And They're Off! The Democratic Candidates for 2020

[Todd]

As I said before, if you were an actual conservative, you would be opposed to Trump. As it is, you are just a standard right winger spouting the standard right wing memes.

One of the things I enjoy about the internet more broadly - and it certainly extends beyond this forum - is how various people have convinced themselves that they know what an actual conservative is, just like they know what a true Scotsman would do.

[FelixSkodi]

One of the things I enjoy about the internet more broadly - and it certainly extends beyond this forum - is how various people have convinced themselves that they know what an actual conservative is, just like they know what a true Scotsman would do.

I would say this was most evident in the approaches of the different subreddits of the two leading Democratic candidates. The air of expectation from the Sanders camp was palpable and unmeasured. Biden's camp has been much more steady, even under rather rabid attack from the so-called progressives. I think Biden has handled himself as admirable as can be expected, and I am fairly excited to see Trump v Biden on the debate stage.

[JBS]

One of the things I enjoy about the internet more broadly - and it certainly extends beyond this forum - is how various people have convinced themselves that they know what an actual conservative is, just like they know what a true Scotsman would do.

Well, I may not be an actual conservative but I am certainly one of the most conservative members here at GMG.

But I think there are two strains to the American conservative movement.  Thanks to Trumpism, they have split.  There is a socially conservative nationalist version, now dominant in the GOP,  which is best called the Right, and libertarian style conservatism, which actually believes in all the stuff the Tea Party said it was for.

[Todd]

Well, I may not be an actual conservative but I am certainly one of the most conservative members here at GMG.

But I think there are two strains to the American conservative movement.  Thanks to Trumpism, they have split.  There is a socially conservative nationalist version, now dominant in the GOP,  which is best called the Right, and libertarian style conservatism, which actually believes in all the stuff the Tea Party said it was for.

There are more than two variants of US conservatism.

[JBS]

There are more than two variants of US conservatism.

If you will, describe them please. (That's a serious request.)

[Herman]

I I am fairly excited to see Trump v Biden on the debate stage.

what makes you think such a debate will occur?

even the election happening Nov 3 is a question.

[steve ridgway]

I have my opinions about American politics whether it matters or not. Very rarely do I feel my opinions matter so this is nothing new to me. That's why I am so bitter and frustrated. How am I supposed to have a fulfilling life if nothing I do or say matters? What kind of life is that?

It is a very good question. I think an important lesson for me may be in learning what to ignore.

[FelixSkodi]

what makes you think such a debate will occur?

even the election happening Nov 3 is a question.

The debate I surmise, as to the other I point to the US Electoral Commission.

[Florestan]

How am I supposed to have a fulfilling life if nothing I do or say matters? What kind of life is that?

Thw keyword here is life and the question is, matter to whom? I'm sure there are lots of things you say and do that really matter, for people like your family or your co-workers, ie people you interact with in person and who are known to you by name and face.

You've been told this multiple times but it's well worth repeating: you should concentrate on doing only what truly gives you pleasure and a sense of self-esteem. Posting on GMG political threads does obviously not qualify and you should avoid it like the plague.

[71 dB]

Thw keyword here is life and the question is, matter to whom? I'm sure there are lots of things you say and do that really matter, for people like your family or your co-workers, ie people you interact with in person and who are known to you by name and face.

You've been told this multiple times but it's well worth repeating: you should concentrate on doing only what truly gives you pleasure and a sense of self-esteem. Posting on GMG political threads does obviously not qualify and you should avoid it like the plague.

Well, I hope what I say or do matters to someone. Hard to tell to what extent that's true. I have always felt I have my unique wavelength and it's really difficult to connect with other people. I'm not into sports. My taste in music and movies is eclectic. I am amused how TYR escaped from his cage in Fort Lauderdale while my sister is disgusted by the fact that some people keep foxes as pets. My experiences concerning headphone crossfeed in head-fi forum were bitter and frustrating beyond comprehension, 100 times worse than what it is here with politics! Sound engineers telling me excessive stereo separation doesn't matter! WTF? That forum made me insanely angry and I don't even go there anymore!  It was an epic mistake to register there. When I had job it was surprisingly hard to connect with co-workers (they didn't even know what fractals are when for me knowing the Mandelbrot set is common knowledge!) and I felt like being left out. That's how it is when you are born a weirdo instead of a normy. Don't tell me it's all my own fault. Normies don't know how hard it is for us weirdos when most people are like aliens who don't understand you!

I can understand minor political disagreements, but this is crazy: My political opinions are not that outlandish! It's not outlandish to ask everyone has healthcare in the richest country in the world! It's not outlandish to ask you can pay your bills if you work full time (living wage). It's not outlandish to ask for "free" education in a time when almost any well paying job requires higher education! These are normal stuff that other countries do and I am called a crazy socialist? WTF? DENMARK IS NOT SOCIALIST!!!!!! So check your own opinions! Think about why you have them? Is it because they make sense or is it because you have listened to corporate media all your life telling you it's all pie in the sky when you try to improve things for regular people. How people here don't see the corporate propaganda is beyond me. It's amazing!

Maybe it's people like Todd who should avoid politics? Why is it me who should shut up? It's unfair!

[71 dB]

I do not post about internal European politics, nor do I post about the machinations of MEPs or Eurocrats.  I do post about how the EU should be destroyed - or at least weakened to the point where it is even more worthless than the UN - because that would be geopolitically advantageous to the US in the medium term and long run.

What is your logic behind this? Doesn't weak Europe mean Russia has more geopolitical power which hardly is good for the US? In fact Russia tries to weaken Europe all the time. The US made Europe it's strong ally after WWII and I'd say it's good for both the US and Europe to keep it that way.

[steve ridgway]

Well, I hope what I say or do matters to someone.

It matters to me, your suffering is helping me clarify my own ideas.

[Karl Henning]

Well, I hope what I say or do matters to someone.

I am sure it does.

To focus a bit more, I am afraid that, because of your inability to listen to reason on this topic, what you say about U.S. politics does not matter to anyone, and that is why Andrei has soundly you advised you that participating in American political threads is de rigueur toxic for you.

[71 dB]

One of the things I enjoy about the internet more broadly - and it certainly extends beyond this forum - is how various people have convinced themselves that they know what an actual conservative is, just like they know what a true Scotsman would do.

I don't claim to know what conservatives are. These people make so little sense it's hard to grasp what goes on in their heads. I think many conservatives know deep inside they have been indoctrinated into a silly crappy ideology, but they are afraid to let go their dumb beliefs and try hard to convince themselves their ideology is great.

I'm not saying there's nothing good about conservatism. Paleoconservatism has some positive aspects to it for example and appreciating classical music is some sort of good conservatism itself, but when you or Ben Shapiro open your mouths it's not great. 

[Florestan]

Why is it me who should shut up?

Because you are the only one whose participation here is obviously a source of stress, frustration, anger and resentment, and you should immediately discontinue whatever behaviour causes, or enhances, your stress, frustration, anger and resentment.

And it's not a question of shutting up at all, rather of knowing your own interest and acting for your own good.

[71 dB]

I am sure it does.

To focus a bit more, I am afraid that, because of your inability to listen to reason on this topic, what you say about U.S. politics does not matter to anyone, and that is why Andrei has soundly you advised you that participating in American political threads is de rigueur toxic for you.

What is this reason I am not listening to? I am quite reasonable person even if I behave like a crazy person. In fact I feel other people here are those not listening to reason. For example: As the richest country in the world the US can easily implement the progressive ideas Bernie Sanders and other on the left are proposing, but the reason they are not implemented is because the US is an oligarchy and the status quo rigged system benefits the top 1 % while screwing up regular people. These left wing ideas would benefit almost all Americans and the only reason why these ideas are not supported by almost all Americans (however, they are usually supported by the majority of Americans) is because the corporate media smears and lies about them: They keep telling fearmongering how medicare for all would cost 32 trillion over ten years, but never adding that the current system will cost much more, perhaps 50 trillion over ten year. They keep asking how are we going to pay for medicare for all when the correct question is how are American's going to pay for the current system. They fearmonger how medicare for all takes away people's private insurances, when people don't like their insurances. People like their doctors. They keep fearmongering how medicare for all takes away choice, when the choice has been the choice of the mafia that robs your money while medicare for all would extend your choice of care providers (doctors) by eliminating networks: You can go to ANY doctor. Thet fearmonger about how medicare for all increases your taxes, but conveniently keep silent about how most Americans would save money, because their public taxes would go up less than what they'd save not paying private taxes (premiums, co-pays and deductibles).

Haven't you Karl seen how corporate media NEVER asks how are we going to pay for it when it's about increasing military budget, subsidies for big corporations or tax cuts for the rich? Haven't you seen how this questions appear instantly when it is about helping REGULAR people? Maybe people really become blind to this bias when they are exposed to it for decades, but I come from a country were this doesn't happen, at least nearly in this scale and I see it from a mile away! That's why I am so surprised you don't see it.

I don't know if I am myself blind to something, but if that's the case you need to explain it to my VERY thoroughy so I get it. All I say it if reason is not listened to here, I am not the only one not listening...

[71 dB]

What does Kyle Kulinski say about foreign policy?  He will say, you will obey.

Well Kyle Kulinski is not for weakening Europe and he (like all lefties) wants to end wars because spending billions of tax payer money to bomb brown people in the middle east isn't wise when you should for example use money to fix the crumbling infrastructure in the US including fixing the water crisis in Flint, Michigan. Kyle Kulinski is against American exceptionalism. He thinks the US has the same rights every other country has.

I don't "obey" Kyle Kulinski. Most of the time I agree with him. Example of something I disagree with Kyle Kulinski: He does not see the value of modern abstract art. I do. However he recognises that some people do see the value of modern art and is fine with that.

Are you obeying someone? John Bolton?

[Florestan]

I am quite reasonable person even if I behave like a crazy person.

[...]]

if reason is not listened to here, I am not the only one not listening...

Lord, have mercy on us!

[ritter]

"Erbarmen! Erbarmen! Du Allerbarmer! Ach, Erbarmen!"

[Karl Henning]

Lord, have mercy on us!

"Erbarmen! Erbarmen! Du Allerbarmer! Ach, Erbarmen!"

Having eyes, he does not see.
Having ears, he does not hear.