Charles Ives

[TheGSMoeller]

THE IVES OF MARCH


Although we are ten days into March already, I am announcing that this will be the month of Ives.
There seems to be many GMGrs who appreciate the beauty and importance of Ives' insurance music.
I figure we can all share our favorite Ives performances and recordings and possibly even create a definitive(I hate that word) list of recordings for each piece and help those who are in search of new recordings.

Let's start with the Symphony No. 1 (1898-1902) Written while attending Yale University, Ives symphony No.1 displays musical qualities and influence of late-romantic composers. Not as inventive compared to later pieces, although you can hear the young, foreshadowing Ives fighting with conventional sonata-form at times, his first symphony is an important key to understanding the development and metamorphoses of Ives' compositional style.
I am recommending this Naxos disc with James Sinclair, who has recorded many great Ives discs, Sinclair convinces his listeners that is not just a student piece, it carries weight and it's reminiscent of composers from that era.


[asin]B0000CDJKI[/asin]

[Leo K.]

THE IVES OF MARCH


Although we are ten days into March already, I am announcing that this will be the month of Ives.
There seems to be many GMGrs who appreciate the beauty and importance of Ives' insurance music.
I figure we can all share our favorite Ives performances and recordings and possibly even create a definitive(I hate that word) list of recordings for each piece and help those who are in search of new recordings.

Let's start with the Symphony No. 1 (1898-1902) Written while attending Yale University, Ives symphony No.1 displays musical qualities and influence of late-romantic composers. Not has inventive compared to later pieces, although you can hear young and foreshadowing Ives fighting with conventional sonata-form at times, his first symphony is an important key to understanding the development and metamorphoses of Ives' compositional style.
I am recommending this Naxos disc with James Sinclair, who has recorded many great Ives discs, Sinclair convinces his listeners that is not just a student piece, it carries weight and it's reminiscent of composers from that era.


[asin]B0000CDJKI[/asin]

Great idea to have the Ives of March! I'll be here.

I agree with your choice on Sinclair's account of the 1st symphony. For me, this disk is a special recording, as I also found the Emerson Concerto a complete revelation, thanks to the good efforts of the reconstruction by David Porter.

Well, the 1st symphony on this recording is uncut, which alone makes this recording essential for the Ives fan. the work itself sounds innocent, carefree, beautiful, a hope of the future and an ache for the past. It is a stunning romantic symphony, amazing work for a student! This is the work that started me on a journey to listen to other obscure late romantic symphonies, as I fell in love with the sound of late romanticism like never before. Hearing the Ives 1st symphony in this recording was an epiphany-experience when I first heard it.

[Mirror Image]

THE IVES OF MARCH


Although we are ten days into March already, I am announcing that this will be the month of Ives.
There seems to be many GMGrs who appreciate the beauty and importance of Ives' insurance music.
I figure we can all share our favorite Ives performances and recordings and possibly even create a definitive(I hate that word) list of recordings for each piece and help those who are in search of new recordings.

Let's start with the Symphony No. 1 (1898-1902) Written while attending Yale University, Ives symphony No.1 displays musical qualities and influence of late-romantic composers. Not has inventive compared to later pieces, although you can hear young and foreshadowing Ives fighting with conventional sonata-form at times, his first symphony is an important key to understanding the development and metamorphoses of Ives' compositional style.
I am recommending this Naxos disc with James Sinclair, who has recorded many great Ives discs, Sinclair convinces his listeners that is not just a student piece, it carries weight and it's reminiscent of composers from that era.


[asin]B0000CDJKI[/asin]

Well I certainly share your enthusiasm for Ives, Greg, because he was one of the first composers I ever heard and connected to almost right away. The first work I ever heard of Ives was Symphony No. 2 with Bernstein/NY Phil. on DG. What a wonderful recording even to this day. That Naxos series is indispensable IMHO. Sinclair is a noted Ives scholar and the recording with Schermerhorn couldn't be any better. I think it's one of the greatest achievements of Naxos' American Classics series. I think I'll put on some Ives from this series right now...

[Mirror Image]

Greg, do you own this:



Speaking of indispensable, this DVD/Bluray release of MTT's acclaimed Keeping Score series is one of the best of the entire series so far. It is educational, entertaining, and completely priceless for the Ives fan. It puts Ives into an even better light for me and the analysis of his Holidays Symphony was enthralling from beginning to end. There is also some great biographical information between various segments of the program. For those who love Ives, don't miss this DVD.

[Leo K.]

Greg, do you own this:



Speaking of indispensable, this DVD/Bluray release of MTT's acclaimed Keeping Score series is one of the best of the entire series so far. It is educational, entertaining, and completely priceless for the Ives fan. It puts Ives into an even better light for me and the analysis of his Holidays Symphony was enthralling from beginning to end. There is also some great biographical information between various segments of the program. For those who love Ives, don't miss this DVD.

I have to see that!!!

Thanks for the heads up. Thats one of my favorite Ives works.

[Mirror Image]

I have to see that!!!

Thanks for the heads up. Thats one of my favorite Ives works.

Leo K, you are in for quite a surprise. MTT takes the viewers to some important locations throughout Ives' live. He even stops by Ives' childhood home and plays on the piano that his father used to play. I think I'll watch this again tonight. I've already seen it twice already.

[TheGSMoeller]

Greg, do you own this:



Speaking of indispensable, this DVD/Bluray release of MTT's acclaimed Keeping Score series is one of the best of the entire series so far. It is educational, entertaining, and completely priceless for the Ives fan. It puts Ives into an even better light for me and the analysis of his Holidays Symphony was enthralling from beginning to end. There is also some great biographical information between various segments of the program. For those who love Ives, don't miss this DVD.

I'm ashamed to say I haven't seen it, John. But I will order it soon.


Anyone else with some thoughts or recommendations for Ives 1st Symphony?

[Leo K.]

I still enjoy MTT's account of the 1st, it's been awhile since I heard it, but it is a very worthy and worthwhile recording, with the wonderful sound of the CSO.

[Mirror Image]

I'm ashamed to say I haven't seen it, John. But I will order it soon.


Anyone else with some thoughts or recommendations for Ives 1st Symphony?

Every Ives fan needs that MTT program IMHO. You'll love it, Greg. Anyway, thoughts on Symphony No. 1? It's a pleasant work for sure, but that's about all it is to me. I do love the slow movement though very beautiful. It's a student work, so we shouldn't expect too much out of it. It seems to show Ives's love for the Romantic past and it's very tightly structured as well. I don't think it's as fine as his 2nd symphony, which to me starts to show Ives's penchant for musical constrasts.

[Mirror Image]

I still enjoy MTT's account of the 1st, it's been awhile since I heard it, but it is a very worthy and worthwhile recording, with the wonderful sound of the CSO.

I'm listening to the 4th from this recording right. Excellent performance.

[TheGSMoeller]

I guess we will move on from Symphony No.1, I urge all of those interested in Ives to give a good listen or two, still a very well written piece...


Symphony No.2 began in the early 1900s and went through years of orchestrations, even said to have been edits made to the symphony up to it's 1951 premiere. The piece displays an Ives signature compositional style of transforming noticeable quotes of American hymns/folk songs into the foreground essentially creating new themes. This time there is a 5-movement but with the fourth Lento maestoso acting as more of a prelude to the final whirlwind of a finale. The Adagio cantabile second movement is achingly beautiful, a climax towards to the end briefly quotes America the Beautiful that will just melt you with emotions, it's certainly alongside some of the finest adagios from the late-Romantic period. Symphony No.2 is mostly tonal throughout, with the exception of an occasional multiple-theme overlapping and the raspberry of an ending. About a minute away form the final bar, the trumpets blast Reveille preparing its listener for a fugue like blast of classic American melodies which is thrilling to say the least, and leading to either the most teeth-cringing, flinch-inducing or the most jarringly exciting final chord in music. I like to think it's both.




I am doing a dual recommendation for #2, Schermerhorn on Naxos, and Bernstein on DG. Similar to Sinclair's 1st Symphony recording on Naxos, the Schermerhorn features a new critical edition for the 2nd symphony. The playing from the Nashville SO is so clean and precise it's as if they could play Ives with their eyes closed. Bernstein has recorded the piece twice, even conducted the premiere in 1951, but has come under some scrutiny for taking too many liberties with the score. I chose his second recording on DG, although the first on Columbia is excellent. First, his Adagio cantabile is one of the slowest on record giving it's Romantic roots more room to breath, and it's lovely. Second, it's a live performance, the playing is thrilling, powerful and mostly flawless, if you have a good stereo system, then when you hear Reveille near the end turn the volume up and enjoy the beautiful madness, because the NYPhil's brass can tear down walls.
If I had to pick one I would have to go with Schermerhorn, it's lyrical and chaotic without ever losing it's direction, whereas the Bernstein seems to be at one volume throughout.

[Mirror Image]

I listened to a good bit of Ives today so I had my monthly fix. I'm now listening Bartok, which, for me, and I've used this analogy many times, is like coming home after a long journey. I'm comfortable in these kinds of rhythmic idioms, which would explain why Bartok, Shostakovich, Villa-Lobos, Stravinsky, Prokofiev, etc. are my favorite composers.

[Mirror Image]

I'll probably listen to some more Ives tomorrow. I think I'll listen to Central Park in the Dark and Holidays Symphony. Not sure what performance I'll listen to, but for the Central Park in the Dark probably Bernstein/NY Phil. on Sony (much better than his DG performance IMHO) and for Holidays I think I'll probably listen to MTT.

[Guido]

The nostalgic aspects of Ives' music work equally well for me in both the late and early works. I agree with you about Three Places in New England (the quasi mystical). But the Second Symphony (based on the popular tunes, patriotic songs and hymns of Ives's youth) is, if more blatant in its nostalgia, no less effective...for me, anyway. I wonder, though, if a non-American listener like yourself gets the extramusical associations of the music? One of the most heartfelt moments in the Second occurs shortly before the Finale's ultimate explosion: a solo cello plays a theme based on "Old Black Joe" and "Massa's in de Cold Ground" while the flute plays a countermelody based on "Long Long Ago" and "Turkey in the Straw" (I hear "Bringing in the Sheaves" too). This bit is heard earlier in the movement also with the horn taking the lead. Recalling the lyrics of those songs, and the association of those songs with my own youth, certainly intensifies the nostalgic experience.

Sarge

I love virtually everything in Ives oeuvre, so for me I find all of it very affecting! It's true that I didn't grow up with these tunes, but Ives treats them as a folk resource on which to draw - by analogy we don't need to have grown up in Hungary to really get Bartok, or be Czech to really get Dvorak and Janacek. Of course, Ives is more explicit in his quotations than any of these, but he renders his source material universal in his complete transformation of it, and it hits me in the solar plexus every time. It's obvious what it means to him, which is the main thing.

The words are the only thing I miss of course, though I do do my research!

[Leo K.]

Ives's 1st string quartet is an excellant companion piece to the 2nd symphony, the performance on this disk is probably the only recording I've heard of it, but it is so good (and coupled with the 2nd quartet) I've felt no need to seek another:

The First Quartet was written in 1896 while Ives was finishing up his studies with Horatio Parker at Yale. The musical idiom is late German Romanticism, with strong influences of Brahms, Tchaikovsky and Dvorak. Yet the work is distinctive in a way that Ives' First Symphony is not. For one thing, Ives uses Protestant Revival hymns in this work, which he was careful to avoid in the Symphony, knowing it would incur the wrath of the Euro-centric Parker. This work also shows a greater sense of craft than the symphony, and a more individual sense of harmony, probably also derived from the homespun harmonies of the hymns. The work opens with a magnificent fugue based on the Missionary Hymn, which will eventually make up the third movement of his massive Fourth Symphony. Other movements are equally beautifully done. The over all impression left by this quartet is of a fresh and original Romantic voice, already outshining the more established American composers of his time. Had Ives continued in this style, he could well have been as beloved as Copland or other American composers of later generations.

[Leo K.]

I thought I'd requote (myself) from another thread about Ives's 2nd Symphony:


(Vanguard Classics 08 6153 71, coupled with Symphony No. 1, out of print)


My favorite recording of the 2nd is the Harold Farberman account, but after listening to this and the Schermerhorn (on Naxos) I have to admit that Schermerhorn is really excellant and is winning me over with each new listen. I'm finally getting used to the corrected tempos in the new criticial edition.

By the way, the Farberman account has the best sound quality on the Vangaard CD (pictured above), perhaps even better than the LP.

The 1st and 2nd Symphonies are works I can put on causually as well as listen seriously with full attention. The 3rd is almost like that as well, but the 4th demands my full attention, rightly so. What I really like about the 2nd is it's effortless dance with the themes...the tunes develop and progress very naturally, humorously and seriously as well. In any given listening situation, I can listen just to the surface, or listen at a deep level and find a profound discourse goin on, connected to Ives's own personal nostalgia, but also connected to a more universal "Americana" that I definitely feel in sympathy with.

The 2nd is so musically evocative of the soil and culture from which it arose in an apparently more "simple" manner than the mature works, and it also evokes nature as well...I often think of thunder-filled clouds in the distance during the 1st movement. Now when I say "simple" I don't mean to imply the 2nd is not sophisticated, rather, I mean to suggest "simple" from the viewpoint of my ears upon hearing the "surface" of the music. Every year I appreciate more what Ives accomplished as a youthful composer.  The 1st String Quartet is another great early work.

I recently bought the new critical edition score of the 2nd Symphony (edited by Jonathan Elkus), which is a real wonderful edition, beautifully put together with excellant commentary and an essay by the editor. The 2nd Symphony is fast becoming my favorite Ives symphonic work. I recently read the article "Quotation and Paraphrase in Ives's Second Symphony" by J. Peter Burkholder, and was taken aback with memories of my own grandfather playing many of these old tunes and hymns on his violin when I was young...we used to play Turkey In the Straw and Old Black Joe and etc. 

[TheGSMoeller]

I thought I'd requote (myself) from another thread about Ives's 2nd Symphony:


(Vanguard Classics 08 6153 71, coupled with Symphony No. 1, out of print)


My favorite recording of the 2nd is the Harold Farberman account, but after listening to this and the Schermerhorn (on Naxos) I have to admit that Schermerhorn is really excellant and is winning me over with each new listen. I'm finally getting used to the corrected tempos in the new criticial edition.

By the way, the Farberman account has the best sound quality on the Vangaard CD (pictured above), perhaps even better than the LP. 

Thanks for sharing, Leo. I will have to become familiar with the Farberman recording.

[TheGSMoeller]

The Ives of March

The Unanswered Question (1906; 1934)


http://www.youtube.com/v/2D5oVyPRiCYhttp://www.youtube.com/v/JgYSthpbV6whttp://www.youtube.com/v/Y7zo2gelqvo


Concert hall version with offstage strings by Tokyo Chamber Philharmonic....Isao Tomita's version....Orpheus Chamber Orchestra's recorded version.

[TheGSMoeller]

The Ives of March

I'll continue with some "Ives of March" posts later, but in the meantime I thought I would change my signature for this occasion.




-Greg

[Mirror Image]

Greg, if we're all still around, every March should be the Ives of March. It's interesting though I usually don't start getting into an Ives mood until the 4th of July. I'm not a patriotic person but Ives makes me proud to be an American.