Elgar's Hillside

[Mirror Image]

I'm glad you have been enjoying The Kingdom MI. Yes, you would enjoy The Apostles too for sure. 

Excellent. I'm currently listening to The Kingdom for the second time and it just gets better and better. I just love this composer's music so much. Would you say that Elgar is your absolute favorite composer, 71 dB?

[71 dB]

Excellent. I'm currently listening to The Kingdom for the second time and it just gets better and better. I just love this composer's music so much. Would you say that Elgar is your absolute favorite composer, 71 dB?

Elgar's music tends to reveal it's subtleties slowly. I'm really glad his music is having the effect on you it has on us elgarians. 

Yes, Elgar is my "absolute" favorite composer MI, but J. S. Bach in VERY close.

How many works by Elgar have you heard MI?

[Mirror Image]

Elgar's music tends to reveal it's subtleties slowly. I'm really glad his music is having the effect on you it has on us elgarians. 

Yes, Elgar is my "absolute" favorite composer MI, but J. S. Bach in VERY close.

How many works by Elgar have you heard MI?

This is great to hear, 71 dB. How many Elgar works have I heard? Hmmm...I'll have to get back to you on this one. I really should, like Brian does, keep a journal of what I've heard by this and that composer, but, since I don't, I'll have to think about it.

[Mirror Image]

Okay, here goes nothing, of the orchestral/concertante works, I'm pretty sure I've heard almost everything:

Symphonies Nos. 1 & 2
Falstaff
In the South (Alassio)
Sospiri
Enigma Variations
Elegy
Serenade for Strings
Cockaigne Overture (In London Town)
Pomp & Circumstance Marches Nos. 1-5
The Sanguine Fan
Polonia
Carillion
Une voix dans le désert
Sursum Corda
Rosemary
Carissima
Le drapeau belge
Froissart Overture
May Song
Three Bavarian Dances
Chanson de Matin
Chanson de Nuit
Salut d'amour
Three Charateristic Pieces
Minuet
Introduction & Allegro
Severn Suite
Nursery Suite
The Wand of Youth Suites 1 & 2
The Starlight Express Suite
King Arthur Suite
The Crown of India Suite
Dream Children
Romance for Bassoon and Orchestra
Cello Concerto
Violin Concerto

Works with vocal soloists and/or chorus w/ orchestra I've heard -

Sea Pictures
The Dream of Gerontius
The Apostles
The Kingdom
Coronation Ode
The Spirit of England
The Black Knight
The Music Makers
The Starlight Express
From the Bavarian Highlands

The chamber works I've heard -

String Quartet
Violin Sonata
Piano Quintet

I think that about covers it.

[71 dB]

How many Elgar works have I heard? Hmmm...

Well, your list of Elgar works you have heard is longer than I expected (based on the fact that you just got into The Kingdom).

The Apostles is definitely something you should listen to.

It seems you haven't heard Elgar's 3rd Symphony elaborated by Anthony Payne? I don't rate it as high as the first 2 symphonies, but it is a great symphony nevertheless. Both Andrew Davies on NMC and Paul Daniel on Naxos are very good performances but I haven't heard others.

The Light of Life, Op. 29 is missing too. If Elgar wrote a lesser oratorio, this is it, but it's a nice work anyway.

Caractacus, Op. 35 is my favorite of Elgar's cantatas composed before 1900. Then comes (Scenes from the Saga of) King Olaf, Op. 30 These are better works than the The Black Knight, which really is lesser Elgar imo.

You have Elgar's chamber music covered. Elgar is not known for solo piano music but there's no reason to avoid it. Solo piano version of Enigma Variations sounds cool and Concert Allegro Op. 41 is great.

Then there's of course the organ works, part-songs, violin miniatures etc. Elgar wrote tons of short, obscure small works. Even I haven't heard ALL of them. 

[Mirror Image]

Well, your list of Elgar works you have heard is longer than I expected (based on the fact that you just got into The Kingdom).

The Apostles is definitely something you should listen to.

It seems you haven't heard Elgar's 3rd Symphony elaborated by Anthony Payne? I don't rate it as high as the first 2 symphonies, but it is a great symphony nevertheless. Both Andrew Davies on NMC and Paul Daniel on Naxos are very good performances but I haven't heard others.

The Light of Life, Op. 29 is missing too. If Elgar wrote a lesser oratorio, this is it, but it's a nice work anyway.

Caractacus, Op. 35 is my favorite of Elgar's cantatas composed before 1900. Then comes (Scenes from the Saga of) King Olaf, Op. 30 These are better works than the The Black Knight, which really is lesser Elgar imo.

You have Elgar's chamber music covered. Elgar is not known for solo piano music but there's no reason to avoid it. Solo piano version of Enigma Variations sounds cool and Concert Allegro Op. 41 is great.

Then there's of course the organ works, part-songs, violin miniatures etc. Elgar wrote tons of short, obscure small works. Even I haven't heard ALL of them. 

Well, usually with me, I get into a composer's orchestral works and then work my through their oeuvre. Yes, Caractacus and The Light of Life are on my wish list of works to explore after The Apostles. I'll probably give Symphony No. 3 a spin sometime (I have Colin Davis' LSO Live performance), but I've been hesitant with it for the fact that it wasn't officially completed by Elgar and only left behind in sketches. King Olaf is another one on my list to explore.

Yes, I'll definitely listen to The Apostles whenever my Elder/Halle recording arrives. I own Boult's performance of it, but I've been quite dissatisfied with his Elgar performances. Boult's later performances of Elgar remain soulless to my ears, but I'm sure many other people like Boult in Elgar.

Thanks for your suggestions on where to go next.

[71 dB]

Well, usually with me, I get into a composer's orchestral works and then work my through their oeuvre.

I see. I usually try to sample different kind of works in the beginning when exploring a new composer.

Yes, Caractacus and The Light of Life are on my wish list of works to explore after The Apostles. I'll probably give Symphony No. 3 a spin sometime (I have Colin Davis' LSO Live performance), but I've been hesitant with it for the fact that it wasn't officially completed by Elgar and only left behind in sketches. King Olaf is another one on my list to explore.

Anthony Payne did well with the 3rd Symphony. He did the elaboration "paynestakingly".  There are moments here and there that doesn't feel 100 % Elgar, but most of the work sounds very much Elgar. The sympnony contains very beautiful music, that's why Anthony Payne wanted to elaborate Elgar's sketches, so people could hear Elgar's last musical ideas. The second movement (Scherzo) of the symphony is my favorite (especially in the Andrew David/BBC SO performance). Who cares who started and who finished it when music is that good?

I have Elgar's Piano Concerto "realised for performance" by Robert Walker and I have to say that's a kind of mess purists may want to stay away, but the 3rd symphony is too good to ignore. It's almost like ignoring Mozart's Requiem for being completed by Süssmayr.

Yes, I'll definitely listen to The Apostles whenever my Elder/Halle recording arrives. I own Boult's performance of it, but I've been quite dissatisfied with his Elgar performances. Boult's later performances of Elgar remain soulless to my ears, but I'm sure many other people like Boult in Elgar.

Oh, to me Boult is great with Elgar. The only problem I have is the sound. I did listen to Boult's The Kingdom inspired by your enthusiam and it was the sound that irritated me. Noise and even strong harmonic distortion at places! That's why I want to hear Elder's sonically clean performances.

Thanks for your suggestions on where to go next.

You are welcome. Thanks for the interesting conversation!

[TheGSMoeller]

Was considering a poll, but I dont want to make this a contest...

Who is your favorite(s) 1-2 punch with Elgar's recorded symphonies?

Sinopoli's 2nd with Philharmonia is special, very dramatic, very operatic. I've just recently been accepting his recording of the 1st as equally fantastic. I was not originally sold on Sinopoli's 1st however, as I found the 1st and 2nd symphonies to have such contrasting musical cores. Speaking of contrast, how about Solti? Perhaps Solti's tempi are more accurate with Elgar's original ideas, and it can be a most jarring experience if you're used to Sinopoli or Tate's recordings. But Solti's performances are lightning infused, sharp but without shying away from the emotional draw. I've really come to appreciate Elder's duo with Halle, especially the 2nd which belongs along side any. Barbirolli/Phil is also great. Slatkin has a dynamite 1st, but a 2nd that fizzles, Tate is the opposite. There are more I haven't mentioned that deserve to be...

If I had to pick one (and this is always subject to change, as with any 'favorite' topic), I would go with Sinopoli. He seems to pull all the right strings for me when it comes to Elgar's symphonies. And the Philharmonia plays perfectly presented in a very rich and full DG sound.


Please respond, criticize, or praise. Either way I would love to hear (read) others thoughts. Thanks! 

[Sergeant Rock]

Was considering a poll, but I dont want to make this a contest...

Who is your favorite(s) 1-2 punch with Elgar's recorded symphonies? [

I have Solti, Sinopoli, Slatkin, C. Davs, A. Davis, Boult, Tate and Barbirolli. (Of the other conductors who have recorded both symphonies I only have Elder 1, Barenboim 1, Previn 1, Thomson 1, Haitink 2 and none of Handley, the Penguin's favorite).

Sinopoli's 2nd with Philharmonia is special, very dramatic, very operatic. I've just recently been accepting his recording of the 1st as equally fantastic. I was not originally sold on Sinopoli's

My feelings exactly (surprise  ). Loved Sinopoli's Second from my first hearing but was initially disappointed with his First. I was expecting a radical interpretation (like his Second) but found it rather ordinary. But the last couple of times I've listened to it, it has grown on me (losing the preconception has opened my ears, I suppose).

If I had to pick one (and this is always subject to change, as with any 'favorite' topic), I would go with Sinopoli. He seems to pull all the right strings for me when it comes to Elgar's symphonies. And the Philharmonia plays perfectly presented in a very rich and full DG sound.

I love Previn's First so much I'm left wondering why I've never purchased his Second. But until that happens, I'm with you: Sinopoli with Boult and Tate runners-up.

Sarge

[Karl Henning]

Interesting, gents, thanks.  (I know too small a sampling to offer an opinion.)

[Mirror Image]

I see. I usually try to sample different kind of works in the beginning when exploring a new composer.

To each their own.

Anthony Payne did well with the 3rd Symphony. He did the elaboration "paynestakingly".  There are moments here and there that doesn't feel 100 % Elgar, but most of the work sounds very much Elgar. The sympnony contains very beautiful music, that's why Anthony Payne wanted to elaborate Elgar's sketches, so people could hear Elgar's last musical ideas. The second movement (Scherzo) of the symphony is my favorite (especially in the Andrew David/BBC SO performance). Who cares who started and who finished it when music is that good?

I have Elgar's Piano Concerto "realised for performance" by Robert Walker and I have to say that's a kind of mess purists may want to stay away, but the 3rd symphony is too good to ignore. It's almost like ignoring Mozart's Requiem for being completed by Süssmayr.

I'm quite interested in Symphony No. 3 now thanks to you. So if I become addicted to it, I'll just blame you. But, seriously, I will definitely give it a listen. As a result, I bought Andrew Davis' recording with the BBC SO on NMC. I already owned Colin Davis' performance, but I'm quite keen to hear A. Davis now.

Oh, to me Boult is great with Elgar. The only problem I have is the sound. I did listen to Boult's The Kingdom inspired by your enthusiam and it was the sound that irritated me. Noise and even strong harmonic distortion at places! That's why I want to hear Elder's sonically clean performances.

You will love Elder's Gerontius and Kingdom. Fantastic performances.

You are welcome. Thanks for the interesting conversation!

[Mirror Image]

Was considering a poll, but I dont want to make this a contest...

Who is your favorite(s) 1-2 punch with Elgar's recorded symphonies?

Sinopoli's 2nd with Philharmonia is special, very dramatic, very operatic. I've just recently been accepting his recording of the 1st as equally fantastic. I was not originally sold on Sinopoli's 1st however, as I found the 1st and 2nd symphonies to have such contrasting musical cores. Speaking of contrast, how about Solti? Perhaps Solti's tempi are more accurate with Elgar's original ideas, and it can be a most jarring experience if you're used to Sinopoli or Tate's recordings. But Solti's performances are lightning infused, sharp but without shying away from the emotional draw. I've really come to appreciate Elder's duo with Halle, especially the 2nd which belongs along side any. Barbirolli/Phil is also great. Slatkin has a dynamite 1st, but a 2nd that fizzles, Tate is the opposite. There are more I haven't mentioned that deserve to be...

If I had to pick one (and this is always subject to change, as with any 'favorite' topic), I would go with Sinopoli. He seems to pull all the right strings for me when it comes to Elgar's symphonies. And the Philharmonia plays perfectly presented in a very rich and full DG sound.


Please respond, criticize, or praise. Either way I would love to hear (read) others thoughts. Thanks! 

For me, I'm still enamored with Andrew Davis' set with the Philharmonia Orchestra on Signum Classics. This blows his earlier performances with the BBC SO on Warner away IMHO. I also enjoy Haitink (also with the Philharmonia), Elder (even more so nowadays), and Barbirolli. I never cared for Solti, Sinopoli, and Boult's earlier performances reissued on the Lyrita label were much better than his EMI remakes. I'm pretty set on these symphonies now, but I ordered Previn's on Philips the other night, so it will be interesting to see how it stacks up to my favorites.

[madaboutmahler]

To each their own.

I'm quite interested in Symphony No. 3 now thanks to you. So if I become addicted to it, I'll just blame you. But, seriously, I will definitely give it a listen. As a result, I bought Andrew Davis' recording with the BBC SO on NMC. I already owned Colin Davis' performance, but I'm quite keen to hear A. Davis now.

I agree with what has been said about the 3rd. It's a work I absolutely adore, the second subject of the first movement surely has to be one of Elgar's most lyrical, beautiful melodies owed to Vera of course. The C.Davis is a great recording, Daniel is good too, but have not heard A.Davis.. Otaka I have also not heard but would be interested to....
Would be interested to hear your thoughts on the 3rd, John.

[71 dB]

To each their own.

Yes, but it depends on the composer what kind of exploration strategy works best. I must say my exploration of Elgar was pretty random, not systematic in anyway.

I'm quite interested in Symphony No. 3 now thanks to you. So if I become addicted to it, I'll just blame you. But, seriously, I will definitely give it a listen. As a result, I bought Andrew Davis' recording with the BBC SO on NMC. I already owned Colin Davis' performance, but I'm quite keen to hear A. Davis now.

Some addiction is surely possible.  Hope you enjoy A. Davis' performance.

You will love Elder's Gerontius and Kingdom. Fantastic performances.

I ordered Elder's Gerontius today, perhaps my last order of 2013. That's my fourth Gerontius. Got a good deal, 6.45 euros delivered.

Mail service has been snail service this December. I'm still waiting for a CD I ordered December 2nd! 

[Mirror Image]

I agree with what has been said about the 3rd. It's a work I absolutely adore, the second subject of the first movement surely has to be one of Elgar's most lyrical, beautiful melodies owed to Vera of course. The C. Davis is a great recording, Daniel is good too, but have not heard A. Davis.. Otaka I have also not heard but would be interested to....

Would be interested to hear your thoughts on the 3rd, John.

Good to hear, Daniel. I'll probably listen to the 3rd sometime next week as my vacation starts this Saturday and I'll be off from work for an entire week, so I plan on listening to lots of Elgar, RVW, and Walton as well.

[Mirror Image]

Cross-posted from the 'Listening' thread -

And it finally arrived...



My jaw is dropped...that's all I'll say for now about The Apostles.

Sir Mark Elder discussing The Apostles -

http://www.youtube.com/v/5cdkd2DEZaA

[71 dB]

If you allow MI, I gather your statements about The Apostles here.

- My jaw is dropped...that's all I'll say for now about The Apostles.

- Such an eargasmic experience.  Listening to Part II: Golgotha right now and loving every minute of it. This work's neglect is unjustifiable as is The Kingdom for that matter. Every Elgar fan needs at least one performance of The Apostles in their collection and if you do decide to get it let it be Elder's recording. I couldn't imagine it getting any better than this.

- Well, The Apostles blew my mind. I'll definitely be revisiting this work along with The Kingdom very soon.

I'm glad you are enjoying The Apostles. I have always (well, 15 years or so) found it almost annoying how much Gerontius gets attention and love (deserved, no doubt about that), while The Apostles and The Kingdom remain rather neglected.

Hopefully these Elder versions can win more people to appreciate these awesome works more.

[mc ukrneal]

Was considering a poll, but I dont want to make this a contest...

Who is your favorite(s) 1-2 punch with Elgar's recorded symphonies?

Sinopoli's 2nd with Philharmonia is special, very dramatic, very operatic. I've just recently been accepting his recording of the 1st as equally fantastic. I was not originally sold on Sinopoli's 1st however, as I found the 1st and 2nd symphonies to have such contrasting musical cores. Speaking of contrast, how about Solti? Perhaps Solti's tempi are more accurate with Elgar's original ideas, and it can be a most jarring experience if you're used to Sinopoli or Tate's recordings. But Solti's performances are lightning infused, sharp but without shying away from the emotional draw. I've really come to appreciate Elder's duo with Halle, especially the 2nd which belongs along side any. Barbirolli/Phil is also great. Slatkin has a dynamite 1st, but a 2nd that fizzles, Tate is the opposite. There are more I haven't mentioned that deserve to be...

If I had to pick one (and this is always subject to change, as with any 'favorite' topic), I would go with Sinopoli. He seems to pull all the right strings for me when it comes to Elgar's symphonies. And the Philharmonia plays perfectly presented in a very rich and full DG sound.


Please respond, criticize, or praise. Either way I would love to hear (read) others thoughts. Thanks! 

I have all of one recording (Boult) of the pair (though I have heard a few others). I am so satisifed with it that I never felt the urge to get another one (and no sets I have include them either). So others can give a more comparative answer - I can only say the Boult (EMI) is well done.

[Karl Henning]

Sui generis, of course, but I suspect Alan will agree that Elgar's own electrical recordings are distinctly special in character.

[TheGSMoeller]

I have all of one recording (Boult) of the pair (though I have heard a few others). I am so satisifed with it that I never felt the urge to get another one (and no sets I have include them either). So others can give a more comparative answer - I can only say the Boult (EMI) is well done.

Neal, if you like the EMI Boult you should give a listen to this live recording from 1976...

[asin]B006VOX7Q8[/asin]