And They're Off! The Democratic Candidates for 2020

[71 dB]

Noting that you're not in America... all that stuff about voting for whoever is the Democratic nominee would clearly be totally lost on you.

I hope everyone here sees I try to be polite. I don't like to be called "totally lost".

As far as I know most Bernie supporters will vote for Biden if he is the nominee, because he is the lesser evil of the two by far. If I was American I had the right to vote I'd do the same. I believe only Bloomberg was a candidate "as bad as Trump" Bernie supporters wouldn't have voted for in the general.

[Madiel]

I don't like to be called "totally lost".

You weren't.

[SimonNZ]

I hope everyone here sees I try to be polite.

You weren't.

[Madiel]

Do you like Biden but hate Trump? Why? They are quite similar.

As far as I know most Bernie supporters will vote for Biden if he is the nominee, because he is the lesser evil of the two by far. If I was American I had the right to vote I'd do the same.

Make up your mind.

[71 dB]

You weren't.

I have tried to be respectful after my latest meltdown and I am sorry if I have offended you. Sure, I have been critical to your posts, but in a polite manner I think.

Make up your mind.

Quite similar doesn't mean identical. $110 is more money than $100. Both look quite similar amount of money compared to say $1.42, but still if given the choice to have either amount money I'd choose $110.

Biden and Trump may have very similar stand on many political issues, but they can be also different on other issues like how much they respect democracy, freedom of press or what kind of judges they pick.

[André]

Bernie Sanders is actually winning, they're just rigging it for Joe Biden. The exit polls don't match (within normal margin of error) with the reported vote counts and this inconsistency surprise surprise benefits Biden.

For example: In Massachusetts exit polls give Biden 28.9 % and Sanders 30.4 %, but the reported vote counts were 33.4 % for Biden and 26.7 % for Sanders. Elizabeth Warren also suffered this way (exit polls 25.2 %, reported 21.6 %). Funny, it's the two most progressive candidates!

This is oligarchy at work: The rich protect their rigged system by rigging the elections so that only "no real change" candidates can win. For example Bernie should have won Texas, but he didn't. I see stories about voter supression in areas strong for Bernie. Voting placing closing early. One guy spend 7 hours voting. Ridiculous! The US is so pathetic even for a banana republic when it comes to having democratic elections and that's why American won't have the nice things other countries have from clean tap water to single payer healthcare to paid sick leave by law to tuition free education to...

Source: TDMS RESEARCH

You should stop reading polls. Do you have any idea what exit polls really are? Chech the wiki article, it even has a paragraph about why they can't be reliable - the 'discrepancies' you mention. It's complotists like you who are dangerous to democracy.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exit_poll#Problems.

[André]

Hot from the presses !


https://www.freep.com/story/news/politics/elections/2020/03/09/polls-joe-biden-holds-lead-over-bernie-sanders-michigan-primaries/4994142002/

Here's why polls are poor indicators of election results. Read the article to the end. The real story starts a few paragraphs down, after the first figure/graph.

Like someone said, « it's not over 'till it's over ».

[Florestan]

Hot from the presses !


https://www.freep.com/story/news/politics/elections/2020/03/09/polls-joe-biden-holds-lead-over-bernie-sanders-michigan-primaries/4994142002/

Here's why polls are poor indicators of election results. Read the article to the end. The real story starts a few paragraphs down, after the first figure/graph.

Like someone said, « it's not over 'till it's over ».

There's no graph showing, at least not on my laptop. Anyway, you gotta love the name of this guy, Bernie Porn. 

[Karl Henning]

... I have the opinions I have.

The fact that your opinions are other than mine is not in the least a problem.

I believe I am able to think for myself and I even think questioning things is one of my rare strengths.

Perhaps you are mistaken.

I don't know what I should do or say to make you have a more positive opinion about me.

If you understood that a meme by "educatebootlickers.com" is wildly biased agitprop for which you appear to mistake equable reason (an act which is at odds ewith your belief, above), and if you stopped spamming this thread with the agitprop (which shows respect for others), it might be a start.

Then there is, if you came to see the sense of what JBS has ben patient to explain to you . . . .

[Karl Henning]

You should stop reading polls. Do you have any idea what exit polls really are? Chech the wiki article, it even has a paragraph about why they can't be reliable - the 'discrepancies' you mention. It's complotists like you who are dangerous to democracy.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exit_poll#Problems.

Actual voters voting is not "rigging an election"  It is the election.

[drogulus]

Why anyone outside the top 1 % "likes" Amy Klobuchar is beyond me and others on the left. What's the appeal? What did she offer to people? Normalcy and decorum after Trump? Nice, but Americans are struggling and need much more than that.

     In the U.S. there are peculiarities that are not obvious unless you live here. To be in the center here means more about how you are willing to identify than what policies you favor. Many people are like me in that they don't judge policies the same way as they do political alignments.

     The centrist appeal is based not only on protective coloration but on a judgment that desired policy is more likely to get enacted by someone more likely to get elected. That's part, and the other part is an appreciation of the difference between attaching identities to people and to programs.

[JBS]

Bernie Sanders is actually winning, they're just rigging it for Joe Biden. The exit polls don't match (within normal margin of error) with the reported vote counts and this inconsistency surprise surprise benefits Biden.

For example: In Massachusetts exit polls give Biden 28.9 % and Sanders 30.4 %, but the reported vote counts were 33.4 % for Biden and 26.7 % for Sanders. Elizabeth Warren also suffered this way (exit polls 25.2 %, reported 21.6 %). Funny, it's the two most progressive candidates!

This is oligarchy at work: The rich protect their rigged system by rigging the elections so that only "no real change" candidates can win. For example Bernie should have won Texas, but he didn't. I see stories about voter supression in areas strong for Bernie. Voting placing closing early. One guy spend 7 hours voting. Ridiculous! The US is so pathetic even for a banana republic when it comes to having democratic elections and that's why American won't have the nice things other countries have from clean tap water to single payer healthcare to paid sick leave by law to tuition free education to...

Source: TDMS RESEARCH

If you actually paid attention to the news, you would have learned that the voter suppression in Texas is being done by the GOP, which dominates the legislature and holds the governorship there, for the sake of suppressing Democratic votes--specifically Latino and black voters.  Maybe this benefits Biden, but the suppression is not done by the DNC and not meant to help him.  It's being done to hurt whoever the Democratic nominee might be come November.,

[JBS]

Actual voters voting is not "rigging an election"  It is the election.

Speaking of voting, Florida's early voting began yesterday.  I voted for Biden just now.   The actual Democrat (as opposed to Sanders, who is a Democrat only for the sake of running for the Democratic nomination).

[drogulus]

     I do wonder how one separates legitimate choice to prefer someone other than Sanders from the evil cabal to prefer someone other than Sanders. I'm unconvinced by a proposition which deems the former as proof of the latter.

     If I prefer centrist tools to get SomethingCare for All it's not me wanting a centrist program, it's me wanting to elect someone who'll advance the ball. What amounts to advancing the ball is partly settled (everyone will be covered, we no longer accept the proposition that health care provision involves a hunt for the undeserving).

[Karl Henning]

     I do wonder how one separates legitimate choice to prefer someone other than Sanders from the evil cabal to prefer someone other than Sanders.

You do like leaving catnip for Poju, though.

[drogulus]

You do like leaving catnip for Poju, though.

     He's easy to talk to.

[Karl Henning]

What the media missed about Joe Biden's electability
Political devotees don't like Joe Biden, but voters do. And there's a reason for that

[Karl Henning]

What the media missed about Joe Biden's electability
Political devotees don't like Joe Biden, but voters do. And there's a reason for that

Biden's speech patterns offend the media. Voters don't really care.

Biden has lost a step rhetorically. In debates, his answers have, to put it gently, a meandering quality. He loses his place, says the wrong thing, mixes up words, free associates. Without engaging the question of whether this reflects a lifelong stutter or a more worrying decline, the simple fact is that Biden performs worst on the metric that media professionals judge most harshly, and most confidently: clarity of communication.

Biden has lost a step rhetorically. In debates, his answers have, to put it gently, a meandering quality. He loses his place, says the wrong thing, mixes up words, free associates. Without engaging the question of whether this reflects a lifelong stutter or a more worrying decline, the simple fact is that Biden performs worst on the metric that media professionals judge most harshly, and most confidently: clarity of communication.

But over and over again, we've seen that voters just don't care that much about malapropisms and meandering rhetorical styles. Books — yes, plural! — were published mocking George W. Bush's garbled sentences. And Bush looks like Cicero compared to Donald Trump's word salad.

[drogulus]

Biden's speech patterns offend the media. Voters don't really care.

Biden has lost a step rhetorically. In debates, his answers have, to put it gently, a meandering quality. He loses his place, says the wrong thing, mixes up words, free associates. Without engaging the question of whether this reflects a lifelong stutter or a more worrying decline, the simple fact is that Biden performs worst on the metric that media professionals judge most harshly, and most confidently: clarity of communication.

Biden has lost a step rhetorically. In debates, his answers have, to put it gently, a meandering quality. He loses his place, says the wrong thing, mixes up words, free associates. Without engaging the question of whether this reflects a lifelong stutter or a more worrying decline, the simple fact is that Biden performs worst on the metric that media professionals judge most harshly, and most confidently: clarity of communication.

But over and over again, we've seen that voters just don't care that much about malapropisms and meandering rhetorical styles. Books — yes, plural! — were published mocking George W. Bush's garbled sentences. And Bush looks like Cicero compared to Donald Trump's word salad.

     I think that's spot on. The political pundits for Dems have a narrow center-left policy preference window and want lots of polish in the presentation. Both the candidates are punished for infractions that mean very little to voters.

     What Bernie Sanders Gets Right About the Media

     If what conservatives say is true about liberal bias in the media, it should follow biased liberals would turn on Sanders. It is, they do.

The distance between Mr. Sanders's supporters and media executives could be felt with particular intensity in the halls of MSNBC last week. After Chris Matthews, the beloved embodiment of MSNBC's establishmentarian centrism, compared Mr. Sanders's campaign to the Nazi invasion of France, Mr. Sanders's supporters began a drumbeat of criticism that helped lead to Mr. Matthews' ouster. When Joe Biden — the Chris Matthews of politics — emerged as the Democratic front-runner on Super Tuesday, the on-air relief at MSNBC was palpable.

    I figure I read Biden's policy vacuity the same as most voters do. Biden will sign bills Dems pass.

[Karl Henning]

     What Bernie Sanders Gets Right About the Media

     If what conservatives say is true about liberal bias in the media, it should follow biased liberals would turn on Sanders. It is, they do.

The distance between Mr. Sanders's supporters and media executives could be felt with particular intensity in the halls of MSNBC last week. After Chris Matthews, the beloved embodiment of MSNBC's establishmentarian centrism, compared Mr. Sanders's campaign to the Nazi invasion of France, Mr. Sanders's supporters began a drumbeat of criticism that helped lead to Mr. Matthews' ouster. When Joe Biden — the Chris Matthews of politics — emerged as the Democratic front-runner on Super Tuesday, the on-air relief at MSNBC was palpable.

    I figure I read Biden's policy vacuity the same as most voters do. Biden will sign bills Dems pass.

Interesting piece!