Bruckner's Abbey

Started by Lilas Pastia, April 06, 2007, 07:15:30 AM

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TheGSMoeller

From what my ears have heard, Knappertsbusch excels when interpreting Bruckner. I've listened to the 4th (Berlin-1944) 8th (Munich-1963) and 9th (Berlin-1950) and they are all brilliant. Knapp is very individualistic in his approach, and not specifically attached to one style or tone as each symphony is given it's own. Anyone else have any thoughts on Knappertsbusch and his conducting of Bruckner's symphonies?
(Couldn't find a decent pic of the 9th recording)


jlaurson

#2761
Quote from: TheGSMoeller on July 21, 2016, 06:57:05 AM
Munich Phil has its own label now, and released Gergiev conducting Bruckner's 4th. Has anyone heard this? Or heard Gergiev conducting Bruckner before?

Yes (though not I that particular 4th), it was a concert in Munich at which this was recorded. I was told that he had a concert of B4 at Suntory Hall that was out of this world... not long after the Munich performance. (I didn't hear it; friends tell me it was good, not great; better than expected.)

He'll conduct (and record) a whole cycle of the Bruckner symphonies (0-9!) at St. Florian. This will mean the first (!!!) recordings of the MPhil of Bruckner 0, 1, and 2.

Also, the orchestra that's premiered Mahler 4, 8, DLvdE and the second perf. of M7 (all but DLvdE under Mahler himself), is issuing its second (!!) ever Mahler recording with that Gergiev M2. (That concert I was at and reported from.) Incidentally I talked with Gergiev an hour about -- ostensibly Bruckner and the new label -- but he was a bit off topic and in the zone... so I can't relate much that's apropos.

Quote from: Brewski on July 15, 2016, 11:16:51 AM
My review of a quite moving Bruckner 6th Symphony last night, with Christoph Eschenbach and the National Youth Orchestra of the USA. I was quite impressed that that musicians relatively young (ages 16-19) could play this so beautifully, and with such confidence.

http://newyorkclassicalreview.com/2016/07/eschenbach-national-youth-orchestra-of-usa-scale-the-heights-with-bruckner/

--Bruce

That's one of the great skills of Eschenbach, to bring (even!) Bruckner so near to such young players. I find Bruckner with him -- and with Youth Orchestras especially -- one of his great strengths.


Quote from: Marc on July 16, 2016, 10:18:30 AM
Did some no 7 listening during the last days, which changed my mind about my little list... I'd like to exchange a splendid recording for a splendid performance, please please please.

(Jens, I hope it's not too much trouble. :))


Will do, of course... hopefully tomorrow. Am at a festival and therefore a bit busy... but I'll hear Bruckner 6 with Herreweghe the day after tomorrow -- and again at St. Florian in a 2  Piano version and the real thing with the illegitimate son of Celibidache (<- licentious rumor!), Remy Ballot. :-)

Update: DONE

Quote from: Mirror Image on July 10, 2016, 06:24:01 AM
Very nice post, Jens! Great job, sir.
Thanks for the positive feedback! Much appreciated. (As I say: "Bruckner is a love. [Mahler an addiction.]")ne
Daverz, may I question your Sieghart/2 choice?!?III Are you sure it's not Eichhorn that you are thinking about?schur

Tally-time
(updated):

No. 00 - Inbal/Frankfurt





No. 0 - Blunier B.O.BonnMarriner/StuttgartHaitink/RCO | Skrowaczewski Saarbrücken



No. 1 - HvK/Berlin (x2) | Neumann/Leipzig (x2) | Haitink/RCO (x2) | Chailly | Sawallisch/BStO | Tintner | Maazel BRSO | Wand/Cologne | Skrowaczewski Saarbrücken




No. 2 - Stein, WPh (x5)| Jochum/Dresden (x2) | Dausgaard Swedish CO | Barenboim/BPh | Inbal/Frankfurt | HvK/Berlin | Suitner/Tokyo | Zender/SWF-BB | Eichhorn/BOLinz/SWF-BB




No. 3 - Kubelik BRSO Sony (x3) {Audite} | Nagano/DSO (x2) | Celibidache MPhil (x2) | Böhm/WPh (x2)  | Venzago, Bern SO | Szell/ClevO | Tintner | Sinopoli/Dresden | Nezet-Seguin | Schuricht/WPh/EMI




No. 4 - Böhm WPh (x4) | Kubelik, BRSO (x2) | HvK/Berlin/EMI (x2) | Klemperer/BRSO (x2) | Honeck, Pittsburgh | Blomstedt/SFSO | Wand/BPh | Jochum Dresden | Barenboim/CSO  | Suitner/StaKapB | B00004YL94/CzPO | Barenboim/CSO | Ormandy/Philadelphia | Herrreweghe (Review)




No. 5 - Dohnanyi/ClevO (x3) | Celibidache MPhil (x2) | Sinopoli, Dresden (x2) | HvK/BPh (x2) | Wand, Cologne | Wand, NDRSO | Haitink/BRSO | Suitner/StakapB | Jochum/RCO/Philips {December 1986} | Klemperer/NewPO | Harnoncourt/WPh




No. 6 - Norrington, SWR RSO (x3) (review) | HvK/Berlin (x2) | Stein/WPh (x2) | Klemperer (x2) | Haitink Dresden (x2) (review) | Sawallisch/BStO (x2) | Celibidache, MPhil (x2) | Nagano/DSO | D.R.Davies | Gielen/Baden-Baden | Bongartz/Lpzg | Keilberth/BPh 




No. 7 - HvK/Vienna (x2) | Blomstedt/Dresden (x2) | HvK/Berlin/EMI (x2) {DG} | Rosbaud/SWR BB (x2) | Chailly/RSO Berlin | Haitink CSO (review) | Böhm, BRSO (review) | Böhm, WPh  | Dohnanyi/ClevO | Skrowaczewski Saarbrücken | Matacic/CzechPO | Schuricht/BPh | Herrreweghe (Review)




No. 8 - Wand, BPh (x2) | Boulez, WPh (x2) | Celibidache, MPhil, EMI (x2) | Schuricht/VPO (x2) |Böhm/WPh (x2) | Blomstedt, Leipzig | Maazel/BPh | HvK/BerlinFurtwängler/WPh | Haitink/RCO/69 | Haitink/RCO/81 | Chailly | Thielemann/Dresden (review)




No. 9 - Kubelik/BRSO (x2) | Wand, BPh (x2) | Giulini, WPh (x2) | Jochum/Dresden (x2) | Haitink, RCO 81 | Barenboim, BPh | Dohnanyi, Philharmonia (review) | Furtwängler/BPh | Mehta/WPh  | Walter | Rögner | Leitner | Bernstein/WPh | Rattle/Complete | Schuricht/VPO





Notes:
Sawallisch is not w/BRSO but BStO in both instances. Berlin and Munich Orchestras dominate w/20 resp. 16 mentions if I counted right.
André mentioned a Zander/2 which I am not aware of; only his 5th... The Bamberg Jochum 8 seems never to have made it onto CD (and evenLP or DVD are unavailable) or else is simply not available.

Very little consensus. Assumed editorial liberties by ignoring the "Chicago-for-everything" recommendation.  Includes Drasko's choices: Speaking of Drasko: Did I get your Furtwangler Choces right? With him, it's always a bit tricky in Bruckner, given the many non-official and officialish recordings that are out there.

Conductors with Multiple Mentions (=/>4):


1 - HvK     : IIIIIIIIIIIIII 14 (˄)
2 - Böhm    : IIIIIIIIII 10 ˅
2 - Haitink : IIIIIIIIII 10 ˅
4 - Wand    : IIIIIIIII 9 -
5 - Kubelik : IIIIIIII 8 -
5 - Celi    : IIIIIIII 8 ˄
7 - Stein   : IIIIIII 7 ˄
8 - Jochum  : IIIIII 6 ˅
9 - Dohnanyi: IIIII 5 -
9 - Schuricht: IIIII 5 NEW
11 - Chailly: IIII 4 ˅


Drasko

Quote from: TheGSMoeller on July 23, 2016, 09:02:41 PM
From what my ears have heard, Knappertsbusch excels when interpreting Bruckner. I've listened to the 4th (Berlin-1944) 8th (Munich-1963) and 9th (Berlin-1950) and they are all brilliant. Knapp is very individualistic in his approach, and not specifically attached to one style or tone as each symphony is given it's own. Anyone else have any thoughts on Knappertsbusch and his conducting of Bruckner's symphonies?

At his best Knappertsbusch Bruckner is awesomely exciting, this organic free-flowing river-like stream of sound where tempo and dynamic fluctuations seem utterly natural, but at his worst fluctuations sound jarring, tempos can get heavy and characterization goes into cartoon caricature land.

Unfortunately he had predilection for Schalk editions, which for me rules out his 5th (but the 3rd survives) and generally I think he is much better live than in studio. I'm afraid I'm not that big fan of that Munich 8th on Westminster, too heavy and ponderous for me.

My favorite recordings would be:

9 - Berlin Philharmonic 28.01.1950
8 - Berlin Philharmonic 08.01.1951 (I have 8 & 9 on Tahra)
7 - Vienna Philharmonic 30.08.1949 (Salzburg on Orfeo)
5 - no go for me
4 - somehow never heard any of his 4ts
3 - Bavarian State Orchestra 11.10.1954 (Orfeo) with some caveats

TheGSMoeller

Quote from: jlaurson on July 24, 2016, 02:24:52 AM
Yes (though not I that particular 4th), it was a concert in Munich at which this was recorded. I was told that he had a concert of B4 at Suntory Hall that was out of this world... not long after the Munich performance. (I didn't hear it; friends tell me it was good, not great; better than expected.)

He'll conduct (and record) a whole cycle of the Bruckner symphonies (0-9!) at St. Florian. This will mean the first (!!!) recordings of the MPhil of Bruckner 0, 1, and 2.

Also, the orchestra that's premiered Mahler 4, 8, DLvdE and the second perf. of M7 (all but DLvdE under Mahler himself), is issuing its second (!!) ever Mahler recording with that Gergiev M2. (That concert I was at and reported from.) Incidentally I talked with Gergiev an hour about -- ostensibly Bruckner and the new label -- but he was a bit off topic and in the zone... so I can't relate much that's apropos.

Thank you for the reply, Jens.  You've done such a great job with compiling all the recordings too, I guess I still need to contribute with my favorites.


Quote from: Draško on July 24, 2016, 03:27:54 AM
At his best Knappertsbusch Bruckner is awesomely exciting, this organic free-flowing river-like stream of sound where tempo and dynamic fluctuations seem utterly natural, but at his worst fluctuations sound jarring, tempos can get heavy and characterization goes into cartoon caricature land.

Unfortunately he had predilection for Schalk editions, which for me rules out his 5th (but the 3rd survives) and generally I think he is much better live than in studio. I'm afraid I'm not that big fan of that Munich 8th on Westminster, too heavy and ponderous for me.

My favorite recordings would be:

9 - Berlin Philharmonic 28.01.1950
8 - Berlin Philharmonic 08.01.1951 (I have 8 & 9 on Tahra)
7 - Vienna Philharmonic 30.08.1949 (Salzburg on Orfeo)
5 - no go for me
4 - somehow never heard any of his 4ts
3 - Bavarian State Orchestra 11.10.1954 (Orfeo) with some caveats

Thank you very much, Drasko!! I've read several other times that the 5th is a no go, I would still be interested to hear Knapp's take on it though. I've come to find my preferences for the last two mvts of the 8th are for more of a broader, meditative approach. I like to hear performances take their time with those themes and melodies. But I can understand your view of it being ponderous.
I think Knapp has many recordings on Spotify, I'll check them out and let you know what I think.

TheGSMoeller

Finally posting my pick for Bruckner recordings...

No. 0 - Davies/Bruckner Linz*, Chailly/RSO Berlin
No. 1 - Barenboim/Berlin*
No. 2 - Chailly/RCO*, Tintner/NSOoI
No. 3 - Nagano/DSO Berlin (1873)*, Vanska/BBC Scottish (1877), Wand/Cologne (1889)
No. 4 - Celibidache/Munich*, Jochum/Berlin, Vanska/Minn
No. 5 - Eichhorn/Bruckner Linz*, Sinopoli/Dresden, Harnoncourt/Vienna
No. 6 - Blomstedt/Leipzig*, Haitink/Dresden, Norrington/Stuttgart
No. 7 - Venzago/Basel SO*, Matacic/Czech, Davies/Bruckner Linz
No. 8 - Wand/Berlin*, Knappertsbusch/Munich
No. 9 - Jochum/Berlin*, Barenboim/Berlin, Knappertsbusch/Berlin, Wand/Berlin

Surprisingly the 9th was the hardest to for me to decide, all four I mentioned above are first rate, and deserve to be placed high. I would even include Harnoncourt/Vienna, Giulini/Vienna, Jochum/Dresden to that list.

jlaurson

#2765
Tally-time
(updated):

No. 00 - Inbal/Frankfurt





No. 0 - Blunier B.O.BonnMarriner/StuttgartHaitink/RCO | Skrowaczewski Saarbrücken | Davies/BOLinz | Chailly/RSOBerlin



No. 1 - HvK/Berlin (x2) | Neumann/Leipzig (x2) | Haitink/RCO (x2) | Chailly | Sawallisch/BStO | Tintner | Maazel BRSO | Wand/Cologne | Skrowaczewski Saarbrücken | Barenboim/BPh




No. 2 - Stein, WPh (x5)| Jochum/Dresden (x2) | Dausgaard Swedish CO | Barenboim/BPh | Inbal/Frankfurt | HvK/Berlin | Suitner/Tokyo | Zender/SWF-BB | Eichhorn/BOLinz | Chailly/RCO | Tintner/NSOiI 




No. 3 - Kubelik/BRSO/Sony - 1878, Ed.Oeser (w/out Scherzo coda) (x3) {Audite} | Nagano/DSO - 1873 OV, Ed.Nowak (x3) | Celibidache MPhil - 1889, Ed.Nowak (x2) | Böhm/WPh - 1889, Ed.Nowak (x2)  | Venzago, Bern SO - 1889, Ed.Nowak | Szell/ClevO - 1890, Bruckner-Schalk Bros., Ed.Raettig | Tintner - 1873 OV, Ed.Nowak | Sinopoli/Dresden - 1877, Ed.Leopld Nowak | Nezet-Seguin - 1873 OV, Ed.Nowak | Schuricht/WPh/EMI - 1890, Bruckner-Schalk Bros., Ed.Raettig | Vanska/BBC SCottish - 1877, Ed.Nowak | Wand/Cologne RSO - 1889, Ed.Nowak | Norrington/SWR RSO Stuttgart - 1873 OV, Ed.Nowak




No. 4 - Böhm WPh (x4) | Kubelik, BRSO (x2) | HvK/Berlin/EMI (x2) | Klemperer/BRSO (x2) | Honeck, Pittsburgh | Blomstedt/SFSO | Wand/BPh | Jochum/Dresden] | Jochum/Berlin | Barenboim/CSO  | Suitner/StaKapB | Konwitschny/CzPO | Ormandy/Philadelphia | Herrreweghe (Review) | Vanska/MN | Celibidache/MPhil




No. 5 - Dohnanyi/ClevO (x3) | Sinopoli, Dresden (x3) | Celibidache MPhil (x2) | Harnoncourt/WPh (x3) | HvK/BPh (x2) | Wand, Cologne | Wand, NDRSO | Haitink/BRSO | Suitner/StakapB | Jochum/RCO/Philips {December 1986} | Klemperer/NewPO | Eichhorn/BOLinz




No. 6 - Norrington, SWR RSO (x4) (review) | Haitink Dresden (x3) | HvK/Berlin (x2) | Stein/WPh (x2) | Klemperer (x2) |(review) | Sawallisch/BStO (x2) | Celibidache, MPhil (x2) | Nagano/DSO | D.R.Davies | Gielen/Baden-Baden | Bongartz/Lpzg | Keilberth/BPh | Blomstedt/Leipzig 




No. 7 - HvK/Vienna (x2) | Blomstedt/Dresden (x2) | HvK/Berlin/EMI (x2) {DG} | Rosbaud/SWR BB (x2) | Matacic/CzechPO (x2) | Chailly/RSO Berlin | Haitink CSO (review) | Böhm, BRSO (review) | Böhm, WPh  | Dohnanyi/ClevO | Skrowaczewski Saarbrücken | Schuricht/BPh | Venzago/Basel | Davies/BOLinz | Herrreweghe (Review)




No. 8 - Wand, BPh (x3) | Boulez, WPh (x2) | Celibidache, MPhil, EMI (x2) | Schuricht/VPO (x2) |Böhm/WPh (x2) | Blomstedt, Leipzig | Maazel/BPh | HvK/BerlinFurtwängler/WPh | Haitink/RCO/69 | Haitink/RCO/81 | Chailly | Knappertsbursch/MPhil | Thielemann/Dresden (review)




No. 9 - Wand, BPh (x3) | Kubelik/BRSO (x2) | Giulini, WPh (x2) | Barenboim, BPh (x2) | Jochum/Dresden (x2) | Jochum, Berlin | Haitink, RCO 81 | Dohnanyi, Philharmonia (review) | Furtwängler/BPh | Mehta/WPh  | Walter | Rögner | Leitner | Bernstein/WPh | Rattle/Complete | Schuricht/VPO Celibidache/MPhil | Kna'/BPh






Conductors with Multiple Mentions (=/>5):


1 - HvK      : IIIII IIIII IIII 14 -
2 - Wand     : IIIII IIIII II 12 ˄
3 - Haitink  : IIIII IIIII I 11 (˅)
4 - Böhm     : IIIII IIIII 10 ˅
4 - Celi     : IIIII IIIII 10 ˄
6 - Kubelik  : IIIII III 8 ˅
6 - Jochum   : IIIII III 8 ˄
7 - Stein    : IIIII II 7 -
8 - Chailly  : IIIII I 6 ˄
9 - Dohnanyi : IIIII 5 -
9 - Schuricht: IIIII 5 -
9 - Barenboim: IIIII 5 *
9 - Blomstedt: IIIII 5 *


Orchestras with Multiple Mentions (=/>4):


1 - Wiener Philharmoniker        : IIIII IIIII IIIII IIIII IIIII IIIII (30)
2 - Berliner Philharmoniker      : IIIII IIIII IIIII IIIII IIIII IIII (29)
3 - Staatskapelle Dresden        : IIIII IIIII IIIII (15)
4 - BRSO                         : IIIII IIIII II (12)
5 - Münchner Philharmoniker      : IIIII IIIII I (11)
6 - Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra: IIIII IIII (9)
7 - SWR RSO Stuttgart            : IIIII II (7)
8 - Leipzig Gewandhaus Orchester : IIIII (5)
8 - Cleveland Orchestra          : IIIII (5)
8 - Bruckner Orchester Linz      : IIIII (5)
11 - RSO Berlin                   : IIII (4)
11 - DSO Berlin                   : IIII (4)
11 - SWR Baden-Baden/Freiburg     : IIII (4)



I had to add another Choice Third for myself. Norrington's 1873 (already helpful!) Third is really splendid. Maybe not quite as obviously as his 6th, but still! Gives the SWR Stuttgart another notch in its belt, on the day after it played its last concert at the proms.

Updated in accordance w/TheGSMoeller's latest B9 antics. :-) Now he's got all his choices in, after all.

TheGSMoeller

Quote from: jlaurson on July 30, 2016, 01:44:59 AM
Tally-time

I had to add another Choice Third for myself. Norrington's 1873 (already helpful!) Third is really splendid. Maybe not quite as obviously as his 6th, but still! Gives the SWR Stuttgart another notch in its belt, on the day after it played its last concert at the proms.

Thanks for the tally, Jens. But you didn't add Knapp/Berlin for the 9th?

And it's nice to see another Norrington/Stuttgart fan here, his tenure, and recordings, seem to be controversial, but I find it all revelatory and unique. Their collab on the 7th is also splendid.


jlaurson

Quote from: TheGSMoeller on July 30, 2016, 06:02:08 AM
Thanks for the tally, Jens. But you didn't add Knapp/Berlin for the 9th?

And it's nice to see another Norrington/Stuttgart fan here, his tenure, and recordings, seem to be controversial, but I find it all revelatory and unique. Their collab on the 7th is also splendid.

I didn't. I have, arbitrarily and inconsistently, made the cut-off for 'nominatable recordings for "favorite" by one person' at three. If you absolutely insist, because it's a can't-live-without Bruckner 9th, I'll add it, though.  ;)

TheGSMoeller

Quote from: jlaurson on July 30, 2016, 07:11:31 AM
I didn't. I have, arbitrarily and inconsistently, made the cut-off for 'nominatable recordings for "favorite" by one person' at three. If you absolutely insist, because it's a can't-live-without Bruckner 9th, I'll add it, though.  ;)

Oh it doesn't matter, I wasn't aware of the 3 cut off. Knapp can sit this one out for now.

Hey anyone here willing to do some CD swapping? I've got a hand full of Bruckner recordings I don't listen to much and I see a lot I would love to listen to.

TheGSMoeller

Quote from: TheGSMoeller on July 29, 2016, 08:26:55 PM
Finally posting my pick for Bruckner recordings...

No. 0 - Davies/Bruckner Linz*, Chailly/RSO Berlin
No. 1 - Barenboim/Berlin*
No. 2 - Chailly/RCO*, Tintner/NSOoI
No. 3 - Nagano/DSO Berlin (1873)*, Vanska/BBC Scottish (1877), Wand/Cologne (1889)
No. 4 - Celibidache/Munich*, Jochum/Berlin, Vanska/Minn
No. 5 - Eichhorn/Bruckner Linz*, Sinopoli/Dresden, Harnoncourt/Vienna
No. 6 - Blomstedt/Leipzig*, Haitink/Dresden, Norrington/Stuttgart
No. 7 - Venzago/Basel SO*, Matacic/Czech, Davies/Bruckner Linz
No. 8 - Wand/Berlin*, Knappertsbusch/Munich
No. 9 - Jochum/Berlin*, Celibidache/Munich,  Knappertsbusch/Berlin,

Surprisingly the 9th was the hardest to for me to decide, all four I mentioned above are first rate, and deserve to be placed high. I would even include Harnoncourt/Vienna, Giulini/Vienna, Jochum/Dresden to that list.

I knew this would happen...in the quest to hear as many, if not all  :P , of the available Bruckner Symphony recordings my list is constantly updating. I finally got around to hearing Celibidache's take on the 9th, and it's earth shatteringly amazing! It might one day be my favorite 9th, but i'll have to warm up to the slower-than-usual tempi of the second mvt Scherzo/Trio, which in no way lacks power or confidence. The two outer movements, however, are breathtaking, and played flawlessly by the Munich Phil. This performance is cosmic.


jlaurson

Quote from: TheGSMoeller on August 01, 2016, 06:36:33 AM
I knew this would happen...in the quest to hear as many, if not all  :P , of the available Bruckner Symphony recordings my list is constantly updating. I finally got around to hearing Celibidache's take on the 9th, and it's earth shatteringly amazing! It might one day be my favorite 9th, but i'll have to warm up to the slower-than-usual tempi of the second mvt Scherzo/Trio, which in no way lacks power or confidence. The two outer movements, however, are breathtaking, and played flawlessly by the Munich Phil. This performance is cosmic.


B9 - Celi - MPhil - EMI/Warner


Am I to understand your new list correctly in that it boots off Wand and and Barenboim in favor of adding Celi and retaining Kna'? If so, will make the necessary adjustments to the tally.  :)

TheGSMoeller

Quote from: jlaurson on August 01, 2016, 07:38:52 AM
Am I to understand your new list correctly in that it boots off Wand and and Barenboim in favor of adding Celi and retaining Kna'? If so, will make the necessary adjustments to the tally.  :)

I think so, I didn't see Celibidache on the list on the tally and really wanted to have this one represented. And I hate knocking the Barenboim and Wand off, both excellent, but I know your rules for this  ;D

jlaurson

Quote from: TheGSMoeller on August 01, 2016, 12:07:41 PM
I think so, I didn't see Celibidache on the list on the tally and really wanted to have this one represented. And I hate knocking the Barenboim and Wand off, both excellent, but I know your rules for this  ;D

I like both BB's 9th and Wand's 9th, so I make an arbitrary exception and they stay; Celi gets added.  ;)

TheGSMoeller

Quote from: jlaurson on August 02, 2016, 02:21:03 AM
I like both BB's 9th and Wand's 9th, so I make an arbitrary exception and they stay; Celi gets added.  ;)

No argument from me.  :)

André

Just listening to a 31.12.1976 Cleveland Orchestra broadcast with William Steinberg conducting the 8th symphony. Ouch !  :o Ouch, ouch, ouch ! ! :o This is mean Bruckner ! Faster and more slashing than most others, including Böhm Zurich or even Steinberg's own Boston or NY broadcasts.

The demons are after him. A great performance.

André

#2775
Copied from the What Are You Listening etc thread:

Quote from: Que on August 10, 2016, 10:10:33 AM
I'm experiencing a small Bruckner renaissance at the moment:

[asin]B000002S1I[/asin]
I quite forgot about the existence of  this recording on my shelves.... And it has been been a long time...judging from the dated issue from 1999. It has been reissued since the at least two times.

Anyway, I am enjoying the performance. Though I'm not sure if the slightly sweet and woolly sound of the New Philharmonia Orvhestra is entirely to my liking - I miss the translucent sound of the BRSO and the Gewandhausorchester Leipzig.... Klemperer doesn't dilly dally and I definitely like that, yet he is surprisingly mellow and rounded.
His approach sounds kind of Mahlerian to me...
A very nice, fascinating performance indeed, but I don't think it me it would represent the ultimate in Bruckner.

Q

Currently listening to the Stein WP recording.

About 5 years ago, I went to a Bruckner 6th concert with a friend, Myung-Wun-Chung conducting the Amsterdam Concertgebouw Orchestra. His comment was that Chung conducted the 6th as if it was Nielsen !

I'll never get to understand his POV (we met only once since - for another Bruckner concert) and my knowledge of Nielsen (let alone any musical connection between Bruckner and Nielsen) is just not on the same level.

I know 3 different Klemperer performances: 2 on EMI (BRSO and Philharmonia Orchestra) and another one, contemporaneous but wildly different, with the Amsterdam Concertgebouw. All three are spectacularly unlike any other.

I prefer the ones that have no negatives (orchestral playing, interpretional indifference or wild idiosyncrasy, crude engineering). From that bunch I choose those that have a strong profile, a positive character (this is A Major after all!) and a personality that stands above the crowd:

- Keilberth with the mighty Berliner Philharmoniker (Teldec). A Siegfried-like interpretation.
- Bongartz, also in Berlin, but east of the Wall (Berlin Classics). Gruff, unyielding, beautifully played.
- Leitner  with the cultured, noble SWF, Baden-Baden orchestra (+ you get the best Hartmann 6 there is on disc)
- Stein WP on Decca. Elegant, powerful but never exaggerated.

I listen with almost equal relish to Kegel RSO Leipzig, the 2 Klemperer EMI, Rögner (Berlin RSO) the other Leitner (in Basel), Jochum in Munich (BRSO), Wand in Cologne and, when in the mood for a gentler, kinder take on the work, Lopez-Cobos' glowing Cincinnati recording (possibly the opposite of Kegel's dark, turbulent, mighty way).

The 6th is possibly the most open of the corpus to a wide spectum of interpretive ways and visions.

Cato

Quote from: André on August 11, 2016, 10:29:00 AM



I listen with almost equal relish to ... Jochum in Munich (BRSO), Wand in Cologne and, when in the mood for a gentler, kinder take on the work, Lopez-Cobos' glowing Cincinnati recording (possibly the opposite of Kegel's dark, turbulent, mighty way).

The 6th is possibly the most open of the corpus to a wide spectum of interpretive ways and visions.

Hello Andre' !!!

Yes!!!  Those three are also all-around faves!  Highly recommended!
"Meet Miss Ruth Sherwood, from Columbus, Ohio, the Middle of the Universe!"

- Brian Aherne introducing Rosalind Russell in  My Sister Eileen (1942)

André

 ;)

Indeed, these are among the 6th's most positive, affirmative versions !

This is one of Bruckner's few 'uncomplicated' works ("0", # 5, # 7 are the others). It does not have textual problems, one of the few that Bruckner did not see as needing amending, re-orchestration, cuts or recomposing (same with # 9 of course, but due to the 'finale' problem, this one will forever be among AB's 'Cinderella' works), and one that has no 'cosmic' type of musical message.

Maybe that's why the spectrum of versions tends to favour strict, no-nonsense interpretations, uncomplicated tempo relationships and a bright, shining orchestral sound. The 6th should bring a wide smile when it ends. The EMI Klemperer art cover is anything but conclusive in that sense. Strange as it may seem, I suspect that a different art cover might bring a more positive response to that particular recording. Of course, that precludes portraying Klemp's face on the art cover - who ever saw Klemperer smiling - or anything other than bored and frowning, for that matter ?

André

A few minutes ago, on another (French-based) web site,  I posted my impressions of a concert recording of Bruckner's symphony no. 1 by Bernard Haitink and the BRSO (Febr. 1974, some 5 years after his Philips recording).

I don't feel like translating everything I wrote, so here goes the short version: if you come across that live concert transcript (check Bersky's Bruckner web site for details), don't miss it. This version has wings like those of a dragonfly. A real beauty (in very good sound). The essence of the work: lightness and agility, anchored deep in the the classical sound of your favourite mitteleuropa saal.