Haydn's Haus

[Karl Henning]

I can't say yea or nay to that, Karl. Fact is, I got those as a throw-in in the Big Box. I don't need any more SQ's, so I haven't paid any mind. Plus, my two favorite opera are missing or partly missing, Opp 50 & 76. So the urge is just not there.... (they may be the best recordings ever made...).

Ho capito.  I saw in an Amazon review that the subset in The Grand Box was incomplete.

I suppose what I should do, before I yield to Alan's sirenesque susurrations, is listen afresh to the brace of late quartet discs I've got at home . . . .

[Geo Dude]

Karl:  If you do decide to pick up some more Haydn quartets and want modern instrument recordings, the single disc Kodaly Quartet recordings on Naxos would be worth looking into.  The Op. 76 4, 5, and 6 disc is wonderful and the reviews of other discs in the set indicate that they are great, too.  Not to mention, the market place prices are generally pretty good if you wish to dip a toe in with a couple of discs at a time rather than a box set.  And there are samples available.

[kishnevi]

Karl:  If you do decide to pick up some more Haydn quartets and want modern instrument recordings, the single disc Kodaly Quartet recordings on Naxos would be worth looking into.  The Op. 76 4, 5, and 6 disc is wonderful and the reviews of other discs in the set indicate that they are great, too.  Not to mention, the market place prices are generally pretty good if you wish to dip a toe in with a couple of discs at a time rather than a box set.  And there are samples available.

I have the exact opposite opinion of the Kodaly.  I have the two CDs for Op. 76, and found them rather boring.  Much prefer the other complete MI set I have of those works, from the Amadeus Qt. (with Op. 77 and 103). 

For an MI performance, I would suggest the Jerusalem Quartet or the Lindsays, although (in the form I have them) they are not complete opera collected onto one CD, but rather "favorite" or "famous" quartets  drawn from all over the cycle.

[chasmaniac]

Reckon I'll need to sample me some sound-clips.

The ones I know are as follows. Kodalys are staid with somewhat distant recorded sound. Angeles are staid with cavernous sound. Lindsays are gung-ho and well recorded, but people other than me complain of their intonation and play-as-oneness. Their stuff is getting hard to find too. Mosaiques are somewhat staid with fine sound and HIP credentials. Of the others, I know naught.

[Elgarian]

Mosaiques are somewhat staid with fine sound and HIP credentials.

May I quibble? I wouldn't say 'staid', myself. Struggling to find adjectives I'd try words like 'pure' or 'ethereal'. They're full of life but it's not the 'get-out-of my-way-and-bloody-well-listen-to-THIS' kind of life. It's more like the quietly vital essence of life; the rippling flow of it, rather than the in-yer-face-get-up-and-bop pulsation.

[chasmaniac]

May I quibble? I wouldn't say 'staid', myself. Struggling to find adjectives I'd try words like 'pure' or 'ethereal'. They're full of life but it's not the 'get-out-of my-way-and-bloody-well-listen-to-THIS' kind of life. It's more like the quietly vital essence of life; the rippling flow of it, rather than the in-yer-face-get-up-and-bop pulsation.

I bow to the essential rippling flow of Elgarian's ethereal vocabulary. 

[chasmaniac]

I very much like the Mosaiques, by the way. But I'm crazy for that hep Lindsay jive!

[Antoine Marchand]

Well, here goes a vote to endorse the acquisition of the Amadeus Quartet box. 

I'm not too much objective because they were almost my introduction to these works, but they were able to wake up on me an ever increasing love for this music.

I wouldn't say that they play exactly an over-romanticized Haydn. It's clear that they are not HIP, but I would prefer to call pre-authentic his approach, with well chosen tempi; a severe, but warm interplay; not a lot of vibrato and enjoyable soundstage.

Anyway, I would recommend to avoid -at least initially- the Original Masters set (mono recordings) because of the aged sound quality. BTW, their interpretations include one of my favorite versions of the "Last Seven Words", ideal for their stern style.

My favorite performances are played on period instruments, but among the ensembles playing on modern instruments the Amadeus Quartet and currently the Tatrai Quartet clearly rank at the top of the choices.

[Antoine Marchand]

It's absolutely true, Gurn.

Although it's a bit late, it's weekend so, who knows, maybe I will watch that video again.

Over and out, dear Haydnistos. 

[Elgarian]

Corrected below:

I bow to the essential self-indulgent rippling burbling flow excesses of Elgarian's ethereal diarrhetic vocabulary. 

[Geo Dude]

Gurn (and anyone else interested in helping):  I'm working on building a Haydn instrumental collection and want to know where I should go next.  I currently have a complete set of the keyboard works, the London symphonies, the QM string quartets box set, and the ten disc piano trios box set is in the mail.  What other stuff should I be trying and which recordings are recommended?  Only two restrictions in regards to recommendations:  HIP required and box sets (or really cheap singles on the market place) preferred.

[Opus106]

Gurn (and anyone else interested in helping):  I'm working on building a Haydn instrumental collection and want to know where I should go next.  I currently have a complete set of the keyboard works, the London symphonies, the QM string quartets box set, and the ten disc piano trios box set is in the mail.  What other stuff should I be trying and which recordings are recommended?  Only two restrictions in regards to recommendations:  HIP required and box sets (or really cheap singles on the market place) preferred.

Other symphonies, from the so-called "Strum und Drang" period. Try the oratarios and masses. For the latter, there are sets from Harnoncourt (Das Alte Werke/Warner) and Weil/Tafelmusik (Vivarte/Sony), which satisfy both your conditions. If you go a couple dozen pages or so back in this thread, you will find a discussion on recordings of his most famous oratorio, The Creation.

That's just for starters; I'm sure the Haydnistos will offer more precise and well-informed opinions on the recordings themselves.

[Gurn Blanston]

I agree with the Stürm und Dräng idea completely. It is an entirely different phase in Haydn's compositional process. To start with, I would recommend this box here;

[asin]B00004SA85[/asin]

There are a lot of reasons to like it, not least of which is that you don't have to sell 12 goats to be able to afford it. If you search "sturm und drang haydn" on Amazon, you find, for example, that Brüggen box for $192, which has the same symphonies as this box has, and the performances are nearly indistinguishable. However, do avoid the "Morning, Noon & Night Symphonies" disk by the same forces. It was very early times when they did that one, and it sounds like Pinnock was trying to figure out what the heck to do. Not true of the S & D's though.

I know Navneeth recommends the masses, and you specifically said 'just instrumental', but if you change your mind, you might consider the Naxos box too. I got it just last week after constant badgering by unnamed Hausrezidents, and what I have heard so far is very impressive.

More later, gotta think, gotta think....

[Geo Dude]

Thanks for the info provided thus far.  I do plan to look into Haydn's choral works, of course, I'm just trying to keep it 'simple' (that word must be used loosely with a composer as prolific as Haydn) right now by sticking to instrumental stuff.

[chasmaniac]

Gurn (and anyone else interested in helping):  I'm working on building a Haydn instrumental collection and want to know where I should go next.  I currently have a complete set of the keyboard works, the London symphonies, the QM string quartets box set, and the ten disc piano trios box set is in the mail.  What other stuff should I be trying and which recordings are recommended?  Only two restrictions in regards to recommendations:  HIP required and box sets (or really cheap singles on the market place) preferred.

You didn't mention 4s, dude. The 2 Mosaiques boxes are recommended. Also any of the Bis boxes. This gives you maximum bang for the buck:

[asin]B001RL8WYC[/asin]

[Gurn Blanston]

You didn't mention 4s, dude. The 2 Mosaiques boxes are recommended. Also any of the Bis boxes. This gives you maximum bang for the buck:

[asin]B001RL8WYC[/asin]
&
[asin]B004M3PTWA[/asin]
edit: Amazon's picture is bad, I guess



give you a huge amount of everything-but-symphonies orchestral type music. Combined 11 disks worth, they are expensive at that, but a bargain in the sense that the music can not be found elsewhere complete like this. Some of it can be found scattered across a dozen or more different disks, but all of it is simply not recorded aside from this. I have no regrets at all about that expenditure! 

[Geo Dude]

You didn't mention 4s, dude. The 2 Mosaiques boxes are recommended. Also any of the Bis boxes. This gives you maximum bang for the buck:

[asin]B001RL8WYC[/asin]

Thanks for the box set tip.

4s?



Any tips on chamber music I haven't tried yet?

[Leo K.]

The Dennis Russell Davies box of Haydn's Symphonies continues to impress. The sound is mastered naturally, with good bass, air around the intruments, and the performances themselves very moving, fun, and exciting.

I'm skipping ahead (alittle) towards the "Sturm und Drang" period, the major key ones at the moment are making my day! IN particular, right now I'm enjoying Symphony No.41 (box uses traditional numbering) in C Major. Very nice!

[Gurn Blanston]

Thanks for the box set tip.

4s?



Any tips on chamber music I haven't tried yet?

4tets (quartets). I think he overlooked your QM reference.

Here's a disk that is rarely recommended, but only because not too many people are familiar with the music. It will certainly come up in the 1769 installment of the Chronology though, since I am really quite keen on it.

[asin]B002DYLU0A[/asin]

In the Big Box, this shows up as duos for Violin & Cello, however, those are arrangements, and not by Haydn.

Then there are these divertimentos of Hob IV, which are trios for violin, flute (or 2 flutes) & cello. They aren't included in any other box shown so far. He wrote these for publication in England in the early 1780's when he thought even then that he might go there one day.

[asin]B00400B1KY[/asin]

Very nice playing on these.

[Gurn Blanston]

Part 17

1768

This year was pretty much 1767 part deux in terms of further adventures. The routine that was to prevail for the next 25 years became established early on; Esterházy from earliest springtime until November, then to Eisenstadt/Vienna for the rest of the year. Despite the seclusion though, Haydn's fame continued to spread. And the Prince was pleased with that, since any fame garnered by his Kapellmeister was also a direct reflection on his own good taste. Here is the music of 1768, along with (for you folks new to this series) my choice of recorded performances to go with it.

The music of 1768:

Hob 01a_10 Overture to Lo Speziale: Sinfonia in G  (Many overtures were published separately at a later date, some only with their opera/oratorio)
Manfred Huss / Haydn Sinfonietta Wien


Hob 01_26 Symphony in d
   La Petite Bande / Kuijken
Hob 01_041 Symphony #41 in C
   Tafelmusik / Bruno Weil
Hob 01_049 Symphony in f   
Hob 01_059 Symphony in A
   L'Estro Armonico / Solomons


Hob 10_09 Sonata in D for 2 Barytons & 2 Horns
   Esterhazy Ensemble
Hob 10_10 Quintet in D for Baryton, Winds & Strings
   Ricercar Consort


Hob 11_052 Trio in D for Baryton, Viola & Cello Book 3   
Hob 11_053 Trio in G for Baryton, Viola & Cello Book 3   
Hob 11_054 Trio in D for Baryton, Viola & Cello Book 3   
Hob 11_055 Trio in G for Baryton, Viola & Cello Book 3   
Hob 11_056 Trio in D for Baryton, Viola & Cello Book 3   
Hob 11_057 Trio in A for Baryton, Viola & Cello Book 3   
Hob 11_058 Trio in D for Baryton, Viola & Cello Book 3   
Hob 11_059 Trio in G for Baryton, Viola & Cello Book 3   
Hob 11_060 Trio in A for Baryton, Viola & Cello Book 3   
Hob 11_061 Trio in D for Baryton, Viola & Cello Book 3   
Hob 11_062 Trio in G for Baryton, Viola & Cello Book 3   
Hob 11_063 Trio in D for Baryton, Viola & Cello Book 3   
Hob 11_064 Trio in D for Baryton, Viola & Cello Book 3   
Hob 11_065 Trio in G for Baryton, Viola & Cello Book 3   
Hob 11_066 Trio in A for Baryton, Viola & Cello Book 3   
Hob 11_067 Trio in A for Baryton, Viola & Cello Book 3   
Hob 11_068 Trio in A for Baryton, Viola & Cello Book 3   
Hob 11_069 Trio in D for Baryton, Viola & Cello Book 3   
Hob 11_070 Trio in G for Baryton, Viola & Cello Book 3   
Hob 11_071 Trio in A for Baryton, Viola & Cello Book 3   
Hob 11_072 Trio in D for Baryton, Viola & Cello Book 3   
Esterhazy Ensemble


Hob 16_46 Sonata #31  in Ab for Keyboard
   Paul Badura-Skoda
Hob 17_deest Fragment in D for Keyboard
   Christine Schornsheim


Hob 22_02 Missa "Sunt bona mixta malis" (fragment)
   Tafelmusik / Bruno Weil
Hob 22_04 Missa in honorem BVM
   Rebel Baroque Orchestra / Burdick
Hob 23a_01 Offertorium "Non nobis, Domine"
   Tafelmusik / Bruno Weil



Hob 24a_06 Cantata "Applausus Jubileum Virtutis Palatium"
   Capella Augustina / A. Spering   Palimina / de Liso / Weisser / Wolf


Hob 26a_37 Lied with Keyboard   'Beim Schmerz, Der Dieses Herz Durchwuhlet'
Elly Ameling / Jorg Demus


Hob 28_03 Opera "Lo Speziale" (Der Apotheker)
   Deutsches Kammerakademie / Goritzki


Wow, no taking it easy now! That is <> 5 symphonies, an opera, a Neapolitan cantata, 22 works for Baryton, 2 masses and a couple of other pieces of sacred music, his first known accompanied lied, and some solo keyboard work. And as we know, composing was only a relatively small part of his job. I think that the early years at Esterházy provided some solid inspiration for Haydn. He had continually improved the band, his music was appreciated, he was alone at the top. He was probably at the peak of his life in terms of continual inspiration.

We are solidly into what his early biographers called "The Romantic Crisis", but which more recently we call the Stürm und Dräng period. This we will see holds true not only for the symphonic output (look at these from this year alone!), but also for his solo keyboard works, and next year for much of his Op 9 string quartet work too. It is safe to say that he is fully entered into the first great period of his maturity, and at 36 years old, he has mastered his tools to an extent that they can keep up with the genius of his compositional spirit. The greatest composer of his, or most other, time is finally emerging.