Prokofiev Op.100

[snyprrr]

Symphony No.5, Op.100

I. Andante              (10:30) 12:30 (15:30)
II. Allegro marcato                8:30 (most perf. clock in right here or just below)
III. Adagio              (10:30) 11:30 (14:30)
IV. Allegro giocoso                 9:30 (in just about every perf., this movement is pretty much right around 9:30)


Without much recollection, I picked up Dutoit's 5th, and ended up wonder why I'd like this amorphous Ballet Music- Symphony with Piano Obbligato- that I could imagine miiight catch my imagination if perhaps someone else performed it. A quick check showed that, at least tempo-wise, most performances of the second and fourth movements are about right where they are stated above, especially the fourth, where there is almost universal conformity (though, there are some quite brisk ones, such as Jansons/Chandos).


I.

Karajan takes 13:00. Some have taken it all the way to @10:30 (Jansons, I believe,Ansermet?Martinon?), whilst some may have even taken it out to 15:30 (I can't remember who this was). Dutoit sounded somewhat flaccid at 13:30, but, maybe that was just his fault and not the tempo's?

The music left me cold in Dutoit's hands, but I heard sumptuousness built into the stacked harmonies, so I knew that the music could come alive in the right hands. I'm curious about both the very quick and slow tempos- is there a Golden Rule concerning this movement?

II.

Timings are pretty consistent across the board, though some take it under 8:00. What's the secret here?

III.

Karajan clocks in at 13:30, but most seem to hover around 11:30, with some quicker still by a minute, and some stretched out passed 14 minutes. Again, what's the Golden Rule here?

IV.

This is the most consistent movement across the board. If we allow for so-and-so many seconds on either side of 9:30, then most every performance has just about exactly the same idea in mind, at least where tempo is concerned.





I'll forego the Discography at the moment, but I'm really curious about all the curious one-offs (such as, say, Celibidache), or the outrageously fast/slow- just- what are all the different things this Symphony can be and still work. Like I said, in Dutoit's hands, this became mid-afternoon nap inducing music of the highest order!

Karajan, Jansons,... those are the first two hits on Amazon... what're your choices?

[TheGSMoeller]

Bold Chicago brass, and an incredibly intense 5th ...





Come for the 7th, stay for the 5th. As vigorous of an Adagio and finale you'll hear...

[Todd]

Bold Chicago brass, and an incredibly intense 5th ...

A bone-crunching, ear-drum endangering recording (because I always listen way too loud).  No other conductor, not even Szell, can match Levine here.  An awesome disc, first note to last.

[snyprrr]

A bone-crunching, ear-drum endangering recording (because I always listen way too loud).  No other conductor, not even Szell, can match Levine here.  An awesome disc, first note to last.

then it's settled?

[Dancing Divertimentian]

My fave:



[asin]B000094YFB[/asin]

[snyprrr]

My fave:



[asin]B000094YFB[/asin]

Yea, that one looked good. Howz da sound?



btw- are we sold on Malko for 7?

[mn dave]

A bone-crunching, ear-drum endangering recording (because I always listen way too loud).  No other conductor, not even Szell, can match Levine here.  An awesome disc, first note to last.

*adds to wish list*

[TheGSMoeller]

btw- are we sold on Malko for 7?

Malko is good for the 7th, although he uses the money-making, happy ending which is a shame.

[Dancing Divertimentian]

Yea, that one looked good. Howz da sound?

The sound is a tad dated but there isn't anything remotely objectionable about it. 

btw- are we sold on Malko for 7?

Absolutely. Fine performance and the sound is surprisingly clear and full - way ahead of the game for its time.

[snyprrr]

Malko is good for the 7th, although he uses the money-making, happy ending which is a shame.

i could use a happy ending ... with no shame

[Sergeant Rock]

i could use a happy ending ..

Hah!  But you know Prokofiev won't give you the kind you need.

Sarge

[Sergeant Rock]

Bold Chicago brass, and an incredibly intense 5th ...

A bone-crunching, ear-drum endangering recording (because I always listen way too loud).  No other conductor, not even Szell, can match Levine here.

I'll have to hear that. Until then, Szell goes to the desert island. The timings for snyprrr:

10:29 7:39 11:35 9:04


Sarge

[Mandryka]

Symphony No.5, Op.100

I. Andante              (10:30) 12:30 (15:30)
II. Allegro marcato                8:30 (most perf. clock in right here or just below)
III. Adagio              (10:30) 11:30 (14:30)
IV. Allegro giocoso                 9:30 (in just about every perf., this movement is pretty much right around 9:30)


Without much recollection, I picked up Dutoit's 5th, and ended up wonder why I'd like this amorphous Ballet Music- Symphony with Piano Obbligato- that I could imagine miiight catch my imagination if perhaps someone else performed it. A quick check showed that, at least tempo-wise, most performances of the second and fourth movements are about right where they are stated above, especially the fourth, where there is almost universal conformity (though, there are some quite brisk ones, such as Jansons/Chandos).


I.

Karajan takes 13:00. Some have taken it all the way to @10:30 (Jansons, I believe,Ansermet?Martinon?), whilst some may have even taken it out to 15:30 (I can't remember who this was). Dutoit sounded somewhat flaccid at 13:30, but, maybe that was just his fault and not the tempo's?

The music left me cold in Dutoit's hands, but I heard sumptuousness built into the stacked harmonies, so I knew that the music could come alive in the right hands. I'm curious about both the very quick and slow tempos- is there a Golden Rule concerning this movement?

II.

Timings are pretty consistent across the board, though some take it under 8:00. What's the secret here?

III.

Karajan clocks in at 13:30, but most seem to hover around 11:30, with some quicker still by a minute, and some stretched out passed 14 minutes. Again, what's the Golden Rule here?

IV.

This is the most consistent movement across the board. If we allow for so-and-so many seconds on either side of 9:30, then most every performance has just about exactly the same idea in mind, at least where tempo is concerned.





I'll forego the Discography at the moment, but I'm really curious about all the curious one-offs (such as, say, Celibidache), or the outrageously fast/slow- just- what are all the different things this Symphony can be and still work. Like I said, in Dutoit's hands, this became mid-afternoon nap inducing music of the highest order!

Karajan, Jansons,... those are the first two hits on Amazon... what're your choices?

I don't know the 5th as well as the 6th and 7th, but I know that I like Mravinsky on Praga, a recording made in 1967. I also have an unpublished one by Gergiev in Paris in 2009 which is special --I'l be happy to share it with anyone who's interested.

[Karl Henning]

btw- are we sold on Malko for 7?

I still prefer Ozawa.  Call me the contrarian . . . .

[TheGSMoeller]

I still prefer Ozawa.  Call me the contrarian . . . .

+1. Tennstedt and Ozawa offer the best 7ths.

And I'll just call you Karl. 

[Ken B]

+1. Tennstedt and Ozawa offer the best 7ths.

And I'll just call you Karl. 

Is this the thread where we call each other "Shirley"?

[TheGSMoeller]

Is this the thread where we call each other "Shirley"?

Shirley, you can't be serious?

[Ken B]

Shirley, you can't be serious?

I get so confused Steve, so confused.

[snyprrr]

BernsteinIPO 15:37  8:17  15:18    10:16
BernsteinNYP 15:17 7:57    14:35   10:30
Levi             15:11  8:42   14:48     9:53 Highly Rated

Leinsdorf    14:32   8:21     12:14   9:40
Kitaenko    14:23   8:51   ((12:33)) 9:31
Weller        13:53   8:58    14:37  9:21
Dutoit        13:58   8:28    12:00   9:58
Masur        13:49   8:47  (((13:01)))9:47
Ormandy    13:48   8:05 (((13:06))) 9:22
Handley      13:42   8:34 (((12:53)))9:49

Tennstedt   13:35   8:41     14:13   9:15  Highly Rated
Alsop         13:33   9:05     12:09   9:43

Barshai      13:18   8:23     ((12:31)) 9:21
Rattle        13:05   8:32    ((12:24))  9:45
Muti           13:03  8:50     ((12:36)) 9:55
Ashkenazy1 13:00  8:27      11:55    9:14
Karajan      13:00   8:07  (((12:57)))9:13 Top Rating
Gergiev2     12:56  8:33  (((13:02))) 9:11
Celibidache  12:50  9:02     13:52   9:31
Temirkanov  12:48  8:28    11:23   9:19

Mravinsky88 12:33   8:13    10:55   9:22
Levine         12:33   8:22    12:16   9:11 Top Rating
Gergiev1      12:30   8:48    14:21? 9:*9
Kuchar         12:25   8:34    10:57  9:28
Jarvi            12:25   8:35     11:58  9:59 Top Rating
RozhBBC      12:13  8:43     11:39  10:06

Martinon2     12:00  7:58    11:01   9:40
Ozawa          11:50  8:49     11:12  9:48 Highly Rated
Ansermet     11:45  7:58    12:08  9:45
MartinonVOX 11:44  8:07   10:27   9:39

JansonsCH    11:02   8:05    10:16  8:51 Top Rating

Szell             10:29   7:39   11:35   9:03 Top Rating

[akiralx]

A bone-crunching, ear-drum endangering recording (because I always listen way too loud).  No other conductor, not even Szell, can match Levine here.  An awesome disc, first note to last.

Yes, this is very fine and was my favourite until I tried Concertgebouw/Ashkenazy which I marginally prefer now.  But Levine's is certainly the most hefty recording.