Chopin

[Madiel]

not gonna happen, is it?

No. Because your demands are too demanding. Go and explore, see what you like.

I can tell you some pieces I particularly love, but I'm not going to be held to some promise to blow your mind. Personally I enjoy his larger-scale, single-movement pieces.

[George]

On the topic of blowing snyprrr's mind, I think that ship sailed long ago. 

[Madiel]

On the topic of blowing snyprrr's mind, I think that ship sailed long ago.

Made me laugh.

[snyprrr]

No. Because your demands are too demanding. Go and explore, see what you like.

I can tell you some pieces I particularly love, but I'm not going to be held to some promise to blow your mind. Personally I enjoy his larger-scale, single-movement pieces.

OK, just in case people don't believe that I.... whatever it is. Of the top of my head (and this is just me "discovering Chopin", basically for the first time (working backwards from the last stop, Debussy)): (who else do you know that dares a ")):"??)... or even a ")):"??)...:

MAZURKAS: I fell asleep to Luisada. Well, there's a lot of them, they seem to be short, and, to me, they all seem to have a certain, distinct flavoure to them,- they seem to be spiked just the tiniest amount,... anyway, I did enjoy the whole thing as a wallpaper tapestry- I enjoyed it in the background but I heard nothing distinctive in between. The Concert of it all seemed quite modern to me. Still, I feel this would be a last-stop for me on the ChopinTrain.


NOCTURNES: obviously, I had Rubinstein?RCA because The Penguin Guide TOLD me to. At that time, I simply thought they didn't sound as cool as Satie's! (@1993) I couldn't tell you one from the other.

So, now, I guess they were the FIRST stop on the ChopinTrain, and I wanted someone new (in modern sound), and happened to get a MusicalHeretige copy of Livia Rev/Hyperion. There is quite a dusky and glowing aura dribbling out of the top of the piano image here, quite the classy recording. I'M STILL UPSET that some of these quiet pieces have eruptions of emotion in them, oh the horror! But, so far, I've grown used to 9/1-2 and 27/1. Yea, that's it for the time. Since I haven't been triggered by these Nocturnes, yet, I AM hesitant to further the ChopinTrain until I find something I can latch on to (happening now with the Ballades).

Also, the Performer here is soooo crucial (as with Debussy, but more so it seems). Currently, I'm curious about CIANI and TIPO,...


BALLADES (4): I've tried Rubie/RCA, Davidovich, Katsaris, Pollini, and fews others, but it IS Zimerman who seems to come out on top! Huh! Katsaris seems psycho, and I LOATHE Pollini in Chopin - for some reason...

However, the Ballades seem to be snyprrr-friendly...


SCHERZI (4): just hearing Pogo sold me here! Wild stuff! Definitely Chopin the RockStar...


POLONAISES (7+): haven't gotten into them yet,... looking at that Katsaris set...


WALTZES (19): I would really just get the Kocsis here and wait for me to get in the mood for... uh... waltzes. The 1st makes quite an impression by Kocsis.



BERCUESE: I like this!

BARCAROLLE:                                               These three pieces always seem to be programmed
                                                                        together. Zimerman, Perahia,... for next week...
FANTASIE:




SONATA 2: Pogo again. Ah, so there's the famous March,... Chopin's quite the barnburner, eh? I didn't know he was just as much a RockStar as Liszt, but Chopin is no shrinking violet!

SONATA 3: Argerich, - obviously, the music didn't hit me quite like #2,... future listening...



PRELUDES (24+1, basically):

ETUDES (2 SETS+3+): I am TOTALLY STUCK on the Pre+Etudes,... I loved the Preludes from the 'RealChopin' set, with the old piano,... and I'm now listening to Berezovsky's Teldec recital (also really like the overblown Godowsky bits!!- now this is more up my alley, totally gratuitous, lol),...

...who's the "Michellini" on EMI, @1979,... not Michaelangeli, a young guy,... can't remember if it's the Etudes or Preludes,...

However, the "studies" aspect of these pieces makes them more entertaining to me than, say, the Waltzes or Mazurkas,... eh?,...

Katsaris seemed too experimental in the Preludes, whereas some other, more "normal", Pianists seem to simply play the MUSIC in them. Again, the Performer seems to be just as important as the Composer,... almost??.... uh....



IMPROMPTUS (4): I looove No.1,... listening to a lot of different people,... SAMSON!!!! haha, sooooo fast, and CORTOT,... however, I like this piece by most people (no matter the speed), it has that cool downward chromatic thing,... haven't heard much of the others,...

RONDOS:


MISC:





I haaave read most of the 'Chopin Recordings' Thread, and really appreciated our helpful members' looong ass Posts on every conceivable Work+Performer critique.

I tend to want to hear GreatSound coupled with the ridiculously sublime and outrageous performer- I've now heard Chopin sound like swooning salon music AND Avant-Garde!!!! SAME MUSIC!!!! I see "off brand" performers that stoke my curiosity the most-

Pogo
Sultanov
Gavrilov
Berezovsky
Demidenko... ??...
Friere...??...
Katsaris (less so the thin sounding Teldec)
Kocsis
Leonskaja
Rev
Weissenberg... I hear  his Chopin is either great, or sucks...??....which is it?
Luisada
CAN'T STAND POLLINI HERE...WTF??... is it the DG sound, or is he just detached as f??...

Arrau... too slow for me??
Pletnev?
Ashkenazy... too masculine for me??...




ok, enough for now

[Gurn Blanston]

OK, just in case people don't believe that I.... whatever it is. Of the top of my head (and this is just me "discovering Chopin", basically for the first time (working backwards from the last stop, Debussy)): (who else do you know that dares a ")):"??)... or even a ")):"??)...:



POLONAISES (7+): haven't gotten into them yet,... looking at that Katsaris set...

I suppose I'm the only one here who really likes this disk:



But then, the Poloniases are my favorite Chopin too.

[Holden]

OK, if you like the Ballades then try this version of No 1 on Youtube. To me it's the best but others may disagree.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jKWkCKdDGVs

My favourite recording of the Berceuse is quite old and by a pianist most don't associate with Chopin (but they should)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LxjqxnrDi0

I also like the Preludes. There is a classic live recording by Arrau from 1960

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDkhi9dt0TU

..but they can be played so many different ways that recommending just one performance is not enough. I'd also seek out Fiorentino whose approach is very different to everyone else's and of course the famous live Carnegie Hall Bolet.

My favourite all time Chopin recital is Sokolov live in Amsterdam from around 2005. This recording was burned onto CD for me by someone who no longer posts on GMG.

[bwv 1080]

Dont forget Moravec

https://www.youtube.com/v/zMSL1cpwcxM

[snyprrr]

OK, if you like the Ballades then try this version of No 1 on Youtube. To me it's the best but others may disagree.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jKWkCKdDGVs

My favourite recording of the Berceuse is quite old and by a pianist most don't associate with Chopin (but they should)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LxjqxnrDi0

I also like the Preludes. There is a classic live recording by Arrau from 1960

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDkhi9dt0TU

..but they can be played so many different ways that recommending just one performance is not enough. I'd also seek out Fiorentino whose approach is very different to everyone else's and of course the famous live Carnegie Hall Bolet.

My favourite all time Chopin recital is Sokolov live in Amsterdam from around 2005. This recording was burned onto CD for me by someone who no longer posts on GMG.

ABM always seems to be given such a dry atmosphere to record in,... or I'm hearing the PianoImage as being too "hard" or something. It's so hard for me if I can't handle the sound... in ABM's case, yes, I am being extraordinarily finicky...


Right now, it's the Impromptus, Preludes, and Etudes that have me somewhat fluxxed... someone here did an "Etudes" comparison, but I can't find it in the 70 Pages....

[snyprrr]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXfJplrbF8U

yay or nay?

So far, only Cortot, but especially Solomon Francois (is that correct?the guy wholookslike a movie star), have moved me. SF just blew my mind, and this girl blazes through, albeit, with a slight less charm than SF, BUT, I didn't find it so far off the Cortot in terms of the mechanics of the playing (again, with a bit less charm from the 8yo, but, I mean,...lol!!)

8yo = 2;18 at the point stopped... lol
SF = 3:00
Cortot = 3:40
Arrau = @5

Who do you like in Op.29? I love that little downward chromatic bit, very forward looking sounding (or is it Mozart sounding?)...

Yundi didn't make an impression,... many are playing it pretty standard,- only SF just blazes through ("power tthru Hhill")...

[snyprrr]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c4EIzo7lf7M

[Florestan]

Just a thought: it may very well be that, of all past composers, Chopin is the only one whose work is still performed, recorded and universally acclaimed and loved almost in its entirety: excluding juvenilia, pretty much everything that Chopin wrote is still in the repertoire. That can't be said of any other major composer, not even Bach, Mozart and Beethoven. Chopin is quite unique in this respect.

[North Star]

Just a thought: it may very well be that, of all past composers, Chopin is the only one whose work is still performed, recorded and universally acclaimed and loved almost in its entirety: excluding juvenilia, pretty much everything that Chopin wrote is still in the repertoire. That can't be said of any other major composer, not even Bach, Mozart and Beethoven. Chopin is quite unique in this respect.

Indeed - most composers with that level of acclaim and of writing, wrote more music, and for more varied and larger forces.

[Mandryka]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXfJplrbF8U

yay or nay?

So far, only Cortot, but especially Solomon Francois (is that correct?the guy wholookslike a movie star), have moved me. SF just blew my mind, and this girl blazes through, albeit, with a slight less charm than SF, BUT, I didn't find it so far off the Cortot in terms of the mechanics of the playing (again, with a bit less charm from the 8yo, but, I mean,...lol!!)

8yo = 2;18 at the point stopped... lol
SF = 3:00
Cortot = 3:40
Arrau = @5

Who do you like in Op.29? I love that little downward chromatic bit, very forward looking sounding (or is it Mozart sounding?)...

Yundi didn't make an impression,... many are playing it pretty standard,- only SF just blazes through ("power tthru Hhill")...

Cortot is very good with it, I haven't heard Samson Francois play it, but here's Stanislav Bunin

https://www.youtube.com/v/4OdFfc6jCIk

[Mahlerian]

Just a thought: it may very well be that, of all past composers, Chopin is the only one whose work is still performed, recorded and universally acclaimed and loved almost in its entirety: excluding juvenilia, pretty much everything that Chopin wrote is still in the repertoire. That can't be said of any other major composer, not even Bach, Mozart and Beethoven. Chopin is quite unique in this respect.

Not disagreeing with you, but isn't that in large part because Chopin's output is much smaller and more focused (so that the people who enjoy some of it don't dislike another part just because it's in a different genre) than those composers'?

[Baron Scarpia]

Just a thought: it may very well be that, of all past composers, Chopin is the only one whose work is still performed, recorded and universally acclaimed and loved almost in its entirety: excluding juvenilia, pretty much everything that Chopin wrote is still in the repertoire. That can't be said of any other major composer, not even Bach, Mozart and Beethoven. Chopin is quite unique in this respect.

I think the same can be said of several equally significant composers such as Ravel and Debussy who had comparably small outputs. I'm not sure it is fair to compare with composers of different era, when economics dictated that they produce an unceasing stream of works to put food on the table.

[ComposerOfAvantGarde]

Just a thought: it may very well be that, of all past composers, Chopin is the only one whose work is still performed, recorded and universally acclaimed and loved almost in its entirety: excluding juvenilia, pretty much everything that Chopin wrote is still in the repertoire. That can't be said of any other major composer, not even Bach, Mozart and Beethoven. Chopin is quite unique in this respect.

Chopin also had a fair amount of experimentation in his music, and influence on later composers as well. Many of his pieces are short, published (and sometimes performed/recorded) in sets and his music is almost exclusively piano music. Perhaps because he was one composer whose instrument of choice was also quite groundbreaking, and pianos around the time when music was being first recorded had enough in common for his music to be particularly well suited. Smaller and more focussed repertoire is, of course, beneficial to the interest in a large proportion of his repertoire. Considering that piano is one of the most popular instruments in western music institutions, it's no surprise that his music is advocated for developing technique and musicality that can be applied not only to other piano music, but any western classical repertoire in general. There aren't many composers like him who had such a small output in such a specific field of expertise. Wagner, Verdi, Bruckner and Mahler, of course come to mind in terms of composers who had a very specific focus and wide influence, but with much larger genres.

[Madiel]

The Ashkenazy box of Chopin recordings has an essay that points out Chopin's enduring popularity is slightly surprising given how radical he was in some ways. There's some fairly astonishing sliding chromaticism.

[Marc]

Just a thought: it may very well be that, of all past composers, Chopin is the only one whose work is still performed, recorded and universally acclaimed and loved almost in its entirety: excluding juvenilia, pretty much everything that Chopin wrote is still in the repertoire. That can't be said of any other major composer, not even Bach, Mozart and Beethoven. Chopin is quite unique in this respect.

AFAIK, excluding (and maybe even not that) juvenilia and spurious works, everything that Bach wrote is in the repertoire. Not still though. It has grown in the last 50 years, and remains quite steady. As a Bach lover, it's impossible to take hold of every new Bach issue.
This includes vocal works (church, secular), orchestral stuff, chamber music, keyboard solo, formerly called 'abstract' works, et cetera, everything is being recorded by various musicians. The Bach catalogue includes 1128 works, but even quite a few Anhang works are performed and recorded on a more or less frequent basis.

[Florestan]

AFAIK, excluding (and maybe even not that) juvenilia and spurious works, everything that Bach wrote is in the repertoire. Not still though. It has grown in the last 50 years, and remains quite steady. As a Bach lover, it's impossible to take hold of every new Bach issue.
This includes vocal works (church, secular), orchestral stuff, chamber music, keyboard solo, formerly called 'abstract' works, et cetera, everything is being recorded by various musicians. The Bach catalogue includes 1128 works, but even quite a few Anhang works are performed and recorded on a more or less frequent basis.

You have a point about recordings (afaIk, there are three complete Bach editions --- far behind Chopin, for that matter, with at least seven) but performance-wise I strongly doubt that even during a whole concert season all around the world (including concert halls, churches and festivals) everything that Bach wrote is performed. And there is one more difference: everything that Bach wrote is of interest only to Bach completists, while everything that Chopin wrote appeals to the general audience.

Granted, Chopin's oeuvre is quantitatively only a tiny fraction of Bach's and this explains a lot; but otoh so is Beethoven's or Brahms' and there are enough of their works who never, or very rarely, get performed.

[North Star]

You have a point about recordings (afaIk, there are three complete Bach editions --- far behind Chopin, for that matter, with at least seven) but performance-wise I strongly doubt that even during a whole concert season all around the world (including concert halls, churches and festivals) everything that Bach wrote is performed. And there is one more difference: everything that Bach wrote is of interest only to Bach completists, while everything that Chopin wrote appeals to the general audience.

Granted, Chopin's oeuvre is quantitatively only a tiny fraction of Bach's and this explains a lot; but otoh so is Beethoven's or Brahms' and there are enough of their works who never, or very rarely, get performed.

And Chopin's oeuvre is quantitatively only a tiny fraction of Beethoven's or Brahms' and this explains a lot, too.