty enjoyable on some levels...)

[Jo498]

Brendel's 1970s recording of op.90 is the mildest (in the first movement) I have heard. I find it rather irritating.

There are actually a few Beethoven pieces where one could argue that they end without obvious "resolution", the finales of e.g. the Appassionata sonata and some others (like op.27/2 and op.31/2) remain in the minor until the end.

My hypothesis about the key characteristics is that they existed in older tuning systems and affected many of the wind instruments still in Mozart's and Beethoven's time. So they have a vague and weak basis in objective features (like the open strings of the violin) but most of it comes from later tradition because of prominent works in the key, like Beethoven's 5th symphony for all those c minor -> major per aspera ad astra pieces.

[(poco) Sforzando]

Brendel's 1970s recording of op.90 is the mildest (in the first movement) I have heard. I find it rather irritating.

There are actually a few Beethoven pieces where one could argue that they end without obvious "resolution", the finales of e.g. the Appassionata sonata and some others (like op.27/2 and op.31/2) remain in the minor until the end.

You are right of course about those finales. I can't pretend to keep all 138 opus numbers in mind all at once. Glad you concur about the Brendel.

[amw]

There are actually a few Beethoven pieces where one could argue that they end without obvious "resolution", the finales of e.g. the Appassionata sonata and some others (like op.27/2 and op.31/2) remain in the minor until the end.

Appassionata, Pathetique & Moonlight among others all end in a sort of violent rage against the heavens which is kind of a resolution I guess. 31/2 is the only piece by Beethoven I can think of right away that ends both in a minor key and quietly, 1/3 is a borderline case (switches to major but only ends up giving an impression of utter exhaustion). Op. 90 ends without an obvious 'resolution' but one could argue that the entire second movement is the resolution...

[(poco) Sforzando]

Appassionata, Pathetique & Moonlight among others all end in a sort of violent rage against the heavens which is kind of a resolution I guess. 31/2 is the only piece by Beethoven I can think of right away that ends both in a minor key and quietly, 1/3 is a borderline case (switches to major but only ends up giving an impression of utter exhaustion). Op. 90 ends without an obvious 'resolution' but one could argue that the entire second movement is the resolution...

Could be simply that we should not let ourselves be constrained by a word such as "resolution," which may work fine for the 5th symphony but not so well for op. 90 or 95? The E minor sonata offers two movements that stand in stark emotional contrast, with no apparent attempt to relate them. In the quartet, it is as if Beethoven - having exhausted the tragic and violent emotions for a good twenty minutes - simply decides, "something too much of this," and recovers his sense of humor and the absurd. Resolution? I don't know, and solemn commentators have been bothered by that tiny Rossinian explosion. But somehow the progression of feelings for me works (as the finale of Mozart's G minor quintet I'm afraid doesn't).

[Cato]

Could be simply that we should not let ourselves be constrained by a word such as "resolution," which may work fine for the 5th symphony but not so well for op. 90 or 95? The E minor sonata offers two movements that stand in stark emotional contrast, with not apparent attempt to relate them. In the quartet, it is as if Beethoven - having exhausted the tragic and violent emotions for a good twenty minutes - simply decides, "something too much of this," and recovers his sense of humor and the absurd. Resolution? I don't know, and solemn commentators have been bothered by that tiny Rossinian explosion. But somehow the progression of feelings for me works (as the finale of Mozart's G minor quintet I'm afraid doesn't).

And is that not why Beethoven is seen as one of the top examples of Romanticism, where such things confound the "solemn commentators" ?   0:)  Expression stretching form into new directions was one of the hallmarks of the era, e.g. Berlioz and the Symphonie Fantastique with its chromatic idee fixe and of course a "program" influencing the structure.

[(poco) Sforzando]

And is that not why Beethoven is seen as one of the top examples of Romanticism, where such things confound the "solemn commentators" ?   0:)  Expression stretching form into new directions was one of the hallmarks of the era, e.g. Berlioz and the Symphonie Fantastique with its chromatic idee fixe and of course a "program" influencing the structure.

Because of Beethoven's use of harmony, form, and key structure, I continue to place him primarily within the Classical tradition as opposed to the Romantic. These terms of course meant nothing to the composers themselves and were simply labels attached by later commentators. But unlike a symphony or quartet by Mozart or Haydn, where the four movements are generally like a menu of courses that harmonize well with each other but rarely form a clear progression, Beethoven already in early works like the Moonlight Sonata was seeking to integrate the movements of the work as a more unified whole. I wouldn't say he did this consistently or deliberately in all cases, but by the end of his career with pieces like the C# minor quartet and 9th symphony, there was an overall arc to the complete work that is not found in his predecessors. Among other things, this entailed placing greater emphasis on the finale, which in Mozart or Haydn was generally much lighter than the opening sonata-form movements, a kind of dessert to the meal rather than a Beethovenian culmination.

[ajb]

Because of Beethoven's use of harmony, form, and key structure, I continue to place him primarily within the Classical tradition as opposed to the Romantic. These terms of course meant nothing to the composers themselves and were simply labels attached by later commentators.

Which "terms" are you talking about? The styles? I don't think one can put one composer into a specific tradition or not. It's the style of the composition that qualifies as "classical" or "romantic". Therefore, as far as the sonatas are concerned before op 53 are classical compositions, after op 53 are romantic...regardless of one's thoughts

[Jo498]

Clearly, the whole "arc" in a work like the 5th symphony seems to demand a resolution as the one emphatically given, more obviously than many others works of his.
The Appassionata seems to some extent a contrasting parallel to the 5th symphony. Both have a passionate, catastrophically ending first movement and a comparably "neutral", quiet second movement (both times variations). But then one gets the emphatic triumph in the symphony and more and wilder rage against fate (or whatever) in the piano sonata.
The Rondo of op.13 seems comparably relaxed or even playful (at least at times). Not sure but I think in this case Beethoven had not really the imaginative power for a finale comparable in tragic passion (or emphatic resolution) so he "fell back" to a rather conventional movement, however brilliantly done and with nice contrasts.

The "Tempest" finale is a rather unique piece (there are a few more "perpetuum mobile" pieces (maybe op.26,iv and 54,ii) but none is so huge and in the minor. Maybe there really is some poetic program for this sonata and the finale is the rolling sea or a galloping horse or whatever.

[Florestan]

For me, the finale of the Appassionata is like a medieval Dance of Death. The last three chords are like the final nails in the coffin: signed, sealed, delivered - see you all on Judgment´s Day.