Worshipping at the National Rifle Assn altar

[RebLem]

Police: Boy, 2, accidentally kills woman in store

Associated Press | Tuesday, 30 December 2014

HAYDEN, Idaho (AP) — Authorities in northern Idaho say a 2-year-old boy accidentally shot and killed a woman after he reached into her purse at a Wal-Mart store and her concealed gun fired.

Kootenai County sheriff's spokesman Stu Miller tells reporters that the woman was shopping with several children, and it's unclear how they are related. Authorities originally said the boy was the woman's son.

Authorities say the woman had a concealed weapons permit. Her identity has not been released.

Miller says the shooting was accidental and occurred in the Wal-Mart in Hayden, Idaho, a town about 40 miles northeast of Spokane, Washington. The store closed after the shooting.

Hayden is a politically conservative town of about 9,000 people just north of Coeur d'Alene in Idaho's northern panhandle.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/police ... ?ocid=iehp

[RebLem]

[It turns out that the Idaho shooting story was not complete.  The kid killed his own mother.  Here is the new, expanded report.  RebLem]

2-year-old accidentally kills his mom in Wal-Mart

By Nicholas K. Geranioss   |   Associated Press   |   Tuesday, 30 DEC 2014

HAYDEN, Idaho — A 2-year-old boy accidentally shot and killed his mother after he reached into her purse at a northern Idaho Wal-Mart and her concealed gun fired, authorities said Tuesday.

Veronica J. Rutledge, 29, was shopping with her son and three other children, Kootenai County sheriff's spokesman Stu Miller said.  Rutledge was from Blackfoot in southeastern Idaho, and her family had come to the area to visit relatives.

She had a concealed weapons permit. Miller said the young boy was left in a shopping cart, reached into his mother's purse and grabbed a small-caliber handgun, which discharged one time.

Deputies who responded to the Wal-Mart found Rutledge dead, the sheriff's office said.  "It appears to be a pretty tragic accident," Miller said.  [An accident?  Maybe, but its an accident that was waiting to happen.  When a woman leaves an open purse with a gun in it within her child's reach but not her own, that is not an accident.  It is irresponsible carelessness for which this woman paid with her life.  RebLem] The victim's father-in-law, Terry Rutledge, told The Associated Press that Veronica Rutledge "was a beautiful, young, loving mother. She was not the least bit irresponsible," [Really?  How do we get to that? I am willing to hear any syllogisms that show that.  RebLem] Terry Rutledge said. "She was taken much too soon."

The woman's husband was not in the store when the shooting happened at about 10:20 a.m. Miller said the man arrived shortly after the shooting. All the children were taken to a relative's house.  [Do the relatives have concealed carry permits, too?  Did anyone check to see?  RebLem]

The shooting occurred in the Wal-Mart in Hayden, Idaho, a town about 40 miles northeast of Spokane, Washington. The store closed and was not expected to reopen until Wednesday morning.

Brooke Buchanan, a spokeswoman for Wal-Mart, said in a statement the shooting was a "very sad and tragic accident. [There's that little nonsense word again.  RebLem] We are working closely with the local sheriff's department while they investigate what happened," Buchanan said.

There do not appear to be reliable national statistics about the number of accidental fatalities involving children handling guns. [Of course not.  We are horses, people.  The NRA sees to it that we have all been fitted with blinders.  They don't want to scare us.  And, as long as we let it work, we deserve to be treated like horses.  RebLem]

In neighboring Washington state, a 3-year-old boy was seriously injured in November when he accidentally shot himself in the face in a home in Lake Stevens, about 30 miles north of Seattle.

In April, a 2-year-old boy apparently shot and killed his 11-year-old sister while they and their siblings played with a gun inside a Philadelphia home. Authorities said the gun was believed to have been brought into the home by the mother's boyfriend.

Hayden is a politically conservative town of about 9,000 people just north of Coeur d'Alene, in Idaho's northern panhandle.

Idaho lawmakers passed legislation earlier this year allowing concealed weapons on the state's public college and university campuses.  Despite facing opposition from all eight of the state's university college presidents, lawmakers sided with gun rights advocates who said the law would better uphold the Second Amendment.

Under the law, gun holders are barred from bringing their weapons into dormitories or buildings that hold more than 1,000 people, such as stadiums or concert halls.  [Aha!  Here we have a direct statement of the outrage threshhold.  You have to have a thousand people killed for official outrage to be the proper reaction.  999 just wouldn't cut it.  That'd be just another ho-hum "tragic accident." RebLem]
___

Associated Press writer Kimberlee Kruesi in Boise, Idaho, contributed to this story.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/2-year-old-accidentally-kills-his-mom-in-wal-mart/ar-BBhmnXx?ocid=iehp

[Ken B]

It can be an accident and still the result of irresponsible stupidity.
Your comment about the official outrage threshold is -- being kind here --  a non-sequitur. 

[david johnson]

??  nra mind control told the kid to reach into the purse and discharge the weapon  ??

[snyprrr]

FAIL

Why you so fraid of guns reb?

I'm sure you've seen that hilarious new PSA everyone's mawing about?

[jochanaan]

It's not guns, snyprrr.  It's the folks who, without proper training and precautions, think they can solve certain societal problems.  And also the folks who throw the second half of the Second Amendment in our faces, forgetting that "the right to keep and bear arms" is contained in the context of "A well-regulated militia".  I only ask that firearms be subject to the same licensing and training as automobiles--an equally deadly weapon in many people's hands.

I also find it ironic that edged weapons past a certain length are completely illegal--as if swords were inherently more deadly than an AK-47.

[Sammy]

This is typical of RebLem and other left-wing folks who use a tragedy to immediately howl at the moon against the current gun laws.  However, I do favor jochanaan's recommendation. 

[The new erato]

All the idiots brandishinc guns are better arguments than any leftwinger can come up with.

[Ken B]

All the idiots brandishinc guns are better arguments than any leftwinger can come up with.

I don't see how a two year old could unlatch a safety and pull a trigger. So this pistol  must have had a round chambered already, just waiting to go off. That must count as reckless.

[The new erato]

I don't see how a two year old could unlatch a safety and pull a trigger. So this pistol  must have had a round chambered already, just waiting to go off. That must count as reckless.

My point exactly. Guns and idiots don't blend well, and it's easier to remove the guns than the idiots.....jochanaan hs good points.

[Holden]

As a sports shooter and firearm owner I had to go through a testing and evaluation program before being permitted to own a firearm. There appears to be no such strictures in the US and maybe this is the root cause of the problem.

I am not allowed to carry that firearm on my person in public unless I am transporting it to and from my vehicle where it must reside, unloaded and with some sort of security device such as a trigger guard. While this will not prevent me from running amok should I choose to do so it certainly gives some peace of mind to the Australian public.

The NRA slogan of guns don't kill people, people kill people is certainly true but it takes no account of who you allow to have weapons. That said, how are you ever going to change a law that has been so entrenched for so long as a constitutional right.

[Gurn Blanston]

As a sports shooter and firearm owner I had to go through a testing and evaluation program before being permitted to own a firearm. There appears to be no such strictures in the US and maybe this is the root cause of the problem.

I am not allowed to carry that firearm on my person in public unless I am transporting it to and from my vehicle where it must reside, unloaded and with some sort of security device such as a trigger guard. While this will not prevent me from running amok should I choose to do so it certainly gives some peace of mind to the Australian public.

The NRA slogan of guns don't kill people, people kill people is certainly true but it takes no account of who you allow to have weapons. That said, how are you ever going to change a law that has been so entrenched for so long as a constitutional right.

To get my concealed carry permit in Texas I had to take 10 hours of classroom training and 8 more on the range. The instructor had zero tolerance for screwups either, it was entirely at his discretion if we passed or not.

That whole story is bizarre. No two year old in the world could take my pistol and shoot me with it. It just couldn't be done. I would have to see the video before I bought in.

As for the entire gun control mess, I have been a responsible gun owner for 50 years. I certainly have some reservations about who should be able to have guns, I think our system of handing them out to anyone and everyone is ludicrous, but I would never favor a no-guns policy, no matter the rationale. Surely there are people in this discussion who aren't either right wingnuts or left wingnuts... 

[Sammy]

I think I'm pretty moderate on the gun subject.  I've never owned one, but I do consider it now and then. 

[Moonfish]

http://www.economist.com/blogs/graphicdetail/2012/04/daily-chart-14

[amw]

Americans' attitude towards firearms is frankly ridiculous. I have no idea how concealed carry is supposed to benefit anyone, or why anyone other than a farmer/park ranger/hunter would want to own a gun in the first place. (I don't see why anyone, full stop, would want to own a sword or a battleaxe or VX nerve gas etc., unless they actually wanted to kill people. So I have no problem with those things being banned completely. Guns are useful for other purposes on the other hand. But not in Wal-Mart, on a university campus, or whatever. I can't imagine why anyone would think a firearm would help them shop better?)

[Ken B]

To get my concealed carry permit in Texas I had to take 10 hours of classroom training and 8 more on the range. The instructor had zero tolerance for screwups either, it was entirely at his discretion if we passed or not.

That whole story is bizarre. No two year old in the world could take my pistol and shoot me with it. It just couldn't be done. I would have to see the video before I bought in.

As for the entire gun control mess, I have been a responsible gun owner for 50 years. I certainly have some reservations about who should be able to have guns, I think our system of handing them out to anyone and everyone is ludicrous, but I would never favor a no-guns policy, no matter the rationale. Surely there are people in this discussion who aren't either right wingnuts or left wingnuts... 

My position is this. Gun control does not work. Maybe it might in Japan, where there are few guns already, but not in the US. I believe the statistics bear this out. I do not support futile laws or regulations.
I have no desire to own a gun, and would not do so.

[Ken B]

Americans' attitude towards firearms is frankly ridiculous. I have no idea how concealed carry is supposed to benefit anyone, or why anyone other than a farmer/park ranger/hunter would want to own a gun in the first place. (I don't see why anyone, full stop, would want to own a sword or a battleaxe or VX nerve gas etc., unless they actually wanted to kill people. So I have no problem with those things being banned completely. Guns are useful for other purposes on the other hand. But not in Wal-Mart, on a university campus, or whatever. I can't imagine why anyone would think a firearm would help them shop better?)

That you have no idea only shows you have not listened to the counter arguments against you. There are serious arguments on both sides and a lot of studies.

[ibanezmonster]

http://www.economist.com/blogs/graphicdetail/2012/04/daily-chart-14

Interesting chart. And that's why I don't like to drive too much than I have to...

Americans' attitude towards firearms is frankly ridiculous. I have no idea how concealed carry is supposed to benefit anyone, or why anyone other than a farmer/park ranger/hunter would want to own a gun in the first place. (I don't see why anyone, full stop, would want to own a sword or a battleaxe or VX nerve gas etc., unless they actually wanted to kill people. So I have no problem with those things being banned completely. Guns are useful for other purposes on the other hand. But not in Wal-Mart, on a university campus, or whatever. I can't imagine why anyone would think a firearm would help them shop better?)

Um... some people like collecting guns, swords, etc. and don't want to kill people. Owning a katana would be pretty cool, though I probably wouldn't get one since swords are a bit dangerous.

My position is this. Gun control does not work. Maybe it might in Japan, where there are few guns already, but not in the US. I believe the statistics bear this out. I do not support futile laws or regulations.
I have no desire to own a gun, and would not do so.

Yep, and in time the whole debate will be meaningless when you can 3D print guns. Sure, it may be illegal to do so in Japan, but it's not something you can actually stop in the long run.

[amw]

That you have no idea only shows you have not listened to the counter arguments against you. There are serious arguments on both sides and a lot of studies.

To me it says more that arguments in favour of concealed carry and the like are actually taken seriously. But then I don't know, I've never lived in America outside New York City, maybe the rest of the country really is a crime-ridden hellhole where carrying a firearm on your person at all times is the only way to ensure your survival against school shooters and terrorist cells.

[Ken B]

To me it says more that arguments in favour of concealed carry and the like are actually taken seriously. But then I don't know, I've never lived in America outside New York City, maybe the rest of the country really is a crime-ridden hellhole where carrying a firearm on your person at all times is the only way to ensure your survival against school shooters and terrorist cells.

Which are not the arguments made for concealed carry.