Bruckner's Abbey

[Parsifal]

After listening to a few samples, I can see where the Venzago loon comment is coming from. I don't think I meet a cycle of that. I will probably pick up a single disc to satisfy my curiosity, probably the 8th. But the Maazel lset is the thing I must have.

[aukhawk]

Well Venzago's recordings may not satisfy Brucknerians, but perhaps that is why I like them so much.  There is much about Bruckner's symphonies that I find quite hard to take (brassiness, repitition) and Venzago's 7th in particular minimises all that.  It's the only recording of this work I turn to.

[SurprisedByBeauty]

With a bit of luck I'll get to participate in a real feast: Bamberg SO under Blomstedt in four cathedrals in four days in Bruckner's Fifth this summer: https://www.bamberger-symphoniker.de/en/programme-tickets/concert-overview/herbert-blomstedt-conducts-bruckner-19-07-2017.html

[Cato]

With a bit of luck I'll get to participate in a real feast: Bamberg SO under Blomstedt in four cathedrals in four days in Bruckner's Fifth this summer: https://www.bamberger-symphoniker.de/en/programme-tickets/concert-overview/herbert-blomstedt-conducts-bruckner-19-07-2017.html

That is a real feast!  Bruckner played in a cathedral is more than appropriate!

I once heard the following story about Toscanini from someone who knew a musician who had played in the NBC Orchestra:

While rehearsing the orchestra, the conductor sees a worker of some sort passing by the podium, and Toscanini takes his baton and knocks the man's hat off.  The worker, not immune to the maestro's reputation, says nothing, picks up his hat, and goes off.  Later, he again passes by the podium, and again Toscanini knocks off his hat.  The man says:

"Hey, Maestro, what's the big idea knocking off my hat?  This ain't a church, y' know!"

Toscanini: "When we play music, is like a church!"  0:)

[SurprisedByBeauty]

That is a real feast!  Bruckner played in a cathedral is more than appropriate!

I once heard the following story about Toscanini from someone who knew a musician who had played in the NBC Orchestra:

While rehearsing the orchestra, the conductor sees a worker of some sort passing by the podium, and Toscanini takes his baton and knocks the man's hat off.  The worker, not immune to the maestro's reputation, says nothing, picks up his hat, and goes off.  Later, he again passes by the podium, and again Toscanini knocks off his hat.  The man says:

"Hey, Maestro, what's the big idea knocking off my hat?  This ain't a church, y' know!"

Toscanini: "When we play music, is like a church!"  0:)

I have the feeling it will be wonderful, yes, but then I also think that Bruckner and churches are perhaps too easily associated. None of the symphonies were actually composed for that sort of a space... but in fact very much for the Musikverein (later, at least; not sure what he logically had in mind for the earliest symphonies). It tends to push the notion of Bruckner the sacred symphonist a little too hard; the incense-wafting a la Celibidache. Don't get me wrong: Love Celi and that's how I found into Bruckner. But I'm not sure if it is 100% Bruckner or doing his music a great service. Fortunately we have this trend and any imaginable counter-trend, too... see the Vinzago discussion. (One reason why I'm not jumping on the Vinzago-rubbishing train. I find them refreshing antidotes.)

Love the Toscanini quote. Se non è vero, è ben trovato.

[Cato]

I have the feeling it will be wonderful, yes, but then I also think that Bruckner and churches are perhaps too easily associated. None of the symphonies were actually composed for that sort of a space...

True, but having heard several of the symphonies (0, 4, 8  ) in the cathedral of the Toledo diocese, it is a great experience!  Let us know what you think!

[SurprisedByBeauty]

True, but having heard several of the symphonies (0, 4, in the cathedral of the Toledo diocese, it is a great experience!  Let us know what you think!

Will do! So far, my experiences have been: Bloomstedt, Ottobeuren, 8th, BRSO and 9th and 6th with Remy Ballot at St. Florian. I think that's been it, though. Very fine experiences, each time, indeed.

[Wanderer]

With a bit of luck I'll get to participate in a real feast: Bamberg SO under Blomstedt in four cathedrals in four days in Bruckner's Fifth this summer: https://www.bamberger-symphoniker.de/en/programme-tickets/concert-overview/herbert-blomstedt-conducts-bruckner-19-07-2017.html

Sounds splendid!

[André]

The unpublished 1876 version of symphony no 2. Eichhorn recorded the original 1872 version, as well as the slightly pruned 1873. Carragan and Berky concocted this assemblage, in which the text is tightened here and there (small cuts).  Movement order is andante-scherzo (it originated the other way around), and the adagio coda is allotted to the clarinet.

It's all very fine - and a very good interpretation. Except that the orchestra, fine as it is, is not the most alert and tranchent outfit and it is put at a further disadvantage by the homogeneous and slightly recessed sound picture. IOW it does not sound bold and youthful enough. This is early Bruckner, after all !

I retain a preference for Stein, Giulini, Karajan, Jochum (DGG), Zender, Haitink, Blomstedt (1872 original). Even Konwitschny's deliberate performance has more character.

[SurprisedByBeauty]

Stalking Blomstedt and Bamberg Symphony in their Bruckner-5-in-4-Cathedrals-Tour.





Pix Wuerzburg & Passau, respectively.

[Cato]

The unpublished 1876 version of symphony no 2. Eichhorn recorded the original 1872 version, as well as the slightly pruned 1873. Carragan and Berky concocted this assemblage, in which the text is tightened here and there (small cuts).  Movement order is andante-scherzo (it originated the other way around), and the adagio coda is allotted to the clarinet.

It's all very fine - and a very good interpretation. Except that the orchestra, fine as it is, is not the most alert and tranchent outfit and it is put at a further disadvantage by the homogeneous and slightly recessed sound picture. IOW it does not sound bold and youthful enough. This is early Bruckner, after all !

I retain a preference for Stein, Giulini, Karajan, Jochum (DGG), Zender, Haitink, Blomstedt (1872 original). Even Konwitschny's deliberate performance has more character.

Many thanks for the information!

Stalking Blomstedt and Bamberg Symphony in their Bruckner-5-in-4-Cathedrals-Tour.





Pix Wuerzburg & Passau, respectively.

Great pictures!

[kishnevi]

Stalking Blomstedt and Bamberg Symphony in their Bruckner-5-in-4-Cathedrals-Tour.





Pix Wuerzburg & Passau, respectively.

There's at least one violinist who seems to have packed but one outfit for the trip...

Re:Passau
That high altar seems to enshrine three Greek deities and Gandalf the Grey. 

[Wanderer]

Thanks for the reportage, Jens! 

Re:Passau
That high altar seems to enshrine three Greek deities and Gandalf the Grey.

Passau is definitely on my radar now.

[SurprisedByBeauty]

Thanks for the reportage, Jens! 



Passau is definitely on my radar now.

More coming in an upcoming actual report of the trip which ended last night in St. Florian!


(Passau organ)

[Cato]

More coming in an upcoming actual report of the trip which ended last night in St. Florian!


(Passau organ)

The Baroque, where more is always MORE!!! 0:)

Many thanks, and let us know your reviews!

[HIPster]

More coming in an upcoming actual report of the trip which ended last night in St. Florian!


(Passau organ)

Excellent. 

Really looking forward to it.

[Cato]

I used to have all 9 on LP !



I have told the story before, but for any newcomers...

I had already discovered intuitively (age 5 or before perhaps)  the differences between the 3-minute radio ditties my mother occasionally listened to (my father was basically unmusical, except when it came to a Big-Band singer named Teresa Brewer) and classical music, the latter supplied by Carl Stalling's pastiche scores for cartoons, a show on Sunday with Alistair Cooke called Omnibus , the organist at my Catholic parish, and Leonard Bernstein's Young People's Concerts (1958).  The latter two shows had to be viewed at my grandparents' house next door, since they did not fit my parents' taste. 0:)

One day, around age 11, I was visiting the Dayton downtown Main Library and browsing through the study scores,when I came across a nice new blue score (Editor Leopold Nowak) of a composer named Anton Bruckner.  Following the score, I reached the first climax of the opening movement of the Seventh Symphony, and thought: "I have GOT to find a record of THIS!!!"

And whoever the Music Librarian was at the time, s/he was wonderful, because a new DGG 2-record set of the symphony - conducted by Eugen Jochum - was waiting for me!  So I took it home, and even though my 1950's record player had only one speaker, I was more than enthralled!

When I have more time, I will be writing about my early experiences as a (perhaps only somewhat precocious      )  11-year old and Bruckner as conducted by Eugen Jochum!   0:)

[aukhawk]

I used to have all 9 on LP !

I misread that - as "I used to have all 9 on 1 LP" 

(That character on the cover picture looks as though he'd fit right in, at Passau)

[Cato]

I misread that - as "I used to have all 9 on 1 LP" 

(That character on the cover picture looks as though he'd fit right in, at Passau)

Yes!  The DGG/Jochum series had album covers with similar sketches of churches to symbolize the symphonies and Bruckner's own piety.

My earliest memories of the First Symphony:

It was not the first Bruckner work to hit my ears: as I mentioned earlier, that "honor" went to the Seventh Symphony! 

However, the First Symphony impressed me with its energy, its drive, its fury in the first movement, and then came the slow movement with its arching themes, both melancholy and hopeful, and I realized that it was not for nothing that ecclesiastical architecture was used on those album covers!  The Scherzo brought back the furious nature of the first movement's conclusion, a fury tempered somewhat, however, by the contrasting theme and the Trio.  And then the Finale summed up all that driving energy, concentrated it, yet at the same time expanded its scope.

I was a teenager at the time of Jochum's  recording, and had already started my composing "career" as an autodidact, so every Nowak score of the symphonies and every recording (especially Jochum's) of a Bruckner work was important for my musical education.

And whoever the Music Librarian was at the time, s/he was wonderful, because a new* DGG 2-record set of the symphony - conducted by Eugen Jochum - was waiting for me!  So I took it home, and even though my 1950's record player had only one speaker, I was more than enthralled!

It strikes me that my memory is off, for it could not have been the stereo recording, but one from the early 1950's: the stereo recording became available when I was a teenager.  Perhaps it was "new" in that they had bought the older monaural recording: I am positive that it was in the bin labeled NEW ACQUISITIONS.

[Cato]

Yes!  The DGG/Jochum series had album covers with similar sketches of churches to symbolize the symphonies and Bruckner's own piety.

My earliest memories of the First Symphony:

It was not the first Bruckner work to hit my ears: as I mentioned earlier, that "honor" went to the Seventh Symphony! 

However, the First Symphony impressed me with its energy, its drive, its fury in the first movement, and then came the slow movement with its arching themes, both melancholy and hopeful, and I realized that it was not for nothing that ecclesiastical architecture was used on those album covers!  The Scherzo brought back the furious nature of the first movement's conclusion, a fury tempered somewhat, however, by the contrasting theme and the Trio.  And then the Finale summed up all that driving energy, concentrated it, yet at the same time expanded its scope.

I was a teenager at the time of Jochum's  recording, and had already started my composing "career" as an autodidact, so every Nowak score of the symphonies and every recording (especially Jochum's) of a Bruckner work was important for my musical education.

It strikes me that my memory is off, for it could not have been the stereo recording, but one from the early 1950's: the stereo recording became available when I was a teenager.  Perhaps it was "new" in that they had bought the older monaural recording: I am positive that it was in the bin labeled NEW ACQUISITIONS.

Today, the Second Symphony is my topic: my Nowak score dates from 1965, so that must be the first time I had heard the Second Symphony, when I was in high school.

If the First Symphony impressed me with its drive and energy, the Second Symphony left a mark with its wealth of fascinating material, which often provided an air of mystery as well as drama: the opening theme in the high register of the cellos, the theme in the woodwinds at C, bar 100, for example, with the marvelous theme in the woodwinds accompanied by a repeated motif of  two 8th notes and a quarter note on massed strings, the insistent trumpet call bursting in at times, and of course the pauses, which "riddle" the movement in more ways than one.       The Andante begins full or portent, and has an opening climax full of drama, portending the greater outburst at K, bar 149.  This slow movement is more restrained emotionally than the ones to come, more mysterious, meditative, enigmatic perhaps.  The Scherzo was just fun: lots of fast fiddling, but that trumpet motif from the first movement was not to be forgotten!  The Coda, I recall, struck me as remarkable.  The opening of the Finale seemed an expression of frustration, scrambling up a mountain, but not quite reaching the top. By the time sections E and F are reached, however, the top seems to have yielded to serenity and then at the end is trampled by the trumpet motif!

I dread to mention that my 52 year-old score is yellowing!  But I will not be bothering with a replacement! 

I do not dread to mention that I also obtained the CD with the Originalfassung of the Second Symphony,  on NAXOS with Georg Tintner conducting.  Again, there is a case to be made that Bruckner tinkered with something that did not need tinkering.