Tagging Classical for iTunes

[MN Dave]

Okay, this has been discussed a bit elsewhere, but I wanted to create a clean slate and ask:

How do you tag your Classical tracks for iTunes?

What is the best method and why?

Have you found any good articles about this on the 'net?

Thanks, iTuners.

[Morigan]

Ah, this is a personal question. I love how easy it is to manage tags with iTunes.

The I like to do it this way. I'll take Beethoven's 5th for example.

Title : Symphony No. 5 in C minor, Op. 67 - I. Allegro con brio
Artist : Karajan, BPO    [or maybe a less abbreviated form]
Composer : Beethoven, Ludwig van (1770-1827)   [That's how I classify every composer]
Album : Beethoven: Symphonien 5 & 6  [or something]

I also use the "Genre" field to classify my music in periods. For example, this file would be in the "Late Classical" category. I use this tag to create dynamic playlists with iTunes for each different period or sub-period.

iTunes also allows auto-detects if the album should be played without gap and if the order of the movements should be shuffled or not (i like this for any multi-movement work, or sets of variations in separate files).

On my ipod, i generally browse music by composer, or by artist if i'm looking for a performer in particular. Voilà!

[MN Dave]

Ah, this is a personal question. I love how easy it is to manage tags with iTunes.

The I like to do it this way. I'll take Beethoven's 5th for example.

Title : Symphony No. 5 in C minor, Op. 67 - I. Allegro con brio
Artist : Karajan, BPO    [or maybe a less abbreviated form]
Composer : Beethoven, Ludwig van (1770-1827)   [That's how I classify every composer]
Album : Beethoven: Symphonien 5 & 6  [or something]

I also use the "Genre" field to classify my music in periods. For example, this file would be in the "Late Classical" category. I use this tag to create dynamic playlists with iTunes for each different period or sub-period.

iTunes also allows auto-detects if the album should be played without gap and if the order of the movements should be shuffled or not (i like this for any multi-movement work, or sets of variations in separate files).

On my ipod, i generally browse music by composer, or by artist if i'm looking for a performer in particular. Voilà!

Does your playlist title look like this then?:

Karajan, BPO - Beethoven: Symphonien 5 & 6

Also, please tell me more about this:

iTunes also allows auto-detects if the album should be played without gap and if the order of the movements should be shuffled or not (i like this for any multi-movement work, or sets of variations in separate files).

[Morigan]

The playlist title would be Karajan BPO - Symphony No. 5, Op. 67 - I. Allegro con brio.

But on iTunes you can arrange the columns so that the Composer name appears second or third. You can sort your library by Composer, Artist, Title or Album. I'd show you some screenshots, but I'm not at home right now.
Another solution would be to list the composer as "Artist", but when you do that, It's had to place the performer (unless you include it in the album title, for example "Karajan BPO, [album title]" BTW there's a field where you can specify the year in which the album was published, but you can also use it to indicate when the work was written, for example (and use this tag to create dynamic playlists).

About the gapless thing...

When you add files to your library, iTunes will detect if the different tracks seem to be linked together (like for Beethoven 5, the 3rd and 4th movement should be played without interruptiong in between). If the program fails to detect it, you can always select the whole album, right click, select "Display information" (or something like that) and check a box that will enable the gapless playback. There's also an option which you can check that will lock the order of the tracks on a particular CD. If you decide to let the program play music randomly in shuffle mode, it will never mix the order of these tracks and will always play them in the correct order. However, that's relevent only if you like to use the shuffle mode.

[MN Dave]

The playlist title would be Karajan BPO - Symphony No. 5, Op. 67 - I. Allegro con brio.

But on iTunes you can arrange the columns so that the Composer name appears second or third. You can sort your library by Composer, Artist, Title or Album. I'd show you some screenshots, but I'm not at home right now.
Another solution would be to list the composer as "Artist", but when you do that, It's had to place the performer (unless you include it in the album title, for example "Karajan BPO, [album title]" BTW there's a field where you can specify the year in which the album was published, but you can also use it to indicate when the work was written, for example (and use this tag to create dynamic playlists).

About the gapless thing...

When you add files to your library, iTunes will detect if the different tracks seem to be linked together (like for Beethoven 5, the 3rd and 4th movement should be played without interruptiong in between). If the program fails to detect it, you can always select the whole album, right click, select "Display information" (or something like that) and check a box that will enable the gapless playback. There's also an option which you can check that will lock the order of the tracks on a particular CD. If you decide to let the program play music randomly in shuffle mode, it will never mix the order of these tracks and will always play them in the correct order. However, that's relevent only if you like to use the shuffle mode.

I don't think the playlist title would include the track name, unless you know a trick I don't which is very possible. I'm not sure why you'd want the track name in the title in any case.

I'll have to look into this grouping thing. See how it's done.

Thanks for your input!

[gmstudio]

Here's how I do it:


Artist:  Composer's last name
Album title:  Title piece followed by conductor if I have more than one
Genre:  I've made some generic tags here such as "Symphony," "String Quartet," etc, for the major forms
Song Title: The titles of the individual movements.

Comments field: More extensive recording info, such as soloists, orchestra, label, etc.

So, for example, a tag might look like:

Artist: Mahler
Album: Sym #6- Boulez
Genre: Symphony
Song Title:  III. Andante

Which differentiates it from:

Artist: Mahler
Album: Sym #6 - Jansons
Genre: Symphony
Song Title: III. Andante

(I use the shortened "Sym" because it makes finding things on the small iPod screen easier.)

In the case of same conductor, same piece, different orchestra:

Artist: Mahler
Album: Sym #9 - Bernstein (NY)
Genre: Symphony
Song Title: IV. Adagio

vs.

Artist: Mahler
Album: Sym #1 - Bernstein (BP)
Genre: Symphony
Song Title: IV. Adagio

FWIW, I also make very extensive use of the Smart Playlists...I think this is one of iTunes smartest features.  You can set up a smart playlist to find all "Composers = Beethoven + Album = Symphony No. 9" and presto, they're all grouped together in a separate playlist. These also feature live updating, so if I add two more recordings of his 9th, they automatically get added to this list as well.

I think the iTunes cataloging system is wonderful. It takes me all of about an hour to do 20 discs or so.  I'll bring that many home from the library, load 'em up, and take them back later in the afternoon.

[PSmith08]

Let's use Carlos Kleiber's 1983 Munich performance of Beethoven's 6th:

Track: "1. Allegro ma non troppo"
Artist: "Ludwig van Beethoven"
Album: "Symphony no. 6 in F major (Kleiber '83)"
Genre: "Classical"

I tend to use the conductor's name for pretty much everything except solo or chamber music. That means, for example, that Giulini's recording of Beethoven's 5th piano concerto with Michelangeli would be,

"Piano concerto no. 5 in E flat major, op. 73 (Giulini '83)"

[Morigan]

Wait, I think I misunderstood you. What do you mean by "playlist title"?

About the others... I think your way of writing the title of the work in the Album field can cause a few issues.

I like to use the original album title. Also, one album rarely contains only one symphony. That's why I just leave the album name in this field and use the complete title of the work in the Title field.

For example, I have parts of the Complete Mozart Edition (Philips) and they really need to be classified by volume and number, and then seach track must be identified as seperate works.

[MN Dave]

Thanks for the responses. Maybe I'm making this too complicated. For some reason, I like the composer's name with the "song title" though I can't remember why at the moment. So PSmith's Kleiber track would be:

Beethoven: 1. Allegro ma non troppo

By "play list" I mean the name in that column down the left side on iTunes.

[Morigan]

OK. Why would that not include the track name?

I'll post a screenie when i get home, lol.

[MN Dave]

OK. Why would that not include the track name?

I'll post a screenie when i get home, lol.

Well, my play list name automatically combines Artist + Album Title. It does not include a track name because the play list is composed of a grouping of tracks.

[MN Dave]

Check this out, rocket scientists:

http://oakroadsystems.com/genl/itunes.htm#U20061204b

[Morigan]

That's very interesting. I still don't really like the idea coding each work as an Album, but it works... and I guess it makes your title list look cleaner

[gmstudio]

For example, I have parts of the Complete Mozart Edition (Philips) and they really need to be classified by volume and number, and then seach track must be identified as seperate works.

To me the CD is just the vehicle to get the music into the system...once it's in iTunes, I don't care that it stays grouped by whatever "album" it came in on.  I have the 11 discs of the Divertimento & Serenades set, but they're all listed individually as independent works. I think the album system (for me) doesn't make any sense once the pieces are ripped from the CD. 

FWIW, I generally also strip off the key signatures of major pieces..."Symphony No. 9 in D Minor" by Beethoven, for example...well, he only wrote one 9th symphony, so I don't really need the key. I like my iTunes window "clean" so I can spot the important differences, such as conductor, easily.

Really, though, everyone will have their own system. There's certainly no right or wrong. It's whatever works for you!

[Morigan]

I think you have good arguments, gmstudio. My system is probably the result of my obsession for order and propre classification!

I agree that your way makes it easier to browse on an iPod screen too!

One more thing, I like to have the album illustrations ^_^ but that's just me...

[MN Dave]

To me the CD is just the vehicle to get the music into the system...once it's in iTunes, I don't care that it stays grouped by whatever "album" it came in on.  I have the 11 discs of the Divertimento & Serenades set, but they're all listed individually as independent works. I think the album system (for me) doesn't make any sense once the pieces are ripped from the CD. 

So, do you group each work in a play list? Or do the tracks just sit in your library to be pulled by album title? I think I'm too hooked on play lists maybe.

[Morigan]

I think there's no need for play lists that much.

If your album field contains the name of the opus (i.e Symphony  #9), you should just sort your main library by composer (or artist if you use this field for composer names) and then by "album"

I'd use the playlist function to create lists like "chamber music", "bel canto", "early baroque", groups of works to be played together according what you want to listen.

[MN Dave]

I think there's no need for play lists that much.

If your album field contains the name of the opus (i.e Symphony  #9), you should just sort your main library by composer (or artist if you use this field for composer names) and then by "album"

I'd use the playlist function to create lists like "chamber music", "bel canto", "early baroque", groups of works to be played together according what you want to listen.

Thanks. I was stuck in a rut and I think you guys helped pull me out.

[gmstudio]

I'd use the playlist function to create lists like "chamber music", "bel canto", "early baroque", groups of works to be played together according what you want to listen.

And if you use the "genre" field or something equivelant to enter "chamber music" or "symphony," you can use the SMART Playlist feature to update those playlists automatically.

One more thing, I like to have the album illustrations ^_^ but that's just me...

Oh yes, I definitely seek those out!

[Keemun]

I tag my iTunes classical music files as follows, using the first movement of Boulez's Bruckner 8 as an example:

Name:  Symphony No. 8: I. Allegro moderato
Artist:  Bruckner, Anton
Album Artist:  [blank]
Album: Symphony No. 8 (Boulez/VPO)
Grouping:  [blank]
Composer: Bruckner, Anton
Comments:  Pierre Boulez; Vienna Philharmonic Orchestra
Genre:  Classical
Year:  1996

When I use my iPod, I typically search for music by Artist, which is why I designate the composer as the Artist.  That way, if I want to listen to Boulez's Bruckner 8, I go to Artist: Bruckner, Anton > Album: Symphony No. 8 (Boulez/VPO).  By putting the conductor and orchestra abbreviations in the album name, I can tell which of my eight versions of Bruckner 8 it is.