Boulez vs. Feldman

[Karl Henning]

Miles Davis: There's no boring music, just boring people.

No wasted syllables there, either!

[Karl Henning]

Triadic Memories

[asin]B001CJYJZU[/asin]

I seem to be the only one who likes this one.

So, I am glad I mentioned it 

[springrite]

I seem to be the only one who likes this one.

So, I am glad I mentioned it 

I do like it. But it is no For Bunita Marcus

[Karl Henning]

Well, glad to share liking the Memories with you, Paul!

[San Antone]

I seem to be the only one who likes this one.

So, I am glad I mentioned it 

I like it a lot.  His piano works are all worth investigating, I'm glad you mentioned it, too.

.

[Sergeant Rock]

I seem to be the only one who likes this one.

I was going to comment while I listened to it...but I fell asleep 

Sarge

[Karl Henning]

I was going to comment while I listened to it...but I fell asleep 

Sarge

That's what I do half the time when I listen to Feldman.  He was cool with that.

[Christo]

'Music while you sleep'. #notbad

[Ken B]

lol .. ... is this quote supposed to just wisk away things? Boring people can create boring music I'd say .. and there is definitely a lot of music out there that can put a person to sleep.

C'mon guys. Stop making it so easy for James to win the thread. Anyone who endorsed that foolish Miles Davis quotation is sentenced to 8 hours of Pat Boone.

[San Antone]

C'mon guys. Stop making it so easy for James to win the thread. Anyone who endorsed that foolish Miles Davis quotation is sentenced to 8 hours of Pat Boone.

Only if it's his metal album.

[Ken B]

It is easy to see why Feldman bores people. Sometimes he bores me. But other times he fascinates. It's a matter of my mood I suppose. But even when I find Boulez listenable he never fascinates.

[Ken B]

I've explained very generally why Feldman's music is lacking for me .. hence reason for picking Boulez over him..

To my ears, Boulez is much deeper in substance/content in all aspects of music making .. you have moments of great calm or stasis, lots stimulation and explosive energy too .. not to mention his conducting legacy, and all of his teachings and films. He seems like a very easy choice over rather one-dimensional Feldman.

What is it about Boulez's music (or conducting) that 'never fascinates', Ken?

Well, I think Boulez is one of the very greatest conductors, so it is not that. I should organize my thoughts on this and post them, but in a nutshell Boulez only cares about the aspects (many of which are indeed virtues) of music which can be isolated, measured, defined,  analysed, theorized. One can define carefully and abstractly sonata form, chaconne, canon, modulation, key, tone row, inversion.

Define a good tune. Define infectious, toe-tapping, beautiful.

Boulez is for bookkeepers and librarians who say "shush!"

[ibanezmonster]

Only if it's his metal album.

Now that is hilarious.

As for Feldman, his music is indescribably perfect for playing Dynamis zones in Final Fantasy 11. They're basically dreamlike, nighttime versions of regular areas. The mood is so perfectly suitable for it that it makes me wonder if his musical style is based on time traveling to the 2000's, playing the Dynamis zones and then deciding to go back to his own time and write a Dynamis soundtrack. Hell, the Promyvion zones would probably be even better.


Especially this:
https://www.youtube.com/v/JtFbOFHVL1U

That sense of nighttime stasis and having to sneak around mobs/monsters. The whole surrealist feel. 

[EigenUser]

But even when I find Boulez listenable he never fascinates.

Interesting. I hate to bring another name into the discussion, but I'm going to anyway. Stockhausen. His music (or whatever some people wish to call it...) fascinates me. Always has -- because it's so strange! Yet much of it I struggle with and I don't find much of it listenable (not an insult to him at all -- just how I feel).

Well, I think Boulez is one of the very greatest conductors, so it is not that. I should organize my thoughts on this and post them, but in a nutshell Boulez only cares about the aspects (many of which are indeed virtues) of music which can be isolated, measured, defined,  analysed, theorized. One can define carefully and abstractly sonata form, chaconne, canon, modulation, key, tone row, inversion.

Not so much for his later works, which are the ones that I love.

His own work is more intuitive and eludes convention, and is filed with pandemonium, violence, explosive energy, beautiful colors, infectious driving rhythms, wonderful melodies, intense harmonies, powerful abstraction .. many striking, truly unique standout works.

Agreed. I initially disliked Boulez because the first thing of his that I heard was Structures. If I had heard Repons or the orchestral Notations first, I would have been hooked. Notations alone has all that you describe above.

Now that is hilarious.

As for Feldman, his music is indescribably perfect for playing Dynamis zones in Final Fantasy 11. They're basically dreamlike, nighttime versions of regular areas. The mood is so perfectly suitable for it that it makes me wonder if his musical style is based on time traveling to the 2000's, playing the Dynamis zones and then deciding to go back to his own time and write a Dynamis soundtrack. Hell, the Promyvion zones would probably be even better.


Especially this:
https://www.youtube.com/v/JtFbOFHVL1U

That sense of nighttime stasis and having to sneak around mobs/monsters. The whole surrealist feel. 

Not a gamer, myself (aside from the odd Mario game), but I can relate. I always thought the last movement of Messiaen's Et Exspecto Resurrectionem Mortuorum sounded like it could be music from Bowser's castle.

[NJ Joe]

I've been listening to ...explosante-fixe... for 3 days now and do find it quite fascinating...it keeps pulling me back to listen again. 

Admittedly though, I'm having trouble humming along. 

Dare I say it occasionally reminds me of Stravinsky, particularly The Firebird and Le Sacre??

[NJ Joe]

It's a homage to Igor.

Ah ha! Interesting!

[Uhor]

I voted Boulez simply because I believe Le Marteau is the best work of the second half 20th century, for it's sheer variety and beauty conjuring with detailed textures sensual and exotic atmospheres.

However I do have a fondness for Feldman's intuition, specially his directness and pacing of events.

One thing both had in common was an absolute fascination for the resonance of instruments. In other ways they are opposites with Boulez being a master of the quick gesture and exhilarating speed while Feldman gives us much time for contemplating the same objects under slightly different lights and angles.

[ComposerOfAvantGarde]

I voted Boulez simply because I believe Le Marteau is the best work of the second half 20th century, for it's sheer variety and beauty conjuring with detailed textures sensual and exotic atmospheres.

However I do have a fondness for Feldman's intuition, specially his directness and pacing of events.

One thing both had in common was an absolute fascination for the resonance of instruments. In other ways they are opposites with Boulez being a master of the quick gesture and exhilarating speed while Feldman gives us much time for contemplating the same objects under slightly different lights and angles.

This is how I think of them as well. Boulez and Feldman both create objects, but Feldman harnesses and examines the objects he makes in extreme detail, whereas Boulez sets his objects free.

[Karl Henning]

C'mon guys. Stop making it so easy for James to win the thread.

Interesting. I hate to bring another name into the discussion, but I'm going to anyway. Stockhausen.

Oh, well.