Rachmaninoff Orchestral & Favorite Symphony Cycles

[Roasted Swan]

Sanderling/Philharmonia on the Apex series uses almost 27 minutes for the 1st movement of the 2nd Symphony, most recordings up to 10 minutes less. Gergiev/LSO close to 23 minutes.

I don't know the Sanderling recording but that will (almost certainly) be because he takes the exposition repeat which a lot of conductors don't.  Rach 2 is just about the last big symphony to be written with this kind of optional repeat.  Personally, if the composer wrote it, I think you should observe it.

On a tangent - fairly recently I was surprised and impressed by this Rach 3;



available in various incarnations but very exciting and Mackerras getting the RLPO strings to use portamenti (slides between notes) to gloriously Romantic effect......

[vandermolen]

I don't know the Sanderling recording but that will (almost certainly) be because he takes the exposition repeat which a lot of conductors don't.  Rach 2 is just about the last big symphony to be written with this kind of optional repeat.  Personally, if the composer wrote it, I think you should observe it.

On a tangent - fairly recently I was surprised and impressed by this Rach 3;



available in various incarnations but very exciting and Mackerras getting the RLPO strings to use portamenti (slides between notes) to gloriously Romantic effect......

Very much agree about Mackerras - who was a fine conductor.

[DavidW]

This thread inspired me to listen to the Gergiev cycle, I'm not done yet with it but some of his tempo choices are not my favorite.  Too slow or too fast, never just right.  I then listened to the Litton 2nd on BIS.  Good, and I like it better than Gergiev, but not great.

My favorite second is Previn, and my favorite third is Stokowski.  I don't have a favorite first but I really like the symphony.

[Daverz]

This thread inspired me to listen to the Gergiev cycle, I'm not done yet with it but some of his tempo choices are not my favorite.  Too slow or too fast, never just right.  I then listened to the Litton 2nd on BIS.  Good, and I like it better than Gergiev, but not great.

My favorite second is Previn, .

Previn recorded it 3 times (RCA (with cuts), EMI and Telarc).

[Brian]

Previn recorded it 3 times (RCA (with cuts), EMI and Telarc).

Previn Telarc is the one I grew up with, but Previn EMI is my favorite now for being just as rich and a tiny bit faster. The cut versions are unacceptable to me.

[DavidW]

Previn recorded it 3 times (RCA (with cuts), EMI and Telarc).

Didn't know that.  EMI is the only one I listen to.

[SonicMan46]

Well, TTT after 4 years - my only Rach symphony set is the Ashkenazy shown below which I enjoy - but just listened to the Hurwitz review at the bottom and he raved about Leonard Slatkin with the Detroit Symphony - now streaming on Spotify with headphones - the physical discs seem available at more than I want to pay, however, Prestomusic has an offer for the FLAC/WAV DL at $20 USD - tempted but maybe streaming is fine?  Anyone heard these Slatkin recordings?  Dave

 

[JBS]

Well, TTT after 4 years - my only Rach symphony set is the Ashkenazy shown below which I enjoy - but just listened to the Hurwitz review at the bottom and he raved about Leonard Slatkin with the Detroit Symphony - now streaming on Spotify with headphones - the physical discs seem available at more than I want to pay, however, Prestomusic has an offer for the FLAC/WAV DL at $20 USD - tempted but maybe streaming is fine?  Anyone heard these Slatkin recordings?  Dave

 

Slatkin is fine, but I prefer Previn.
If you do want the Slatkin, the original "Vox Box" is available from Amazon for under $25

[Roasted Swan]

Slatkin is fine, but I prefer Previn.
If you do want the Slatkin, the original "Vox Box" is available from Amazon for under $25

Hurwitz has a disproportionate regard for Slatkin.  He's good, often more than good but his Rachmaninov is simply not the most distinguished, most individual there is.  In all round terms Ashkenazy/Concertgebouw is hard to beat - and available these days dirt cheap.  Previn is let down by a very weak Symphony 1 but there are many fine versions - individual and sets.  I still love the fire and brimstone of the old Soviet sets by the likes of Svetlanov or Rozhdestvensky.  Folk got very excited by Petrenko in Liverpool but I wasn't that fussed

My favourite three would be;

No.1 Svetlanov/USSR SO
No.2 Rozhdestvensky/LSO
No.3 Mackerras/RLPO (coupled with a great Symphonic Dances)

For a set (different orchestras but same conductor) I like Walter Weller on Decca if not the Ashkenazy...
PS.  Litton on Virgin with the RPO was rather good too I thought......

[vandermolen]

Hurwitz has a disproportionate regard for Slatkin.  He's good, often more than good but his Rachmaninov is simply not the most distinguished, most individual there is.  In all round terms Ashkenazy/Concertgebouw is hard to beat - and available these days dirt cheap.  Previn is let down by a very weak Symphony 1 but there are many fine versions - individual and sets.  I still love the fire and brimstone of the old Soviet sets by the likes of Svetlanov or Rozhdestvensky.  Folk got very excited by Petrenko in Liverpool but I wasn't that fussed

My favourite three would be;

No.1 Svetlanov/USSR SO
No.2 Rozhdestvensky/LSO
No.3 Mackerras/RLPO (coupled with a great Symphonic Dances)

For a set (different orchestras but same conductor) I like Walter Weller on Decca if not the Ashkenazy...
PS.  Litton on Virgin with the RPO was rather good too I thought......

Hurwitz is very biased towards American conductors, especially Slatkin (whom I admire). He can be quite dismissive of 'Sir Adrian Boult' etc.

[JBS]

Hurwitz is very biased towards American conductors, especially Slatkin (whom I admire). He can be quite dismissive of 'Sir Adrian Boult' etc.

The anti-Gramophone effect?

[SonicMan46]

Thanks All for the comments on Slatkin - BTW, the Vox box is the the St. Louis Symphony - the Naxos features the Detroit recordings - Jerry Dubins and Fanfare (attachment) have the same sentiments, i.e. NOT the stellar performance promoted by Hurwitz - I listened to about half of the 3-disc set on Spotify this afternoon and was not overwhelmed - my Ashkenazy box will do just fine.  Dave

[lordlance]

Hurwitz is very biased towards American conductors, especially Slatkin (whom I admire). He can be quite dismissive of 'Sir Adrian Boult' etc.

To be fair Boult (probably again the effect of recording technology catching up rather late - same fate that befell Walter and Klemperer) sounds rather undistinguished and even somewhat dull in all the music I've heard of him. A bit of a shame. Of course I don't really listen to much British orchestral music so perhaps he remained vital in that repertoire till the end. 

[Der lächelnde Schatten]

Hurwitz is very biased towards American conductors, especially Slatkin (whom I admire). He can be quite dismissive of 'Sir Adrian Boult' etc.

He is good friends with Slatkin, so that's why he always speaks so highly of him.

[DavidW]

@SonicMan46 My favorites are Previn for the 2nd and Stokowski for the 3rd. Despite loving it, there is another great 3rd that I'm sad I can't quite put my finger on. As for the 1st and the symphonic poems, you already have the box for that.

Everything that Ormandy and Reiner did is worth listening to.

If you wanted something modern, I like Nézet-Séguin, who is atmospheric in the symphonies and driven in the concertos (that is with Trifonov).

[SonicMan46]

@SonicMan46 My favorites are Previn for the 2nd and Stokowski for the 3rd. Despite loving it, there is another great 3rd that I'm sad I can't quite put my finger on. As for the 1st and the symphonic poems, you already have the box for that.

Everything that Ormandy and Reiner did is worth listening to.

If you wanted something modern, I like Nézet-Séguin, who is atmospheric in the symphonies and driven in the concertos (that is with Trifonov).

Thanks David - the Ashkenazy performance of the first is considered one of the best, so getting another version of Nos. 2 & 3 would be nice - assume these are not 'live' performances w/ audience distractions?  Thanks again - Dave

[DavidW]

Thanks David - the Ashkenazy performance of the first is considered one of the best, so getting another version of Nos. 2 & 3 would be nice - assume these are not 'live' performances w/ audience distractions?  Thanks again - Dave

The first symphony and the concertos are live. I didn't recall a symphony of coughs in any of the recordings, but if you have Spotify, you can listen for yourself.

[Daverz]

Hurwitz is very biased towards American conductors, especially Slatkin (whom I admire). He can be quite dismissive of 'Sir Adrian Boult' etc.

I don't think it's fair to say Hurwitz is dismissive of Boult.  Here's the description of his "Top 10 Boult recordings" video:

English conductor Adrian Boult wasn't just a passionately devoted advocate of 20th-century British music; he was one of the first conductors whose reputation did not depend on his conducting of the German standard  repertoire. In this preview of the ClassicsToday.com survey of his ten greatest recordings (ad free, with sound  samples), we explore his remarkable career in some detail.

He's also covered a lot of Boult's Decca, EMI and Lyrita recordings in separate videos.  If not much non-British repertoire is covered, I think that's more the fault of the record labels Boult worked with.

https://www.youtube.com/@DavesClassicalGuide/search?query=boult

[vandermolen]

I don't think it's fair to say Hurwitz is dismissive of Boult.  Here's the description of his "Top 10 Boult recordings" video:

He's also covered a lot of Boult's Decca, EMI and Lyrita recordings in separate videos.  If not much non-British repertoire is covered, I think that's more the fault of the record labels Boult worked with.

https://www.youtube.com/@DavesClassicalGuide/search?query=boult

Fair enough - ok thanks 

[vandermolen]

He is good friends with Slatkin, so that's why he always speaks so highly of him.

Interesting to know. I do like many Slatkin recordings. (Shostakovich, Bernstein, Rachmaninov etc)